Auro-3D Speaker Layout Support AV Processor Receivers Compared - 9.1, 10.1, 11.1, 11.1 7+4H, 13.1

[@jb.2986]

Best vid to date Jon. So much great information! And Yes, the Auro 3D upgrade is worth it. As you know we are running the McIntosh MX123 using the Auromatic up mixer for multi channel hi resolution sources. 7.2.6 is just so good with that algorithm. That’s the sweet spot for our fam. 7.2.4 would be my minimum threshold. Keep up the great work my friend!

[@ripewave]

Glad this video was on track. Any feelings on whether or not a Top Center or Height Center Auro-3D channels make a big difference? Does not sound like you are doing that yet - but could it help or is your 7.2.6 configuration good enough? -Jon

[@jb.2986]

@@ripewave No need for top center IMHO. There are times where Dolby Atmos wins out with music upmixing (for instance Natalie Merchant Tiger Lilly DVD Audio) and it's nice to have that configuration with just the press of a button on the remote.

[@ripewave]

Thanks for that feedback. Your feeling that those center channels don’t add much align with my assumption. However, I may have to create a setup with those center speakers to be able to provide a firsthand comparison back to this audience. Before I do, I am preparing for front wides. I am pre-wired and now need two channels of amplification and speakers. -Jon

[@jb.2986]

@@ripewave Roger that buddy. VOG may be more relevant with movie watching but we rarely use our system for that. Plus there’s not much native Auro 3D movie encoding of which you are well aware I’m sure. To me Auro 3D shines with its up mixer algorithm of multichannel music and even two channel. VOG may actually be a distraction in that case. I’ll be interested to hear your thoughts Jon. Keep up the great work.

[@ripewave]

It should be possible to upmix to any defined speaker layout without being a distraction. However, that is not to say the algorithm has been correctly optimized to deliver. So you may be right that the actual result is distracting with a top or height center channel. Jon

[@ap6553]

Thanks for the deep dive on Auro 3D support, it certainly doesn't get enough coverage.

[@ripewave]

I am glad the Auro-3D content has helped to fill this gap. While this video hasn't got the same levels of views are others, I am still glad that I produced it and will continue to develop content even if it's has a more niche audience. -Jon

[@mauriciob8260]

Update : I just bought the Denon X3800H and with the latest firmware update now it possible to do Auro 3D using the same configuration of Dolby Atmos . I have 11.2 / 7.4.4 set up with top front -top middle-rear surround-back surround and all speaker are active when using Auro 3D option in the surround decoder , really sound really good so good that now I prefer this option instead of Dolby Surround/Atmos 😁👌

[@ripewave]

Yes - the March 2023 update made a big difference. Glad you had success with it. -Jon

[@FURognar]

I would like to see more people talking about Auro3D. Need to get the word out there about how beneficial it is for upmixing your legacy DVD and Blu Ray collections to these bigger channel count theaters. The experience is amazing.

[@ripewave]

Do you feel that the Auro3D experience is still impressive with a traditional Dolby 7.x.4 layout or are the Top Center and Height Center channels needed to make it worthwhile? I have been using Auro-3D with my 7.2.4 layout and find it to be noticeably different and often better then using the Dolby decoder - Jon

[@FURognar]

@@ripewave depends on where the Top channels are mounted. If they are around the 45° angle of elevation, it still sounds good for Auro, though closer to 30° is better. A lot of people put their Top channels between 50° and 60° of elevation to gain better phantom imaging directly above that. At that more extreme angle, Auro doesnt sound as good as the speakers no longer work with their corresponding ear level speakers.

[@ripewave]

Good advice

[@stackoverflow8260]

Jon, It wil be great if you can do a demo of your Auro 3D and Atmos speaker layout. I want to get best of the both with my drx 8.4. Also, I'm clear about the front heights and angles but i dont have a clear understanding of rear heights and their angles.. and rear surrounds and their distances from main viewing area.

[@sjsphotog]

I have a Denon 4700h using it in a 7.2.4 configuration with the Auro3D 7 1 + 4 Hagrid. Great stuff. Loving it. ❤😊

[@ripewave]

I feel that you layout is the sweat spot today. -Jon

[@mauriciob8260]

they need to include Auro 3D in the upper middle flagship receiver also ( example Pioneer 505/Onkyo RZ50) if they want people to start interest in this format

[@ripewave]

I think that would help. Those models support the same number of channels and speaker layouts as their flagship models. Therefore, it is technically possible to add in the same way. With the flagships around 2x the cost, this may be part of their positioning, but it doesn't help the consumer and holds Auro-3D as a niche format. I wish I know what Auro charges Onkyo/Pioneer per unit for the license fee. That would give us a better understanding of whether it is possible to offer Auro-3D at lower price points without losing too much margin. They could always make it a paid option if that was an issue. -Jon

[@mauriciob8260]

If Pioneer and Onkyo manage to include Dirac Live in the LX 505-305/OnkyoRZ50 why they cant include Auro 3D ,same as Auro 3D you want more people to embrace your format then lower your license fee 😁@@ripewave

[@ripewave]

Auro Technologies needs to navigate the next year very carefully. They can’t just ride on their tech but they also need to be competitive and find a way to drive native content - especially with streaming services. It is an uphill battle as Dolby dominates content for both physical and streaming media. -Jon

[@MyFatherLoves]

Monoprice has in their HTP-1 manual that in their system, they've programmed the middle height speakers to reproduce a VOG channel by mapping a phantom center between those channels and the same with the front heights. They are also programmed to map a phantom center height. So, even though the discrete speakers aren't there, they do have the HTP-1 programmed to give you a 10.1, 11.1, and 13.1 experience depending on the number of speakers in your system of course.

[@ripewave]

Thanks for the details on the top middle creating a virtual center. I referred to your knowledge in my latest video posting tomorrow. While I would prefer an option for a discrete top center, this is the next best approach. Wish Monoprice would explain what you posted in their documentation. I do list that the webUI has web help build in. I still wish for printed manuals for this type of solution -Jon

[@MyFatherLoves]

@@ripewave yeah, I wish it was better explained as well. It’s just a tiny mention of it and then they move on.

[@ripewave]

I appreciate you weighing in

[@CancelIFR]

Nice video. I am using the Denon x3800H and this confirmed that I can do the 7+4H. Thanks!

[@ripewave]

Thank for confirming that the Denon x3800H supports Auro with 7+4H -Jon

[@mariusm5187]

Been using Auro3D for years and I would never go back!

[@ripewave]

You are one of many who feel that way. Let's hope the technology lives on. -Jon

[@cdavidhord]

Later today I'm going to experiment with upmixing to the Auro 11.1 variation. I have a Denon 8500HA set up for 7.2.4. I wish I had this information when I ran all the speaker wires as there was much dry wall and paint repair. Placing unused wiring would have been smart if I had this knowledge at the time.

[@ripewave]

I am a big supporter of planning for future expansion and running extra wires just in case. Glad the content is helpful. -Jon

[@trauma50disaster1]

when I went through the process of checking all of these setups out I had speaker wire and ladders temporarily placing speakers, what a mess.

[@aptwolf]

The HDMI issue not sorted out on the Denon 6700 mentioned at 18:17, please can you provide more details on the HDMI issue on the Denon 6700

[@ripewave]

If you have a Denon AVR-X6700H made after May 2021, the bugs are resolved. However, while the units with the newer HDMI boards functions without an issue with HDMI 2.1 sources, you are still limited to a single HDMI 2.1 port. The newer models support HDMI 2.1 on all inputs. That is what I was referring to. The new models are a full HDMI 2.1 solution per today's state of the market. -Jon

[@aptwolf]

Thank You Jon@@ripewave

[@vjay4297]

10:00 what's with the black and blue colour for the dots?? can you help me. also, can you please have a legend on the display next time you do something like this .. cheers.

[@ripewave]

I had to go back and review the video to observe. I think that was just a consistency error. They should have been all blue or all black as the selection only needed to represent support. Certainly, your suggestion of adding a legend for icons and color codes would be great when there is a convention. -Jon

[@TubedTalk]

I like how detailed your comparisons are and I think you put great overview of market. One little detail though, there is no Dolby 7.2.4 or 7.x.4. .1 marks LFE channel, not number of subwoofers. So to give example: - wrong: 7.4.4 - true: 7.1.4 with 4 subwoofers Dolby never had number of speakers, but number of channels. You can have 2 or 4 subwoofers but still there is only 1 LFE channel and all those subwoofers play same LFE channel. There is never more then 1 LFE channel. But this is me just beeing picky on small details. Other then this, really great video.

[@ripewave]

I believe both perspectives are correct. Your point is correct regarding Dolby encoding. I am reporting how the processor handles the .1 LFE channel. My goal is to show how each model is able to treat that channel. Yes, it is the same source information but some equipment provides the ability to set different levels, delays and phase outs. This is what I am reporting. -Jon

[@trauma50disaster1]

I think since denon now has 4 discrete subwoofer channels that is where the 7.4.6 comes from, prob years ago there were not discrete and people had to do extra hobby work to get 4 to play, I think.

[@THEBADGUY56]

Hello, I watched your video and I have the denon 4700h, and It can process 7 bed layer and 4 height speakers. the surround back option is available. external amp required. for auro-3d 7.1 + 4h

[@ripewave]

Nice to have your confirmation on the speaker layout support. Helpful. -Jon

[@peterwilliamson2965]

I'm debating between the Denon X4800H with Dirac, and the Denon X6700H with Front Wides. Neither have both, and I don't want to spend a lot more to get both. Is Dirac far superior, and are Front Wides really noticeable? Thanks!

[@ekjellgren]

Sitting against back wall, will I benefit from back height speakers at all?

[@1Aquadon]

Thanks John!!

[@ripewave]

Glad the video content was helpful.-Jon

[@TheBaldBeaner]

Arcam avr20-30 have 16 channels, they have a document Harmon sent me explaining how to setup all the types including the vog and center height using channel 15 and 16 added back in 2020 to be for 13.1 aero

[@TheBaldBeaner]

Forgot to mention, in the document from Harmon says that they don’t specifically call the vog.. vog but they call it top, the other channel you select ch for center height.

[@Yorkscarnivore]

Best auromatic settings for 11.1?

[@ripewave]

I am assuming you mean the Auro-Matic upmixer “strength” setting. I don’t have any suggestions for you other than playing with value until you feel it is best. Some people prefer a more pronounced surround effort that sounds more spacious. Others don’t. -Jon

[@gowthamk5392]

Can onkyo RZ 50 with extnl amp can we put this auro 3D setup!?

[@ripewave]

No - Onkyo is only planning support for Auro-3D with their flagship model, the TX-RZ70. -Jon

[@trauma50disaster1]

two denon 3800's at $1700 each or $3500 will give you 7.8.8 so 15 channels for half the price for the flagship that gives only 13 channels. I connected two together and it picks up the audio correctly through hdmi out and then select the speaker placement to cover all locations.

[@ripewave]

How do you have the 8 height channels laid out? 4 wall mounted, 4 ceiling mounted? How are they split between units? -Jon

[@trauma50disaster1]

@@ripewave 2 front height, 1 front center, 1 vog, 2 middle height, 2 rear height. They are split according to what is allowed, so avr 1 won't allow all height, so you just select the coresponding. btw I also did it with the sony 7000 and had dolby and auro going.

[@ripewave]

Thanks for sharing. I have multiple units in my house, so I may experiment. -Jon

[@stackoverflow8260]

Does any Sony support Auro 3D?

[@ripewave]

No - they don't seem to be interested. The product manager said it is not currently in their roadmap. I believe they are focused on their own 360 Reality Audio format as the alternate to Dolby Atmos. -Jon

[@stackoverflow8260]

@@ripewave thanks Jon!

[@stackoverflow8260]

Jon, where can we buy demo discs for Auro?

[@ripewave]

Good question. Auro sent me one as someone who has been posting videos on their technology and I will be using it for the first time next week. I can ask them how you can acquire. -Jon

[@stackoverflow8260]

@ripewave thanks Jon! From what I know, they have two. I also ordered drx 8.4 today.

[@philippebeauplan9431]

So far no movies out there supporting it, to me it doesn't matter which way to setup your speakers

[@ripewave]

It seems that the popularity of Auro-3D is its up-mixer and not the native source content which you correctly identified as non-present. -Jon

[@trauma50disaster1]

it kind of matters to the few who choose setup of speakers as a fun hobby...