American Rapper First Time Seeing - BTS vs Spotify [Reaction]

EP33: Smokey Approved S.Korea- American Rapper First Time Seeing - bts vs spotify [Reaction]
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[@sharonnelson3713]

Big Hit was a small independent label that almost went into bankruptcy while BTS was in training and near debuting. When BTS debuted and for several years BTS was the only group Big Hit had. BTS made Big Hit the wealthiest label in Korea.

[@kw6180]

To add, BigHit was so broke, they couldn't pay for the doorm that the guys stayed in. The parents came together and helped pay the rent. ARMYs used to send the boys food because their fridge was often empty. Jin, the oldest, used to take the members home to his parents' house to feed them and raid the pantry. The label couldn't afford clothes for events and wore cheap $5 designer knockoffs and was often ridiculed by the cash rich Big 3 artists. It was so bad that til this day, the S Korean industry and general public still wouldn't give BTS their flowers because they still feel that these bumpkins shouldn't be where they are. Simply put, BTS are more famous worldwide then in their home country. There's so much more than meets the eyes with BTS' back story. Keep exploring, you will be astounded

[@Jurnalist_]

That’s a real struggle to riches story. Truly inspiring. We as artist hide so much of our struggle but it seems that is what made you guys so fiercely loyal.

[@kw6180]

@Jurnalist these guys are genuinely good, humble souls... which is insane because of the bullying and repeated attempts to sabotage! Based on their achievements, you'd think the government would exempt them from mandatory military service, nope, they all have to go. The oldest, Jin, just enlisted

[@cg558]

@@Jurnalist_ it's hard for them to hide it when we're there to see it all. We hear the comments, see the treatment.

[@LynnHermione]

Source? I never saw this. Dont say things without source

[@iluvdogs1430]

Totally agree Namjoon deserves a Grammy for Indigo. That album is a musical masterpiece!!!

[@NathiM03]

I think so too but I’m glad the RM has clearly displayed his disinterest in the accolades because it allows him and us as his fans to enjoy the art with no worries, RM and the other guys had to endure a whole lot of nonsense with the Grammys.

[@CL-cn8wt]

I agree, I love that album so much. Who knows he may submit it next year

[@dilaylad1903]

When it comes to BTS's contract with Geffen, it is only for America, and it is only distribution. BTS has their own online platform from which they sell their albums and merch directly from Korea (through the HYBE's owned Weverse). They are not signed to Geffen at all, it's just an accord, and so they ARE independent artists.

[@Bonusdoc]

At the time when BTS was put together in 2013, Big Hit was a small indie label on the brink of bankruptcy. Big Hit’s entire roster consists of 2 artists: BTS and a Korean folk singer. Big Hit did not debut another artist until 2019, increasing their roster to a grand total of 3 artists. So it’s an underdog story, fair and square. BTS only had Orchard for distribution from 2017-2020. No US label is linked to them until Columbia in 2020 and Geffen in 2022 for bare minimum physical distribution deals only. BTS is also not listed on Geffen’s artist roster. Big Hit does their own distribution for much of the world - the tag on physical CDs are different in other parts of the world. Big Hit also has now opened their own physical store and would ship albums to countries without the help of a local distributor and bypassing the system entirely. The way Geffen / US label promotes BTS is very a la carte and vastly different from their own fully signed artists; there was 0 US label involvement when their album “BE” (2020) came out, with a grand total of 6 radio spins for the lead single from mainly independent radio stations. So BTS certainly gets no special treatments despite some sort of ties to a US label. It’s a game of “BTS being too big to ignore and too enticing to not try to get a bite of them”, rather than “riding and dying with BTS as their own team”.

[@OT7_DopeOldARMY]

I think when you said "squandering" you meant "floundering." "Squandering" means they were spending money extravagantly or foolishly, or to lose something through negligence or inaction. I don't think that's what you were trying to say. 🙂 Also, "consisted" and not "consists" since Big Hit has BTS, TXT and Lee Hyun (the "3" you mentioned) and under their label now. Not trying to nitpick, but the intended meanings change completely without these clarifications.

[@hadia254]

I second this comment!! Not one of these US labels is fully signed to them, big hit is not stupid enough to tie the team up to a US label to fund and profit from them in 2022 world wide when they're already there topping every major music industry in the world already, they need none of the promotion these labels offer in exchange for their souls WW, the US's active attempts to push them out is the only reason they signed them at all and it's surface level they don't get as much as he thought not even close

[@imajinallthepurple]

@@OT7_DopeOldARMY I think it's because Jurnalist used the word squandering. 😉

[@OT7_DopeOldARMY]

@@imajinallthepurple even more important to correct the word then, since it’s hard to squander money you never had. 😂

[@DaughterOfFiji]

@@OT7_DopeOldARMY lol😭

[@volhan.p.9722]

I just want to add some information to what others said in the comments. To understand financial struggles of BTS and Big Hit in 2010-2013 and even some years after: fans used to send to boys clothes and kitchen utensils as gifts to help them. Clothes they wore in MVs and to aword shows was replica of brands or no name at all (and K-Pop is very focused on looks and brand names).

[@lealarsen2017]

yes so they where bullied for the way they look and make fun of their names and their music.

[@JaserKing123]

Yes. Bighit was an independent label made by BangPD. It was literally Broke ass company with No name in Kpop industry. But BangPD took every last saving of his pocket also took tons of Loans to debut BTS... It took until 2015 for BTS to finally have a breakthrough in their own country. If they had failed back then BTS would have been disbanded. Then in 2016 when BTS started to become quite demanded in US... BTS literally had No US Distribution as well. It wasn't until 2017 BTS signed for Columbia for Distribution deals for their albums only. BTS is still an independent artists that's only signed to Bighit (now a Big label under Hybe corporation)... And Hybe was made from BTS's money... Like BTS story is just so crazy.

[@babbes4210]

Army doesn't stop streaming on spotify because it is one of the few ways the fandom can help BTS climb up charts since the sales of physicals was capped(another way the industry tries to keep BTS out). Without add's, radio and other underhanded tactics, streaming is the only way the fandom has to keep bts on the charts for a long time. And Charts mean visibility to the GP. Visibility also makes it harder for corrupt institutions to distort numbers or diminish bts their impact. Not all countries have bts albums in their supermarkets. In Europe the albums are not only hard to find but are also very expensive so not many fans can support the group that way. So streaming is the only tool we have and we have used it well.

[@eileencritchley4630]

I buy BTS albums I'm in the UK but I have to use Amazon which I hate as a company.

[@alipotter0613]

Remember BTS are worldwide so not everyone in BTS ARMY has the access or resources to buy albums/merch/tickets. So the way they support the members is by streaming, voting and watching, all of which is free. ARMY supports BTS however they are able.💜

[@DaughterOfFiji]

yep, army for 7 years and i have no bts album/merch. all i do is listen on spotify and vote

[@histfictfan4460]

@@DaughterOfFiji You're doing what you can and I thank you- it all counts.

[@sharonnelson3713]

Very good point 👍💜.

[@cg558]

@@tvok_300 great work. True army. 💜💜💜

[@goreyfantod5213]

41:18 I've been enjoying your reactions, but the comment you made here was WAY off. You said, "you guys probably wouldn't even know," when musing about whether Big Hit was an independent label. I get the sense that while you're open to learn, you're still clinging on to a lot of assumptions & trying to pigeonhole BTS into them. 1. A huge proportion of BTS' fans are self-taught experts on various aspects of: - the S. Korean music industry & U.S. music industries esp. w/r/t the Idol business, radio play, streaming, charting, album sales & promo, ticket sales, award shows, tv appearances, endorsements - BTS' history. You're looking at a massively successful group in 2022 & assuming their record company, HYBE, made them, using the American industry things you're used to. In reality, BTS' record company, Big Hit, was tiny & independent. They'd had 2-3 moderately successful acts and also a group with a significant scandal. Big Hit put together the members, but ARMY made BTS massive & Big Hit benefited so much that they were able to expand, go public & become HYBE. 2. The U.S. popular music business started out dispersed, then became monopolized by a small number of companies. The S. Korean Idol industry started as a monopoly of one (SM Entertainment), then two (YG), then eventually three (JYP), companies, known as, "The Big 3." They controlled access to tv, which used to be the main promotional platform for Idol music. Big Hit was literally the first independent agency to break the Big 3's stranglehold on the industry & they did it by marshalling fan engagement to run creative end-arounds, not with money or influence. 3. S. Korea's Idol music business is a carefully constructed hybrid of influences, techniques & practices from several successful industries - A&R, training, writing, producing, image management, promoting, etc. were all tightly controlled. Managing fan engagement is a big deal in the Idol industry & has been since the beginning. There's all the stuff that BTS inherited (fan chants, light sticks, coordinated mass voting, merch. importation, etc.), + BTS is a 3rd Gen group; the social media (esp. KZbin, Twitter), & streaming generation. BTS & their fans didn't invent any of it, but they mastered all of it. I go so far as to say that ARMY weaponized the industry's fan engagement practices & used them to subvert the system.

[@izzatys7037]

Well said, thanks

[@pjmbyul]

BigHit Entertainment: Nearly went bankrupt in the years before BTS debuted. BTS: Debuted in 2013 and were not even paid until maybe late 2014-into 2015. BigHit: Had no money to put BTS on certain programs or to properly promote them in Korea, thus BTS created their own content. BTS: Broke into the American music market in 2017 and signed to Columbia Records as a DISTRIBUTOR. NOT as their American record label, but JUST a distributor. Columbia did NOT promote BTS. They had armys out here begging Columbia to do something because every time they mentioned a roundup of their artists, they seldom included BTS. They also never pushed BTS to radio or other outlets EXCEPT for two of their all-English songs (which was unsurprising). BTS: Turned their poor music label into a multi-company corporation called HYBE that now oversees multiple music labels (including BigHit Music), gaming companies, IP ventures, social media platforms, live concert + streaming technology, etc. ALL because of BTS. This is an inarguable fact admitted by HYBE itself and covered thoroughly in official reports and news articles. BigHit: Still BTS' ONLY and official record label. BTS: Dropped Columbia in 2021 and now UMG is BTS' distributor. Again: not their label, just music distributor in the U.S. UMG doesn't promote them much, either. Therefore: BigHit was infamously poor and lacked major sway/promotional vehicles, and BTS is NOT signed to any USA record label as their artist. UMG just distributes them, but does not claim BTS as *their* artist and thus does NOT promote them like how they do their artists.

[@paus_52]

Bighit has 2 groups (BTS & TXT) and 1 soloist (Lee Hyun).

[@NamuBang]

And thank goodness for that!

[@cinand4361]

Yes, as others have said, BigHit was a tiny independent label. It nearly went bankrupt numerous times. Bang PD (Bang Shi-Hyuk) took out many loans and paid a lot out of pocket to keep BigHit going, and if BTS hadn't started to be successful in 2025/2016, they would have gone under. BigHit is now a subsidiary label of HYBE, which has many other labels under it as well. But both BigHit and HYBE were absolutely built on the backs of BTS. And BTS, with their new contracts, are shareholders in HYBE and have other benefits (deserved). If you're ever interested, you can look up the story of BigHit, Bang PD, and BTS. The early years of BTS were definitely a tightrope act. Their rags-to-riches story is almost unbelievable.

[@cinand4361]

Also, SO CLOSE on their names. V is in front of Jimin (between j-hope and RM) -- Not Jimin I'm front of V. It makes sense since you haven't delved as much into vocalists yet, but that was super close!! I used to confuse V, JK and Jin when I was new to BTS 💜

[@cinand4361]

One more thing (sorry! I'm awful!) -- thanks so much for all your insights. Really, this is so educational and informative, and your respectful honesty is very appreciated. I think the main reason I stream as an ARMY is to keep BTS visible. I want to make sure that they can't and won't be ignored or written off by anyone in this industry. We also get mad about the playlists because so many people who stream use these curated playlists (e.g. Today's Top Hits or Rap Caviar) and BTS not being on them feels suspicious at times. ARMY is so active that many, many media outlets want to use us for clout. We're aware of it and seasoned ARMY know the tricks (generally) but it's always good to get more information about how it works.

[@ann-archist7172]

Yes, they don't need spotify to make money, but they do need it for charts. And not appearing on charts creates a situation where media play can suggest groups are not as popular as they are. Also, BTS has said how much charting means to them. It's probably because they have literally come from recording albums in a garage. As ARMY we are here to help them achieve whatever they want even if we wish it didn't matter to them.

[@dis-eased]

exactly, billboard made sure to increase the importance of streams and radio play for a reason. buying albums isn't cutting it anymore if bts want to be anywhere near the top 10.

[@OT7_DopeOldARMY]

@@dis-eased It would (might?) cut it IF Billboard hadn't limited the number of albums that can be purchased by one person - 4 for physicals, 1 for digitals.

[@dis-eased]

@@OT7_DopeOldARMY yeah it would be enough at one point but not after all the changes. we are never in a million years getting radio play so the best next thing is streams. we need to get to a point where our streams alone can guarantee a top 10 like Taylor’s swift’s album. we have the numbers for that, and i’m guessing that we could probably do it with the 2025 comeback with all the hype that it will get.

[@ralphy383]

So, about the grammy... BTS don't like afterparties too much.. They went to a variety award/ thing in 2019 but were seem to be incredibly uncomfortable. BTS also don't do much talking... and buttering up people.. If you wanna make a song with them, you gotta talk to them about the song. They don't hang around other artists after award shows... They go back to their hotel rooms to do a live for fans to thank them and then get some rest.

[@histfictfan4460]

My kind of men.

[@atlantis315]

the fact that only Namjoon is fluent in english certainly doesn´t help them be comfortable in a social setting....that must be so stressfull

[@paus_52]

@@atlantis315 even in JITB listening party in their own building with people who speaks their language they were still like hiding in the corner and only talked to people they already know except our sunshine Hobi just because he's the host 😆

[@ZoriNikolova]

What a men❤

[@dici1396]

I really do find your insights about the industry interesting and enjoy your discussion on BTS music. And while I see what your saying about alternative ways the manipulates the system where even a distribution contract can be sus, I don’t think BTS falls in that category. BTS only recently worked with Geffen and it feels like it’s mostly to deal with their international shipping issues (it’s not quite fixed bc shipping costs can be nuts) but when it comes to Geffen adding influence bc they have an interest (even though BTS isn’t directly signed w/them), then where is it? Where is their influence bc it’s not doing much and they have other artists where they have done more. The bare minimum has been happening (playlists, radio, etc is almost nonexistent). Also, side note, their concerts are not funded by radio stations (they have sponsors like Hyundai or coway sometimes now) so they don’t get access to radio that way and even when BTS perform at a iheart radio event, they still barely played them at all. So I see your point on possible machinations and how they can apply but it’s not really the case here. Also, agree that Spotify/streaming platforms are awful to artists. They pay a fraction of a cent and their playlisting system is corrupt and more pay for play. So basically you have to pay to earn a fraction of a penny. It’s garbage and need to be fixed. But streaming is the most common way people consume music and if the BB charts are supposed to rate artists on their popularity (it doesn’t but it’s supposed to) then streaming numbers should be included some way. Also, ARMYs aren’t streaming for money, it’s for publicity and because it is one way people (not only corporate interests) can influence the charts. When Boracity says to stream, she isn’t saying to do that instead of buying music or going to concerts. ARMYs are big believers in the importance of actually purchasing physical/digital music and we sell out every show but streaming does improve the visibility of an artist, so imo it’s good to do as well. But once again, I truly do enjoy watching you comment on the industry, BTS, and other artists too so thanks for reacting. I learn more about the entertainment industry from your videos and they give a lot of food-for-thought when it comes to possible new ways for ARMYs to show support. 😄👍🏾 Another good Boracity video is why armys don’t like kpop and the next bts. She also came out with a new video yesterday “why your boyband hiatus doesn’t apply to bts”. It would explain a lot of the hiatus and military stuff that’s goin on right now, so I think you’ll find it interesting. 💜

[@dici1396]

ARMY, please double check me, I’ve never seen a BTS concert sponsored by a radio station and I’ve tried to research it and haven’t found one.

[@NamuBang]

@@dici1396 never seen it either. BTS hits different

[@jennaeveliina313]

@@dici1396 it clearly says that theyre conserts are not funded by radios ect.

[@izzatys7037]

BTS buttering for grammy’s/going for after party for “socialising” are quite unlikely. They have mentioned many times that they have put a top notch quality music and want that to be judge and listen in a good faith. In my pov - MOT7 (Carl Jung concept) & Butter really deserved a Grammy. They have really outdone themselves. Now, with RM’s Indigo - if he don’t even receive the nomination than I gave up cause that album are a masterpiece. It’s a pure gems.

[@sharonnelson3713]

If buttering up the Grammy members is how you get a Grammy what is the real value of winning as the best of whatever. It seems to me that Grammy really has no core value and as it continues in this path it becomes meaningless to everyone except for those who win. I didn’t know about this with the Grammy until I started following BTS and I have lost all respect. I don’t care about it anymore and BTS doesn’t need a Grammy to prove to anyone how talented they are.

[@paus_52]

Like the members don't even go to after parties and he wants them to spend 6 months of their precious time to buttering up the Grammy's members 🤣

[@BAMMIE7613]

@@paus_52 ohh i cant imagine sending them alone to parties . JTBC listening party was them trying to ignore all people and stay in a corner sharing same drinks nd cuddling eo🤣🤣🤣

[@itsbonniefay2417]

They definitely don't need a grammy to solidify their artistry

[@rosepedal5466]

right

[@army4life456]

As for distribution...BTS only just signed the deal with Geffen last December. Prior to that Columbia distributed for them only in the US. UMG was doing distribution in Japan, so it wasn't exclusive for all over the world.

[@DrCheryl_Army2021]

BTW I am 62 year old with a Doctorate and am proud ARMY since 9/2021. Saw them at Sofi, Grammys and LV in 2022. Own complete discography including solo work!

[@Jurnalist_]

Big up on the doctorate. That’s real support the whole discography.

[@orchidmsc]

@@Jurnalist_ You'll find that alot of us have doctorates.

[@NanciBK]

Hubby and I are ARMY and own the whole discography as well. We’re OG GenX metal heads and I am an educator and he is a nuclear engineer.

[@OT7_DopeOldARMY]

Even today, Big Hit Music is a separate, private entity from HYBE, even though it is a subsidiary 100% owned by HYBE. A few months after Big Hit Entertainment rebranded as HYBE (which happened at the same time that HYBE bought Scooter Braun's company - April 2021), the company announced in July 2021 that BigHit woud be separated and remain a private company. My understanding is that it was essentially done to maintain BTS's independence, protect them, allow them to retain creative control.

[@yasminesb7947]

True

[@atlantis315]

the guys were also gifted some % shares of Hybe by Bang PD right before the company went public on stock markets. It s a small %, but it is worth tens of millions of dollars, b/c Hybe is worth BILLIONS. however small the shares, it must be a good feeling for the guys to be shown so much respect by their boss. It is not at all a common practice in the industry from what I know.

[@Zoubinouna]

BH was small and bankrupt I know they were praying for bangtans success on their knees

[@bangtanall7217]

I watched few of your vids & notice you mention that all these streaming doesn't benefits BTS monetary. The thing is, I think you know that ARMY are highly strategize. And we strategize on many aspects of BTS from the most major things to the most mundane. Yes, we will make sure they'll get the best charting on Spotify, Billboard etc but we also make sure they ''chart'' in monetary value. We make sure to buy their album & songs & even supports other ARMY who couldn't afford it. And we move by regions to make sure that they top most album & song sales. For instance, that's why you'll find them having number 1 in most countries in iTunes sales. For iTunes, if we notice certain countries haven't reach that record yet, we will start mobilizing. For KZbin streaming, we encourage premium accounts & if you don't have premium, ARMY are encourage not too skip ads. We want to make sure BTS gonna earn something from that. Well, we're funny. 😅 In fact, we pissed off KZbin at one point & they deleted 64 mil views within 24 hours. We are still mad about that. We also sold out all their concerts & pick a fight with Ticketmaster who tried to scam fellow ARMY. As for product ambassadors, or other advertisers, we also basically show our / their influence. For instance, JK once say he love one laundry softener. We outsold those softener globally in just a few days. About a year later (I think), that company collab with BTS to promote their products. This happened to many other non sponsored & sponsored products. We once backlog new Hyundai cars for six month bcoz there was more orders than expected. Just bcoz BTS bcame brand ambassador. And we talk about fashion that BTS wore so they can get more sponsors. BTW, BTS bcame LV global ambassador. Not to mention their official merch. It's war among ARMY. Those products would be sold out within minutes. Basically we stream but we also make sure they'll earn so they can make more music & be happier. Yes, it's very important for ARMY that BTS are happy. PS : Check Samsung. They started to have purple colored product bcoz that's ARMY official color & BTS r ambassadors.

[@blupand4]

Lol true. Did you remember JK was pouting since k army purchase all his favorite kombucha??? 😅 that was a funny vlive when he said “aren’t you too fast??’ Or something like that if I remember correctly lol

[@sc33h3o3]

samsung is 20% of Korean economy

[@daphnehernandez6270]

so true😂😂😂

[@rosiem3760]

Totally agree! ARMY will show support for BTS in any way possible. I stream and buy their songs/albums, and vote for awards. 💜 As an ARMY who collects their merch, it's a 'nightmare' when we see the merch being sold out in less than a minute! 😱 As we know, a large percentage of ARMYs are working professionals who have disposable income and can afford to buy BTS merch.

[@nancytamez1109]

I remember JK did a did a quick vlive while he was eating a salad and drinking that drink he likes Someone in the comments asked what he was drinking ! Then a couple weeks later JK did another vlive where he mentioned that his favorite drink was sold out! But the cool thing is that the company that made this drink was struggling do to Covid. They sold out there whole inventory! To thank JK for his help they sent him a case of it!! This is why the boys are so loved! They are not stars that are untouchable they are like family!! I’m 58 and I have three boys in their age group and I feel like they are mine as well! I support them anyway I can!

[@hattrick8127]

BTS was absolutely a true independent artist when they debuted by any measurement you would associate with that word. I appreciate what you said about the Grammys. I've worked in radio in the US for 20 years, and I wholeheartedly agree. But I don't think they will do that. They became successful in part by defying the system and not playing their games. It was done by necessity because Big Hit didn't have the money or influence necessary. I don't know if getting a Grammy is important to them anymore.

[@sc33h3o3]

i read a perspective that if they had won a Grammy it would have been possible for the military exemption criteria to be exempted to include Grammy award winners (specific so that not every kpop idol or kdrama actor would qualify, concern of military defense ministry); if true then i wonder if that might have been a reason to pursue Grammy

[@Stephanielaury]

We already do that. We buy ticket, album and buy products. Also we supported 100% but we can't denied that the music business like spotify made it possible for many army to access bts song because THEY ARE UNABLE TO GET PHYSICAL ALBUMS.

[@user-vd1hr5gj4l]

To answer your question at 19:16: a million times YES!! 😀. Bangtan is absolutely an independent artist who debuted from a struggling near bankrupt company. The group and company were industry outsiders and outliers to this day, even though in Korea, they have surpassed the "Big 3" entertainment companies in global impact, reputation, and success (financially and musically) Bangtan truly built that company (their label Big Hit Music) into the giant corporation of HYBE Labels today. Yet their journey still moves like an independent artist because unlike many in their field, they do not sign with Western labels but continue to control their own narrative moving with the Army. Also their having a distribution deal absolutely helps but truly lacks in a way that a fully signed artist receive benefits. Great reaction, as Jimin says, "You nice, keep going!" Also 39:20 thank you for recognizing the longevity impact of Bangtan's discography!!

[@marirezende8478]

38:20 spot on. That group songs' lyrics don't even make sense much of the time as well, it's all "Oh I'm such a bad b*tch ratatata I have lots of money and designer clothes boom boom boom". And I'm not even exaggerating, that's what's worse 💀

[@myaar7358]

FRRRR

[@ZoriNikolova]

For reaaal these girls just waste their talent for just media play, money ans popularity of their name, nothing artistic in them...

[@apriliyanarachmat79]

Boracity maybe will make bts vs grammy next time since we have beef with grammy too 🤣 Also, army are streaming bts songs diligently but we are aware that many artist wont get penny from the streaming platforms, thats why we always prioritize to buy their physical albums or songs. Bts has great sales number. Many other fandoms or gen public always guilt tripping us for buying CDs or vinyl in digital era. they push the narrative that it doesnt represent the music consumption. But we dont care, since we wanna support bts, we want bts to get the penny that they deserves. Don't forget to stream bts and their solo releases! We have to maintain our crown as best global recording artist!!

[@Omniscientquonky]

bighit was a small independently owned label founded in 2005, by the time bts were ready to debut, they had little money, a girl group that barely lasted a year, and a single soloist from the first act they managed who isn't often active. the girl group failing was a majorly wasted investment of money in the end (mostly not the label's fault but that's a story for another day lol), which left them strapped for cash with a group of boys to be their sole moneymakers. they didn't turn a real profit until 2015, when bts rapidly surpassed the rest of the idol industry in sales. from there they kept rising until bighit became a massive company and rebranded as hybe, the music side of the original company remained bighit, as an independent, privately owned label cut off from shareholders (a move by former CEO bang pd to keep bts out of shareholders' greedy hands) -- to this day there's one soloist and two groups only. to this day bts still singlehandedly make up 65% of hybe's profit. very much an independent powerhouse, a scary thing for any industry that's used to getting what it wants by throwing its weight around. bts piss off a lot of people simply by virtue of existing and not playing the game

[@tina-cu2xt]

Bighit absolutely was small independent label when BTS were formed. They even struggled financially for years after BTS' debut until around mid-2015 when BTS released their first hit called "I Need U".

[@dreamzbts6585]

18:45 Bighit was a very small label on the verge of bankruptcy & that is why BTS content was cut short or BTS was not even invited as other major labels had a very big hold over music shows & award shows BTS performed at red carpets not even the main show. Getting an opportunity to perform was a big thing for them. 2 years into their debut they had to perform for a fashion show in the background where you cannot even see them because there literally no light on them. They were the background music for the walk. They went on streets requesting people to attend their free concert. Since bighit was so low on resources, BTS used to use employees & managers of the members as extras on music videos So Geffen records ONLY distributes. We as ARMY really want them to do something to promote something cuz they don't do really ANYTHING not even a tweet to promote. Some even say because the profit Geffen will make out of BTS is very low, they don't really care. Like Life Goes On song got 6 radio spins

[@fatia4076]

Actually she is right their distribution companies in America don't do any promotions or just a little to nothing for their latest album proof that's when they did a deal with giffen believe it or not there was 0 promotions in America they distributed the albums and dipped

[@dreamzbts6585]

23:35 atleast for BTS for the entire world Geffen is not distributing. In Korea BH/hybe does it, in Japan a different label. The worldwide shipping that happens on weverse where you can buy BTS albums is done by Bighit globally. Geffen for BTS is only in the US Also only recently did BTS have distribution deal

[@a-ee7840]

Bighit was a bankrupt company at one point💀💀 they definitely a major company now but back in the day yeah, bts were in the trenches

[@chere100]

38:25 Completely agree. I look forward to listening to BTS even when I'm old and feebled, in a rocking chair, lol. ARMY for life. 🥰

[@rosiem3760]

From what I learned, BTS contract with Geffen Records is focused only in distribution to the US Market. For example, Asian ARMY buy BTS Albums (and merchandise) in Weverse shop. Weverse is owned by HYBE (where BigHit is a subsidiary) and Weverse shop does cater to Global, Japan and US market.

[@Jurnalist_]

This is true and geffen only got them in oct when the last deals of the year happen before the holidays. We verse handles the Asian market and as much as they can because they don’t have to profit share in those regions giving geffen control there would be a waste of money and harm BTS in that region. Idk who handles Europe but I’m sure it will be a subsidiary of geffen.

[@cg558]

@@Jurnalist_ it's Sony in europe

[@WilliamsAK07]

She's shedding light on the Spotify corruption and their relationship with BTS. She's not trying to say BTS is better than Drake, Taylor Swift, and everybody, she's shedding light on the fact that Jeremy has a relationship with Interscope and their artists are at a benefit with Spotify. Encouraging listeners to pay attention, stream their favorite artists, speak up, use your voice! Lol...Geffen is doing nothing for them, only support and promote artists that are signed to their label, do nothing for distribution contracts only. Have you seen Geffen promoting BTS, NO!!! BTS is and have done all their own work in getting be visible on their own!

[@explore.express.love.3483]

My personal experience of repeatedly hearing some other artists when listening to an album by bts is a testamony to Spotify being extremely biased. And I don't mean just any Artists, cause I always thought unless you have the premium version getting purely an albums tracks was inevitable. But SOME artist's tracks just show up OVER and OVER again and I never ever searched for their tracks. And if one thinks its popular etc. and that's why it keeps popping up then no. Cause I would then have heard many more trending artists tracks. Not from artists whose daily listeners itself is dropping. Moroever bts doesnt show up in others album listens the way some of these artists do. Cause i once occasionally give plenty of artists a listen and barely any interruptions to begin with. Inspite BTS tracks were heavy trending that time. And that's how it should be. Only then can you get a decent listen without being overly interupted. Also army are the literal examples of how language can break barriers. I particularly say army because bts is extremely diverse with their music with easily above 10 genres. And made in a very honest and authentic manner (not some disrespectful or cringe/uninformed attempt on a genre). If they are included in playlists that each of their songs genre fits into, then people would definitely search for it. If not every single one, a definite of 2 songs per genre will be searched for. Because they have music that could put u into a trance. The whole misconception around bts doing pop music itself begins with the way bts is put into their own box inspite being some do the biggest artists. And I stress 'ARTIST'. Not boyband, not idol, not dance musicians but pure artists.

[@janetuss6496]

Yes, Big Hit was not at all a major record label. They were a very small under-funded company that almost went bankrupt at one point. BTS constantly had to worry about being disbanded due to insufficient funds. Big Hit had no power or influence in the music industry, hence why BTS even had a lot of difficulty getting a spot to perform on broadcasts. I think the first time they got to perform was because someone dropped out last minute. And when they did get a chance to perform, their performance was cut short sometimes. They did not get the type of media coverage that other artists from big companies did. Big Hit also didn't have large established fanbases that big companies already had, they basically had a grassroots fanbase that slowly built up because of BTS. Big Hit literally grew only because of BTS's rise and success, but that took many years of struggle, even in their own country's music industry. Before BTS's success, the k-pop industry was dominated by 3 big companies - JYP, SM and YG. If an artist came from any of these 3 companies, they'd have a much easier time with many things. Including promotions, media coverage, performance slots, winning awards, etc. The Daesang grand prize award is the most prestigious in their music award shows. The winners of that award usually come from one of those 3 big companies. It's nearly unheard of for other artists outside those 3 big companies to get that award. But BTS won it eventually. BTS was the first group in a very long time that didn't come from any of those 3 companies to win it. That's not to say artists from those 3 companies don't work hard - they do. But being an artist in SM, JYP or YG already gets you a MAJOR advantage that other companies don't. They call it the "Big 3 Privilege". The girl group that was mentioned in this video is Blackpink, they are from YG. These groups work very hard, but they have many advantages being backed by a large, powerful and wealthy company. Their companies also already have large established fanbases who are ready to support many artists coming from the same company.

[@yasminesb7947]

I agree .. Also those big 3 have their hands on many medias and asian streaming platforms where often they are shareholders.... To this day BTS and BigHit apart their own platforms and shows they created (weverse, run BTS, KZbin channels, reality shows...), they are not involved in any of those platforms financially so their success was only thanks to them, their hard work and talent... I remember Suga was having a partial job at their debut to help buying their outfits and foods.... It was really hard for them

[@ruthfischer7615]

@@yasminesb7947 I heard the job was for university funding? and that eventually the label paid?

[@yasminesb7947]

@@ruthfischer7615 That's not what he said, he said something about working part-time as a delivery person to help with living expenses and clothing. You're confusing this with the fact that he initially hid his shoulder accident from the label for fear of being fired from the band but his label after finding out told him that they would never have fired him and instead would have helped him even with his college expenses. Those are two different things.

[@ruthfischer7615]

@@yasminesb7947 Thank you! 💜

[@led_by_pied_pipers1530]

28:15 i think that's what happened with colombia records. they did the bare minimum and "floundered". army were really not happy with how little CR did and when bts didnt renew their distribution deal with them and signed with geffen instead it just looked like CR really dropped the ball with bts. i remember army twitter celebrating cause they were so frustrated with CR.

[@BAMMIE7613]

please check out bts vs billboard bt bby gang mag too

[@Jurnalist_]

Coming up

[@BAMMIE7613]

@@Jurnalist_ THANKS🙂🙂

[@IThink2Much]

Big Hit started as a small, independent label. In S Korea, at that time, there were 3 big companies that dominated and idol groups coming from small labels were squashed by these bigger labels and their influence. They tried that with BTS (the only group Big Hit had back then). But BTS used other outlets than kpop groups traditionally used and grew despite numerous attempts to bring them down. There is a video of the hardships that BTS endured to get where they are now (BTS Hardships by xCeleste). I recommend it. BTS and ARMY have come through so much sh!t. BTS carried Big Hit for years. They couldn't take breaks because BH didn't have enough income coming in from other artists to sustain them without BTS. Which is why they eventually bought some smaller kpop labels and then bought Ithaca Holdings (Justin Beiber, Arianna Grande, etc) and formed Hybe (which BH is now under). They are finally able to have something of a break after working non-stop for years....which is pretty much the reason they didn't have time to schmooze the Grammys (which I don't think they would do anyway). And, ofc, BTS doesn't need Grammys to be relevant. I would much rather not see them spend 6 months of their valuable time sucking up to Grammys. But the Grammys (and all awards shows) are quickly figuring out that BTS is a big draw. People have lost a lot of the enthusiasm they once had for awards shows. And they are realizing that if you have BTS in attendance (and you treat them with respect), you're guaranteed a lot of interaction from a very passionate fandom. Otherwise, their numbers are going down. Honestly, I think the music industries, both western and eastern, are a bit threatened by BTS. They have proved that you don't need to go through the system to gain a worldwide audience. I highly recommend watching information videos on BTS. The more you learn about them, the more you realize just how amazing they are. Thanks for your reaction. I liked having a perspective from someone who has some experience in the industry.

[@JayneAngelinaSkye]

Geffen doesn't really do anything for BTS that's the sad part. It's like the vested interest isn't there. We always have to drag Geffen to post a link or something do something. They barely do anything.and BTS didn't win no Grammys thanks to these labels. Also I dont think they'll get a Grammys just for attending the parties. The ppl they want to win will win regardless if they mingle in that scene. And it would be embarrassing to do. They want to win off the quality of their music and although we all know that isn't the case with the scammys they only choose quality sometimes in a blue moon.

[@Jurnalist_]

Geffen is still very old school in their movement and thinking so social media post and digital influence I wouldn’t expect from them but they are one of the best to make sure your music is everywhere to be able to stream it or buy it. Could they do more and should do more. Yes they should. As far as Grammys yes doing parties for potential selection would be embarrassing to not win if they did that. I just know it’s very pivotal to younger acts getting that final selection. Hopefully they get one off the music alone.

[@alisong5011]

@@Jurnalist_ I haven't seen anyone mention this but BTS' label only joined with Geffen in, like, 2020. They were a small independent company until BTS made it big. BTS was their only group until recently and they still bring in 70% of the company's money. So I understand your confusion- they were a small independent label, even nearing bankruptcy before BTS's first big hit, which wasn't until their second album trilogy ("I Need You" is the song). Now, due to BTS success, they have more resources and have entered deals with bigger companies to help promote BTS internationally. Though they were unsatisfied with the game and I believe have already terminated at least some of those business relationships. Turns out they didn't like selling their independence and souls for more success.

[@imajinallthepurple]

12:38 I might agree with you if not for the fact that it's not the first time rules, charts or results have changed just as BTS were winning or about to break a record. 13:54 It's called "whitewash" and it's horrible. An editor overdid it to BTS's official pictures not too long ago. How those pictures ever got approved for release by Big Hit I'll never know but they looked like the walking dead and no, the fandom didn't like it. One ARMY editor even removed the whitewash - that's the version I kept. Horrible trend. 🤦‍♀️ 23:30 Geffen is only used for distribution though. But I do agree that it's a power deal and I accept that we'll never know exactly what any industry deal entails. 32:00 Except it shouldn't matter if you "hang out". That's exactly why the Grammy is losing it's meaning and importance. It's becoming increasingly about connections to an award that simultaneously wants to claim that it's all about the quality of the music. (When BTS went live with ARMY after the Grammy show these guys garnered a lot more views than the whole show did btw. 😏) Just Jurnalist wrapping up with speaking facts about the message of BTS's music. 👍💜

[@Jurnalist_]

They will continue to make these changes to devalue new media so radio is still weighted the heaviest as they were started for radio in its inception. Again doing it on the back of a foreign groups success is very suspicious.

[@annelamb3073]

Early on, RM was stressed because they were literally the only income and supporting BigHit and he knew all those paychecks depended on him.

[@melsb1825]

Oh you definitely need to look at the origin story :). The ultimate underdogs.

[@lealarsen2017]

yes they were BROKE they had 7 dollars each for food pr day so Jin the oldest members was the only one who had parents with money so he would use his father credit card to pay for food for the other members. when a kpop group sign to a label the label has to pay to housing food and training. also clothes and all of that. and then later when the memebers get their first paycheck after debut they has to pay the label back for all of that. so they first start to earn money for themself after that is being paid of. however bighit was so small that it took the members maybe 3-4 years before they got real money. and their first home was so cramped. you should watch their information video by taylor to know how small it was. for other groups they get as much food they want and pay off their debt faster and the amount is not that big either. that is why most want to sign with the big labels but if they don´t get in they try at a lesser known company. both RM and J-hope auditioned for a big label first but didn´t make it. but the others only signed with bighit. i think bighit only had 5-7 employees before they signed bts. after that they had to get a loan to hire more staff. like makeup artists and stylists. and photographers. BTS dance director said that in an interview with a English rapporter. so it was litterally from zero.

[@btsonyeonsam]

The reason they're considered independent artists today is because they're not signed to a label in the US (they exclusively have had distribution deals) and that's how billboard quantifies that for its charts. They wouldn't now be considered independent in Korea, although Bighit was definitely an indie label with very little money at the time they started out (nearly bankrupt at one point).

[@marip.9152]

Honestly, I wish their distribution were worldwide. As someone who lives in Brazil, a BTS album costs the same as my rent (yep, you read that right) with shipping and taxes because it’s imported from korea. I have a really privileged background so i can buy physical albums here and there but until i can see BTS albums being sold on stores and they make shows here regularly (they love Brazil but the executives here dont see money in kpop), unfortunately, streaming is how my fellow b-armys can properly support them.

[@flyushkifly]

18:20 stuff like this makes me wonder if you are just pushing our buttons. 😂🤣😂 Edit : this was a sarcastic joke. ARMY knows their shit, as you've seen. We know BigHit was on the brink of bankruptcy ~2010. We know they were seeking silent partner investors to the tune of $20-30 million, and we know who eventually put money in - repeatedly - to keep them afloat. (Do I remember his name? No. Lol but I used to.) BigHit Music grew from a tiny label, only representing a handful of artists, to eventually form a huge corporation - HYBE - and become one of its (4?) subsidiaries, BigHit Entertainment. HYBE rivals some of the biggest companies in Korea - and we're talking Chaebols like Samsung and Hyundai - and it is _the house that BTS built_. When it applied for an IPO, ARMYs invested. 😅

[@flyushkifly]

We also know how little Geffen and Colombia promoted them. They were very late to the game as well after HYBE was formed. BTS had already become known worldwide.

[@Grassisgreenbean]

How can anyone watch dubbed movies tho 😭😭 it looks so dumb

[@Jurnalist_]

They were very common in America for a period of time. I just think we got used to it. 😂

[@soobinsbluefairyashi5086]

I love hearing your opinions about the music industry & how it relates to BTS. I fell down a rabbit hole too of discovering your channel. Love to see an intellectual. Subscribed. 💜

[@Jurnalist_]

Happy to have you thank you for your time.

[@bbvistas7596]

Well, because ARMY is as large as it is, BTS revitalized vinyl and cassette tape industry when they started selling them back in 2018 or 2019. ARMY caused the big uptick on those kinds of physical sales. The reason BTS did that was to counter other artists exploiting bundles with t-shirts, etc that is also selling a digital access code that counts as a song or album sale. So these artists suddenly rise for 1 week in the 200 charts, and drop off the next week. They can't get sellout shows in the US. They are not being played on the radio. Streams and views fall off rapidly. While they may have top voting in one competition, they are barely in the top teens in other award voting. We see this a lot. Spotify with 5 million streams in a week coming out of a town that only has 5 thousand people.

[@kimallison9078]

No Big Hit wasn't a big company. Until Big Hit & BTS came together. They didn't have the backing of the other company.

[@cg558]

I love your content, but I just wanted to point out, your mistake seems to be assuming BTS are handled normally in the US or elsewhere. Very little to do with BTS will match what you're familiar with. No worldwide exclusive distribution deals - different big 3 company distributes in each market. BTS don't like or trust many parts of media or music industry. They create new platforms rather than working with ones they dont trust. They seem to always chose the hard way. Even distribution deals are a very recent thing.

[@jessicapierce3027]

Yes, Bighit was a small label, at the time of BTS's debut they only had one other artist signed who was active in music. We like to call HYBE the house that BTS built, because everything HYBE was able to achieve was possible due the the revenue brought in by BTS. When it comes to their American distributer I'm waiting to see how much Geffen is willing to do for BTS, because when Columbia music was working with them they only bothered to promote them when they had an Enhlish release. After that song became their first #1 hit the CEO decided he would co-write a song for them, and that was the only other time they promoted BTS to radio stations across the country.

[@BrilliantHuman]

38:22 Exactly. I'm not really much of a pop music listener, haven't been for a while. And truthfully, dynamite, butter and PTD are for me that typical pop sound and because I wasn't hearing anything else from them in North American media I thought that's all BTS was until I fell into the rabbit hole and really felt their sincerity. There are so many reasons that BTS was successful, they have a great team, they were hungry, they have RM & Suga who are truly musicians to support them (and J-Hope, but he was mentored by those 2 as well), and they are all charismatic AF...plus the fate of just really truly loving and supporting each other which feels really good to be a part of. It's hard to manufacture what they are.

[@cypressxsg4815]

I used to listen to spotify's playlist 'cause I used to be lazy of making my own. But when I want to listen to a specific genres that I know BTS should be and never find them. Spotify forced me to make my own playlist 😂

[@vikzytoria]

I respect your insights, for sure. But you speak from a position of the industry via western artists and labels. And you absolutely cannot apply those things to BTS and BigHit Music/HYBE. They dropped their distribution relationship with Columbia after Columbia always failed to properly handle their US distribution and promotion. Literally, BigHit will refuse anything that's not in the absolute best interest of BTS and their creative existence. Bang PD and BTS preferred to cut huge ties and knock out their own doors to circumvent the industry restrictions. That's why you'll see ARMY claim that BTS paved the way. Their every struggle is why Kpop is even relevant in the US after the first generation groups came and left. We rely on physical sales, streams (massively through Spotify, KZbin, Weverse, and shows they appear on), and digital sales. Those are the only things ARMY has learned to push BTS into the charts as long as we have. Geffen is only partnered as of October 2022 for a "coming soon" project. The Orchard handled their sales of mini vinyls and cassette tapes.

[@Jurnalist_]

I can only speak from a western perspective it’s the one I have. Moving to geffen because Columbia and UMG have dropped the ball furthers my point that they are just leeches but they did enough to make it worth leeching from the boys. Geffen I’m sure will be tasked to out perform the three prior western labels they have tried to work with. I hope Geffen does their job.

[@vikzytoria]

@@Jurnalist_ so do I. And I didn't mean it disparagingly at all! It's one of the crazy parts of being a part of ARMY. When you love the songs, you love BTS as people, and loving them makes you want to learn about all the things that made them who they are today and what they (and ARMY) have faced. And then all of a sudden you find yourself learning how the entire industry works because it is sadly up to us to find ways to beat the leeches and those who just don't want BTS to succeed. It's this ripple effect for sure. We are an intensely organized fandom that uses all our collective knowledge as an investment. Now, BTS were never fully signed with Columbia. They had a short-term agreement with them and really got hardly anything of value back. When MotS:Persona dropped, it was so poorly handled by Columbia on their part that ARMY was point blank asking the CEO wasn't pushing for radio play or playlisting. Instead, we rallied on sales and streams and still got that #1. That's just what I think we mean when we say that these record labels haven't yet even taken a bite out of the pie. The story of BigHit Entertainment, Now HYBE and BigHit Music (who only manages BTS) is crazy.

[@bbvistas7596]

Jurnalist, you will have some people coming in here for this reaction specifically. They should be nice and informative, right ARMY? There are some things that do not apply to BTS that may be where a US artist has to consider or deal with; ie BTS ARMY (the fandom) fights to get tickets for 100K person concerts, full-scale world tours in 32 locations for multiple days sell out in minutes. We will fly to S.Korea, Saudi Arabia, NY, LA to get anywhere they perform live. BTS do not need the US industry. There isn't enough space for all of us to see BTS perform in 60K-90K stadiums. Literally all BTS has to do is come to America to prep ARMY for music to come, tour to come, music to come like they did in 2020. Curse that pandemic. But for awards, all we have are streaming and album purchases in the US market. Radio rarely plays their music. Back to the real point, we also love to listen to their music and we do so on platforms from our phones. That's natural for us. Listening to radio is not. A dying breed.

[@joonie3lover761]

I guess we saw the same twt right?

[@eileencritchley4630]

True I've not listen to radio since 1995 ugg now I feel old.

[@lealarsen2017]

army also made sure that BTS albums would be available around the world. they would keep going to all the record store asking if they had the bts album. so finally they contacted bighit and bought some. and first then was BTS able to penetrate the US market. but it was slow because no show or tv station wanted to have anything to do with a kpop group because of the bad stigma surrounding it. so army did all the work for them and still does without help from the media. so BTS is very grateful to us and we are prud of them too. we have climed the Mountain together.

[@sharonlahaye5803]

Big Hit was so small that BTS members all lived in one room (bunk beds) with one small toilet. They went to a nearby smal family-owned restaurant for their meals. Suga even took a part-time job as a delivery boy while training. They spent up to 16 hours training. Jimin moved his mattress into the practice room. For their early videos, they used the staff’s cars and filmed in a garage. It was bad.

[@amiii5292]

24:35 Very interesting because BTS was signed to The Orchard from 2017/2028 to 2021. It was announced in October 2021 that they ended their month-to-month contract with The Orchard and signed to Geffen records, but they aren‘t listed on Geffen‘s artist roster. If I remember correctly, they had many problems with distribution when being signed to Orchard. Before that they were signed to Def Jam Records for their overseas Japanese activities. As many other Army have already mentioned Bighit was smaaaall when BTS debuted in 2013. Bighit was the first small and independent agency that was able to win against the 3 major music corporations in South Korea (YG, Jyp and SM) that had all the money and power over broadcasts when BTS started getting numbers. 16:28 I‘m pretty sure it‘s active corruption. With the release of Dreamers EVERYTHING went wrong. It was painful to watch. The song was leaked by Spotify, it didn’t top the youtube charts in the first week despite having the numbers and even if fans complained and wrote emails all week, Billboard didn‘t count 60 mio+ views… After Spotify didn‘t count streams for some songs by BTS and Jungkook and didn’t include them in the year-end lists fans trended worldwide the hashtag SpotifyCorrupt for hours, so Spotify had to do at least a little damage controll. Edit: 21:02 Yes! Jimin is behind V and the rest is correct.

[@sc33h3o3]

i think RM Indigo (released on 12/2) can be nominated for a Grammy for 2024, isn't september 23 the cutoff for the year? i think Coldplay X BTS My Universe was released on september 24, 2021 which is why they're nominated for this year duo/group performance.

[@lealarsen2017]

many like myself stream songs on youtube and sportify because it´s easier. but because i want to support BTS the best way possible i also buy their physical albums. because i also want the merch that is inside but the actual cd is rarely being used. also because many labtops dont have a cd player. but i also love to have the album on display on the shelves. army's are collectors. and the concerts are so hard to get that people fly all over the world to attend if they get Lucky to get a ticket.

[@dreamzbts6585]

12:35 I think the argument boracity magazine is trying to make here is not towards the top 5 artists like Drake or TS rather placing BTS there on top with those artists is a give away of the popularity BTS has vs the girl group Jeremy wants to push cuz they are nowhere near that list. That's why that section of video is titled how spotify is hiding BTS. The comparison that is being drawn here is not with those top5 artists but with the girl group Jeremy favours

[@bbvistas7596]

31:48 BTS does not go to Grammy parties. They were involved with the Grammy museum one time in 2018 for an interview. BTS does not even attend Grammy after parties

[@Fairy0345]

BTS comes from an Independence Company that were almost bankrupt, there are pictures online where you can see BTS recording songs in a garage, and even lived in an extremely small place

[@Danielle42381]

I think the theory behind Spotify being the industry is not so much hurting Spotify and those who own it but more attached to not having immediate access to more unique listeners. Streams also play a big portion of BB charts, immediately after radio. So you need to view her comments in this vein, as opposed to physically supporting an artist through physicals, merch, and concerts.

[@dinaarmymom9145]

37:22 No empty seats at a BTS concert unless they weren't for sale or last minute no shows. Otherwise, packed house every time.

[@marar8045]

You can see the dance practice videos they release for most of their songs and literally see the evolution of the company by seeing the evolution of their dance studio. Just like their dance studios went from a basement to basically half a floor of a multi story building bought by the company, their label went from a tiny unknown one to a corporation with ties in America and Japan.

[@annakim9300]

I guess you forgot but it is already mention in your previous video reaction that stated Bighit was a very small independent record label and Bts is the main resson they are what they are today.

[@Jurnalist_]

Yes but small major trying to stay alive or scrappy independent fighting with the majors is more so my question now.

[@totchi6]

@@Jurnalist_ I'm sure you got your answer a million times over by now but trying to stay alive is your answer! The company wasn't anywhere near the map the big three were on, and the fact that they're the top now is entirely because they put their trust and hopes entirely on a bunch of nobodies with a lot of promise and then kept on doing it even in the years they were floundering.

[@delasmercedes2940]

I completely understand your take on the deal between BigHit and Gaffen, because I was as mistaken as you are, expecting to find BTS music promoted and distributed under that label, as their big names are at my Canadian music store around the corner. Ain’t happening at all: One has to import BTS’ works directly from BigHit’s Korean distributor: Weverse Shop. I’ve just preorder for Can$129 the Indigo vinyl launched yesterday. I’ve paid a shipping fee that the same as the vinyl price and Im getting it in May-Jun. Guess what? I did the same with vinyls JINTB and Love Yourself: Her (launched last month) I’ve paid for all BTS catalogue similar shipping costs in the last 18 months, + for some merch. Then I have to pay for customs fees. Still, I stream from Sp and Apple everyday - Im paying premium so it counts more for the charts and mostly out of spite. Then there are fundraisings I’ve contributed a bit, so ARMYs who cannot afford purchases get to have their own. Am I uniquely crazy? Nah! ARMYs had it all figure it out, so I’m just a baby army catching up with the og ones, whose incredible commitment and hard-work for BTS gifted me the miracle of feeling young + passionate about music again by supporting BTS this far. I’m a 60++, whose roots are core motown/OG/punk/funk/rock +country indi fan+empty nester, w/ a 1987 pioneer equipment complete with a fav turntable. I never belonged to a fandom in my previous life, and Im having the time of my life. I also have a piggybank for their first concert in 2025. I don’t care where it’ll take place, I’ll be there. So, Don’t you worry, we, ARMYs have it down path. While BTS paved the way for K-music industry, and now the international ones, I tell you, ARMY from 2013 onwards have paved it for all fandoms across the world and continue doing so: BTS and BigHit producers+staff deserve it, the former as musicians and as human beings, the latter as visionaries. Thank you for your reactions, they are informative and entertaining, specially these ones on our comrade in arms from BoraCity.

[@ralphy383]

Bighit in 2010 was a bankrupt label that was staying afloat by Co managing groups from jyp entertainment run by Mr jyp. Mr Jyp and mr Bang shi hyuk were friends but had different ideas for the music industry. Bang shi hyuk was tired of all the really fake kpop musical acts that just get tossed after 7 years... he had left jyp. Jyp showed some kindness and since bang shi hyuk was only starting out, Let him have some groups to Co manage before starting out on bang pds own thing. Some of the groups bighit was co managing was 2 am and eight8. And a girl group called Glam (they later had a huge scandal and disbanded. We'll get to that) Bang shi hyuk got really desperate afterwards. He had ideas for a hiphop group composed of just rappers who could influence society... Sleepy, a friend of Mr bang, went to an underground hiphop performace, He found Runch Randa, a 16 year old. He went and informed Mr bang, NAMJOON was called for auditions which he fucked up but still got signed. Bang pd saw real potential in the kid and wanted to form a group around him. Bang shi hyuk then later fully formed his idea... a hiphop group named BPB OR BULLETPROOF BOYS. RMs buddies at the time, all his rap crew joined bighit to train... it included supreme boi, iron, i11even, kidoh. They made some songs together. You can find them on KZbin. They sent out audition posters. Suga found them and auditioned. Jhope was training under jyp and was doing dance battles. He later transferred to bighit for unknown reasons. So the og line up of now renamed bts, was 7 rappers. But i think it was around then BIGHIT lost their active group Glam (had a scandal involving the members who fought, ) (RM while he was trainee has written some lyrics for one of their songs) and went almost bankrupt and RMs friends all left, except for suga and jhope who stayed back. Then jin and jk was picked by their labels workers Who were really desperate... Through another round of auditions v and jimin were found. The trainees after the 3rd round were all singers. There were several other trainees who were in the line up.. bit many of them left cus bighit couldn't manage them and they were not cut out for the really harsh broke lifestyle. Broke as in broke... They had fungus growing on the walls due to water leaks type broke. 10 people sleeping in small bedroom. Jin was from a fairly well of family and he used to take jk out to eat. They had unseasoned chicken breast 3 times a day sometimes cus according to what V said in a TV show they couldn't afford anything else. Lmaoo Yeah so bts were the first fully active artist to be just under bighit. All other artists before that were just co managed with other labels.

[@Juju0LM]

Again , Your comments made me believe that the music industry isn't corrupt, it's just xenophobic. But , I don't agree with your statement that stream is not the industry. It is, in a sense: format. Spotify company is a popular and dominant tool in the US music industry Of The digital format. The fact is: Physical albums no longer sell. Trying to propagate the idea that not buying digitally or streaming will cause physical sales to sell again is unrealistic. I believe that favoring other streaming platforms is better than just boycotting Spotify. Making other digital platforms more popular than Spotify is, in my opinion, a better solution!

[@BrilliantHuman]

33:20 Then if it's truly not about the best music and artistry...fuck the Grammy's. False prestige. Maybe it's not being voted in by sales records, but if going to parties and rubbings elbows is what does it then it really shouldn't mean anything in my mind. BTS fan or not... I haven't been listening to mainstream music for many years now, except after I fell into the BTS rabbit hole this year so I haven't actually cared about awards shows much but this just confirms for me why I haven't.

[@missymisschief]

I work in AI Engineering and I have to disagree with the vision related to the future of the music industry. We are moving towards the VR faster and with more force than we anticipated.. i think that what we see now with this "wave of melancholy" towards older things and technologies is a natural response to the shock caused by the rapidity with which everything is changing... The time when the red pill and the blue pill are something real has finally come. With the state the world is in, not too many of us will choose to exist in this reality anymore.. And even if they do, this reality will be massively altered by the way things will be done and by the new status quo.. A few decades ago, I would've said that maybe I trust the human kind for this not to happen.. but we're becoming more ignorant, more unhealthy, more stupid, more desensitised that I just lost faith... Let's meet in 10 years and see how it goes.. :))

[@SnapCracklyPop]

8:03 When she said “benefited” them here, she’s not talking about benefitting artists but Erlich/Interscope/Spotify associated with/have a stake with these artists being high on the chart.

[@worldsnews170]

BigHit was a bankrupt company 😅

[@taptaphello123]

I think there were a lot of times you spoke in this reaction of course with your own lens before even listening to the point. I think we generally agree but your definitions are off because they're from your experience and not ours. If you don't believe that BTS is independent because they're tied to Geffen since 2022, well, how do you think they got there? I think you might find it interesting if you research Bang Si Hyuk and Hybe. He is the guy that help put BTS together and mentored them. He's the one that originated the vision creatively and business-wise. Hybe went public in 2021 and has many subsidiaries under its umbrella including the management team that handles Bieber, Grande etc. It includes companies that make the overall music experience (concerts, games, etc). However, even when he grew all of that and still under Hybe, he kept BigHit Ent an independent entity so that no board member etc can influence BTS artistically.

[@NanciBK]

In the beginning, BTS was taking gigs like backup music for small mall fashion shows because they only money the label and was getting was from whatever work BTS could get. BTS wasn’t getting paid for years after they debuted, but they were keeping the lights on at Big Hit. Big Hit was formed by a previous employee of the big labels who hated the way the music industry worked and wanted a new model that prized artistic freedom and artists‘ genuine voices. So not only were they mistreated as low status, they were direct enemies of the large labels who controlled the music industry in Korea. They had a vested interest in not allowing him to succeed and they bent all their resources on crushing BTS.

[@mariev347]

Ah.. Seria fácil se o tempo parasse e música se resumisse a apenas ouvir música ao vivo ou comprar cd's. Mas não. A grande maioria das pessoas nunca foi num show ao vivo, a grande maioria de fato ouve músicas nas plataformas de stream porque é mais fácil e DE GRAÇA (youtube e soundcloud, pelo menos). É assim que o mundo capitalista funciona, é assim que o resto do mundo funciona. As pessoas na vida real, os não-artistas, os não-fãs, que ouve sobre música só quando um artista chega no topo da billboard ou no top do spotify vêem o mundo musical dessa perspectiva. E mesmo se o army decidisse sabotar o spotify, tudo permaneceria da mesma forma. Borahae City tá certíssima; os únicos que seriam prejudicados seriam os meninos. Pois o Army sempre foi um grupo específico, nós não somos todos os ouvintes existentes do spotify, não chegamos nem perto, já que é uma plataforma mundial. Enfim, sim, o mundo capitalista é uma bosta, o mundo musical imposto pelos estadunidenses centralista de merda é uma merda.. Mas é assim que as coisas são.

[@Patricia-pm8sw]

Up until December of 2021 BTS were signed to a distro deal with Columbia and they treated them worse than an unwanted step-kid despite them being their biggest earner.

[@Jurnalist_]

Earner yes but they not getting to keep that much off what they earn and from what I’ve learned. BTS isn’t willing to do anything that would hurt the brand that would increase that profit. They underestimated them boy’s.

[@BrilliantHuman]

34:53 At this point BTS is beyond awards and charts...they are known and powerful. But I wonder if some of Army's focus on this continued narrative is just from the absolute need to support them and get them the votes and sales and charts and awards that they absolutely needed support getting early on considering they were being shut-out from typical promotions, etc. That, and to not disappoint BTS since they've been vocal about their fear of "the fall" in the past...

[@Jurnalist_]

I would say army support and focus and even bts taking their focus off accolades to just make better music are both just what an artist need. Meaning as artist we all want those accolades they are most likely how you found your fav that inspired you. They have the accolades of massive radio saturation, awards, sponsors, what ever it is they have them and we want to at a point mirror then surpass our inspirations. But when you really get in this industry for the music and what it can really do for and to people. You realize that having that focus on those accolades was a small box we created for ourselves. What we can do and do with music is magic and no accolades can enhance that. When you cross that bridge of understanding and you can be happy with that choice the Grammy or radio saturation or what ever it is becomes fleeting or my fav Korean word hyunta. This is why bts to me is beyond it but army knows that deep down despite squaring the meaningless nature of these things if they were to get one it not only makes substantial musical history it would salve a wound maturity can only allow you to carry.

[@itsbonniefay2417]

Yes, BigHit was not a major record label at all. They had a hard time promoting BTS and putting them on korean TV because they weren't doing great financially. Once BTS started to gain footing and were doing well, mostly in countries outside of Korea is where they began to gain the most traction, then BigHit was able to promote them more and put more into BTS financially. At the time they were losing more money than they were gaining and it was difficult to make decisions, not knowing the future of those decisions, like if there would be successes or failures. It took I believe 2 years for BTS to win a 1st place award for their song I Need You, which is big for the group and BigHit. It was a rocky beginning. The label and BTS honestly both grew from the bottom, a small company trying to promote this hip-hop group without a foothold in Korean television. Now BTS has been solidified as top global artists and "BigHit music" is now under Hybe Label, the corporation.

[@PasteisAwesome]

I didn’t even know there was a dubbed version of squid games 😂

[@Jurnalist_]

Exactly we do not care about nothing in America. 😂😂

[@PasteisAwesome]

@@Jurnalist_ 😂 I watched it with the subs! Even if I knew it had a dubbed version I wouldn’t have watched it. I’m not a fan of dubbed tv. Takes away from the authenticity in my opinion.

[@Jurnalist_]

@@PasteisAwesome I agree unless I found it dubbed I watch the sub version.

[@koldwarm257]

I don't listen to bad bunny but I'm from Spain and I can assure you that he deserves the position, I don't listen to him but I know almost all his songs and all the songs he releases have been a hit at least in the Spanish-speaking world and let's remember that this includes all of Latin America, bad bunny has a lot of fans and fills up concerts at very high prices, but even so, people do everything to be able to go to a bad bunny concert, so even if I don't like it, I can't deny that it's a very listened to artist, here in a disco they never play songs in English, people love bad bunny songs to party

[@fierte]

I'm not going to determine if BTS deserves the title of independent artist or not but I think you'll be able to have a much clearer picture if you looked into their deal with Geffen now and Columbia before. Columbia did some bare minimum promotion for BTS and they did that only AFTER BTS put out an English song. Columbia went all in with that song. Well as far as they could as per their deal with HYBE. Geffen doesn't even list BTS as an artist on their roster. Their role is just access to shelves and streaming platforms. But this is me speaking from my outside in perspective.

[@marirezende8478]

18:46 Yes, BigHit entertainment was a small independent label in Korea. They only had BTS and a duo of ballad singers at that time, the label was concentrated in one floor of a small building in Nonhyeon-dong. They didn't have much funds also. And yes, all of HYBE's success was thanks to BTS.

[@zeyv4551]

Well, if going to the parties will give you a Grammy, BTS will not get one. They never go to the parties. They would rather spend their time with ARMY.

[@somethinggreatishappening8536]

Perhaps musical group or simply artist work best to classify BTS. Or simply artist of the century.

[@kristinapetronyte3812]

I’m confused why you asking the question if big hit was a major label when bts debuted. I am bindge watching your videos now and I just couple hours ago watched two introduction videos that you reacted to that had information that big his was on the verge of bankruptcy at that time and that’s where most of bts struggles came from due to lack of resources. I just hope that you posting your videos not in order and at the time you filmed this reaction maybe you haven’t watched the other once yet 😢 other wise, it means that you just didn’t listen.

[@Jurnalist_]

So just because they were having money problems doesn’t mean they were independent let’s say. So I’m asking in this video for clarification sake. Were they a major label will financial issues or a small indie outfit with financial issues. Yes other videos have stated they had money issues but so did cash money records or no limit records both of which were independents at one point but are now major labels and were major labels like no limit records. They actually signed snoop and helped him bridge a time in his career after death row. I’m asking a very nuanced question as you can’t stay an independent forever. You eventually become a major no matter how you started. Columbia records was once an independent but now they are a major. So I wanted to clarify what the situation with big hit. Were they struggling and a major or struggling and an independent on their way to becoming a major as they are now.

[@kristinapetronyte3812]

Wow, I didn’t expect your such a detailed reply! Bang BD was a produced at a major label and decided to creat his own agency. Big hit started in a garage. It’s definitely a story worth a movie. P.s you are the most honest reactor I had found so far. The fact that you started reacting to BTS by accident is awesome 😂

[@bungluna9211]

Re: Bad Bunny, I think you've been going to the wrong clubs. I personally don't listen to that type of music, but it's played in all the LatAm clubs around here. He is huge in Spanish Speaking countries. As for BTS, yes, they qualify as indie artists. The fact that their company became so big is entirely due to their success. Others in the replies have given more detailed answers to this.

[@Jurnalist_]

Crossover and real impact is when I can go to non Latin spaces and the music is present there. Also the Latin clubs I’ve been to in Edinburgh are not playing him there currently either.

[@bungluna9211]

@@Jurnalist_ I'm located in Texas, so the population here is probably very different from Scotland. True crossovers are near impossible for non-English artists in my experience, so in that sense you are right. This is changing, though, or so I hope.

[@Jurnalist_]

@@bungluna9211 it is changing and faster than I expected. It is a slow burn but it’s on the way.

[@VAngel876]

At the time of Big Hit putting together BTS they were 3 guys with one group that they shared with another label and one solo artist that is it. They had this dream of putting together a hip hop group and so they strarted looking for rappers and did an audition show and promoted it with Bang Shi Hyuk sitting on a couch saying in Korean "We'll beat you with our rap, dance and singing skills". But for the first 5 years they were the only group that Big Hit had and they struggled for 3 of those years. After 2017 they started looking for another group then in 2019 after they had signed a new contract with BTS, in 2021 HYBE was formed and they started buying other agencies and grew but Big Hit Music under HYBE is still considered a small independent label under the HYBE umbrella and then Geffen became their publishing companies. So no they were not there from the beginning. I too believe that streeming is not music, it only feeds spotify, and those that know BTS know that watching them live is so much more meaningful. On the Grammies they wanted to stay there but because of the Korean military law they have not been able to spend 6 mo in the US. Maybe after they finish their military service.

[@CantFindAUsername01]

I appreciate the informative, honest takes here!

[@Jurnalist_]

Glad it was helpful!

[@sissyfart]

Before Geffen, before Hybe existed , they were with The Orchard for distribution. If I recall their partnership with the orchard started in 2018. Maybe 2017 at earliest.

[@ZariDV]

You always have such great input in your videos. You make sure to bring value to every piece of content and that's rare these days. I love how well you know the industry that you can clear up misconceptions and explain the way things really work. I think ARMYs tend to be pretty interested in knowing the inner-workings of the music sphere. I will say that when it comes to supporting BTS, it's incredibly incredibly expensive. They have incredible stuff and I'd buy it all if I could but my bank account says "Hell no" lol. It's damn near a bill to try to support the group fully or even half way. Streaming is often the easiest, most feasible way for many ARMYs. Especially international ARMY because the shipping cost alone on items is beyond ridiculous. For eg. I bought RM's album and to buy it, get it shipped, and have it cleared in customs in my country amounted to about USD$89.29. In my country that can do a lot. That's a grocery bill for one album. Not even talking about how much it would cost if I tried to get each BTS album plus their singles plus their solo albums. No one expects us to get it all but it's difficult to not be able to support the way we'd like to. You see the light sticks you see ARMYs waving at concerts? One ARMY bomb would cost me USD$129.74 to bring it into the country even though it's perfectly affordable on the website without shipping added. So yeah...streaming really is the way most of us can for sure support. Because you don't even want to know the cost of getting a ticket for a concert, paying to fly there and back, the food and travel budget, the temporary housing cost, etc since BTS don't tour everywhere. They've certainly never been in my country so it would have to be a full trip. I'd have to sell a kidney to go to one of those concerts ll. I'd love to one day but that's years of savings that I'd have to put together for just one night. With the way these companies are predatory with prices, especially to international fans, it's difficult to support the way we'd like. It shouldn't cost nearly 1/3 of my monthly mortgage cost to buy an ARMY bomb. So we do our best for BTS in other ways when we simply can't afford it by streaming hard, getting them charting and awarded, doing listening parties with other fans and picking which albums we want to focus on jamming out to so we can keep helping them break records. It would be hard with most other artists but I can listen to BTS all day easily with how different a lot of their stuff sounds so it's not like we have to force it.

[@wildlotus4339]

I think it is how business works everywhere on earth. It is unfair but we do not really need award or recognition for BTS. They are huge already.

[@Jurnalist_]

Very true but even knowing this we still want those Trophy’s. Getting them is very much hyunta scenario though.

[@charach7855]

@@Jurnalist_ 🤣🤣 How you love the word "hyunta" so much make me laugh so hard 🤣🤣

[@Jurnalist_]

@@charach7855 it’s such a good shorthand that can express so much. I get why it’s used in everyday speech and not just for in the bedroom. Understanding the usage of hyunta on a grand scale is actually hyunta. 😂😂😂🤔🤔

[@charach7855]

@@Jurnalist_ "Understanding the usage of hyunta on a grand scale is actually hyunta. 😂😂😂🤔🤔" Love your comment above 😂👍💜

[@juliamars6573]

Oh man. It's hard to find words for how much we don't care about some local LA party lovers. 6 months doing parties? Their time is sooooo much more valuable. Omg how can we explain it to him. I am frustrated.

[@Jurnalist_]

I get it trust. I also know as artist we still want these awards despite them being corrupted.

[@juliamars6573]

@@Jurnalist_ Yes. Yoongi wants them and now JHope too so we are supporting them as much as we can. But we still don't care. We just want them to have it bc they want it. Just like you want to give a shiny toy to a child. (I am old enough to talk like this)😊

[@TheTwil1]

BigHit as close to bankruptcy and the only group they had was BTS. Plse look at from nobody’s to legends. They ARE independent and are NOT part of the K-pop big three. Lol K-pop big three wishes.

[@deborahbardwell]

I love your reaction and insight! I was listening with undivided attention when you were explaining things!