Babylon 5: Need Babylon 4

Babylon 5 scene of an alien explaining why he and his friends need Babylon 4

[@Violent2aShadow]

This is a brilliant scene. The first time you see it, everything Zathras says seems incoherent. But when you see it again in a latter episode from Zathras' perspective, he makes perfect sense.

[@Kalenz1234]

If you see it again even later after finishing the series you realize it was all a lie. The war, light and dark, the one. All lies.

[@crb2061]

@@Kalenz1234 How so?

[@Kalenz1234]

@@crb2061 Did you finish the show?

[@AgentExeider]

@@Kalenz1234 I think we found a Shadow agent...

[@HighmageDerin]

@@AgentExeider no, he just works for homewatch......

[@Draylath]

"You are finite, Zathras is finite, this.... is wrong tool". One of my favourite zathras lines 🤣

[@flapjackboy]

No, you did not meet Zathras. You met Zathras!

[@Draylath]

@@flapjackboy ah yes but that wasn't a zathras line, it was a zathras line 🤣

[@ernestlindsey1305]

"Wrong tool... NEVER use this Tool."

[@thedragon133]

R.I.P. Tim Choate he was a great actor. and Zathras was a really great character.

[@gmarchenko]

Not Zathras, Zathras!

[@zacmumblethunder7466]

I liked Zathras, but I liked Zathras more.

[@KneelB4Bacon]

_"Yes. Yes. Zathras is used to being beast of burden to other people's needs. Very sad life. Probably have... very sad death. But... at least there is symmetry."_

[@Zamolxes77]

"... so Zathras talks to walls ... talk to ceilings, but dirt is closer. Dirt is used to have everyone walk all over it ... just like Zathras. Also dirt has insects in it. Not so good for ... conversation, but much protein for diet "

[@Lazyguy22]

"Ain't no-one give a rat's ass about the working Zathras".

[@Kaziklu]

Kinda when you think about it. The actor died in a Motorcycle accident in 2004. he deserved an award for this portrayal. Zathras and his brothers Zathras are one of the best things in the show.

[@christosvoskresye]

@@Kaziklu That, and the galactic ubiquity of Swedish meatballs.

[@michaelweigel8253]

@@Zamolxes77 Zathras never listen to Zathras.

[@KneelB4Bacon]

This is the most amazing long-distance setup I've ever seen in a Sci-Fi series. It blends almost perfectly with the "War Without End 1&2" episode that came out a couple of years later.

[@stescooter100]

+Catzilla It wasn't planned that way. At the the time when JMS make shootings for Babylon Squared it was planned that Michael O'Hare/Sinclair will be still a part of the show in the next seasons; originally that was a setup for Season 5 (!) after Babylon 5 was destroyed; but because of Michael's O'Hare illness the whole scenario have to be re-write as he left, still JMS great writing skills allow him to make beatiful ending of Sinclair arc in War Without End 1&2.

[@slagit]

@@stescooter100 Yep he had amazing skills to adjust for set backs with actors leaving and such. Amazing how it all played out in the end!

[@AgentExeider]

@@stescooter100 Yeah, according to JMS he had "trap doors" for every character, even trap doors for the female characters to exit and come back should any of the actresses ever gotten pregnant during the show's run. Talia for example, her trap door, was the constructed personality, but the trap door back in, was the crystal that Kosh had that Abboud make during his "business meeting". That crystal had triggers that would have allowed Talia's real personality to resurface and defeat the militant psi corp one.

[@thedragon133]

He was a true ranger! We live for the one, we die for the one!

[@Robert_Douglass]

Intil-zha, vení. In Valen's name.

[@lloydchapman5392]

I was today years old when I realized Zathras was a ranger. Were they all rangers ?

[@tatianalyulkin410]

I just realized it! JMS- " Vicky, you ARE such a retard! No wonder you're a Reb. " 🤣

[@thenuclearsandwich]

I wish we had gotten more Zathras. A very likable character.

[@SoloPilot6]

Zathras is finite.

[@ireallyreallyhategoogle]

Zathras was likeable, but Zathras isn't bad either.

[@unarmd8649]

Zathras tried to warn Zathras, but Zathras never listen to Zathras.

[@christianresel8051]

Wait for the movie later this year (2023). Not like Zathras aint in it with his greatness XD

[@TomFynn]

Zathras is great, but I prefer Zathras to Zathras. It's the little things Zathras does. No, not that Zathras. That Zathras.

[@rbjr208]

When I saw that episode, I was dying for answers. In the end, I was more satisfied than I ever could have imagined...

[@scottmantooth8785]

Zathras also quote Shakespeare...very dynamic...very moving...also do musicals, but not much dancing...back injury....very sad

[@mountainstartemple6041]

Maybe Zathras was making food ....food from oven ... tasty food ... insects ....num num na noo nom! .... maybe Zathras wa at the end of a shift ... but no-one listen to poor Zathras!!!

[@tadpetrie3464]

Imagine "Rosencrantz and Gildenstern Are Dead" with R + G played by 2 members of Family Zathras!

[@SuperRegic]

The way the explanation of how Zathras came to be in babylon 4 and even how the station disappeared, is pure genius.

[@foca2002]

This is the first episode of B5 I watched. And I hooked. I learn english by myself only so I can watch this.

[@calvinjohnstone2664]

😆 hope things are going well buddy👍

[@foca2002]

@@calvinjohnstone2664 this was long ago the year was 1998, I way better now.

[@katherinewolfe]

@@foca2002 - Babylon 5 is coming back - you must learn more English! :-)

[@ceterfo]

For Babylon 5, not because???? I love sci-fi but I've never been able to sit through Babylon 5, I think it's time for another go.

[@flowerpt]

Legend.

[@emperorpalpatine4723]

"Not the one. Won't talk. Can't talk. Not the one. They told me, they did. Zathras listens, he does, yes. Zathras listens and does what he's told."

[@dwaugh2215]

He's been talking like that ever since we caught him

[@slagit]

Love this character!

[@superdave8248]

The crazy thing is I can only imagine the actor was told to say the lines exactly. No playing with the lines. Every word said by Zathras had meaning. One misspoken word and it could have had huge impacts to the Zathras story line. It wouldn't surprise me if more thought was put in Zathras' lines then were put into entire earlier episodes of this series. JMS had great buildup and delivery. So did Star Trek: The Next Generation. Especially with Worf and Data. Their story arcs took years to play out.

[@Spookssga]

My theory on what happened to the first 3 stations is that Zathras tried it before with the first 3 stations and failed due to complications and made it look like sabotage, but was successful with B4

[@pmagrin]

It was explained that Shadow agents recognised the design of the Babylon stations from the previous shadow war 1000 years previously and destroyed them to prevent any of them being sent back in time.

[@rizon72]

Zathras quite possibly the best bit character in B5.

[@duffey3]

rizon72 what about the two maintenance workers cleaning the corridor?

[@Scottlp2]

Or the technomage? B5 was a very well written show with a number of great major/minor characters.

[@brianr101010]

I like how he kept popping up and turned out to be the sibling also named zathras.

[@youtert]

No, Zathras was much better.

[@stevenpilling5318]

God rest Tim Choate. What a character he created!

[@kalle911]

I remember when I first watched the series way back, this particular story arc blew me away when all was revealed.

[@kiillerrob]

Get out. same here first real story arc for me

[@Zamolxes77]

Yeah, it was a very good arc, and when you see the 1st part in season one, you know it will happen soon, because the scene at the end, when old Sinclair is revealed, and you hear Delenn's voice.

[@dennish300]

It was an amazing piece of writing.. loved every moment of this series!

[@Nighthawke70]

JMS did the B5 time travel arc good. There are two types of stories when they use time travel; scripts that should have been canned, and academy award winners. This is one of them.

[@stescooter100]

Great ending of Sinclair arc. Amazing JMS writing skills, especially after found out that it wasn't planned from the very beginning /Michael's O'Hare departure was the reason to re-write the whole scenario/.

One of the very few time travel (to the past) plots that I can bear to watch too, it was so cool, I gave it a pass.

[@edwarddeguzman3258]

I remember reading that JMS put a trap door in all the recurring characters just in case the actor needed to leave

[@biocapsule7311]

I was very disappointed when season 2 came around and it wasn't O'Hare... but the trap door was very satisfactory. And everyone did a great job. It is amazing writing... all the more so for those who are patient enough for the original run, because we actually have to wait.

[@erikawhelan4673]

@@edwarddeguzman3258 JMS indeed wrote in trap doors for the main characters

[@henriqueribeiro8167]

@@erikawhelan4673 but did he write a Trapdoor to poor Zathras?! (smack, pop) no no no! Nobody think of poor Zathras, they think he will just come along, no matter what happens.. Oh poor Zathras.

[@Scifimaster92]

Here's an interesting fact: According to Wikipedia, Zathras's speech patterns were inspired by those of JMS's grandmother, a Polish immigrant who initially spoke English poorly.

[@ChildePC]

Being polish... I understand him perfectly

[@The_Gallowglass]

@@ChildePC Being understood I polish fantastically. Pierogi.

[@bostonrailfan2427]

it’s familiar to anyone who grew up with non-English speakers, you get used to putting the words together for the meaning of what’s said

[@jurybery]

Zathras sounds similar to slovak "zatras" which would be imperative of "to shake". There are fairytales about "oslik zatras sa!", about a donkey you would shake and he would spit(?) Golden coins. So zathras reminds me of this fairytale. You need to shake him to get what u need.

[@Robert_Douglass]

Did that also influence the changes in the stress patterns in the name that indicated a different Zathras?

[@disruptive_innovator]

Zathras was a great and intriguing character. Thank you Tim.

[@SirCraigius]

Its funny how we don't really understand why Zathras reacts like that when he sees Sinclair, until we see the next B4 episode and find out he told Zathras to NOT refer to him as "The One".

[@Syndur]

+SirCraigius Yeah, I always liked those episodes -- spread apart by several seasons. Nowadays, shows aren't planned for an entire run, they just hope to somehow get funding for the next season and don't much care about anything else.

[@Jokie155]

Bit hard to blame them when there is such a clear history of early cancellations. It's a near miracle that The Expanse got saved from it at all.

[@flybeep1661]

@@Syndur Clearly you don't watch Game of Thrones. That show has arcs that last years, some even 7 years.

[@Syndur]

@@flybeep1661 Yeah, I watched the first two episodes or something like that, saw a splatter-show with no plot, and dumped it right away. It just wasn't my thing.

[@simtill]

@@flybeep1661 You are clearly referring to the first 4,5 seasons when the show could rely on the books to provide arcs and story, as the shows later seasons were just shit.

[@gerard5705]

3 out of the 4 actors in this scene are no longer with us :(

[@LanIaFortroSha]

It's pretty scary how many of the B5 cast are already gone.

[@otiscarter1356]

Mira died today

[@slagit]

So many have passed too soon!

[@flowerpt]

They are, in our hearts. Did you know you have a piece of a JMS in you?

[@paulgibbons2320]

Just rewatched this. Should have got an Oscar for this performance. Must be one of my favourite aliens.

[@davidking7205]

Loved this character ... sadly the actor died in a motorcycle accident (2004, aged 49) .... it seems that Babylon 5 had a lot of deaths amongst the cast!

[@ibobeko4309]

Wtf he also, In September 2004, he was on his way to a rehearsal for a play in Los Angeles when a van failed to yield at an intersection and struck his motorcycle; he was pronounced dead on arrival at the hospital. A public memorial service was held the following October, on what would have been his 50th birthday, at the Egyptian Theatre in Hollywood attended by his many friends and fans.

[@idunbeezasmart1]

On the plus side, there are 9 more of them.

[@shyone968]

The B-5 curse. To die before your time. See a little time travel humor. Zathros died before his time.

[@slagit]

Yes sad how many have passed on and another one passed on this last week! Ms. Furlan will be missed...

[@bostonrailfan2427]

the longest lived are the ones who were established stars before the show…Boxleithner, Scolari, Mumy: they had been known even if not A-List. Furst was the only one who had consistency outside of B5 but even so it was just one movie not anything else

[@MehWhatever99]

I got to watch Babylon 5 again. These little clips are NOT enough.

[@slagit]

Yep I need to do a re watch it has been some years!

[@dankuchar6821]

It's remastered and now available on HBO max

[@davidking7205]

3:05 .... security guards .... never change! LOL

[@nathanel1313]

great scene, great character, great acting skills.

[@darrinwebber4077]

Zathras go. Zathras die. Zathras stay. Zathras die. Either way. Bad day for Zathras.

[@Trisjack20]

Very clever episode! Love this Babylon 4 arc!

[@cernstormrunner7263]

This was my mom's favorite scene. She cracked up every time she would hear "not the one what?"

[@kellycassutt3165]

Zathras can never have nice things.

[@BillCoghlan]

The best show, ever.

[@McRocket]

I really like Zathras. But I slightly prefer Zathras over Zathras. ☮

[@feralbluee]

as i said in another Zathras - this character is just soooo lovable - "Zathras cute, Zathras is heart."

[@jack1701e]

Turns out Babylon 4 was also a last great hope for victory as well!

[@RonanMacQuarrie]

Zathras would be a good companion to the Doctor

[@mgoggin65]

Loved this show in the 90s

[@georgeparkins777]

Zorak, you were *on* this show...

[@Zhaan4ever]

I love the delayed reaction of the gaurds

[@Thirdbase9]

Part of the greatest time travel storyline in science fiction.

[@Robert_Douglass]

We live for the One. We die for the One. Intil-zha, veni. In Valen's name...

[@kevindondrea144]

WOW!!! I didn't know that. But after seeing your post I had to see what happened. My wife his bouts of that. It's amazing how all these famous people are starting to die young again. I always like Andreas Katsulas in Star Trek too.

[@tinkersparkie10]

I'm lucky in that I have the full series on C.D including all films

[@hoffenwurdig1356]

1:41 Thinking about the Earth-Minbari War ... “Mitchell, stay in formation! It might be a ..."

[@Foebane72]

When I first saw Zathras, he reminded of the old Universal idea of a WEREWOLF. After all, he has all of the facial hair of a werewolf, so can you blame me?

[@IoEstasCedonta]

They really had to tie themselves in knots to make this make sense after O'Hare left. It's just lucky they managed to get him back for that two-parter.

[@EdwardSteven352]

We need Babylon 6

[@alexakaa.charlesross8919]

Would love to see members of the non aligned worlds as members of the main cast, like the Drazi or pak'ma'ra. Watching the series for the first time, I'm about half way through season 4. Even though I still have season 5, the movies and Crusade I'm sad its almost over.

[@ytgray]

"Babylon 5 was the last of the Babylon stations. There would never be another." The last lines in Babylon 5, Sleeping in Light, as spoken by Ivanova. Excepting that tiny text bit from the newscaster. Here are the rest of her lines: It changed the future… and it changed us. It taught us that we have to create the future, or others would do it for us. It showed us that we have to care for one another, because if we don't, who will? And that true strength sometimes comes from the most… unlikely places. Mostly though, I think it gave us hope - that there can always be new beginnings… even for people like us. As for Delenn, every morning for as long as she lived, Delenn got up before dawn and watched the sun come up.

[@flowerpt]

Wow, this is the first time I picked up on the extent of the last Shadow War - they wanted to end all life a thousand years ago, not just knock over some ant hills.

[@MarkTanner-ff3sp]

Tim Choate was a great guy. Died way too young.

[@ChildePC]

Zathras... Was perhaps one of the first species to leave and go beyond the rim.

[@kairon156]

Modern sci-fi can learn a thing or two from Baybalon 5 or even the interesting bits for DS9.

[@weswolever7477]

That suit bares a curious resemblance to the suits from 2001 a space odyssey

[@augusthawks6576]

Loved this episode and the one later on that explained it.

[@AengusFallon]

Zathras is the man. Why does no one listen to poor Zathras?

[@erictaylor5462]

We need B-4 before B-4 was built.

[@HyperReport]

Hey, did anyone else catch what Zathrus said? He said he warned, but nobody listened. Could Zathrus be a paradox; in that, he continues to live the same 1000 years over and over and over and over again?

[@MrAlumni72]

There are 12 of him, I think he once said - all of them living and traveling thoughout time. All named Zathras.

[@suchiuomizu]

@@MrAlumni72 No. There were 12 Zathras brothers, but only the one went through time. The rest stayed on Epsilon 3, helping Draal with the Great Machine.

[@rfletch62]

Later episode. "Zathras was always the quiet one..."

[@PreacherAtArrakeen]

I kept expecting him to say 'mussssn't hurt the Preciousssssss.....' Gollum, Gollum.

[@cyradon393]

Given that the precious in this case is a fully activated diplomatic station bigger than its own successor, I think it'll be good to go

[@SuperVstech]

The funny part is when Zathras sees the shimmering figure in the suit and says “the one” ... he is wrong. It’s Delinn

[@LanIaFortroSha]

She's also 'the one'. Kinda like the Bible; there are three 'the one's.

[@TimeMaster77]

Well, originally it was. The groans give this away. They had to change the story because of O'Hare's illness and departure.

[@nicholasmaude6906]

I just realised watching this clip that of the four people in this scene only Kent Broadhurst (Major Lewis Krantz) is still alive and he's now 83 according to the IMDB.

[@LincolnFStern]

I you look closely, you'll see one of the droids from Silent Running in the Sand Crawler.

[@Texx010]

I uploaded the scene from Babylon 4 immediately prior to this one, where Sinclair and Garibaldi have the flash forward scene where Babtylon 5 is under heavy attack and is about to explode. I would encourage the uploader of this video to add Zathras to the search tags.

[@mikefrederickson9437]

How is it remember this fuller this show filled in occupied a few Sunday afternoons

[@freemanz4051]

KUBRICK! 3:27 That's David Bowman, jogging on the space station in 2001. See the black "obelisk"? Hear the breathing?

[@aaronearl7697]

Actually, it was Frank Poole jogging around Discovery's carousel. Interestingly enough, however, I've read that the spacesuit the One wears in this scene is one of the actual costumes from 2001: A Space Odyssey. The black device in the scene DOES make me think of the monolith... I guess this scene might, indeed, be a wink and a nod to the Greatest Science Fiction Movie of All Time.

[@ernestmarshall2098]

Babylon 5 on Comet network Monday thru Friday at 7pm

[@lfroncek]

Only one of these actors is still alive. Bummer...

[@FighterUnitHopeless]

HOW THE FUCK DOES HE CLICK HIS TOUNGE LIKE THAT?

[@john-lenin]

Babylon 2 fell into the wormhole. Babylon 3 fell into the wormhole. Babylon 4 burned down, imploded, and then fell into the wormhole. But Babylon 5…well we’ll see.

[@mikesmolowitz1269]

Everyone said it was daft to build a space station in a swamp. But I built it all the same - just to show 'em.

[@BaldWolf]

Haven't seen this in years, immediately knew Zathra's name

[@mariusqaztarilk7834]

That guy reminds me of the bat rider from Neverending Story quite a bit

[@rizon72]

There are some continuity errors, they capture Zathras looking for tools, he doesn't appear in the conference room.

[@dennish300]

Damn I miss this show!

[@feykro222]

Is this Zathras or Zathras or Zathras?

[@suchiuomizu]

None of the above, its Zathras.

[@Sleipnir1971]

3:02 ... no matter the century ... security guards (in TV programs) are just dumb! hahha

[@1femalegeek]

I LOVE Zathras!

[@haakonstenseth]

-- Ivanova and Zathras in Babylon 5:"Conflicts of Interest""Let's try this again." "As you wish." "Zathras came with us to Babylon 4." "Yes." "Zathras stayed in the past with Valen." "Yes." "You are Zathras." "Yes." "Therefore, you went into the past." "No, that was not Zathras, that was Zathras. There are 10 of us, all of family Zathras, each one named Zathras. Slight differences in how you pronounce. Zathraas, Zathras, Zathras.. You are seeing now?" "There are ten of you?" "Yes! Well, nine now." "And Zathras?" "Zathras gone! Zathras warned Zathras, but Zathras never listened to Zathras. Zathras was quiet one in family. SO! What can Zathras be doing for you?"

[@kevindondrea144]

This episode is one of my 3-5 favorites. The 2nd part is up there with this one. As well as the one where they show the future of the earth and we all evolved to the same level as the Vorlon's. I also liked the one with Jack the Ripper.... And further more Dr. Sheldon Cooper, you are WRONG about Babylon 5. It was an AWESOME show. The New "Battlestar Galactica" is the one that sucks. No, the wench will NEVER be Starbuck.... No matter what she thinks or says. But I digress.

[@kevindockery5182]

I love Babylon 5.

[@jeffbaumert3642]

So that's where Kirk ended up during "The Tholian Web" /s

[@dodgyb2001]

And goosebumps...

[@MrLimborace]

Zathrus needs poontang, yes, this Zathras needs.

[@espearite3]

Don't you wish you had him along for ever potential date you'd meet??? LOL

[@sirhborn]

Like B5 More then star trek, strange??

[@James-hs3tu]

Never understand the chactor. What was his storyline

[@speedracer1945]

I read on another site here on u tube that this actor played Zathras died in a motorcycle accident . Don't know if its a rumor or what .

[@NATIK001]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Choate Not a rumor,

[@RogueShadows]

Poor Zathras

[@kevindondrea144]

I thought so. When I first saw the show I made that comment. I'd also like to know how George Lucas got the copy-write for Droids. He didn't invent them, he stole them from "Silent Running".

[@haakonstenseth]

He is not the one wouldn't talk 😁

[@davidkosa]

Who is the actor that plays Zathras? He is quite good.

[@TimeMaster77]

Tim Choate. He died in 2004 in a motorbike accident :(

[@DarthSchwartz]

r.i.p tim choate

[@tatianalyulkin410]

Wait a second- Zathras is a Ranger?

[@b5kalad]

I was he was on the crusade series.

[@greggweber9967]

2001 A Space Suit?

[@Feathers-Rainbows]

Was a good series :)

[@davidkosa]

Was that Zathras? Or was he Zathras?

[@mrmike1884]

No. It was Zathras!!!

[@FalconRS]

What if Sinclair simply shot himself to escape his fate designed by others? I mean, he had actually no choice, it was thrown literally to his face.

[@kimmccarthy7747]

I have the feeling something else would have appeared that would still enable it to all come together. The Fates in this episode were so tightly wound together there was no way it would not have worked out somehow.

[@ethenallen1388]

He did not want to escape his fate.

[@FalconRS]

@@ethenallen1388 because others decided. he had absolutely no free choice. pawn in others game. Id rather let galaxy burn. To hell with these so righteous all knowing Minbari.

[@FalconRS]

@TomeOfBattle Yes, you can. If Minbari were so stupid they needed mutated Human as a leader, they deerved to lose war. And don't lecture about innocent lives: Minbari almost wiped out entire species just because one unfortunate border incident caused by incompetent commander. They were genocidal murderers themselves.

[@ethenallen1388]

@@FalconRS It seems to me that someone who would rather let a galaxy filled with countless worlds inhabited but uncounted billions of being burn rather than accept a part in something greater than oneself, regardless of how that part came about, is a slave to their own spitefulness and ego. Ever that or they'd make a perfect puppet for the Shadows. I'll let you choose which.

[@Ephisus]

What a cool show.

[@HarPlayer]

I didn't get this chacter ???

[@paulgrove1407]

A B5 remake without Zathras will be a poor thing indeed.

[@nightowl685]

@Scifimaster92 thank you for that:)

[@smaariseth]

Is there a streaming service that has B5???

[@dankuchar6821]

It's now remastered and available on HBO Max!

[@paxbeata]

Wait, this is not Zathras, this is Zathras.

[@mrmike1884]

No you are Wrong!!!. It was really Zathras!!