Bart Ehrman, Who is this Jesus Character anyway?

New Testament scholar Bart Ehrman will present a 90 minute seminar on the topic, "Did Jesus Call Himself God? A Closer Look at the Evidence". To see it live on November 7th at 3:00pm Eastern time for $9.95, CLICK THE LINK.
aronra--ehrman...
That price includes getting a recording afterwards. It will cost $14.95 on the website for the recording afterwards for those who don’t sign up for the live event.

[@GnosticInformant]

“If you don’t know much, you can say anything you want and think your right “ - Bart Ehrman

[@kevincrady2831]

In fact, every _serious_ scholar agrees with me (and if they don't agree with me, clearly they're not a serious scholar). :)

[@TheAbrantino]

Flat Earth mantra

[@daftmantis9027]

*you're, bart said smartly

[@garygood6804]

@@daftmantis9027 yes. You're is correct. Beat me to it.

[@carlosdelgado8119]

The Bible is telling us a story that unfortunately some churches don’t preach. I can assure you that Christ is real and in fact is the only way to heaven, He is the way, The Truth and The Life. Learn what The Bible is telling us, and do not let any man drive you away from your salvationC who is Christ Jesus, our Lord. “My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me,is greater than all[a];no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. I and the Father are one.” John 10:27-30 The Bible Story: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eKrTnXp7h7yNhrs

[@nolsterbuckr8496]

Geez, Aron's just cranking out content ever since eating those fiery hot noodles. Very cool to see you chat with Dr. Ehrman!

[@JAGUART]

AronRa. So hot right now!

[@kai_plays_khomus]

Thought exactly the same when I saw the notification. 😁

[@nitehawk86]

Ra-Men

[@brianreardon159]

👌

[@raymondhoward2492]

It horrifies me to think what this man thinks hot food is

[@goldenskeptic6309]

So God sacrifices himself, to himself, to close a loop the HE created? And they say it's not a belief? Unbelievable!!!

[@WarlockHolmes420]

Yes but his holy bloddletting cures our souls! 😁😁😁🤣😂

[@WarlockHolmes420]

God came down to earth to kill himself so we didn't have to suffer forever if we just believe it happened 😁. Perfectly reasonable 😁 😂🤣

[@WarlockHolmes420]

I guess the other trillion trillion planets were busy lol

[@idlando]

And prays to himself, like in the garden before crucifixion. Theological recursion.

[@WarlockHolmes420]

@@idlando Makes perfect sense!

[@emanuelmayer]

I love "Lost Christianities: The Battles for Scripture and the Faiths We Never Knew" so much, thank you!

[@natew.7951]

I'm reading that one right now!

[@southernsal3113]

I'm ashamed to say that, when I was a Christian, and studied the Bible, I didn't know nearly as much as I do now. But, I suspect, there's a reason Christians won't dig deeper.

[@proculusjulius7035]

@@southernsal3113 they willingly choose to do so even when confronted with factual evidence of this.

[@jesuslord6822]

1 Corinthians Chapter 15 Is The Ressurrection Creed Thatt Paul Had Received Only 3-5 Years After Jesus Crucifiction And Had It Written 20 Years Later In A.D 54-55 And Jesus Went On The Cross At A.D 30 Also The Tel Dan Inscription States The House Of David On It And The Moabite Stone Records Mesha Just Like The Bible Worshipping Yahweh The Pool Of Siloam When Jesus Heals The Guy Is Also A Real Place And The Book Of Acts Gets The Environment Of The First Century Correct Which Myths Do Not Do It States Drusilla And Felix Got Married While Josephus The Jewish Historian Records The Same Thing And Believing In The Jesus Of The Bible And Christianity We Are Saved By Grace Not Of Ourselves It Is The Free Gift Of God By Repenting And Putting On The Lord Jesus Christ While Jehovah Witness And Mormonism Do Not Think They Are Saved And Are Earning Salvation To Get It However The Biblical Jesus Is The Only Way And Its Not About Achieving It Rather It Is More Like Receiving Christ To Be Saved In Him And Your Works Are The Fruit Of Your Salvation Amen And 2 Timothy 4:11 States Bring The Cloak I Left At Carpus Indicating It Was Authentic And Jesus Is More Worth It For Everlasting Life And Gary Habermas Has The Greatest Case For The Ressurection And Dr. James Tour On KZbin Also Shows The Reasons It Wasnt An Accident God Bless Jesus Is Lord Five Scientific Reasons To Believe In God kzbin.info/www/bejne/iqW2iayoet-LqZY The Case For Design kzbin.info/www/bejne/rJ2bYWWifaaea7s Jesus And His Ressurection Video kzbin.info/www/bejne/d2HMdYGCrdKKjK8 Gary Habermas On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/l6rCdZVqh9yNla8 The Reliability Of The New Testament inspiringphilosophy.org/defending-christianity/

[@AnnoyingNewslettersPage6]

@@jesuslord6822 are you listening to yourself?

[@grayintheuk8021]

You have to love a video where the title is "Who is this Jesus Character anyway?" Excellent video thank you. You two, AronRa and Bart have been incredibly instrumental in my de-conversion from Christianity to common sense. Thanks so much and also for this video. Very Best to you all - keep safe. Gray

[@dr.floridamanphd]

@The Dead Roach Society “I don’t get that because I was raised Episcopalian. It’s Catholic Lite. Same religion but with half the guilt.” Robin Williams

[@grayintheuk8021]

@Joe Andersen Thanks for quoting parts of this book at me Joe. I'm aware of what is written as I've read that book many times. I'm totally unconvinced by lack of good evidence presented. Best Gray

[@jesuslord6822]

@@grayintheuk8021 kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKbXhHeBaN-kj6M

[@grayintheuk8021]

@Joe Andersen Thanks Joe but there are no scientific reasons to believe in the supernatural world. We have no good evidence in fact. The case for design is terrible and rebutted. We have nothing on the so claimed resurrection. I think that you have been convinced by the lower quality claims of many apologetics. These people have an agenda which is usually money and power. The earliest is 50-70 years then 150 after the death scene in that book. Also even if Jesus wrote the book himself and signed it, that is not proof of the supernatural. However, I don't think you would agree. Why would a book written so long after the events by 'no one knows' who ever be convincing to anyone? Certainly if this was from a god then sorry but that is not a smart god. Why, well there is no reason to think just because someone said they are a god in a book, they are a god! What's the difference to finding Harry Potter in 2K+ years and concluding that the naughty bloke was a Lord! That is similar except we know who and when the books were written. We don't with the bible. Also a god builds the universe with trillions of stars and planets and we, the entire purpose of this experiment, get an old book in a dead language. That very poor method to convey this god's thoughts and wishes, is why we have over 1000 different denominations of Christianity. The written word is very poor for a universe building god but just what you expect from Bronze Age sexist people. The evidence is certainly not good and a god would know better. I am totally unconvinced, I don't know why anyone would be. Well childhood indoctrination before the age of critical think is a favourite way it normally passed on. Thanks anyway for trying. Best Gray

[@jesuslord6822]

@@grayintheuk8021 #JESUS FIRST Responding To Bart On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWPRlmakmdOJh80

[@BurnBird1]

You managed to get Bart Ehrman!? I love this guy! I've watched so many of his debates and lectures online!

[@jarrygarry5316]

I read his books and it is really good.He is a good scholar.

[@AAwildeone]

Bart has a new book so he's making the rounds for free. Don't get used to it lol

[@eddieclark9802]

Same here. He drives me crazy with "uh", but love his knowledge. 😊

[@funstuff2006]

@@AAwildeone Lol, I hadn't taken that into consideration when I was thinking "how did a youtuber so unabashedly contentious and quick to ad hominems book a scholar who is so affable even when fervently disagreeing."

[@paullynch6945]

The whole religion thing is just bizarre.

[@Ho-oh-Nut]

Yeah. Most religious people were indoctrinated as kids with less then 1% of the information on their religion, the stuff about how good is love and all that’s bull

[@kevin4618]

Not really. Imagine you were brought up in a time where no one knew anything about physics. You didn’t know why you were on the planet. You saw yourself as different from all the other species and knew nothing about genetics. What sort of answers do you think people would come up with at the time?!?!

[@FlyDown306]

Also imagine you want to govern a population of people, in certain instances even capital punishment isn't enough to dissuade the population from committing unwanted behavior. But an afterlife in which everyone is to be judged by a Supreme being and if found guilty one is punished for all eternity can be a good deterrent.

[@somethingsinlife5600]

Also...Has anyone else noticed how "God" became more and more Pro-Monarchy and later on more and more Pro-Capitalist throughout the ages? Also...is it just me who thinks Gods used to be more transactional, where you gave them something and they gave you back the same or more. But later on it became more and more about "You owe God everything, he owes you nothing, he doesn't have to keep his end of the bargain, just accept the rule of the rulers"?

[@dr.floridamanphd]

God has always been pro-power.

[@mrcurly1147]

I guess god's evolve too! Now if we can just get one of the ass hats to go to deity school to learn how to become likeable.

[@whatabouttheearth]

I think you are conflating. You have to look at the society and era that that religion or particular denomination came from. American Christianity for instance, has never been pro monarchy, but there is a big capitalist tendency, there is a reason for that. The dominant social ideology is always stronger, and that changes the slant of the particular form of a religion

[@somethingsinlife5600]

@Just a man. And you my friend don't know what a true scottsman is :)

[@whatabouttheearth]

@Just a man. Capitalism is waaaaaay more than that. Obviously you need to read more of the right books. And no, in Capitalism most workers do not make profit, as in surplus, they get paid way less than the value they produce and the owners of the company make profit, 'owners of the means of production' back in the day but that is more complicated now since some modes of production have been decentralized and democratized such as media, but really the term always referred to industrial labor, and in industrial labor there are still "owners of the means of production" who make profit, and the workers do not receive the value the create. Plus capitalism extends beyond that to a plethora of socio-psychological relationships. People work for a wage in any market economy, including socialism.

[@agent_w.]

Thank you Aaron for consistently calling religion out on its BS

[@mrcurly1147]

This must be like his 8,000 episode or something! And he's still getting new religious insanities exposed!

[@satanofficial3902]

It's *SEXIST!!!* to use the term "bullsh*t" when she cows go poop, too. And, it's also *SPECIESIST!!!* because non-bovine animals also expel digestion remnants through their anal orifice. In the future, instead of saying "bullsh*t", everyone should please say "Non-gender-specific non-species-specific animal excrement". And instead of using "BS", please use "NSNSAE". Thank you for your cooperation. 🐮 "Moooo!"

[@jesuslord6822]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKbXhHeBaN-kj6M

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST Responding To Bart On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWPRlmakmdOJh80

[@mrcurly1147]

@@jesuslord6822 I don't believe in sin. That's just a ploy the dupers use to get you to feel guilty about not giving them more money. I could give a flying f**k whether your insecure god is offended or not. First provide evidence the dufus actually exists, then try and convince me I should worship that thing. Good luck with that.

[@Vadjong]

[spoilers] Whether Darth Vader was Luke and Leia's father during "A New Hope" is the more relevant question nowadays

[@galacticbob1]

I love that you have spoiler tags for a movie that came out 45 years ago. 😄

[@thefran901]

@@galacticbob1 There are young people growing up all the time who obviously will watch all sorts of cult classics for the first time, the have the right to enjoy old stuff without spoilers too.

[@JackgarPrime]

"Sometimes it matters what the word 'is' is!" Good stuff! I'd love to hear the two of you discuss more in the future!

[@derreckwalls7508]

That was a reference to what Clinton said when asked about his relationship with Monica and said "There's no relationship...", which was true if "is" means now.

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST Responding To Bart On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWPRlmakmdOJh80

[@JackgarPrime]

@@derreckwalls7508 Yes, I know. Thats why it was funny!

[@jesuslord6822]

@@derreckwalls7508 #JESUS FIRST A Guy Reported To Me Before At Church I Have More For You To Do Then Came Back To Life And Many Believers Have Reported This According To Gary Habermas

[@jesuslord6822]

@@derreckwalls7508 #JESUS FIRST Jesus Is The Christ And He Doesn't Call Us To Earn Salvation Rather Give Our Lives To Jesus The Free Gift Of God For The Body Is Dead Due To Sin But The Spirit Is Alive Due To Righteousness And By His Wounds We Are Healed

[@aaronshropshire8552]

Two of my favorite speakers sharing a screen! Looking forward to the seminar.

[@grapeshot]

I think even if he existed he was nothing more than a first-century Galilean cult leader, no magical powers and he didn't rise from the grave like some extra from Night of the Living Dead.

[@wadeinn463]

See! You admit there’s resurrection. Pray to the Living Dead.

[@c.guydubois8270]

But butt it's a miracle! It has to be, it must be like this. Lol

[@Bob-of-Zoid]

Alice cooper was one of them!! All hail Alice "Jesus" Cooper!

[@tabularasa0606]

@@Bob-of-Zoid And Keith Richards is still alive, All hail Keith Christ.

[@braindeveloperdimensional5579]

In Islam, the people who rise from the dead are called kafir, and Muslims use the word kafir for non Muslims now. It's strange that they don't consider Jesus a non Muslim. But, wait, some of them do.

[@gnomevoyeur]

“If you don’t know much, you can say anything you want and feel you’re right” this may well be my favourite quote from any person who has ever lived.

[@bthearen]

I went to an Apostolic Church for a short time. It’s what we called the “Jesus Only” church. They believe that God was Jesus and Jesus was God. Same with the Holy Spirit. They also only baptize in the name of Jesus, not the father, son, and Holy Spirit. I never really cared about doctrine but thought it was interesting.

[@andrewlitvinov7266]

So they really are unitarians. Protestants really managed to get back to the roots.

[@dr.floridamanphd]

@Account NumberEight evangelical math: 1+1+1= you’re going to hell!!!!!!!

[@rookmaster7502]

It certainly made it a little more simple. No need to decide which of the three entities to direct one's prayers to.

[@reko3103]

In the name of the Jesus, the Jesus and the holy Jesus.

[@wendyleeconnelly2939]

That's what I thought... Apostolic which I think are a form of Holiness-Pentecostals... "Jesus Only" or "Oneness Pentecostals"

[@AdeptPaladin]

Wow. Ehrman and Aron together? Ehrman is a certainly someone who, while I don't always accept his views, makes a dang good case for an intellectual review of the bible.

[@stuchly1]

At least he feels like he honestly tries to attain a historically accurate view instead of settling for any random off the cuff idea or justification. There is a level of honesty in this which I can definitely appreciate. It's a learned believer who definitely knows his bible backwards telling other believes that they are believing wrong and I'm all in for this kind of tea.

[@c.guydubois8270]

Dr. Josh ...

[@dr.floridamanphd]

@@c.guydubois8270 what about Digital Harambe?

[@thomasneal9291]

@@stuchly1 "At least he feels like he honestly tries to attain a historically accurate view" ooh, subtle. Yeah, he does feel like he does that... doesn't he. OTOH, the rest of us who studied the same "evidence" weren't convinced by his arguments much, even when they were in vogue. Ehrman is STILL the only jesus historian left standing basically, and there is a reason for that. His issue was always that while he might be able to find evidence there was some guy whose name was Jesus who lived in the period, his linking of that to anything remotely resembling what was EVER written about his has no evidence whatsoever. ergo, he has no support for the religion that was built OUT of those myths. He clearly failed, but like most intellectually dishonest people, he will NEVER let go of his own bias. An honest argument cannot be built upon being consistently wrong and in denial about it.

[@jesuslord6822]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKbXhHeBaN-kj6M

[@esbendit]

The amount of ink and blood spent arguing facets of the trinity is astounding.

[@Bob-of-Zoid]

Way more blood than ink!

[@JAGUART]

The magnitude of thought, writing, apparatus and institutions wasted on theology is 2nd only to the mysteries of the universe itself. It really is damn near incomprehensible that the world occupies itself with it.

[@Starhawke_Gaming]

@E IN MEDIA ROCKS - most atheist channels wouldn't give a single flying fuck about theology if it wasn't for all the theists who want to force their religion, or at least their religious rules and beliefs, onto everyone around them including non-believers. (Edit:typo)

[@nm1915]

@E IN MEDIA ROCKS ah yes. The old “I don’t have an argument so I’ll just paint everyone I disagree with in the same broad generalization.” Do you have anything to say or are you gonna say the same things that every other boring theist troll that comments every other day says?

[@nm1915]

@E IN MEDIA ROCKS I like how instead of providing an argument or evidence, you just did the same thing I mentioned in my comment.

[@russb24]

Ehrman: "Jesus Christ, Superstar, Do you think you're what they say you are?"

[@jesuslord6822]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKbXhHeBaN-kj6M

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST Responding To Bart On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWPRlmakmdOJh80

[@jesuslord6822]

@Nic B #JESUS FIRST Sharing The Resources For They're Salvation

[@professorariel]

I want every lecture/talk to start with "hello puppies and kittens" from now on.

[@EdwardHowton]

That's what the low budget zombie TV show _Z Nation_ called zombies. Kind of weird hearing it in an educational context after seeing that ridiculous show.

[@EdwardHowton]

@Miraak Yeah I know, that's part of why I called a Bart Ehrman presentation educational, because he shows just how idiotic the bible's fairytale story is.

[@wendyleeconnelly2939]

yes this was awesome!

[@wendyleeconnelly2939]

@Miraak hunh? not even culturally and historically or linguistically?

[@WarlockHolmes420]

Thanks Aron. I needed to hear something that grounded me. Life is absolute HELL ATM for me so THANK YOU 💜

[@jamesmaybrick2001]

tell me about it. other than jumping off the nearest bridge what keeps me going is just looking up at the night sky. in the face of all that drama, distance and beauty what does anyones struggles actually mean in the full picture. death is assured (although i am hoping for a robocop body to have my battered brain implanted in) but the universe will keep ticking on (for a few more trillion years at least). enjoy the view while you have it. little else matters in the long run.

[@HelloThere-xx1ct]

Awesome to see this collaboration!

[@suffist]

*Who is this Jesus character anyway?* Well for a start. No one has the slightest physical evidence to support a historical Jesus; no artifacts, dwelling, works of carpentry, or self-written manuscripts. All claims about Jesus derive from the writings of other people. There's no contemporary Roman record that shows Pontius Pilate executing a man named Jesus. Devastating to historians, there's not a single contemporary writing that mentions Jesus. All documents about Jesus came well after the life of the alleged Jesus from either unknown authours, people who had never met an earthly Jesus, or from fraudulent, mythical, or allegorical writings. In other words, it's all just hearsay. Hearsay isn't evidence for anything.

[@benjamindover5676]

And then I force the Christian to look it up for themselves and to bring me their #1, very best home run contemporary evidence for a historical Jesus in their own words and NO LINKS. Just one,, they're very best. The reason I insist on no links is that when they find out that there are none, they will resort to posting a link to some Christian site with more lies. And when they do this, it shatters one of the biggest lies the Christian Church tells them. The Christian comes face to face with the FACT that they have lied to and there is no contemporary evidence for Jesus. It's all just a bunch of hearsay written down long after the fact.

[@suffist]

@@benjamindover5676 Exactly! Virtually all other claims of Jesus come from sources outside of Christian writings. Devastating to the claims of Christians, however, comes from the fact that all of these accounts come from authors who lived after the alleged life of Jesus. Since they did not live during the time of the hypothetical Jesus, none of their accounts serve as eyewitness evidence. "Josephus Flavius, the Jewish historian, lived as the earliest non-Christian who mentions a Jesus. Although many scholars think that Josephus' short accounts of Jesus (in Antiquities) came from interpolations perpetrated by a later Church father (most likely, Eusebius), Josephus' birth in 37 C.E. (well after the alleged crucifixion of Jesus), puts him out of range of an eyewitness account. Moreover, he wrote Antiquities in 93 C.E., after the first gospels got written!" Therefore, even if his accounts about Jesus came from his hand, his information could only serve as hearsay. "Pliny the Younger (born: 62 C.E.) His letter about the Christians only shows that he got his information from Christian believers themselves." Regardless, his birth date puts him out of range as an eyewitness account. "Tacitus, the Roman historian's birth year at 64 C.E., puts him well after the alleged life of Jesus. He gives a brief mention of a "Christus" in his Annals (Book XV, Sec. 44), which he wrote around 109 C.E. He gives no source for his material. Although many have disputed the authenticity of Tacitus' mention of Jesus, the very fact that his birth happened after the alleged Jesus and wrote the Annals during the formation of Christianity. This shows that his writing can only provide us with hearsay accounts. Suetonius, a Roman historian, born in 69 C.E., mentions a "Chrestus," a common name. Apologists assume that "Chrestus" means "Christ" (a disputable claim). But even if Seutonius had meant "Christ," it still says nothing about an earthly Jesus. Just like all the others, Suetonius' birth occurred well after the purported Jesus." Again, only hearsay. And this is their fantastic evidence for their Jesus. It would get thrown out of every law court in the land. (lol) The most famous white guy in all of History never even existed.

[@kevincrady2831]

In fairness to the historicists, there's no evidence of that sort for the vast, vast majority of people who lived at that time. If we were talking about a figure like Socrates or Pythagoras or any of the various false Messiahs that Josephus mentioned, this sort of "hearsay" would have to be enough to at least say, "Yeah, sure, this person probably existed." In the case of "this Jesus character" however, historicists are presented with a paradox: he has to be someone who was so impressive to his followers that they became convinced he was a divine being through whom the Universe came to be--yet so unimpressive that nobody in his time, including the "scribes" with whom he was said to be constantly arguing, considered him worth writing home about, even in condemnation. While there are historical figures about whom myths and miracle stories were created (e.g. Alexander the Great, Emperor Vespasian), historians can strip away the myths and tall tales, and still have an authentic historical person who would be renowned enough to accumulate such stories in the first place. In the case of Jesus, if you strip away all the miracles and theological constructs to yield a plausible historical person (say, a failed apocalyptic prophet and cult leader), the result is not the sort of person myths and miracle stories are written about. If we look to the earliest writings about Jesus (the authentic letters of Paul and the Gospels), we would be very hard pressed to find references to anything the historical man said or did to convince anyone that he was a divine cosmic being worthy of worship and faith. There's not even the notion that he had disciples during a life on Earth. Paul exhibits no interest in "the real guy." If we had only Paul's writings, we would not know when or where Jesus lived, anything that he said or did that might have earned him renown, or anything about him at all other than that he was crucified, and that people (including Paul) claimed to have seen him in visions after his death. Paul's "biography" of Jesus is extremely sparse (he was "made from a woman," of the seed of David, a Jew, and he was crucified). With the sole exception of his crucifixion, those "biographical details" are just check-boxes for meeting the minimum requirements in order to call him the Messiah. IIRC, other than one quote from the Last Supper narrative, Paul never cites Jesus even when words attributed to Jesus in the Gospels would clinch the arguments he makes. He never makes reference to the great man's words or deeds to support his positions or inspire his flock. Instead, he is wholly focused on his theological construction of Jesus as a divine, cosmic figure. While he refers to James as "the brother of the Lord," he never feels a need to explain why Jesus likes him better than his own brother (on the premise that Paul was talking about a sibling relationship rather than something like a proto-ecclesiastical title) when he's arguing for the superiority of his apostolic status to that of James. The Gospels portray Jesus as being famous for having superpowers (something Paul apparently neither knew or cared about as far as we can tell). A few scraps of "teaching" are provided, but if you were to assemble all the "red letter" sayings of Jesus, and not count Synoptic repetitions, you'd be lucky to have a single Pauline epistle's worth of material. Think about it--the teachings of the guy whose followers regarded him as an incarnate deity were less worthy of preservation than the words of some dude that walked into the service fifteen minutes late. Worse still, historicists readily admit that a lot of the teachings placed in Jesus' mouth were put there by the Gospel writers (and/or later redactors) for their own purposes, and not things the historical Jesus might have actually said. Pretty much all of Jesus' "life" as portrayed in the Gospels was crafted to reference Hebrew scripture, or (arguably) other popular sources like Homer. Jesus is the new and improved Moses, Joshua, Elijah, Elisha, Odysseus, Dionysus, etc., and did we mention the superpowers? But nothing about the real man or how he managed to impress the earliest Christians so much in the first place. So we're left with a nobody who was adored by his followers for nothing in particular, but to such a degree that they believed he created the Universe, and followed him off a theological cliff into starting a new religion. It makes more sense to me that Christianity started with the esoteric readings of Scripture and mystic visions, only getting to a "real man who walked on Earth" after Christians started wanting their Mystery Religion savior to have more truthiness than all the others. Jesus is not the Joseph Smith of Christianity, he's Christianity's Angel Moroni.

[@suffist]

@@kevincrady2831 Exactly! Paul's biblical letters (epistles) serve as the oldest surviving Christian texts, written probably around 60 C.E. Most scholars have little reason to doubt that Paul wrote some of them himself. Of the thirteen epistles, bible scholars think he wrote only eight of them, and even here, there occur interpolations. Not a single instance in any of Paul's writings claims that he ever meets or sees an earthly Jesus, nor does Paul give any reference to Jesus' life on earth (except for a few well-known interpolations). Therefore, all accounts about a Jesus could only have come from other believers or his imagination. More hearsay.

[@benjamindover5676]

@@suffist Regarding Paul. They believe that Paul met with the brother of Jesus named James. Right? (as if there is only one pair of brothers named James and Jesus at the time) If so, don't you think that James and others might have told Paul some childhood stories about Jesus? If you met the brother of God,, wouldn't you ask him some questions and mention them in letters? Don't you think we would have heard something about that? But yet,, not one word from Paul about the Earthy young Jesus?

[@ethio6301]

You actually got him on congrats

[@idlando]

Busy guy, he just appeared on Religion for Breakfast too.

[@thomasneal9291]

@@idlando he's not nearly as influential as he once was. there are reasons for that.

[@idlando]

@@thomasneal9291 ok? Because?

[@jesuslord6822]

1 Corinthians Chapter 15 Is The Ressurrection Creed That Paul Had Received Only 3-5 Years After Jesus Crucifiction And Had It Written 20 Years Later In A.D 54-55 And Jesus Went On The Cross At A.D 30 Also The Tel Dan Inscription States The House Of David On It And The Moabite Stone Records Mesha Just Like The Bible Worshipping Yahweh The Pool Of Siloam When Jesus Heals The Guy Is Also A Real Place And The Book Of Acts Gets The Environment Of The First Century Correct Which Myths Do Not Do It States Drusilla And Felix Got Married While Josephus The Jewish Historian Records The Same Thing And Believing In The Jesus Of The Bible And Christianity We Are Saved By Grace Not Of Ourselves It Is The Free Gift Of God By Repenting And Putting On The Lord Jesus Christ While Jehovah Witness And Mormonism Do Not Think They Are Saved And Are Earning Salvation To Get It However The Biblical Jesus Is The Only Way And Its Not About Achieving It Rather It Is More Like Receiving Christ To Be Saved In Him And Your Works Are The Fruit Of Your Salvation Amen And 2 Timothy 4:11 States Bring The Cloak I Left At Carpus Indicating It Was Authentic And Jesus Is More Worth It For Everlasting Life And Gary Habermas Has The Greatest Case For The Ressurection And Dr. James Tour On KZbin Also Shows The Reasons It Wasnt An Accident God Bless Jesus Is Lord Five Scientific Reasons To Believe In God kzbin.info/www/bejne/iqW2iayoet-LqZY The Case For Design kzbin.info/www/bejne/rJ2bYWWifaaea7s Jesus And His Ressurection Video kzbin.info/www/bejne/d2HMdYGCrdKKjK8 Gary Habermas On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/l6rCdZVqh9yNla8 The Reliability Of The New Testamentt inspiringphilosophy.org/defending-christianity/

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST For By Jesus All Things Are Created I'm Here For The News Of The Kingdom Of God And While Religion Has You Doing Good Deeds To Earn Salvation The Biblical Jesus Died And Rose Again For The Forgiveness Of Sin And By Grace You Are Saved So You Walk In Him For He Loved Us So We Love The Lord

[@uncle0eric]

I've never heard an explanation of the Trinity, the Incarnation, or the Atonement that didn't just completely fall apart after the smallest bit of scrutiny.

[@EdwardHowton]

I've never heard _an explanation_ of it. Period. People have made noises with their face-hole at me when asked, sure, but none of it even tried to explain anything.

[@sh33pboi]

I was raised believing that the trinity were three people but also one being. It doesn't make sense and it's not supposed to make sense because God is bigger than sense. Trying to understand it is useless, you're just supposed to accept it. It was like they were proud of their cognitive dissonance.

[@timsmith6675]

Just registered for @Bart Ehrman lecture to support him and @AronRa. It's a win-win! I can't wait for the exclusive lecture from this highly renowned NT scholar and for less than $10.

[@philj3167]

Bart's debates are a pretty good watch. Excellent source of info on bible, and breaking down it's b.s.

[@mrcurly1147]

Enough BS in there to fuel many careers... long careers... Enough to sink an ark.

[@satanofficial3902]

@@mrcurly1147 It's *SEXIST!!!* to say BS when she cows also go poopoo. 🐮 "Moooo!"

[@jesuslord6822]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKbXhHeBaN-kj6M

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST Responding To Bart On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWPRlmakmdOJh80

[@Julian0101]

@@jesuslord6822 Oh yes, the first response to bart from mister "My interpretation on the bible is not wrong, you just dont understand the bible the right way".

[@loudtim265]

Dude you have a special way of cutting thru bullshit and then yanking it out root & all. And you do it in a way that is intelligent but also anyone can understand. We are lucky to have you, never stop fighting the good and honorable fight to keep the religious from taking more power in our government.

[@jesuslord6822]

1 Corinthians Chapter 15 Is The Ressurrection Creed That Paul Had Received Only 3-5 Years After Jesus Crucifiction And Had It Written 20 Years Later In A.D 54-55 And Jesus Went On The Cross At A.D 30 Also The Tel Dan Inscription States The House Of David On It And The Moabite Stone Records Mesha Just Like The Bible Worshipping Yahweh The Pool Of Siloam When Jesus Heals The Guy Is Also A Real Place And The Book Of Acts Gets The Environment Of The First Century Correct Which Myths Do Not Do It States Drusilla And Felix Got Married While Josephus The Jewish Historian Records The Same Thing And Believing In The Jesus Of The Bible And Christianity We Are Saved By Grace Not Of Ourselves It Is The Free Gift Of God By Repenting And Putting On The Lord Jesus Christ While Jehovah Witness And Mormonism Do Not Think They Are Saved And Are Earning Salvation To Get It However The Biblical Jesus Is The Only Way And Its Not About Achieving It Rather It Is More Like Receiving Christ To Be Saved In Him And Your Works Are The Fruit Of Your Salvation Amen And 2 Timothy 4:11 States Bring The Cloak I Left At Carpus Indicating It Was Authentic And Jesus Is More Worth It For Everlasting Life And Gary Habermas Has The Greatest Case For The Ressurection And Dr. James Tour On KZbin Also Shows The Reasons It Wasnt An Accident God Bless Jesus Is Lord Five Scientific Reasons To Believe In God kzbin.info/www/bejne/iqW2iayoet-LqZY The Case For Design kzbin.info/www/bejne/rJ2bYWWifaaea7s Jesus And His Ressurection Video kzbin.info/www/bejne/d2HMdYGCrdKKjK8 Gary Habermas On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/l6rCdZVqh9yNla8 The Reliability Of The New Testamentt inspiringphilosophy.org/defending-christianity/

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST For By Jesus All Things Are Created I'm Here For The News Of The Kingdom Of God And While Religion Has You Doing Good Deeds To Earn Salvation The Biblical Jesus Died And Rose Again For The Forgiveness Of Sin And By Grace You Are Saved So You Walk In Him For He Loved Us So We Love The Lord

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST These Resources Are To Be Viewed Through A Gentle Context Amen Jesus Is Love And The Only Way To Be Saved Is Through The Jesus Of The Bible The Creator And Its The Free Gift Of God But May We Honor The Lord Jesus And No Longer Live For Ourselves But To The Lord

[@jesuslord6822]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKbXhHeBaN-kj6M

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST Responding To Bart On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWPRlmakmdOJh80

[@southernsal3113]

I like Dr Ehrman. He has knack for asking the right questions. Thanks Aron Ra 👍👌👍

[@EnbeeEspee]

Anyone who thinks community colleges provide inferior education, take one look at the enviable intellect of Mr Ra

[@howtheworldworks3]

Some guy tried to tell a cool fantasy story in the past and his fans went nuts and invented all kinds of crap based on his story. Poor guy. All he wanted to do was to tell some cool stories.

[@howtheworldworks3]

@Liam Quinn I was talking abut the first creators of the bible myths who were most probably telling stories verbally. Please stop writing if you are that stupid.

[@BlackEpyon]

Wish this was longer. Both of you have encyclopedic knowledge of your respective fields.

[@mrhdbnger]

His name has been dropped in too many conversations to count but this is my first time hearing and seeing Mr. Ehrman. What a charming and well spoken man. I was raised Lutheran so that trinity thing was drilled into me and I never could get my head around it. Any time I questioned it I was simply told not to and assured that it just is what it is, the Son begotten of the Father and being one substance with the Father and the Holy Spirit who procedes from the Father and the Son, whatever the hell all of that meant. Just shut up and recite it like a good boy. I wasn't a good boy or a good Lutheran. Nice to hear him say I wasn't wrong to think it was nuts.

[@historicalbiblicalresearch8440]

Christian Theologians are quite embarrassed by the Trinity concept but they are stuck with it

[@johnkerr1113]

I forget who dreamt up the trinity but for sure it was a human being ( Tertullian I believe ?) in the 3 rd century... amazed that people believe stories made up almost 300 years after a supposed event by an early apologist.... a story about a story about......

[@jayd4ever]

@@historicalbiblicalresearch8440 no but they accept it is hard to understand

[@jayd4ever]

it is hard to understand

[@jayd4ever]

@@johnkerr1113 he didnt dream it he came up with it to explain scripture

[@thenate9913]

I’ve watched so many videos of yours and didn’t think you were raised Mormon. I was as well but later left thinking god would want a personal relationship. I then eventually became enamored with science and nothing added up. Eventually I met my first atheist friend and the talks we had made me realize I am in fact atheist.

[@penelopegrier5073]

I was 4th generation Mormon myself. Walked away from all of it three years ago.

[@tyrionlannister3459]

This was such a good conversation, where's the damned rest of it??

[@jhunz23]

AronRa is so smart, articulate & unassuming He could give one question but its so mind-blowing.

[@RossOneEyed]

The baptism is a prime example of three beings. When Jesus was at the river, the Spirit descended as a dove while the Father said "Behold, this is my Son." Three distinct, separate beings. Of course, since it is all made up, does it really matter?

[@onedaya_martian1238]

It's like arguing who gets to eat the donut hole, or where the hole goes after the donut is eaten...heaven ? Religions are a better scam than a timeshare, as people pay the preachers to build a venue for talking about a place that they don't have to prove exists, just promise it WILL exist...just show up weekly and pay money to be convinced.

[@musicauthority7828]

It's so AWESOME!!!!! to see Bert Ehrman a renowned biblical scholar. and Aron Ra a well known Atheist. having such a great conversation. this could be a lesson for everyone that because people don't have to have the same beliefs. they can still be able to have a constructive Conversation. well done guys.

[@fancymcclean6210]

Great to see two, very smart, educated gents, talking erudite sense about religion. Wouldn't it be fantastic to see more of this? Flaxen Saxon.

[@religionisevil8850]

Aron, I've seen that this channel called Standing For Truth (ironic) has made a lengthy response to your flood series. I don't find a lot of what they say convincing, but I think you should respond to them lest they think they've beaten you.

[@Angelmou]

Gutsick gibbon adressed StandingforTruth misinformation at her channel on youtube in partially 3 hour long videos. Like any creationist he just repeats his lies instead of adressing his misquotations of papers or misquotes the debunking of his doing. Most of his lies revolve around out of context quote of chromosome2, mitochondrial eve he copies from Nathanial Jeanson and such adressed by Gutsick gibbon but also by others like Creation Myth youtube channel. Aron had as guest in some previous episodes. Aron also adressed StandingforTruth directly, where he did not manage to adress the phylogeny challenge about 2 years ago or so. Standing for Truth is a well known bearer of false witness and censor (he deletes comments on his channel pointing out his errors) for his imagined Jesus together with one of Kent Hovind's imitators and scholars Matt. His misinformation is beyond absurd. For example we have 8000 year old pine trees which would predate his 6000 year earth idea and the flood nonsense - where he tries to presents ring disturbance events - the problems about them is not only that the rings do not look the same as normal rings even for lay people - some are caused in deserts, some are in bitter cold tundra steppes etc. to fitt together to his story the pine trees must have teleported from siberia to mexican deserts and so on like crazy. This is just 1 example of insanity. The list is endless.

[@religionisevil8850]

@@Angelmou Thanks for the response. It's a very interesting sort of "truth" that requires lies and sleight-of-hand to keep it afloat, eh?

[@deathbytheblade6757]

@@religionisevil8850 Just goes to show. Trying to convince people that a fairy tale is reality takes a special kind of stupid. Or just indoctrination and programming, which are a real danger to young minds.

[@deathbytheblade6757]

@@Angelmou I've been doing this atheist thing for a while now. I've learned a couple of things from it, one being don't argue with religiots. I would suggest boiling down why you're a 'none' to something clear and simple, like 'religion is nonsense because it creates a narrative about us as human beings that can't be in the same realm as reality.' It's whole purpose is to conform people to believing a ridiculous assertion.

[@NeuroRift]

I wish this interview could've been a couple hours at least.

[@michaelkgrantj]

If a person cannot go to heaven unless they accept Jesus as their lord and savior, that is called worshipping a god. Not THE god, but A god. So this violates the golden calf rule or god lied to the Hebrews. It's all crazy talk no matter what you believe.

[@michaelkgrantj]

How can there be hindsight when evidence shows that Noah's Ark never happened!!! That was not a question because you refuse to believe facts. I don't even know where to start, but here we go... The fictitious bible only mentioned stones falling from the heavens to kill people in Juasua 10:11. Not to carry rain to drown everyone including innocent children and unborn babies. Science shows that stones would never reach people on the ground. Stones burn up all the time falling to Earth even TODAY! Every since humans created god and the bibles and quran they have been saying we are in, "End of Days." The 2000 years of it not happening is science, and science showing you that, "DAYS Are Infinite." Then there is death, heaven and hell. Burning 🔥 for not believing shows how desperate god wants people to believe it. The infinite level of pain is linear to god's desire that you believe it. God knows the heat and desire because it allegedly created them both, so god's... Level of Desire - Your Believe = Hell Fire That is the psychological profile of an Obsessed Stalker. The problem is that STALKERS will do ANYGHING to induce their victim to disire them. God being that obsessed, yet leaving not evidence that will induce people to desire/worship it FAILS the Truth Test. God leaves ZERO evidence to induce you desire/worship it. God evens leave PLENTY of evidence that shows the bibles/quran are all fictions. It LOVES and will BURN you FOREVER and leave NO REASON for you to believe that, EXCEPT OPPOSING EVIDENCE.

[@fotofillholland]

This reminds me of common stories in science-fiction novels, also reminds me of comic book fans discussing plot holes with characters like Superman, more so parallels with the origin of Scientology. Could it be the Bible is actually the world's first science fiction serialised comic book?

[@LaurieKoudstaal]

This is a great snippet. Thanks Aron!

[@SiberianExpress2007]

I was hoping that Aron would have talked to Bart Ehrman about Jesus mythicism.

[@onedaya_martian1238]

Aron is smart enough to know that Dr Ehrman thinks a jesus existed and that Bart gets riled up on the myth topic. Seems Ehrman is convinced the clothes HAVE to have an Emperor, else the scholarship is worthless.

[@bleirdo_dude]

If only Bart realized that Paul's Jesus, and Philo's Logos are the same imaginations derived from OT scripture.

[@SiberianExpress2007]

@@onedaya_martian1238 I’m skeptical of Jesus mythicism since so few scholars buy into it, even those who are atheist. The scholarship would be no less important if Jesus turned out to be entirely mythical since Christianity would still be the largest and most influential religion in history. The Old Testament is agreed upon by scholars to be mostly fiction but it’s still a hot area of scholarship. I think Aron and many atheist activists get dogmatic about Jesus mythicism.

[@angeliparraguirre7329]

Great guest, and very interesting conversation. Good job!

[@Raydensheraj]

Seeing some real heavyweights on your channel make me happy. The last video series on the textbooks are the definition of scholarship & research... science communication deluxe.

[@FlyingSpaghettiJesus]

Jesus - the middle eastern Jew most Americans wouldn’t sit next to on a plane.

[@nativeatheist6422]

C'mon Bart. Debate Richard Carrier. Let's settle this.

[@Griexxt]

He debated Robert M. Price. I think the best we could hope for is that people like Bart here recognise that some mythicist positions are at least plausible. I don't think it's possible to definitively prove either case.

[@YY4Me133]

No one has to prove Jesus did _not_ exist; it's up to those that want other to believe he did to provide credible supporting evidence. In the absence of such evidence, there's no good reason to believe he did.

[@jayjayd]

How Jesus become God is one of the best book I read ever! Thank you very much!

[@sbludba]

try reading the Koran next.

[@MaleINTP]

@@sbludba i have. I don't like violence against women as it is advocated for in the Koran time and time again.. (surah 4:24, surah 4:34..) The practice of spreading an idiology through blood and conquest is absurd.. it's what you expect out of people instead of a divine request (although it is seen as one throughout the Hadiths and the Kuran itself). The sun setting in mud is absurd. The moon being split in half is absurd Birds flying back to Abraham after him cutting them in parts is evil and absurd Talking parts of your body is absurd.. and so on.. Yet "this is the book of Wich there is no doubt" and of "no contradictions" Maybe you should try reading a real book instead of that nonsense.. try something about physics or biology

[@sbludba]

@@MaleINTP seems like you have NEVER read the bible.

[@thomascanfield8571]

When Jesus prays to god he must have a better phone provider because I never get an answer.

[@kevincrady2831]

That's because you don't have an iGod 6. But not to worry, I do, so if you'll just give me 10 percent of your money, I'll relay God's orders to you and your requests back to him. No, really! ;)

[@edluckenbill8363]

This a very informative video. Thanks Aron 😊

[@AbnormalWrench]

Wow! This was a great interview!

[@harrypothead42024]

The difference between Scholars like Bart Ehrman and Scholars like, William Lane Craig is, Bart Ehrman is interested. William Lane Craig is terrified.

[@Bob-of-Zoid]

More like Bart Ehrman is an actual scholar, and William Lame Craig, plays one on TV!

[@onedaya_martian1238]

William Lane Craig seems always astonished that so people listen to his crap and bemused he is able to travel and make a very good living off of these tales. If I didn't know better, I think his smugness comes from his internal voice , wretchedly sounding like his actual voice, saying "This sh@t MUST be true if all the kids I teach believe it so willingly." When Craig is most terrified, he goes into full scholarship mode, quoting authors and saying their names with the accents of their country of origin and saying "obviously others don't understand what this means, so they don't understand what the bible is saying". He reminds me of a dry lumpy bowel movement.

[@harrypothead42024]

@@Bob-of-Zoid I do think Craig is more of an actor than a philosophizator

[@MegaCoKO]

Meet up with Richard carrier... That would be a discussion I'd pay for!

[@scottbignell]

Ha. Yes. Me too. But Carrier burned that bridge years ago. Ehrman wants nothing to do with him.

[@MegaCoKO]

@@scottbignell I was talking about carrier and Aron... But do you know why there's beef?

[@scottbignell]

@@MegaCoKO Ah. I misunderstood. Regarding the beef, basically Carrier trash-reviewed Ehrman's book "Did Jesus Exist?". Ehrman responded with a couple of blog posts, which Carrier also responded. It ended with Carrier accusing Ehrman of being a liar and Ehrman refusing to have anything to do with Carrier again.

[@MegaCoKO]

@@scottbignell do you know if that was retaliation against carriers book historicity of Jesus being slated? Lol I wicked curious, it's like an academic version of the real housewives, "the real PhDs" 😂

[@scottbignell]

@@MegaCoKO Not sure what you mean by "slated". This all happened before OHJ was released.

[@Griexxt]

Were the Three Little Pigs really three literal pigs, or were they one celestial pig who lived in three different earthly manifestations of houses?

[@anyajohnson7965]

You’re helping so many strangers NOT be insane. Thank you. I’m sharing everything of yours with every person who laughs at me when I tell them I don’t believe in god. Or that I’m a special creation .

[@juanriingen]

Bart D. Ehrman left Christianity "kicking and screaming." and became an agnostic. He is currently serving as New Testament professor at Chapel Hill, University of North Carolina. Posted Fri.,11/27/2021 10:51am , on our way to Quemado, to visit the mountain cottage of Elic and Tina Pangan, Fri., 11/27/10:50am

[@jtveg]

Outstanding interview Aron. So awesome to be able to get the great Dr Ehrman on your show and hear his valuable and learned insights into the trinity. I just wish he could've stayed on a bit longer.

[@jesuslord6822]

Responding To Bart On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWPRlmakmdOJh80

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST Your Life Is Precious To Jesus Brother

[@jtveg]

@@jesuslord6822 Lol. Do you actually believe Mike Winger can teach Bart Ehrman about the New Testament? You are a fool. Dr Ehrman studies original texts in their original languages. He has written many scholarly articles and books on the subject. He is a leading expert in the field. All Mike Winger does is parrot what other apologists have said and puts on his own spin on his favourite biblical translation.

[@jesuslord6822]

@@jtveg #JESUS FIRST Came Back Since I've Told You Jesus Did It And Not Anything Temporary In This Life Is Worth Giving Up Everlasting Life With Jesus The Creator

[@jesuslord6822]

@@jtveg The Original Verse In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. - John 1:1 The Altered Verse In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god.”-John 1:1, New World Translation

[@janjoska2549]

Why debate about properties and qualities of a non-existent being. That is like arguing whether you could lift Thor`s hammer.

[@shldnfr]

So that if you talking to a believer you can have an understanding of their viewpoint.

[@davidbarros9546]

of course you can't

[@onedaya_martian1238]

Money $$ is to be made. How much cash does telling the origin story of Peter Parker becoming Spider-Man bring in ?? Cadbury's best month in revenue is when people buy chocolate eggs that are supposed to be provided by rabbits, for kryst's sake (pun intended). When 42% of the population care nothing for logic, best one take their easily scammed money than someone else.

[@seasonedbeefs]

I reckon I could lift it

[@MartinJames389]

There have always been cults and movements in Judaism impatient for Mashiach and ready to declare that the Tzadik they follow must be him, only to be denounced by others who don't follow that Tzadik. There were such claimants 2,000 years ago, of course, but many more recent. Quite a crop from Poland, Ukraine, Hungary, etc. over the last 500 years. The most recent was Menachim Mendel Schneerson, of course, declared to be Mashiach by a big chunk of Chabad-Lubavitch in the 1980s and 1990s. The only one ever in the USA? (Not sure, but I think so.) That one was shut down within Chabad itself. I read one Lubavitcher describing it as "a psychosis", but it was a mass psychosis in their ranks for quite a few years. They had to put a lid on it, though, otherwise they'd have lost their influence (which far exceeds their numbers) in the wider Hasidic world. Seems to me Jesus was just one such. Indeed, there are religious Jews who recognise Yeshua as a great Tzadik, only with particularly crazy followers who made up a whole stream of nonsense after he died.

[@BileDuctBalderdash]

I have some oceanfront property in Arizona, from my front porch you can see the sea

[@goldenskeptic6309]

You Tube, where religion comes to die.

[@benjamindover5676]

It used to be that way,, now it's where YT doesn't want anybody's feelings to be hurt.

[@goldenskeptic6309]

@@benjamindover5676 So true. You cant say anything these days. 😔😔

[@rammsteinrulz16]

Where society comes to die*

[@rookmaster7502]

The entire concept of the Holy Trinity seems rather convoluted to me.

[@onedaya_martian1238]

Is using the word convoluted a polite way to say b@llsh@t ?

[@nitehawk86]

Dr Ehrman. The person theists manage to misquote more than Jesus.

[@thomasneal9291]

they lean on matchsticks. it doesn't really matter if they break a few. only that the house built on them doesn't burn.

[@jonadams8841]

@@thelord3561 you so funny.

[@HughJaxident67]

@@thelord3561 Repeating lies will never make them true pal

[@HughJaxident67]

@@thelord3561 *1 Jesus Died By Crucifixion* There is no historical evidence to confirm this *2 He Was Buried* Nothing unusual about a dead person being buried. *4 The tomb was later found empty (accepted by 75% of scholars)* Firstly, 75% of scholars? Where are you pulling this statistic from? Your ass? Secondly, the only source we have referencing any tomb is from the gospels which were written by anonymous, non-eyewitness scribes, so you're basing your assessment on hearsay many time removed - not good evidence by any measure. *5 The disciples had experiences which they believed were literal appearances of the risen Jesus* No, the anonymous authors of the gospels claimed that these disciples had experiences - that's a chasm of difference, doesn't mean there were any disciples or that they had any experiences, indeed Paul (who provides the earliest Christian writing) is not even aware any disciples existed. *6 The disciples were transformed from doubters to bold proclaimers* So the anonymous authors of the gospels claim... *7 The proclamation of the ressurection took place at the very beginning of the church* So what? Doesn't mean it ever happened in reality. *8 They preached the message of Jesus's ressurrection in Jerusalem, where Jesus had been crucified and buried* Not a single contemporary source to confirm this, not ONE. *9 The gospel message centered On the death and ressurection of Jesus* No reason to believe it's anything but an invented fiction *10 Orthodox Jews that believed in Christ had made Sunday their primary day of worship* So what? *11 James a family skeptic, was converted to the faith when he believed he saw the ressurected Jesus* You are aware people suffer from delusions and visions right? *12 Saul (Paul) was converted to the faith because he believed he saw the risen Jesus* And followers of other religions believe they have seen their deities too, so what? Doesn't mean they have. You see, we have countless examples of men lying throughout history and no examples of any gods - I know where the smart money is... *Gary Habermas, The Risen Jesus & Future Hope, 2003 pg 9-10* Ah yes, that clueless Christian apologist.

[@HughJaxident67]

@@thelord3561 So what? It doesn't mean that what these scribes wrote were based on anything true and we already know that many books in the bible have has later Christian interpolations.

[@c.a.t.732]

So if early Christians thought Jesus was the human son of a god (Yahweh) who only after death was made divine, that would be like Heracles and Orion, who were mortal sons of Zeus and Neptune respectively, and were only made divine themselves after death. That seems to have been a "thing" in the Mediterranean region.

[@c.a.t.732]

@@thelord3561 Here's the pin to pop all your tedious tripe-filled balloons: We now know, as our benighted ancestors did not, that human beings didn't originate when a dirt-man and a rib-woman magically popped up in the Middle East as the Bible claims. Adam and Eve are a myth, ergo so is "original sin" and "the Fall", ergo Jesus died for nothing.

[@c.a.t.732]

@@thelord3561 Three more long, tedious posts that are irrelevant... since Adam and Eve and the Fall are a fairy tale, there was no need for Jesus to pay for original sin by dying. Hence, his death on the cross was pointless. Oh, and that his tomb was later found empty being "accepted by 75% of scholars" is nonsense, since that story is pure hearsay.... none of the Gospels were written by eyewitnesses.

[@paulwilliamson6660]

Wow, my two favourites!

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST For By Jesus All Things Are Created I'm Here For The News Of The Kingdom Of God And While Religion Has You Doing Good Deeds To Earn Salvation The Biblical Jesus Died And Rose Again For The Forgiveness Of Sin And By Grace You Are Saved So You Walk In Him For He Loved Us So We Love The Lord

[@paulwilliamson6660]

@@jesuslord6822 yeah, but... No.

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST Responding To Bart On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWPRlmakmdOJh80

[@jesuslord6822]

@@paulwilliamson6660 #JESUS FIRST Your Life Is Precious To The Jesus Of The Bible And He Is Not Against Your Mistakes Except He Doesn't Call Us To Live In Sin Rather Give Our Lives To The Lord Jesus The Free Gift Of God And A Guy From Church Reported To Me I Have More For You To Do Then Came Back To Life

[@paulwilliamson6660]

@@jesuslord6822 I don't believe in sin. I try to live my life without harming other people and helping where I can. Don't believe in any deity, but if they exist, somehow, and that isn't good enough for them, then bollocks to them.

[@eddiej9733]

The great value of Bart to any believer is that he gets you to use your own apologetics on yourself. He gets you to delve deeper into your beliefs, by actually going to scripture constantly to refute (or to test)

[@hatuletoh]

The trinitarian explanation given to me as a kid--and I definitely pushed my teachers on the question because I was even more literal than most kids, and this concept did not work for me logically--was that in order to take on human form, jesus accepted the limitations inherent to a mortal existence. Or at least some of the limitations. In other words, despite being the same god as "god the father," being on earth as a human meant that jesus no longer had access to the omniscience and omnipotence he had and would have in the heavenly realm. He was able to perform miracles and know the future to some extent because he could call upon god the father more directly than any other human, but for him to descend to earth, suffer, and die, he had to accept mortal limitations on his divine nature. After all, how could the immortal god experience physical suffering, much less die? It sounds plenty ridiculous now as I recount it, but I'll give the catholics credit for one thing: they always liked to have an technical, apparently logical (from their perspective) understanding on these sorts of questions; "god's mysterious ways" was never sufficient for them, at least the priests and monks I knew, and they devoted a lot of thought to answering these questions. One other bit of credit I'll give those priests and monks: they were always willing to say to me, despite the fact that I was just a kid, "we don't know for sure, but one explanation is...," or even, "the official church doctrine is this, but another possible explanation is..." As long as one accepted certain fundamental concepts like the trinity, then the details about things like the exact nature of the trinitarian relationship could be freely debated. Kind of a waste of brain power, but at least I wasn't (usually) discouraged from critical thought.

[@dr.floridamanphd]

By any chance were you raised Jesuit?

[@onedaya_martian1238]

I love the cultural aspect of catholicism. The traditions form a bond between disparate people, and when it was in Latin, one could go anywhere in the world and feel a kindship with the folks (but f@ck the sick clergy). I always thought that one day, like when I was told I was right that Santa was just a nice story to enjoy christmas with, I would ultimately be told that religion was just a myth to connect us to various perspectives of the past. Alas, I learned it is all a power and money scam, enabled by indoctrinating children and the childish. Never-the-less, I still see how devotion can build beautiful things like cathedrals and make wonderful music; it is just sad that it exploits the easily duped.

[@SinHurr]

Totally unrelated but do you have any tips for long hair care? Mine's getting pretty shaggy and boy it's troublesome. It's hella curly.

[@jursamaj]

I'll save you the 10 or 15 dollars: We can't know anything about what Jesus thought. Even granting that the Jesus of the bible substantively represents 1 individual, as opposed to a composite of several preachers, or a legend, the stories are 3rd hand at best, and probably much worse than that. What the stories mostly tell us is what they story-tellers wanted to tell.

[@bleirdo_dude]

Even Mark clues you in that it's a parable.

[@zapkvr]

@@bleirdo_dude Mark?

[@bleirdo_dude]

@@zapkvr Yes Mark 4:10-12

[@steinjarl4915]

And just how is "In the beginning" different from "Once upon a time"?

[@maskim7132]

This video wasn't nearly long enough

[@moonboogien8908]

Aron hasn't aged a day in 10 years... While Bart..... Well, great to see ya.

[@katherineg9396]

I grew up atheist and I figured out a long time ago that the trinity was never going to make a bit of sense to me. But thanks to your talk with Bart Ehrman now I have some understanding of why it will never make sense to me.

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST For By Jesus All Things Are Created I'm Here For The News Of The Kingdom Of God And While Religion Has You Doing Good Deeds To Earn Salvation The Biblical Jesus Died And Rose Again For The Forgiveness Of Sin And By Grace You Are Saved So You Walk In Him For He Loved Us So We Love The Lord

[@jesuslord6822]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKbXhHeBaN-kj6M

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST Responding To Bart On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWPRlmakmdOJh80

[@_Omega_Weapon]

Proselytizing proves nothing. Think for yourself or be content being a mindless parrot.

[@justsomefighter466]

Oh good another new video to watch from aron

[@_Omega_Weapon]

There's no way to figure out what Jesus thought because it's impossible to prove he existed in the way the buybull describes.

[@mcarp555]

Isn't Ehrman's ceiling fan too close to the wall to spin?

[@kirkmarshall2853]

Amazing. I love how much Erhman’s work has shown we can’t trust any of the stories about Jesus and even after reading his work I am just as much as mythicist as ever.

[@onlimi616]

But you do know that Erhman is strictly anti-mythicist, right?

[@kirkmarshall2853]

@@onlimi616 yeah he’s wrong but that’s fine he has the the right to be wrong 😂

[@deathbytheblade6757]

It's not about myth. It's about mysticism, from which all religion comes.

[@onlimi616]

@@deathbytheblade6757 Well yeah, kinda sorta. But some people believe that a real Jesus person never existed. And that he was originally an angelic type of being who people later said, "well, he should've came to Earth by now, so let's make up a story that he did. Let's say, 30 years ago especially since everything was destroyed in the 76AD wars, and who's going to remember that far back to dispute us? " Those people believe Jesus is a myth, thus mythicists. It's a little bit different from mysticism IMO, which could have a living breathing Jesus existing. Look up Richard Carrier if interested in the subject.

[@deathbytheblade6757]

@@onlimi616 Thanks for that. Good to know. Should probably educate myself a little more, but I kind of have other priorities. More of a history buff these days: How many Roman legions did it take to crush the Jewish revolt and destroy Jerusalem? 'That's a valuable piece of information right there.'-.Ron White (and not for any particular reason) In their defense, it was surprising to know that the inhabitants of the city held two of the city's three walls against the siege for 7 months. I'm just some random sword geek who wonders how many gladii were in the vicinity at the time. Its a fascinating read on Wikipedia, start with 'Second Temple'. Just imagine coming across some random Christian who believed the Nation of Israel was still in possession of the Ark of the Covenant. Everybody knows the Templars had it last. Again, some random sword geek I am. I wrote what I wrote thinking mysticism was akin to the belief in the supernatural, summed up. I chose to use the wrong word. Superstition would have been more apt. Either way, they way you stated after 'IMO', it sounds like you believe it would create 'Jesus' existing as a reality. I don't think it works that way. One can't argue against religion being a creative force, given the number of churches in my town, but neither superstition nor mysticism ever created anything, other than delusion and disillusionment. I'd prefer to keep living my life in the second of those two states, thank you very much, as religion is not synonomous with freedom.

[@rafaelgomez5504]

That were something else... Good Aron , invite Him again ... And show a good topic.

[@darkshadow9291]

Faith is based upon that which cannot be proven without faith there is no manipulation without manipulation there is no fear and without fear there is no power and that is all religion is about gaining power over others

[@TheMusicalStylingsofBrentBunn]

Ah, it's a shame this was so brief. Bart Ehrman has been a big influence for me.

[@scapegoatiscariot2767]

This one is going in the "Christian fantasy camp" playlist.

[@scapegoatiscariot2767]

@@thealmightyjesus7018 None of that is coherent when you compare it to the reality that you can experience or learn about. Not any of it. You can actually take my word for it. I studied the New testament pretty thoroughly for 23 years and even if you are a scholar yourself, I disagree.

[@scapegoatiscariot2767]

@@thealmightyjesus7018 Jesus Spam. Tastes like Treat. I don't know why you people do this. You don't even ask what people may know, just spit out pamphlet size encyclopedia of Jesus mythology. I've studied the New testament for 23 years. Even if you're a scholar, I disagree with you.

[@scapegoatiscariot2767]

@@thealmightyjesus7018 Wow, you're really at work aren't you? I bet you'll never respond to a damn comment. Do you understand that what you're doing is psychological regurgitation?

[@scapegoatiscariot2767]

@@thealmightyjesus7018 Let's do this. I'll ask you a question and you ignore me. Do you think a person can choose to believe something that is utterly ridiculous? Or do you believe that belief is something that you are convinced of and not something you simply agree with because you fear torture? It is actually one question and it's quite simple. What is your definition of the word belief, give me examples of your usage of it. This will reveal all anyone needs to know. You either understand what the word means or you do not. I'll give you a hint, Jesus was wrong.

[@fepeerreview3150]

Aron Ra, thanks for inviting Dr. Ehrman onto your channel. It's always interesting to hear what he has to say. Personally, I am far from convinced by his arguments for the historicity of Jesus. I think the weight of the evidence is in the direction of mythicism. Nonetheless, he's a pleasure to listen to.

[@vegasflyboy67]

I know who I am! I'm a dude playing the dude, disguised as another dude!

[@ፕኗ-ቀ6ፐ]

Christians will praise someone like Bart ehrman when they believe he backing up something they believe but when he isn’t they’ll insult him and act like he not to be taken seriously.

[@aemiliadelroba4022]

Humans make anything believable for themselves when they really need it to comfort them . They make up stories . I’m not saying there is no truth but not the one we hear from these so called believers. The real thing is really fascinating.

[@sirjuliusnorris7513]

Love your content, Aron, and also really value Dr Ehrman's work! Would love to find a list of other New Testament (and Old Testament) scholars/historians who have come to similar conclusions as Dr Ehrman, if anyone knows. Also, I came out of SDA theology 20+ yrs ago, but although I know of many JW anti apologists channels, I can't find ANY anti SDA apologist channels. If anyone knows of any, PLEASE let me know. Thanks so much.

[@onedaya_martian1238]

Best way to detox from theology is to learn anything else but that cr@p. Just a loving suggestion. Moving from cigarettes to chewin' tobacco is still sucking on the jesus nicotine. The world is a buffet, religions make people believe their rice is the only thing to consume and that just a moderate sampling of anything else is evil. Life is too short to dine at a single table with the same people and hate everyone else at the cafeteria.

[@davidrandell2224]

Any of Kamal Salibi’s 4 bible study books is a treat. Or try his blog, just a few pages.

[@Bhoddisatva]

I suppose pop Christianity is in the process of simplifying their mythology and concept of god. Like when the original pantheon was reduced to just Yahweh.

[@jesuslord6822]

1 Corinthians Chapter 15 Is The Ressurrection Creed That Paul Had Received Only 3-5 Years After Jesus Crucifiction And Had It Written 20 Years Later In A.D 54-55 And Jesus Went On The Cross At A.D 30 Also The Tel Dan Inscription States The House Of David On It And The Moabite Stone Records Mesha Just Like The Bible Worshipping Yahweh The Pool Of Siloam When Jesus Heals The Guy Is Also A Real Place And The Book Of Acts Gets The Environment Of The First Century Correct Which Myths Do Not Do It States Drusilla And Felix Got Married While Josephus The Jewish Historian Records The Same Thing And Believing In The Jesus Of The Bible And Christianity We Are Saved By Grace Not Of Ourselves It Is The Free Gift Of God By Repenting And Putting On The Lord Jesus Christ While Jehovah Witness And Mormonism Do Not Think They Are Saved And Are Earning Salvation To Get It However The Biblical Jesus Is The Only Way And Its Not About Achieving It Rather It Is More Like Receiving Christ To Be Saved In Him And Your Works Are The Fruit Of Your Salvation Amen And 2 Timothy 4:11 States Bring The Cloak I Left At Carpus Indicating It Was Authentic And Jesus Is More Worth It For Everlasting Life And Gary Habermas Has The Greatest Case For The Ressurection And Dr. James Tour On KZbin Also Shows The Reasons It Wasnt An Accident God Bless Jesus Is Lord Five Scientific Reasons To Believe In God kzbin.info/www/bejne/iqW2iayoet-LqZY The Case For Design kzbin.info/www/bejne/rJ2bYWWifaaea7s Jesus And His Ressurection Video kzbin.info/www/bejne/d2HMdYGCrdKKjK8 Gary Habermas On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/l6rCdZVqh9yNla8 The Reliability Of The New Testamentt inspiringphilosophy.org/defending-christianity/

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST For By Jesus All Things Are Created I'm Here For The News Of The Kingdom Of God And While Religion Has You Doing Good Deeds To Earn Salvation The Biblical Jesus Died And Rose Again For The Forgiveness Of Sin And By Grace You Are Saved So You Walk In Him For He Loved Us So We Love The Lord

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST These Resources Are To Be Viewed Through A Gentle Context Amen Jesus Is Love And The Only Way To Be Saved Is Through The Jesus Of The Bible The Creator And Its The Free Gift Of God But May We Honor The Lord Jesus And No Longer Live For Ourselves But To The Lord

[@jesuslord6822]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKbXhHeBaN-kj6M

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST Responding To Bart On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/nWPRlmakmdOJh80

[@mongo1228]

It would be amazing if you and bart could collaborate with a title of something like What the bible really says/ means

[@Terrypics]

Any belief I had when younger is long gone but I have always been amused by this weird and confusing construct of the trinity. Something that just popped into my mind while watching this video, is it that God is just a schizophrenic.

[@onedaya_martian1238]

Not god, but the people who find messiahs in the real world and follow perfectly nutty or evil people, who affirm their perverse world view...from flying planes into buildings to storming the building that didn't get flown into.

[@Terrypics]

@@onedaya_martian1238 I agree with that narrative but I was mainly referring to the trinity.

[@stuartharris3364]

Aron , I hope you will consider using your admirable talent for being the hot knife thru butter and put a short lecture on Fox. I've heard of a thing called Go fund Me.

[@johnkerr1113]

Great to hear 2 learned men discussing the topic of jesus... could someone explain to me how anyone cound write about jesus being tempted by the devil when he was alone in the wilderness ?.. how would anyone know?... always baffled me how apologists explain that.. no angelic stenographers around at that time I am guessing

[@williammarkland8351]

I have to say that being a pay for event is problematic. Smacks of tele-religion even when opposed to the the standard evangelical corpus. Who needs the money? How is it being used? Charity rather than self monitization?

[@flowingafterglow629]

I know Bart's not going to be wasting time reading comments, but in terms of "did Jesus think he was God," I come back to an issue I wonder about - the concept of "god" at the time. What did think "god" actually meant? I mean, I would like to have hoped they moved on from the ancient Hebrew view that you could melt your gold, shape it into a golden calf and then call it a god, to the point you are worshipping it and even sacrificing animals to it, but how far had they moved? I've been so hung up on the Golden Calf story recently, and how mind-bogglingly bizarre it is when you think about that aspect. Seriously, they melted their jewelry, shaped it into a calf, and called it a god. If Jesus is working from that perspective, it's really hard to see any meaning at all any more even if he DID think he was God.

[@kevincrady2831]

It's not any sillier than putting some ink on some paper, binding the pages into a book, and then treating the resulting object as if it's a god ("It's perfect and infallible! We must do as it says!"). It's only our cultural presuppositions that make literature seem more plausible as a repository of the divine than sculpture. People who "worship idols" don't think the statue or image _is_ the god. Rather, they view it as a vessel of the deity's presence, something like the way an icon on a computer desktop allows one to access an otherwise invisible program by means of the proper ritual (move the cursor over the icon, and double-click on the mouse button...).

[@flowingafterglow629]

@@kevincrady2831 "they view it as a vessel of the deity's presence" They melted their jewelry and made a statue. That's the "vessel of the deity's presence"? You prove my point. And no, people don't think the bible is God or a god.

[@rahimerayane4298]

@@flowingafterglow629 With all due respect sir Jesus like many Prophets (peace be upon them all) they were follow the monotheistic principal of submission to God alone, Adam, Noah, Elijah, Elisha, Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, David, Solomon, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad and the others had one message to all mankind: unify the one true God Jesus said clearly and expressly looking to HEAVEN: "Now ETERNAL LIFE is that they KNOW YOU, THE ONLY TRUE GOD, and he whom you sent, Jesus Christ." ”((John 17: 3). All the prophets had this mission and were all the path that leads to the ONLY TRUE GOD who ONLY knows everything.All prophets including Jesus and all other humans will be subject to ONLY TRUE GOD on the Day of Judgments.

[@onedaya_martian1238]

@@mr.gaming6277 And after providing a command not to kill, an order is given for the same people receiving that command to slaughter 3000 men, women and children. The insanity of that book is over the top.

[@flowingafterglow629]

@@rahimerayane4298 Jesus thought people were possessed by demons. Obviously, there wasn't just "one true god", he believed the ten commandments that said "thou shalt not have other gods before me" ACCORDING TO THE BIBLE, Yahweh himself believes there are other gods. It's all moronic, sure, but that's what the bible said.

[@Questionablexfun]

2 of my all time fave peoples on 1 channel 💙 excellent !!!

[@derecksimpson6964]

The bible says what ever you want it to say.

[@Griexxt]

Yup, the Bible is a ventriloquist's dummy.

[@mitchellkent1815]

And so what good is it?

[@derecksimpson6964]

@@mitchellkent1815 makes a good justification for being a monster & controlling the sheep. :(

[@cygnustsp]

I quit the JWs when I was 25 and studied all kinds of christologies. I decided that the Sabellian one made the most sense, but by that time I quit Christianity altogether and now recognize that the Trinity takes all the inconsistent stuff said about Jesus and compiles it into an internal consistency. It's funny and also cool that people are still trying to figure it out. Ehrman is a smart dude. I also liked the work of James Dunn.

[@cygnustsp]

Btw for anyone who doesn't know, JWs believe Jesus was the Logos, Jehovah's first creation, thus not coeternal and not coequal but existed in heaven, and then was 100% human on earth. And the texts that Ehrman mention are the very ones JWs use. Oddly, pretty much only JWs have this understanding. It isn't quite Arianism either, JWs long ago denounced that. On the surface it makes sense. I take that back, none of it makes sense.

[@jesuslord6822]

1 Corinthians Chapter 15 Is The Ressurrection Creed That Paul Had Received Only 3-5 Years After Jesus Crucifiction And Had It Written 20 Years Later In A.D 54-55 And Jesus Went On The Cross At A.D 30 Also The Tel Dan Inscription States The House Of David On It And The Moabite Stone Records Mesha Just Like The Bible Worshipping Yahweh The Pool Of Siloam When Jesus Heals The Guy Is Also A Real Place And The Book Of Acts Gets The Environment Of The First Century Correct Which Myths Do Not Do It States Drusilla And Felix Got Married While Josephus The Jewish Historian Records The Same Thing And Believing In The Jesus Of The Bible And Christianity We Are Saved By Grace Not Of Ourselves It Is The Free Gift Of God By Repenting And Putting On The Lord Jesus Christ While Jehovah Witness And Mormonism Do Not Think They Are Saved And Are Earning Salvation To Get It However The Biblical Jesus Is The Only Way And Its Not About Achieving It Rather It Is More Like Receiving Christ To Be Saved In Him And Your Works Are The Fruit Of Your Salvation Amen And 2 Timothy 4:11 States Bring The Cloak I Left At Carpus Indicating It Was Authentic And Jesus Is More Worth It For Everlasting Life And Gary Habermas Has The Greatest Case For The Ressurection And Dr. James Tour On KZbin Also Shows The Reasons It Wasnt An Accident God Bless Jesus Is Lord Five Scientific Reasons To Believe In God kzbin.info/www/bejne/iqW2iayoet-LqZY The Case For Design kzbin.info/www/bejne/rJ2bYWWifaaea7s Jesus And His Ressurection Video kzbin.info/www/bejne/d2HMdYGCrdKKjK8 Gary Habermas On Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/l6rCdZVqh9yNla8 The Reliability Of The New Testamentt inspiringphilosophy.org/defending-christianity/

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST For By Jesus All Things Are Created I'm Here For The News Of The Kingdom Of God And While Religion Has You Doing Good Deeds To Earn Salvation The Biblical Jesus Died And Rose Again For The Forgiveness Of Sin And By Grace You Are Saved So You Walk In Him For He Loved Us So We Love The Lord

[@jesuslord6822]

#JESUS FIRST These Resources Are To Be Viewed Through A Gentle Context Amen Jesus Is Love And The Only Way To Be Saved Is Through The Jesus Of The Bible The Creator And Its The Free Gift Of God But May We Honor The Lord Jesus And No Longer Live For Ourselves But To The Lord

[@jesuslord6822]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/aKbXhHeBaN-kj6M

[@Bob-of-Zoid]

The description of the trinity sounds like the description of Jim Bob from a trailer park somewhere off the beaten path in Texas!!

[@tedgrant2]

"Why callest thou me good ? There is none good but one, that is, God" said Jesus. (Matthew 19:17)

[@exiled_londoner]

Prof Ehrman is certainly impressive in his analysis and understanding of the texts he studies, but I still don't understand why he is so convinced of the historicity of Yeshua ben Ioseph. I can accept that there is some evidence for the existence of this character, but it's not that strong, not contemporary, and leaves the issue very debateable and open to argument, especially in the light of how we can see evidence of changing and developing narratives in the concerted campaign to manufacture a cult around the Jesus figure in the later first century. I don't accuse anyone who finds this weak evidence sufficiently convincing of bad faith but I do criticise those who refuse to accept that the matter is still very much up for debate. I am not a specialist in this field but I have a good understanding of the Historical Method and I cannot see how any historian can reasonably say that the matter of historicity is settled with any certainty. Personally I tend towards Dr Richard Carrier's position (a reasonable chance of historicity but on balance less than likely) and even if you think the balance tips in the opposite direction I see no justification for assigning any certainty in either direction.

[@Starhawke_Gaming]

But but but... Without "Oily Josh" , then all of Christianity falls apart. 😂

[@exiled_londoner]

@@Starhawke_Gaming Yes... of course it does. But Prof Ehrman isn't trying to prop up Christianity as far as I know.

[@rahimerayane4298]

Jesus like many Prophets (peace be upon them all) they were follow the monotheistic principal of submission to God alone,Adam, Noah, Elijah, Elisha, Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, David, Solomon, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad and the others had one message to all mankind: unify the one true God Jesus said clearly and expressly looking to HEAVEN: "Now ETERNAL LIFE is that they KNOW YOU, THE ONLY TRUE GOD, and he whom you sent, Jesus Christ." ”((John 17: 3). All the prophets had this mission and were all the path that leads to the ONLY TRUE GOD who ONLY knows everything.All prophets including Jesus and all other humans will be subject to ONLY TRUE GOD on the Day of Judgments.

[@exiled_londoner]

@@rahimerayane4298 - This incoherent rambling has no relevance whatsoever to the comment I posted.

[@exiled_londoner]

@@thealmightyjesus7018 - And Mr TAJ Must Be 100% Correct In Every Detail Because Every Single Word Is Capitalised... Hallelujah!

[@amellirizarry9503]

When people explained the doctrine of the trinity to me, I used to think of the end of Fight Club, that’s the analogy i like to use now