The Truth About a Big Law Firm Salary

THE TRUTH ABOUT A BIG LAW FIRM SALARY//The current law firm starting salary has hit the $205,000 mark, and that has the potential to create an interesting law firm lifestyle predicament. Because the truth about a big law firm salary and how much lawyers make is that the most important part is to maintain financial freedom so that you can leave a law firm whenever you’re ready.
The big law lifestyle can be seductive, and what to know about a big law firm salary is that it develops this power to keep lawyers where they are. Check out this video on how to give yourself the gift of financial freedom so that you can learn how to pursue a legal career that you love (even if that career is staying at a law firm long-term)!
Let me know any questions you have about the law firm lifestlye in the comments below!
Angela
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Check out my playlist of other LEGAL LIFESTYLE VIDEOS!:
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Top 5 Myths About Lawyers: • Top 5 Myths About Lawy...
Why I Became a Lawyer: • Why I Decided to Becom...
Girl Lawyer War Stories: • Girl Lawyer War Stories
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• The Truth About a Big ...

[@AngelaVorpahl]

👉🏻 Download the FREE GUIDE: “Best Questions to Ask in Law Firm Interviews": launch.angelavorpahl.com/best-questions-to-ask-visit Let me know your thoughts on the video! Have you had completely different or very similar experiences with law firm salaries?

[@Robsonhigh]

Fantastic and very meaninful video! I could also resonate with this alot as I have my own start up but not in law.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@Robsonhigh Thanks so much! It definitely applies to all types of jobs I think, especially the difficulties in creating a lifestyle that's dependent on a certain income and then trying to give yourself the permission to walk away. Also, cheers to you on your start-up!! Entrepreneurship is so incredibly impressive to me :)

i loved your video. Nice explanations and interesting details. Thanks for sharing your experience.

[@joecrispin6043]

What law school did you go to and what type of law are you in now?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@ I'm so glad you enjoyed the video!! Thanks for watching!!

[@El-Wifer]

I’m 25 years in and have kept my expenses at a level that I could afford my life on 1/3 my income. That has allowed me to pay college tuition for three children, save for retirement and know that if I became unemployed or walked away I could continue on without too much panic. People try to push me to buy a bigger house or get another car (we only have one between a married couple). I don’t need a bigger house. I need peace of mind. Thanks for getting the word out.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Heck yes!! That's awesome!! Exercising that kind of restraint is really difficult and counter to the strong consumerist culture we have, but yours is a perfect example of the freedom that comes from living modestly! Cheers to you!! :)

[@CompletedReview]

People in non-major cities hear $205k and think it's a lot of money. Keep in mind that $205k in NYC is the equivalent of making $70k in Charlotte, NC. The cost of living in NYC is extremely inflated. And that is the primary reason why the salary is so high.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hey, Jack! You're totally right that the cost of living completely changes your buying power from city to city, but the crazy thing is that 10 years ago or so more regional legal markets started matching NYC salaries and bonuses, so now young lawyers can achieve much higher earning power in places like Dallas, Texas (for example)! I made a video comparing this "buying power index" if you want to check it out! kzbin.info/www/bejne/gYWveWmOo6-Wa7s

[@jamalnasir5648]

Yes, but $170k is still something like $12k a month after taxes for a single person withholding taxes at 0 deductions. Considering she paid $2300 a month on rent which is what is normally associated with high cost of living in NYC, there is still plenty left over for the month. The issue is the life style. Taxis, food, alcohol and most likely a drug habit if you are a lawyer or investment banker in NYC is what kills your budget. You can have the same lifestyle in Charlotte, NC and blow your money just the same. Doesnt matter if your rent is cut in half by moving there.

[@dustinjdeal]

Yes, the COL in NYC is higher but it’s not THAT extreme....it’s much better than only making $70k in Charlotte.

[@jamalnasir5648]

@@dustinjdeal correct. A 6 pack of beer in NYC does not cost 4x more there than it does in North Carolina. It costs a couple bucks more. If you buy a 6 pack and chill at home instead of 'going downstairs' and spending $100 on food and drinks, you wont have money issues even in NYC. Doesn't matter where you live if your lifestyle is like that. Growing out of this phase eventually happens no matter where you live but is especially hard in NYC because the temptations the city offers especially to younger people. I feel like this is why the lady who made this video always thought the NYC life would be temporary.

[@Kevinschart]

lies... $205k is a lot of money in any market. rent is double in new york, but after that everything else is marked up to a lesser degree.

[@umairagha4455]

so you were basically Harvey specter -Works in a big firm -moved to manhattan, new york -loves eating bagels -is a good lawyer -makes lots of cash before she worked as a pro bono lawyer

[@AngelaVorpahl]

haha I NEED to watch that show so that I can fully appreciate these Suits references

[@JoaoPedro-bd4pe]

she became more like Mike afterwards xD

[@OiVinn-eq1ml]

More like Donna lol

[@JoaoPedro-bd4pe]

@@OiVinn-eq1ml why donna?

[@OiVinn-eq1ml]

João Pedro Looks & acts like her

[@tiffanyferg]

This is fascinating! Love the concept of the golden handcuffs, I never want to get stuck in a life that I wouldn’t be able to sustain on an average salary

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Agreed!! The concept is unfortunately very real, but I think that talking about it and drawing awareness to it gives us a good shot at helping people not fall into the all-too-common trap :)

[@Domdotcom1996]

I found tiffany ! ☺️

[@pawsnotclaws2772]

tiffanyferg omg hi Tiffany 😆

[@rachellekelner8719]

tiffanyferg wait this is so crazy I love your videos, but you’re just chilling in the comments??

[@margaretd3710]

I'm a retired lawyer who was always in a solo practice. I had planned on working for a public interest or non-profit type of firm/agency but when I got out of school the economy had tanked, so there I was practicing on my own. Personally, I loved it. I did a lot of pro bono work because I always viewed being a lawyer as an opportunity to help people. So I never made a lot of money; in fact, I could have made more money as a legal secretary! But it allowed me to work from home so I could care for my children - and I have a daughter with multiple disabilities - and I needed that freedom. I'm in my 70s now and don't regret a day. Just wish I'd made enough to pay of those doggone school loans! I'll be paying on them until I drop in my tracks.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Margaret, this is an incredible story!!!! Any chance you would be interested in telling the story of your legal career for one of the upcoming videos?

[@criminallaw9573]

1) You earned less than a secretary and 2) you never could afford to repay your loans. That is an absolutely typical outcome for a law school graduate and a great set of reasons NOT to go to law school. I hope others learn from your example and make better choices.

[@Jorora]

@@criminallaw9573 L take and no one cares. Some of us actually care about helping others and don’t just look at a big pay check. Plus there are plenty of ways to work for non profits and help people and then get your loans payed off through public service forgiveness. You also missed the point where at the time the economy wasn’t doing hot and she couldn’t really get any of the jobs she wanted but she still did something that made her happy. She also had a kid that required more freedom. Life happens but at least she was staying true to herself.

[@blkstarpwr]

Hi Angela. I just want to tell you that I love your content. I am a second year associate currently looking to change practice areas and I came across your page yesterday while looking for videos on lawyer job interviews. I am so happy I came across your page. Your advice is practical and so relatable. I really admire your genuineness. I only wish I came across someone like you and content like this while I was in law school. Keep up the great work!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I appreciate you saying that so much!!! Thank you!!! It makes my day to hear that the videos are hitting home with people and actually helping to give some insights or perspectives into the legal world!! If you ever have a question or something you've always wanted to know send it my way, I love sharing what I learned as a junior associate starting out!! :)

[@STONESGAM]

I was a corporate attorney for almost three years. I started at $130K back in 2010 out of law school at a big firm. Some weeks I only worked an average of 40-50 hours per week but there were many times when I would just have to work 60 up to 80 Hours in a week for several weeks when something was pressing and needing to be done. I remember one weekend I cancelled plans to work on a brief all weekend that ended up not even being needed when I went in to work on Monday. I knew it was not for me and I just didn't have the personality for that lifestyle long term. I was able to pay off a major portion of my school loans on that salary though and then took a job in house where I worked a more normal 9-5 or 9-6 schedule the vast majority of weeks and very rarely any weekend work. Once in awhile things got hectic but they do so in most careers once in awhile. I enjoy the new job a lot more and I still make a good salary of high 5 figures almost 6 figures at this point. It was well worth the pay cut in my opinion to not be burned out and stressed all of the time.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi Derek, thank you so much for sharing your experience working for a biglaw vs. non-biglaw job, I know that is so helpful to people trying to figure out what would be the best fit for them!

[@qwertymehta8342]

Is your new job at a smaller law firm or did you completely change your profession?

[@STONESGAM]

@@qwertymehta8342 A smaller firm with more regular hours. Still an attorney.

[@alexchoi8339]

that was incredibly insightful and encouraging. I also experienced something like the golden handcuff working at a car dealership at young age although, obviously didn't make as much as a lawyer would make. I walked away from all that to get my college degree and it wasn't easy. I have just started studying for LSAT and I dont want to fall in the same trap of doing things just for the money. My friend who works at a law firm making 180k was the first inspiration for me to embark on this journey but I've always just wanted to become a lawyer even if werent for the money. This was a good reminder of why I started reconsidering this option in the first place. Thank you for the great content.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

My pleasure!! I'm so glad the video hit a chord with you!! And that's awesome that you're pursuing a career that excites you! When the drive is the interest in the work, the paycheck is just an extra benefit but not the primary motivation, which is exactly as it should be! :)

[@CapriceSoulsister67]

"Golden Handcuffs" is such an accurate description of that tie that binds you to a firm job, even as an assistant. Congratulations for doing what you did! You are an amazing person!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi Caprice!!!!! You are the sweetest!!! How are you???? 😍😍😍

[@CapriceSoulsister67]

I am well.... adjusting to life here in Dallas, TX. We moved here Oct 2016 and I really haven’t stopped juggling since we got here, BUT I’m happy the struggle has lessened. #YayYou

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@CapriceSoulsister67 I'm so glad to hear it! I'm sure NYC to Dallas was a huge change in a lot of ways, and I can only imagine that coronavirus has made it even more challenging. I'm wishing you all the best and please stay in touch and keep me updated!! :)

[@stephandden]

Interesting! Can definitely relate to a certain extent living here in Toronto as a management consultant at a big 4 firm. Great video ✨

[@christopherniccolini9394]

Your story is amazing. As a student looking to start law school soon, this is an amazing perspective. Thanks so much!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

My pleasure!! I'm so glad the video spoke to you!!! And I'm pumped for you guys to see the videos coming up in 2020!!

[@robynfloyd9215]

Enjoyed your thoroughness in this interview. You are my kind of girl by the way! I love going out to eat and just taking in the big city life. Loved the interview!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Loveis You, thanks so much!!! I couldn't agree more: big city + food = my happy place :)

[@TofuProductionCinema]

I love how down to earth this video is. First time reviewer, definite subscriber.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

What a sweet comment, thank you so much!! I'm so glad you liked the video!! :)

[@SuperCarottesRapees]

Enlightening! Thank you for making the video :)). And your conclusions are intelligent.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

My pleasure!! I'm so glad you liked the video!!

[@danieltull3622]

Thank you. It is very helpful to hear a perspective from someone in your shoes.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I'm so glad the video was helpful!! I'm pumped for you guys to see the new videos coming up in February!!!

[@williamsimpson2777]

I'm a Cambridge Law student in the UK and just found your channel - your content is really interesting so thank you! Subscribed :)

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Awesome!! I'm so glad you find it helpful! I'm pumped for you guys to see the new videos coming out in February!! :)

[@isawnisa]

Hi, Angela! I’m a lawyer working in the Philippines and your video suddenly popped up in my recommended vids! This video was well made and I really like your insights! It’s nice to learn more about life of lawyers from diff parts of the world. 😀 Thanks for your video!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi, Isai! I'm so glad you enjoyed the video!! I've had so much fun making these, and I'm pumped for you guys to see videos I have planned for you in 2020!!

[@najah1494]

Thanks for sharing! Starting law school in August, so this is helpful information

[@AngelaVorpahl]

My pleasure!! I'm so glad the video was helpful! :)

[@ct6410]

I am taking the LSAT in July and, at 36, will be a non-traditional law student if I am accepted to a program. I've been warned that schools, and subsequently employers, might see my age as a drawback, but I think it's the opposite, and for the reasons you stated in this video. I taught for 13 years. I traveled. I did all of the things I wanted to do besides law school, and now is the right time. I'll gladly offer my wrists up, because this is the job that's going to see me out. I hope that at least some programs and some firms can see an advantage in that.

[@edmondmurphy]

Great video, you laid it all out in a great presentation.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks so much! I'm so glad the video resonated with you :)

[@Meganyeni]

I love your videos. Very informative and I really appreciate the honesty.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

That's awesome!! I'm so happy to heart that :)

[@SoundMind581]

Angela.. Thanks for your videos. They're really helpful... Strategically so... You're really awesome

[@AngelaVorpahl]

My pleasure!! I'm so glad the videos are helpful!!

[@JessETV]

Your channel is so amazing and informative! I’m learning so much!! Also you are so intelligent! Great video! 😍😍

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks so much, Jessica!!! I'm so glad you're liking the videos!! It's a blast making them and it's so awesome to hear that they are helpful!! :)

[@mrog5481]

Usually before you even get to "OMG what should I buy" you're faced with "OMG I paid HOW much in taxes???"

[@AngelaVorpahl]

That's sooo true! Understanding not only taxes but all of the expenses that go along with paying off student loan debts and affording monthly living expenses is a huge deal and one that a lot of people are side-swiped by. Luckily, I have a great video coming out on all of the financial aspects you need to keep in mind when you start your first job out of law school that I'm so excited to show you guys!! And if you want to see a video on my personal income vs. expenses in my first two jobs out of law school (federal law clerk in Dallas, TX and law firm associate in New York, NY) feel free to check it out here(!): kzbin.info/www/bejne/iGXCYWhmpbuBjtU

[@aug-pahunters51]

@@AngelaVorpahl great point Angela, I work tangentially to big legal and the associates I know are not great with financial planning. My work allows me to be literally anywhere on the planet with dependable internet and factored in travel freedom as my number one priority. Bright young people need to place more value on lifestyle planning. Keep up the great content!

[@sikena]

Thanks for all the information, I’m in middle school and I’ve always wanted to go into law, and this helped in understanding how life after law school will be like when I’m an adult. Also you remind me of Casey Novak from law and order haha

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Yay!! I'm so glad the video helped!! And thanks for the character shout-out! I had to look up Casey Novak since I watch zero law shows, but the reference was great ;)

[@__heyitsdana]

Wow.. im going to law school this fall and this is sooo useful. Thank you!!!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi Dee! I'm so glad to hear the video was helpful! I run a free FB group for law students and prelaw students looking for clarity and support in their law school journey, would you like the link to join? :)

[@Oogabooga1234.]

I’m in high school at the moment and I’ve been interested in law for so long.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hey, Kelly! That's awesome!! I have loved my career as a lawyer and the profession always benefits from new lawyers excited and motivated to make their mark! Do you have any question in particular about law school or the life of being a lawyer?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@Jasamrit BHATTAL Hey! Getting a job at a top tier firm comes down to two things: (1) your law school's rank (www.usnews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-law-schools/law-rankings); and (2) your class rank. The higher ranked your law school, the lower you can rank in your class and still have a shot at getting a job with a top tier firm. Here's the general breakdown: -T14 law school (No. 1-14): Top 40% (class rank) -Tier 1 law school (No. 1-50): Top 15-40% (class rank) -Tier 2 law school (No. 51-100): Top 5-15% (class rank) -Tier 3 law school (No. 101-150): Top 1-5% (class rank) -Tier 4 law school (No. 151-201): Valedictorian The higher your law school ranks within each tier, the more flexibility you have in the class ranking you can get and still be competitive for BigLaw interviews. I hope this helps!!

[@Oogabooga1234.]

@Angela Vorpahl I live in California and I’m not sure what I should study for my undergraduate degree before law school

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@Oogabooga1234. Hey Kelly! The nice thing about law school is that you can study absolutely anything in undergrad :) I get this question a lot and I always recommend studying something you actually enjoy because (1) what makes you unique and creates a unique perspective on your path to wanting to become a lawyer will help your law school application stand out, and (2) GPA is the second most important factor (after your LSAT score) in getting into law school, and if you study something you enjoy you're more likely to do well. Common majors for lawyers are political science, history, and English, but as I said, if you're drawn to something else definitely do that thing because admissions offices love seeing something different! :)

[@stankakol5195]

Forget about it.

[@rummankhan4693]

My new favorite channel, it’s like having a virtual mentor lol

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Omg this comment made my day!! I'm so happy to hear this message resonates! 😊

[@timmckeown1313]

Great video and your answers to the questions being asked are very good. Having practiced for 33 years (and still going) I can tell your viewers that the practice of law is hard work. That 6 figure salary many covet is not just handed out (as you know). It is earned. The pressures to perform are incredible, the time commitments are insane, and the trade-offs are very real. As they say, there is no free lunch. Good luck in your current and future endeavors.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks so much, Tim! Your insights are fantastic! If you don't mind me asking, what type of law do you practice?

[@timmckeown1313]

Angela Vorpahl Hi Angela. I focus on real estate related litigation and transactional work, but also do some environmental and estate litigation. It’s a good mix that has kept me busy through the years.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@timmckeown1313 Very cool :)

[@mikaylajoiii]

You should do a video about the atmosphere at big law and what it’s like to work there!!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Oooh that's a great idea! I would love to do a video on that, maybe get a bunch of input from various BigLaw associates! I'll put that one on the list and let you know once it comes out! :)

[@mikaylajoiii]

Angela Vorpahl OMG YESSS!! I’m a Highschool senior and I really want to go into Big Law so anything about the process and passing the LSAT and BIG Law in general would be absolutely amazing!! 💛💛

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hey, Mikayla! I'm working on a video with a step by step process on how to get a job in BigLaw, but in the meantime if you want some insights into what it's like to work for a BigLaw law firm, I just released a video on the Top 100 U.S. law firms (where I give some insights into whether working for a BigLaw law firm is for you)!: kzbin.info/www/bejne/a2LYgn-Gp71rZ7c. I also have a video out on how much lawyers in BigLaw actually work (office hours v. billable hours) so feel free to check that one out too!: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eZWYm5uHfb6LgJY.

[@Kiliana]

This was a really fascinating video :) Nicely made, ma'am!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks so much!! I'm glad you enjoyed it!! :)

[@ahmedtony5568]

Hi Angela! I love your videos - thanks for all the valuable advice. You should consider (I'm sure you do already) writing a book. You have great content in your videos and replies. I'd recommend writing the book bluntly like "The Curmudgeon's Guide to Practicing Law", but with your usual associate mindset. Good luck, and keep going.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks so much, Ahmed! Haha I LOVE the idea of writing a book. We'll see how that plays out in the life journey :)

[@robevans2114]

I loved hearing about your experiences

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thank you so much!! I love sharing this information and it's wonderful to find that others enjoy hearing it :)

[@josephsmyth832]

Just came across your channel. Really appreciate the wisdom that you shared in the video. I am interested in law as well as philosophy, I don’t plan on making a career out of it but definitely it’s beneficial as commerce and business governs this world. It takes courage to get rid of the “golden handcuffs”, were you able to pay off your school debt even though you left?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I was! But I was in a very fortunate position in that I was awarded a full scholarship to attend law school, so the money I paid back was loans I had borrowed from my parents for living expenses during law school, all of which I was able to pay back within a few months of graduation.

[@BearMeat4Dinner]

Great video!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks!! I'm glad you liked it!!

[@starbury64]

Awesome video. Life is most fulfilled in doing what makes you happy.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Well said!! I'm so glad you enjoyed the video!! :)

[@starbury64]

Anything that I can learn from in a positive way I admire...

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@starbury64 😍😍😍😍😍😍😍😍

[@Doyle-Nutbush]

If you want to stay in that career field, try opening up your own boutique law firm specializing in something you really enjoy. Pick a city where it's not too crazy with good weather

[@AngelaVorpahl]

This is excellent advice! I actually thought about starting my own law firm for a while and then realized that the area of the law that most excited me was human rights, so the thought of starting a non-profit in the future is definitely in the back of my mind :) What kind of law do you practice?

[@MY-qu9lh]

this is such a well-made video! It was really inspiring :)

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks so much, Miki!! I was a bit nervous to post it to be honest, but I'm so glad I did :)

[@uh6311]

Very helpful. Thanks

[@AngelaVorpahl]

My pleasure!!

[@lawrenceblack322]

First time I've seen your videos and I'm in LOVE.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Yay!! I'm so glad the videos resonate with you!! That's such an awesome thing to hear :)

[@lawrenceblack322]

@@AngelaVorpahl I'd love to just chat and kick it with you.

[@adelespinasse1]

Thank you for sharing your experience! I’m curious about the painting of the women selling fruits on your wall. Where is it from??

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I'm so glad the video was helpful! The painting is from South Africa :)

[@RajeshGupta-hs1nx]

Great video. Helped me a lot. Thanks for making it!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

My pleasure! Is law school something you're considering, or are you already on that path? :)

[@RajeshGupta-hs1nx]

@@AngelaVorpahl I've finished and am a full lawyer but I realised that though I like law, the legal jobs for practicing it (as an advocate, prosecuter, judge etc.) are connected to an unhealthy work-life-balance. All the money and prestige is in my view per se worthless, and especially worthless, if you don't have a life, especially time. I've come to the conclusion that I want to work to live, not live to work. Hence, I'm considering doing a rather administrative 9 to 5 work which gives me a balanced life. And my legal skills I can make use of in my freetime as a voluenteer for a social organization. So my solution is that I do a job that may not be so prestigious, but it gives me work-life-balance and pays the bills. And the freetime I use for a highly fulfilling volunteer work which allows me to realize my legal and intellectual skills without any pressures.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@RajeshGupta-hs1nx That's awesome, Rajesh!!

[@RajeshGupta-hs1nx]

@@AngelaVorpahl Thank you!

[@RecoveringGenius]

Your biggest accomplishment? Leaving with your health, looks and sanity! Cheers!

[@johnosandra]

Sound advice, mate!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks! I'm so glad it resonated with you!!

[@Billybobthor]

Good video. Liked and subscribed.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks!! I'm so glad you enjoyed it!!

[@michaeldodd3563]

This was not the information I imagined I would receive by clicking on your video, but I’m glad I did. Well done! Did having a family (kids, husband, white picket fence or whatever) factor into your decision to step down?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi, Michael! Thanks so much for watching, I'm glad you liked the video!! Having a family wasn't something that factored into my decision to leave BigLaw, but more reasonable working hours is definitely the main reason why people leave! For me personally, I was looking for the freedom to re-evaluate my career and search for a professional focus that excited me and felt meaningful, and I realized after 5 years that intellectual property (and private law in general) wasn't that thing :)

[@nimra9715]

I’m 17 and really want to go into law I live in England btw but I know how competitive it is so I am really nervous 😟 your video has motivated me to keep going with my dream I want to become a lawyer specialised in family law

[@AngelaVorpahl]

That's awesome!! Keep working hard and going after that dream! I'm a firm believer in anything is possible if you put enough grit into it :)

[@mikejuba9228]

Don't be afraid to live the kind of lifestyle most folks would not want to live, so you can enjoy the kind of retirement most folks won't have. Though I no longer donate money to charity like I did when working; I donate time, in lieu of. Still driving the same car I purchased 18 years ago but set money aside for when it finally dies. There's an awesome song written in 1999 called "Everybody's free to wear sunscreen". This guy was right on, years ago. Best of luck (mixed with good ol fashion common sense) in the future Angela. P.S. Love the 3 Stooges!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks so much, Mike!! And shout out to you as well for your charity work and finding a way to live a non-traditional lifestyle as well! :)

[@mikejuba9228]

Angela Vorpahl , you're very welcome :D

[@teresse2742]

So happy about your video. I do not work in a lawfirm because in here the trainees (associates in the US I suppose) are paid very little except for maybe in 10 lawfirms. I do, however, have one of the highest salaries among my former classmates and it is difficult not to inflate my lifestyle. I still live off the same budget I had as a student with few occasional splurge buys to keep me happy and I invest everything to get financially independent asap and to be able to do something I’m really really passionate about. :)

[@AngelaVorpahl]

That's awesome, Teresse!! Go you!! Just out of curiosity, do UK law students tend to graduate with a high amount of debt as well? Anywhere near the $150,000-$200,000 average we have here?

[@teresse2742]

@@AngelaVorpahl hey hey, sorry about the late-ish reply. I am not from the UK sadly so I don't know the exact numbers but I do have a friend who studied lawschool in the UK and she said that her debt is not as high as the average US debt is but they too tend to have student debt. They do have a better student loan system though, which requires them to pay only after they start making money above a certain amount. I live in Czech Republic and our education system is free until 26 years of age so we mostly graduate with little to no debt but as I said, the pay is not as good as the US or UK lawschool graduates get. :) I had no debt after uni and am making about 22k usd before tax (15%) per year which is Prague average and slightly above average for the country as a whole (the big lawfirm salary is 31k but hourly rate is similar because they have many many overtimes included in the base salary) . Sometimes I ask myself if I'd switch my position with a UK/US lawschool graduate and honestly I don't know. The debt really scares me. :)

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@teresse2742 It's a huge issue for sure! I know a lot of U.S. lawyers would trade lower salaries for being able to be debt free :)

[@johnphoenix17]

Great video! I'm currently a Software Engineer but I've been thinking about going to Law School for awhile and definitely entertaining the idea of joining BigLaw afterwards. There's a "challenge" that comes with it, or so I've heard, that really gets my attention. However, I haven't heard many details about it. What would you say, other than the usual (long hours, the size, etc.), that lawyers should know before joining BigLaw? What would you say are the biggest differentiators of BigLaw compared to other firms? and lastly, what are some of the things you and/or your colleagues enjoyed the most/liked the least about your BigLaw experience? Also, I think is awesome that you mentioned Manhattan! NY is where I hope I can get into law school and then practice law - keeping a close eye on Columbia/NYU/Cornell :)

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hey johnphoenix17!! That life plan sounds awesome!! In answer to your questions: (1) The biggest reasons why BigLaw is generally more of a rough lifestyle than working at a smaller law firm are: --the hours: you'll be working 11-12 hour days consistently as well as occasional weekends --the lack of freedom over of your schedule: not only are you working a lot but you are also expected to be on call whenever they need you, including nights, weekends, holidays, and vacation --the lack of personalized attention: most BigLaw law firm associates feel like they are treated more as a number than a person, since starting associate class sizes can be huge and senior associates and partners tend not to invest their personal time and resources into developing associates' careers until much later down the line, whereas in a smaller firm you may be one of only a few associates and get a ton of face time with seasoned attorneys that you can learn from on a day-to-day basis --the level of work: you'll generally be doing repetitive, low-level, grunt work for your first couple of years at a BigLaw law firm (e.g. reviewing documents or contracts), whereas at a smaller law firm you will generally jump in and start doing substantive work (because they don't have huge teams and they need you to start working as a real attorney right away). (2) The worst parts about BigLaw are the ones I listed above, which I definitely experienced to a certain extent. (3) The best parts about BigLaw (for me) were: --The constant movement and motion -- I was a litigation associate and there was always something going on, a new project popping up, another fire to put out, and I really liked that fast-paced environment. --Misery loves company -- even though a BigLaw experience can be rough, you'll have a lot of associates in your same class that you will be spending late nights and weekends with, which can actually be pretty fun. Going through hard times with people has a way of bringing you closer together :) --The other great part of my experience was that when I started at the firm they were just starting to build up their New York office, so it was actually a smaller office that had a lot of cases on their plate, so I got to skip a lot of the menial work as a young associate that can be so soul-crushing, and got to actually take depositions, write dispositive motion briefs, and speak in court at discovery hearings and pretrial conferences. I hope this helps give you some more insight! My plan is to make a video on the day-in-the-life of a BigLaw ssociate soon so look out for that!

[@pranavpillai7778]

Good points. Imho, go into big law if you really want to. Don’t go if you want to pay off your debt. Choose a law school based on cost and employment data released by bar association.

[@bonnyp.2814]

I have worked in the legal profession for over 25 years, and without even knowing you, I know with absolute certainty that having relinquished that salary and the unrelenting demands (the "costs") to have it, for a pro bono job, you are now more fulfilled, content and at peace. Of course, I could be wrong, but I doubt it. Good luck in your next chapter.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thank you so much, Bonny! It was a tough transition, but 2.5 years later I'm so glad I chose this path! :)

[@Gwendolan]

Walked away as a senior associate after 4 years. Had nothing lined up. Landed an in-house gig, 4 days 9-5. Very interesting work. Today, it pays better than my last lawfirm salary.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

That's AMAZING! What an awesome transition for you. :)

[@RRPartnersBucharest]

So interesting! And true, it really is the same around the world 👍

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Nice! I'm so glad the video's message rings true in other places too!

[@oldfashionedwrx3574]

I love how you mention golden handcuffs, happens in any job!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Yeah!! It's crazy how prevalent it is and how easy it is to fall into!!

[@1588chrissy]

Ditto, love my home and freedom lifestyle but can’t leave because have thousands in stock and would lose that (huge component of my retirement fund).

[@bamban2001]

Amazing video very informative ! Just wondering what law school you went to/what law schools you would recommend to attend in order to be a comptetive candidate to a job at one of these big law firms? I’m currently a bussiness law major with a 3.9 gpa, is there anything you recommend to do like clubs or community service to get into these schools? Thank you!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi, Juan! I went to SMU Law in Dallas, TX! To be competitive for a BigLaw job depends on several factors, but generally speaking you can go to a Top 14 law school and be competitive for BigLaw jobs in all major U.S. cities, or you can go to a Tier 1 or Tier 2 law school and be competitive for BigLaw jobs in the city where you attend law school (and possibly other major cities in your state) if you are ranked highly in your class after 1L year. I break down the law school ranking vs. 1L class ranking in this video if you want to check it out(!): kzbin.info/www/bejne/e6bVqJ-jn7Cmo9U I also have a video on going to a T14 law school vs. a regional law school, and the pro's and con's, here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nHqZaGqpZ8eBm5o I hope these help!! Angela

[@TheJoshGalt]

You are 100% right about the golden handcuffs. Big house, renovations to everything, vacation property, etc etc. I’d love to leave but I am stuck.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Oh man I'm so sorry to hear that, Josh! You definitely don't have to be debt-free before making a move, but scaling down is for sure a big part of that. Are you in the law firm world?

[@TheJoshGalt]

No. I work as a senior manager for subway infrastructure construction. I suppose I could leave and find a lower paying, less demanding job ... but it would force me to dip into my savings which I have worked very hard for. It is funny, because you end up working so much that you never get the chance to enjoy the trappings that having a high paying job affords you.

[@latinousa5694]

My new favorite channel! I have a marketing and advertising background but I am considering going to law school. I think I want to study corporate law or employment law. Do you have a video explaining the different types of law careers? Also, do you think someone like me that has a non-traditional background could do well at a law school? Thanks a lot!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hey Cesar! That's so exciting! I don't have a video giving a run-down of the different types of law although it is definitely on my list to do! In the meantime, you might find the video on litigation v. corporate law helpful since those are two biggest "umbrella" legal practice areas in the civil law world. You can check it out here(!): kzbin.info/www/bejne/g5_NiWSkd96ihcU In answer to your second question, I was actually listening to a podcast recently with a woman who is an expert in law school admissions, and she was emphasizing over and over how much a "non-traditional" background is actually a huge asset for law school admissions. People think it's a negative, but from the law schools' perspective you're bringing experience and diversity in your background that most of who go straight through (myself included) don't have. Plus, most people who have worked before law school have a much more compelling and cohesive narrative about WHY they want to pursue a law degree, rather than the "I don't know what else to do" mentality. So definitely see it as a strength and not a weakness! Angela

[@TheGolfClan]

You’ve earned my subscription - very helpful video. 👍🏼

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I'm so glad to hear the video was helpful!! :)

[@TheGolfClan]

@@AngelaVorpahl Absolutely, I'll have to check out more of your videos. Keep it up!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@TheGolfClan Thanks so much, Dougie!!

[@foodiusmaximus]

Excellent video, my only gripe and it's not exactly personally directed at you, but rather the general attitude that living in New York City is "making it". I love living here but I think a more sustainable approach is living in Brooklyn, Jersey or Queens where you could actually buy a house for salary earned + the amount of rent being dropped on a tiny apartment in the city. Crown Heights to wall street is a 15 minute train. LIC is 25 minutes to midtown. Just thoughts.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Totally, there a lot of wonderful neighborhoods where the lower cost of living can make for a higher quality of life. I think the allure of NYC for a lot of people, myself included, is that it's a representation of the pinnacle of talent, ability, success, and accomplishment, and moving there and surviving creates this idea of a right of passage that you can do anything and that fears and doubts and preconceived beliefs can be defeated and destroyed. Of course after living there for several years the reality of the city begins to set in, but NYC has always held that magical quality for me, and living there has played a huge role in giving me the courage and confidence to realize that I can do literally anything in life no matter improbable or difficult it may seem.

[@yassineo727]

you can always be a cook $10 an hour , no health insurance , no paid vacations , no future and no life

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Are you a chef? I've always wanted to learn more about that lifestyle because the idea seems so glamorous but I know in reality it's long hours and low pay, at least at the beginning. But I'm curious if there's ever a stage when it shifts and the lifestyle starts improving?

[@LeveragedFinance]

@@AngelaVorpahl not unless you start your own restaurant

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@Melanie Craziness. Hats off to those fighting for that dream!!

[@belingosh3393]

Same situation in France with BigLaw ! Much respect for what you did !

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks, Belingosh!! I had no idea France was the same way! What type of law do you work in at this point in your career?

[@user-ym9sx6jt8m]

I don’t think that French law firms pay that much money to junior lawyers. Matter of fact, France is well known for being a market where junior lawyers and paralegals have low starting salaries

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@user-ym9sx6jt8m That's so interesting -- I wonder on the flip side, if going to law school is much more affordable in France?

[@cloudfg5251]

@@AngelaVorpahl junior lawyers in big law firm in Paris can make around 80 000 euros a year. Sometimes more if its a us law firm based in Paris. ( something around 100 000 a year). Its lower than us lawyers but education in France is free

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@cloudfg5251 I think almost every single U.S. law student would take that trade :)

[@juanismyrealname683]

Great video

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks so much!! I'm glad you enjoyed it!!

[@beemocha]

Very informative! I think about pursuing a career in law but I’m worried about not having a lot of free time. I’ve heard people say that with a career in law the work follows you home. That’s SCARY because I cherish my free time! I don’t wanna think about work when I come home to binge-watch Family Matters 😂 Im a Massage Therapist & im able to have a nice work-life balance,but we definitely don’t make as much as Attorneys do of course lol

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Work-life balance is definitely a thing that lawyers struggle with, but there are some practice areas (like wills and estates) that allow for a slower pace of work with more flexibility. It will also depend on where you work and the clients you serve. Clients who hire biglaw firms are willing to pay those high billable rates in exchange for constant availability and "perfection" of work. If you were to work for a law firm who serves individuals or smaller companies, you'll start to see a slower pace of work with more flexibility to leave to go home at a reasonable time, take weekends and vacation, etc.

[@oceangrunge7139]

Love the content, and I really appreciate the information and perspectives that you provide. I do, however, have just one comment about the slides that you use to introduce the question: I find that they disrupt the flow and I, for one, would prefer if you either spoke the questions out or connected the segments in some other way. I think jump cuts are fine (and I'm actually quite a fan of content creators that use them liberally because I think they can help improve the flow of the content - as you yourself do, intra-segment), and so even if you miss out on connectors on your first pass recording, you can always throw the camera back on and film those at the end, and jump cut to them in the edit. Of course, this are just my two cents, and if the rest of your viewership prefers the slides, you should most definitely keep them. Lastly, I just want to emphasise that I was just hoping to provide some constructive feedback and I mean no ill intent whatsoever. Thanks again for doing these videos and I look forward to seeing more! :)

[@AngelaVorpahl]

No worries at all, I appreciate the feedback! It's timely that you bring it up because I actually prefer speaking the titles too and started incorporating that into my latest videos :) With the interviews it's tougher because the conversation is much longer and more unpredictable so I use the jump cuts to break it up into more bite-size pieces. But I definitely appreciate the feedback and will keep doing that in my other videos!!

[@marmat7072]

Great vid. Applies to all careers

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks so much!! And thanks for watching!

[@jayeshsidpra4127]

Hi Angela, ive just realised that you are actually replying to comments, which is better than i can say for any for any other youtuber period. I am a student currently studying in England, and i was just wondering if you had any advice as to how i could get from a guy doing my a-levels, (I think thats junior year in american terms?) to working as an associate at a law firm in NYC. BTW great video, liked lit within the first min!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi, Jayesh! The easiest way for anyone to make themselves competitive for a U.S. law firm job is to go the traditional route of attending a U.S. law school for 3 years, and ranking very highly in your class. If your sites are set on NYC, you would generally need to attend a top 14 U.S. law school and ideally rank in the top 40% of your class after your 1L year. The only question mark I have that I'm working on getting an answer to for you guys is whether U.S. law firms shy away from hiring international law students because of the necessity to sponsor a work visa, but I'm hoping to make an entire video on that soon, so stay tuned! If you are interested in the U.S. law school ranking vs. 1L class ranking that you need to be competitive for a BigLaw firm job, check out the video here(!): kzbin.info/www/bejne/e6bVqJ-jn7Cmo9U

[@leenkissinger1372]

It's alawys difficult for us to leave our job to pursue ur dream when we find urself got stuck in the luxury lifestyle which we can't afford after resignation. so, courage and decisiveness are needed.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Amen to that!! Very well said and I totally agree!

[@sonamd7409]

Thank you so much for your videos!!! You've taught me a lot. How possible would you say it is to work in a big law firm and also do pro bono work?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I'm so glad to hear the videos have been helpful! They've definitely been a ton of fun to make :) With respect to doing pro bono work at a biglaw firm it's definitely doable (that is, people do it) but it is going to be difficult. Biglaw takes up a TON of your time and adding on another pro bono project is not only going to be tricky, but the partners you're working for will always expect you to prioritize your paid work first. If you're interested in taking on a pro bono project my recommendation would be to get at least 2 other associates to do it with you so that you guys can cover for each other if something comes up in the pro bono case but it conflicts with a work deadline. And if you can take the pressure off of doing an entire pro bono case by yourself it makes it feel much more doable and possible, plus you can learn from each other and share case ideas and strategies. Not to mention pro bono work is an awesome way to cut your teeth as a young lawyer, particularly in biglaw where it takes a few years before you generally get the chance to do substantive work. So, in short, definitely doable, but just expect it to be time-consuming and a learning curve just like everything else, so try to form a small team around it if you can :)

[@nikhiliyer9371]

Only if you would have continued as an attorney (in a law firm) you'd have been a 9th year associate (As you mentioned in the video-you joined the firm in 2011),you would have easily earned, approx in the range of 350k-500k(including bonus) but you choose to do pro bono after 5-6 years. It is a trade off, but that's all life is about, to be happy and to be able to things which we want to instead of cribbing or regretting it later! Nik

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Exactly! It's so funny, I've recently been thinking about just that, that this year would've been the year that I would have made partner if I had stayed! I have lots of thoughts about it, which I'm going to put into a post coming up, but long story short I definitely think I could have led a great life either way, but having the life I have now I wouldn't trade it for the world :)

[@asal8955]

Hi! ^-^ I don’t know if you’re going to see this but I want to be an International Lawyer. I am currently a sophomore in high school and I’ve realized that being a lawyer is something that would be very fulfilling for me and something I would enjoy+ love doing for the rest of my career. I have a few questions that I was hoping you could answer? 1) I love learning about different cultures, experiencing new things, talking to different people, learning new languages and most of all helping people^-^ would I be able to study International affairs/Public affairs, Political science, psychology, sociology, etc. ? [Will these affect whether or not I go to law school] 2) I learned becoming an [International] Lawyer takes 7 years. Would I be guaranteed a job right after school? What is usually the starting salary for new lawyers? 3) How do you find a nice law firm to work at? Somewhere in time, I would like to work for the UN or Geneva International:) 4) Does being a lawyer take time away from family? I want to build a family and I’m scared that being a lawyer won’t allow that, ie is it time consuming? Are hours flexible? 5) What traits do you think you need to be a [International] Lawyer? 6) What age did you get your first lawyer job + when did you get out of school? - I will admit, I’m kind of scared. I feel like I wouldn’t be able to make it or that I will suck but I have such a passion for this... did you have doubts before you started? Thank you in advance! ❤️

[@phillipdefraties8906]

Thank you for all of the helpful and informative videos. Do you know what the average time frame is, if there is an average, to make partner? Also, is there an industry standard/average salary for partners, or is it specific to each firm? Thank you!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Yes! I'm actually in the process of making a video all about how to make partner :) The average time frame is 8 years (10 years at some firms). And the average salary definitely varies, but for first-year partners at biglaw firms they generally start off around $400,000 to $450,000 per year. Smaller and midsize firms will usually be much less, around $150,000 to $200,000, of course varying more or less depending on the size of the firm.

[@phillipdefraties8906]

@@AngelaVorpahl Thank you for the information. I look forward to the video.

[@MuditVerma]

I didn't know about the golden handcuffs phenomenon, very insightful! What post-graduate degree are you now pursuing?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I know, it can get really crazy! A master's of law in international human rights :)

[@anushkavishwanath]

U speak really nice

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks! I do my best :)

[@survivalguy11]

hey Angela, powerful video. you’re super right about being accustomed to a lifestyle with a high price. im not in law, but recently experienced something similar working in tech. What’s your post grad degree going to be in?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I'm so glad the video spoke to you! Yeah, the same thing definitely happens in other industries as well, I feel so strongly about the topic and making sure everyone in high-paying jobs is aware of the potential destructive power that the job can have. I'm currently getting my Master's of Law in International Human Rights! :)

[@survivalguy11]

Angela Vorpahl Good stuff! i like the passion. i watched some of your other videos and appreciate the insights you’re sharing. cheers from Texas!! 😬

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@survivalguy11 OH HEY TEXAS!!! I always love meeting another Lone Star State-r!!! :)

[@petergabriel9261]

I am a very ambitious 2L! I am trailblazing here. My parents only have a third education. So, I love watching law testimonials and learning from those who are where I want to be. Please consider looking at my resume and help me breach that barrier to the #biglaw!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi Peter! That's so exciting!! If you're looking for additional support, I'm inside my free FB group all the time answering questions! Would you like the link to join?

[@mkute4784]

thank you sm! i want to be a corporate lawyer and work in mergers and acquisitions and it was just wonderful hearing you talk about the real experience of being a lawyer! do you think that biglaw, considering the salary, is worth it? 205k is definitely a lot of money, but ppl say that since you work so many long hrs, biglaw isn’t even fun? what do you personally think?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I personally really enjoyed it! Yes, it's stressful work. Yes, it's long hours. But because you're working so much you also learn a ton. And if you are smart about budgeting, saving, investing, and paying off student loans, your salary can be a HUGE step in the direction of financial freedom :)

[@yardmasterswealtheducation8424]

I wonder how much a lawyer would accept if the work load is light (one small company), and quality of life is high? Thoughts? I love the phrase The Curse of the Golden Handcuffs. My wealth education perspective is designed to set people free from this curse! Awesome!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

There was actually a survey done, and overwhelmingly young lawyers at law firms said they would trade working less hours for a lower salary! Anecdotally, law firms are allowing more and more non-traditional work arrangements, but it's a slow progression in a very traditional industry.

[@yardmasterswealtheducation8424]

@@AngelaVorpahl I am forming company theories that will revolutionize how business is done. It will deal a fatal blow to that which is identified as corporate greed. My Best Business Theory defies the typical thought process that a company needs to provide a ladder for advancement. Our companies will pay all positions the same salary, from the front line yard workers to the CEO. They all do their part, and each part is equally essential. I want a lawyer who will start by setting up our company, and provide us with all the legal advice and work we will need to get started, and grow. Eventually, my job factory (that is what a business is to me) will be able to create a full time legal position, and eventually a full legal department, that could, with the right person, be split off (birthed) from my company to be it's own entity, serving my companies, and many others! Ok, it is a huge vision, and I got excited typing about it, but, I want an amazing individual, with a solid foundation of integrity, to live out a great story. If you are going to create the best jobs on Earth, why not make sure they also tell stories of great, individual success? Anyone interested?

[@Samantha__420]

Thank you SO much for this video. I recently have been sworn in as an attorney in the State of Connecticut and will be sitting for the FL bar in Feb. I’m currently in the process of securing a big firm position, but was clueless on where to begin when it comes to compensation range. Very informative. Thank you!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

That's awesome!! Congratulations!! And I'm so glad the video was helpful! Feel free to ask me any other questions that come up during your job search :)

[@Samantha__420]

Angela Vorpahl absolutely! Thank you!!!😃

[@raotrilochan]

Hi Angela ,very informative ,could you shed some light on JD/MBA programs and do alumni get any benefits while switching fields

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Good question! So from what I've seen/read JD/MBAs seem to function similarly to LLMs in the sense that they create a slight "bump" on your resume, but no real increase in job opportunities or pay, and of course at the cost of another year of time, tuition, and lost income. That being said, there are definitely some "soft" benefits that could come from a JD/MBA, and Brett Cenkus has a good video explaining what these are, which you can check out here(!): kzbin.info/www/bejne/bGKsknmGjbGSrqs

[@raotrilochan]

@@AngelaVorpahl Thanks for the reply 😀

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@raotrilochan My pleasure!

[@roryhanlon927]

I was actually pretty surprised when I read you were able to get 4 weeks off a year, my previous impression was 10 days would be more standard. I’m a law student in the U.K. and trainees I’ve met at grad rec events have said actually taking your holiday time was a big benefit over the higher paying US firms (who pay US salaries in London - though law grads here are much younger without the debt because we don’t have the JD). Also, I’d be interested to hear your insight on things like “7 year or out” rules etc. Is they’re a trainee>associate conveyor belt which forces people out if they don’t hit the partnership track?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hey, Rory! So the 4 weeks of vacation is standard, but actually taking it is tough. It's getting better, but there's still a stigma around taking vacation (especially any longer than a week at a time), with a built-in belief that you're lazy or not dedicated to your job. It's possible to swing it, especially after a large case or deal ends and before you get staffed on a new one, but you have to be really strategic about it to try and avoid having to actually work while you're on vacation (which is sometimes inevitable). The up-or-out system is still pretty common, and law firms don't do a great job of communicating to associates whether they're actually on partnership track or not, so there's a ton of room for improvement in communication and the way that process is handled. And of course there are exceptions where associates who don't make partner can stay on as "staff attorneys" or "of counsel" for years. I'm actually working on a video about partnership, so stay tuned for more info :)

[@roryhanlon927]

@@AngelaVorpahl Hi Angela, thank you so much for the detailed reply. Will definitely stay tuned. On this side of the pond 5 weeks is standard, and I believe there's less stigma around taking it (I hope) at the large UK outfits. For now I'll assume your holiday model is it how at works at US firms here as well. They all offer 5 weeks + bank holidays (statutory minimum), so maybe it'd be slightly easier to claim the US 4! You can understand why they don't communicate on "up or out" though. "Once your salary becomes too expensive we'll fire you unless you make partner" probably isn't the best recruitment brochure cover! If no one knows whether they are on their way out or not they'll remain motivated, if you know your gone you'll have the productivity of a dead duck - bottom line being I doubt we'll see that improvement because its not in the firms interest.

[@ggrobbins9353]

Your video is very insightful and so fun to watch! I’m thinking of studying for the LSAT to apply for Law school. I have a very strong undergrad GPA from a top 20 US University. I started a master’s after undergrad but for health reasons never finished it and my gpa suffered in while in master’s. Would top tier law schools care about the unfinished master’s, or does my completed undergrad degree gpa count much more strongly for admission consideration? Thank you so much.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks!! With respect to your master's my first reactions are (1) if you never finished your master's degree I don't think you would even need to mention that you took some classes, (2) even if you do mention that you started a master's since it was abandoned I wouldn't think you would need to list a GPA, (3) if for some reason the application explicitly calls for you to list the unfinished master's and the incomplete GPA, I would definitely include an explanation that the master's was abandoned for health reasons. To be honest, the thing that law schools care most about is your LSAT score, so if you rock that (plus your high undergrad GPA), my sense is that you'll be totally fine. If anything, they tend to view any "after college" experiences favorably since they tend to prefer students who have some life experiences to bring to the table rather than coming straight out of college. I hope this helps! Let me know how it goes!!

[@ggrobbins9353]

Angela Vorpahl Thank you so much for your reply. I appreciate your caring about my question so much!! ❤️

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@ggrobbins9353 Of course! That's what I'm here for!! :)

[@BigDaddy-mh3ry]

Angela Vorpahl How do you see salary for patent attorney? I am planning to go to Law school and I already have 7 years of experience in IP field.

[@Rose-19090]

thanks for your video. what are you pursuing your post grad degree in? do you intend on continiuing practice after you complete your prg?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I'm getting my master's of law in international human rights! I'm also simultaneously launching my young lawyer career coaching business in February (yay! feel free to sign up here for the FREE beta version: www.angelavorpahl.com/). With respect to practicing law, the plan is to continue with the pro bono human rights cases I have for this year, and then see if I can ramp it up next year to split between the career coaching business and taking on new pro bono cases!

[@Skarred]

That sounds awesome, unfortunately, I live in Australia where you will probably only get 50k/yr and even less with the conversion lol, so about 30k US. a partner position is offering 150-200, but that's with a lifetime of experience.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

That's so interesting! I love hearing about the legal markets in other countries! I understand the entry level salary may be lower, but I imagine the cost of law school and the student loan debt burden is also much lower?

[@paulehrhardt2150]

Hi Angela, I have a (very juicy, david-v-goliath) void judgment case I would like to file (i.e.goliath) in fed court in the northern california district. Any advice you could give me on how to find pro bono or contingency representation ?

[@DavidThomas-me6pi]

Good that you can work on cases that mean something to you.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Yeah! I really enjoyed the IP litigation cases at the time too, I just slowly outgrew them over the course of 5 years and was ready to try something new :)

[@leejezun9124]

Hello I just found your channel and I have a few questions if you have the time to answer. Do these big firms only hire certain types of associates?? For example if I wanted to go into family law would I have a chance to get one of these big law jobs. And I was also wondering when you get to pick what type of law you want to do...

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi Lee! BigLaw firms generally have practice groups only in the types of law that serve large clients (i.e. companies) rather than individuals because companies have a lot more resources and are the ones that can afford to pay the high BigLaw legal billing rates. Since family law is much more individual-oriented (rather than company-oriented) as far as client base, you won't find family law as a practice group that BigLaw firms generally do. That being said, there are definitely smaller and midsized law firms out there that practice family law. BigLaw firms generally hire through each law school's OCI (on campus interview) process, so if you are offered a summer associateship through that process (which will happen your 2L summer), before that summer starts the law firm will reach out to you to ask if you have a preference for practice groups (you generally get to choose 2). And then the law firm will assign you to practice groups based on need, but also trying to match you up with the preferences you told them.

[@barrettthomas9800]

So stoked to get to law school.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I'm so excited for you!! Let me know if you have any questions as you go through the process!

[@youracherrynut442]

Tough out big law for a few years and then move in-house = set for life. Besides the money, the training that you get in big law as well as having that big firm name on your resume is totally worth it in my opinion. After a few years of big law you can take a slight pay cut and move in-house with much more reasonable hours.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Totally, I have a lot of friends who also took that route :)

[@JohnDoe-pi4lu]

Hi Angela - great video! I saw your other post on monthly budgeting and found it very helpful. Could I ask what you had in savings when you left your big law firm? In other words, what was your "walk-away" number? I know a lot of people who work high paying jobs that they do not like, but have trouble leaving the high salary. It shows a lot of courage on your part to go find fulfilling work!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Oooh good question, I don't remember what my walk-away number was, but if I had to guess I probably would have had somewhere in the ballpark of $200-300k saved up including all retirement accounts and investments and everything? Something like that!

[@sarahscott3047]

I am applying to law school this year in Ireland and I was wondering if there are many openings/jobs in the top tier law firms in nyc? I would love to move over to the USA to work as a lawyer in the future! I would also love to know the best law firms in the USA to work at?

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi, Sarah! I'm actually in the process of creating a video on job opportunities for international lawyers looking to work in the U.S. so stay tuned for that! As far as the "best" law firms in the U.S., that's going to be subjective of course, but I created a video on the Top 100 ranked law firms in the U.S. (by three different publications), which also include rankings for the best law firms by other breakdowns such as practice groups, geographical location, etc. if you want to check it out(!): kzbin.info/www/bejne/a2LYgn-Gp71rZ7c

[@mozehey]

You have an amazing smile. Do you have veneers? (I don't really have a law question. I'm not a lawyer, but I've played on in improv.)

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Thanks, Marian! I actually DO have a veneer on the tooth to the right of my biggest right front tooth :) It came in tiny so the veneer is a cap on top of it, which honestly has been there for years and I should look into getting it changed out...

[@RWong-wn3pv]

If one makes $205,000 + per year, SAVE 50% plus.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

That's definitely the goal and thankfully what I was able to do :)

[@BD-hm3fb]

Save 25% people in their 20s need to splash on fun

[@abhim9221]

taxes in Ny, and cost of living will eat our paycheck more than you think.

[@bgates275]

I think what makes it difficult to walk away from a high paying job, isn't necessarily one materialistic thing in particular. When you walk into a room of friends or peers, and everyone smiles and gives respect, or simply the choice that allocating resources provides, gives you a really nice dopamine hit. That feeling of elevated status is very addictive.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I couldn't agree more, I think you're exactly right :)

[@megantaylormichaels]

Respect from what? Lawyers are a dime a dozen at biglaw. Impressive is having a good wife, and children, while bringing in business on your own. Simping for other lawyers is pathetic. You earned a degree and a license. Why would you take orders and be a bitch for another lawyer?

[@chadimaalouly8399]

I love law. I’m a high school senior now, and I’m feeling a calling to pursue law. Either be a federal prosecutor, or work in a big tier law firm. I know it sounds so bland, but I’m just so scared of graduation law school, after all that hard work and student debt and not make enough money. I live in California and I worry that I won’t make the money to live comfortably. How could you ensure that you become a successful lawyer with at least the 200,000 dollar salary discussed in this video? I don’t want to graduate and be in the lower percentile of salaries.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi, Chadi! Very cool that you want to pursue a legal career, it can be a great professional path :) In answer to your question, there are no guarantees in life of course, but there are definitely steps you can take to position yourself as best as possible to be successful in your legal career. I'm actually coming out with a video soon on what to do in college to prepare for law school, and I'm also working on a full-blown course on exactly what you need to do in law school to get great grades and position yourself for the most job opportunities possible upon law school graduation. So stay tuned for both of those! In the meantime, the higher your GPA the better and the more internship/volunteership experience as possible with or around lawyers the better :)

[@dathunderman4]

Only way to ensure it is if you go to a top law school. 86% of Columbia law school’s grads in 2018 made at least 190k. Those type of numbers are very rare tho and only indicative of the top few schools. Tbh there’s no way you can technically “guarantee” this, but you have a great shot at making that type of money by going to a top law school. So make sure your gpas is in the 3.9s in college and kill it on the LSAT

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@dathunderman4 Agreed, going to a T14 law school gives you a great shot at a BigLaw job! That being said, you can position yourself for a BigLaw job outside of the T14 law schools as well, you just have to be smart about the law school you pick, the legal market where the law school is located, and work your butt off to get into the highest percentiles of your class ranking after 1L year :)

[@tinaantwi2665]

Hello Angela I just subscribed to your channel and thank you so much for your advice, you have allowed me to think about my career path a lot in the past few days. I would just like to ask I am confused if I should try to pursue a JD. I am interested in diplomacy, travelling. Fashion investing, tech and law. Originally I really wanted to be a lawyer but now I really do not know. I have spoken to so many university counsellors and I am not sure what to do until I watched your video about greying skills in tech and business. I am really stuck in my career choice and really don’t know anything that would fit the criteria mentioned. Do you have any suggestions Angela, I would really appreciate it. Just feel lost and stuck right now

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hi Tina! Yes, I definitely have lots of thoughts on this! Send me a DM on Instagram (@angelavorpahl) with these questions and I can give you my thoughts over audio :)

[@tinaantwi2665]

@@AngelaVorpahl thank you so much Angela. I will definitely do so!

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@tinaantwi2665 🙌🙌🙌

[@chloemoretz8621]

I wanted to know your opinion on collage and experience. Do you think it is better to have experience or a collage degree from a very good school(Top 10 school for example) and also how does this effect the job and salary

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Hey, Chloe! So there are definitely a lot of factors to consider when choosing what college to go to, and prestige/ranking can be a big one. All else being equal, going to a top-ranked university will make you more competitive to get into a top-ranked law school, but that doesn't mean that it should be the only factor you consider. There is a LOT to be said for gaining financial independence as quickly as you can after you finish college and law school because it allows you to have much more freedom, flexibility, and ownership over your career going forward. So I would say to definitely take into consideration the cost of tuition and any scholarship money that you can get from the colleges you're considering. I would also say that without a doubt your LSAT score is the most important metric that law schools consider, so if you can perform well in a major that interests you at a college that is well-respected but far less expensive (and preferably with a campus lifestyle/city that fits you well), and you rock your LSAT, you can still be competitive to get into a T14 law school (if that's your goal) even if you don't go to a Top 10 university. Even when choosing a law school, however, I would recommend considering the same factors before choosing based on prestige alone if the latter will put you into hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt. The goal at the end of all of this is to find a fulfilling and exciting career that is right for you, and while having a prestigious educational background can be part of that equation it definitely doesn't have to be. I hope this helps give you a little clarity :)

[@kevinjoyce6303]

You should add management consulting to that list of comparably compensated professions. MBA grads joining MBB and B4 firms are making ~$200k+ including bonuses.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

Oh yes! Good call! And I think their salaries and bonuses jump even faster than law firm associates' do!

[@ferlou2373]

For real? Weird, in Germany big law firms pay waaaaaaaay more than MBB and B4. Like nearly twice as much.

[@AngelaVorpahl]

@@ferlou2373 Oh really? I wonder if the hours required are similar as well?

[@ferlou2373]

Angela Vorpahl From what I’ve gathered it‘s even that on average (Ofc it differs from firm to firm and area to area) that the working hours are longer in consulting. But now that I think about it, the most likely reason is the fact that it takes you up to 7 years until you become a real lawyer in Germany, which means when you compare the two like I did, you kinda compare apples and oranges as a not too small proportion of consultants start with „only“ bachelor degrees and consequently get a much lower wage compared to someone who went through 7 years of education. If you just compared the entry level salaries of consultants with an mba or phd (so people whose education is on a similar level if you look at the time spent), their salary wouldn’t look that different.

[@jamesreveres335]

I wish I had a problem with having too much money 😂

[@AngelaVorpahl]

I hear you, on the list of possible life problems it's a privileged problem to have for sure!

[@atvman1014]

More money, less problems! More money beautiful boat, more money, mustang COBRA