Was It Supposed to be Greg? | Crazy Ex-Girlfriend Theory

Or read: genericwonderful.wordpress.co...
Twitter: / harrisonchute
Email: [e-mail]
If a TV character leaves a show without having died, we’ll always wonder if they’ll return, and sometimes even if they did die, especially if we have such a powerful emotional connection to them.

[@inasaira8380]

i love that greg got her a baloon that says "she is with jesus now" after her UTI emergency lmao

[@FlamesAndShadows]

He just loved Jesus riding a unicorn over a rainbow too much XD

[@Mia199603]

And she's Jewish so that's another layer of amazing

[@hy3000]

I feel like the fact that greg left was to show how people can leave from "toxic" relationships or relationships that don't work before everything blew up like rebecca and josh did. Greg shows a healthy example that you have to let things go and work on yourself first before committing to a relationship.

[@victorym744]

I concur 100%. Him leaving was precisely him growing. Good for him

[@Huntersthomphson]

hy3000 Sweetie your overanalyzing a show with "FICTIONAL" people again.

[@vinceknox4425]

Left Foot, Right Foot *cough* Media theory relies upon analyzing fictional characters *cough*

[@laura-vq6zc]

@@Huntersthomphson oh right because they're the only one that watched a 16 minutes video about said fictional people

[@laura-vq6zc]

sorry i just now realized that this is 2 years old lmaO

[@briannalee1998]

I remember watching the first episode and thinking, "wow, Greg is definitely going to be endgame!"

[@kaybart]

I find Greg sympathetic because his face and voice are so nice. And, uh...all the reasons you said, also. Yeah. But his FACE.

[@nelumboandrews6762]

This is the reason why i didnt like newe greg

[@virtuousthing9070]

wow middle aged women seem to REALLY like greg

[@kgal1298]

Santino is amazing. I love Skyler too, but I wish they could have had Santino back besides his voice on the Cinderella Broadway soundtrack is just everything honestly such a good Broadway performer. Aye.

[@mfjrecampo9083]

@@nelumboandrews6762 yeah new greg just looks too happy and confident. It's not how we know him and it feels weird. Skyler looks more like a Josh.

[@TinycanKill]

I wish he was a search term on porn sites XD

[@Voyher_]

Greg never finished singing "It was a shit show", leaving the last line hanging in the air but not actually saying it. This could be indicative of how it's not really over between Greg and Rebecca, or it could be a statement about how one rarely gets satisfying closure when a relationship ends.

[@ckliffames1]

Rachel talked about that song in a Facebook live session. Originally they asked to have 3 "shits" bleeped but standards and practices only allowed 2. My guess is that they would have had a final "shit show" but when they didn't get it they made it more poignant musically by leaving it off on the end.

[@MyFantomTangents]

restriction breeding creativity, and overall a better story :D I love it

[@shannonkahermanes6080]

The creators have said Greg will definitely not be back, but I like that thought. Definitely gives it more meaning!

[@vincentlee8787]

Leaning towards the second, but I agree, it's so brilliant. Little touches like that really elevate this show to something truly special.

[@emmyma2632]

"Crazy Ex-Girlfriend" creator and star Rachel Bloom (Rebecca Bunch) told TV Line she's not going to say whether the actor will return on the show or not. She, however, acknowledged his presence is badly missed on the set. "We love him, he's wonderful, he's amazing and we miss him," Bloom said of Fontana. Before he left the series, Fontana had discussions with co-creator Aline Brosh McKenna on the possibility of bringing Greg back in future episodes. "She already had ideas of how we'd be able to check back in with Greg, although I don't know if that can or will happen now," Fontana told Vulture. TL;DR - Creators didn't explicitly say whether Greg will be back or not. "She already had ideas of how we'd be able to check back in with Greg, although I don't know if that can or will happen now," Fontana told Vulture. source - Christian Post

[@ilovelucasg4eva]

I always found something different when it came to Rebecca listing Greg's name off in the finale. Notice the gentleness in her voice. It's a croak of sadness, but its said softer than any of the other guys. I think it was because Greg fully explained himself to Rebecca when he left ("It Was a Shit Show") and for that reason, Rebecca was actually able to come to terms with his departure from her life. Silas, by virtue of being Rebecca's father, never felt the need to explain his absences. Josh, as we saw, abandoned her. Finally, Robert's breakup was harsh and while an explanation was provided, it was curt and Rebecca was left with hardly any closure.

[@user-uc2he9wb2f]

But also closure is never owed. You must remember that closure as we understand it does not exist.

[@ilovelucasg4eva]

@@user-uc2he9wb2f I understand that, but Rebecca didn't at the time of that episode. She hadn't come to terms with that lesson herself by that point, so that lack of closure Robert left her with affected her badly.

[@marissab4114]

I don't really see her ending up with anyone either. I do think the show could make it a little open ended like showing there's hope for her with Greg or Nathaniel. But I don't see them letting her drive into the sunset with a male lead. It would be giving power to her idealism, which the show likes to tear down at every turn. Rebecca ultimately wants love and a family but she needs to go about loving herself first and finding a way to accept and show love in healthy ways.

[@Jasmine-ei1ty]

I don't if you saw the last episode but oh my god you were so right ! Sorry I'm here two years after but anyway 😂

[@mariaskabardonis8353]

You were right from the future

[@willowwisp9320]

I’m so glad the show ended the way it did. The idea of one character being “endgame” and just leaving off once they end up with Rebecca would erase all the work she did on herself.

[@ili7046]

who does rebecca end up with

[@willowwisp9320]

@@ili7046 nobody

[@akasakikawasaki1890]

I agree. Finale was perfect but my head cannon is Nathaniel, he's had a similar growth as her and imo is the perfect balance between the fantasy romance of Josh and the practicality of Greg.

[@victorym744]

I like Nathaniel. He represents Rebecca's life prior to her running away. He's a cold splash of reality who makes her question her delusions. I'm interested to see how their relationship, platonic or otherwise, will develop. I think Greg deserves to have a life of his own, and I appreciate the fact that the show specifically veers away from having the supporting characters revolve around the protagonist. I do love Greg, though.

[@chikibingbing]

I'm Team Nathaniel!!!!

[@Huntersthomphson]

Victoria Em Sweetie your overanalyzing a show with "FICTIONAL" people again. This comment was way to long get a life jesus.

[@Huntersthomphson]

chikibingbing No one asked

[@youngfunny1824]

Girl Dog Ironic how you say she's needs to get a life, when in fact, it's actually you who should get one for being so spiteful

[@Huntersthomphson]

Young & Funny Wait I'm confused I should get a life for being so spiteful that insult made no sense

[@lettucelive]

God does anyone remember this small line Rebecca told to someone (maybe Paula?) right before she started seeing Greg? It was obviously right after she realized the Josh thing wasn't going to pan out. She said something like "I'm going to start dating mature men--maybe a college professor." Then in season 2 we find out about Robert, who is a college professor. It makes me wonder if she was just faking getting her shit together or if she was regressing in this scary kind of way. Sometimes with shows you have to wonder how much of it is you projecting and how much of it is the writers giving you hints and clues as to what's to come. But I still think about that line.

[@slipknotfatman]

lettucelive Very astute. I agree and after season 2 we have lots more to worry about lol

[@Huntersthomphson]

lettucelive Sweetie your overanalyzing a show with "FICTIONAL" people again. This comment was way to long get a life jesus.

[@QuesoCookies]

I actually think it was pretty obvious from episode 1 that Rebecca was regressing and framing it as progress to indulge in the opportunity to try to fix her problems the wrong way. It's the same reason she gets along so well with Paula. Paula indulges in regression with Rebecca and frames it as motherhood. They're framing their steps back as steps forward to justify doing what's easy rather than doing the difficult emotional legwork required to actually grow and take forward steps.

[@karaann6966]

I didn't notice that at all but I think you're totally right! This show does such an incredible job of really showing the complexity not just of mental illness life and of love in general and our emotions and the ways we can manipulate even ourselves if we want to believe something badly enough and what you've just said, if that was the writers' intention, is an incredible example of how good this show is at that

[@TheSomeawesome]

Greg leaving was 100% due to Santino Fontana needing to leave the show for 'career growth', according to him. What amazes me is how beautifully this show is written, and how despite logistic reasons pushing things, they find a way to make the text so powerful and give drive and reason to every event in the plot. Writing aside, Santino has mentioned that there is still a chance for him to want to return for the show. If or when that time comes, Rachel and all the brilliant writers will absolutely find a way to smoothly bring his character back in a way that advances the story and the individual arcs.

[@HarvestMoonAngel]

Greg was always my favorite character. Didn't matter if he was with Rebecca or not. Great video!

[@ebonyrose7236]

AirheadedAngel not my favourite character but his drinking song is my favourite

[@s_tia_v]

Another great analysis! I do miss Greg sometimes, but Nathaniel has potential... I like how the series realistically show how love is not always meant to be with all the love interests. Thanks for eloquently portraying the show in a way that could be taught in a class.

[@AngyBangyyy]

Tia totes agree! I majored in Media Studies and I learned a lot more here in this channel (in some aspects). That being said, this would be great material for class to get students discussing. Anyhoo, looking forward to more episodes! I'm thinking a... Heather analysis?

[@83croissant]

I saw "Settle For Me" as more Beck's perception of Greg's feelings, or partly his adoration of her but filtered through her perception. Soon after he says he DOESN'T want to be settled for. But then that's me taking what he says he wants over what he DOES so I dunno

[@alyssaolson7964]

I agree with you. She actually mentions to him later in that same episode that he had a "settle for me vibe" or the like, which he quickly denies. He's also demonstraterably insecure about just being her backup for Josh throughout most of their relationship. It really does seem to be Rebecca's perception of him rather than his actual words. It happens relatively often (ex I Love My Daughter, I'm So Good At Yoga) so I guess I shouldn't be too surprised about that

[@rikosborne1212]

My god, your deconstruction of Greg is brilliant. Are you with me in my opinion that this is the best show on television? I got pulled into this show, and immediately saw Greg as the guy I was supposed to identify with. And then, as I kept watching, I realized that I AM EVERYBODY ON THIS SHOW.

[@flippa400]

I see Greg somewhat as a dismantling of the classic guy-who's-been-there-all-along romcom trope, and I think that's partly why fandom gravitated towards him (also there's always a trend towards the cis white guy, that's a whole other topic). We've seen it so many times before, the fantasy, supposedly perfect love interest (Josh) falls through, and the lead realises that the person for her is the guy wearing flannel who's been cracking jokes etc. for the whole movie. With Greg, it actually shows him as a person with his own complex issues which, combined with Rebecca's, mean that the classic narrative, that seems to progress relatively standardly through much of S1, can't play out, and that in (largely Rebecca's) trying to force it to play out, the result is a toxic relationship that hurts all involved.

[@flippa400]

One thing I forgot to mention is that the dismantling of this trope is also a commentary on how a story need not be leading towards a happily-ever-after romance

[@samstarba4569]

I personally think that the biggest problem with Josh is his immaturity and jock-like personality, not his racial background. Like it was said in the show (?), Rebecca is too smart for Josh and can play him like a doll while Josh keeps responding to Rebecca's maneuvers with "fight or flight" reactions. That is just painful to watch.

[@carolynv8979]

I can’t see Gregbecca ever really working long term. Even once he’s healthy; snark and a critical eye are part of his base personality. He can’t and SHOULDN’T change that. It’s the type of rye humor that comes naturally to him and that he enjoys. Rebecca enjoys things wholeheartedly and unapologetically. She’s goofy and enthusiastic. Greg never will be. People like to say these massive differences in personalities are good for people but in practice it’s very lonely when you enjoy things enthusiastically and your partner can’t enjoy them too. And it can be exhausting constantly trying to cultivate genuine interest in each new phase, always biting back a rye instinct. The truth is sometimes we love people who aren’t a good match for us and these two characters loved each-other, but that could never be enough on its own to sustain a healthy relationship between them. And I think that’s important to show. Real love doesn’t make someone endgame.

[@TheStardustConspiracy]

We need a part two of this video for the Greg of the four season!

[@rbush88]

13:49 "[Greg returning] would only be additive. It wouldn't be an answer to a thematic void. There's no loose thread here; just sadness" This is such a great look at Greg's leaving but also a great look at so many arcs in TV storytelling and I think, important to remember in distinguishing things that are sad in TV and things that are unearned or bad narrative.

[@aeh5109]

I like them because it’s “mock, love”. Couples who are able to make fun of each other (because they know and understand their flaws) and not take it too seriously last longer and have a healthier relationship

[@mostlyscar]

it was never about any of the men, they were all just part of Rebecca's journey. i think the show ended so perfectly.

[@MrsPossible1]

" Male heterosexuality is pretty gross" So true. :'D

[@oof-rr5nf]

MrsPossible1 That part was so hilarious xD

[@miriamspringett3797]

That cut at 12:27 between the scene of her Dad leaving and Greg leaving broke my heart a little :'(

[@pi14pi14]

Your poetic prose will always astound me. I find myself going over each sentence and nodded along, because you say things that I am not able to verbalize. Thank you for your talent of explaining. I certainly don't have that, but I am glad I have found someone that does. Keep going strong!

[@qmechanic]

I'm probably in the minority, but I would never even ask the question "Was it supposed to be Greg?" because that question presupposes that a person needs to have a romantic partner to be "complete". This is also probably the reason why I generally dislike romantic comedies. Greg left West Covina and Rebecca, but no one died, no one did hard time in jail. There is nothing stopping Greg and Rebecca getting back together again in the future. I'm actually pretty worried for Season 3, because I think either Paula or Rebecca may commit a crime in their pursuit of revenge against Josh, and that leads to one or both of them being disbarred.

[@aneezaali2412]

!!!I love reading this and just watching the ending of season 4. It feels so cool.

[@alyssaolson7964]

That is remarkably close to what actually happened

[@mariaskabardonis8353]

I am here from five years into the future. The ending for Greg was always maybe in the future as it was for Nathaniel and one can make a case with Josh. I think if the actor stayed it would have came to the same outcome. I feel the writers always had this plan for Bex arc. I liked Greg and Rebecca in s1 and later switched to her and Nathaniel but it was a good thing went to clear his demons and came back more evolved. He had demons to and I glad you touched that Rebecca also had fantasies on him as well. I am rewatching the show so it's nice reading analysis

[@IkanariPh]

A big reason to Greg's charm was Santino Fontana 🥺🤧💗

[@LifeIsABeach3210]

He also had the only decent male singing voice in the show. A leading man voice which has so far not been replaced. Musically as well as emotionally and plot wise Santiago's loss is felt.

[@mirrorreflex]

The actor that plays Josh has a nice voice, but unfortunately they keep on giving him pop songs which do not showcase his talent.

[@tylerjamesnazario1770]

There's a lot of men with great voices. Nathaniel, Josh, White Josh, and etc

[@cherrysherry1132]

and 2nd Greg skylar has a great voice but santino did better at the role, he was first after all

[@Charharr]

I'm with you here. While I was sad Greg left, and I loved their chemistry, it was the right thing for him to get out. I also feel healthy end-game for Rebecca should probably not involve romance, but general happiness and good mental health. I've been thinking that if that truly happens, the show will have to end in a sort of 'silence'. The musical numbers have been Rebecca's way of coping - if she is legit become well enough, she won't need the songs anymore. I think this could be great and really powerful of finishing the series. A nice, quiet, content ending for Rebecca and Crazy Ex-Girlfriend. And a final 'up you' from the writers against the trope of 'ending with a bang'.

[@BagelsAfterMidnight]

I really like that theory, a silent ending

[@vincentlee8787]

I love this theory so much.

[@cbanders3625]

I would love the last lines of the show to be a very genuine, "this is what happy feels like." Just a personal relief of, "I made it through the wilderness, and I'm ready for life" statement. A total 180 degrees from when she says it in the pilot

[@elizabethbennet4791]

when you're jumping around like Rebecca, it definitely seems like she may be on the edge of codepedency and just needs to cool it.

[@slipknotfatman]

cbanders3625 I don't see that coming tbh. That line and it's relation to the Butter ads always said to me that 'Happiness' as a concept is a hollow marketing buzzword, filled by whatever fantasy like ideals you can imagine; given how strongly one might aspire to fantasy, especially if mentally unstable. It's at it's core an unreachable summit we all trick ourselves into climbing and the consumption of rom coms and ice cream is our sustenance lol.

[@ckliffames1]

Bagelsaftermidnight I am SOOOO glad you are continuing your analysis of the show even thought we are at least 6 months away from season 3! Please keep them coming!

[@victorym744]

ONLY 6 MONTHS?! This is amazing! :)) I'm not used to follow-ups happening this quickly (But I'm a Sherlock fan, so I guess ANYTHING is faster than Sherlock installments)

[@thanatos101b]

I always found Greg and Rebecca to have a more toxic relationship than Rebecca and Josh. In a podcast, Rachel Bloom said that Greg was somewhat everything Rebecca was fleeing from in New York. Which is very true because Greg combines the worst qualities of both of her parents. He is critical and negative like Naomi and withholding and aloof like Silas. It is notable that as their relationship progresses, Rebecca becomes more grounded and sensible and Greg, in his self-loathing, sabotages it. The most quintessential Greg story line is in episode four, "I'm Going on a Date with Josh's Friend!" Rebecca draws so much attention to herself that it is easy to overlook all the different screwed up things Greg does. We're supposed to view Rebecca going home to have sex with a vegan as such beyond-the-pale behavior that we ignore everything leading up to that moment (it's actually perfectly acceptable behavior). When Greg asks Rebecca out, he leads with insulting her... several times. He says, "You're not that nice to me and you're weird" and remember this is his opening line for asking her on a date. He's negging her, but we don't notice it because Rebecca slips into "Settle for Me." Then, latter on in the episode he invites himself over to her house, and doesn't resend even though he can see it is making her very uncomfortable. On top of that he can't stop himself from criticizing her veganism. He first dismisses his comments as jokes, but even when he sees she is actively getting upset over it, rather than apologize for his insensitivity he continues to criticize her for it. And then he calls her a liar and starts talking about her mental health. She outright says that his comments are offensive and mean, and yet he still keeps making them. It's very important to note that prior to this conversation Rebecca was maintaining her veganism, even if it was a large struggle for her, but the moment it is over she immediately goes to scarf down some tacos. Greg, in his criticism and negativity, essentially crushed her soul. But again, the audience doesn't consider that because it has already moved on to Rebecca sleeping with the taco vegan. But what attracted her to that taco vegan? Well he just listened to her, didn't judge her, and empathized with her. That's the basis of their connection. When she told him she was struggling with temptation he said he understood how she felt. When he catches her eating meat tacos he accepts her weakness and doesn't judge her for it. Greg is incapable of not judging her. He's incapable of accepting her. And that's true throughout the entire time he is on the show. The season one finale is, more or less, the only time Rebecca dials back her delusions. She starts the episode with wildly high expectations of Disney romance, and Greg disappoints them almost immediately. But in a unique change from normal, Rebecca simply reassess and regrounds those expectations. And then Greg disappoints them again. He is unwilling to even give her just one nice slow dance, even though she keeps asking him nicely. Eventually he is just unwilling to be honest with her about his feelings, causing her to run to Josh. Greg is an archetype. He is the guy in the two star movie that the lead female character is supposed to be with but doesn't view as a romantic option until the end of the movie. She's supposed to realize the guy she is with is an asshole or in some other way unsuitable, and then realize her true love was under her nose all the time. But what that fails to take into account is that Greg treats Rebecca genuinely horribly in most of their encounters. Rebecca easily distracts with her own outlandish behavior (and thoughts), that Greg just slips so comfortably into the idea of who she should be with... regardless of the fact that his own flaws make him completely unsuited to be in a relationship with her. Josh's ability throughout season one to simply affirm Rebecca's worth (at the end of the Party Bus trip or at summer camp) is what Rebecca truly needs. No one hates Rebecca as much as she hates herself ("You Stupid Bitch"), and what she needs is someone to heal her, not constantly put her in that mental state.

[@QueenAnneBoleyn6]

thanatos101b I agree with most of this, but I would argue that Josh isn't what she needs either, because he doesn't see her either. He's not judgemental like Greg, but he's too happy go lucky and frankly not smart enough for him to be a partner to Rebecca. She can't be in a relationship until she sorts out her mental health.

[@jayt3386]

thanatos101b so basically, rebecca and nathaniel should have babies

[@elizabethbennet4791]

Actually I think this show is genius at really uncovering what "crazy" means anyway, as the creators call it, "deconstructing crazy". The outward signs of "craziness" are there and can easily overshadow some of the more dysfunctional types of "crazy" that men exhibit, because women are more emotionally expressive than men. They can be so cringeworthy and obvious that the others near them can seem healthy by comparison. The "crazy" can take a life of its own. Often these behaviors are simply a cry for help or desire to release for pain, and are often healthier than bottling them up and never addressing them. Ironically, Greg reminds me a lot of this douchebag I dated. I met him while I was in a very unhinged and unhappy place in my life, and sure enough, he fed off my "crazy" i.e. dysfunction. He got to feel strong and healthy by comparison and like everyone else in his life, he had no problem reminding us and himself how much healthier he was. When really he was incredibly self-righteous and self-focused. Oh he was so good at playing the part of the Nice Guy, the man victimized by women, etc etc, but it was easy to see shortly why he irritated people so much, namely, being pompous, smug, narcissistic and passive-aggressive.

[@kitthomas7965]

More a reply to the concept than the specific comment so far after the fact, but Rebecca ditching Greg for Vegan guy isn't really acceptable behavior, for a few reasons the show actually illustrates very well: 1) Generally, it's rude to ditch a date via a deceptive text to have sex with someone you just met. Rebecca can totally pick up a guy at a festival, but she did it IN THE MIDDLE OF A DATE. It seems unfair to think that Greg wasn't going to be upset about that. Especially since he's already insecure about Rebecca only using him until Josh is available. Coming to her house was certainly uncomfortable, but its also something every character in the series does (Rebecca repeatedly shows up at houses, Paula tracks Rebecca down at the party, Josh storms into Rebecca's house several times about her relationship with Valencia), so it's not GOOD, but its a shared flaw. 2) She didn't ditch Greg when he was being an asshole. She ditched Greg after they had a pretty reasonable conversation and she sang about giving up the fantasy of Josh. She had a choice (to leave the fantasy of Josh for a guy she might have a real relationship with), and she ran away from it. That's why she kicks Vegan out immediately: she wasn't actually looking for someone who understood her, she just wanted quick sex to avoid her real problems, and the Vegan seemed up for it and sympathetic. 2) It's a direct call-back to the beginning of the episode: she could deal with her feelings, or avoid them with a no-strings-attached hookup to distract herself. Heather says it herself: that behavior is impulsive and unwise. That time, Rebecca decided to be healthier (mostly in ways that still didn't confront her real problems). At the Festival, she's faced with a similar choice: try a real relationship with Greg as the (supposedly) healthier choice, or get a taco/have anonymous sex with Vegan. That time, she gave in to quick sex, lied to Greg, and looked miserable as soon as the Vegan got out of bed. She KNOWS its a bad choice, but it was escape route. Don't get me wrong, Greg isn't a good alternative for Rebecca. Greg's judgmental, petulant, and aloof of behavior is bad for Rebecca; Rebecca's fickle behavior, manipulation, and fantastical expectations are toxic for Greg. When Greg tries to understand or "accept" Rebecca (at the party, when she fights with Valencia, apologizing at the Festival, when he sees the window shattered), she rejects him, and/or it turns out she's only interested in him because she wants to get to Josh or Josh has rejected her. When he tries to distance himself, the people around him continually push him to try again, even when he says it's a terrible idea. All of this feeds Greg's fear of abandonment and commitment, while he's a snarky asshole to Rebecca, until they're both so suspicious and wary of a real relationship that they destroy it. Greg is a drunken ass and falls into his insecurities about Josh, but decides to try and better himself...only to find that Rebecca immediately went back to the fairy tale of Josh, just as he always feared. And when he decides to leave, Rebecca once again tries to convince him to stay, after Josh isn't available and she decides the signs pointed to Greg. Greg needed to leave, for both of their sakes, and is an excellent subversion of the Best Friend All Along trope, but not because he alone is a bad person--he and Rebecca are flawed in incompatible ways, and can't heal while they're together

[@Huntersthomphson]

thanatos101b Sweetie your overanalyzing a show with "FICTIONAL" people again. This comment was way to long get a life jesus.

[@berrakguven7719]

I'm just really glad your channel exists and you make these videos. This one broke my heart but it also helped me make sense of Greg's departure, which was something I had been thinking/theorizing about since his last song.

[@eciyk]

Greg Serrano is sooo similar to Nick Miller from New Girl

[@loreensmermaid]

Exactly!!!!!!!!!

[@rainwhite1642]

I feel like they were equally toxic for each other. Greg was mean to her, yes. But Rebecca was also passive-agressive towards him, and his fears and insecurities about her using him until Josh was available were nearly always justified. Their flaws played off each other, and it just bacame a toxic cycle.

[@bambida1st]

I would love to see this video revisited with the addition of season 4

[@AngyBangyyy]

This is great, Bagels! It feels like going back to school again studying film & tv! Look forward to more episodes

[@melissaberges702]

Greg was the real thing, a type of relationship viewers could actually relate and remember.

[@gingermofo]

"it's a lot more nuanced than that." Nice.

[@jopiagalis]

I only recently got into the show and I am loving your in depth analyses! Thank you for putting in that time and effort and thought into these. They are so insightful and touch on a lot of complexities related to characters and scenarios and storytelling and it’s really fascinating

[@MonRuiz26]

I love your videos so much, I literally started dancing when I saw you've uploaded this.

[@nicolejordan5977]

I just love Santino Fontana so much that I'd always want him back he's what drew me into the show and I admittedly am bias to him however logically I agree that I'm not sure Rebecca should be with anyone and although I'm very curious to see her have a healthy relationship in the series I'm not sure she can

[@ingridw3900]

Nicole Tichner I'd at least forgive the situation if they would talk about him. It seems so artificial. there was no mourning at all.

[@theeleanorshellstrop]

I love your use of media studies and the deeper analysis of Greg’s character and realizations in this!

[@cottonswab2131]

Only 3 minutes in and I can't get over how well done this is!!! SO MUCH RESPECT

[@Hobocrazy545]

UGH YOU'RE SO SMART I LOVE THIS THANK YOU FOR PUTTING WORDS TO THINGS I'D NEVER BE ABLE TO SAY

[@birdsfallsilent]

God this is great, thank you SO much for making and sharing this with us! So fascinating, I can't wait to rewatch it with this deeper consideration

[@samstarba4569]

Not related to Grebecca but... Have anyone else noticed that, despite a few obvious differences (age and ethnicity being the most striking ones), Josh and Rebecca's dad are quite similar to each other? They both have a rather relaxed and warm exterior and seem to have no problems with hanging around people but also tend to avoid responsibilities, be detached (without seeming aloof), and lean on others on issues such as money or job? I even see some similarities between their facial expressions and such. That could explain why Rebecca seems to regress into the level of a 10-year-old when hanging around with Josh. She was quite different (more reasonable and adult-like) when she was hanging around with Greg. (Don't know about Rebecca-Nathaniel dynamic since I haven't been able to watch the third season.)

[@leyich]

I love this analysis. I agree with you re the end being Rebecca happy and single. And I don't know how ppl could think Greg would be endgame when he himself sings 'We can't undo, can't make amends, dysfunction is our lingua franca. We can't unscrew each other's friends, we are Jerry Springer, not Casblanca.' Even if we ignore all of their multitude of issues combined and how their unhealthy coping mechanisms are highly incompatible (even if they are emotionally compatible, which I'd say they are, their coping mechanisms are POISON for one another), Greg himself admits there's too much toxicity, too much emotional baggage for them to EVER work out as a couple. Plus I don't think the fandom realises how DESTRUCTIVE their relationship was for Greg. Sure, it had been unhealthy for Rebecca too, don't get me wrong, Greg passively enabled her codependency and her using romance as escapism and he was emotionally violent with her (even if unintentionally), but Rebecca, like you said, was his rock bottom in human form. She destroyed him emotionally and had he stayed, he'd never be able to remain sober and she would have just destroyed him completely, and he'd only harm her, too, bc then she'd be focused on romance rather than therapy and would get hurt when he'd retreat to emotional withdrawal as his coping mechanism. I do think though that the majority of fans miss his character rather than his relationship with Rebecca. He was the best male vocalist and his entire character hit way too close to home for me, esp. his depression and mommy issues, plus I myself had a Rebecca in my life I had to escape for mutual benefit too so, I could really relate. Ngl, up until 3.04 I hoped we'd see him again, not together with Rebecca (bc again, too toxic for both, not realistic, not gonna happen and besides the point of the show) but just as a character, and my ideal for them was just to be friends after they are better and have spent a time apart, but after 3.04, I just hope he stays in Atlanta and never interacts with Rebecca again. Which was the point, I guess. Now I'm happy we will never see him again, no matter how much I miss the character and Santino's vocals. ...I had a point when I started writing this comment, but I forgot what I wanted to say. Sorry. I just hope the fans let go already and stop harassing the poor cast and crew, damn it.

[@BetweenGraces]

this youtube channel makes me so happy.

[@cbanders3625]

I would LOVE and super appreciate your thoughts on the Christmas Eve Eve dinner with Greg and Heather VS the Bar Mitzvah with Rebecca and Josh. For me, they are very parallel while also different in their own way.

[@elsagreen1476]

What a great analysis! I'd have to rewatch it and think about it some more. I have a lot of thoughts about their relationship. I've just binged the first 1 and a half seasons in 3 days, but, here they are. To me Greg is the antithesis of the fantasy that is Josh. He sees Rebecca, truly sees her, and she sees him as a real person. They call each other out, and even though it comes out as critical and even cruel on Greg's part, it's something that, with time and improvement, could turn into constructive support. Pushing each other to be the best they can be while still accepting each other as they are. But yes, they were, in many ways, toxic to each other. It's fascinating because as much as Greg is a catalyst for the deconstruction of Rebecca's fantasies, she's the catalyst for Greg to face his issues head on and make changes. They had real chemistry, one that I don't think is necessarily rooted in shared trauma. Part of it is, and why not? It doesn't mean their relationship wouldn't work once they recover - if one ever truly recovers. They're not keeping each other locked in toxic patterns either. But they get along. They enjoy being weird together. They feel comfortable around each other, like they don't have to wear a mask - that is, until Greg's insecurities and Rebecca's high expectations kick in and they ruin everything. Ultimately their main problem was a lack of communication. And it makes me angry, because it's so easy to fix. But I like what you said about sex being the easiest way to have something and still avoid their feelings. Ultimately, they were both cowards (but mainly Greg. Step up, man!!) Greg has taken the first step towards fixing his issues, alcoholism being the symptom more than the disease. He's getting better with emotions, with communication, he's going after what he wants. His arc is over, and no matter how beautiful the hanging closure of his last song was, it doesn't necessarily means he comes back, though I would like him to. Once Rebecca fixes her own - mainly, her tendency to define herself by the men in her life -, I believe they may find their way back to each other, hopefully far away from West Covina.

[@ObaREX]

Bravo, dude. I'll be honest, in my head I know the show is brilliant for tying up Greg's character as well as they did. That said, he was my favorite character. I knew his relationship with Rebecca wouldn't work out but a small part of me did want them to be the end game. But the show isn't about those fantasies. At least, not really. I actually thought I would stop watching the show after Greg left, but luckily his departure was in the middle of an episode so I kept watching.

[@alyssasongveera7431]

Can't believe i just found your channel! Great analysis

[@julialkk]

i keep coming back to this video, it's a masterpiece

[@pizzabam769]

Since Netflix deleted CEXG and thereby deleted my heart I can only get my happiness from your videos. Thank you!

[@Lolicanthe]

Just discovered your channel and I'm kinda wowed by the content and the analysis ! I'm huge fan of this show for all the layers it contains and I'm so glad to have discovered someone that so clearly goes deeply into it ! Thanks =^.^=

[@WizWiteKnight]

Watching this two years later... You nailed it. You guessed the ending of the show! Well done! (Also yes, it was always meant to be Greg)

[@illtardisyourdoctor]

I've been listening to Greg's songs a lot this last week and this keeps popping up in my suggested and I'm finally giving in and watching it

[@illtardisyourdoctor]

my thoughts before watching this that stayed in tact after watching this: okay so I personally don't believe Greg was meant to be end game for Rebecca. I think Rebecca's journey is to learn to see the world more realistically and to hold herself accountable for her own wrongdoings and mishaps. I agree that, while Greg leaving is sad, it was neatly wrapped up and tied off and there's nothing really leaving us wanting (-except for maybe watching his own self discovery become realised, but that's just because I love him as a character and I want to SEE him happy and not just know that he is-) I would have liked to see Rebecca and Greg work out, but I don't think it was supposed to happen. I don't think it was supposed to be Greg, I don't think it was supposed to be Josh and I don't think it's going to be Nathaniel either.

[@hopetherespudding]

This video was incredibly well put together and insightful 💜

[@vainpiers]

I kinda hope that crazy exgirlfriend ends with Rebecca and Greg meeting again and leaving what happens next ambiguous. Do they let the moment pass? do they talk and reminisce? or something more.

[@murnshaw]

It seems like your argument against Greg being the endgame is simply, he's not good enough for Rebecca Bunch. This is fair, for all of the reasons you have listed. But a big part of Greg's narrative, and Rebecca's narrative involving Greg, is self improvement. It's no coincidence that when Becs chooses Greg, it is when she decides to strive to be better. And Greg, when presented between the choice of his love for Becs and the opportunity to improve himself, chooses to leave to improve himself. If you look at their dynamic through this lens, you see that they are never intended to get together in their current state. They are meant to end up together after a long bout of self-discovery and self-improvement. It is interesting, isn't it, that after Greg leaves, we see that Becs is also presented with the same dilemma that Greg has? And she decides to choose love instead of self improvement, despite getting super close to the epiphany that the right choice is to fix herself, emotionally and mentally. It's almost as if she is subconsciously rejecting Greg because he does not choose her. Thank you for pointing out how the decision for Becs to not be held accountable for her actions robs her character of agency. That is a big part of why the season 2 finale is so distasteful for me. The season 2 theme song plays this phrase off as a self-depreciating wink at the audience, but we find out as the season climaxes that no, it actually means what it says seriously. It's not Becs' fault that she betrays Valencia for Josh; she has mental problems. It's not Becs' fault that she kisses Nathaniel; That's because of the Santa Ana winds. And it's definitely not Becs' fault that she pushes up the wedding for her doomed-to-fail relationship with Josh because she's trying to compensate for a mistake that she is absolutely not responsible for making. If you're going to have your protagonist make these kinds of unpopular decisions, the least you can do is make her own them, a-la It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia or Archer. Because then you at least play into the power fantasy, which is something that Crazy Ex-girlfriend did super well in season one. The more I think about the season two finale, the more it feels like a super villain origin story. The smart, capable, socially awkward lawyer who has been pushed into the dirt too many times by the world now vows revenge against it, one ex-boyfriend at a time. Not going to lie, I would totally watch that show, if the writers decide to double down on Rebecca Bunch's lack of remorse.

[@murnshaw]

Yes, any objective viewer of the show can tell that Rebecca Bunch is a selfish character who very often hurt the people close to her for her own gain. My issue isn't with the character but with the show's decision to portray her as a passive participant for several major plot points during season 2. For example, the kiss with Nathaniel is explained as the fault of the Santa Ana Winds exerting its will over Becs - "You're going to kiss your crush because I am making you" when we all know the reality is more "You're going to act on your crush and use me as an excuse." This robs Rebecca Bunch of agency in her decision to kiss Nathaniel, and makes her a passive participant in the story of her life. Something similar happens in the season finale - Josh unilaterally decides the wedding is off and Becs doesn't even put up a fight; The Rebecca Bunch we root for would have shown up at the ministry and try to gaslight Josh into changing his mind. If/When Josh still declines to marry and Becs vows revenge, that would have been a great character development moment. Instead, we get kind of a whiny passive whimper and an unearned vow for vengeance from a "victim of circumstance". All of these writing decisions make Rebecca a weaker character by excusing her behavior in a way that is unconvincing to the viewers. Like I said, we know she's bad news, and that she's trying to become better. Don't tell us Becs can't help it when bad things happen to her when she's the cause of most of those bad things and don't put her in a corner and expect us to believe she would just huddle there and cry; Rebecca Bunch is not a huddler and a cryer; It is a disservice to portray her in that way. If she's going to make a bad decision, let her own it and trust your viewers to stay invested.

[@juliaeverose]

Chung Hsiao You should really watch season 3 then lol

[@ahumanbeingfromtheearth1502]

@@murnshaw i feel youve massively missed the point here. The show isnt explaining her actions as being a result of the santa anna winds; rebecca is. The show isnt claiming rebecca betraying Valencia is not her fault; rebecca is. The show isnt claiming that the failure of the wedding is all on josh; rebecca is. The show very clearly doesn't expect you to agree with rebecca on these things (especially not after season 3) its simply portraying that as how she rationalises her actions.

[@murnshaw]

@@ahumanbeingfromtheearth1502 I didn't watch anything past season 2 but I can see your point - there is a lot of evidence that the show is told from the perspective of an unreliable narrator. But I would argue that since there are no lasting consequences to Becs' actions from a narrative standpoint the writers are enabling their character's bad behavior. The people Rebecca hurts keep forgiving her without condition and that says more about the writing than it does the character.

[@jessicaharkley5286]

@@murnshaw the last season actually addresses all of this. Recommend finishing it

[@susanruda]

This is an in depth and wonderful analysis. I'm impressed. Kudos, and thank you.

[@BagelsAfterMidnight]

Thank you for watching!

[@chuckm1961]

To answer the post title, no. It was “supposed to be” what it was. The story of a woman who needs to find her self before she can find a mate.

[@MoherowaSmerfetka]

Than you so much for this video. I needed that closure to the story of Greg.

[@BagelsAfterMidnight]

Thank you -- I'm very glad to hear that!

[@raven_zoe]

I can't WAIT to see what you have to say about them bringing Greg back but played by a different actor. Maybe, in fact, Greg IS the one after all!

[@megano.4261]

I just rewatched season 1 and noticed that in the episode you reference, where Rebecca wants to "make healthier choices" she wonders out loud if she should date "someone older, like a professor" - like Robert?! Like Chekhov's Gun. This show blows my mind, it's so good.

[@marysmith5003]

Then later she sleeps with Greg's dad! Talk about how older is so not a healthier choice.

[@samstarba4569]

I guess women tend to associate older men with safety and security, and thus view them as a "healthier" choice. If only world worked that way...

[@withalittlehelpfrom3]

I’m here from the future, and can tell you: No. No, he wasn’t. But also, that’s a fair assumption based on what they gave us, even in Season 4.

[@rimaabisamra6233]

This went a lot deeper than I expected!

[@allsingersme]

Lol the post you added near the end was written by a friend and read over by me

[@zombiemolly9711]

Greg... I want Greg to return.....

[@einsame_Maria]

I love this video, agree with everything... Except one thing. I don't think Greg's leaving should make the viewer think that emotional violence can be justified or that maybe we left someone like Rebecca and hey it was for the good. No. It was to show that two people with problems annot be happy together. They first need to heal. Gregs needs to deal with his addiction and move on with his life, go get that dream of his and Rebecca needs to learn that other people cannot make her happy unless she is able to be happy by herself. Because that idea that "only if this one stays" then she'll be happy is the driving force of all the disaster in her life. Greg had to leave because they wouldn't be happy either way, they are too damaged. And this brilliant show is trying to break that awful tradition of romantisizing unhealthy relationships on TV I still have this idea in my mind that they will probably bring Greg back when Santino is avaliable again. Or mayb even just for the series finale. Because his story is not complete, it doesn't feel like it's complete. Especially given how Greg and Rebecca got together right before the season 1 finale. Which is probably was when they still didn't know whether the show was renewed or cancelled. So they were wrapping up their story. And broke then apart for the second season. And so on. Again, I think Greg needs to heal and as he had to leave WC, he's doing it off screen. And Rebecca needs to heal and become a functioning person before she gets into a relationship that could last and not traumatize her further

[@JulianneHannes]

I just realized that Greg is suppose to be a play on John Cusack and his iconic characters in Say Anything and High Fidelity who are Crazy Ex Boyfriends who are "adorably obsessed"

[@shannonkahermanes6080]

Great video! I love Greg and I miss him on the show... but I know it's just something that wouldn't work out.

[@SuperBradley01]

great review!

[@Faye_Reloaded]

Excellent analysis!

[@abjaaksm]

this is especially good to watch after tonight's episode haha

[@shivalipradhan9186]

i love greg character.....hope to see him back. They connect beautifully in season 1. Their chemistry connects the audience.

[@goldilocksclyq2994]

thank you again..... some things are bugging my mind but i can never put it in words like you did.....

[@martabaski8967]

what's your move now, @bagels after at midnight

[@gabrielab2473]

At the time they met, yes, they had a connection, but also they were going through stuff and that took a toll on their relationship. Like in real life, just because you like/love each other, it doesn´t mean you are "mean to be" or "have to end up together". They were a part of each other´s journey, period. As much as we love Greg, they just weren´t ready to be involved. Their unresolved issues were bigger. Still maybe later on things could´ve worked out. On the other hand, I prefer Nathaniel over Josh... I feel like unlike the rest of guys, he saw Rebbeca at her best and at her worst and still decided to stay. He didn´t run away, he didn´t judge her. Moreover, they helped each other somehow. That´s something you don´t get everyday. Someone who thinks you are a ray of sunshine even when you are obviously your worst enemy. No character was "perfect" but it was nice to see that above everything, Rebecca´s wellbeing was way more important than who she should have end up with.

[@zyxwut321]

Do you do analysis on other shows as well? Are there other channels? I'd be fascinated to see your analysis of shows like "Mad Men", "Sopranos", "The Wire", "Breaking Bad" and other new classic shows from our recent "golden age of television". :)

[@Caitlin12221]

I've recently finished Crazy ex-girlfriend and though I know Rebecca didn't technically end up with Greg it was hinted in the last episode that she totally might. And quite frankly, I hate them together. Their relationship has always been portrayed as "lesser than" all of the other Rebecca's love interests. And even when they forced the idea of them getting back together in season 4, one of their very first dates ended up being a complete disaster and opened up a way for Rebecca to get back to all her unhealthy behaviors. Yes, the song that the "new Greg" sang to her was super cute, but they were not compatible at all - hence the huge outburst. Greg has always been really bitter while Rebecca overall is a pretty joyful person that gets excited over small things at heart. They eventually could end up just triggering one another. I don't think they're "meant to be" just because Rebecca has bpd and Greg is an alcoholic, so therefore they both have "darkness" within them. I don't think Rebecca deserves that and it's not fair to her. Their relationship has never been healthy, not even once, unlike with Nathaniel who clearly ended up being a better person thanks to her (and never backed away from it even when she didn't want him), and even Josh - because ever since they moved in together as roommies he's been nothing but sweet to her and their personalities actually do click.

[@tindrajohansson8916]

Yes! This is exactly how I'm thinking as well. Sure Greg has his good sites and made her happy, but he is way too sarcastic and dark for her. She needs someone who is more joyful and doesn't think she is embarrassing. I love this show, but every time I watch it I have to skip Jaymes wedding episode because Greg is too greggy..

[@ric-oco655]

The series already ended but I still want her to end up with Greg

[@victorym744]

I am watching this after the latest episode and I am shook. Are you updating soon? PLEASE TELL ME YOU WILL UPDATE SOON I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO FEEL

[@sebasallcool5]

I was sad at first about Greg's departure, the season took a big hit after he left but if Greg was still around the amazing last episodes from season 2 wouldn't happen and season 3 would be so different.

[@lilims123]

A while ago I read an article where some guy ran into Santino and his wife at a restaurant in NY. I can't remember the specifics, but basically he didn't like being away from his wife so I don't think he would want to return.

[@varoot]

I've been listening to the songs from the show recently and realized how much potential Greg and Rebecca would be. I kinda get why they pulled him out of the show though. I felt the show wouldn't progress much with Greg. I hope they save him for the end where he just comes back and still in love with her.

[@rena8262]

hey does anyone know where to find the video where rachel bloom talks about not having any boundaries?

[@absieb]

This is interesting in the light of Greg's return

[@20karisan]

This is like reading an Lacan's essay piece after he suffers a concision.

[@maebhmaverick1969]

Love these reviews, any plans to do other shows?

[@BagelsAfterMidnight]

Every now and again, but CXG will remain the focus

[@LilyN2099]

i loved greg and it hurt when he left, but i DEFINITELY understand why he left and saw that their relationship just was not healthy at all for either of them

[@whimsicallymad7580]

"There's no loose thread here, just sadness" - The story of my life

[@ashsweet]

I was soooooo critical of Greg through the show. I just feel like I know his type, and its probably a huge loss that I personally never was able to empathize with him. he never goes beyond a caricature for me for some reason. probably my own tendencies to mistrust the 'relatable sarcastic cool guy' archetype.

[@gabrielalemes5351]

Long text, beware Greg's leaving was painfully beautiful, and I miss him a lot, really. I still hope him to get back, even if probably won't happen. But I guess we truly miss Santino. He was the best male singer in the show, his acting was awesome, and that really makes a difference. After some reflection, I realized Greg history ended in the best way possible. He was resented of his mom, who leaves the town, him and his father. He has the same urge to get out of West Covina, but can't do the same, although his father gets fine eventually, and can take care of himself. Probably, that was what make him turn into a alcoholic. Sure, working in a bar didn't help at all. They take the real world fact of Santino signing one season in the show, and gave Greg closure. After make up with his mother, and make sure his father was ok, the only thing that was holding him up was Rebecca. And that's why I think it was the best decision from both to leave. Because, neither of them was fine, and will make the same mistakes Rebecca made with Josh, thinking love was the answer to all their problems, when both need more help. They truly loved and understand each other, but in the moment things get complicated, Rebecca would turn to her obsession with Josh, and Greg to the alcohol. He still will wanted to go to college, and she to get married. Greg and Josh would lose their friendship for good, fighting for the attention of Rebecca Also, Nathaniel's coming could afect in this relationship, insted of what happened with Josh. So much more could go wrong, and they already suffered in the first season. So, even if it feels hurtful, and we wanted more, it was the best for them.

[@ellen8005]

I can't actually fault any of your points. They are very insightful and even provoked some rethinking on my part regarding the character. What I mainly agree with is that if Greg does return (and I really want him to as he is and will always be my favourite character) he will have a new role to play. Maybe as a reflection for Rebecca to see what change can do. To see what independent or being happy within yourself looks like. I would love to see Greg and Rebecca reunite romantically. But in a way that does not diminish the growth of either character. And if that is impossible than I will just have to deal with that fact and the broken heart that comes with it. Plus there are always fanfics to soothe me.

[@sallyk1937]

Spoiler for end of show! . . . I have been replaying your videos since the show ended because I miss Crazy Ex a lot already. But wow, way to predict the very end of the entire show!

[@ambercotrone]

This was a great essay 🙌Instant sub 😊

[@duck6100]

greg and rebecca were just in a bagel shop (possibly) after midnight i can't guys i can't

[@El1society]

Greg will definitely be endgame. The other two dates were fairytale dates while Greg’s ‘date’ felt more natural and like they’re an old married couple