432 Hz? You Miiiight Want To Check Your Sources

Sometimes finding how a trend started leads you to disturbing places.
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[@Bthelick]

Let's not even get into Veretasium's video asking if all published studies are flawed by nature of the publishing system.

[@julianmorrisco]

All published studies? Crikey. That’s a bit of a dick claim if it doesn’t have very, very strong evidence. It’s not as if we need to raise fundamental questions about science in our post-truth world. My wife’s thesis in 1986 was about bias in scientific studies, so this isn’t a new claim. But has anyone provided a workable alternative? Even if the system is somewhat broken, it still does more good than any other regime we’ve ever had. When I was a kid, my father did the world’s second heart transplant (he was a junior doctor on the team, anyway). The patient lived about six weeks longer and it was considered a triumph. People had something like a 25% chance of surviving ANY heart surgery at the time. Yet 25 years ago, 30 years after that transplant, my father-in-law (no relation! 😀) had a quad bypass. He died of dementia with a perfectly good heart a couple of years ago. It is the scientific establishment and its ’flawed’ system that enables that pace of advancement. In the 1980s an HIV diagnosis gave you about 5 or so years to live. I had a friend who was a haemophiliac and was given contaminated factor 8 (the clotting stuff, taken from blood donations) when he was about 15. He was dead before his 18th birthday and it was a grisly last couple of years for him. If it was today (put to one side the fact that blood is properly tested now) the HIV would be controlled for however long the haemophilia let him live. I still miss James and the fact that we found solutions to the thing that killed him is tragic and can still make me sad when I think about it. But without our science, nobody would be surviving HIV longer than a decade or do.

[@NunSuperior]

It's obvious we should tune down to 420 Hz.

[@traildoggy]

great for dub

[@ax14pz107]

Fuck that. I'm tuning to 469 hz.

[@8stringer1243]

Benn is gonna find you and cancel you. Adolph's birthday was 420

[@dannyroessler]

421! I always get a bit late

[@MPSpecial]

it used to be 415 we were SO CLOSE

[@MelindaGreen]

The studies were triple-blinded which is where the subject doesn't know what they're getting, the provider doesn't know what they're administering, and the researcher doesn't know what they're doing.

[@Chompchompyerded]

How did they manage to keep people with perfect pitch from knowing what they were getting?

[@FlowingInTheGodsLoveAndGrace]

What you mean ? Tell me why EXACTLY ROCKFELLER CHANGED THAT FREQ ???????

[@ewencousin]

From my experiences either in pro big band, or jazz combo, we usually ask for the piano to be tuned at 441 or 442 Hz, because the brass (I was trumpeter) are often higher in tune. The temperature variations make the sax/brass instruments drift. And moreover I recorded a small year ago with a bagad (breton trad orchestra) and a 7tet, with very high tuned instruments, so we had to tune up till 448 Hz (we could see it on the rev 2) and still felt low in tune. (And then, I don't think being the only one feeling that 440 Hz is low^^). But It's not - in my opinion - a subject worth to talk much about.

[@saoirsecameron]

I play Scottish highland bagpipes and they are tuned to A 451hz I think.

[@alexeypolevoybass]

As a former brass player (now a bass player), I confirm that temperature variations change the brass instruments' pitch ever so slightly, but still noticeably enough to adjust other instruments to. And that's not only because of the instrument itself shrinking, but due to air temperature also. There are fine tuning valves to accommodate for that, but sometimes they can't help enough.

[@Drmcclung]

1) what recording studio or concert venue in their right mind is going to pay someone to detune all 88 keys of their piano by ONE OR TWO hertz and 2) What exactly is this supposed to accomplish for drifting tune of the other instruments as the recording/show went on other than make the resultant binaural beat that much more irritating? Has the music industry really gotten this fucking ridiculous?

[@Blokfluitgroep]

​@@Drmcclungmaybe people use a digital piano?

[@ryanhurtt4074]

Not me reading that as "sexy brass instruments." LOL

[@kicsisziszi]

Get your instrument. Tune it to this and play it. After that tune it to that and play it. Then decide which works for you. That's it.

[@TheGirlWhoFeltTooMuch-Yayaa]

Perfect comment

[@TheAcousticRabbitHole]

@@TheGirlWhoFeltTooMuch-Yayaa Except for #3, A444Hz Schumann Resonance.

[@definitelynotdistracted]

@TheAccousticRabbitHole shoe man

[@TheAcousticRabbitHole]

@@definitelynotdistracted Sho 'nuff.

[@nicosuj]

That explains why after tuning everything 432Hz KZbin and instagram started to recommend those Alpha and sigma male channels, I read the word "Agenda" so many times it lost it's meaning to me.

[@marcusdavis4575]

Am I the only one alarmed by the International Flugabone Agenda?

[@naught101]

agender = non-binary?

[@chinmeysway]

Agenda’r?

[@mittenface]

Again, duh.

[@poison7512]

Its just the algorithm feeding you more nonsense conspiracy BS. Because you showed an interest. The agenda is to get you to keep clicking.

[@DisintegrationZerfall]

I tune my A to 4.32 Hz so only Elephants can enjoy it. Since then my audience got HEAVYLY invested in my music.

[@mirzaaljic]

You might mess up their ability to predict earthquakes if you keep tuning that low.

[@novi_key]

@@mirzaaljic COULD WE GO EVEN LOWER

[@yoymate6316]

on the other hand you’re probably making peanuts

[@book3100]

Elephant doom metal, absolutely groundbreaking.

[@0v_x0]

​@@novi_key Get the whale market

[@a_8764]

Couldn't have predicted LaRouche would make an appearance. Truly one of the most unhinged people in modern history.

[@zerologic7912]

I haven't watched the video yet, holy shit what a name drop

[@BirthquakeRecords]

Yeah, it came out of total left field for me too. Dude was an unhinged maniac, and I can’t help but laugh every time he comes up in conversation because he’s like the Green Goblin of right wing politics - just so cartoonishly awful that he doesn’t sound real (I’m also too young to have lived through any of his career, so I’m insulated from the actual horrors of his career, and can find it funny)

[@flow221]

@@BirthquakeRecords Have you taken a look at the current US Congress? In the 80s, someone like LaRouche had very little chance of being elected to anything anywhere. 40 years later, Christian nationalism and conspiracy nuttery have been normalized. He'd be a legit Republican candidate for office in 2023.

[@methyod]

@@BirthquakeRecords there is something inherently funny about the name lyndon larouche, you are seen & you are valid brother

[@coen123]

@@BirthquakeRecords and considering LaRouche got his start in left wing politics, and later ended up influencing a set of modern day nutjob "communists" that are mostly ignored/ridiculed by anyone who isn't a terminally online loser, there's a good case that he's kinda the Green Goblin of leftist politics as well! He truly is the nutjob that goes across the isle. A true hero for our politically divided age.

[@MaximusNYC]

It's also worth noting that these numbers -- 432, 440, etc. -- are all hertz, AKA cycles per second... and therefore, all of them are based on a completely arbitrary human unit of measurement: the second.

[@TheSSEssesse]

This is sort of a flawed way of disproving the theory considering the system of measure is in fact arbitrary yet the actual frequency itself is not. For example 3.1 miles and 5km are still the same distance.

[@RCrosbyLyles]

Was not expecting Lyndon LaRouche. Nice touch. Great reminder that crazy didn't just materialize over night.

[@JimAlfredson]

I love Neely's video and often link it to people online. As a professional piano tuner, the A432 thing just makes me laugh. Pianos are not only tuned to Equal Temperament, which results in lots of irrational numbers for each pitch other than A4, but must also be stretch tuned, so they don't even follow the actual mathematical formula for Equal Temperament, instead varying wildly as you go up and down the octaves. This means that tuning A4 to 432Hz often doesn't result in C4 being exactly 256Hz anyway. It can vary by half a Hertz or more depending on the size of the piano, the length of the strings, how the piano is scaled, etc. It's usually another irrational number like 256.12Hz or 256.73Hz. It's all just nonsense that preys on one's ignorance.

[@StripeyType]

This is not a disagreement with your sentiment, but as a point of fact we should let the record show that 'irrational number' has a specific mathematical meaning and that your two examples are not irrational numbers.

[@JimAlfredson]

@@StripeyType thank you for the reply. I'm not a mathematician so perhaps I don't understand the correct definition of 'irrational number', but my understanding is that it is a number than cannot be represented by a simple fraction or a ratio. Equal temperament consists of dividing the octave into 12 steps using the twelfth root of two (12√2) which is approximately 1.05946 and is not a rational number as I understand it. The main point of my comment is that we don't even use true Equal Temperament on pianos anyway. We stretch tune them. This is due to the inharmonicity of the strings, the way our ears perceive pitch, and other factors. So now we're not even dividing the octave by the rule of the 12th root of 2 that we devised in the first place, which again leads to even more irrational numbers.

[@eriktrips]

​@@JimAlfredson You are correct: irrational numbers are values that cannot be expressed as integer ratios. The two figures you post do not *look* irrational because, I assume, they are approximations of the irrational numbers they stand for--because a non-integer ratio can only be accurately expressed as an infinitely long decimal without a repeating pattern. But to tune anything in real time, you have to round off. Otherwise, the job would take forever!

[@StripeyType]

@@JimAlfredson yes you've got it right. I had not realized that the numbers you offered as examples were approximation of the twelfth root of two. You are correct that that number is indeed irrational. Thanks for setting my understanding correct.

[@JimAlfredson]

@@StripeyType your comment made me check my original statement and to make sure I'm not out here adding to the deluge of misinformation! So thank you!

[@mattnieri1202]

So according to history, you're fascist if you like 440, and you're fascist if you like 432. Sounds fair.

[@Amusiastudio]

Benn likes 440. He is aligned with Nazi’s and is a fascist

[@ginogatash4030]

I mean, this kinda frequency shit does have weird ties to other weird sigma/alpha male type shit which also often lead to alt right pipelines, I have been suggested that kinda dhit by KZbin after watching a bunch of 432 videos so at least in my experience there's a weird tie even if not direct, like it's unlikely that all the people into this frequency shit are on the same boat politically but even then a lot of the guys who make this shit present it really weird regardless of politics which makes it a perfect for other pseudo science like sigma males or mewing. Like whenever you google 432 hrtz shit on KZbin it's a lot of thumbnails that look like weird culty shit about big brain or even spiritual increase nonsense kinda like newing and other shit like that, makes one feel uneasy about the whole subculture regardless of fascism, you know?

[@bobSeigar]

That is a lot of words to say: "I'm reactionary" ​@@ginogatash4030

[@gwaccola]

439Hz sounds fair...

[@Meridian_58]

What if I don't like either but I'm a fascist anyway?

[@MikeRenouf]

Yep. Aphex Twin's 'Come to Daddy' at 432 Hz is SOOOo much more calming.... 😏

[@Acoustic-Rabbit-Hole]

Mike, Aphex Twin WAS an A-432 composer. And other alternate tunings. Play out his tunes over your piano. They don't match A-440 standardized tuning. And Aphex Twin would be in COMPLETE disagreement over what this mean-spirited post is suggesting.

[@MikeRenouf]

@@Acoustic-Rabbit-Hole damn I forgot to add the '#joke' I guess my attempt humour wasn't as obvious as I intended. I don't generally do mean-spirited.

[@jyjjy7]

@@MikeRenouf This person is claiming to speak for Aphex, just ignore them

[@frankmontoya4717]

@@MikeRenouf Hi, Mike. This Frank Montoya. I am The Acoustic Rabbit Hole. I have been banned from this video's replys for disagreeing. If any interest, I am a sound-to-color synesthete, and here is my KZbin page showing my work and color-shape associations. - the acoustic rabbit hole - kzbin.info/door/QzAv4E_kMLQLpK9vzQYg8Q

[@pluggerizer]

@@Acoustic-Rabbit-Hole i don't think that Afx tuned to 432 intentionnaly , he's using analog synths and loves to detune them as to produce phase shifts...kind of sure he's laughing out loud when hearing about the 432hz BS.

[@ryanreedgibson]

People also believe that vinal sounds better but it doesn't. It's just mastered differently due to the physical constraints of the media. Goebel's also killed his four children because he couldn't imagine a life without the NSDAP.

[@jannespor8178]

What's vinal?

[@ArtificialDjDAGX]

@@jannespor8178 a misspelling of the word vinyl

[@JoseGRendons]

By the way 432 Hz and 440 Hz only apply to the western Music, and guess what? there is a whole world out there beside the western , In China, Japan, India, Arabia , etc they use completely different frequencies and scales and their music language is way older than the Occidental Music Language.

[@VERAXON]

love this comment, there such a vast world out of the western music mental models.

[@squarelanguage]

Most people probably don’t listen to either 440 or 432 anyway. Often songs are played pitched up on the radio. Older recordings were sometimes pitched up when recorded on tape with varispeed to sound more energetic or to get all the separate recordings in the same pitch (e.g. Beatles “Strawberry Fields”). Janet Jackson’s “Rhythm Nation” was pitched up and sounds better pitched up, but also crashed particular hard drives. Adam Neely has a good video about this also. And then there’s DJ mixes played at varying tempos. If anything, tempo probably has more of an effect on mood or anxiety than actual tuning. That’s why it’s called “down tempo” or “up beat”.

[@burn_after_reading]

Yes, man you are making a good point. Not even one vinyl record on a dj gig is tuned to anything stable as long as the record is pitched up or down to beat match the tempos. This is so funny. It never disturbed me on a dance floor. Only some times when a track is pitched to an extreme it could ruin it but i agree it's because of the tempo being changed so much that the track looses it's character (except certain pearls that sound good totally screwed).

[@squarelanguage]

@@burn_after_reading used to dj so totally aware. I cringe when I hear pitches move too fast. Though at the same time it's interesting to see the crowd get excited when someone's doing a sloppy mix. Either it's the dissonance in rhythm (pitch slowed down) that people know will resolve or it makes people more aware a new track is coming in. Who doesn't like jazz

[@squarelanguage]

Though I do like pitch bending in music in general (funky bass lines come to mind)

[@collinbeal]

And science largely corroborates this tempo observation, showing that not just humans, but, in fact, various animals prefer music that is approximately their resting heart rate, along with being in the same range as their vocalizations.

[@joshsmith7033]

I thought radio songs were pitched down then sped up???

[@PosyMusic]

I agree with you. 440Hz is just a convenience to make instruments play in harmony, nothing more. Music can be out of tune in any way you want. In the early days I did that a few times myself by accident because I started with a sample of something that wasn't an instrument to begin with (and then tuned all other sounds to it, instead of the other way around...)

[@WellBadPanda]

Thanks for watching, and I hope to see you soon

[@BoshkoIgich]

If it sounds good who cares that you tuned your instruments to that sample!

[@necrobynerton7384]

@@BoshkoIgich Exactly! Music should be enjoyable in any way that sounds good. Lately I've been exploring microtonal music, and as weird as it sounds, it can turn out absolutely breathtaking if done properly! Music isn't and never will be a definite, just because you like a piece of music, it don't mean others will like it.

[@MilkoOfficialChannel]

So 432Hz couldn't be equally convenient to make instruments play in harmony? Our base 10 or decimal based math is what keeps us from getting "there". Base 12 it is, but if you like 10 fecking go with that but just stop imposing your stuff on the rest just because.

[@kaitlyn__L]

@@BoshkoIgicha lot of the Undertale soundtrack is half-flat or sometimes even more precise than that, and it works really well for them. Though only in the game, not on the official album. Not sure if that means the game is distorting them, or if they were (perhaps mistakenly) re-tuned for album release. Still, a lot of the nostalgic quality in eg the goat lady’s home comes from it being just a little flat like that; even folks who don’t know much about music and who probably don’t have perfect pitch complain about the album version sounding “colder” which I find interesting. Microtonal stuff is really cool, and a lot of older European pianos are A435 so that can definitely sound more right to some people… but any 432 stuff is total nonsense riding on the coattails of all those other real things.

[@inamorom]

Honestly as an Italian I've never heard of 432hz outside of American/ English KZbin. Will ask around, this was extremely interesting!

[@Acoustic-Rabbit-Hole]

Mr. Romani, here is some of my sound-to-color music theory. - kzbin.info/www/bejne/gKKYn5WDqZmtqKc

[@ChristianIce]

Confermo :)

[@lorenzo_bo]

ti sei perso Red Ronnie allora

[@anteatermusic]

Beati voi

[@jpalberthoward9]

When you tune to A=408, it puts the 432 at Bb, and it sounds great for the blues.

[@reaganharder1480]

You know, I did an experiment for a highschool psychology class regarding 432 tuning, and I found no correlation. Granted, my method was based on a highly subjective ranking of how relaxing a song was to a person, and my sample size was something like 8 teenagers, but if we want to be dealing with tiny and poorly conducted studies, I feel we should add my research to the pile.

[@ForeverConsciousResearch]

Make a video and put up a paper online :) Would love to hear more on what you have to say.

[@reaganharder1480]

@@ForeverConsciousResearch genuinely, I think the above comment is about all I have to say about that experiment. I doubt I still have any of documentation anywhere, and even as I was carrying out the experiment I knew it was far too small to be remotely conclusive. It was a highschool project and I mentioned it here mainly as a joke about poorly designed or executed experiments.

[@ForeverConsciousResearch]

@@reaganharder1480 8 is a small sample for sure but appreciate the response. Thanks for getting back to me.

[@RegebroRepairs]

I bumped into this first in 1989 when some people in my little town talked about their weird political party. And one of the pamphlets was about 432Hz. It started with "this is more authentic and how old music is supposed to sound", well, OK, that sounds reasonable and interesting. Aaaaaand then they started talking about the natural resonance of the spheres of heaven. 😀And also they wanted to colonize Mars, because that would somehow create world peace. And yeah, that's how I discovered the LaRouche cult. What nutcases.

[@naught101]

Look, if all those people would leave for Mars right now, it probably would contribute significantly to world peace.

[@coen123]

considering the current crop of Neo-LaRouchians are going on about building a cross-continental land bridge, their infrastructural and engineering ambitions have gone downhill

[@jennifersilves4195]

​@@coen123 Oh I haven't heard anything about the LaRouchies lately. I like my violin at 432.

[@drphosferrous]

Drop D tuning on an electric guitar that's already tuned down as far as possible without floppy strings is meant to invoke the devil but it doesn't work it just sounds cool.

[@Terrible_Peril]

@@drphosferrous that doesn't work for you? works for me! lol

[@mitchohriner3779]

That was a wild, wild ride! It's just so impressive how many skills you possess in music making, research, and public communication.

[@TheLeg3ndaryHooligan]

(Derogatory)

[@mitchohriner3779]

@MKULTRABOOST TV OK buddy...

[@silverXnoise]

I always used A=432 in my tradpunk group, Göebbel’s Wet Syringe’ Hot Revenge and His Secret Police-are you trying to suggest we had some kind of connection to fascism?

[@NevHayze]

I've just heard the frequencies break down better mathematically. this is actually a great video explaining this!

[@wsadhu]

Music throughout the history that we know was tuned to a variety of frequencies from 415 up to 455 Hz and maybe beyond those numbers both ways. The main idea was to tune the orcestra to A) the non-tunable instruments, B) to the frequency best resonating in the room where it is played. Thus we call the 440 a Viena tuning and for example a 435 - a Paris tuning, 450 - german church tuning, and so on... In some cases the tuning frequency was written in the piece along with the notes.

[@chrismillett]

As a music therapist myself, I always feel like you validate so much about my experience. We, as music therapists, are dealing with these misconceptions like 432 Hz and the Mozart effect and how they impact what people think I do (which is not magic lol).

[@johannalvarsson9299]

As audio-engineer, I feel you. We get confused with "audiophiles" all the time.

[@sk8pkl]

As an autodidact lover of learning, i am asking you.... Have you ever heard about musical temperaments? Have you really understood the necessity/problem with temperaments? Everybody who only speaks about 432hz without mentioning a temperament is lost in confusion. Have a great time studying and understanding. I did.

[@TheAcousticRabbitHole]

Ironically it's A440hz that takes the magic OUT of the music.

[@Chompchompyerded]

Mozart tuned to 422. Handel to 418. A has been on the rise constantly it seems. The earliest tuning fork (made by John Shore in England, 1711) was set at 414 cycles per second.

[@ThreadBomb]

@@Chompchompyerded The lower tuning was practical, because the all-wood string instruments would bend or break at higher tension.

[@dirg3music]

Im so excited to see this one. I've been saying it for what feels like forever now that 432hz is the flat earth theory of music. lmao. This is gonna be great.

[@avianna7738]

I mean, musically speaking, it does literally make for a “flat” Earth. 😂

[@dirg3music]

@@avianna7738 lmaoooo. Holy shit I didn't even think about that.

[@zackkorth2410]

was going to make this same comment. not surprised someone else thought of it, people like to imagine there's a "better way" and they have the key to it, i think they're just bored.

[@ThenVersusNow_]

Young people were raised being able to look up information on their phones and now it is backfiring. It's like they missed the fundamentals of science and life.

[@dirg3music]

@Versus I think it comes from that all too familiar human desire to be "in the know", and people searching for information based on how it makes them feel rather than concrete facts. Adam Neely said it really well, it's easy to look around at the world and see something is fundamentally wrong and to try and find a way to explain that. But tuning systems ain't it. Lmao

[@iso_brown]

20 years ago I discovered the Flashbulb and enjoyed it a lot, time passed, and now I discover that you are not only a great musician but also someone who has a lot of interesting things to say. So I just want to say thanks !

[@Vexadrem]

I would have never knew til I read this comment. Never knew his real name or what he looks like. Adult swim exposed me to the flashbulb forever ago

[@tricitytypebeat8622]

This was a great video, loved this info. Definitely gave you that sub afterwards. I agree with you, people gotta do their own thing but don't try forcing ideas on other people. If they wanna listen to it like that, they can grab it and change it themselves, it isn't hard to do

[@isingatlantic]

Great video - appreciate the history - this is a thread into research I've been doing. Thank you for mentioning the difference between tuning the instrument to said frequency rather than pitch shifting it. As a music artist, it's important to experiment with these tunings and then make a decision off of what feels, sounds, or resonates best with the artist. I wish more artists would be willing to release two separate recordings of the same song in those two different frequencies and see how that resonates with the audience. I do love sonic datura and overtones though and there is a distinct difference between both tunings.

[@ckline]

C being 256 Hz when A is 432 Hz only works in Pythagorean (3-limit Just Intonation) tuning, which has seen very little use in the last few centuries. In the current 12-equal system, C would be 256.8687... Hz when A is 432 Hz. 12-equal historically came about as a simplification of Meantone temperament, which itself came about as a compromise between Pythagorean tuning and 5-limit JI. The reason for this compromise is the 3-limit major third, ratio 81/64, sounds rough and discordant, while the 5-limit major third, ratio 5/4 (or 80/64) sounds restful and at peace, but by slightly fudging the values of 3, 5, and/or 2, the difference between these two tones (81/80) gets tempered out. The purity of the whole numbers is sacrificed a bit to make these two major thirds identical. When we think of the note "C" in relation to the note "A" within the current meantone/12tet paradigm, we usually say that "A is a minor third (6/5) below C" or "A is a major sixth (5/3) above C". These are 5-limit ratios. We think of "F" as the 'subdominant' of "C"; it is a perfect fifth (3/2) below "C" or a perfect fourth (4/3) above "C", and "A" is a major third (5/4) above that. (4/3)*(5/4)=5/3. We don't tend to think of "A" as a 27/16 ratio (although 27/16 and 5/3 are equated in 12tet and all meantone systems). But for C to equal 256 Hz and A to equal 432 Hz in the same tuning, A would have to be a pure 27/16 ratio above C, not a 5/3, and not a tempered midpoint between them. Basically, if you're using A432 to get "nice round whole numbers" for your frequencies, and you're using virtually any instrument available today, you're doing it wrong.

[@ckline]

and that's not even getting into the fallacy of seeking "nice round whole numbers" when multiplying ratios, especially within a base-10 numbering system

[@bacicinvatteneaca]

I didn't understand shit :D

[@tommyfinke]

THIS!

[@TheMirolab]

I can understand why someone might "feel" that the same music played at a slightly lower pitch is warmer, fuller, and more relaxing. Because IT IS! That's what lowering the pitch does, but not because it's more in-line with our molecular heartbeat. It's like comparing 2 processes in audio (eq or compression), whatever process makes the music louder will sound better to us. Now how about we debunk Solfeggio Tones!

[@jaxhassler8024]

What do you mean debunk?

[@mttlsa686]

What are solfeggio tones???

[@homeopathicfossil-fuels4789]

Actually A432 sounds more depressing, soul draining and sad to me than the established standard. Even spooky, and knowing its origin just reinforces the spook-factor for me. Bassy music is nice but it feels like 432 is in an uncanny valley of the seriously geologically unstable kind.

[@TheMirolab]

@@homeopathicfossil-fuels4789 Yeah... but that's how it just makes YOU feel. Music is a highly personal experience. The feelings invoked in me by different genres of music are very different than the feelings invoked into you, or other people. The same would go for tunings. For many, Opera music lifts their spirits. For me, it's nails on a chalkboard. There is no universal rule.

[@homeopathicfossil-fuels4789]

@@TheMirolab Well I was literally describing my subjective experience of the music, so your point is kinda moot. The uneasyness is amplified by knowing its related to insane fascistoid new age cults [to me].

[@kitwheston]

I have a feeling these comments are gonna get spicy, and the video isn't even out yet... this and your women in producing video are amazing, please keep covering topics like this!

[@stephenroldan5107]

Think I know what your saying. Lol

[@Taschenschieber]

"females"?

[@Graham_Wideman]

@@Taschenschieber See earlier video kzbin.info/www/bejne/aHrTk2tnr5lpoas

[@Taschenschieber]

@@sashafury2422 I've figured out OP was referring to this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/aHrTk2tnr5lpoas Some quotation marks would have helped...

[@mronewheeler]

My brother got really into 432Hz for a while as a teenager and he bought a program that would convert his mp3 library to that tuning. He then explained to me how 432Hz made the kick drum resonate a lot more with him. And I, being a drummer, told him that that's odd since a kick drum isn't tuned to 440Hz to begin with. The tricks our minds can play on us when we become convinced

[@josefavela1654]

What if Satan approves of Fidelity in a marriage. Does that make it wrong? 🤔

[@VIRALBEATS360]

I always wondered where this conversation came from..."Post truth" is right. There seems to be a collective revisiting of these fascist watermarks, that is entirely intentional. I'm glad that people are picking up on it, and you are sharing this, on your platform. Great work!

[@LarsBjerregaard]

Nah. It's post-truth allright, and that just means people abandon any notion of established, objective truth, or solid science, and think they can claim that whatever they think is true is the truth, and so they do that. But yeah, the Italian angle was funny, didn't see that one coming. Just another instance of "reality is stranger than fiction".

[@homeopathicfossil-fuels4789]

Thanks to you and Benn Jordan for making me feel less insane and alone in this observation. I felt like that one episode of Voyager where Seven of Nine downloads the entire ship's database into her cortical implants and makes wild associations, but there is an actual thread of coherence though all of this. A lot of the things expressed by modern spiritualists remind me of what little actual fascist theory I could dust up and read about (Sun Tzu's advice of knowing your enemy better than your friend) especially fascistoid art movements.

[@whatabouttheearth]

I'd certainly say the "post truth" movement is "right", usually very "right".

[@kaitlyn__L]

@@homeopathicfossil-fuels4789very true. “alternative” or new age stuff has been incubating this stuff for a long time but it’s definitely getting a lot worse lately. love the username btw

[@axeman2638]

And you never stopped for a second to wonder why?

[@alrecks619]

ah yes, the 432hz to having crappy worldview pipeline.

[@MumbleEtc]

I am glad you mentioned that it's not inherently wrong to listen to 432hz music in here. I'm absolutely no defender of the claims that music tuned to it makes it inherently more spiritually potent, but I will say that the few times I've heard music in 440 replayed in 432 for comparison's sake have felt like the aural comparison of when the shower water is a liiiittle too cold, so you turn it up and it feels just that little bit nicer on the skin. Though I think this feeling could be achieved by going from 440 to any slightly lower frequency, and is just a natural response to hearing higher frequencies calm down if only a little. I think *that* feeling is a very easy one to exploit and misunderstand as "hearing it in the right frequencies". If you played music to these musical flat-earthers without perfect pitch in, say, 444hz, and tuned it down to 440 by comparison, and pretended that you went from 440 to 432, they'd probably believe you and likely have exactly the same reaction.

[@KP-ky1kh]

This makes sense. I think lowering any parameter (volume, tempo, etc.) combined with the fact that people can compare it to some original will often lead to the idea that the version with the lower parameter sounds more calming or balanced. You could do it with any sound probably, not just music. Going up on a slider usually intensifies something, while going down usually calms things down. And yeah, most people probably wouldn't notice any effect unless they are able compare two versions or if they're told it's the specific frequency they want it to be (even if it isn't). That alone should make people stop and think about how much they create inside their own head and how much is actually caused by vague universal and natural forces. Our brain plays tricks on us all the time, but it can be hard to admit and accept that, so instead we point to external forces. Which is fine, as long as it doesn't harm others...

[@ricochetsixtyten]

There is a difference, alot of my favourite IDM is in 432hz and the difference is there, I dont buy any of the conspiracy theories though, I think it just sounds better because its more unusual and the brain likes some novelty.

[@nickwallette6201]

@@ricochetsixtyten I honestly doubt the ability of any average listener to distinguish the difference between 432 and 440Hz without comparing them side by side. Like, play a song at one tuning today, and another tomorrow, and 9.9 times out of 10, nobody would even know you did anything to it. The only thing good to come out of this whole movement was that, when I first discovered this was even a thing, I watched a video of a side-by-side comparison, and discovered an artist being used as the sample song. I've since listened to and enjoyed it quite a bit -- at its normal speed.

[@aerowise1321]

The earth is flat, 432 days of the year. All the rest it’s a plane.

[@Begly-k1i]

As a brit, 440Hz was definitely a psy op. We're still sore about that tea in the harbour incident. We're also bitter about your lack of 'u' in harbor.

[@SFLogicNinja]

When my students brought this to me when I was teaching back in the day, I really tried to be open minded about things. After looking into things, I could not find any good data. Also, our relative pitch is pretty strong and testing is really difficult to do right. This video was a wild ride. Thanks!

[@walter.liebich]

This is an interesting topic, I agree to most extend and I would like to add some historical dimension to the topic. I'm playing a historical church organ of 1892 which is tuned at 20 degrees Celsius to 434 Hz... in winter it changes to 432 Hz ... in hot summer then maybe 437 Hz and sometimes organ can't accompaign other instruments with my organ, because other instrument are tuned to 440Hz, and extraordinary work would have to be done by an amateur to get the other instrument tuned to the organs tune. Tuning the historical organ would mean to hurt thousands of pipes. Same with old pianoforte's called hammerklavier which were used by Beethoven and Mozart... those old piano's sometimes don't have a metal frame, it is sometimes only a wood frame, to withhold the tension of all the more than 100 strings..(1,5 tons on modern piano).. And yes there are some orchestras around, playing on historical instruments with below 440 Hz. Modern orchestras play at 442 Hz to even 445 Hz, but yes this can be a problem for human voice to get High C for the Tenor in an opera etc... Did you know that when Nazi Germany declared 440 Hz as standard, American and other nation's orchestras didn't want to follow Nazi German order and started playing 442 Hz? I saw a Beatles band portrait in your video, did you know that records of Beatles always were tuned a little bit higher than 440 Hz... another thing is, that if you have an orchestra accompanying a woodwind or brass or even string instrument, those solo instruments tend to be tune higher e.g. if you blow more air into well tuned flute, it might deviate to a slight higher tune, without audience really realizing it, or even appreciate it. Before 17.th century the tuning in Germany floated depending the region between 450 and 480 Hz. The organ in Leipzig where Johann Sebastian Bach played was tuned to 465 Hz. After Bach there was long a definition of 441 Hz Cammerton. The french standard was in older n time 408-392 Hz. In France there was a standard in 18th century 416 Hz. So i really appreciate the modern standard a 440Hz standard, but old piano music might have sounded differently. Strings which have not such a high tension give a more round, less treble sound. But treble is nowadays wished...

[@victoriab8186]

*thisss* and yet in England, the idea that historically tuning was lower than today is so prevalent that we perform Bach that was written in Leipzig at 415. Which is utterly stupid

[@macronencer]

Any argument that uses the intrinsic properties of values in Hz is automatically assuming that one second has some kind of significance in the universe. If people really want to go there, then they should count in vibrations of Caesium atoms or something. Seconds are arbitrary.

[@callmesleeper]

Fun fact. I clicked the like that turned it from 432 to 433.

[@Eaglemadhatter]

Its almost like the Google knows how to

[@chebghobbi]

This video is no longer in tune with the Universe thanks to you. I hope you're pleased with yourself.

[@AdamGoodlet]

As a 432Hz music advocate, I LOVE this video! I use 432Hz tuning to align a system of harmonic BPMs, by using this as the tuning frequency, the harmonic BPMs are much easier numbers to use in a DAW, with fewer decimal places to allow this. The system of harmonic BPMs have changed my live set for the better in amazing ways - Every sound I create can be used at any BPM and be in-tune with the performance.... I've been performing electronic music for 25 years, and the harmonic BPM framework has been the most significant thing I've done! Your analysis of the nonsense and waffle is amazing - for me, it's all about the maths and the fundamental numbers - Intention trumps tuning 100% of the time! Thanks Benn.

[@benavanzato5127]

I am curious what this sounds like. Can you link to a video of you playing with harmonic bpms and how it makes your set better?

[@AdamGoodlet]

@@benavanzato5127 I’ll be putting some content online soon - All of the maths and frameworks are outlined in a book called Mathemagical Music Production - it’s on Kindle as well as hard copy - essentially linking the BPM to the key… when re-pitched all the keys work harmoniously, for example, allowing you to take a sound made in A @ 101.25 bpm, speed it up to 135 and it plays in D - I’ve built an ableton set with hundreds of sounds, and I can jam them all together, seamlessly switching genre and style - planning a few videos soon so will keep you posted :) 🎶🔊

[@MisterMunkki]

Oh God someone went down the iceberg to the "sound is rhythm" level xD Sounds interesting honestly ! But it doesn't HAVE to be 432 really. And when you start getting into the "math" of sound it can get crazy. The acoustic "beat", distortion, intermodulation... "color" or "movement" in a sound

[@AdamGoodlet]

@@MisterMunkki Agreed it doesn't have to be 432Hz... But... The harmonic BPMs are far more accessible in the tuning - there's a book called Mathemagical Music Production on Kindle - it's pretty epic, dives deep into the maths, and best tuning systems to use to get the best numbers - well worth a look :D

[@InBeats-o4q]

128 BPM is heart rythm

[@machinageist]

This was excellent. I wish there was content like this about the 528hZ solfeggio stuff too. Many of the websites promoting these concepts of present the two as if they are both simultaneously true, and they are wildly inharmonic with each other. One other thing I would like to note is that many of the 432 proponents also wish to abandon even temperament and use whole number values for note frequencies. Which would make simply tuning your instruments or recordings down 32cents insufficient anyway. The vast majority of music made in 432 is still even temperament though, negating much of the claimed of esoteric value. The whole thing doesn't stan up to the least bit of critical investigation.

[@bryananthony6086]

The solfeggio frequencies can be debunked pretty easily because the whole premise is that they came from Gregorian Chants in the middle ages, and yet there’s absolutely no surviving information, documentation, or even oral history that would be able to indicate what “frequency” the Monks used to Establish a fundamental for their basic scales. They picked whatever worked for the choir leader, or what the choir leader knew would work for the choir.

[@tunes2you1111]

@@bryananthony6086 why so triggered over this topic? Just carry on doing your thing and let others do their thing. I have faith in you, you can do it.

[@usualatoms4868]

I prefer A=220 Hz myself. It's much lower and makes everything sound super nice, but it's still consistent with the 440 Hz tuning so you can jam. Only an octave lower of course.

[@zbnmth]

:'D

[@Merlincat007]

Hell yeah! Run everything through polyphonic octavers! Haha

[@bricelory9534]

HAINBACH, is that you?? Play it back at half speed!

[@chrsm]

Woof Woof. I prefer 28160 🐕

[@ewwitsantonio]

i prefer a solid A27.5, full volume, only through subwoofers, mostly to help constipation, which is a spiritual blocker

[@rado3714]

Baffled as to how you have time to make these great videos - not to mention the background research involved - and still manage to put out amazing work like your recent album but I appreciate it all.

[@s90210h]

b probably just uses his downtime in one video as the moment to research something else. I can picture him reading these 432 articles on that little dingy boat he had in the Florida swamps with the 'gators

[@MontoyaMatrix]

When one hates Spirituality THAT much, he will take out extra time to lash out. - www.youtube.com/@theacousticrabbithole9608

[@JUNO-69]

The little sound edits tuning down when you speak the words are so damn cool and immersive

[@AshleyGittins]

Yes! Awesome little nuggets :-)

[@DenariusHaveNarius]

Having just heard about the 432Hz idea, I tuned my guitar to it. Not because of any of the theories but just to lower the tension a little bit and see if that alters my playing in any way. I'm more interested in microtuning but haven't dug into it too much other than trying a few tunings.

[@rhov-anion]

Back in high school, our lead clarinetist got a brand new instrument for Christmas, which cost his "not exactly well off" family a ridiculous amount. Yet for how expensive it was, it came out of the factory tuned horrifically bad. His parents were not musicians and didn't know this. When he tried to play it, it sounded "off." With everything pushed in all the way, he just could not get it in tune. They tried to get a refund but were denied. He was stuck with it, and his parents couldn't afford to buy him another one. He was our lead clarinet, with lots of solos, so the entire band tuned up in order to match him. Like... A LOT UP!!! I had to push my trombone all the way in. Now, in everyday practice, it didn't really matter what we tuned to. In most concerts, our audience was parents, siblings, and maybe the nearby retirement home. No one could tell we were not tuned to A440. Until we met a judge with perfect pitch. Every year, we competed in a state-wide concert band festival. Three judges sit out in the concert hall, a copy of the score in hand, they can jot down notes onto the score or tape record their impressions out loud (it was the 90s). One of the judges caught on right away that we were tuned high and BLASTED us for it. From the stage, we could hear this judge yelling into his recorder... which NEVER happened. He went up to our band director afterward and really laid it onto him. Our band director tried to defend his choice in tuning high due to our lead clarinetist having a defective instrument. This judge basically ordered that the kid trash the clarinet, and if he can't afford a new one, then use a school clarinet, but never set foot in another competition tuned like that. He could have used this "flaw" to affect our score, but the judge leniently did not, with a warning that if we ever competed tuned like that again, he would give us a zero. The poor kid couldn't get a refund, couldn't afford a new clarinet, so he was stuck with this super expensive, super defective hunk of wood. In college, he gave up on his dreams of playing music professionally. Rather sad... I always felt that if he had not had such negative reactions to a purchase that surely put his family back a lot of money, he may have continued to play. The takeaway: always make sure you can play in tune before purchasing a musical instrument.... and that means A440!!!!

[@scottdavis7730]

“If your clarinet is playing consistently sharp, you’ll need to pull the barrel out.“. Clarinets can be tuned which is much more practical than changing an entire band’s tuning. Had he bothered to take even one professional clarinet lesson, he could have saved himself a lot of grief.

[@jateurlings]

Benn, videos like these are why you are my hero.

[@bendudding]

Hilarious video! I recently had a friend who was obsessed by 432 so I looked into it and saw how flakey the pseudo science was behind it and also looked at some of the history of tuning standards in classical music. A much bigger difference in my opinion is the difference between equal temperament and just intonation. Also should we ban anyone from playing in A flat or other keys that don’t include A - 432? You are bang on about the whole point of a standard that everyone adheres to is that you can play along on other instruments or Dj etc. Love your work - keep it coming.

[@kaitlyn__L]

LMAO never thought about the just intonation thing. I’ve seen people ask for A432 saxophones but… like you say they’re not tuned to that! Maybe a C melody sax in whatever range would play the 256 lmao

[@awesomeduder]

the funniest option on any of my instruments, by far, is probably my Alpha Juno being able to switch to A432 tuning. thanks for that, Roland!

[@nickwallette6201]

It would be hilarious if some vendor intentionally included a 435Hz option, just to troll. haha

[@viewoftheaskew]

I tune my guitar to 432Hz, I like the way it sounds and it's a little easier to play as the strings have a little less tension. It also helps a little when singing high notes.

[@zapazap]

Have you tried 428?

[@Berk-lf6ge]

Have you tried 427 Hz?

[@chebghobbi]

Have you tried lower tension strings?

[@JimVajda82]

Great video, I didn’t expect Lyndon LaRouche! My challenge to 432 Hz is why is it only a note’s fundamental frequency and none of its harmonic content that makes it “in tune with the earth” or whatever? No matter the tuning, most music has a lot of information at 432 Hz. Cut it with a notch filter to hear the difference.

[@FretboardToAsh]

I respond positively to Slayer, Bolt Thrower, Death and Sodom. It is legitimately calming to my already overly speedy pattern-obsessed brain. I don't think any of them bothered lowering their songs to that pitch though.

[@sebp400]

man, Bolt Thrower. I remember buying Realm of Chaos before I knew them. that's some classic death.

[@vesellin]

Slayer are nazis

[@ronanwhit]

[EDIT] While the book I mention below does predominatly focus on tuning systems (which are not the same as a reference pitch for said system), it also discusses the topic of different reference pitches used within Western Art Music, which does relate to the topic of this video. [Original Post] A book I would highly recomment to anyone interested in learning more about tuning and temperament (which tie quite well into this topic) is "How Equal Temperament Ruined Harmony" by Ross W. Duffin. It discusses the topic in a very interesting and accessible way, and while it doesn't discuss 432 as a tuning pitch, it shows that over the years us musicians performing Western Art Music have set our A a many different frequencies over the years, and we still do! A442 is common with symphony orchestras in the USA, A440 is common in the UK, and in Germany it is often A443 or even higher! Thanks for yet another really engaging video Benn!

[@SineBeta]

Humm, interesting,. The tuning differences may be related with pitch inflation.

[@koraamis5568]

When I was a kid, I was in a kids orchestra in school, once we went to play at a place at high altitude, and the instruments got affected so we did not tune to 440, and according to the director that seemed to be a normal solution in such cases, he actually liked to use 445 Hz quite often anyways, just because of his personal taste for the music we werte playing. Tuning depends a lot on the directors and of course the oboe.

[@janzabram]

A great counter-point to Duffin's work is Webern's "The Path to The New Music," which outlines how evolving tuning systems gave rise to the conditions needed to formulate harmony as we know it and also to the logical evolution of harmony into serialism.

[@ronanwhit]

@@janzabram That is a great point, it is pretty difficult to perform chromatic music with 1/4 comma meantone! The section toward the end of the Dufffin does address this in quite a nice way, if I remember correctly

[@TheGotoGeek]

For an explanation that doesn't have an axe to grind :-), try this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/ipjakpx7gNOAirM

[@tungtobak]

I tried making a couple of songs with a=428, just to try doing "wrong" on purpose. I initially tuned to Rowland S Howards guitar in an old Birthday Party song. It works, but it sounds like you've run the tape slow on playback. Sort of fun effect.

[@DrClocktopus1]

All music would be better if we tuned to Rowland S Howard

[@rainbowkrampus]

@@DrClocktopus1 I don't think my music system has that many letters.

[@avianna7738]

Yeah, I don’t know about this supposed opinion that it sounds “better”. To me it sounds slow and unnatural, like I’ve just entered a horror movie.

[@rainbowkrampus]

@@avianna7738 It sounds like priming to me. Someone is told a thing by a person who presents some kind of credibility display (this is a social display, not actual evidence of credibility) and so the person becomes primed to believe a thing before they've even encountered it. They've made an association between the credibility display and the thing itself. So when they do encounter the thing itself, they buy into whatever the claims about the thing were uncritically.

[@tungtobak]

@@avianna7738 I wouldn't say "better" either, but sometimes slow and unnatural can be just what a song needs. I play mostly stoner doom type of stuff so you can see how this tuning might fit the music.

[@TheJohnniegolden]

God BLESS YOU BENN FOR SPEAKING IT AS IT IS! KEEP GOING AND DON"T STOP! LOVE AND PEACE TO YOU.

[@SFLogicNinja]

When my students brought this to me when I was teaching back in the day, I really tried to be open minded about things. After looking into things, I could not find any good data. Also, our relative pitch is pretty strong and testing is really difficult to do right.

[@noahlovotti7722]

432 hz guy: "These sheep don't know anything about pure harmony" People who do: "Then why don't you ever play in Just Intonation" 432 hz guy: "In what? Is that a Tesla term?"

[@lefunghi6151]

What a ride, loved every minute of it. The sheer etertainment value of some of these insane rabbit holes is just great

[@frasermoffatt1817]

I love it when skepticism meets BS! Well done, Benn.

[@originalamias]

This was excellent, love how you cut through the bull with science as knowledge, huge respect, you are making the world cleverer

[@sinewaymusic]

Your video production quality is just so impressive. And you always research your topics so well. Hats off!

[@Michael_Smith-Red_No.5]

I get around these tuning debacles by writing all of my songs in the key of H.

[@ghbytdsrfhb]

and all real musicians' songs are 69 BPM

[@tungtobak]

Funnily enough in some countries B was for a long time called H. It's basically because of an ancient typo, lower case b looking a lot like a h. I live in Sweden and learned the notes like this but rejected it and starting using b as soon as I started making music with a computer. Germany still uses h to this day.

[@PiesliceProductions]

In finland it is H as well

[@Civilizashum]

jazz people used to call that a hillbilly key (key of B).

[@FEO]

I've always found the 432hz thing ridiculous but had no idea how deep this rabbit hole went. Thanks for the vid.

[@brigglerintune]

Verd-ee. He wasn’t a random Opera singer. He was one of the most important artists (composers) of the 19th century. There was no standard tuning in Europe at that time. Some Opera arias are more difficult to sing now because the original pitch was almost a half step lower. That may have been his concern. He also didn’t like tubas. He preferred cimbasso. I don’t care what pitch you’re tuning to. I play trombone. We can tune to anything!

[@diannebettag9313]

@diannebettag9313 1 second ago Thanks for your defense of Verdi. He was also an elected official in Italy and got legislation passed there to lower the pitch to 432hz in order to save the voices of the singers. Below is a Reply I made above. "It's amazing that you are the first one to mention one of the problems of singing at the higher pitches. The reason the Schiller Institute was able to get every major opera singer to sign onto the call for lowering the pitch is that the higher pitches are ruining their voices and causing them to retire earlier. The other reason is that the register shifts show up in the wrong places, changing the meaning of the composers' intentions... "

[@ruggerobelloni4743]

Larouche and Verdi should not be mentioned in the same bit. Think Trump /Einstein. An idiot and a Genius sharing a single opinion can happen. Verdi was only thinking of singers. Most stupid ideas have a US origin. In 20 years in California I heard It all:TV soaps / Shakespeare, Chaplin/3 Stooges,same level. Bach and Mozart were prolific because they had no TV. As an Italian musician I see more Anglos with trendy fixations. All Blues and Jazz guys I met (b.1910/23) were all music and no bull, including some who worked with Benny Carter and Duke Ellington. An original 1823 Guadagnini guitar I had returned to 430 by itself while my modern ones (1923/28/48 51/59/67/83) sound "right" at 440, flabby if lower,shrill if high Most string instruments were invented or perfected in Italy, and also musical terms , even Orchestra (mispronounced) I played American music all my life and this great US gift to the world sadly comes from folks often despised and slavery. Tuning to one's voice range was common.Classical friends I know use 415/430/435/440 for diffent periods. Love music and let us shut up and play.

[@NickBatinaComposer]

bro ty for this contribution, I felt like a lone warrior in the comment sections about this topic for years

[@Luos_83]

Pfffff. Watched this one as it was on my backlog, and now youtube is "Oh you watched something 432 hz? here's a million videos about it"

[@DanielBobke]

I went down this rabbit hole because I had a customer bring me some guitars to work on (a session musician) and he asked me to tune them to A=432 Hz. That is the first time that has been requested in my time as a guitar tech, so I got curious as to why someone wanted to do this. What I found was a lot of conjecture, hippie frequency worship, ridiculous reasoning, and crystal worship-like mumbo jumbo about it. If I had to hear one more time that it is the "frequency of the universe" I was going to punch my screen. I will tune your guitar however you want, but the 432 Hz counter culture is laughable, to be honest.

[@Poopymattyt]

3 6 9. Nikola tesla understood that very well

[@PlonkapplePrequel]

I do not understand the 432hz thing at all. However.. My music player app has a playback speed setting, and it is fun to slow down fast music like EDM and breakcore to hear how different it feels. I usually do like -6 semitones or -5.

[@unclemick-synths]

I habitually play up-tempo EDM videos at 0.75 for a deeper groove.

[@SusanG03]

In 1939 John D Rockefeller shifted the global tuning frequency purposely to 440 hertz

[@davislottmusic]

432 is ONE NOTE

[@Civilizashum]

"The claim that John D. Rockefeller or the Rockefeller Foundation, in collaboration with the Nazis, intentionally shifted the global tuning frequency to 440 Hz in 1939 is not supported by credible evidence. Here are the key points to consider: International Agreement In 1939, an international conference hosted by the International Standards Association in London resulted in a recommendation to use 440 Hz as a standard tuning frequency. This decision was made as a compromise among various tuning systems in use at the time, and it was not driven by any single entity or individual7 9. Lack of Evidence for Conspiracy There is no substantial evidence to support the conspiracy theories involving the Rockefeller Foundation or the Nazis in promoting the 440 Hz standard for sinister purposes. These claims, often attributed to Leonard G. Horowitz, have been debunked as unfounded and lacking in historical accuracy369. Historical Context The adoption of the 440 Hz standard was a result of a broader effort to standardize musical pitch, which had varied significantly across Europe and other regions. The standard was formally adopted by the International Organization for Standardization (ISO) in 1955, not in 19397 . No Direct Involvement by Rockefeller or Nazis There is no credible evidence that John D. Rockefeller or the Nazi regime, including Joseph Goebbels, played a direct role in imposing the 440 Hz standard as part of a conspiracy to control or manipulate people through music369. In summary, the claim that John D. Rockefeller shifted the global tuning frequency to 440 Hz in 1939 as part of a conspiracy is not supported by factual evidence." - Perplexity dot AI

[@Civilizashum]

You're spreading misinformation. It's not that hard to check this today.

[@TheGarageBandSyndicate]

I play guitar and have found 432 more enjoyable and disonate especially with open tuning which is great for playing Tool covers. I always ask if the other musicisns I play with are comfortable with tuning to me, and am always willing to go 440, but never met anyone who really gave a crap either way.

[@roanman7409]

Hendrix famously tuned down to Eb which is equivalent to somewhere just above 415 A4 which is very near the prevalent tuning for Baroque music ... Bach, et al. I have tuned down a couple songs over the years because I "feel" dance music to be a little more powerful ... maybe richer somehow when it comes to that hitting you in the chest thing when you drop it half a step. But I also freely admit that this particular feeling might likely reside just down the same street from the placebo effect.

[@maxp552]

Benn and his comment section are the new generational Einstein’s that have transcended the knowledge of the individuals that harnessed magnetic energy, built the pyramids and were the inspiration/blue print behind most of Tesla’s inventions which are still being used today. It is a miracle that Benn and friends surpassed the knowledge that has withstood the test of time all behind their computer screens. Congratulations

[@Civilizashum]

"Einstein’s" Einstein's WHAT? The construction there , "Einstein's" will describe something an Einstein is in posessition of. More than one Einstein is written "Einsteins".

[@1bassman9]

All the notes in A432hz are whole numbers, no fractions, and all are multiples of the number 9. The bass clef, the Fibonacci spiral and even the cochlea are in the shape of that spiral. You can be cavalier about it, but there are many mathematical and natural co-incidences !

[@Civilizashum]

are you making some kind of joke, in parody of the situation? Because that is utter nonsense.

[@1bassman9]

@Civilizashum What did I say that you think was a joke ?

[@AnalogMonoxide]

The other day I accidentally tuned my oscillator to 432Hz and unlocked the mysteries of the universe.

[@secretelitemusic]

What did the Vorlons think of your 432Hz dubstep tunes? Expiring minds needs two no.

[@timothyporr]

Thanks for this! I’ve been wondering about this issue for ages. 👍🙏

[@GregoryRobertsLx]

This was a rabbit hole I didn't know I need to go down. Thank you for being the tour guide.

[@Linguae_Music]

I've done an incredibly large amount of psychedelics, and so I've interacted with new age people more than most people. I've been hearing the 432 Hz thing for years xD For a while, when I was younger and lacking in critical condition thinking skills, I indulged myself in some of these ideas and got lost in a delusional worldview for a few years. (But who doesn't?? :P) People think they are getting these "spiritual insights" but 99% of the time, they're just being manipulated. The culture around psychedelics is full of this, which is sad, because they have so much potential for healing... Yin and yang, I guess. As much as they can be used to heal, they can be used to damage. A lie, when believed, is a mental wound... But it always presents itself as a blessing. Be careful out there, you kids ;D

[@JohnnyVinceEvans]

Great job, Benn! I'd looked into this a bit, and did come up with some neo-fascist dogwhistle language as well as some rectally sourced chakra talk, but had never come across LaRouche's name. Growing up not far from his compound in rural Loudoun County, VA in the '80s, I remember how he was constantly in the news (or buying bizarre full-page ads in the Washington Post, to keep himself there). This debate fits into that pattern. Contemporary A=432Hz and anti-vax arguments share many parallels, but what's most relevant here is that they're both examples of bad faith actors using part-truths to manufacture a wedge issue, in order to graft themselves onto the emotional response of a large population. As illustrated by LaRouche's Italian "patriot" pivot, the 432Hz argument was never really the point. Covertly building political power was. BTW, one hallmark of LaRouche's cult was an "ends justify the means" mentality. Lately, both 432Hz and anti-vax thought leaders have made their most significant inroads among two groups that might seem ideologically incongruent: extreme right wingers, and holistic health practitioners. In both spheres, there's a low barrier to entry to becoming a mid-level influencer dealing in misinformation or products, that adherents are primed to believe in, both by their own general ignorance of the subject at hand, or by a distrust of conventional channels. This mistrust is often justifiable (because conventional channels also contain plenty of bad faith actors), but at any rate, it is exploitable. You don't have to be Anthony Fauci to know that both groups are among the most vociferous detractors of the scientific method, and Democratic principles in general. Not part of my original point, but I should note that one could make a very long list of subtly different emotional responses that a person could have listening to music at 432 vs 440 Hz. But the truth is that most people aren't well-versed in the physical nature of music (or physics in general),, so it's easy to mislead them, by presenting suggestive theories for these different experiences as demonstrations of alternative "facts".

[@crumblebob2297]

Explain to me how antivaxxers weren't right about the science from the beginning

[@radzmar]

Der ganze Schwachsinn, der im Internet verbreitet wird, verursacht bei mir Schmerzen. Thanks for pointing this out Benn.

[@MargaretHarmer]

Great video and story! The only reason for tuning lower in my opinion is when tuning older instruments. No old piano can withstand the modern tension. I’ve played in baroque music ensembles and some of them use old instruments and tune lower which is very interesting to do. I’ve played on old timpani with new animal skins. It’s hard to tune these instruments. Also in old trumpets or reconstructed trumpets to imitating old ones not only is the tuning different but the scales intervals are different. This gets into a whole huge topic of intervals and scales. My main point here is yes Verdi played a hundred years ago didn’t sound the same as today.

[@stanleyjungleib650]

When A on the well-tuned piano is anything, not even its octave will be exactly 2x of that. Reality stretch-tunes any reference to increasing deviations as it approaches the extremes of our hearing. Also, study Diana Deutsche, who proved that the resonance of our skull biases how we perceive tonic pitches.

[@theJellyjoker]

430 gives me a headache, 440 takes a bit longer but it's still uncomfortable. This video hurts after about a minute.

[@m.a.freund3332]

When I was a kid just starting on guitar, my tuner died. Instead of buying a new one, I decided my scant money would be better spent on a Big Muff Pi. I learned music on piano, so I would tune my guitar to my family's piano, but our piano was old and had survived multiple moves across state lines, so even the piano wasn't a reliable source of perfect pitch. I had to tune my guitars to what felt right. I was tuning low for the songs I was writing anyway, which opened up its own can of worms, especially on acoustic guitars that don't let you adjust the intonation. When I finally graduated into buying synthesizers years later, I found out that my tuning standard had me tuning to slack keys, like halfway between E standard & a half step down. It probably generally wound up around 426Hz, but whenever I wrote songs, I'd play around with the tuning until the tone just clicked with how I felt. Whether that was sharp or flat or right on the 440 mark, I didn't care, I just knew it was right when I heard it. Was it annoying trying to record several different instruments in nonstandard tuning? Not really. I just use my ears! Would it be annoying to jam with other musicians that way? Absolutely! I totally get why standard tuning is a thing, that makes sense. But this notion that there's one singular frequency that resonates with humans most naturally is hogwash. I can't predict what will resonate with me any time I sit down to write music, I have to find it every time, and I love that aspect of experimentation. There is no one right frequency, there are just right frequencies for the way I feel in the moment. I think every song has that one key it works best in, but there's no wrong option. Ya know? The best example I know is Magnolia Electric Co.'s "Trouble In Mind" and "Nashville Moon". They're the same exact song in musical structure, but one is a Nina Simone cover in F and the other is an original work in A. Some days, "Trouble In Mind" hits the spot, others "Nashville Moon" speaks to me like nothing else. I wanna exhort musicians: if you're not afraid of a little trial & error, try different tunings for your music! There is no one perfect way, just a most convenient way.

[@koraamis5568]

just for fun, a long time ago, I saw a video about 432 Hz and Schuman frequency, so I decided to calculate the frequency for A based on lot of pseudo science included in the video, and it was totally not 432 Hz, but lower than that, so I made a track with it, but did not tell anyone which track, till now nobody ever noticed which track it is 🤣🤣🤣

[@billnetherlands]

Benn, I love these skeptical pieces you put out (as well as the typical synth stuff). Great work!

[@Albert_Camuk]

I tune my drums to 432 all the time, especially hi-hats, sounds astonishing!

[@ckline]

another comment... at the beginning there's a cymatics image comparing 432 to 440. For 432 the sand is beautifully distributed, but 440 it is a jumbled blob. Cymatics is real and cool but the images are misleading - the size of the plate is directly related to which frequencies produce the beautiful cymatics vs the jumbled blobs. That is to say, the plates themselves are tuned. So take a plate tuned to A432, and it will produce nice patterns at 432 Hz but not at 440. The same is true in reverse, a cymatics plate tuned to A440 will produce nice images at 440 Hz, and a jumbled mess at 432. So it's basically just like taking an instrument tuned to A432 and going "wow, this produces a great 432Hz tone!" It's tautological. It's saying nothing.

[@andersbarfodsvaneskolan9378]

former pitch in Europe was 435Hz with 12-TET giving you a C5 at 517.3Hz.. This was also called continetial pitch.. This is what we should have maintained as a standard for vocal reproduction. This was tested by 5 composers and 2 physicians in France 1859 ,, And proved to be a good average pitch for a lot of different voices singing different operas. Two other pitches used for opera in the previous century in the 1830s in Paris and Vienna was from two tuning forks at 434Hz and 433.9Hz.. A pitch that prevents early register shift which you get with 440-443Hz..

[@WhenIWasAKitten]

The dreaded passaggio.

[@detectivewiggles]

The _basic concept_ isn't total nonsense. When I had surgery once, I started having an allergic reaction to the stitches, and there was nothing I could do to control it--meds didn't help. My surgeon, who was an expert on doing surgery on people with nervous system dysfunction (I inappropriately go into an allergy state as a result of dysautonomia), told me to get a microcurrent device and to find out the right frequency to simply tell my body to have inflammation somewhere else instead of around my 12-inch incision. See, the nervous system uses an electrical signal of differing frequencies to communicate instructions to the body. One thing it affects significantly is, as I just mentioned, inflammation (aka hemodynamics). So different frequencies send blood to different parts of your body, and that can induce different moods, but if you're not talking about a pure tone (or an electrical current being sent through the body), then the effect is incredibly minor. Obviously any piece of music is going to have tons of different frequencies so it's just absurd to suggest that editing it to be ?in a certain key? (i'm not a musician so unclear on the actual technical changes here) would have such a powerful effect. The thing is, the placebo effect is also a direct consequence of the inflammatory response, so what is being studied here is the most prone to outside influence from all the other factors that determine your mood

[@detectivewiggles]

What is less bullshit, though, is the idea that different temperatures of light can affect your mood. Sitting in a room with all blue walls will immediately trigger a panic attack for me, but due to my dysautonomia the effect of color on my nervous system is magnified in me compared to other people. Even being presented with huge fields of color has only a minor impact on mood in most people.

[@TheGirlWhoFeltTooMuch-Yayaa]

Thank you for your comment. I’m actually planning to do a dive into the effect of frequency on inflammation and if a microcurrent device could help with inflammation from RA. I know you say that without a pure tone or electrical current the effects would be incredibly minor but in my personal experience of living with RA, I have noticed significant changes in my body’s inflammation and in my mood due to the frequency, tempo, tone, etc of the music/sound I listen to (only when listened to with noise cancelling over the ear headphones) even without it being a pure and constant tone. Of course we all have sounds that resonate with each of us as individuals, but I would never assume that just because it resonates with and helps me that it would be beneficial to someone else.

[@TheGirlWhoFeltTooMuch-Yayaa]

Also I have heard of dysautonomia before but didn’t really know much about it. After reading your comment I looked into it and I think your comment was meant for me to see its. As someone who has Chiari malformation type I with a 7-9mm herniation, Sjogren’s, and RA, I am constantly dealing with almost all of the symptoms of dysautonomia, of which the brain fog, migraines, dizziness/vertigo, sound/light sensitivities, severe dry eyes (and eye/vision issues in general), ❤ palpitations/chest pains, anxiety, and dysphagia are the most common and annoying for me. It can all make you feel like you’re going crazy and not understanding what’s going on is frightening. If I had known all of the symptoms I deal with could all be related to one issue, I may not of been in such a constant state of worry and fear for so long. Sometimes it just helps to know we’re not alone in what we are going through, ya know? Anyways, that’s for posting your comment and sharing your experiences.

[@dantesquires4125]

I'm glad someone else noticed the math was questionable. Though I do find the ranges of the various schuman frequencies a fun thing to play with. It's nice to think about the interconnectiveness through frequencies.

[@martifingers]

I love seeing intellectual rigour applied with such sharp humour and humanity. Great stuff and a very welcome update on the Adam Neely original.

[@Silvermeow]

When you don't understand cymatics and why they are important lol

[@martti7363]

I’m here for more debunk videos! Somebody has to do it!

[@titapesata9812]

hi benn, thanks for the video! Interestingly, i've always attributed *443Hz* to facism - for context here in Vienna, Austria it is nearly impossible to find a piano tuned at 440Hz, they are all at 443(up to 445 sometimes which is crazy). Historically, we've had 435-438Hz here (end of 19th/beginning of 20th century) right up til 1938 aand then we didn't anymore. At the International Conference in London in 1940 western countries agreed to A440Hz, but we still... don't (?) Especially classical musicians defend this with such viciousness and fanatism pretty similar to the 432Hz crowd... yikes. (Funnily enough they keep defending that disgusting vibrato that the nazis brought the same way, pretending as if it were necessary to *produce* sound on string instruments ☠️)

[@Kara-loop]

What do you think is the right Hz? I am still searching for answers…

[@ewwitsantonio]

nazi vibrato? huh?

[@annieobrien3069]

We’re in a frequency based reality and there are countless historical and mathematical findings pointing us to these frequencies being most resonant to our natural surroundings. Multiple studies showing the positive response the human body has to these frequencies and some of the very first instruments have been proven to be tuned to or have the ability to produce 432 and 528hz tones.

[@deborahduda4039]

I've been searching for the info in this video; Thank You so Much!! One of the biggest takeaways for me was the ignorance and lack of the variables in all of these "studies" , all of which prove nothing. I just appreciate you diving deeper than the bandwagon mentality as people are so quick to accept the shiny new thing as Gospel without the facts or knowledge of the subject. Thank You!