Are Refrigerants Flammable?-"Did You Know" The ESCO HVAC Show

[@averyalexander2303]

Awesome demo! I'd love to see this tested with R32 and R454b too since it's looking like that's what will be in our homes soon. Another scenario I'd like to see tested is discharging the refrigerant into a semi enclosed container such as a bag and seeing if you can achieve a flammable mixture with the air. That would sort of simulate what could happen if, for example, an evaporator develops a large leak into a room and then a gas furnace, dryer, stove, etc is lit. I could see that scenario potentially being very bad. I realize that type of scenario would be unlikely, but we must also consider what could potentially happen in a worst case scenario with the right ratio of refrigerant and air and a strong ignition source, not just showing that a product can be safe to use under ideal conditions like many of the videos online are showing.

[@escogroup]

If I could find a way to do this without losing my 608…..I’d be all over it. But unfortunately I have not found any non-regulated uses for R32 or R454B…..yet. Clifton

[@averyalexander2303]

​@@escogroup I believe that type of testing is exempt from the EPA's ban on venting. I can't find it on the EPA's website at the moment, but I remember seeing it somewhere. If testing wasn't exempt, there would be no legal way to even classify the flammability of refrigerants. That may also fall under the "de minimis" exemption for oil tests, acid tests, etc. Either way, you could try to call or email the EPA to get conformation just to cover yourself if they did try to go after you. I doubt they would, but I completely understand your concern.

[@agusmaulana2970]

Good explanation. However, it should be noted that regulated flammable HFC refrigerants will produce toxic gases. The combustion of a refrigerant material has different sizes, according to the principle of the fire triangle. However, every time we fill the refrigerant into the cooling system and of course it has been tested that the system has no leaks, always do the vacuum work first. Of course, this activity has eliminated one component in the fire triangle, namely oxygen, which is the trigger for the fire. Therefore one thing out of several things for security purposes, what needs to be considered is that the vacuum process must be carried out.

[@timothyverstrateii7513]

Thanks for doing this, you're a great teacher.

[@escogroup]

Thanks Tim! We enjoy sharing what we have learned.

[@bucket4622]

Very interesting and entertaining presentation thanks

[@escogroup]

Thanks for joining us Bucket. It’s a crazy world out there, we are just trying to keep the industry aware of these transitions. A2L residential equipment is starting to hit the wholesalers now

[@CommonSenseFishing209]

Id like to report refrigerant abuse and get my 10k lmao.

[@escogroup]

For educational purposes only with the use of unregulated chemicals, that happen to be what we use as refrigerants…🙄

[@RobTucker-cx6vo]

great demo!!! If i'm not mistaken, your message is that all refrigerants are flammable and the new products are the same as the old when it comes to this. Then why do the manufactures deem they need flammable gas sensors in the new equipment?

[@escogroup]

Thanks Rob, yes the point made is that ALL refrigerants are flammable to a degree under the right combination of fuel, air and ignition. Our manufacturers are complying with building codes to add leak detection sensors to minimize the spread of “potentially combustible “ gases into an inhabited space.

[@escogroup]

It comes down to 3 things to have a successful refrigerant transition; 1) Be well educated 2) Use best practices 3) Shared learned experiences

[@avessyed442]

Amazing pratical demo of flameblity ratio of refrigerants.

[@escogroup]

We are glad you liked it. Please let us know if you have ideas for training we can develop to help you and others better understand where the industry is headed.

[@realSamAndrew]

Nice demonstration.

[@escogroup]

Glad you liked it!

[@michaeladams7038]

I'm going to share this anytime someone mentions flammable refrigerants.

[@escogroup]

Thanks Michael, we appreciate it. Lots of false information out there

[@donaldbakerakathedonaldaka5261]

Love the look Clifton!!

[@pauldombroski5185]

Awesome job on this! Tell Jason I said Hello!!

[@escogroup]

Thanks! Will do!

[@AmericanEnergy01]

GREAT Job!

[@escogroup]

Thank You! I figured it might be a bit controversial but needed to be discussed professionally. There is a LOT of misperceptions and bad information out there right now. Thanks for joining us!

[@AmericanEnergy01]

Enjoying the channel, this is Don Thomas, the HVAC ChatGPT guy from the podcast several weeks ago. Thanks 👍

[@ducharmehvactraining925]

excellent thanks!

[@escogroup]

You're welcome!

[@NickAlati]

In Arizona we call Global Warming summer

[@JamesPettinato]

The problem everyone is missing is the propane is mixed with poe oil, the mixture becomes napalm

[@escogroup]

There is NO propane in A2L refrigerants

[@averyalexander2303]

Any refrigerant will burn very well when mixed with a mist of oil. Even if the refrigerant itself is CO2 or some other completely non flammable gas, the oil will still burn. A truly non flammable refrigerant isn't possible when there's always oil circulating through the system with the refrigerant.

[@escogroup]

@averyalexander2303 yeah oil is still very flammable no matter what refrigerant is mixed with it. Nothing scares me me with a torch than rolling fireballs of oil-Clifton

[@escogroup]

@@averyalexander2303 Very good point. The fires I have encountered in the field were primarily oil related and not refrigerant related. Best practices will be the key with installing and servicing these next generation of refrigerants.

[@Steve410811]

No big deal. I remember ppl freaking out from r-22 to 410a 😀👍

[@hassanmahmood703]

Please investigate indoor A2L R32 gas leakage fire blast reason in pakistan . Three to fiur cases are recently happened in asia pakistan

[@escogroup]

Thank you for pointing this out Hassan. I have been researching ductless explosions in Asia that have showed up on KZbin. So far each of the systems have been improperly installed R290 ductless systems that are not allowed by code in most of the world. I will continue to investigate and do a video once I have better data- Clifton

[@codykruies3414]

Hydro Floro olefin