Falcon Mustang Spindles vs Granada Spindles knuckles

[@2nd66tube2]

I'm autoxing a 66 Mustang with Granada spindles . I however have a 1" UCA drop, and homemade adjustable strut rods. I used 75 Granada outer tie rods and adjusting sleeves . I have manual steering adding as much caster as possible helps a lot. I'm not using a bumpsteer kit

[@AutoRestoMod]

That would do it.

[@ronlees]

I swapped Granada spindles on my 1964 Mercury Comet Cyclone. Almost thirty years later no problems. Handles great with flaming river steering gear and shelby pitman and idler arm.

[@AutoRestoMod]

Yup, you eliminated the issues that cause the problems: the drag link parts. The rack changes the position of the tie rods.

[@mekial2222]

I've been running granada spindles and brakes on my '74 maverick for years. my only complaint is the difficulty in finding other caliper options to move away from the 'friction slide' style caliper to a floating caliper... For as popular as the conversion is, I'd expect that someone would have a write up or bracket made to put a newer style caliper on a granada spindle without breaking the bank with those ridiculous brake kits I find instead...

[@amx19733]

Awesome!!

[@6ford9]

I bet nobody realizes is that your passing on a lot of info that is hard for a younger generation to find and would disappear like all good things. I learned a ton. I have Granada spindles on my. 64 fairlane now I know why she drives a lil funny.

[@AutoRestoMod]

Thanks. We are a dying breed. My wife will sit slack jawed sometimes when I talk to her customers (she sells RRS suspensions RRS-USA.com

[@brandonminich6042]

I swapped in a set on my 72 Mustang coupe. They work great. Cool to hear the science behind what works and what doesn't. 👍👍

[@AutoRestoMod]

The Granadas will do fine on the larger cars. Even '67 and '68 Mustang

[@sonnym9954]

Five years ago, I purchased a brake conversion kit from Mac’s auto that sat in a box until this week. It stated fitment for a 1964 Ranchero. Its description was: 41-83979-1 Front Disc Brake Conversion Kit, 5 Lug, Falcon, Ranchero, 1960-1965. So I assumed it was a perfect fit. Little that I know is this was to convert from a 4 lug on a V6 to a 5 lug as in a V8. The rotor bearings ID was way too narrow for the spindle. I contacted Mac’s technician and he suggested I get a bearing that would fit both parts. Problem is that the ID needed for the original spindle is too large and the OD for the rotor is too small. I thought about trying to just get a disc and place over the original hub, so I am in the process of hunting such a thing. Anyone else had such a problem? Suggestions?

[@daniellaw2528]

A spindle has a shaft. A knuckle has a bolt in or pressed in hub assembly.

[@AutoRestoMod]

I am pretty sure that the Falcon, Fairlane, and 64 1/2 to 73 Mustang used a spindle.

[@ianbray3580]

Great info thanks my 67gt fastback has been fitted with Granada spindles and single piston calipers. Now I'm going back to drum brake spindles and four piston calipers as the brakes and steering are terrible.

[@hotrodray6802]

Easily correctable if you find someone who understands front ends. Ive done several.

[@pwrbyford68]

Good info. I have a set of Granada spindles/disks on my ‘68 Mustang. No complaints here, especially since I got them free :)

[@AutoRestoMod]

The Granadas will do fine on a '67 on up Mustang.

[@daviddaniels6473]

I did this swap on a 66 Mustang years ago. I used the Granada outer tie rod ends and had no problems with alignment at all.

[@AutoRestoMod]

Do you and Joey Tracy sit next to each other? 😄 OK, super glad for you! It's like I tell folks: there are no never and always in this hobby/industry. It could be that you have a set of 1968-70 Mustang spindles.

[@daviddaniels6473]

@@AutoRestoMod I WISH!!! No, it was a 76 Granada that had been badly crashed. I grabbed the entire Front suspension off it for my Mustang. I had done the lower and move to the rear upper control arms, Ala Shelby, but my car didn't stop so good. AND I was running a "street boss". I almost ran over my buddy John once. Obviously better stoppers were needed. I went the Granada route because it was about the only game in town.

[@stever.7008]

CSRP also has kits based on original kelsey hayes and SN95 Mustang disk brakes besides the Granada set up.

[@j.anthony3571]

Thank you!!!

[@bentnickel7487]

Thank you. I learned something new today.

[@6ford9]

Would a ball joint delete kit to heim joints help with the adjustment issue for under 65 cars.

[@AutoRestoMod]

It is really more about the tie rod position.

[@9thgatedim273]

Can I use these for my 56 fairlane

[@AutoRestoMod]

I don't thinks so.

[@jamesford2942]

Ford standardized their bearings so that the Pinto, Granada, and F series trucks all used the same bearings. The difference was that the trucks had a longer spindle and different bearing spacing. The main problem with handling is that the Granada is designed for more caster which is having the upper control arm moved back. When installed on the Mustang it actually kicks the spindle into a zero to negative caster situation along with tilting the tie rod out of alignment with the control arm causing bump steer. The length of the tie rod mount to the lower ball joint is shorter which speeds up the steering ratio accentuating the bump steer problem. The tie rod mount should be in line with the center of the lower ball joint to the center of the rear end to get proper ackerman angle so that your tires track properly in relationship to each other and the wheelbase of the car. Granada wheelbase is different than Mustang. A properly designed spindle would work much better than the Granada spindle. An other issue is that it is hard to make Mustangs handle because they weren't designed with enough caster to begin with as they were based on the Falcon that was an economy car not designed for the race track but for basic easy to drive grocery getter. To really make a Mustang handle well requires a redesign of the front suspension.

[@AutoRestoMod]

Great info cuz!

[@NameWithheld999]

Granada spindles were terrible on my 62 Falcon. The ride was so bad if I ran over a penny I could tell you if it was on heads or tails. I got the CSRP spindles that use the Granada brakes but have the correct tie rod geometry and it's so much better.

[@johnharper5125]

I have a 1970 mustang fastback with Granada spindles and disc brakes and the geometrics are way out and the towing changes under weight who would make a spindle I could put on it do you have anything to tell me

[@AutoRestoMod]

You can get a replacement spindle now that the brakes will bolt right up to. RRS (www.rrs-usa.com) makes a complete bolt in McPherson strut system that will dramatically change the handling for the better.

[@Mike_Neukam]

Reproduction falcon/mustang v8 spindles are available now as well.

[@meanbird4979]

I’m new to this and I am restoring a 1965 Ford ranchero. I have a set of Granada spindles. So they will not work on the ranchero? Is there a way to get them to work fine? What do I need? Maybe I will buy aftermarket spindles later when I have the money.

[@AutoRestoMod]

They just induce more bumpsteer. Some folks can't feel a difference. I prefer to have parts intended for a chassis. The Granadas were intended for cars the size of a 1966 Fairlane.

[@REDEYESHADOW1]

@@AutoRestoMod I have a 65 Ranchero with 68 Montego front disc brakes. Horrible bump steer problem too! Do you think I can assume the spindles are the culprit? Currently looking at the road and tract bilstein shock coil over system as it seems to take up the small bumps too! What do you think?

[@classicstangbrn8964]

Great video Jeff didn't learn anything new this time, but running 67-73 spindles on 65-66 Mustangs do the same as Granada spindles, that being said I have 69 Cougar disc brakes on my 65 fb for over 25 years on wouldn't know bump steer if you smacked me in face with it. That's going away and it's getting steering corrected 70 drum brake spindles and 94-04, 13 in corba brakes we will see.

[@jrealist1]

Will that disc spindle your showing be good for a 63 mercury monterey?

[@AutoRestoMod]

I don't think so.

[@joet.4756]

Great info Jeff!

[@scottdore132]

thanks for the video that answered my questions..... next we need early foxbody vs late foxbody vs sm95 spindles ;)

[@AutoRestoMod]

OK that would require some digging on my part. Not a specialty...😀

[@scottdore132]

I have 2 early sets, 1 late set (I think) and I haven't bothered with sm95 spindles it's like granada spindles... to many compromises

[@caivnj]

I just got finished doing this swap on my 67 mustang coupe

[@olmoe1167]

Nice episode, Jeff... Even I learned a few new things... Never heard anyone refer to them as Knuckles, though....lol Oh, how I remember driving all over, from junkyard to junkyard, looking for cars that hadn't had the front suspension stripped... Usually it was a Wasted Day and a lot of Gas burnt.... Ah, the love of the Hobby...

[@joeytacey743]

Dear autocrafters, this video has me confused because I put the Granada disc brakes on the front of my 65 Mustang in 1997 and it is 2019 now and I have never had any problems with handling, steering, or high speed problems

[@AutoRestoMod]

Firstus: Auto Krafters is our sponsor, not the creator. Secondus: Maybe in all of those 22 years you didn't notice that the front end would kinda take off if you hit a bump, that is, bump-steer. That is OK. Some folks are steering deaf like some folks are tone deaf--not a negative, just how it is. If you have not "noticed" the problem, that doesn't mean it isn't there. 🙂🙂🙂

[@edr5038]

Will a 70 mustang disk brake spindle fit a 63 falcon without the grenada problems?

[@AutoRestoMod]

Nope. It has the same tie-rod position issue.

[@edr5038]

@@AutoRestoMod what can I put on the 63 falcon that has the bigger wheel bearing and not terrible bump steer ? Am I going to have to go aftermarket? I was looking for a relatively inexpensive ford made option. Thanks. I tried the forums but everyone is using all types so I can't get a straight definitive answer

[@jwelchon2416]

Granada's filled up salvage yards pretty quick.

[@raygordon3728]

So did pintos and Mustang 2s but people still keep using their front ends and pinto wagons for V8 conversions. The only thing Granadas had that were ever worth anything were disc brakes, 8 inch third members and sometimes a 9" disc brake rearend.

[@realmaindrianpace]

Now this is a big, wordy subject that has caused arguments for decades. I have been doing Granada spindle swaps on earlier unibody Fords for close to 30 years now, but haven't done one for a while because you can't find them easily any more. On the Falcons and Comets, there is no one spindle that works on both the '63-'64 V8 steering and the '65 V8 steering, two different setups with different geometry, and using any '65-up spindle on '63-'64 steering - or on six cyl steering - will result in a dangerous, darty, unpredictable bump steering handful at anything over about 30 mph. But later spindles, including Granada, work sufficiently on the '65 V8 steering setup with it's longer inner/outer tie rod assemblies which operates in a more gradual arc of motion, reducing or eliminating bump steer. I've done around 20 Granada swaps over the years, with no complaints about dodgy handling to date, and I have two cars with them in my fleet; a '65 Ranchero with '65 V8 power steering, and a '60 Comet with '65 V8 manual steering. On the Comet, I used Granada outer tie rod ends and had no trouble aligning it to factory specs. On the Ranchero, I used a Granada outer tie rod end on the right side, but I had to use a custom hybrid tie rod end from Rare Parts on the driver side because of the '65-only larger tie rod and adjuster sleeve threads on the power steering valve side. Ford only used these huge threads on the '65 Falcon/Comet and '65-'66 Mustang, and the Rare Parts tie rod is made for a Granada conversion on these cars. No problem aligning the Ranchero either. Do I think that the Granada geometry on older cars is perfect? No, but it's workable if the right steering is used. It's always best to use the factory matched spindles on a given car with an aftermarket bolt-on disc brake kit for best geometry. I have not used the aftermarket Granada spindles yet, so I don't know which Falcon steering setup they are optimized for, but they cannot work on both the '63-'64 and the '65. I imagine they are for the '65 falcon, '65-'66 Mustang steering as there would be a much bigger market for that application.

[@AutoRestoMod]

Well, I'm glad that you have had good experiences with them! The geometry changes that I see with the Granada are enough to give me pause, but hey, it seems to work for you!

[@williamcharles9480]

Good info, Jeff. I found that the Granada spindles worked exceptionally well with my 67 Mustang. I found that the track width increased 5/8 inch per side over the stock width for the 67 Mustang for obviously a total of 1 1/4 inches total track width. This may be an issue for some according to wheel fitment, but my 15 inch by 8 inch wide wheels with a 4 1/2 inch back space work just fine when they're mounted with 225/50-15 tires and a 1 1/2 inch upper control arm drop with a negative wedge kit installed on the upper ball joint. The tires still remain within the fenders without any rub. The only reason that I went to a 1 1/2 inch upper control arm drop is because of the relocation of the upper ball joints that allowed for this, otherwise no more than a 1 inch drop would be recommended. Jeff, you probably already know most of this stuff, but I figured that I'd chime in with my experience. I used Granada manual steering outer tie rod ends to fit the spindles that will fit the O.E. Mustang adjustment sleeves, also.

[@AutoRestoMod]

We like it when others chime in with good, constructive info!

[@devinb1784]

Do they make a kit that will work with original 14 inch wheels? Most aftermarket disc brake kits for the 65-66 stock spindles say they require at least a 15 inch wheel

[@AutoRestoMod]

I woould contact CSRP and see. If the wheels are post 1967 then they should clear the caliper and have the larger hub hole.

[@IowaMercMan]

@devin b I had a helluva time finding 14” tires! They’re out there but increasingly hard to get. Do your homework. I switched to 15” wheels/tires (and a little wider) and that alone provided noticeable improvement in handling. Just sayin’... fins tires before you finalize your mod plans.

[@coreyjeffords3083]

Love watching your guys' videos! I have a 65 mustang that I am working on. I am looking to do the total control products front coilover conversion. Would it be more beneficial to upgrade to the CSRP spindle that has the beefier spindle or would a stock "brand new" 65 spindle be good enough? I am looking to do a willwood disc brake conversion as well... Any info would help! Thanks.

[@coreyjeffords3083]

Quick side note. My car currently has a spindle from a 71-73 cougar part number D1ZA-3107A with the disc brake....

[@AutoRestoMod]

Not trying to be cagey, but it "depends". If you are doing the occasional Open Track event and driving on the street 99 percent of the time, I would go with the '65 spindles or stay with the D1ZA (provided TCP says that they are OK to use on a '65 with their suspension). Brake choices for the early spindles are way better if you are planning to do a steady diet of Open Track. Since you are doing the TCP suspension, you might also look at going to a '70 Mustang spindle. It was beefed up compared to the '65.

[@coreyjeffords3083]

@@AutoRestoMod Thanks for the response and info! You are awesome!

[@adollarshort1573]

Does anyone make a drop spindle for early Mustang?

[@AutoRestoMod]

There are several companies that carry them. Ridetech has a set, Maier Racing also. Be advised that you may have to run a specific brake kit.

[@adollarshort1573]

@@AutoRestoMod Thanks so much! Will check them out. 👍

[@reaperronin8898]

Ya,,, Great Video... 👍

[@neil3449]

Great video Jeff. Are these Granada spindle geometry issues a factor if you upgrade to a rack and pinion system on 65/66 Mustangs or is a correction built into the rack and pinion system?

[@AutoRestoMod]

Good question! Some racks can be adjusted to work with the Granada spindles. RRS has an adjustment in the bar that allows for the tie rods to be correctly positioned.

[@fatknucklesproductions7517]

I was planning on doing this on my ‘65 Fairlane awhile back, but I couldn’t find a Granada in a junkyard 100 mile radius. Maybe it wouldn’t work based on this not sure everything on Fairlane always goes to 64 then 66-71 🤷‍♂️

[@johnbaldwin413]

I have a 65 Fairlane also hard to find a good suspension and brakes with out paying a ton for

[@TheKa1o]

So Granada spindles don’t work on 66 and older, but what’s the consensus on a 67? What would you need for a swap like that?

[@AutoRestoMod]

Honestly, use your current spindles and a good set of aftermarket brakes. You can also get a set of spindles new now if yours are clapped out.

[@joeytacey743]

This video has me confused, in 1997 I put Granada disc brakes on the front of my 65 Mustang, and I have not had any problems with handling..high speeds or steering... it's 2019 now I still have the car and I don't have any problems, so like I said this video has got me confused

[@raygordon3728]

We've been installing them on 64-73 Mustangs and other Fords for over 20 years. Some people don't know about the tie rod mod or the insert mod on the tie rod hole. This can cause many problems if you don't have the updated tie rod end or the insert made to go into the underneath of the tie rod hole. On 66 and earlier we use an insert made to fit inside the tie rod hole. on 67-69 mustangs we use the 70-73 outer tie rod. And on 70-73 the stock tie rod works fine. When it come s to the rotor hub any aftermarket wheel will clear the hub. If you're dealing with stock wheels we trim down the hub on a lathe. We've tested these for over 20 years and have installed hundreds of kits on classic Fords. We have never had anyone complain of any issues driving down the road. The Granada kit is an excellent conversion. And with brand new Granada spindles available out there why use your 50 year old spindles? It's like putting 20 year old legs on an 80 year old man.

[@farmerjim-fat-man-do]

Thank You! So tired of explaining why granada spindles dont work well on the 64-66 mustang, especially it is a V8 car. ...now i can just point them toward your video. Several companies offer the factory style kelsey hayes ford kits for a reasonable price now so why would one want to mess up something so simple with granada parts i will never understand.

[@MrSloika]

Because back in the day the only reasonable priced option for the hobbyist was the Granada setup. Junk yards were full of Granadas and the parts were dirty cheap. For a long time the only practical way to get rear disc on a an early Mustang was the grab a Lincoln Versailles rear end out of a junk yard.

[@PCHelp-ct8vq]

Curious, so which way are you choosing to go with the Rancho ?

[@AutoRestoMod]

We'll be using stock '65 spindles and aftermarket discs.

[@karlx-1]

Who let the air out of Cam!!??

[@AutoRestoMod]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. OK that was funny.

[@PanditaP]

I just went from Granada spindles back to V8 spindles and the difference is night and day. Granada spindles are total ass.

[@AutoRestoMod]

Depends on where they are. They are great on a Fairlane.

[@hotrodray6802]

Too bad you dont know a GOOD front end man. Any problems are easy to fix. 2020, everybody wants a bolt on kit because nobody has a clue what the hell theyre doing and why.

[@PanditaP]

@@hotrodray6802 LOL, okay.

[@sonictails6458]

Wheres the NPD sponsor??

[@AutoRestoMod]

Manic Mechanic is brought to you by Auto Krafters Inc. who were kind enough to join with us to sponsor the show.

[@rockerpat1085]

Man I hate both of you for having such great hair!!!!!!! Lol!!!!! Keep Rocking!!!!!

[@AutoRestoMod]

I...don't know what to say. Thanks...for....hating our hair? LOL. Thanks for watching and enjoying the show.😀

[@johndoe3441]

This guy annoys me did you take puctures this isnt a how to video stands in the way makes videos complaining about shit thats pointless its a 60 year old car if you want performance buy a z06 vette

[@AutoRestoMod]

I bet you are fun at parties. You need to learn sentence structure. If you are going to bitch about me, do it correctly. 😀 Have a great day!

[@FredCombs-j7o]

Granada disc brakes are much better than the mustang , due to the calipers are much better attached

[@rvbzero7]

None of this sh|t actually matters. all that matters is specifying if the spindles have different wheel bearing sizes