Article 50 two years on: Article 50 negotiations - a retrospective

[@hurri7720]

The ball and the stupidity lies firmly in the UK, It's was rather entertaining for a while but one gets more and more fed up with people who cannot grasp that one cannot have once cake and still eat it.

[@TorianTammas]

Hurri - It is amazing the people a 2 trillion economy could strong arm a 16 trillion economy in a withdrawal agreement from leaving the EU. I am not sure if they are ignorant, dreamers or just totally incompetent and unfit for their job.

[@hurri7720]

@@TorianTammas , rather poor education, and the result of what I would call a result of post empire trauma. Not all Brits are affected. I think Fintan O'Toole can explain it a lot better than I can. kzbin.info/www/bejne/gKencopriM-Xl6c Fintan O'Toole: Brexit: Ireland and the English Question

[@pigofapilot1]

The WTO has a far bigger cake than the EU. WTO=164 member-states; EU= 27 member=states. In addition, you are politically and economically bound to EU policy for which you are required to sacrifice sovereignty. The EU 'cake' has been 10 years of EU austerity for the middle/lower classes whilst they watch the EU financial/corporate sectors become fabulously wealthy. Ask Greece, Italy, Portugal and Spain amongst others about the EU 'cake'. We are a net contributor to the EU and not a beneficiary. That money originates directly from the UK taxpayer but is re-distributed upwards to the private sector by the EU. No government has its own money and that includes the EU.

[@TorianTammas]

@@pigofapilot1 What exactly do you mean? Did anyone tell you that the 28 EU countries are part of the WTO and that the 27 (excluding UK) countries of the EU are a 16 trillion economy. The UK is a 2 trillion economy. WTO is worst and lowest trading conditions one can get and is only used when you have no trade arrangement or treaty as they are much better. The EU has more then 50 trade treaties with Japan, South Korea, Canada and a lot of other important countries. So we speak about at least 80 countries that are closely connected and either part of the EU or have a trade treaty with the EU. When you take the EU, China and the US then you have more then 50% of world GDP.

[@nikoladd]

So they are saying EU shouldn't accept that the UK is mature enough to make up it's mind? That might be true, but the EU, i.e. it's structures, have no babysitting functions. From EU's perspective it is strictly a matter of UK's internal affairs to make it's mind and think of the consequences. It did not interfere in any previous failures of democracy(or any democratic exercises) in any member state. There are plenty of examples. Fore example EU did not take any position on the Scottish referendum. Neither did take any position on Catalonia. It's the same thing.

[@HS-fm9kv]

No but they are taking a position on the breakdown of the separation of powers/ curves on check and balances in Hungary and Poland.

[@nikoladd]

@@HS-fm9kv separation of powers is a requirement in the treaty those countries signed to, which for example is one of the reasons Turkey will not be allowed in. Formally Poland and Hungary are in breach of contract. EU has mandate from the other members to maintain those treaties. Same as with Austria, Netherlands, Italy and so on. You could make a case that UK has no functional democratic institutions, as the panel commented, but that's UK's business again. In principle the UK is democratic and that about satisfied the other signees of the EU treaties so far.

[@HS-fm9kv]

nikoladd hence why the EU is stepping in... Which does make me chuckle slightly when Brexiters accuse the EU of being un democratic by ‘interfering’ in member states’ affairs. One can see similar with the EU helping the UK keep a semi functional government through the withdrawal process...

[@lawrencebrown3677]

He refers to uncertainty;there was no uncertainty on the part of those who voted to leave the EU. The talk about 2"deal " was invented by the remain side to prolong membership.WTO Rules are the default position and this is what should be the basis of anything that needs to be be negotiated.

[@redpeony]

The same sun that sets on the Brexit mirage will rise on Winston Churchill’s dream of a United States of Europe.

[@baffbaff4085]

Faisal is perfect for the BBC. ROFL. Where was he before Channel 4 or The Guardian?

[@joserojas6682]

Simple boilerplate arguments. If only political economy was as simple as this. Wishful thinking!

[@TorianTammas]

Why is the UK unable to keep its words and unable to deliver at agreed times? I think we have to face that the UK in ungoverned. A failed government that is a divided minority that behaves like entitled rich kinds in a school play. Everyone wants to have the leading role not caring about anything but himself.