Should You Buy The Instock Mode Envoy in 2023?

[@AndyVNguyen]

Use code ANDYV50 to get 50% off your first Factor box at bit.ly/3H9tJB3!

[@yvpetkov]

Finally somebody pointing out flaws! I'm kinda sick of the "influencers" in the hobby to be honest. All boards are hype, all are best value, all are flawless, until you get one and realize how many problems it has.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Definitely agree with you! Even when companies sponsor a showcase I make it a point to put it through the ringer and find what’s wrong with it so people know what they’re getting. As a result I get less prototypes to review but at least I can provide a valuable perspective

[@Francisco-gz5nf]

Doing everyone a solid. Everyone kept praising this board. If you pay a few extra dollars you can get a nice full sound from the modifiers as well.

[@martintheiner5779]

@@AndyVNguyen i completley agree with your statement about reviews. on one hand you can be grateful to get prototypes and/or sponsored units to review on the other hand you know as content creator (i hate the word influencer...) that if you do point out flaws of products you might just never get anything again which hurts content creators in the long run. i think alot of people think being a content creator is not a business but it is, and if there is alot of money in it for people they tend to not review everything objectivly because you know you dont want to bite the hand which feeds you. its hard nowadays to look for "truthful" reviews because you never know in the end til you get it yourself which is kinda ridiculous if you spend sometimes 500+ bucks for a product which needs sometimes ages to be in your hands. anyway im grateful you do the reviews you do even if it means you might not get to review certain products because youre not the "all is awesome" type. also i just noticed the spacebar sounds kinda wierd on the enovy ? kzbin.info/www/bejne/jqm8mKKritd-fNk like right there maybe its just me but idk man thats why i like your videos and black simons videos - minimal bullshit

[@bakeraus]

I'm with you on that, they are just hype beasts. Give people a honest review ffs

[@DJKr1z]

@@AndyVNguyen Hi Andy I found that you use the hotswap PCB, the inconsistent also cause by the standoff, that's why when you loosen up the mounting screw, doesn't fix it. on my mode 65 with hotswap board, having same issue with inconsistent feel and sound, after removing the stand off, now is good. I think all mode hotswap pcb, by default using unnecessary standoff (CMIIW)

[@lilfat3]

I sincerely don't understand why people are still looking up to unikorn. I have one, and it is indeed good. But it's an old keyboard designed many years ago. The custom keyboard community has really evolved since then. So if I'am looking at unikorn now from today's perspective, it's just a "good" keyboard, not an "endgame" keyboard anymore. If now I hear people say that a keyboard is "as good as unikorn", I don't even take it as a compliment on that board. Because nowadays, being as good as unikorn just means being an average good keyboard.

[@lagggerr]

Well I don't agree with you. I just recently acquired a pc unikorn and let me tell you it bangs really hard. It's definitely an endgame board. In reference I have tried over 20 + boards before getting it and for me it is really good. Maybe It's all preference but still for me the sound/feel is 10/10

[@Ray.F]

Thanks for the objective review, no one commented about the inconsistency in sound. It was reviewed often as if it was the next best thing since the invention of toilet paper

[@AndyVNguyen]

i was so surprised that no one mentioned it. every review is like THIS IS THE BEST KEYBOARD EVARR

[@x3LightNinG]

@@AndyVNguyen i mean it explains a lot if you look at who are spreading good words of it. literally every "big" keyboard streamers out there, mf even forbes made an article about how "good" it is, tell me the marketing team of mode isnt behind this

[@scruffy1471]

@@shynnsup8383 i don't know waht to tell you, the mods on the envoy sounded bad. There's not more he can do other than buy 10 envoys and review his aggregate experience, but that's unreasonable.

[@Ray.F]

@@shynnsup8383 I would usually chalk it down to a "revenge" review if it's nearly 90% negativity (peek the now deleted Keychron V1 review from Consumer Tech Review). Just because a bad point is mentioned about a board and 5 other good point is brought up, doesnt mean the reviewer is a hater. Sure, you can say that he was scorned by mode and delivered a scathing review, and I'll absolutely trust this review more than reviewers that received it for free and preach that it's the next best board to buy in the guise of "all opinions are my own". At least andy has mentioned both pros and cons about the board, and he wasn't the only person to point this inconsistency in sound though - brandon taylor did point it out too but again people dismissed it. I'm all for more reviews that talks about the good, the bad, and the ugly. No board is 100% perfect to the point it'll only receive praises without criticisms. I can tell you all the flaws about highly regarded boards too like the tomo, sonnet and the F2 that I have on hand currently. they are not perfect and have some mild annoyances too.

[@Ray.F]

@@scruffy1471 And if he actually did buy 10 envoys and found that some have no resonance in the same exact config, that wouldn't look good for mode's qc, wouldn't it? Haha

[@moldybread5733]

As a big fan of both Andy, and Alexotos(he is a big fan of mode): Not gonna lie with the cycle 7 and the neo out right now this board may be leaning more on the mid range part of the scale. Price to performance wise, they may not be consistent in terms of sound but the aesthetics can make up for it depending on the preference pf the buyer. Andy, from what I know, leans more on the sound department of the hobby, which is why I can understand his thoughts on the envoy. But imagine how chad it would be of Mode if they saw this and decided to send Andy more products to review

[@AndyVNguyen]

I’m definitely a sound guy! I’m crazy enough to desolder an entire build of something doesn’t sound just right. I know not everyone is like me of course. Mode has ghosted my DMs for a while but well see! Haha

[@Joker-bn5uq]

@@AndyVNguyen How do you think an O-ring mount board in a PC case (like the parallel beam 65) would compare sound wise?

[@jessicaho19]

Alex isn't just a fan of Mode, he's literally sponsored by them lol

[@CMLXMNDXv]

Yep Andy that’s why I watch YOUR content now. No BS, just honest, facts, and a lot of muskles.

[@0xBULLgogi]

Sorry Andy, I wanted to revisit this. I ordered a polycarb case and carbon fiber plate and MAN. This thing is my FAVORITE keyboard as of now. More than the Neo80, the Vega Ai03 and Bakeneko that I have. The polycarb case/carbon fiber plate is much different from the aluminum case/fr4 plate I was using. Yes there are inconsistencies on the tab/shit keys where the mounting screws are placed but that inconsistency does not bother since I barely use those keys? Anyhow I couldnt help but come back to this video and your criticism cause the alphas and spacebar sound AMAZING

[@AndyVNguyen]

Glad you found something that worked for you!

[@Aexeq]

I appreciate the honst criticism, but let's try and see the bigger picture. Every "budget" board has its flaws. Some have bad ano, some have bad sound in some way, some are a nightmare to build and some are just a boring fckin box on wedge since it's the cheapest to produce. The Envoy is not good because its the "Unikorn killer" or however you want to title it, but because its not a box on wedge design. Of course it has it's flaws, but it also has lot's of things going for it, and if thats just the in-stock status of all parts, especially if someone manages to break their PCB. Like all the big names praised it too much, here i just see the opposite, hating on it like a cult and calling it "someone really said the truth" like no, this is just the opposite of what the big names did instead of a totally balanced review. Sorry for the rant, appreciate the honest and in the end i just wanted to say, trust your own decisions and don't let reviews of your favourite contet creator vote for you.

[@alexossan2829]

Hi Fuji. I love the Envoy's smooth anodization finish, it's definitely a grade above my Zoom TKL, QK80 and QK60r2. I wish every anodized chassis has this kind of feel to the finish. It also doesn't seem to show any fingerprint, but that may be due to the green color I have. For gripes, I think the board has a ringing problem with switch top-out. Initially I loved how it sounded right after finishing the build, but there's something about it that stands out when I'm typing normally and trying to concentrate on work instead of the keyboard sound. But I'm actually not fully sure what that sound is. Need to try with a quieter switch when I get time.

[@0xBULLgogi]

I've assembled my Envoy with an aluminum case and FR4 plate using Gat Silver Pro switches and I'm not coming across the sound issue you pointed out

[@AndyVNguyen]

Thanks for the feedback! It varies from plate to plate it sounds like. A fixed copper plate and alpacas didn’t have as much of an issue either. So it makes me think it is is the plate hole that’s causing it

[@ternedo6074]

The right shift sounds like when you take the suppressor of your m4a1 in CSGO

[@HoveKB]

Mode even sent one to me to check out. It’s a really nice board. Especially the sound at the entry level. The weight is nothing special but the mounting style is innovative and it works. A bit squishy, but good enough to be a solid recommendation. It lived on my desk the whole time I had it. Really enjoyable.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Thanks for sharing!

[@CrustyRL]

How do u get one sent out to you? Neither of us have a lot of subs so ig its not based off that

[@traymount-ib1fl]

Appreciate the honest review

[@AndyVNguyen]

Of course’

[@theoverunderthinker]

I care a lot more about the feel inconsistency than the sound because most of the time I am using my keyboard, I am also wearing headphones. but I can feel the keys either way!

[@patiszejuicebox]

Hi Fuji! Honestly, I’ve only seen two people talk about the inconsistency in sound, and that is you and Brandon Taylor, and I’ve only heard of the inconsistencies in later protos that were closer to the production run. Now admittedly, I did buy the Alu ver of the Envoy. I’m sure I’ll be fine, or at least that’s my copium is telling me.

[@AndyVNguyen]

I'm scared for the alu.. because PC never pings. And if you think about it.. this is CF. which is non metallic. And the mounting, non metallic. And the case, non metallic. So how did we arrive at ping? also fuji says hi

[@raduluben]

For everyone that has a problem with resonance or ringing : if you are going to keep the keyboard on your desk, just remove the two screws that hold the pcb into the case. I was quite dissapointed with the resonance aswell, but after removing them it’s just perfect for me. Yeah the mods might sound a bit mettalic here and there but not in a bad way

[@burgosmatthew]

Yeah my right tab key and right shift still sound bunk. The rest of the board sounds pretty damn good. I am a little surprised that Mode went forward with this design, it just seems below their capabilities.

[@raduluben]

@@burgosmatthew honestly i’ve embraced that sound as i like natural, not dampened, metal keebs and plates. Also like alexotos said, you can hear the case but more of a resonance instead of the classic annoying ping. It just gives me the feeling of typing on this hunk of metal and for some weird reason i like it

[@Randomlosername]

Newer to the hobby, but there are definitely some points I disagree with. Mainly the mention of Inconsistency with the typing feel and how you didn't notice loosing or tightening the retention bolt made any difference in the feel. While building mine I was able to fine tune using the retention points and achieved a consistent typing feel across the board very easily. Giving it just enough bounce/flex to not get buried into the chassis while typing or when pressing harder on the keys. I am using a copper plate (with boba u4t's) and the alu chassis so idk if that attributed to anything on my end tho. Will def admit that the mods sounds a little thinner around the holes and that is def a point to mention so people are well informed. Definitely still really enjoy your content tho, but I am sad that you are gonna pass on the Envoy as it is tied for favorite in my collection so far right next to my Ginkgo65.

[@AndyVNguyen]

For sure I think the sound is the biggest culprit for those holes. Thanks for sharing your experience!

[@x3LightNinG]

ginkgo is def the superior one..

[@AndyVNguyen]

ginkgo went under the radar for sure. kinda lived in vega's shadow but didn't have any glaring issues

[@Randomlosername]

@@x3LightNinG yeah i definitely love it so much. I always find myself coming back it to it over and over.

[@Randomlosername]

@@AndyVNguyen fun fact. Your video was actually the one that helped me make my decision on purchasing it. So thanks for that 🙏🏻

[@Ozneb_]

It’s interesting that you found that the sound was weaker in the corners. Alex posted some sounds comparisons in discord of the Korn, foundation 60% and 3 of his Envoys and I didn’t notice the sound weakening around the holes at all. I guess I’ll just have to try it out for myself when my board arrives next week.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Some people’s mic setups pick up sound differently . I use a condenser mic that hears everything as it is and i turn off all processing. All I can tell you is my ears also hear the sound issues

[@0xBULLgogi]

Was this also the same on the aluminum case version of the Envoy?@@AndyVNguyen

[@burgosmatthew]

Alex also had a pre-production version of the board didn't he? All I know is that I have an Envoy sitting in front of me and Andy's assessment is 100% correct.

[@MrSkullhead0]

Sorry I had to comment again. To be fair, Alexotos did mention that there was ping if the screws were screwed too tight on the Alu versions of the envoy. I don’t think he played around too much with the PC variant because he didn’t like the PC edition as much. I know you’re not calling people out on their reviews, just thought I’d mention it to others who might go psycho and come after the other reviewers.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Thanks for sharing. Chat definitely brought that up and I loosened it all of the way. And then took it out.. and then the sound was still there. And I realized it wasn't the screw. lol

[@MrSkullhead0]

@@AndyVNguyen I’m curious if other oring materials other than the orings provided would help?

[@AndyVNguyen]

It feels like plate and pcb design. but I’m not sure

[@mr.guillotine3766]

I agree with you. These days there are far too many options at damn near any price point to settle for one that you're not going to be happy with. Now, obviously for those who really enjoy the modding aspect, getting a board you are mostly happy with, and then doing the work yourself to get it to where you really want it, can be a great thing, but some flaws are too big to overlook or require modding in a way that makes the board too jenk. Hell, even poor people like myself have options in our budgets, though those can be harder to figure out due to the fact that most folks aren't going to be doing too many reviews on the ultra budget options, but they are out there if you dig around....so may as well get something that you'll probably enjoy for your budget instead of settling just because you want the company to have made a good product. It's ok to admit that something fell short, that's how the good companies can learn and grow...

[@Keebkollector]

Hi Fuji! Thank you for the review!

[@LittleBahamutGTR]

Thanks for confirming to me that even with a half-plate on a Unikorn, the the board is still stiff compared to my other half-plate keyboards. I still like the typing feel of my Unikorn, especially the space bar. I am waiting for my 30A o-ring to see if I can just soften it up a bit since I don't want to compromise using a 1.2mm PCB. Don't want to change plate either since I already like the sound from a half-plate aluminum.

[@AndyVNguyen]

yeah the unikorn is NOT flexible! i was told this so much and i've tried a million builds and they all hold pretty sturdy no matter what. it's not bad at all, it's just not "flexible" like these flex plate and flex cut pcb boards. half plate alu plate is goat in korn

[@ImOnMy116]

for whatever it’s worth, I don’t have a Unikorn, but in my bakeneko I’ve used a half plate with a SNOP 60 PCB (1.6mm) which has flex cuts above and below the alphas, and it definitely has more give. I think you definitely lose some volume vs. a non-flex cut PCB (I also have an H60 PCB for comparison, which is 1.6mm with no flex cuts), but if you wanted more give (particularly with a stiffer material half plate), that may be something worth exploring. Just be sure to be mindful of compatibility with the Unikorn daughterboard/jst placement before pulling the trigger on an aftermarket pcb.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Yeah the flex cuts will do that. But up until the most recent run, the Korns came stock with non flex cut pcbs.

[@ImOnMy116]

@@AndyVNguyen I’d definitely say that’s the right call for most people, especially since the majority of the hobby probably doesn’t want to solder, and in my experience/opinion, there’s very minimal if any typing feel benefit from flex cut PCBs paired with a full plate (as you’d expect for hotswap).

[@BokehhBob]

solid review, kind of harsh on mode doubt they'll send you product LOL I did notice once I switched to a POM plate the areas around the case screws sounded much better. At the end of the day how many people are actually spamming those specific keys though. I dunno. I think for the price you really cant beat it atm in the 65% entry level range. Most boards at this price point need foam to sound good.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Lmao yeah I ain’t getting anything anymore. The price at launch was pretty solid. Right now, it still wins for instock. The cheaper boards are still group buys iirc.

[@assumzaek]

Appreciate the honest reviews you're putting out!

[@FranktheTank319]

I found that the unikorn is pretty stiff. It's not flexible at all, but it does have that o ring flex. But the envoy doesn't really come close to the sound. Also, I noticed how rattley yours was when you were comparing two boards together. Wtf

[@AndyVNguyen]

Yeah the envoy isn’t perfect. It’s good enough for the price and availability but people seem to not want to accept that. They want unikorns and kohakus to be viewed as bad keyboards

[@g4rg4ntu4]

I built mine on Sunday - it arrived over a week ago but I had to wait for my long pole stabilisers to arrive. I built it with fr4 + all foam, alu + no foam, and a few other configurations in between, and I feel it's a good looking keyboard, but the inconsistency in the bottom right keys (around the right shift) will cause my poor OCD ears to melt over time. Same issue top left, but less pronounced. Also left shift isn't great either for some reason - I've tried changing the stabilisers and still doesn't feel great. For me the experience has been slightly disappointing - it's a good looking board, and it mostly sounds great, but it is slightly let down due to marked inconsistency in a few locations. IMHO I prefer the sound of my Bakeneko 60 which to me sounds more consistent across the rows in comparison.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Wow so the foam doesn’t even resolve the sound inconsistencies in those areas? I didn’t have time to test it but I was leaning on Taeha’s suggestions to use a little foam. That’s disappointing. I know some people legit don’t even use right shift so it may not bother them but that is still a shame

[@g4rg4ntu4]

I haven't given up yet. The latest configuration is case foam, alu plate, solid block mounts, no other foam. This is the best configuration I have tried so far. The inconsistencies seem to be masked somewhat with a harder mount. Also, I screwed the plate to the case more tightly. So in my experience the less bounce, the better the sound - but it's all subjective of course. All the same, even with a harder mounting style, it does feel quite soft when typing, which is pretty cool. My recommendation so far - the best sound for me comes with a harder / tighter mount, case foam, and no plate / PE foam. I'll keep playing with it because I am a tinkerer. I might even post a video of the different configs. @@AndyVNguyen

[@xristinarose2409]

Yes ok but the kihaku and unikorn are nowhere to be found. Even 2th hand on ebay not for sale so what good does it to want it and not getting it? At least mode is in stock and actually buyable

[@AndyVNguyen]

yes, being buyable is nice.. but doesn't change what it is. it's a decent sounding keyboard with inconsistent sound in some places but it is not a drop in gummy o ring mount keyboard. the sound and feel are different there are a lot of good gasket mount and drop in o ring boards that are purchasable secondhand (which is what most of the hobby is) for dirt cheap today. all the qk/owlab/cycle stuff can be purchased new

[@xristinarose2409]

Im new to the hobby and dont know the difference between drop in o rings and gasket mounts 😅 i dont even know what any of this means. Just build my very first board and i really love it tho i forgot to buy stabilizers but it is already sounding and feeling better then anything ive ever had

[@SheenValentineLi]

I spent days wracking my brain on why my Pluto's spacebar sounds so shit, but then after I watched your video today it hit me. The Pluto had the same exact issue where case sound is reverberating when I'm using the spacebar. This proved to myself that I wasn't crazy! That some boards just have that issue. I'll try to tape mode my Pluto and hope it minimizes the issue.

[@AndyVNguyen]

oof spacebar hurts

[@TheWeaversofEternity]

So you said there are plenty other boards for the price or cheaper that are better than the Mode Envoy, but didn't mention any of them. Could you please possibly elaborate? Thanks.

[@AndyVNguyen]

QK and cycle

[@iqowo2867]

As another person with a preordered envoy pc I can’t notice any sort of standoff noise. But in any case this is quite disappointing to hear for what seemed like such a promising product.

[@AndyVNguyen]

you're lucky! enjoy the board

[@Stranger.8888]

I've just got my envoy. There is a big issue with the sound of the Q key compared to the W key. The sound of the Q is so much different from the W key, though they are next to each other and in the same row. the r4 row sound is significantly different than the rest of the row. I have to say that I had a bad experience with the board.

[@burgosmatthew]

You should take a look at the build guide and make sure that you have properly aligned the board onto the lattices. I don't have sound issues with the Q key but definitely do with the TAB and Right Shift Key and Enter Key just the same as Andy.

[@Stranger.8888]

​@@burgosmatthew sound is different even when the board is not in the case. the Q key has a higher pitch than the rest.

[@Stranger.8888]

@@burgosmatthew There are two giant holes on the plate and the PCB for the screw used to secure the PCB. It's the design flaw. Even when I took the screw out, the sound is not improved at all.

[@KarmaBluntz]

Would you recommend the envoy65 over the zoom65v2? Trying to build my first board and have been recommended the envoy over a lot of other options but it seems like you brought up some very valid and easily evident issues with the board that most haven't mentioned.

[@AndyVNguyen]

envoy, other than the sound of those few keys, sounds better than zoom65v2 imo. but zoom65v2 will be more consistent

[@KarmaBluntz]

@@AndyVNguyen Thanks for the reply but I ended up ordering a neo65 for first build. I'm in on the rainy75 preorder and looking to get the f1-8x v2 as well now though. Thanks for your honest reviews and opinions!

[@jessiequema2494]

Appreciate contents like this. I rarely see a content creator roast studios like you do and this is why I don't trust most content creators if all they do is rave about the product. To date, I still watch your Best Keyboard for 2022 content. Hope we see more content's like this from other creators. Hope you get more sponsorships.

[@EnnTomi1]

thank god not everyone is coping. I guess my wait continues

[@AndyVNguyen]

what specifically are you looking for in a keyboard that you're waiting for?

[@TC0598]

Just by looking at the comment section makes me realize that many people in this hobby are so easily triggered, those fanboys for certain content creators or board companies only want to hear the things they want to hear, even the actual owner of the board is giving his honest review they still don't give a damn about it, once the review is negative, they'll just be salty about it. which is super sad. it's really nice to see someone like you to give out the honest review, so that customers won't get misled, and get to know the full picture of the product. nice vid!

[@AndyVNguyen]

THANK YOU! I disagree with one take and point out one issue on a board and people are acting as if I waged war on Taeha and Mode. I just wanted to bring to light that the board is good enough, but not as good as it was being marketed. I'm a sound guy and it missed a sound mark.

[@johnliveonsky]

@@AndyVNguyen Sound depends on a lot of factors so prescriptive statements don't make a ton of sense. People also talk about sound differently. I don't think any of this makes the board better or worse as it is extremely subjective and depends on a lot of factors including your build and cofig. Even Alexotos addressed these claims and I quote: "I have 3 personal envoys and have built a bunch at this point including the proto and none have that issue". He also said: "I can't perceive any critical sound difference. I mentioned in a few of my streams that over tightening the screws on the envoy, mainly the all alu one, may result in some metallic sound. So just dont over tighten it!" He also provided sound tests with these messages. No offense but I rather take his word for it (and the majority of other creators and reviewers) than yours. I think the board is pretty darn good and it might be the best 65% of the year.

[@MrSkullhead0]

So close to getting mine. I’m second guessing my POM+PC envoy combo here. Imma put nixies in it because I’ve only heard PC envoys with long poles. Don’t know what you have planned on content but I’d like to see a video comparing the numerous mounting styles we have nowadays. I have seen things still being sold as tray mount from the Hibi June, all the way to geons plateless tadpole. It would be fun to see a history or thoughts on what the mounting style means to a board.

[@AndyVNguyen]

mounting style history sounds like a GREAT idea!! thank you MrSkullhead

[@QualityScrub]

Carbon fiber all the way. It’ll sound fire

[@brocky]

After using the Mode Envoy for about a month, I'm still trying to figure out how to configure it perfectly to reduce the pingy sound coming from the right side of the keyboard. The two screws holding down the PCB to the case is not a good design idea. I think it would've been far better for us if the Mode Envoy was a two piece case design, which would allow us to use a force break mod if we choose. The lattice mount is a gimmick as not every lattice is equal (some are stiffer and harder than others). The black mount is what I prefer to use since it's consistent. I still love the look of the keyboard. I think the silver mirror looks fantastic on the accent and the weight. Definitely not a Unikorn killer. Unikorn is perfection in sound.

[@AndyVNguyen]

thanks for sharing. that sucks.. i didn't even think to squeeze all the lattices to see how it felt. it wins in aesthetic and instock but the rest is just ok

[@Misfirem]

im so excited for mine to arrive tomorrow.

[@AndyVNguyen]

New toys are always fun. Sometimes I buy things on Amazon just to get that feeling, knowing full well I’m likely not gonna keep everything lol

[@Misfirem]

@@AndyVNguyen yup its always a fun feeling lol. I appreciate your honesty in this review, hopefully things still turn out well when I build.

[@AndyVNguyen]

what config do you have?

[@Misfirem]

@@AndyVNguyen green ano with CF. wood accent, silver bottom.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Green and wood, NUT Get it? Cuz it’s like a tree

[@x3LightNinG]

really a cool, collective, and objective review. by all means its one of the best boards within its price range, but i agree there are too many coping users saying its next to the best of unikorn cuz some of the streamers say so... like cmon

[@albertko1]

That's why I'm very curious how the Neo65 stacks up against this. They have a very similar core features and the Envoy certainly has more customization and aesthetic detail... I do like that you point out the flaws in the details on the production run boards. Nobody else is doing that.

[@AndyVNguyen]

I should pay for shipping to get more production run boards. After the elementg67 fiasco (the GB runner changed design after he hit his MOQ) I'm super sus of what happens behind the scenes

[@Babigoldfish]

Many Vietnamese streamers said neo65 is better. No hollow, resonance and better anode compared to this

[@albertko1]

@@Babigoldfish got my Neo recently in red and the anodization is very impressive. I built with the gaskets and it's nice and soft, sounds amazing as well.

[@dannythomas7784]

​@@Babigoldfish and know they know that when swap to plate like carbon fiber, the corner pings af

[@KarmaBluntz]

What boards would you recommend over the Envoy that are available in-stock for 65-75% layout in a similar price range? Trying to do my first build and seriously considering the Envoy but I wanted a deeper more muted creamy thocky sound signature while the Envoy seems pretty bright.

[@AndyVNguyen]

maybe tomo?

[@KarmaBluntz]

Thanks for the reply I'll check it out.

[@QualityScrub]

The bottom foam eliminates all resonance in my testing. Also, different switches have different levels of resonance. Not all have the issue to my ear. For example, Gateron Raws have no resonance in my poly Envoy, but I’ve added bottom foam in my alu one with Obscuras.

[@AndyVNguyen]

I find that long pole switches alleviate case hollowness and we used long pole switches here. That's good news that case foam helped!

[@mattdemoraes]

Really like the objectivity you’re trying to offer, though I think Mode bringing a $200 board with this much customisation and mostly great sound is pretty great. I think getting too bent out of shape about perfect consistency in sound at this price point we might be getting overly critical of makers doing their best and delivering a good product. I can think of many many makers producing garbaggio at higher price points 🙂

[@AndyVNguyen]

Mode instock can’t be beat here. I literally can’t think of an alternative. KFA tried to instock products and they … can’t lol.

[@mattdemoraes]

@@AndyVNguyen cheers for the reply pal. I think it's both great that you highlight some of the things that aren't perfect and great they've managed to bring us this product. Always a fan of your content.

[@tantran2711]

What’s your thought of mode 65 in 2023? Worth $300 price tag?

[@Ragnorok64]

Dang it man! I built mine on friday and quite enjoy it. I dont know if I ever would have consciously noticed the inconsistency without you pointing it out in this video. I still like my board and I typically wont be jamming away on my tab or right shift but I'll never be able to unhear it now. The finish and appearance are sick though, so even adjusting for potential copium, I'm still satisfied with my purchase.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Haha just try to enjoy what you have. I'm kinda just here to ruin peoples day LOL jk. I just have to point out these things because people trust me to be objective.

[@Laughadaffadil]

based@@AndyVNguyen

[@Rivek]

I feel exactly the same way. Well said!

[@SuperMoose333]

I really wish that I would've watched this before picking one up. The main thing that I am interested in for a board is the sound and the envoy was so hyped up. Its a solid board, but the sound was definitely different than I expected

[@AndyVNguyen]

I did this as early as I could! The sound is good if you never hit mods lol. It’s just not as perfect as people said it was. It’s just good

[@SuperMoose333]

@@AndyVNguyen exactly! I couldn't agree more 👌

[@HoaiNguyen-mm9ze]

Would you choose a bakeneko over this in terms of getting the feel/sound of a unikorn?

[@AndyVNguyen]

1000 times yes

[@whaaaat_scoobs]

I kind of naturally stopped using my Envoy and it is mostly because of those stupid fkn screws they used to hold the plate/pcb in the case. What a terrible solution. I too have to leave the screws loose to the point they wobble in the case because otherwise the board is just way too stiff. I like Keychron levels of bounce/flex, when I can get it, and I was disappointed in the Envoy for that. They could’ve come up with a better way I think. Maybe use the 3D printed pads around the edges to snap in the pcb somehow, like those pencil eraser gaskets on some boards, I think Geon has that style right? Either way Mode is mostly great, Sonnet is one of my GOAT all time fav boards, but the Envoy was a miss for me. Oh well what’s another $250 wasted it’s not like I have 5 other boards that did me the exact same way in my guest bedroom closet lol…

[@fnvfanMSPR]

I don't like the Envoy at all. It resonates and the lattice blocks have horrible QC. I went back to my QK60 R2

[@AnhBoyDad]

Honest is honest 😤 thumbs up

[@oliviachan5051]

Thank you Andy for the honest review. I tried asking Alex during his stream about the sound inconsistency near the standoff and whether it happens in those other board that he built (a qc issue in production run). Unfortunately did not get an answer. Sad sad. I am wondering taking all into account, would you recommend bakaneko60 or neo65 or cycle7 if I want to get a budget board for my bf?

[@AndyVNguyen]

I haven’t gotten hands on neo65. But cycle7 for something quieter and more refined and has arrows, Bakeneko for the best sound (just lay down paper towel in case to adjust for hollowness) and best mouse space for gaming.

[@euzelvillanueva3886]

You need to transition from keeb vids to Fuji/Jackson vids

[@kename1280]

Fr hes so washed now he needs it

[@imjustinb]

Any other keyboards with a poly case that you recommend with similar RGB? Really love the clear frosted cases, and the price is throwing me off for this board

[@adrewyn]

Hi Fuji :D Good vid Andy, Envoy reviews are hella lopsided. BT was the only person I saw who had any negatives to say about the board, and some of the fanbase (y'all know who you are in Alex's stream chat) were mad salty and dismissive over it. BT wasn't even lying, the board tipping cause of top row is real. Does it affect normal use? Nawh, but even with light force, any forward pressure will make it happen and it's a valid critique. And for context, I actually like my Envoy. My Envoy is also a game changer for me cause I mentally resolved myself and I'm ready to hard commit for my dream board. It's time to start praying for a win in the Kohaku raffle, and goddamn if that PolyHaku ain't a beauty!

[@AndyVNguyen]

fuji says hi back! Yeah it was so odd to just hear so much good coverage, I thought this was gonna be a home run. It's still pretty good, just not what I expected. I agree with the tipping. It's crazy that people will be dismissive if there's any criticism. When we stop criticizing these products the designers will stop innovating. There's always room for improvement and people should always be asking questions IMO The polyhaku is so niceeeeeeeeee. The RGB fish is the bees knees!

[@てぴぴぴぴ]

I'm not sure if I get the tofu65 2.0 or the mode envoy. Which one should I get ?

[@AndyVNguyen]

tofu65 is more consistent but quieter. mode envoy has some inconsistent sound but has poppier alphas

[@ojgimpson]

What boards would you recommend in this price range that are better? (Besides the Bakeneko)

[@AndyVNguyen]

I'm personally waiting for the 65/TKL Cycles If you need instock, you have to grab something from extras during the time frame it's available. As for any time instock, you gotta go with Mode.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Check this sound test of the Cycle7 twitter.com/andyv_nguyen/status/1691829835105173778

[@phykios]

I appreciate the honest thoughts, everyone has different opinions on every board so I respect you standing on your own opinion. But I have a question, how does the alphas alone compare to the unikorn? Because honestly, for me, if the alphas and space bar come pretty close to the korn, with the price and availability of the envoy, it might be worth it to me. Also what's your fav switch that you've paired with your unikorn?

[@AndyVNguyen]

MX blacks on alu, sp star fr4, inks on CF were my favorite combos!

[@SevericK_BooM]

In my experience the board with the still mounts is super duper stiff, the space bar flexes because there is not a mount under it, but everywhere else it almost no flex

[@AndyVNguyen]

Are you using the foams?

[@SevericK_BooM]

@@AndyVNguyen only PE

[@AndyVNguyen]

yeah PE shouldn't make it stiff, odd

[@aramriley7062]

In all honesty…..the closest sound I’ve gotten to the unikorn was the newer mode 65 with fr4 plate,cream bottom, copper weight, durok gold stabs and obscura switches anthracite caps, and full lattice blocks all around with plate foam ….. consistent sound all over the board and really close to the unikorn sound if not right there with it!….its hard to hear the difference

[@AndyVNguyen]

i think that's just the long pole switch sound

[@zivens.2407]

Hi fuji! The sound of the mods don't bother me as much, but I do wish that the sound inconsistency had been brought to my attention. It's just about the integrity, you know? With that said, you said the protos didn't have the stand-off-like things; I wonder what made them go with that implementation?

[@AndyVNguyen]

Yeah all I heard was super hype for the board and no issues. I don't know what the proto had, but the production run has no standoffs to have a proper "retention screw" design. It's proper but that big gaping hole was def an issue

[@ziich1]

At the end of the day people need to remember how subjective this hobby is. Feel sound and looks preferences are literally different for everyone. Take review videos with grains of salt not gospel. Understand the review style of the person reviewing the item and don’t buy simply based on a review I treat board reviews the same way I treat smartphone reviews. Either way thank for this one. I like you review style and the opinions you presented

[@SagaSynthetics]

Always a pleasure watching your videos Andy! 😄

[@AndyVNguyen]

thank you for the support!

[@TheManicGeek]

hi fuji I am having even worse acoustics issues with my case since I went with Alu... like it's legit pinging from Tab over to "T", and in the bottom right it pings all along the arrow cluster and right Shift. FR4 plate, Multicolor SS accents and weights, switches are full nylon with a standard length POM stem, keycaps are DCX, no foams, no stand-off fasteners. I'm actually even noticing the issues with the retention fasteners removed, entirely... maybe the issue has something to do with the cutouts for the lattice block mounts? That's the only other point where the PCB/plate assembly physically connects with the case, otherwise maybe it's time to play around with my foam kit I got and see if that helps, or maybe even a different washer material for the retention fasteners.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Fuji says hi back! Someone pointed out to me both Alex and Taeha used some form of foam.. I’m sure that was to mitigate sound issues. So unfortunately that’s prob your best bet

[@TheManicGeek]

@@AndyVNguyen Yeah I re-built it with the case foam Mode sells as an add-on for Envoy, probably what they used. It's dull enough now that when sitting at a normal typing distance I can't really make it out much without having killed all the character of the board.

[@erones]

Hi, what was the grey keyboard that Envoy is being compared to on the sound test? It sounds so good! I'm not sure if I just missed it on the video, but I saw that it was a 65% keyboard and got me thinking that that is not the korn

[@Ray.F]

Looks to be his Kohaku

[@AndyVNguyen]

Like Ray said, it's my Kohaku

[@nickashmore5972]

This is the only honest review of the envoy. I cannot stand mine. Built it every way imaginable, different plates, different switches, foam and no foam. The alphas sound great but modifiers are hot garbage to the point it’s unusable for me. I’m selling it.

[@AndyVNguyen]

here here.. yeet it

[@ancientalien815]

And you hear the screws rattling too if they are too loose. Its kinda lame.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Def didn’t realize that but yes, too lose and it’d definitely jingle around

[@ohdeer1823]

damn its until NOW i realized why this vid has so many downvote.....its a PC envoy which has the weakest sound profile amost all envoys.....

[@AndyVNguyen]

oh i didn't know it was the customer's fault for buying the PC keyboard Mode sold

[@ohdeer1823]

@@AndyVNguyen i think it comes down to judging the board with its weakest variant or something like that :/ still, not everyone has a mv7 to gaslight themselves into thinking mode's "lesser neo65" is a decent board for no-foam (im trying to print gasket that could secure the plate without using retaining screws, along with adhesive pe sheets just so it can compete with neo lol)

[@CrispySenpai]

I’m curious if you feel the same way about the aluminum case. The only pc board I want is the moontower

[@AndyVNguyen]

alu would honestly sound worse. pc usually covers up sound issues like this

[@x3LightNinG]

the pc kohaku actually sounds pretty sick, you can check it out

[@chuyees]

nobody talking a out how he casually deadlifted 455 or something?

[@sandy-vd3sl]

ok i want a board that is under 230, and i am cool with 65% to a 80%, (if i could choose it would be 80%) what should i get, i care about the sound and feel most but want something that looks cool, what are some good options? (i have been out of the keeb hobby for a bit and want to get back in)

[@AndyVNguyen]

qk80?

[@sandy-vd3sl]

okie, i have been looking have not bee able to find something more then that either lol@@AndyVNguyen

[@Cloud-lc7wn]

Thanks for your honest review, Andy! I guess I'll keep my Vega for now until I can get a Kohaku lol

[@DMCnME]

Great content Andy. Preference is king and “sound” is so subjective. A bunch of influencers trashed the qk75 and it’s my daily. I’m a fan of Mode but I’m skipping this board. I need a function row so I’ll save my money if the new Loop.

[@JaLLY77]

Are you gonna do jelly evolv keyboard?

[@AndyVNguyen]

they haven't really been talking to me after i reviewed link65 and said it wasn't worth it lol

[@JaLLY77]

@@AndyVNguyenooooo I see,, love the vids btw!! U a real one

[@AndyVNguyen]

Thanks for the support!

[@onehitking9124]

hi fuji, oh yeah andy, are u gonna try out the neo65 and do a comparison with the mode envoy?

[@AndyVNguyen]

mode envoy is going back to the owner who's immediately selling it lmao. i haven't had anyone reach out about the neo65 so probably not

[@onehitking9124]

@@AndyVNguyen aw, I can't believe it man, u are one of the most like entertaining keeb enthusiasts for me. People should sent more review boards for u to check out and have fun.

[@AndyVNguyen]

Thanks for the kind words man. I’ll see if I can reach out about neo65

[@alexfung7417]

Hi Andy, Is it still worth it to get the IRON165 nowadays? (due to the price and other factors), thanks for the vid.

[@AndyVNguyen]

It still looks good and if you can get it well under retail it still is an good enough sounding keyboard that looks great. People were saying they could get Iron160s for like almost half price lmao and that's a great price to get it.

[@alexfung7417]

@@AndyVNguyen Im seeing around $450USD with the SS accent. Do you consider it as a endgame kb in 2023, thanks for the reply.

[@kaeroseon]

@@alexfung7417 If I remember correctly he said its tough to get the Iron165 to sound good with linears which is why he isnt a big fan of it. Maybe with some modern long poles it could sound good? Idk.

[@alexfung7417]

Sound is not my consideration, Im just not so sure if its still an endgame in 2023, and is the price worth it in 2023.@@kaeroseon @AndyVNguyen

[@kaeroseon]

​@@alexfung7417I really don't know as I'm also one of the few people that wanted it as an endgame. But if you really enjoy the design and don't care about sound I say go for it as it's your board, your money.

[@jenslingspaint3523]

OMG I need more Fuji content in my liiiiiife.

[@AndyVNguyen]

haha i'll try to bring her into future videos!

[@adriancpm]

Speaking of Korn what’s your fav build on it since it’s been a couple years old now? Hi Fuji!

[@AndyVNguyen]

FUJI SAYS HI BACK Ink on alu half with locked 7u bottom atm. I stan inks

[@adriancpm]

@@AndyVNguyen nice but what is a locked 7u!? Lol

[@AndyVNguyen]

a plate that doesn't have 6.25u spacebar compatibility. only 7u. so there's more aluminum. it's a custom plate i ordered

[@MrNikkiMilano]

Hello, I have a question, i have a choice to buy one of following boards - tofu 65 2.0, mode enjoy 65 and mode sixty five. So according your video i realize that there aren't any big difference between envoy and tofu, but what about sixtyfive doest it bring much better experience than tofu and envoy, as according to the some youtubers sixtyfive is the next level board is it true? so i have a oppotunity to buy tofu for 125$ on the other hard sixtyfive costs around 300$, so doest the overpay of 150$ worhth it and i will really get next level typing expiricence?

[@AndyVNguyen]

You will not get “next level” 2x the typing experience by spending more imo. The typing experience is tofu 65 2.0 is very nice. The sound is OK. I’d probably lean towards sixty five in general if I had the budget but you could be just as happy with the tofu 65 2.0. I enjoyed my tofu60 2.0 when I used it.

[@rexammus]

honestly I don't see why anyone would pay premium kb pricing for plastic boards. GMK67 is a very competent board, it is insanely competitive in the plastic keeb market and realistically nothing even comes close to the money to quality ratio the GMK67 provides. This thing coming in at 200$ could get you a keychron Q2 or even a zoom65. Complete bonkers price point for nowhere near the quality you deserve.

[@serbadork]

Honestly you know the market is crazy when you even have someone like Redragon coming out with pretty decent 75% polycarbonate keyboards like the elf pro with foam dampening, and gasket mounting, for around a hundred something bucks. The market for mechanicals has gotten so good now that you can actually afford to be choosier depending on what you want out of a keyboard and what you can afford to buy. You can buy one of those boards at any micro center or order it online whenever you want now! It’s kind of nuts how much the keyboard scene has progressed from when I started back in the mid 2010’s.

[@AlexMcDermott]

How do plastic boards compare with alu? I’ve only had alu custom boards

[@AndyVNguyen]

Pc is deeper sounding and less chance of hollow or ping sounds

[@robothtml]

I have a 223 aluminum Tiger 80 and a 120 dollar PC Tiger Lite. The lite sounds miles better and the Alum Tiger 80 is a PING machine.

[@AndyVNguyen]

@@robothtml cheap plastic sounds MILES better than cheap alu

[@ojgimpson]

Would be interested to see you try the alu version as well

[@Hahahanoyes]

Im sorry but i just don’t hear a difference between $90 keyboards and these. Its in your heads

[@involuntarysoul3867]

so i guess no MODE collab then?

[@AndyVNguyen]

They worked w me before! But all good they have grown to not need me anymore

[@kingmidas430]

Can’t tell if you’re just upset with the comparison to unikorn or if you don’t like the board. Seems like this was less than a review and more that you were upset with another reviewer comparing to Unikorn.

[@AndyVNguyen]

the comparison should not have been made and i personally dont like the board for the price range since new, better things have come out

[@kaeroseon]

I mean a majority of it was a review and praising it for what it is. But with the NEO65 around the corner it's hard to justify the Envoy.

[@kingmidas430]

@@kaeroseonThe Envoy is a higher quality of board than the Neo65. Keep in mind the Neo 65 might be your preferece for cost/quality ratio but the Envoy is a higher quality.

[@kaeroseon]

@@kingmidas430true, in terms of manufacturing no doubt the envoy is better. But the neo has a similar mounting system with oring mount as a bonus and doesn’t use screws leading to a more even sound. It also has wireless if you need it. And for a similar price there is also the tofu 2.0 which I think is also slightly better than the envoy, there’s the zoom65v2 and cycle7 which aren’t as minimal but also higher value for money.

[@Babigoldfish]

Neo65 has better anode, doesn’t have hollow mods and resonance. The Neo hasn’t been out yet when you made this comparison. Why you have the need to defend the envoy that much?

[@lazypanda1493]

Can you recommend another PC board around this price point？

[@AndyVNguyen]

cnc pc at this price point is unheard of imo. the china gb's don't do cnc pc often. so if price is your main constraint, this is the best option

[@lazypanda1493]

Thanks, yeah pc boards are expensive af

[@sumojo]

Got this board and was disappointed with the sound too. The hollowness and inconsistency in feel just isn't it for me. Decided to use the pcb foam and silent switches and the issues went away. It's okay for a work keyboard but again, kinda disappointed I can't enjoy the acoustics of it.

[@AndyVNguyen]

yeah throwing foam fixes it and at least taeha said that as well. but we shouldn't have to fix it with foam for a board that was touted as one of the next best things. i'm a sound guy too so i would not buy this board. even if the pc and rgb look nice..

[@MN-re3nd]

just received my Envoy and am loving the aesthetics and sound - but to be fair, i am still a relative newcomer ("only" have a qk80 & jris65) and am nowhere near as experienced/critical. in your opinion, what should a next step be in terms of a 65%? assuming budget

[@SevericK_BooM]

I’m fairly new as well. I have a dolphins75, qk100, and nuphy halo. This is one of my best aesthetic boards, green envoy, wood accent, grey keycaps, it definitely looks great. My space bar sounds below average though. I built the envoy with only PE foam and fr4 plate

[@x3LightNinG]

i personally recommend ppl straight ip jump to end games or whatever you think its cool if you think you’re staying in the hobby for awhile. its a waste of money to me if you get 10 cheap boards before reaching the premium ones, just dive right into it and settle with it

[@huymichael5641]

Honestly it is all about whether or not you want to spend some bucks on them or not. Premiums board are better finished or better in term of sound but of course they are not 2x or 3x better than a board half its price. What I think you should do is that to just do some researches and gives premium boards a try, I know some people who keep settling for budget or entry boards that grows bored of the hobby until they started trying out the higher end boards.

[@gargin1633]

Can you provide a few alternatives that you would go with within this price range type beat?

[@AndyVNguyen]

I would go with Bakeneko if you want korn. But there’s just not a lot of instock options year round yet. Mode has that market

[@ohdeer1823]

have you tried replacing the rubber ring on those 2 screws with poron or killmat?

[@AndyVNguyen]

Not 100% sure but I remember the kids still being off with the screws not attached at all so idk what killmat would solve

[@ohdeer1823]

​@@AndyVNguyen not sure if its my makeshift killmat rings on the screws that makes it sounds a bit more acceptable, still kinda off but not as terrible as yours, but i think this has got to be the most genuine envoy review ive seen so far, its not THAT bad but still kind of a disappointment

[@ohdeer1823]

@@AndyVNguyen Neeeeeeeeever mind* GOD they sound atrocious after I ran out of copium

[@AndyVNguyen]

lmao you revisited it?

[@ohdeer1823]

@@AndyVNguyen (fixed the typo) I did, been using tomo for a while then switched back to envoy just for fun- it was not fun, one could say the flaws make me appreciate tomo even more but like the alphas are so bright and crisp until you hit those two keys and they ruin the whole experience :'(

[@LS-is5ob]

off topic but what tshirt are you wearing? looks like it has a really good fit :D

[@AndyVNguyen]

Urban outfitters relaxed fit. I think it looks like a garbage bag but my wife said that’s the proper fit so yolo

[@harapeco0o]

I'm about to buy this board, but when I saw your review, it makes me think twice for it lol love the design and looks, but the inconsistent sound and feels will be the deal breaker so bad for me

[@AndyVNguyen]

i feel that

[@steppbrooEFT]

Now you really gotta get your hands on an alu envoy man. With all due respect, PC envoy sounds weak af, even with the copper plate. Though the issues you mentioned still exists on the alu version, it definitely is something special and a cut above the boards at its price point.

[@AndyVNguyen]

themanicgeek just replied to a comment below saying his alu envoy is pinging worse lol but yeah alu with all the options is gonna look great

[@steppbrooEFT]

@@AndyVNguyen hmm my envoy has no observable ping, even in recordings but mine has a copper weight, could be why

[@annoto997]

hi fuji! thanks for keeping it real as always. although i jumped on the bandwagon and got the envoy T_T.

[@AndyVNguyen]

fuji says hiii! but hey the envoy looks pretty right?

[@annoto997]

@@AndyVNguyen Yes it looks really good. I got the alu olive coloured version with the walnut accent and shiny polished steel weight. The ano is immaculate. Passed on the PC though cos no funds, hahahaha. The PC looks pretty with the RGB though.

[@AndyVNguyen]

oofff walnut accent. PC is super nice and it's a decent way to get cnc pc rgb 65%.

[@annoto997]

@@AndyVNguyenmaybe i will pick it up another time just for the RGB and nice alphas. I think the spacebar is pretty decent too!

[@AndyVNguyen]

I don’t have a pc rgb board right now and the rgb in this looks so nice

[@kayseeday]

Great review as always. I've always wanted your insight as to what is the best silent switch and board combination for office work. I wonder if this will be great for typing feel with silent switches or if you believe that there is a better board for the money or overall. We office workers are out here 😂

[@AndyVNguyen]

lmao i wish i could help but i barely have any silent switches!

[@engboonhau9673]

OMG... I bought envoy kind of early of the pre-order and it is arriving within september and only i get knew to this... Lots of reviewer just say they feel nice, but not mentioning pings near the standoffs. planning to built no foam with CF plate and owlab neons, but the ping just break my sweet dreams

[@AndyVNguyen]

I normally would say long pole switches reduce hollowness/ping but these are gateron cream sodas and are already long pole.. might just have to put some foam in

[@engboonhau9673]

@@AndyVNguyen will have some experiments when my board came. Have some thoughts in mind but still need the board itself to do so. Thanks for the honest review!

[@AndyVNguyen]

I hope you enjoy the board regardless! There has to be a way to mod around the sound concerns

[@hoph19]

should I get a second hand unikorn? been considering getting premium 65 for a while

[@AndyVNguyen]

unikorn is a 60. but if you can get it like 1k or below sure.. but the aftermarket is too much

[@snawsdesigns]

Andy, what do you think about sonnet?

[@AndyVNguyen]

I heard good things but it gets expensive quickly

[@AndyVNguyen]

Also someone in comment says top mount kinda hollow

[@snawsdesigns]

@@AndyVNguyen Thank you! Can you recommend some 65% keyboard to get a similar sound to kohaku that I can buy now? The price is not important, as long as it's in stock.

[@AndyVNguyen]

instock is tough. you should look into aftermarket. if you join my discord people can help you figure out something www.discord.gg/weeng

[@NuhUhmm]

Def hyped low end board. Hype pushed it to a “mid” tier. Also, hate mode bully discord mods.

[@AndyVNguyen]

it's a solid budget low end board with nice finishes. but the budget level went CRAZY in the last 6 months so envoy seems a little outdated already damn their mods are bullies? how so?

[@NuhUhmm]

@@AndyVNguyen asked a legit question about the timing of their drops. members flamed me and mods jumped in instead of giving legitimate answers. made me lose interest in their products.

[@jalexanderc]

hi fuji not that I felt invalidated before watching this review, but this vid def made me glad I got a sixtyfive before the envoy was announced. top mount on top!

[@AndyVNguyen]

FUJI SAYS HI BACK! top mount is solid. the sixtyfive wasn't the CLEANEST implementation but top mount is more interesting over time than gasket imo. i'm leaning more towards top mount these days if i can get it.

[@jalexanderc]

@@AndyVNguyen fuji!!! I agree, it took me a number of rebuilds and mods to finally be satisfied with my sixtyfive, but I've landed on sp star ayaras (basically meteor whites with 2 stage spring) on fr4, and it's, as you would say, MONEY

[@leafyeon]

... i'm glad I waited for ur vid of this...

[@AndyVNguyen]

if only they sent me a proto to review. i def asked.. and got ghosted