The Cool Youth Pastor Problem | Belief It Or Not

[@cplus14]

"You know who else was a rebel, fellow youths? Jesus! And what does this rebel want you to do? BLINDLY SUBMIT TO AUTHORITY"

[@dinosaysrawr]

"Rebel against THE WORLD by voting a straight Republican ticket and doing everything we tell you to!"

[@Tee_34]

Lesson Learned: Not all rebels love freedom.

[@nuttysquirrel8816]

😆😂🤣

[@paulmichael7194]

Castro, Lennon and Hitler were all rebels too! 😂 Edit: I meant Vladimir Lenin. I left this because the responses where funny.

[@Cheznrice]

Lol

[@stringcheeseofficial1977]

“How small is your god if science can defeat him” sounds like a line from a video game cutscene leading into the climactic boss fight but it actually came from an ex-evangelical exasperatedly dunking on a creepy youth pastor. I love the internet

[@LooseDeuce]

IKR!

[@alpacamaster5992]

Sounds like a line out of metal gear solid

[@Aaron-mj9ie]

Basically my entire adolescence was a JRPG which ended in my and the party defeating god.

[@mattkuhn6634]

God of the Gaps is a real thing

[@turboguppy3748]

Puny god...

[@vintagearisen]

Can we talk about the weird ass side effect of having someone who was SO IMPORTANT in your life when you were in middle and high school not giving a rat's ass about you when you become an adult? This was something that happened to me, my youth pastor was someone I really loved and looked up to, he was the third most influential adult in my life after my parents. I grew up, graduated college, moved away. Dude didn't come to my wedding (didn't even send a card or a "sorry I couldn't make it" message), and when I went back to visit a few years ago didn't seem interested in talking to me or catching up with me. Broke my fucking heart. But why would he? He was paid to pretend to care about me when I was a teen. I became an adult and he wasn't being paid to pretend to care anymore.

[@leslieyancey5084]

Damn…that is heartbreaking! 😞

[@scottgoodson1847]

Really sorry to hear about that. I try to maintain at least social-media links with my old students, as I suffered something similar when my old youth pastor moved to Florida; I would send him emails and get ghosted. When I became an adult, I facebook friended and deleted him in short order when it became apparent his beliefs had taken a hard-right white nationalist turn. Course sometimes, it is not the youth pastor's fault because church boards do dumb things like put youth pastors who take a position at a different church under gag-orders to not talk about things with former students for fear of the church looking bad.

[@phillipinek1856]

That happened to me too. My youth pastors would always tell us we could call them whenever we need them. One in particular I felt very close to, she was also like a parent figure to me. Her opinion really mattered to me. When I moved for college, she never really called to ask me how I was doing. The relationship we had went to dust. I really needed someone back then. I was in a new environment and missing home. But she was just doing her job I guess and I wasn’t her responsibility anymore. What I didn’t like about youth was the false close relationships we had when really it was just a ploy to get you to join the church. Evangelism is a scam.

[@venusindior2787]

Sooo true. They're like "oh well the hot time for indoctrination/friendship bombing is up"

[@justachonkyspider]

I know the feeling too. It really sucks. They build you up for years and then once they've fulfilled their goal they forget you exist. 😔 I always wanted them to notice me....but I was generally a "good kid" so the really popular youth pastors never wasted time on me. One even called me "a judgmental little p****" which was kinda true....but it still hurt my feelings. I got the shunning from my "Christian" friends later in life after I left....most of them stopped talking to me since I left the church only one guy still makes an effort to hangout.....and that's out of over 20+ people.....I lost a whole community. I guess what I'm trying to say is don't feel too bad because you're not alone. This is an opportunity to make more genuine friends that love us for who we are.

[@howelldavis8949]

I think I may have had the only non-creepy, kind and caring youth pastor ever. He didn’t follow trends, never acted inappropriately and actually cared about all of us. I mean I still deconstructed but I saw him a few years ago and the way his face lit up as he recognized me made me so happy. He didn’t try to proselytize me, just asked if I was doing ok and happy

[@SeanStrife]

I feel like if more youth pastors were like him, Christianity might have a better reputation.

[@llynxfyremusic]

My youth pastor is also great! She taught me a lot of the things I see atheists say now that I'm older. She explained how you should consider historical context when reading the bible and to not treat it as a rulebook. She respected that I had little interest in becoming a Christian and didn'ttry to convert me. She just wanted to share what she knew :) (I did consider it for a brief time but decided against it)

[@grubgobbler3917]

My youth pastor was literally the only reason I stayed in church as long as I did. When I was like 10 I stopped caring about Christianity, and at about 13 my parents would have let me stop going. But I kept going for about 3 years, just for this one guy. Didn't believe in God or anything but he was just a good teacher of philosophy and life stuff. I left the church when he did and never looked back. He would have been a great college professor honestly.

[@iliketowatch.]

These are great stories. It sounds like these "youth pastors" would have made great therapists or school counselors. Most kids can use the advice of a guidance counselor (in addition to what they learn at home). As a parent, I can say that it takes a certain amount of humility to admit that you don't know it all and to agree to having your kids get advice elsewhere (teachers, counselors, coaches, therapists, etc.) I can attest that my kids benefited from guidance from others. They are on the road to exceeding what that we, their parents, achieved and isn't that what the American Dream is all about?

[@Caelinus]

I have one youth pastor who was a huge nerd, and had a hard time connecting to people or speaking in public or selling the youth group. He was single, which was a problem for the church, and terrible at putting himself out there. But he was a great guy who did a really good job with the 20 of us. The one who replaced him was a dynamic, charismatic and driven individual who ballooned the youth group to 5 times its original size, and even did a lot of actual pastoral work. He was married, was an ex-missionary, and had 3 kids. His wife had cancer and he stuck by her throughout. People loved him. Until he ran away with one of the girls in the youth group the moment she became legal. So I ended up seeing both extremes there. I truly think that the original guy would have made a really good children's counselor, or anything that did not force him to do several hour long speeches a week. He was amazing one on one or in small groups. The other was just obsessed with being the cool guy, and using it to his advantage.

[@emilykestrel5446]

I used to work with a lady whose husband was a youth pastor. He went to jail for having sex with an teenage girl in his church. While his wife was pregnant. He got caught because he was also sexting another girl and when she told her friend (the first victim) about it, they reported him. So… my coworker not only stood by this sleaze, she blamed the girls for “tempting” him, and also said the police, judge, media who reported it obviously were “anti-Christian.” But also his going to jail was “God’s plan” so he could proselytize to the other inmates. I wish I was making this up…but sadly it’s all true.

[@callusklaus2413]

I was tempted to make some stupid joke about mental gymnastics, but my blood just ran cold. This woman has been manipulated by her community, had her family destroyed by an ideology that cannot be dislodged by anything outside of her own mind.

[@TheTruthKiwi]

Damn that's tragic af for all involved, especially the manipulated minor and wife.

[@transmascswag]

This doesn't make any of that ghoulish tragedy any better, but she knows. On some level, I really think she knows. All the stuff she said was just a kind of pathetic attempt to cope with reality.

[@Breakdowns04]

Even as a believer, that makes me sick.

[@breezybee777]

​@@transmascswagwhat do you mean? Like I don't know anything about this story so do you know more?

[@Neyebureturns]

You teach kids about homosexuality or other ways of living and they accused you of grooming. But they see all THIS as normal

[@UlexiteTVStoneLexite]

Lol yeah

[@ararepotato1420]

Self awareness isn't something these kind of people are very good at.

[@none11flop9]

@@ararepotato1420 ironic.

[@PedroHCF37]

@@none11flop9 just like vince

[@Amigo21189]

I've come to the conclusion that we're dealing with a group that views morality as a matter of _who does it_ rather than what is done.

[@crystalrose043]

As a daycare worker, the "one on one relationships with kids" is such a red flag. One of the biggest red flags for grooming we are taught is an adult spending time with one specific kid or gift giving, etc (favoritism) and interacting outside of daycare/work

[@crystalrose043]

And, of course, being alone with a child is a HUGE red flag. There should never just be one adult and one kid, and if there is it NEEDS to be something out in the open, where other people could easily walk in/see.

[@renee8833]

Ding ding ding!

[@ButWhyMe...]

So does therapy fall under this...?

[@lunaangeleclipse9745]

@@ButWhyMe...The therapists I saw when I was underage never gave me gifts or favouritism/special treatment. Nor did they try to interact with me outside of their therapy services.

[@xletragedyx]

They were teaching and coaching the youth pastors to groom children

[@Dez861]

I'm a wheelchair user. I have been, and will be, for my entire life. When I attended church as a teenager, our youth pastor used to say this "fun" little catchphrase, urging the parents in our congregation: "Don't handicap your children to God." According to this guy, and this was his exact phrasing, it would be absolutely terrible for your child to use crutches, or a walker, or a wheelchair - all devices I use/used regularly to make my life easier - because they'd be unable to have a fulfilling life. Denying your children God, he said, was as terrible as placing them in a wheelchair .... needless to say, I wasn't this man's biggest fan, neither was my mother. For the record, I've still got the wheelchair but, I've since ditched God - strangely enough, I have a very fulfilling life.

[@StableGirl41]

Many people have done and said things, in a position that was “God-ordained” that was terribly wrong But just because that person believes what they’re saying is from God doesn’t mean that it was. Don’t see God through the perspective of what people have done What people have done don’t represent who God is

[@joeiechristiansantana9641]

@@StableGirl41 God hates everyone, ever wonder why people like me (satanists) look like we're winning?

[@alr.3137]

Could it be that you're lying to yourself?

[@acfkelly6291]

Omg. I'm so sorry. They prayed I would talk (not comparable), then regretted it. I asked too many questions

[@augustuslunasol10thapostle]

​​@@alr.3137 could it be you are full of it

[@tiffanyferg]

I sporadically attended one of the megachurches in this video as a kid / young teenager, big yikes! I primarily went just to socialize with my friends; any free food was also a big plus. Luckily I never got to know any of the youth pastors personally. One of my worst church memories was an all-night lock-in: one small group focused on modesty and the youth leaders told us - 12 year old girls!! - that we’d be responsible for making grown men think “bad thoughts” if we didn’t dress modestly. Even at that age I knew that was a horrible, deeply wrong thing to tell children. Disgusting!

[@advisorywarning]

I love your content💕

[@tc-tm1my]

Yeah most of the kids I went to church with only went to hang out with friends or get free food. Most left by the time they reached 18. And their parents were the most devout members. I considered becoming a youth minister when I graduated high school because I wanted to keep hanging out with friends at church. Luckily I became an atheist the next year and left religion behind.

[@spinecho609]

Woah The Tiffany Ferg! Good videos and good taste

[@marcomoreno6748]

WTF is a lock-in. It sounds incredibly suspicious, at best.

[@A_Spooky_Dude]

The whiplash between "hey some youth pastora have done some seriously fucked up things" and "minor spoilers for Spiderman No Way Home" in the intro had me laughing harder than I should've been

[@ginam830]

At A church I attended in the early 2000’s the married youth pastor impregnated a 14 yo girl. The church kicked the child out of the church and tried to cover up the pastor’s behavior. It was a big reason I started questioning the church.

[@gato8008]

That's just messed up. I hope she's doing somewhat okay now.

[@UlexiteTVStoneLexite]

Wow that is awful

[@phillipinek1856]

Gross

[@ararepotato1420]

A PDF file that needs to be thrown away.

[@cam4636]

@@ararepotato1420 That's the thing; in-groups will protect abusers rather than admit they allowed an abuser in their midst.

[@mitchellclark4377]

Not even a minute and a half in and we get "it's hard to tell from the mugshots". OOOF this is gonna be good.

[@mitchellclark4377]

I also love your pained appraisal of the youth group games...

[@mitchellclark4377]

Every time I hear them say 'students' I cringe a little inside.

[@politicamufu648]

was that Ludwig ?

[@themaninblack7503]

Lol

[@manicpixiedreamgoth1263]

Youth Pastor: "Send private messages and snaps to minors!" Me, a public school teacher: 😬😬😬 Seriously, though, communicating with kids on non-school-run platforms is a HUGE no-no under most educator codes of conduct and is a fireable offense in most districts. This + being alone with a kid in your office/classroom = 🚫🚫🚫. Such a weird dynamic in these churches between teenagers and adults.

[@maribethmorgan7886]

Isn’t it crazy how a lot of religious parents are calling public school teachers the groomers though when they’re ok with a fully grown man snapping their fourteen year old daughter? It blows my mind

[@jgroth3906]

You can't be alone with a kid in a classroom? So if a student wants to discuss their grade or something they aren't understanding they have to do so in front of everyone? I'm glad they didn't have those rules when I was in high school.

[@manicpixiedreamgoth1263]

@@jgroth3906 It's not advisable, no. Sometimes it is unavoidable but in that situation standard practice is to leave the door wide open and (if you can) have a colleague or admin be aware of the conversation. Most teachers also keep an unofficial "incident log" in case things come up later involving grades, discipline, etc., and will include one-on-one convos with students in that. It sounds incredibly paranoid, but it's for the protection of the student AND the teacher.

[@IATEALLTHECHEESE]

I mean, I have my flute teacher's phone number so she can text me updates on upcoming music events and lessons (she's this older lady who has no access to the school communication systems e.g. Microsoft Teams) so that's an exception, but yeah I agree.

[@hyperx72]

I didn't think there was a rule about not being left alone with students, since I've seen that (or at least something similar) happen where after class one could discuss like, grades or schoolwork and such.

[@hazeelise]

It has always creeped me out when young "cool" men are youth pastors... in the church where I grew up, a 40-year-old woman was the youth pastor, and she didn't try hard to seem cool and relatable to the kids. But they still liked her. It was just a less... creepily close relationship. I started seeing lots of cool young men as youth pastors when I was a teenager, and it made me feel icky and nervous, so I distanced myself from them.

[@serena841]

These "cool" men who work with kids have always freaked me out. For me, it was mostly teachers.

[@cosmicrais]

I could understand young men working at our Summer camp because it was a summer job and they were saving up for college or what have you. What was so icky were the grown men 30+ that had no reason to work a minimum wage part-time job caring for kids other than 'they liked it'

[@darkstarr984]

Yeah, somebody about the age of the kids’ parents and generally relaxed and willing to organize things and answer questions and listen are the youth pastors I met, they were both men and women, and genuinely caring people. They didn’t try to get close with any single kid but were just very kind and accessible to everyone there. I didn’t spend much time in these things but the “cool guy” youth pastors are pretty cringey at best.

[@knjparadise]

i visited a church with my friend a couple of times whose youth paster was a lady in her 50’s. she didn’t try to be cool, and she was so nice everyone loved her

[@Sumilidonuser]

Context; I grew up in a church, had a girlfriend at the time, and am bi. I had a youth pastor; he was kinda cringe, but nice enough, I'd call him a good friend at the time. We just did a yg meeting about *P R I D E* being a sin (yes that pride, my church never pulled punches) and I came out to him afterward just to see what he thought. I was long past disillusioned with the church at this point and just wanted a giggle. Man's came up to my girl after and said (I kid you not) "Thank you for being such a great influence on [him] and helping him through his feelings of HOMOSEXUALITY." BROTHER THAT SHIT HAD ME DYING FOR WEEKS.

[@darthandeddeu]

There was a youth group in town that as part of their conversation therapy placed lesbians and gay men together. They encouraged them to double date. I was working at a restaurant that had a semi private room that could be used if asked, ( semi as in there was 10 seats if not In use for a group with a " secret" door) They would swap seats once in the room.

[@yachishairclips2250]

The cringe of that sponsorship delivery is spot on!! Good job for potraying it right!! 💯

[@atrapdr6251]

I’m really tempted to buy one lmao

[@Chelaxim]

He needed to turn the chair around before sitting in it.

[@somewhat-blue]

I was gonna say, props for having a sponsorship I didn’t skip through. Very funny

[@mookinbabysealfurmittens]

Yes!

[@austinrutledge6484]

I couldn't fucking watch it it was so spot on

[@MrTreyblob33]

Since deconstructing I'm constantly blown away by how insane this stuff is and more blown away by how normal it seems when you're apart of it. That bottle rocket story made my jaw drop...

[@brokenrecord3095]

he seemed like he wasn't even embarrassed by being such an idiot...

[@Coolhandkelpy]

Same! I am shown the things that were told to me every Sunday, and I'm shook by them now, but back then I didn't even bat an eye...

[@monsignorerasmus.6441]

What would happen if he pulled that same shit at say, a youth camp for a country club?

[@thedudeamongmengs2051]

I went back to church once after not going for a few years and it was so weird. It was the same place with the same activities and the same people, but it felt completely different. It was like watching a magician from backstage

[@matthewgagnon9426]

Guy was basically *laughing* as he told the story of taking a kid's eye out with a bottle rocket. It's absolutely insane.

[@timothymulholland7905]

My youth pastor was hung up on sex. How “far” you could go on a date was a big theme. Tongue kissing was a problem. You had to be engaged to do “light petting” and married to do “heavy petting”, but he never explained the difference, so we worked it out for ourselves. Great fun.

[@irish_deconstruction]

?😳

[@dingdongism]

Your youth pastor obviously didn’t help very much with that “advice.” But oddly enough, it was advice, though poorly given. What happened to “pray on it?” the advice to look to god for guidance? I guess that only works when you are looking for a vague enough outcome that you could retroactively explain it as god “working in your life.” Ugh I’m glad I’m not in that world anymore.

[@petehjr1]

As it usually goes. Why there are so many more underage pregnancies in "gods country". "They'll figure it out"

[@probenfetchak8076]

You all must be talking about Tobey Maguire when Andrew Garfield called him a cool youth pastor

[@dellybird5394]

lol I'd like to see his biblical reasoning for why engagement meant you could do "light petting". Everyone loves a loophole. These rules are all so arbitrary, and the people hung up on them should not be around teens unsupervised. At least my upbringing involved pastors too squicked out by sex to go into details other than the standard "if you have sex you will die"

[@kylea.9830]

My youth pastor growing up was convicted of sexual assault of several minors in the middle of the year. The other youth pastor attemted to cover it up and faced no consequences from the church.

[@the_sky_is_blue_and_so_am_I]

My youth pastor acted like he cared about me tons. I gave church my all even though I'm suffering through religious trauma because of my Transness. Then he dropped the mask. It was only a sales pitch. It was a sales pitch. That hurt me so much. He was my friend, My mentor, someone that helped me so much with group activities. But also gave 3 homophobic services and his service gave me a panic attack. I'm so dumb.

[@maudernart5246]

You're not dumb, that pastor is dumb. Maybe I'm being reductive bc it sounds like he helped you and was maybe very socially intelligent in some areas. But the important thing is that YOU did nothing wrong, all you did was put your trust a person who ultimately failed you

[@Samtember]

Yeah please don't talk to yourself like that. You're not dumb, you were a kid who wanted to belong and be loved and have role models. And he exploited that. It hurts so much but we can't give them anymore power by blaming ourselves.

[@TheHookahSmokingCaterpillar]

No, you're not dumb, you just hadn't seen that side of him. He's the idiot, not you.

[@airacummins5076]

You arnt dumb you were manipulated,

[@LouLouLion]

No you're not. You were young and emotionally manipulated. You are not and were not dumb, and you found your way out.

[@femaleintrovert1173]

I never liked going to youth group. My social anxiety was horrible when I was a teenager. I preferred to be alone, then in social situations. I was also diagnosed with Asperger Syndrome. Anyway, the other teens didn’t like me. They didn’t like me because I was constantly on my phone in corner, or I was in another room, trying to get my energy back up again. I never listened to what the youth pastor said, it never interested me. Most of the kids that attended the youth group, were white, and homeschooled, so you guys could imagine what they thought when they saw a “anti-social” black girl. They ostracized one girl, because she wore shorts, that were too short. I thought they were cute, but she stopped attending the youth group fortunately. They also ostracized my brother, because he acted, “feminine”. When I was about 14-15 years old, my family stopped attending that church. My brother and I stopped attending the youth group, after a mentally unstable kid, said, “Death to Obama!”. There were also rumors going around saying that my brother and I didn’t have a father, because we are black. We told our dad, and he was furious. It also didn’t help with the fact, that my dad was an usher at that church. People sometimes wouldn’t even donate because they thought my dad, (my black dad) would steal the money. I started to identify as an atheist around that time. I’m glad I’m an atheist now.

[@justinwatson1510]

I am sorry for how most white people have failed at being decent human beings, and I'm even more sorry that it has negative consequences for you in any way. I hope that changes soon.

[@Giganfan2k1]

Wow

[@Callimo]

What in the hell? Were you all in a Lutheran church or something?

[@femaleintrovert1173]

@@justinwatson1510 even though I’m grateful, you don’t have to apologize for most white people. Regardless of race, sex, or gender, no one is perfect. I’ve moved on from their toxicity.

[@femaleintrovert1173]

@@Callimo the church is called, Christ Community Church. I don’t think they’re a Lutheran church.

[@deadchannel22]

Not a youth pastor specifically, but my teacher from my private Christian school. I am a trans man, which means I was assigned female at birth, so keep in mind I was technically "a girl" through this. He would constantly get me alone and give hugs that were just barely too intimate and a tad too long. The principal even caught him holding my hand once and blamed me for it lol. Totally wasn't coercion due to a power imbalance, nosiree. Luckily it didn't get any farther than that, but it easily could've. It still makes me super uncomfy to think about. Especially knowing that the other adults would never believe me. I was very comfortable with him at first. I opened up to him and told him very personal things. He was "the cool one". He played bass and video games. He told jokes and was super chill. Eventually as he got closer to me as I got older, I started to sense something was off. I couldn't tell what though. Not until I graduated and looked back on it. Now I feel super icky but I also feel lucky that it wasn't worse. Please always make sure the adults in your child's life are trustworthy. And know that your kids may not tell you they're uncomfortable with someone because they don't know they are. It can be really hard to recognize toxic situations at a young age. I also don't have the best relationship with my father so I used him a lot to help with my daddy issues, so that wasn't healthy either. There are so many things that can go wrong with someone that young having any kind of a personal relationship with someone that much older than them. It makes me sick that these kind of situations are not only perpetuated, but glorified and encouraged! Please watch out for any adults your kid may have an unhealthy attachment to. It's almost never going to end well.

[@HiddenMongoose]

I'm glad you're out of that situation and discovered who you are meant to be. Thank god it didnt go further than that but fuck those people who blamed you. The ADULT in the situation should know better. People are idiots. Dont let their words effect you, man. Again, hope youre doing better and I'm proud of you

[@AegixDrakan]

Oh my gosh, I'm glad you made it out of all that unscathed. :o

[@deadchannel22]

@@HiddenMongoose Thanks for the kind words! I haven't actually talked about this before, so I definitely appreciate the support!

[@teresataylor8961]

Glad that you made it out ok. But don’t blame yourself for ‘Dad issues’. It’s normal for young people to look for mentors, and young people missing a protective parent either because that’s parent isn’t there or doesn’t care are particularly vulnerable. Preying adults seek that and seize that. An appropriate adult would have chosen healthy ways to be a mentor. And good mentors lead by modeling appropriate boundaries to minors, not the other way around. ✌🏼

[@deadchannel22]

@@teresataylor8961 thanks for saying this. I think a part of me kind of still blames myself, even though consciously I know that's not right. I'm still working through a lot of feelings but this helped😊

[@ThEjOkErIsWiLd00]

I'm only halfway through, and all these tricks and games etc. they have to get children to "come to jebus" sound pretty much like the same tactics that a groomer would use, gross! And this is why, on my list of "things theists do that piss me off", preying upon vulnerable people is RIGHT at the top, and who's more vulnerable than a child?

[@donovanlocust1106]

And they scream about gays being groomers..

[@jameseglavin4]

Damn straight… I don’t care if it’s church, or Boy Scouts, or sports, or whatever - anyone who wants a private fiefdom of authority over kids is suspect. I’m determined to never have kids but I was one myself and that’s enough for anyone to have a personal stake in how kids are treated going forward. It’s like the idea of how vulnerable young people are to all sorts of abuse is thrown out the window because we have these categories of people who are given a pass. It’s gross and I think teaches really bad lessons about autonomy, consent, independence, etc.

[@probenfetchak8076]

You all must be talking about Tobey Maguire when Andrew Garfield called him a cool youth pastor

[@kathryngeeslin9509]

Some occupations attract child abusers. And people who do them well however well-intentioned are training people to be abuse victims.

[@Rawnblade13]

All this psychological manipulation on kids and adults...If so much manipulation is required, it's not worth believing.

[@jman5675]

I was never a christian (I grew up jewish) this is just one of the MANY things I never understood about christianity. I remember one of my friends would make fun of the youth pastor at her parents church. She was genuinely shocked to learn that synagogues don't do that.

[@linagreenlyfe6705]

What do synagogues do then? Besides learning Hebrew/Old Hebrew

[@jman5675]

@@linagreenlyfe6705 usually kids either sit in services or, if we were lucky, we might sneak away and play outside. Our temple eventually included kids programs, but they were just for the REALLY little kids, like 4 to 8 years old. After I turned 13 and came out I spent most Saturdays in the temple library, after a while the younger kids started hanging out with me, and I ended up as a surrogate older sibling to a bunch of them. I remember running through the hallways playing tag, or playing cards on the stairs, we always had to make sure to get back by the end of services because there would always be cake and sweets served afterwards, if a member of the congregation had a simcha, like a baby being born, a bar mitzvah or a wedding they'd usually sponsor the food and sometimes they'd go all out, those were the best, because then we spent more time with friends while parents talked.

[@Katie2986]

Many mainstream Christian churches don’t have youth pastors.

[@linagreenlyfe6705]

@@jman5675 Jewish people are lucky. They don't have to worry about religious trauma like everyone else.

[@jman5675]

@@linagreenlyfe6705 😂 that is genuinely hilarious, many exjews were kicked out of their family and mourned for dead because they disagree with their parents. Just because something is different doesn't make it perfect. There is significant religious trauma, especially given Jewish history, I grew up with the idea that I was hated by the majority of humanity, that the government could turn on my people at any time, and in constant fear of christian fundamentalist terrorists.

[@FaeriePrincex]

My youth group (I was a trans pagan, went there for ages because of a cute boy) had a surprisingly high rate of teen pregnancy. Given that it was a small group it was particularly hard to ignore.

[@tc-tm1my]

Teen pregnancy in churches is way higher than the nationwide average.

[@darthandeddeu]

​@@tc-tm1myforcing kids to be close together and trusting they'll be caste because " they're christian " is a recipe for more Christians

[@KhiemNguyen-ly1wz]

I doubt they care how old the girls are when they got pregnant, long as they don’t abort it

[@Waspinmymind]

@@KhiemNguyen-ly1wzAnd from experience they’ll then berate the child for the rest of her life. Leading her and her children into a cycle of abuse that’ll end with most leaving the church indefinitely.

[@Souten66]

@@KhiemNguyen-ly1wz oh they care. They will give the couple the side eye BIG TIME and that girl will be slut shamed like you would not believe. I remember doing the Sunday School course on saving yourself for marriage and everyone side eyeing the girl and guy making out in the corner while they were waiting for their parents to pick them up

[@n0etic_f0x]

I was a loser in high school and it is funny he brings up sex and dating because due to that and my massively stubborn nature I was just like "Yeah... but what if having sex is not evil and what if even being gay is not evil?" and to some kids that was just too reasonable for the preacher to get through to you. I had no reason just "Well... but what if he is wrong? People have had sex and they are fine, please explain this!" and he couldn't.

[@TheCount991]

Oh but people don't have sex and are fine! Unless they are a married hetero couple. Any other sex automatically makes both parties look down on each other and start treating them like garbage. And by "sex" I mean anything that somebody somewhere might think is inappropriate. Like handholding or having lunch together without parental supervision. And then they wonder why so many chrisitians get married at 18 and promptly get divorced. They can't spend time together alone until they are married, and once they do, they realize that there's no way this is going to work out.

[@n0etic_f0x]

@@TheCount991 the whole thing is… something, it is depressing in that it stifles sex education but it also destroys people’s faith as it is just so obvious that it is wrong… even to children. Other than being gay I had no reason to protect LGBT people I was in denial of it at the time, but I needed an answer that just never came.

[@ThEjOkErIsWiLd00]

It hurts God's fee-fees, what's not to get?

[@ArtisticlyAlexis]

I got an orthodox Youth Rabbi annoyed by saying that gay sex was okay, because in the Torah, it simply says that "A man may not lie w/ another man, the way he lies w/ a woman." And since men don't have the same parts, it's impossible for him to lie w/ a man the _WAY_ he lies w/ a woman. If we want to take the Torah literally, that's what it says!

[@kaneconqueror6560]

I am someone who can not stand being told to accept something based on authority, and always need to understand the reasoning. With premarital sex, there actually is some pretty good reasons, mainly having to do with pair bonding from a biological and psychological standpoint. Divorce rates within 5 years for people who married as virgins is only 5%, but it jumps to 20% if there was one previous partner, and 30% if there were two. Plus it's easier to be content with your partner in the absence of comparison. All that said, I believe churches go about teaching all wrong, since they usually just say something is bad because god said so, and don't give any reasons beyond that. In turn, once people lose respect for god and start ignoring those teachings, they discount everything they were taught as baseless even if there are actual reasons, because they were not taught those reasons when the value was instilled and now those reasons are viewed as attempts to justify.

[@venusindior2787]

I was so jealous of the evangelicals and their "cool youth pastors". I was a homeschooled Catholic, attended every camp, youth mass and pretty much trained up to be a youth leader. I was determined to be the alt, cool youth leader (non existent concept in Catholicism) and I'd built top tier rapport with everyone. I dressed more indie, majority of my friends were non-catholic and so I felt more pressure to project a perfect image of myself spiritually. Then at 19, I talked about depression and grief from losing my brother in a testimony. Previously I played it very safe in my testamonies - others talked about mental health/porn addiction/sex. They called a meeting of 6 adult leaders and me - saying that I wasn't speaking about my faith enough. I refused to change it. My brother had died 2 months prior. They ended the meeting saying, I was no longer allowed to mentor anyone anymore and it would be preferable if I avoided the other teens. The leaders were people I thought I could lean on forever but after that they lost all warmth towards me. My Catholic friends were suddenly embarrassed of me. It was bizzare. I had somehow proved to them that I was a liability. I lost my community almost overnight. Thankfully, I left the church the next year and so, yes they were right. Fuck indoctrinating kids and then shaming them for having emotions.

[@monus782]

I was raised conservative Catholic as well but when I was around 17 I came across an extremist priest who was doing the old Latin Mass and I got hooked for the next couple of years (but it was also when I started to see the flaws and contradictions in the theology but my family gaslighted me to think they weren't there at all), Trads like to brag about how all the remaining young people in the church are attracted to the old rite but it was because of them that I finally deconverted and left Christianity entirely when I was 24 so I'm grateful to them for that (but alot of them, including past me, are basically delusional fascists at this point). I'm sorry for what you went through and I hope you're doing better, I lost most of my friends when I left shortly before the pandemic and the last couple of years have been lonely to say the least, I pretty much ghosted and went radio silent on them because I didn't want to be gaslighted and told I would go to hell since they were more extreme than I was.

[@karelgott2610]

Wow, I'm so sorry. It looks like the church is like the friend, who´s with you all the time when things go well, but as soon as things get tough, they ge t angry and leave.

[@hayyoraeyo662]

My stomach dropped when you started talking about burn out. That was what initially pushed me out of church. I worked literally full time hours at 12, 13, 14, 15 years old-helping run VBS, teaching Sunday school small groups, decorating for events, even painting a ministers freakin office, etc… Now, I’m an evil science loving, leftist Atheist, with a capital “A.”

[@none11flop9]

lol you deny the existence of god because you worked too much at church? doesn't follow.

[@hothog8261]

Not what they said at all.

[@none11flop9]

@@hothog8261 you're right

[@milksteak553]

Dude it's so normal tho when you're in it. I did so much free work for church, and them I got a real job when I was like 17 and realized I could make money

[@Clay_j_Bray]

Going to the opposite extreme is the answer. K......

[@TheHaylion]

Growing up in Montgomery Alabama my youth pastor, who also pointed out how his wife is, went on a rant and pointed out that one of the kids had an abortion. He didn't say who it was, but I think that's a huge violation and betrayal of trust.

[@OneEyeShadow]

Was it Robert, Arthur, Jessica or Philip? I guess we'll never know. Seriously, though. What a piece of shit father.

[@angygremlin4423]

Y I K E S

[@gupdoo3]

Throwback to the time my youth pastor thought it was a good idea to play ultimate frisbee with a banana INDOORS and then was surprised when there was banana guts all over the gym

[@fenrirhellhound760]

This is literally a form of grooming though- trying to groom kids into staying or being christian and it’s considered normal. Of course, they don’t see it that way. Even worse these people have the audacity to claim that any kind of education to kids about anything LGBTQIA+ is grooming.

[@ddjsoyenby]

it's keeping kids in the c#lt.

[@TheCampdragon]

Both are very creepy

[@EmeraldLavigne]

It's tradition to groom that way, tho.

[@brianglover177]

Campdragon/ huckaby, wow

[@_Aurelian_]

Sounds like something a groomer would say.

[@mads597]

What’s really sad to me is how there’s clearly a legitimate desire among these teens (and non-religious youth, too) to experience more social/community support in their own lives, and it’s true that greater society is ultimately lacking in this regard. So youth ministry fills the void, not in good faith (lol pun), but instead exploiting that vulnerability.

[@dangercrue]

that is exactly why i kept going to this local sleep away christian camp from age 10 up until i was 16 when the pandemic happened. i was autistic and in middle school felt so disconnected from everyone else at school so when i would go to camp and meet kids who had the same interests and were also autistic/etc, i felt like i belonged. i started seriously thinking on my doubt of christianity at 13 but stayed going until the pandemic shut it down for a year. looking back, that was the only reason i kept going, to interact with people where i didn't feel left out. it's even the only reason i kept going to my church's youth group until it crashed and burned spectacularly (deservedly) because of the way the older people in the church acted towards us in the youth group.

[@monus782]

And speaking from experience that void of community is how cults and extremist movements can thrive as they can attract youth who feel lost and lack identity, that's exactly what happened to me when I was around 17 but I'm now grateful to the extremist preacher I listened to for leading me down this path where I'm an atheist at 28 now (he's still a huge asshole though)

[@ZeroAceX13]

My youth pastor once told me this. "If violence is not working. You are not using it enough." I have told a lot people that and I used it when was playing d&d. For my vengeance paladin.

[@0gammag0]

Perfect for my “any challenge needs to be completed through battle”-flawed barbarian!

[@TheMostEccentric]

ouchie wouchie that doesn’t sound very Christlike

[@dingdongism]

What on earth was the context for that advice?

[@ZeroAceX13]

@@dingdongism I do not remember. I am 26 now soon to be 27. This was when I was in high school. But I will always remember that part of the conversation I had with him. Because like a few days later I thought to myself. "I don't think a youth pastor should have told me that." I now just remember that part because you know, a youth pastor should not be telling teens. That if violence is not working, you just not using enough violence.

[@rebeccaholcombe9043]

@@ZeroAceX13 It's also scripturally inconsistant, but...I'm not surprised.

[@carjis]

“It’s hard to tell from all the mugshots.” I WAS GAGGED-

[@ConsarnitTokkori]

you know who else was probably gagged?

[@charliepenn677]

I worked as a summer camp counselor for years, and if I did any of the "relationship building" suggested in these training, I would be fired immediately and never work at a summer camp again. I've seen multiple people for minimal social media contact with former campers. I can't believe slapping "Its for Jesus" on child care gives them a pass to violate basic child care standards.

[@ViableBurrito]

I thought you might mention how youth pastors want you, as a volunteer, to focus on the influential kids. They couldn't say it outloud, but only the cool kids offered a good roi. So that's who we were supposed to focus most of our attention on so they could bring more and more cool kids. It pissed me off then and 15 years later, pisses me off again

[@xDentDeLionx]

The youth pastor is at my church did this. I used to get picked on hardcore by the popular church kids and the youth pastor couple never did anything to help. Wouldn’t tell them to stop, only told my parents how I was a problem child and they will pray for me. It got to a point where I just left after my parents dropped me off and played in a creek behind the church. Those church kids were some of the meanest kids lol I still dislike that youth pastor and his wife, Jeff and Christina. Assholes!

[@pepperjack8813]

wait, my youth pastor invested a lot in me personally, was I seen as a cool kid?! I was a fucking loser lol. Really miss judged that one lol.

[@timbertome2443]

Gotta love the way they think about it, too. "Only gr00m the kids that'll give a good roi." Like wtf.

[@superxxamadeus4098]

Yeah I had pretty bad anxiety and depression in high school and would never really talk to anyone but my family at church, but my cousins and sister were normal and social and the youth pastor had great relationships with all of them but would ignore that I existed. And I would just kinda think, like aren't you supposed to be here to help the kids, and yet you are only forming relationships with the ones who already seem to be fitting in great and not struggling socially? Like as if I wasn't already getting enough of that in most every other social setting. I don't really care anymore that that happened since maybe having that relationship would've made it harder to leave the church, but it was only just another obnoxious situation to fuck with my self esteem at a young age.

[@cmndrkool321]

All the youth pastors I met acted more like rejects from comedy clubs and tried way too hard to be your friend. It just made me uncomfortable because I been in situations where people only wanted to be my friends for some sort of personal gain. I was on high alert with people who were too nice to me.

[@hydrogeddonn]

I am working on coming out as gay. One of my friends of nearly a decade is very involved in the church and youth ministry, a lot of these things in the video are things he does. His church publicly shamed my other friends sister for being a lesbian and called her a jezebel and a terrible influence and a danger to the kids when she came out as gay while a youth volunteer. I don't think my friendship with him will survive. He'll probably always have a hidden evangelical motive. His "acceptance of other people's beliefs" is definitely a mask for evangelism "by example" it hurts that I'll lose a friend via my identity.

[@Callimo]

Sweet gaysus, that sucks. At least you're prepared for the fall out, but just remember there are far more compatible people for you out there.

[@fikey8445]

Hi I'm a lesbian and exvangelical and I feel the same. I don't want any of my old church friends to know bc then I'll be demoted from the status of equal and friend to an evangelical pet project where they're just friends with me to eventually get me to "fight" my "homosexual tendencies" and come back to the lord. I feel for you and your struggle, because I know you want to keep your friend and be who you are at the same time. I wish you luck dude

[@lulucool45]

sorry for HIS loss. you definitely don't need someone like that in your life. i hope your coming out goes as smoothly as possible! thrive! ❤🧡💛💚💙💜

[@happyclappy1805]

Quick question :why is this douche bag still a friend? While I empathise with you, might you want to reflect on why this callous, judgemental, cruel sounding guy is a friend? I say this as a recovering pentecostal youth leader. True story. Blessings hugs and strength to you on this tough journey called life

[@KezanzatheGreat]

Just remember, if there is a god who "designed" you (as unlikely as that is), then that god created you to be just as you are ... and it's not your friend's place to judge you for it. 😊

[@lindseyhendrix2405]

I had a good friend of mine in college who would outright diss churches and the belief of God so I asked here where those views came from, politely. And she opened up to me about her visits to her best friend’s youth group in high school and an all-too-comfortable youth pastor who was involved with said best friend, among other girls. I didn’t ask to what extent because that’s not my business but she explained that the hypocrisy of preaching purity culture and preaching being so good and calling out every sin while doing downright evil to young girls in his care… *THAT* is what turned her away from Jesus and the church as a whole. It always stuck with me and with this recent SBC list coming out that POS was most definitely on my mind. And sure enough, there he was on the list. I sent it to her to verify and apologized to her again all while sharing her same righteous anger and pain. It’s so alarming how untouchable these pastors get blown up to be… it’s not their freewill but it’s evil tempting them because they are in the position as a youth pastor. Accountability is a myth. A dream even. The audacity that fuels them is beyond me and the audacity and privilege that churches / whole denominations hold to simply _move these predators around the country where they can start over all while ostracizing the victim and their family_ makes me want to flip tables and simply rage in the “church.”

[@ImpoForrest]

Holy wow. The woman in the “Ministry Coach” clip was my youth pastor in San Diego. I haven’t seen or thought of her since I was probably 15. I can’t believe I’m seeing her, still in the same position compared to me, a now proud gay dude who’s left the church. We’ve gone on such different journeys.

[@tc-tm1my]

The lady with dinosaur hands?

[@sebthepo8260]

She is fine af

[@sleepyhead8681]

I was hiking with my dad at 10 and he lost his keys so A Christan family kindly gave us A ride and tried to force convert me durring the ride home. Turned me off from Christianity for life although politics, history and science did as well way later.

[@brokenrecord3095]

years ago I was hitchhiking through Minnesota and I got picked up by a vanload of teenage Bible enthusiasts. At some point - perhaps like 2 minutes in - the conversation turned to Bibles, and specifically if I had one. I admitted no, I don't happen to have my own personal Bible but I sure have always admired Bibles. I mean, you need to be polite hitchhiking, you want to get to Wauseka after all. Anyway they were astonished by this apparent shortage of Bibles I suffered, so they all ponied up like real US dollars so I could buy me a real Bible of my own - it was like $12 - they pressed the cash into my hand! Insisted I take it! they were real excited! here's a live one one the hook! then one of them realized that HEY! they GOT A WHOLE BOX just full of Bibles in the back of the van! I could have my own Bible right now! King James, NRV, whatever you like, all different but all GUARANTEED true! They didn't even want the money back! So anyway, I got to Wauseka, I got me a bible, and I got me $12 in cash along with a bunch of my new best friends that I would never see again. Anyway I spent the money on beer. Don't remember what happened to the Bible.

[@presentfuture7563]

Ah yes, the whole Christian "help with strings" bit. We're good Samaritans! Now listen to our pitch!

[@dingdongism]

@@brokenrecord3095 I hope you picked the King James one. You can tell it’s authoritative because a king gave it his stamp of approval.

[@kevinsedwards]

Science and faith can be completely different from each other. Religious people are dumb I agree but there's definitely something amazing going on

[@bcwest619]

Yeah, the part about telling youth pastors to go to school plays, sporting events, and other things that are important to the kids. SUPER dishonest and SUPER gross. And ultimately self-defeating. When I was younger, I didn't have a lot of friends. So my youth pastor coming to things I enjoyed made me feel like I actually did have someone that cared about me. But eventually it became clear that he wasn't doing it because he cared, he was doing it because it was literally his job to pretend to care. That vail being lifted was one of many, many steps of me leaving religion entirely. The dishonesty and manipulation of making kids that need honest friends THINK you care about them deeply when you don't showed me how much of the church "community" is sales rather than genuine caring.

[@allanmason3201]

That bit made my skin crawl. It's odd how these phoney, sanctimonious creeps pay lip service to teens being able to intuitively spot adult fakery (although I'm not sure that's always true), but then they go on to talk about how they fake interest in the activities of "their" kids. As you say, it is manipulative and nothing more than part of the marketing program of the church.

[@dellybird5394]

The fake attention I got in religion was one of the worst things for me. I didn't have much in common with the other church kids, but they were taught that they should go out of their way to be "nice" to me even if they didn't want to. The last thing I want is for someone to be nice to me out of obligation. It's easier to be your genuine self outside of the church.

[@lostusaslambus]

I was DESPERATE for friends and a father figure in middle/high school, but I guess my impoverished ass wasn't part of his ministry focus he wouldn't give me an ounce of attention, let alone go to something I did. He didn't even invite me over for dinner or to babysit like he did many of the other girls (probably for the best). At houseboat camp when I was 18 he told me "someday, somewhere else, you'll find your place." 🙄 I mean, he wasn't wrong

[@phillipinek1856]

One of the major reasons why I left the church. There was no genuine “community” for me, it was all an act.

[@asafoetidajones8181]

God is a racket.

[@kylefromthewood8829]

So many of the youth games involved touching, I finally figured out they wanted us all to date each other so we wouldn't have spouses outside the religion. Many of my Baptist cohort did marry each other, at 18 or 19 years old. I was shunned because I wouldn't date within the church. Insulated community. I married an atheist and it had the exact effect the church knew it would, so I guess they were right about needing insulation.

[@victoriarotramel2274]

Our youth group had a "challenge activity" where they set up 2x2 pieces of fully transparent pieces of plexiglass. Then they divided us into two teams, boys and girls, and smeared peanut butter on either side of the plexiglass. Then they tied your hands behind your back and you had to lick all of the peanut butter off your side of the glass before the person on the other side did. Created a VERY interesting image of them essentially sloppily making out in front of everyone just with a 1/4in of plastic in between them. While tied up??? Seemed designed to set people up

[@lich.possum]

@@victoriarotramel2274 wow that is...right on the nose.

[@washipuppy]

As someone who got invited to and attended christian youth groups despite not being religious (But being friends with Christians and being particularly strong in christian studies) - Those groups were absolutely a way to get your Christian kid in intimate contact with other Christian kids in the hopes that they might date until they couldn't stand it anymore and got married. After the bible recitations and break-downs of what the chosen passages meant and how we could apply them to our lives, we were encouraged to be in close proximity to each other. To have structured games that involved us being near each other and having conversations that were... I'll say charged without being blatantly sexually charged. Not even truely emotionally charged, just the spark of connection. It was like a match-making dance without the dancing. And to be fair, I remember thinking a LOT about whether the cuter boys might want to kiss me, so it was clearly working on some level. Thinking about it, any of those boys wanting to kiss me, the outsider athiest who treated religious studies as a kind of literature study for the english cannon rather than a truely held belief, would have been a nightmare for their parents. I was supposed to become another good christian girl after all, not lure a good christian boy into kissing.

[@peterkapinos277]

I suppose they'll all stay married forever.

[@AppleBottomJeansBootswiththa]

@@victoriarotramel2274 im sorry WHAT!!??!?!!??

[@natalieeuley1734]

Youth group was honestly the highlight of my teenage years as the one place where I wasn't bullied. And it was awesome because it was an easy way to volunteer, too. That being said, I wish there were things like youth group that weren't indoctrination. There needs to be secular alternatives for doing the same fun stuff

[@thesteelsquid863]

But then kids would find out that the jebus isn't your only source of joy in life, and that would lessen the power the church has over them

[@Farmingdaneo]

There are plenty. Science camps at local universities and summer day camps at community centers are a few I attended.

[@violet7773]

​@@Farmingdaneo that depends on where you live. I don't think there was anything like that where I grew up, or at least it wasn't well advertised

[@Farmingdaneo]

@@violet7773 Ya, that is unfortunately very true.

[@to819]

Youth pastors are legitimate mental cases. I spent 21 years in the church and I never met anyone as unhinged as a youth pastor. Why? My guess is that they feel the need to act like overgrown children because they're surrounded by teens. It's deeply disturbing to witness. These people should be in mental wards, where they can't hurt or influence one more child.

[@rebeccamiles4041]

This was a good episode. I remember being constantly body shamed by my youth pastors because I developed early and couldn't wear the same type of clothing as most of the other girls, most notably shorts...and don't get me started on the swimsuits. They always preached modesty to me, but couldn't seem to control their own comments about my very tame attire as a 13 year old girl.

[@TipTheScales27]

Dude wtf that’s disgusting 🤢 It’s horrible enough as it is being cat called by older men in public as a child. That is on a whole other level I’m so sorry you had to deal with that bullshit

[@jenna2431]

My youth group was led by two strong "good Christian" couples. When Husband A, however, went off with a new fling, Husband B came over to help Wife A with the household chores like grass cutting and such. Then when Husband B and Wife A got caught up together and left, Wife B was left to suffer the sympathies of the church. THAT is all I remember of my church youth group. Oh, and then when I was an adult, my best friend went off with the youth "Education" pastor literally in the middle of the night, leaving her husband to suddenly cope with three children. What I see the problem being is that Wife B and my bestie's husband would have been better served if their marriages were simply dissolved rationally and correctly and life went on. But instead, those involved had to sneak around and lie, and create acrimony and horrible situations for all of the children involved. Congratulations, Christianity.

[@onedaya_martian1238]

Wow. Just. Wow.

[@jenna2431]

I just remembered a youth pastor at Centrifuge. He said it was fine to do communion with chips and Coke so we did, completely oblivious of the Jewish symbolism involved in bread and wine. Another win there, Christianity.

[@onedaya_martian1238]

@@jenna2431 Coke Zero has all of the Jesus and none of the calories, I hear.

[@lich.possum]

@@jenna2431 has the church considered making the blood of christ carbonated? Give the kids something fizzy to drink when they wake up in four to five hours

[@dingdongism]

It’s sort of hilarious that you end this with “Congratulations, Christianity.” While Christianity has a fuck ton of atrocities to account for, this story has nothing to do with anything bad from Christianity. What you have here is husbands A and B and wife A making your run of the mill regular human terrible decisions.

[@amberbydreamsart5467]

The part about stupid, dangerous games hits. Our church had a weekend retreat to a campground that always ended the last night with a game of 'romans vs christians', where the kids would split up into groups of 3-6 and roam around the woods at night trying to find the 'safe house' campfire, while the counselors & youth leaders acted as 'romans' and would hunt us through the woods, if one of your group got tagged, you got brought before 'nero' and put in prison. This game always, always started at sunset and lasted like two hours, with one flashlight per group sprained ankles were nigh inevitable, youth leaders would chase and /tackle/ kids sometimes in the hunt. It was exciting to a dumb kid like me at the time, but for other kids it was downright traumatic, and participation wasn't optional. in hindsight, so, so irresponsible of them, especially in a wooded camp that a lot of the kids didn't know the trails of well. I'm amazed no one got terribly lost

[@Hazelo035]

We played a similar game one year at church camp. But luckily it was during the day, though still in the woods. We went around and had to find the other Christians, in a world where Christianity was outlawed and they would put you in “jail” in one of the cabins if they found out you were Christian. But they also had another group of people who pretended to be Christians, but it was really a “state-sponsored cult”, to lead the Christians astray.

[@chlomo7672]

Yo that’s crazy. There was this youth group that I went to in middle school that had a summer camp at this campground near the beach and also nearby were these old stone bunkers that people can tour and hang around. Every year we’d have night games there like capture the flag, cops and robbers, and others that involved a lot of running around and stuff, and mind you this was with a group of over 40 kids most years and maybe like 6-8 adults. Anyway, this one year (I actually didn’t go cuz I was in high school by that time) they were playing a game there at night and this 13 year old kid fell 20 ft or something down a narrow, stone shaft in the dark. He could’ve had serious injuries or worse, but thankfully he only ended up with a broken wrist and ankle but holy hell everyone was traumatized after that and they permanently changed the location of their summer camps

[@littlewyzard]

why did i think that sounds kinda fun 💀💀

[@aeircrown7994]

this just Roleplay but more Christian lmao.

[@Yuri-uf2tu]

Wait where was your camp because I temper doing the exact a same thing?

[@jennamars80]

I was a science teacher in HS and the teacher across the hall had a youth pastor come once a week with pizza and give a sermon for the "Christian club." He also showed up during a club food fundraiser and took pics with them. He then also kept kids after the bell to preach to them and I had to interrupt and tell them to get to class. I sent those pics and secret recordings of his sermons to the FFRF and soon he was gone. They sent a letter to the district as it was a violation of the law. He wasn't allowed to give sermons and the sponsoring teacher wasn't allowed to participate in the prayer. He wasn't allowed to incentivize attendance with free food. The kids did not lead the meetings, he did. The kids are supposed to run meetings or it's not a legitimate club. So what these pastors are encouraging is illegal, but they will get away with it so long as there isn't someone like me who knows the law and complains.

[@Lrbearclaw]

My mom was a youth pastor and I am so glad that she showed common sense. We did have games, but nothing that could put people in danger (and anything using food she made sure to avoid anything that could have allergy issues). One thing I love is that she made sure she was never alone with the boys (that my dad, the pastor, or another man was in the room) and Dad was never alone with the girls just so no one could even think anything untoward happened. This was in addition to my parents loved every kid that came to the youth group and treated them like the kids were their own. So if the kids needed to talk, they were there for them at any time. It is notable to add, that in the nearly 300 kids that came through (at least 4 weeks in the span of two months) and the average of 80 regulars, my sister and I were the only ones who had both parents AND they were not divorced. For most of the kids, they didn't have both parental figures and the ones who did, the parents didn't care. So, my parents did. If they were invited, they made sure to go to games or whatever, not because "social relationships lead to spiritual awakening" or whatever that idiot said. My parents went because they wanted the kids to know that they were loved, that they mattered (because their own parents didn't bother going). You see, she didn't see the kids/teens as a "ministry field", she saw them as broken people who needed someone to love them. So, my parents did. I remember one time we had a co-ed all-nighter/sleep-over at the church, and Dad stopped all the boys and had a chat with us all. He pointed over his shoulder to where the girls were bedding down and simply said "There will be no sneaking over. All of those girls are as good as my own daughter and I am a light sleeper." All the boys either respected him or they feared him (and his low, calm tone) because not a single one tried anything. (Even though one or two of the idiots had been whispering about how they planned to try before his little "chat".) Anyway, so many youth pastors try to be "cool" when all they have to do is care. If you truly love the kids and just want to be a positive force in their life it means more than any preachy message you could deliver. They may not remember a single topic you preach on, but you know they will always remember the way you changed their life. For good or ill. So always, do good.

[@maxdoubt5219]

Why the focus on youth? If their message is so clearly true, why not appeal to adults, who would then spread the "good news" to their kids? Because kids are more gullible.

[@Aaron-cs3xl]

And kids are more vulnerable.

[@scottgoodson1847]

The youth pastor job is to be the pastor to the youth. Generally, churches which have a "youth pastor" already have a senior pastor/adult pastor. If you are asking "why have youth ministry at all?" the answer would be that young people are worthwhile and unique members of churches with unique needs, and (see Dunbar's number as mentioned in video) the "adult pastor" cannot be close with everybody. While paying "the kids matter!" thing lip service though, many churches don't actually give youth representation when it comes to board decisions and etc, which I would consider a problem tbh. Some youth pastors do go out of their way to build relationships with parents and students simultaneously, though this can be difficult, as even among believers, many parents kind of see youth ministry as glorified babysitting and would rather be hands off. IE: they only want to hear from the youth pastor if their kid misbehaved.

[@Ian-pn1ff]

it’s indoctrination as much as people may say it’s not it’s quite obvious religion shouldn’t be taught or force fed if you really want a true believer than let them come to you

[@dingdongism]

Kids are in the process of acculturation, in every human society. Sure, there are good ways and bad ways to do that acculturation, ways that allow the free and egalitarian development of personal and social identities, and some not so much. But you’re reaching when you suggest that focusing on youth _at all_ is just playing on their vulnerability. Any society that cares about its values will give special attention to youth. One goal simply has to be not having shit values like so much white American evangelical Christianity does.

[@annjepsen1621]

They have the same sales technique as the tobacco industry

[@GuitarRocker2008]

I was a youth leader in my church before I came out as a girl and stopped going to church. It still makes me laugh how often our pastor and other members used me as a male role model (most kids in our church had absent or dead fathers) and someone to look up to. One mother even asked me to give her sons “the talk” but aside from that being way too uncomfortable for me and my feeling like a fraud (still an egg) her boys were still like 8 and 9 so that felt VERY inappropriate.

[@Ircy2012]

I find it both ironic and telling how the best model of positive masculinity they could find was a woman.

[@spankowitzmusic]

@@Ircy2012 shows how broken masculinity has become. I'm what you'd call a "cracked egg", I'm aware of that fact that I'm a girl, but haven't yet come out to anyone, or even started on my transition. its tough, but I'll get through this

[@bradypustridactylus488]

When I was a missionary, there was this stupid little thing called Golden Questions, "How much do you know about the the Mormon Church?" and "Would you like to know more?" This was a big thing. We were supposed to ask random people on the subway, people in the supermarket, people on the sidewalk, people in the laundromat the Golden Questions, 15 per week. It terrified me. Just writing this 50 years later gives me symptoms. Door-to-door tracting was bad enough. Every door was a gut punch; I could feel my internal organs disintegrating from the repeated blows. The Golden Questions were never going to happen. So, I lied small time. If I made eye contact and they read the black badge, I counted it as a Golden Question. My district leader would say, "You only wrote five Golden Questions this week on your report. You need to bring that up to the goal." This was a weekly thing. Finally, I said, "Look if you keep pressuring me on this, I will report that I asked all 15, even if I didn't ask any." So the next week: "You said that you asked all your Golden Questions, but your companion tells us that you didn't ask any at all." "Of course, I asked the Golden Questions. Am I the kind of guy who would lie on my weekly report?" Then I got cocky, "I have the three-two system. Three on Monday, two on Tuesday, three on Wednesday, two on Thursday, three on Friday, two on Saturday. Then, Sunday, I'm home free." They finally left it alone. It was a great life lesson in the cultivating passive-aggressive behavior.

[@a.bastianwiik5592]

"Would you like to know more?" Yes I want to learn about the Bugs on Klendathu and how I can join the Starship Troopers! I hear they have all genders welcome communal showers and fun obstacle courses.

[@jenna2431]

Eye contact and your black badge--I love it. I do often wonder about all those young men I fed missionary dinners to when I was married to a Mormon. I could tell from dinner conversation that some of them were seriously on the ropes. (And I couldn't believe it when they were so appreciative of roast beef or salmon. Apparently I didn't get the memo that standard fare for the missionaries was supposed to be cold cereal, bologna sammies, or box mac and cheese when they dined at members' homes.)

[@tos100returns]

Someone once asked me if I wanted to know more about the Mormon church. I told them, "I am highly familiar with The Mountain Meadows Massacre, and that's all I need to know."

[@lsmmoore1]

@@jenna2431 And I bet those missionaries got more nutritious fare from you than anywhere else. And that would be the case even without vegetables on the menu.

[@leslieyancey5084]

Ugh…reminds me of my days as a JW having to do field service! We had to fill out monthly service reports and had goals we had to meet as well. It was frowned upon if you didn’t meet the quota, and most of the time I didn’t.

[@dennissmith1072]

Honestly what started my deconstruction was the fact that I went to a youth Bible study and I realized I was doing it for everyone else there and not myself.

[@Macwizzard]

I'm regularly shocked how most churches do NO background checks - and most states have loopholes for church groups where they are not required and in some cases exempt from mandatory reporting requirements.

[@alexmorgan2148]

Quick note here NEVER PLAY CHUBBY BUNNY!!! I can't believe how much these pastors downplayed how dangerous this game is. "Oh I guess a couple kids choked while playing it, so it got outlawed". No $#!+ Because the marshmallows melted and went down the wrong tube. Absolutely ridiculous

[@hothog8261]

The kids who lost their lives probably did so to allow god to work in the lives of others. Who knows how many people god touched through the childrens' death. He does work in mysterious, marshmellowy ways. (I am not joking about the children passing, but of how religion deals with senseless tragedy and human suffering).

[@alexmorgan2148]

@@hothog8261 I figured as much

[@LJStability]

But also, for real, this video really puts into context how creepy and unsafe these youth pastor programs are at times. "You gotta show up to their sports games, out for coffee....". Man, sometimes, teenagers just need time alone or time to be themselves. Looking back at my childhood, I just needed a different living situation and being by myself than anything else.

[@coryp1821]

My youth group was a good example of what the church could do with it resources. I lived in a small town with nothing to do, so the church opened its doors Friday nights from 6pm-11pm. It had an hour service, but the rest of the time the church was open to the towns teenagers. We had band equipment, a gymnasium, games, and class rooms all free to use. It was run by parents who volunteered and I latter found out there policy was that the adults could never be alone with a teen and they had to check in with there fellow volunteers ever ten minutes or so. Bands formed because of having equipment and practice spaces, improve groups as well, we got to DJ, and a lot of kids came to play sports or just play video games with eachother. The church would pay for pizza every week to feed over a hundred kids. That church didn't worry about building "Young Christian soldiers" they just wanted a safe place for bored teenagers to hang out in a town that didn't have any thing to do. Long story short, after I left that youthgroup I devoted my twenties to ministry then realized that the evangelical system was so broken and poisoness so left it entirely. Still, I thought it was good to share an example of a simple thing the church could do to actually do good. Anyway, great video as always, love your stuff.

[@Clay_j_Bray]

Thank you. I am so tired of ppl complaining on the internet..... pointing out problems is easy. You actually offer a sort of solution...... A tip for you youth pastors..... If your team is solid you don't have to try so hard to recruit ... people will want to join

[@renee8833]

I would have loved this

[@Joyride37]

That sounds fantastic and like a great solution to the predatory vibes of the current system. Let the church serve the community like they claim they do, but without any expectation that kids and teens only get the services if they practice the religion or convert

[@Clay_j_Bray]

@@Joyride37 yes, every " gift" the church's give comes with several ulterior motives, and expected repayment....typical of manipulators EVERYWHERE

[@schlookie]

Interesting. Back in my church going days, a couple of my friends were youth group leaders. Apart from an opening and closing prayer, they kept the youth group very informal, in order to appeal to kids from outside the church, and they mainly focused on the kids having fun, and doing activities. Anyway, this didn't sit well with one of the church elders, who thought the youthgroup was too focussed on fun and games, and wasn't churchy enough, so he tried to intervene. My friends stood their group and refused to alter the way they ran the youth group, so the elder went off and started a competing youth group, in the same church, on the same night! Result, both of my friends and their families quit church in disgust, and the youthgroup became a shell of its former self.

[@chasethe808]

My brother goes to one of these hipster/tattoo/ironic churches and they act like they are so cool with everything. But, when you get down to it, they are trans phobic, homophobic and all the other phobics.

[@darkstarr984]

Yeah, the hipstery churches are usually the worst of the worst

[@dordbird]

I went to a Southern Baptist megachurch in Texas, my youth pastor was arrested for sending inappropriate photos of himself to highschool churchgoers, some of the victims I knew personally but most chose not to identify themselves. From the ages of 9 to 17 my family treated him like my older brother. The level of disgust, betrayal and sadness is why I haven't gone back. (On top of them not being LGBT+ affirming and me being gay)

[@ViableBurrito]

Just went to a Dude Perfect show. I had no idea it was going to be one long cool youth pastor extravaganza, followed by them presenting the gospel at the end. They play stupid games, dress up as characters, make fun of each other, make millions of dollars, then get "real" at the end and share how it's all about jesus for them.

[@sluttyMapleSyrup]

Dude Perfect are a bunch of evangelicals?! Well shit.

[@weasel7491]

Bro what??? Thats so wild

[@annaairahala9462]

Dude Perfect are christians? Never knew that

[@ViableBurrito]

They give a quick heads up... "we're going to take a 5 minute break. When we come back we'll be sharing about our personal relationships with Jesus if you want to stay." Then 2 minutes later they break into it.

[@cosmicgregg]

Wow that's new info to me, somehow not shocking though

[@ahnahleesa4817]

My youth ministry was very much separated by gender. The pastors and leaders were men obviously but the girls were mentored in small groups under young 20-30 something women. As a 30 year old now I can’t imagine willingly spending time with teens and tweens in social settings. Even weirder I remember having a sleepover at my mid 20s leader’s house with my small group when I was 14. Nothing bad happened it’s just really weird. Being that age now as the mentors I would never have a group of tweens/teens over my house to sleepover it’s freaking weird.

[@maudernart5246]

The only thing I can compare this too as someone from a secular background is maybe the counselors I had at sleepaway camp who were mostly in their late teens to mid 20s. They were wonderful but there were always clear boundaries and even though we looked up to them and adored them we didn't see them as "friends." Like I was never under the illusion that they were anything more than glorified babysitters who were getting paid a sub-minimum wage to essentially entertain us and make sure we didn't die

[@ahnahleesa4817]

@@maudernart5246 yeah it’s similar but also has clearer boundaries than a lot of youth group mentoring does. I think camp counselors would get in trouble if they started hosting their campers at their homes. Its also a job that hopefully runs background checks and gets references unlike youth groups that aren’t always diligent about that stuff unfortunately.

[@ericapoe]

I definitely rolled my eyes at the mention of his gorgeous wife 🙄.. they do have a good marketing concept of using “relatable” youth pastors.

[@agoo7581]

I swore I heard someone in the congregation willing too. What the fuck is wrong with those people?

[@jmlkinc]

The implicit message to teenage boys is 'Look, I got with someone hot! Maybe if you stick with me and follow my every move, you can get a hot chick too!'

[@TipTheScales27]

He for sure is 100% cheating on his wife

[@optillian4182]

@@TipTheScales27 Probably with a dude. lol

[@superxxamadeus4098]

The creepiest pastors would always find a way to work in how God thought it was awesome when they would have sex with their wives. That would be more of like a main (not youth) service thing to say, but it would always be like "yeah fellas, know what I'm talking about? *wink wink*" and wouldn't stop doing that shit even when people specifically said it made them uncomfortable lmao.

[@bradiedean7466]

Our "cool youth pastor" at the local Young Life chapter actually embezzled $80,000 from the organization. My mom actually was the one who realized it immediately when she took over as treasurer but the great of the board refused to believe her at first. She didn't want to be liable when they inevitably got audited, so she kept pushing until it went up to Young Life corporate leadership and they fired him, but both the local chapter and the organization as a whole refused to press charges or sue for their money back because they didn't want to make the church look bad. My mom kept getting pressured to shut up about it and stop telling the other parents and volunteers until she got fed up and quit.

[@thepip3599]

After watching this video I had a nightmare where a “cool” youth pastor lady stalked me and showed up at my school and kept trying to invite me into her office in private. Only instead of Christianity, she was preaching about the Great Old Ones, like from H.P. Lovecraft’s books! She was trying to get me to worship Cthulhu. In retrospect that was freaking hilarious!

[@AtaraxianWist]

This story now lives in my head rent free.

[@justrachel4496]

As a Christian who volunteered as a youth group assistant in my early 20's, I would NEVER recommend any kids attend a youth group unless: * there were background checks on EVERY adult who would be present during youth group time; and * there were AT LEAST two adults with the kids in an official capacity at all times; one of them was a woman; and they were not related to each other. (A married couple doesn't increase safety for the kids, as they are likely to cover for each other if something inappropriate happens.) It felt like I was the only one who cared about the safety of the kids when I was working there. The only dangers I heard mentioned by anyone other than me was that a youth group leader could be *falsely* accused of inappropriate behavior, a boy could be *falsely* accused by a girl of inappropriate behavior if they weren't supervised, or that the children could be exposed to "false doctrine". There seemed to be no consciousness that actual abuse was possible.

[@jemmat5400]

This is how our youth group is run, 100% of adults need working with children checks and there is required training for all volunteers about responsible interaction with people of all ages, and reporting unsafe situations

[@knjparadise]

i was a child care worker and this is how we were trained. this is also how my youth group was run. that being said shit still happened, and i’d be weary of letting my kid go to youth group

[@justrachel4496]

@@knjparadise I get what you're saying. Is there any group setting where you would feel safe letting your kid go to? The dilemma that I'm having when considering my future kids' safety is that it seems like they can be harmed anywhere they go, but socialization is also super important for kids too and keeping them home all the time is also not a safe choice to raise well adjusted adults.

[@knjparadise]

@@justrachel4496 i will definitely be talking to my kids about this stuff(at an age appropriate level of course). i have a friend who every school year teaches her kids about what to do if they feel uncomfortable, and empowering them about making decisions that makes them most comfortable for their bodies. also having a relationship with their preschool/daycare and making sure that policies are implemented in order to protect the children. also teaching my kids consent, and that they don’t have to do anything that makes them uncomfortable

[@Jeretti16]

My husband’s youth pastor put posters up on the wall with different levels of sex acts and made everyone line up under how far they had gone. I was blown away when he told me that story.

[@wordforger]

UGH. Just... UGH.

[@happyclappy1805]

Whaaaaatt? Disgusting but very feasible. I can't

[@Samtember]

the wat-

[@TheHookahSmokingCaterpillar]

My jaw just hit the floor.

[@Jeretti16]

Yeppppp…. Youth pastors are sus

[@mablenorman5915]

There was a youth pastor at my previous church that was actually a good guy. He spoke intelligently, wasn't over-the-top, and was older with teenage kids of his own. I liked his sermons because he reminded me more of a history professor than a preacher. But of course he left and the church hired a guy much like the ones in this video.

[@alostkoi]

I was raised Catholic, so youth pastors weren't something common while growing up, but as someone who had teenage years, i saw so many girls drooling so much for young teachers, it's a no brainer to see how easily a youth cool pastor could... "Get astray" and u know, abuse power.

[@wijcik]

You are outlining every reason why I absolutely hated my church's youth group, especially as an introvert. I did not hide my displeasure, and this resulted in me being labelled as "not caring about being edifying", and "not a team player" and "difficult" by the youth pastor's buddy and other teens' parents in the church. Oh, and as for "building relationships", the youth pastor had an "inner circle" where his favourites, who went to youth group regularly, were members. They were considered the "real Christians" and were mostly my school bullies, so that was awesome 🙄 It's amazing I'm still a Christian, now that I think about it.

[@Colddirector]

My schools chaplain was a pretty decent guy, but I always disliked how youth groups were using games and genuine social interaction just as a delivery mechanism for Jesus. It was super uncomfortable and not at all convincing to me even back then. I think even in the best circumstances it’s just a fundamentally cynical and manipulative tactic, even if the people running it are well intentioned

[@stevenjennings5887]

watching this reminded me: as a member of a youth group when i was in high school, i was asked by my youth pastor to shoot arrows into a target in front of the stage to illustrate a talking point about the harm words can do. I agreed, being an archery instructor for a summer camp. I assumed there would be safeguards of some kind in place, given the proximity of the stage to the front row. No such guards in place. I was a teenager, I wanted his approval, and I didnt want to let anyone down, so i did the bit. I was loosing arrows into a target that was set up less than five feet from my peers in the front row. No one was hurt, but I still remember the cold chill down my spine when i realized the recklessness at play just to make a point. thank you for these videos, Trevor. I need to talk to my therapist.

[@victorlannister5606]

Shout out to my youth pastor who told me my dead grandfather would’ve hated me because I was bisexual!!!!!!! But I mean just because my grandfather had died a week before my high school graduation and he basically raised me I should’ve known my youth pastor just wanted me to know homosexuality was and even though this triggered an eating disorder and anxiety issues I’m still dealing with today!!! And that same youth pastor who was caught cheating on his pregnant wife with an 19 year old intern! So his family had to leave the church!!!!!

[@LukeMcGuireoides]

I remember when we switched to a new assembly of god church when I was around 13 or 14 and the super christian kids were all up in my face, try to build relationships, as mentioned in this video, and when I would be receptive and try to be reciprocal, they weren't receptive. It was like they only cared about making me feel like people were interested in being my friend, but they didn't actually *want* to be my friend. Weird. It was a MAJOR turn off. That was when I began to pull away from christianity and see it for what it really is. So glad I woke up and saw through the sham facade. The kids were so fake and performative, hell, everyone was.

[@leslieyancey5084]

I had a similar experience with the Jehovahs Witnesses. They were only being “friendly” in order to recruit me into their ranks and put another notch on their service report! 🙄

[@phillipinek1856]

I used to be part of an assemblies of god church too

[@kaneconqueror6560]

I had a similar time one summer when I didn't go to the christian summer camp with the rest of the youth group. When they got back, several came up to me and expressed how they felt guilty about how they treated me and were gonna change. I called them out and told them exactly how things were gonna play out over the next year, including when the guilt would be forgotten, when they would start ignoring me again, and when they would start treating me like shit again. They looked shocked to have someone point out how fleeting their grand "change" was going to be, but they forgot all about that and moved on right on schedule.

[@brutalbasspro]

My grandma would put my in summer Bible camps when I was a kid. My grandparents lived on the other side of the state from us. I never knew anyone and never fit in my mom wasn't religious so the whole thing was weird. We all played arcade games and laser tag once that was fun but all the praying was hard for me. The youth pastor was/is also a cop so all his preaching and games were cops and robbers or beat cop stories. How many drug addicts he arrests and how fun it is when he gets to do swat training and dress like he's going to war on his home turf... his words not mine.

[@IvyLeather13]

They literally said "We need the kids to be taught by someone even more irritating than Steven Furtick."

[@camiw377]

The whole section about bonding with your kids blows my mind. I'm a substitute teacher but I've had longer term assignments, and if I went to my student's sports games or something I'd be opening myself up to a criminal case lmao

[@EvilDrHousegaming]

When I was in Youth Group I had a talk with the head pastor since he went on a rant about how "trans people are delusional" and I told him he was wrong and he said I was too young to know what I was talking about. I was 16 at the time and had been openly non-binary for 2 years.

[@Craxin01]

Damn, my skin was crawling throughout this ENTIRE video. When an adult starts acting like this around kids, the word grooming comes to mine. Yet, because these are people employed by the church, parents who would otherwise be chasing people like this off instead welcome them in. Revolting.

[@5superhombre]

The youth pastor from my high school years recently reached out to have me fill out a survey and I ghosted the guy and couldn’t really understand why I didn’t want to talk to him. But this video has helped me contextualize my discomfort with him and what he does for a living. He was never sexually weird but weird in a lot of other ways

[@JaredTVW]

I was a camp counselor at a Boy Scout Camp(which I know they have a negative impact due to perverted people) but one important rule was to never be completely alone with only one child. If you wanted to talk one to one, make sure it’s still public. These people saying they are having private conversations possibly in their office or online is giving me uncomfortable vibes.

[@kathrynvincent1563]

God I remember my final summer church retreat where they brought the college pastor and I just could wrap my head around God anymore and he zeroed in on me and wouldn’t let me express what I was trying to explain without going full lecture on me and I, as an 18 year old girl got scared. Afterwards he praised me for having such good questions and grasped my shoulders tightly. This technically isn’t SA luckily but when every touch is demonized and sexualized between guys and girls your own age, a grown man grabbing you feels like hell. And I left that church and haven’t returned cuz I just felt unsafe

[@ronwisegamgee]

Having some young, hip person or even just someone knowledgeable about pop culture just so that they can slink their Christian agenda onto you is fucking creepy.

[@TheHookahSmokingCaterpillar]

It's exactly the way the Hitler Youth operated if you read accounts of why kids said they liked attending, even when their parents disapproved.

[@brialapoint2608]

Thats youth pastors at their most innocent. It comes off as harassment at the very least

[@Colddirector]

Even when I was a lonely teen, the way they’d use fun and games only to spring the Jesus stuff on you at the end was super uncomfortable.

[@jmalmsten]

Whenever I see those videos from religious schools, especially the ones trying to be hip, there's something about them that always creeps me out down to the very marrow of my bones. It is a bit like watching Homelander in The Boys. That total lack of knowledge if the outcome will be worth the risks in staying.

[@salemcrow5078]

Your comparison actually gets funnier when you remember there is an actual youth pastor scene in the series where they have Starlight speak - and I think Homelander actually shows up there to speak too

[@jmalmsten]

@@salemcrow5078 oh, yeah. That sequence of events! (nervous laughter)

[@SPMunny]

The fact that all my female friends and I know at least one youth pastor who got a little too friendly with at least one teenager within their congregation and in more cases than there should be married one…. Yeesh

[@raccoonshand6271]

My mom had sent me to a Christian counselor a few years back. My mom thought it was some kind of rigorous religious therapy, but really, we just prayed at the end of every session. The lady was super cool, I connected with her well and she would often sympathize with things I had been going through. At this point, I knew I didn't belive in god but I didn't know why, and that was just amplified by my mental state. I remember talking to her about something I had been through when she began her sympathetic comments. She proceeded to tell me about a youth pastor that she had who had groomed and, she insiniuated, took advantage of her. My loss of faith felt real for the first time in that moment, and I could tell that in recounting, it was hard for her to believe. I feel awful for all the kids out there who were hurt by the people who they were told were their guidance and then forced into silence because of the church. It's a gross power dynamic that will never change because it's the people inside of the church who benefit, and to them, that's just "god's plan".

[@ulawan5]

As a scout leader, it's absolutely bananas to me that from how I'm hearing it, there are ZERO norms in youth ministry regarding what we call "two-deep leadership" in scouting, NO adult is allowed to communicate privately with a youth without being in eye/earshot of another adult. No digital solo communication without another adult present, either. And the Youth Protection Training certification is REQUIRED for every single individual over 18 that is registered with BSA, scouts who haven't aged out yet included. YPT also brings the red flags of grooming (REAL grooming.)/potential signs and symptoms of abuse front and center and quizzes you on them, as well as letting victims tell their stories of being abused within scouting. Being a registered adult also means you are a mandatory reporter to authorities outside of BSA. That organization has so many opportunities for abuse due to close contact with kids and that mentorship aspect, but I truly think that they are trying now to stop and prevent that abuse. It is MINDBLOWING to me that this kind of training seems to be actively disregarded and even discouraged by youth pastors. What in all fuck is going on over there.

[@bens7686]

When I was in seminary, we were taught explicitly with charts and demographic data to prioritize kids and teens for evangelism because they are easier to convince and have higher retention rates into adulthood if biased early.

[@SenorEscaso]

I didn't realize that the "always talk about how attractive their wives are for some reason" thing was a universal thing. My youth pastor used to always refer to his wife as "my smokin' hot wife".

[@celewign]

I think it’s an attempt to bond with hormonal kids who think immature thoughts like that

[@bethanythatsme]

I can't think of an interesting or clever way to say it, but I'm all together grateful for this channel & the sharing in the comments. Greetings and well wishes from Oregon, hope y'all are okay out there.

[@tos100returns]

Yay, Oregon! I hope we don't get those fires like what happened two years ago, where the sky was red for an entire month.

[@bethanythatsme]

@@tos100returns that was terrifying!!

[@0gammag0]

@@tos100returns when the Marshal Fire I think was raging here in Colorado, it was raining ash for several hours. Here’s hoping no fire-prone states get lit up this rest of the year!

[@hothog8261]

Gi Ducks!

[@marsrover5898]

i also used to feel terribly guilty for not inviting my friends to church and felt immense pressure to do so, it really made me feel like dirt

[@agluebottle]

Not being viscerally freaked out by the vibes youth pastors pit out is something you have to be conditioned to. Whenever one of these clips plays my stomach and shoulders tense right up.

[@five_6_seven_8]

I don’t understand how they can believe Jesus to be this fricken awesome, but ALSO you need a master class in sales to get anyone to care

[@iamashleyyvette]

It’s so weird 😩

[@pepperbee_]

My youth pastor (or a young priest organizing youth stuff) was the best person in the church institution I've ever known. He was so progressive and loved everybody. It actually got me thinking that religion might not be hating other things but LOVING good things. I always said he was too good to be a part of the church. It was so outlandish to me that a good person would associate with the organization. Turns out I was right. He got a girl pregnant and ran away one evening. They're now married and have a happy family together. Some people are REALLY too good.

[@lazyperfectionist3978]

yeah, we had one of these youth pastor groups in my high school, I distinctly remember a few times eggs got thrown at students (outside school hours in a separate building, of course, but that doesn't make it any better) as part of their games. It felt very strange having churches being allowed to perform inside a public school as a non-american atheist, as well as those same youth pastors running mandatory religious classes that you couldn't get out of without parental consent in both primary and high school I'm not proud to admit I used to spend some of my lunchtimes with these sorts of youth pastors, but mostly because there was either free food bible study or a bit of gambling with raffle tickets and the prize being snacks (I suspect it might have been the potential undiagnosed ARFID making me a bit food motivated since cafeteria food repeatedly made me ill and those two events had food that didn't upset my stomach).

[@stacie1595]

To be honest, adults showing up and showing support for students made a huge difference in my life. I understand that there is a point were it gets creepy and crosses a line into grooming but sometimes students really do just need a trusted adult to show up at a game or a show, say good job, and go. I'm a teacher and I was taught in university that attending school functions is a great way to show kids you care. Even as a student teacher, I attended a choir concert and a basketball game just so my students knew I was making an effort to participate in the community. I was also a dancer throughout my youth and young adulthood. My biggest and most positive role model was my jazz teacher who, despite being a high school math teacher during the day, would still show up to my talent shows and plays. Even to this day she is an adult outside of my family that had the most positive impact on my life and showed me how to be a dedicated and passionate educator. I get it that these youth pastors probably take it too far and do more harm that good but being a role model sometimes means putting in effort and showing up for a student that needs support, it just needs to be handled with care and as professionally as possible.

[@harvest1223]

as a volunteer of a of a church i 100% agree with this you cannot make it about yourself (the youth pastor) and not want people to lash out or quit hell even i quit

[@a.bastianwiik5592]

Wonder why Norwegian death metal became a thing? Youth Pastors. Really good at teaching musical instruments. Their lameness inspired. We had so many lame slow repetitive songs about Jesus being a Shepard and we being sheep. We used to color with bright colors of rainbows(lol) over Noahs ark and the Garden of Eden.

[@tos100returns]

In 1980, a youth pastor named Ash came to my school, from a group called Young Life. A bunch of us kids attended their presentation about that fun get-away in Colorado, where you can jump and fall down a hillside of pebbles. It looked like a great time, although it was too expensive. We played guitar, and Ash even taught me some chords. He also did this goldfish swallowing contest, which I had won. I didn't feel too good after 33 of those things. They tried to hide the Christian aspect of it at first, but a bunch of us kids weren't buying it. All the same, when I look back it was a VERY weird experience and a lame attempt.

[@khunt5336]

you swallowed 33 goldfish? were they live?

[@0gammag0]

@@khunt5336 I hope not, it would be so weird to feel them going down

[@UlexiteTVStoneLexite]

Please tell me they were goldfish crackers....... Please please tell me you're talking about crackers cuz do you know how many parasites those things carry? Those fish are not raised in the best environments and I do not recommend them being fed to fish. I worked in a pet store for 12 years and I constantly had to deal with those things caring parasites

[@VeraDragon]

Omg I had Young lyfe and Wild lyfe (for even younger kids) continuously pitched at my schools growing up It wasn’t until I actually attended one that I realized it was a Christian cult where we got preached to and then all sang sweet home Alabama (no literally, that was the last thing we did after the sermon, every time I went) Then party and swam at the giant pool at one of the leaders house

[@justadumbchrysanthemum]

I’m not sure how relevant this is, but my older cousin and I were Sunday School teachers at our church for a couple of years. (I was her assistant teacher.) I don’t know about her, but they did not do any background checks on me, I don’t think they were even aware that I was less than five years older than the kids we were teaching at the time. They definitely didn’t know that I personally made no effort to teach the kids about Catholicism and opted to teach them about dinosaurs and volcanoes instead because it’s objectively cooler.

[@sorcererinasweater7670]

It's also more useful information as well

[@0gammag0]

Considering that I don’t think many religious children understand that dinosaurs existed and went extinct, you were definitely doing them a favor

[@artsyhoodies]

My fight or flight response was activated by the sponsor. I've never even been in a youth pastor group, but that just hit every fiber of my being with fear.

[@bluecolumbine]

A church I went to growing up had a new youth pastor, he ended up marrying one of my peers. I honestly think he had groomed her because they got together very quickly after she became an adult, I feel like if it were organic it would have been a much slower onset. I think he was grooming her for some time before she was an adult. Really just grosses me out because he was like 10 years our senior.