America vs Everybody: Will The US Win The Chip Race? - Philip Wong | Endgame

[@HyperionLogic]

Professor Wong is one of those rare intellectuals that speaks clearly and able to communicate with normal people. I enjoyed this interview and learned a lot from his ideas.

[@cungcung5042]

This is one of the best source of knowledge on chips & semi conductor in internet. Thank you Prof Philip Wong for sharing his vast knowledge in such simple way. And thank you for digging this out, Pak Gita.

[@juhantoon6524]

One thing I can say for certain is China will emerge champion over US in the chip industry or any other fields for few reasons : 1) China has the critical mass market to support any industry. 2) China has very long term industrial master plan which is well thought out, consistent in implementation and well funded. 3) It is in the Chinese blood that the more external pressure is exerted, the better they will emerge. Classic example is Huawei, Space station, Baidou and military assets, EV, Solar panels, Drones etc. 4) May not be the last but the most important is Patriotism of the Chinese people which the US can never have.

[@WinDonX]

Pilihan kita: kirim anak2 muda kita ke org2 spt Prof Philip Wong sbg mentor dan pembimbing atau ke profesor2 kita yg abal2 ? Cara utk meningkatkan kualitas talent kita ya kirim sebanyak-banyaknya anak2 muda kita ke org2 sekaliber Prof Wong. Kalau tidak, ya 2045 kita menyongsong indonesia berkarat.

[@NailaDiandra-q9w]

Akhirnya topik ini dibahas sama pak Gita karena saya sudah menanti menanti kalo pak gita bakal membahas topik ini saya sebagai pelajar yang mengambil jurusan rekayasa perangkat lunak bisa menambah wawasan sedikit demi sedikit di dunia tech and sains. :)

[@stanbimi]

Professor Wong described the recipe for building a successful semiconductor industry, but most countries will never get enough required ingredients: talented engineers, scientists, scale, funding, official support, resources such as electricity and water, work ethics & education culture, market, etc. It's not hard to name which countries have most or all of the critical factors.

[@luklauw]

We heard it from the professor. To compete, countries need talents and for talents to thrive they need social support. So for Indonesia to be able to have presence in the semiconductor industry, the first thing to do is to prepare our society. We need a society that value STEM more than religiosity, IMHO.

[@wawanhermawan-sz7gl]

indonesia has a herd mentality, it is very dependent on leadership, even religiosity was due to how political situation led it that way (not necessarily by design but more by accident) post-suharto period in early 2000s, so in essence it's "curable" but it needs STEM-aware leaderships

[@AWSOM817]

What Indonesia needs is some real “genius” that easy to like and some true genius that make things easy to understand instead of social climbers that use their knowledge to manipulate. Religion is coping mechanism for most folk, radicals are easy to handle if they lack support(economically+socially). Sadly most Indonesian geniuses either easy to dislike or petty social climbers. And if any were stand out as i mentioned, they get hammered like nails in the plank, either because of jealousy or simply greed, usually by its own peers.

[@andrewlim7751]

Never!

[@muhammadirfanislami818]

It is silly to make such dichotomy between STEM and religion. LOL.

[@PahatRout]

@@muhammadirfanislami818 , Why? Generally, it seems there is an abyss between them. If only one accepts religion as a personal relationship between you and Him in your mind; then things would be easier to explain.

[@pedjabrankovic7815]

It is very interesting to notice that China is, in the sense of not strictly tech development, but advancing in thinking, decision making and organisation, exactly at the place where South Korea was back at the beginning of 2000 when they started crossing the barrier of exceptional "me-too" competitor to technological avantgarde. China does it equally well at the level of organisation and developing process, but with one huge difference - quantitative plane. Its overall economy is far more powerful and the raw population is far larger than the Korean ever was. So the results will soon be(and already are to some extent)something kinda Samsung and Hyundai times 5 or more and what is even more important, by jumping over steps they learned from others(something Korea did too, but at far less advanced level back then), China will bring that process at the entire new level.

[@gregwang8628]

Just look at the past forty years, who were leading the US technology development in all fronts? It came from a huge swath of talents from all over the world joining efforts, and now? What a change of heart, it’s the people’s choice, so be it.

[@hazelman1]

Apa yg saya tangkap dari Mr. Wong adalah berkali² beliau menekankan pentingnya kolaborasi agar semua manfaat dari terciptanya chip dapat dinikmati semua orang di dunia. Beliau seolah menyatakan bahwa TSMC memilih untuk berada di jalur tengah. Menekankan, monopoli teknologi oleh suatu negara memiliki lebih banyak keburukan dan kemudaratan, selain tidak mungkin hal tsb terjadi sebab apa yg paling membuat kemungkinan kemajuan teknologi chip terjadi adalah karena kolaborasi itu sendiri. Pemerataan pengetahuan dan akses pada kemajuan teknologi praktis harus dilakukan karena manfaatnya lebih besar untuk kemanusiaan. Pada titik tsb, langsung mengingatkan saya pada sejarah penemuan atomic bomb, dan bagaimana hal tsb membuat satu negara atau satu bangsa cenderung bertindak semena-mena terhadap bangsa lainnya. Untun, hal itu tidak terjadi karena Soviet tak lama kemudian juga berhasil menemukan formula yg tepat untuk atomic bomb mereka. Taiwan, melalui TSMC dan keunggulan rekayasa teknologi foundry mereka di dunia cenderung memilih untuk bersikap netral daripada condong pada satu pihak adikuasa. Saya memberi hormat kepada keputusan Taiwan dan TSMC memilih jalan tersebut. Terima kasih Pak Gita telah menghadirkan podcast yg sangat mencerahkan. 🙏🏻

[@BestFitSquareChannel]

Superb! Thank you Mr. Wong. Thank you Mr. Wirjawan. Excellent. Best wishes. 🖖🏼

[@hanantosubiakto]

China unggul di jumlah paper, tapi new idea masih US yg unggul. Ketika new idea dilempar dan semua negara tahu, China yg unggul di paper new idea tadi. Scale does count!

[@JS_Gaiserik]

what's scary is that China also manage to produce high quality papers, albeit as you said, lack in innovation compared to the US.

[@Mangputt]

​@@JS_GaiserikXi dan China sangat ambisius, kalau seandainya mereka bisa menutup langit dengan jemari; rasanya sudah mereka lakukan. Out of the box idea~membanjiri produk global-paper globa-researcher global. Seakan balon yang mau scale up buat berubah jadi bomb untuk siap menghadang garangnya Mamarika bahkan klo bisa, dia mau knock out tuh Mamarika

[@johnlay3040]

Chips technology is advancing to carbon and photonic, for which China is at the forefront. The US is behind in those areas. So, I don't think the US could win.

[@anwiycti1585]

😂😂

[@saluran1733]

Go taichi chip go 💪 And 6G as well 🎉

[@moh6410]

untill jews move to china china won't get very far

[@servehonestly]

now don't get complacent like the US.. progress n advanced discoveries are unending... never b complacent or feel exceptional.

[@johnlay3040]

@@servehonestlyChina has learned its lessons hard, and it has the brains and talents to keep the progress. The negative consequence of American Exceptionalism is a good example for eveyone to see.

[@markarmage3776]

Knowledge belongs to mankind, the sad and quite ignorant assumption that only one country or one people can have exclusive ownership of technology is absurd.

[@AlamKehidupan-x4t]

This excellent discussion give me new insight on techology. Thank you pak Wong & Pak Gita.

[@Gman979]

Not many people are aware of the new alliance between Russian and Chinese scientists which I believe will have a big say in how future technology will be shape and develop.

[@wanglei5500]

Russian Math and Chinese hard work, your words make sense. 👍

[@isalutfi]

Turut menyimak. Terima kasih Pak Gita dan segenap tim Endgame yang sudah menyajikan diskusi dan perbincangan yg menarik ini bersama Philip Wong. Terima kasih juga sudah menyertakan video podcast ini dengan rencana pembelajaran/episode notes yg bisa kita baca dan pelajari. Semoga semua materi-materi yg tersajikan bisa mendorong kita untuk menjadi pembelajar sepanjang hayat. Salam sehat selalu!

[@believeingood5875]

The title should be changed to whether China will win the science and technology war? And the answer is yes.

[@budyanwar1777]

looking at current technological developments, the use of semiconductors will increase in the future. I hope that Indonesia can produce its own semiconductors, with the availability of the raw materials needed all in Indonesia.

[@nsebast]

Hanya mimpi belaka. Untuk Indonesia bisa punya pabrik sendiri pertama musti punya SDM yang sangat kuat dalam matematika dan science. Orang Indonesia tidak mempunyai kegigihan dalam belajar dan berpikir - masih kalah jauh dengan Amerika dan Cina.

[@JACK..BORNEO]

Mustahil indonesia bisa bikin itu.. pembuatan chip itu sangat mahal.. motor aja masih impor , jgn bilang bikin chip bikin geli..😂

[@himatulaliyah5911]

Orientasi generasi milenium kita masih tuntutlah ilmu ke timur tengah,.coba aja bandingkan pelajar kita yang ke negara maju dengan yang ke timur tengah. Harapan kita mungkin ada di generasi z dan selanjutnya, dimana generasi ini sejak kecil punya akses hampir tak terbatas internet.. jadi punya orientasi yang lebih luas

[@텍스트나우]

원자재만 있다고 되는 줄 아나? 그랬으면 아프리카가 반도체를 독점했겠지 ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ

[@banana-st1fq]

excellent! good questions and good answers. Congratulations to both

[@fabwee9496]

Excellent,, this is how we technologist look at things. Not from the cesspool way up like some.

[@sirthomasfishnchips2477]

Very insightful session, thanks for such a educational opportunity. I hope to enter semiconductor industry too as a professional. Well wishes from India🇮🇳

[@userngo09.02bmo]

One can sense that the professor is very reluctant to touch China related issues.

[@wawanhermawan-sz7gl]

very typical of chinese academics who left china in the 80s for the west

[@slc801]

FBI may be listening 😜

[@avil8686]

Not maybe, it's a certain thing​@@slc801

[@holycow343]

mccarthyism never left.

[@dewinmoonl]

43:29 spot on hahaha. I'm chinese academic working in the US, the US has great novel ideas, but once it's known, it become "rice farming" and the chinese farm some good rice lul

[@ferrynalle5886]

This is an interesting topic. Because semiconductor is the one of hot topic today in Chemistry point of view. Thank you Pak Gita and team. 🙏

[@prometheus-l5u]

Great discussions❤

[@nugadi2020]

Yang harus diciptakan adalah ekosistem, tidak cukup dengan pendidikan saja. Harus link and match.

[@ramonching7772]

Yep. It is really America vs everybody.

[@WAHYUIKA]

Jadi inget bukunya Chris Miller, Chip War

[@rolandwong9306]

Chris Miller will learn a lot from Gita's interview with Philip Wong. From the usual US zero-sum game approach and cold-war mentality, Miller's approach is narrow thinking. The last part of the interview illustrates why the US attempts to onshore Samsung and TSMC will be like a fish that is to be eaten; they don't know how to fish. They need long-term backing, R and D, government policies, talent development, and economics to support this industry. Intel will swim in its red ink revenue with a customer of one.

[@level1selamat155]

Absolutely enlightening

[@joechow3338]

Really enlightening! Great explanation and looking into the future about our livelihood under the technological world.

[@fkarifin8393]

very strong and solid information, thanks Pak Gita

[@DAWN001]

When freedom of speech is in jeopardy, how can we expect scientists to continue free exchange of research ideas and findings?

[@jerrellholder8382]

I think right now the freedom of speech thing is past tense the great USA don't want freedom of speech anymore..usa is no longer the end all be all country other nations are doing well and have patriotic feelings to their country

[@jliang70]

Scientific research does not have the element of social ideology.

[@bayuwijaya222]

Indonesia Wajib Punya Wafer Fabrication jika ingin mewujudkan indonesia emas

[@moh6410]

nanti demo demo anti amerika, anti asenk asink, anti yahudi, anti lgbt. tim cook yg kebetulan seorang LGBT pun takut invest di sini

[@Cemenmen1]

​@@moh6410kocak Luh. Lihat fakta. Lulusan kuliah Indonesia terendah. Sedangkan Jokowi mengeluh. Padahal tidak peduli. Dan sekarang akhirnya pendidikan malah naik. Itu fakta. Bukan fropokator

[@aruneelakkham5898]

One of my favorite episide so far. Thank you so much ❤

[@rohand03]

Most Chinese scientists can read and write English, so there won't be a problem for them to keep up with western world publication. Can you say the same with the US scientists? Can most US scientists read and write Chinese?

[@wawanhermawan-sz7gl]

that's not an issue, there's this thing called AI you know, not only to translate but also to summarize high level academic papers

[@hitthedeck4115]

Can you tell me what high impact Chinese journals are? As far as I know, practically all of them are Western and in English so Chinese academics will most likely still publish their papers in these journals for foreseeable future.

[@rohand03]

@@hitthedeck4115 I don't live in China so I don't know. To be fair, I also don't know which high impact publications in the US are. If the world is split to 2 sphere, US sphere and China sphere, Chinese scientists would be forced to publish within China and that platform will quickly grow. Not to mention China is producing much more patents than US now. Most of them are in Chinese is my guess.

[@hitthedeck4115]

@@rohand03 You can google which the high-impact journals in various fields are, basically all of them are western. Not just Chinese, but any scientist in the world want and is pushed to publish in these journals since that will dictate how impactful their research are (due to visibility).

[@jayy1980]

@@hitthedeck4115lol you are shortsighted. Go and check the research publications and you will know they are predominantly Chinese people. If China decides to switch to just Chinese you’re focked

[@uchannel1197]

what Jensen Huang did is redifine Moore's Law and renamed it Huang's Law

[@kshen7485]

India has the potential, but no fundings. Israel has enough fundings, but no future. Asia has everything. As Kishore Mahbubani said, the 21st century will be the Asian century.

[@randica07]

Semoga pak gita selalu dalam keadaan sehat dan bahagia 🎉🎉

[@setiokoalip1764]

An anecdotical analogy about our guest here, if mark zuckerberg is the joko widodo, professor wong is one of the nine dragons 😂 (just for fun) maturnuwun pak gita for this inspirational talk.. godspeed

[@jeprotable]

the Eastern Era…hallelujah

[@AriyoAP]

Necessity is the mother of invention. Sebagai masyarakat Indonesia, apakah kita sudah menganggap STEM sebagai suatu 'necessity' dengan harapan dapat melahirkan lebih banyak pemuda yang mampu berpikir dengan metode STEM? Di Indonesia, sering kali cara berpikir yang out of the box dianggap aneh, sehingga kebanyakan orang tua justru mengharapkan anaknya untuk berpikir secara pragmatis. Sederhananya, mengajarkan anak2nya untuk mengumpulkan bekal materi (harta) dan bekal spiritual (pahala).

[@tedwong7037]

KMT incubated TSMC, but now it became a political asset for DPP

[@paulwirjawan2387]

Wrong title. Should be China vs. Everybody.

[@Mangputt]

Sakti bet Pak Gita ngundang narator kelas kakap gini🥶

[@HadiAriawan]

thanks for this insightful session!

[@slc801]

You need collaboration ! Tell that to the US politicians china will be leading in all fields in the near future but yet you want to decouple 🙄

[@initiallblast]

konduktor , semi konduktor, super konduktor itu material nya ...makanya pabrik nya berusaha membikin "bahan" dulu dr extraktif sda termasuk quartz berbentuk padat tp halus/grain alias pasir ...sama aja kyk pabrik kimiawi batre ada nikel vs LFP vs sodium ion dst dst ...juga palagi konkrit kyk pabrik semen wkkwkw .. materi = matters , kan fisika bgt palagi quantum, partikel itu matters kan ... dst nya bisa berhubungan dg biologi nih protein dna dll juga matters tuh, tp literally bernyawa /wet bahkan wet computing spt otak literally ...sedangkan kalau semi konduktor, lebih ke computing/switch turn on turn off benar dia he3, dst artificial 'otak' (otak manusia/intelegensia manusia pula/akal) kan sekarang arah penyempurnaan/pendekatan nya/approachment nya ... bisa aja lebih kuat dr pendekatan/approachment biologi, "playing god" nya ini chip gini2, palagi klo main-nya keroyokan komputer2 di seluruh dunia terkoneksi internet utk "mikir" he3 ...walau masih halu sih *sentient* kyk robot robot film transformers alien itu bisa datang ke terran/bumi misal nya, halu bgt kan

[@albertwong1919]

There doesnt seems to be any winners in this race, everyone is a loser question is who loses more....

[@Nine-Signs]

Wrong, the capitalist minority are winning, no matter if their politicians in their pockets and the workers under their feet are losing, the capitalist minority, who own vast chunks of the US AND CHINESE economies SYMULTANEOULSY, are always winning, at any cost to the rest of us.

[@gabrielm4740]

Agree. Everyone will lose about the same as the climate change is about to wipe human out. It's obviously not helping to waste the world's resources creating many small yards.

[@aliceyan8808]

Great interview Gita

[@AbuDNN61]

Great conversation and informative.

[@tabularasa1134]

The Rhetorical Pragmatic meet The Technical Semantic🙂

[@gastonbess9469]

America will soon pay countries to be friends with it bad child 😂

[@purnamawinarsa7079]

Selamat hari pendidikan nasional, semoga kurikulum di Indo tidak melupakan sains

[@HaryonoYonk-yu5ei]

Masih jauh panggan dari pada api.... Contoh real....masih bnyak yg tertarik pada perdebatan makan siang gratis.... Harus leader sprti pk jokowi....dilihat ato diukur dari seberapa banyak beliau menanam bibit ato menghasilkn para peneliti.... Bukan sekedar tentang kepopuleran.....bersahaja tdk korup...sangat merakyat... Bahkn seorang pemimpin visioner ....tapitdk dpt mewujudkn dlm skala yg nyata ...mk tetap harus legowo dianggap gagal...

[@tubagussujana2835]

Amin, semoga sains di indonesia semakin maju dan bisa memakmurkan rakyat

[@sguntarto]

Philip Wong discusses the semiconductor industry with guest Professor Philip Wong from Stanford University and TSMC. Wong reflects on his upbringing in Hong Kong, emphasizing his family's emphasis on education despite limited means. They delve into the historical and geopolitical factors shaping the semiconductor industry's landscape, particularly TSMC's role in Taiwan's industrial policy and the rise of Asian research capabilities. They explore the implications of AI on innovation speed, the importance of collaboration for technological advancement, and the intertwining of manufacturing and innovation. Wong stresses the necessity of talent cultivation and cross-cultural interaction for sustained progress, highlighting the interconnectedness of policy, education, and innovation in shaping the semiconductor industry's future.

[@NightSkyTower]

Talents coming to get usa are the folks keeping the hegemony...the Asians should realize to make better Asia..

[@PipoHargiyanto]

Insightful 👍🏻

[@tedchandran]

Jai Hind. We Indian origins are the alpha Tech heads in AI software. It may sound a bit strange that we are not running the biggest AI chip making companies.

[@houfame]

Those Indian if they got fired would be herding cattle in some Indian villages. So first build your country before acting like you are some genius when you clearly are not. See what the Chinese are doing. Be humble and learn from them.

[@anderb9311]

A camera on the phone .... 58:19 ... really funny ....

[@moodymusician6200]

Well done pak gita

[@gauriblomeyer1835]

There is another issue nobody dares to talk about. The issue of technical difficulties in the production process. Just take Airbus and Boeing. The production process of every airbus airplane is more that 100 times more complicated than the process of producing an Boeing plane because the airbus is produced in three different countries, UK, France and Germany, all with a completely different language. But why is the Boeing company unable to produce their planes correctly ? The problem is the missing harmony within the workers and their leaders. One company has mastered this issue excellently and this is Munich RE ( reinsurance). In its inner structure it is a sport club. On weekends the CEO plays in a table tennis competition divided to age levels against the door man of the company. Established Fair play within this company shows in great optimal successful cooperation and economic success. It never happens there what you find in all companies that divisions of one sector work against divisions of another sector. There are cases of insolvency because within the company directors were fighting against each other.

[@wawanhermawan-sz7gl]

common in all big companies, as asians would say, an elephant cant dance, their tusk and ears and legs could do their own thing

[@booksquotes948]

China makes world class phones for 500$.

[@herricktantrianto9815]

Shame that content like this lacks traction in this country. Willingness and idealism to produce content like this aside from endgame is practically none. Shame that “our people” are enslaved to “low value” content.

[@riderpaul]

K through 12 in the United States is so bad that we have to rely on other countries for students in our universities. It's going to take 40 years for the US to catch up. The US students are so bored with their schools that they smoke pot instead of going to classes. We need to pay teachers more to get good teachers so that the kids want to study. It's all about motivation. US are schools are completely uninspiring.

[@yoohootube12]

38:29 Is it Helix or Hynix?

[@bahagia2]

thanks a lot

[@Avigkit]

Thanks

[@gwirjawan]

Thanks for your support!

[@genocidegrand2057]

thanks

[@sumajiji5191]

nyimak om

[@ericyeo805]

Unfortunately, the good guys works benefiting the supply chains that in turns, enjoys by the people has to be disrupted by some idiotic and egoistic politicians who knows next to nothing in manufacturing and business, to destroy the industry for their selfish interests. Yoo don’t expect the Chinese to be happy to invest in reinventing wheels to be understanding when they finally lead in the field. The US could have continue to grow in their fields of advance tools and engineering and others to rely on their products. This will keep the status-quo instead of deliberately egging new competitors which they had done.

[@ahmadmustakhimabdmutalib59]

😢wak, jangan pakey baju hitam, elok grey or white or green or bright 😊 like billgates

[@neosiagroup]

kalau diperhatikan, setiap podcast yang pakai bahasa inggris like nya tidak sebesar yang bahasa indonesia

[@moh6410]

Nadiem Makarim mau wajibkan bhs inggris aja pada gak setuju emang bener bahwa bebek gak bisa di ajak jadi elang

[@kooisengchng5283]

Prayers will not build bridges, advance scientific knowledge and all aspects of societal development. In fact in many countries religion is the cause of conflict rather than development.

[@urimtefiki226]

Who is gone absorb the cost? Me the inventor, because fo the bs.

[@amiigose]

mr wong must back to china

[@gauriblomeyer1835]

Can the US ever reach the technical level of the company Zeiss Jena in Germany which no power of the world can buy. It is a foundation and all its profits are not going to shareholders but to research. No company of my American friends can do this. And the Chinese will also not come near to the technical level of Zeiss Jena products.

[@pedroghirotti]

And once again the problem is capitalism... But things will change. Hopefully the Workers are going to receive their fair share.

[@umaktinah9167]

cool sekali cara minta subscribenya.

[@ahmadmustakhimabdmutalib59]

😊 Wak, bikin videos translate basa malay lah, ngak ngerti ingris...

[@hamidsaputra8823]

Mr. Wirjawan, please invite Ehsan Masood to study the relationship between science and Islam, he is from London.

[@AlfahriKrnwn]

❤

[@zzz-gp9wr]

keren

[@561-m3s]

Wowww

[@DimasSurya-p4l]

Ini konten mahal sih

[@AntonDev-cw3kc]

All starts with economics. Some countries have implemented the sustainable economy model accidentally, others need to construct it manually. If you do not have appropriate political, society institutions you will not have modern technology. But iyou will not have stable political and society institutions, if you do not have social security. Chine is not an example, it is just a mistake of complicated game between USA and USSR, it will fall soon, no doubts. If you have a stable society, you do not need to built a complex industry. The industry is only 20% of GDP, and it's share is constantly decreasing. The tourists services share is constantly increasing instead. The more wild nature Indonezia will save, the richer nation it will be. This aim contradicts with industrialization, isn't it?

[@qake2021]

👍👍✌️🇧🇷🇷🇺🇮🇳🇨🇳🇿🇦➕️👏👏✌️

[@dejohnettejack2273]

sok pinter lu

[@moh6410]

eh ada badut nyasar

[@billhammett174]

boring

[@laikakhan1313]

This guy talks too much.....

[@slomo4672]

Which one?

[@boiscooka232]

Chinese Tofu Chip 😂 so overrated

[@michaelmarchal4004]

Phillip is Chinese you I$iot

[@rommele1134]

Clown comment🤡☝️☝️

[@karangputih]

the Yank always feel happy to despise. Do you know that Nvidia bos is a Chinese Jehsen Huang, AMD is Lisa Su. One of KZbin founder is Steve Chen. 5G, Space Station, Ev dan Speed Rail are they tofu. and how many speed rail do you have ? and soon your space staion is over. Bad mouth thick face

[@slc801]

Wow !! Didn’t expect ignorant people to be watching this 😩

[@bernadinesiy3338]

Envy and insecurity...

[@bharatc.sampat6406]

Rubbish talk