Biblical Studies is a Circus Show | Dr. Richard C. Miller

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MythVision Podcast

Күн бұрын

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@MythVisionPodcast Жыл бұрын

Grab his book Resurrection and Reception in Early Christianity 👉 amzn.to/35FqNYf

@DoreenBellDotan Жыл бұрын

I'm so terribly sorry that the Pharisees veered away from the Prophetic Tradition and, in so doing not only led generations of Jews astray but also engendered Christianity, which took Pharisaic errors in interpretation even more far afield. My sincerest suggestion to Westerners is to look deeply into Stoicism.

@DoreenBellDotan Жыл бұрын

Please read what I am about to write carefully because it is not something that you've heard before and it is best that it is not colored in your mind by that which you've heard previously. God does not appear anywhere in Torah. I'll say that again. God does not appear anywhere in Torah. God is so beyond anything that we can comprehend or talk about that referencing about God is impossible. God has no name, no designation, no characteristics. God does not exist. Existence is one of God's creations. We cannot talk about that which does not exist. Even now, I am referring to your ideas about God, not God. The Tetragrammaton is not God and not God's name. I'll say that again. The Tetragrammaton is not God. The Tetragrammaton is the highest, holiest version of the Creation. The Rabbis, when they were exiled from the Place that is called HaShem because they rejected the Prophetic tradition and started making Torah into a law book, made HaShem into a god because HaShem was no longer their ambient reality. So, they worship what they cannot experience as a god.

@DoreenBellDotan Жыл бұрын

Most people think that the Torah is a finished product. It's not. It's the seeds. To try to read Torah as though it is telling narratives and giving instructions about how to conduct ceremonies is like thinking that DNA is the finished organism. I'll prove what I'm saying in the Hebrew response to this comment. If you don't read Hebrew, put it into a translation function.

@DoreenBellDotan Жыл бұрын

ב"ה עברית = 682 = התעברה ספר = 340 = זרע מחיה תורה = 611 = את הרה ספר תורה = 951 = את הרה זרע מחיה

@DoreenBellDotan Жыл бұрын

The Christians misunderstood the concept of 'immaculate conception'. The correct immaculate conception is the understanding of those who consciousness knows how to build worlds out of the Torah. Just as a egg cell has to know how to deconstruct and reconstruct the genetic information in a sperm cell, so the consciousness needs to know how to unpack the information in Torah and use it to build worlds. The Prophets know how to do this. The Rabbis haven't a clue.

@TrisjensChronicles1203 Жыл бұрын

I’m not going to lie, I can sit in front of Dr. Miller all day as he talks about this and soak it all up. Got dam, I love when Professors can be 100% honest about the Bible and it’s history. Intellectually honesty matter for me. Thanks Derek for this gem.

@TrisjensChronicles1203 Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2block Are you saying that it’s clear creation had to be done supernaturally at some point, so it is Yahweh/Jesus as this creator of the universe?

@travis1240 Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2block sorry but that just doesn't follow. "Some magic happens here, therefore God" isn't a valid line of reasoning. Acting like some ancient book can answer modern questions of science through magic is completely dishonest.

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

ATTENTION!!! I am here to proclaim that Jesus Christ is the only true savior for the world. If you deny Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, you will not see the Kingdom of Heaven. Jesus loves you and He died for your sins and on the third day, He arose from the grave. Jesus Christ is alive!! REPENT, believe in your heart and confess with your mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord and you will be saved. MARK 1:15 For the Kingdom of God is at hand, repent and believe in the gospel.

@lynnbaker2336 Жыл бұрын

My problem is the fact that, while I have an intellectual agreement with most, if not all of this, I cannot deny the fact that I have experienced God on a supernatural level.

@TrisjensChronicles1203 Жыл бұрын

@@lynnbaker2336 Not to take away anything from you, these other groups like Hindu, Shintu, Mormons, Islam, Gnostics, Kemetism etc have experienced God on a supernatural level also.What do you think of that? Could it be everyone is just experiencing a human experience?

@alflyle9955 Жыл бұрын

For those folks like me, here's a helpful hint: SBL stands for Society of Biblical Literature. SBL describes itself as "SBL, a membership organization with over 7,000 scholars, is the oldest and largest learned society devoted to the critical investigation of the Bible from a variety of academic disciplines. Through its work, SBL supports scholarly research and fosters the public understanding of the Bible and its influence."

@talithaleah6563 Жыл бұрын

Oh my goodness, thank you!

@dbarker7794 Жыл бұрын

Alf here leading us out of the desert. Thank you! I went through about thirty definitions, all wrong.

@ANCIENTWARRI0R Жыл бұрын

This should be pinned at the top. So helpful.

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

@talithaleah6563 Жыл бұрын

@@ChristianSoldier71 it’s okay, there is no such thing as sin, and none of us will be tortured after death because we will be dead. You don’t have to be afraid of end times, you will die at some point, hopefully a long time from now without a lot of pain, but no demons are coming for you.

@dmichael100 Жыл бұрын

This is interesting to hear. I did Masters and Ph D studies at a confessional institution where you did have to sign a statement of faith when enrolling in classes each semester. I left with an almost finished PhD because I could not in good conscience sign the statement another time. I was a member and attended both SBL (Society of Biblical Literature) and ETS (Evangelical Theological Society) gatherings. In fact, those two events are normally scheduled at the same time and place each year- SBL occurring after ETS. There was a big discussion when I was in seminary about how SBL lacked the faith commitments of ETS. There was big hullabaloo because some ETS scholars were "witnessing" at SBL and SBL put out a statement that prohibited it. So to hear now, that SBL's scholarship is shackled by faith commitments is interesting to say the least. My own serious study of the Bible and other early Christian writings convinced me to disavow a 4- decades long faith. In my experience. most "Christian scholarship" is very earnest, bright young students desperate to keep answering the question "IT HAS TO BE REAL DOESN'T IT?". If they can do that with, what can only be described as a a "scholarly veneer" over it, it soothes increasingly troubled minds plagued with cognitive dissonance.

@stevebeary4988 Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2block Have you read Genesis? I think someone read it for you.

@rembrandt972ify Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2block "The 1LofT states that energy can't be created or destroyed, it can't happen naturally." The First Law states it cannot happen, not that it can't happen unless a God pulls a miracle out of his ass. "It is clear creation had to be done supernaturally at some point yet it is still denied because people are just too proud to accept that, among other things." Have you ever heard of psychological projection?

@mrwolley1741 Жыл бұрын

What book recommendations would you make of works that helped you in your journey?

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

@dmichael100 Жыл бұрын

@@mrwolley1741 Good question. First, I had the luxury of serious bible study at the PhD level and reading other ancient material especially the vast collection of pseudepigrapha, apocrypha, classic Greek and Roman writers (Livy, Cicero, Lucretius, Seneca, Diodorus Siculus, Hesiod, Epicurus and others) made it clear that the biblical writings are not unique and certainly not divinely inspired. First, I should add that the reading of the biblical material itself showed me their historically contingent nature- the readings of other writings around the time of the Old and New Testament material put in into context. I discovered at the highest scholarly levels, the argument that the biblical writings are unique is farcical. But that is material of a more academic nature and few people have the time , luxury and/or skill set to study such material- though Christian apologists use bits and pieces with which to prop up their claims. But I think you mean more accessible books from others who have made the same journey. There are far more of those than I dreamed (when I had the courage to admit biblical Christianity was not true, I thought I was largely alone as a decades-long believer). "Why I Believed" by Kenneth W. Daniels- a former missionary and Wycliffe bible translator. His journey was so genuinely related (he even prints his prayers to God as he fights to retain his faith- I prayed almost identical words - it was striking!) *"Childish Things" -Dave Warnock *Empty the Pews" a collection of former believers' stories *"Four Disturbing Questions" Tim Sledge- another former pastor of many years The above are all former believers like me so I found their writings more relevant than the atheists who have never been believers though I have the highest respect for Sam Harris" work. The never-believed atheists can be quickly dismissed by believers ("They have never felt what I felt- they don't understand") I used the same dismissal when I was an active Christian apologist. *Bart Ehrman is a former believer and top-notch Greek scholar-so you get some of both. His book "God's Problem" was one I found particularly prescient. One of the main questions I have tried to answer since discarding Christian belief was "What keeps so many choosing to believe dogma even though it is demonstrably untrue?" and "How did religious belief emerge and shift through history?" "Two books titled "The Origins of Christianity" are excellent- one by Archibald Robertson and the other by Thomas Whittaker *The Evolution of God" by Robert Wright is wide in scope and contains enlightening observations Here's a good one: "The Ark Before Noah"- showing how closely the flood account in Genesis follows an indisputably earlier Mesopotamian story- one that just came to light in the last 20 years and is older than even Gilgamesh. *The best theological work I've read on contemporary Christian belief is by a former believer/scholar titled "Theology After the Death of God" by L. Ron Schultz. It is a little academic- not an easy read, but excellent. *The Denial of Death" - Pulitzer Prize psychological/sociological work by Ernst Becker. That should get you started at least.

@rainbowkrampus Жыл бұрын

Great conversation. It was one of the most surprising things when I first started getting into this stuff that so much of what was considered foundational in Biblical studies was based on junk arguments and that much of the field was wholly divorced from empiricism, sound epistemology and basic logic. Hector Avalos was talking about this a more than a decade ago in a real serious way and we've got guys going back to at least the 70's talking about how the field needs to reorient itself towards teaching true, verifiable things and working against dogmatism. It's no wonder the US has such a massive problem with fundamentalism. The people whose job should at a minimum be to moderate between theology and fact have let theology run rough shod over fact for decades.

@rainbowkrampus Жыл бұрын

@@vocesanticae Couldn't have said it better myself.

@annascott3542 Жыл бұрын

@@vocesanticae the discipline is so compromised is a scandal, I’m of the opinion that there’s no place for it at secular universities and it their Departments if they have one should be abolished, rolled into classics & other related fields, and relegated to only the seminaries.

@annascott3542 Жыл бұрын

100% on board with everything Dr. Miller said here.

@tonycook7679 Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2block this is a complete non-sequitur. You can't connect these two ideas like this, it's nonsense.

@tonycook7679 Жыл бұрын

me too

@Isaac5123 Жыл бұрын

@@annascott3542 good question

@theseustoo Жыл бұрын

@@annascott3542 It seems that Tony Cook was responding not to you, but to someone (whom I've had previous encounters with and who is a fundamentalist Christian) with the pseudonym '2fast2block', which the latter either changed his mind about and removed himself, or was so embarrassed by Tony's response that he removed it himself, or just possibly, was so hateful that it was removed by the YT censors. (My money would probably be on either of my first two suggestions.) Evidently it was removed before you saw either comment. Have a nice day! 🙂

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

@kariannecrysler640 Жыл бұрын

Refreshingly genuine and sincere. I like his style 💯

@dennisquinn7729 Жыл бұрын

Good to see Dr. Miller. Haven't seen him since we worked together on Sacred History Magazine 20 years ago.

@Mr.PeabodyTheSkeptic Жыл бұрын

One of the best explanations for the poor reasoning from within apologetics and it's defenders. Great. Great video. This is saved on my playlist.

@tonydarcy1606 Жыл бұрын

"Biblical studies is a circus show". Couldn't agree more. By and large these characters are not interested in history, they're only interested in what backs up their faith. In the same way as the "vulgar economists" are not interested in how capitalism actually works, but only in justifying its existence.

@tomrudolsen6235 Жыл бұрын

BIBLICAL STUDYING IS IMPORTANT TO LEARN WHAT GOD HAS TO SAY, AND NOT BEING A FOLLOWER OF A POPE OR SOME ROSARY OR AVE MARIAS. IF YOU ARE TIRED OF WHAT YOU HAVE LEARNED, THEN TRY AND SEE IT IN A FRESH PRSPECTIVE ❤😊😮👍👌😎😉

@tomrudolsen6235 Жыл бұрын

PERSPECTIVE ....SORRY 😎

@letsomethingshine Жыл бұрын

Bibliolatry? Which canon and why? Why Jesus/Joshua quote book of Enoch but it not included? Which version of said canon? Which edition of said version? why? Why would a true god/gaut/gott/goth fail in both Islam and Christianity?

@tomrudolsen6235 Жыл бұрын

I DO NOT THINK BIBLE STUDYING HAS BECOME A SHOW, ONLY TO THE EXTENT THAT MAINSTREAM MEDIA HAS PUSHED ITSELF INTO EVERYTHING AND EVERYTHING HAS BECOME MORE INDIFFERENT. YET YOU CAN STILL BE SERIOUS ABOUT IT ! 😎

@MichaTheLight Жыл бұрын

@@tomrudolsen6235 Seems a lot of fun having imaginary friends. There could be smth on the other side buts not an old fart sending lightening in your as* cause your were disobedient. Most of us are to dumb to understand NDE's or OBE's that's the only phenomena regarding afterlife. But the stupidity of us ants leads to the fact that we see smth may even an entity and smack it must be God. If I would be that entity I would be embarrassed if an ant declares me as the ant God and the ant declares itself the crown of creation on the base of a brief look on me 😂

@MrArdytube Жыл бұрын

For many of us who have left the faith, we can look back upon how we kept pockets of hidden deference that likely took years to leave behind. We continue to have moments of realization that there is yet one more bit of dogma that remains unobtrusively embedded in our perception of reality. I identified as an agnostic for decades before I finally admitted to myself that I was actually an atheist

@JamesTaborVideos Жыл бұрын

Really great interview Derek and Richard...I have less and less interest in the SBL for the reasons you mention. Do you remember when Jonathan Z. Smith, my teacher, agreed to serve as President--his reasons are most interesting, see his Presidential address. It was classic, in a word: we history of religion folk want to STUDY you guys! As in the famous quip variously attributed to Scholem and others with various phrasing: Magic is nonsense, but the study of magic, ah, that is scholarship.

@DaithiMcG Жыл бұрын

THANK YOU. I feel heard... SO refreshing to hear Dr. Miller's take on the state of biblical studies and to call it out for what it is! -DF

@epochalypsemeow5732 Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2block Doesn’t matter how many times you comment this on different posts, it’s not gonna make any more sense. It’s not clear it had to be supernatural lol

@epochalypsemeow5732 Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2block There’s nothing to tackle. I’ll listen to scientists thank you very much. That’s where progress is made.

@epochalypsemeow5732 Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2block And notice who resorted to attacking character first. That’s pretty telling in itself.

@stevesheppardmusic Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2block it's ok, I understand, it's difficult being part of a cult.

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

@AlanMordue-hx5wv 10 ай бұрын

I am a British member of SBL and I understand your view. I am very skeptical but I know loads of sincere people across the views!! I have been in this mad world since 1987 in bookselling and publishing.

@N1976DL Жыл бұрын

Derek, you always have all of the best guests on your podcast. Binge-watching these videos with Dr. Miller on this Memorial Day weekend. Thank you and take care, brother.

@liberalinoklahoma1888 Ай бұрын

Great respect for all these scholars that are standing up for the truth.

@26beegee Жыл бұрын

Ending this very serious discussion with Dr. Miller’s son is brilliant (and very cute)!

@HarmonicAtheist Жыл бұрын

Really loving these videos!

@kariannecrysler640 Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2block what is always was and will be. The only creation in biblical mythology is the fables. The winding down you mentioned could easily be part of a cycle like everything else in nature. You do not have to believe in these things, but they are just as valid an explanation.

@SouthGallaecian Жыл бұрын

Would love to see a conversation between Richard Miller and Richard Carrier. They share so much that they would have the opportunity of exploring issues that don't typically get discussed.

@Marabarra134 Жыл бұрын

would be great yes

@timelston4260 Жыл бұрын

I met Richard Carrier. Not impressed. He seems to like stirring controversy rather than getting at truth. Richard Miller, by contrast, seems motivated to know, not speculate for dramatic effect.

@nekanoh Жыл бұрын

Thanks!

@MythVisionPodcast Жыл бұрын

Thank you for that superthanks

@solomonessix6909 Жыл бұрын

I’ve never heard anyone us the word “Shaman” to refer to Christian pastors, BUT I feel it's appropriate and fits them so well.

@julianmarsh8384 Жыл бұрын

I have more respect for shamans. At least with their first appearance in the Old Stone Age, they did serve a useful function...religious leaders today, uh, not so much.

@alstewart6870 Жыл бұрын

Didn’t u watch the video???

@suejohnson4144 Жыл бұрын

Thank you. Thank you.

@Ken_Scaletta Жыл бұрын

The idea of a faith commitment is diametrically opposed to the whole idea of scholarship. Requiring a scholar to say they'll never change their mind is essentially forbidding them to do scholarship. I have much appreciation for scholars like Dr. Miller who are willing to pursue honesty and truth even to the extinction of their own faith, and for not being willing to bend the knee to cultic (yes cultic) control. No other field of study requires anything like that. It's bizarre and anti-intellectual. It's scary. It's literal brainwashing.

@annascott3542 Жыл бұрын

Absolutely right.

@annascott3542 Жыл бұрын

It’s outlandish & desperate.

@johnobrien6415 7 ай бұрын

Derek, I've got to hand it to you. Over the years your interviewing skills have improved, and the guests you get on to speak are top notch. I hope this doesn't come off wrong, but the early stuff you seemed a little goofy and some of the guests I had to wonder about. These are all good, high quality professional talks, conversations and interviews you have on your show, You seem more knowledgeable, and at ease. It's like you've been trying to grow into this role, this field. This is some guy to be taken serious. Some day it'll be the young buck trying to break into the field who'll be interviewing you. Then the student will have become the master. You will have taken the pebble from my hand. It will be time for you to leave.

@AngeloNasios Жыл бұрын

Good conversation, much needed.

@liberalinoklahoma1888 Ай бұрын

I am of the opinion that religion being 'investigated' by religious people is as 'honest' as police departments investigating their own.

@tumblebugspace Жыл бұрын

Excellent discussion raising important issues within biblical scholarship. Cute little guy there at the end, too! ☮️❤️🐾

@trevanhatch8717 Жыл бұрын

I would say that most SBL members aren’t at prestigious nondenominational schools. Probably 2/3 are at theological schools. Literally 70% of the book vendors at SBL are Christian presses. Almost everything about SBL is faith based.

@HarmonicAtheist Жыл бұрын

Loved seeing your son at the end!!

@Arven8 Жыл бұрын

I had no idea that about 50% of mainstream biblical scholars were intellectually compromised in that way. I don't believe this will change any time soon, because the majority of people who are interested and motivated enough in intensive study of the Bible are bound to be believers.

@jacogericke7466 3 күн бұрын

Respect! 😎

@jillphilips3788 Жыл бұрын

God BLESS YOU

@djfrank68 Жыл бұрын

It's nice for me to hear someone as credentialed and articulate as Dr Miller, verbalize many ideas and opinions that I've had bouncing around in my head for years.

@MichaelWalker-de8nf Жыл бұрын

The young man at the end really wrapped the conversation perfectly!!! Well done 👏 ❤

@barryjones9362 Жыл бұрын

I can't believe I was ever dense enough to pay $300 per month to Calvary Chapel back in the early 1990's so I could earn a "certificate" in "bible studies" by listening to endless tapes of Chuck Smith's sermons...a certificate that meant precisely nothing outside the specific Calvary chapel I was attending.

@ELL289 Жыл бұрын

You weren’t the only one. We used to quote CHUCK in hushed tones!

@robdavinroy1761 Жыл бұрын

Simply Fantastic. I cannot say enough about Derrick bringing this courageous man to KZbin for all to hear. I’m excited that a new golf league has started and can’t wait to eventually get to the putting green of historical truth. But we cannot take our approach shots to the pin until the apologists clear off on the green. Or do we just hit the ball toward the green anyway and yell “Four!!!” ??

@scottgoulette8900 Жыл бұрын

Hahaha... as an avid golfer myself that is a great analogy, even if you got the idea from Dr. Miller lol

@Lionofjudah333 Жыл бұрын

I agree. It's more than remembering the truth, its another to go out and become the truth.

@fancymcclean6210 Жыл бұрын

Interesting. I find it sad, that in our supposed 'age of rationality' this needs to be mentioned at all. Supernatural constructs have no place in rigorous academic scholarship regardless of the topic. I found the 'heart surgery' analogy very illuminating. Keep up the good work fellas. Just purchased a copy of Dr Miller's book and looking forward to reading about his thesis. May Lord Woden protect you. 😉 Flaxen Saxon.

@Herschel1738 Жыл бұрын

My spouse was having a colonoscopy done at a small local hospital in a small rural southern county. The doctor comes in once a month from a large city nearby to perform the procedures. After all the paperwork was done, the doctor asked if my spouse wanted to pray with him. We both were kind of startled and said "No, thanks" to which I added "I prefer to put my faith in you skills as a doctor, not in your ability to pray." But it is kind of scary to put yourself under the knife of a doctor whom you may have offended by rebuffing his "sincere Christian offer of God's protection".

@letsomethingshine Жыл бұрын

The theologians do not see what they are doing as "heart surgery" they see it as culturally important "painting" and thus they want to stick to certain saleable/popular/"official" styles like Egyptian wall scribes did.

@ivtch51 Жыл бұрын

Richard's book arrived in the post today so looking forward to a deep, focused read at some stage soon. Yes this competing 'secular/academic against theological interests' divide affects me at times on my B A Theol course too. Our lecturer recently brought up a piece of outdated data surrounding gay sexuality research in class; 20 years out of date. I felt totally misrepresented and misunderstood and so wanted to point this out. Except for this incident of misrepresentation, I have no idea where this lecturer lies along the progressive to conservative theological spectrum but my cautious radar of survival skills was/is up. I will remember this incident and when this course is complete I will politely email to point out this error and say why I was compelled to remain silent.

@entwood Жыл бұрын

So good to have the insider's view of what Carrier, Price and Fitzgerald have been telling us about for years.

@pizzazombie7373 Жыл бұрын

Incredible interview!! Thank you!!

@nedsantos1415 Жыл бұрын

Religion. If it's not about a sense of "belonging," then it's about "wealth" or "power" or both.

@RebeccaRaven Жыл бұрын

It's a good thing that scholars don't have to profess belief in Jane Austen to study "Pride and Prejudice."

@donnievance1942 7 ай бұрын

They have to believe in Jane Austen, but they don't have to believe in Mr. Darcy.

@dakrontu Жыл бұрын

Imagine Chemistry classes in Alchemist seminaries that obstruct real Chemists, seeing them as eccentric for challenging unevidenced dogma. Or Astronomy classes full of Astrologers. Or Math classes full of Numerologists. Or Psychology classes full of Demonologists and Exorcists. Or Paleontology classes full of Creationists. Or Medicine classes full of Faith Healers and Homeopaths. Or Dead Sea Scrolls classes full of Catholic priests anxious to censor anything contradicting their dogma. Or Anaesthesiology classes full of fanatics who think it sinful not to suffer pain. Or Microscopy classes full of fanatics who think it blasphemy to see the minute handiwork of their Creator. We can all understand how such horrific circumstances would have held us back (or indeed did). I appreciate the despair-inducing frustration of being an open-minded researcher into religious texts.

@TheJacrespo Жыл бұрын

Money and power these are the truly goals behind. Apologetics is all about power and money as it has been ever.

@Dr.Anti-Theist Жыл бұрын

Some of the current MV content and interviews I've watched is absolute fire. WOW!

@jamesswagerty16 Жыл бұрын

At least one verse in the Bible is absolutely true. Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten.

@alexlarsen6413 Жыл бұрын

Dr. Miller is such a legend!! 👍👍 Loved seeing his kid there at the end!

@JoMariSmokinLocos Жыл бұрын

"I don't want to believe, I want to know." Powerful. Thanks Dr. You are a badsss.

@jmaniak1 Жыл бұрын

People are deserving of respect. Ideas should not have the same privilege.

@librulcunspirisy Жыл бұрын

Thanks 👍

@annascott3542 Жыл бұрын

Love it!! Haha I love that he called them shamans, lol

@debrawehrly6900 Жыл бұрын

I appreciate and respect what uou said about valuing people more than being right. Unfortunately, i had made that mistake by stating my opinion on a friend's blog.

@CamtheMac Жыл бұрын

I just finished G.A. Wells book ‘Did Jesus Exist?’ And it has helped me regain some sanity.

@tookie36 5 ай бұрын

4:20 what’s the witch doctors past record? Who isn’t praying before a heart surgery ?

@davidaaronhill5680 Жыл бұрын

Love it! No tiptoeing around.

@babisbabinos8075 Жыл бұрын

All I see is tiptoeing.

@SouthGallaecian 4 ай бұрын

I think we need to start using the concept of "academic Overton window."

@TheBackyardProfessor 9 ай бұрын

Sounded like he described Mormon studies. They also have the answers before they even begin the research, and then only use info that gives them the answer they want.

@VoxUrania Жыл бұрын

There are walls in Classics that are surprisingly similar to these debates. Without signing declarations of faith, there are still gates of admission around religion in the ancient world. Even garden-variety anachronism plays a role. The Academy as a human institution allows careerism to outweigh evidence.

@MonicaSLM1 2 ай бұрын

But is it supposed to be a midpoint or a conversation? I completely sympathize with Dr. Miller's critiques and take them to heart, and I've heard similar ones over the years about SBL. But this interview seems to be a call for withdrawing from the large conversations (e.g. at SBL) and getting more and more into siloed echo chambers. This is not only an issue for religious studies & biblical studies, but has become a societal phenomenon in the US where people have stopped having serious conversations with those who disagree with them - and look where that has gotten the country over the past few years.

@RichardMiller-ym5jc Ай бұрын

Hi Monica. There is a place for conversation with those not playing by the common principles of the secular academy. There MUST however be a place for true academics to discourse. Right now, the latter discussion does not exist… anywhere for Biblical Studies. Instead, we have religionists running and dominating a discussion that can never qualify as secular discourse.. Just as in Iran, they have no space for secular discourse into the origins of the Qu’ran. So, Qu’ranic Study in that part of the world is defunct and never advancing toward authentic understanding. Same applies to Biblical Studies in North America.

@hawaii5050 Жыл бұрын

Under the spell. You said that very well. However, keep moving forward because your work is the golden hammer of the mythic Thor , telling the truth. And some little kernels of truth are going to get through to some of those people. I may not be able to topple the Sandcastle all at once you may have to do with a grain of the time. Keep up the terrific work.

@antonius_006 8 ай бұрын

Searching for the truth and Psychological Balance requires honor. History of Compared Religions / Psychology of Religions is the way to go. Carl Jung (Answer to Job) and Reza Aslan (Zealot) touched on this subject.

@wabisabi6875 Жыл бұрын

5:42 "Having the answers before they know the questions; that's not a scientific approach." BINGO! Anyone engaged in free inquiry must be prepared to abandon their opinions, no matter how long-held or cherished they may be.

@TaxTheChurches. Жыл бұрын

Master debater Christopher Hitchens made meat of religious college religion professors.

@joshua6244 Жыл бұрын

Biblical studies in the UK don't require people to sign confessions of faith. Academics at most universities are not shackled. At Oxford and Cambridge many theology academics are college chaplains and so have to be Anglican clergy and, for example, at Christ Church college, Oxford theology academics are canons of the cathedral (which is part of the college). Many of those clergy are what might be termed "radical" in their views with no sanction. But at the other universities you could be an atheist professor of theology. No university requires students to sign up to any faith statement.

@liberalinoklahoma1888 Ай бұрын

Tell the truth, the facts with all their warts and bitter tastes instead of sweet lies.

@ChristopherCudworth Жыл бұрын

Rigorous and honest. That’s why I wrote my book Honest-To-Goodness, Why Christianity needs a reality check and how to make it happen. Let’s be honest above all.

@MrArdytube Жыл бұрын

❤❤❤ love the boy doing the outro

@60th60th Жыл бұрын

Excellent throughout!

@martyalmberg9317 Жыл бұрын

good video, great talk!

@willmosse3684 Жыл бұрын

It would be useful if you started this by telling us what exactly SBL is. I know many people watching probably know already, but not all of us. I can deduce it is some kind of Biblical studies network, but a full definition would be good. Otherwise, at 8 mins in it’s very interesting. Thanks

@ardalla535 Жыл бұрын

You don't have to be a scholar to come to the conclusion that Biblical Studies is a circus. You just have to know how to read, and actually do it. That also goes for Biblical Archaeology (and pretty much everything that has Biblical in the title).

@alstewart6870 Жыл бұрын

Pat, how familiar are you with biblical archaeology? Your statement leads me to believe you know little, otherwise you would never say such a thing!

@marktwain5232 Жыл бұрын

@@alstewart6870 I fully agree. Biblical archaeology does NOT require any "statement of doctrinal faith" at all. It is "cultural archaeology" in the context of the precious ancient texts we have that have been preserved. I studied as an undergraduate student under Dr. James B. Pritchard at the University of Pennsylvania regarding the Epic of Gilgamesh back in the 1960's. He could both work the spade in the grid lined dirt of the Middle East on his digs, and then try to interpret what he found. Besides all that, I believe the study of the Bible itself is also very important on the Jungian level for the modern reader. I recommend the books of Edward F. Edinger to everyone. The great contribution of the Jewish people, if nothing else, is the preservation of the history of ideas.

@alstewart6870 Жыл бұрын

@@dialecticobserver Rather then give your thoughts, why not show facts that prove Christ or Christianity a fraud, unless of course u can’t?

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

@alstewart6870 Жыл бұрын

@@dialecticobserver oh ok, because u say so then???

@henrim9348 Жыл бұрын

It takes a lot of courage to take certain positions. One can lose their whole $$$ by telling the truth.

@ReverendDr.Thomas Жыл бұрын

In your own words, define “TRUTH”. ☝️🤔☝️

@xiuhcoatl4830 Жыл бұрын

@@ReverendDr.Thomas Events, or prepostions that can be demonstrated to be true empirically or rationally.

@ReverendDr.Thomas Жыл бұрын

@@xiuhcoatl4830 TAUTOLOGY. 🙄

@xiuhcoatl4830 Жыл бұрын

@@ReverendDr.Thomas you wanted a definition, there is. Thats not tautology

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

@ralphyetmore Жыл бұрын

A faith-based field of study is biased toward the faith of which it is based. Can't say I'm at all surprised, but I appreciate the fact that you said what has to actually be said for some.

@tedreed6046 Жыл бұрын

Although I can understand the value in taking an objective look at the Old and New Testament narratives, I have some reservations about the possible negative effects on the people in the churches who need to be ministered to if this is openly expressed. People expect in their church a sense of security or a "warm fuzzy feeling". What Dr. Miller is expressing are ideas which would only lead to confusion for the people in the churches. People want security in their faith, not confusion. I think that the ideas expressed by Dr. Miller should be considered with caution and the conclusions which are reached should be presented with extreme care.

@grahamlindsay1263 Жыл бұрын

Negative effects- like being a Russian citizen in 2023, breaking the mold of nationalistic propaganda is a very sensitive subject to deal with in our consciousness.

@donnievance1942 7 ай бұрын

I don't know why we should worry about people whose lives aren't based on a primary respect for knowing the truth about things. Lack of a fundamental valuation for truth above all is one of the most fundamental moral failings. Tip-toeing around to maintain the comfort of such people is counter-productive for society.

@jawnatutorow 6 ай бұрын

@@donnievance1942 I think what you're saying is good, but seemingly, and I'm not saying you specifically, most people would not give grace to Christians but would give grace and understanding to say transgenderism? Aren't they both based on the same premise of truth? What makes the person feel good is right? It just seems people have much more understanding, tolerance, and patience for anyone except a Christian. And if we're to go out and show people 'truths' for their own good, wouldn't gender confusion be a part of that?

@chrisdiver6224 Жыл бұрын

Friends, this is the third discussion of yours I've watched and I still don't have a clear understanding of what Dr Miller's groundbreaking contribution is because you haven't provided a basic synopsis of it. Can you point me to a video where he discusses that specific content, please?

@KayemGenmo 8 ай бұрын

This will improve around the same time when it will be okay for a politician or candidate to say he or she is an atheist.

@loyisog4795 Жыл бұрын

Love love this channel. Thanks Derek, we don’t deserve you

@chuckyfarley9465 Жыл бұрын

@@2fast2blockan eternal cosmos is just as likely as an eternal God. Good luck.

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

@chuckyfarley9465 Жыл бұрын

@@ChristianSoldier71 I am here to proclaim that cheese tastes good, and that the God of the Bible is a capricious thug that likes to hide. But, don't worry only cheese is real.

@troyfreedom Жыл бұрын

Christianity is dying one mouse click at a time. The Internet is having a colossal impact and is moving at breathtaking speed throughout societies all around the world. The process is very similar to the invention of the Gutenberg Press.

@sdlorah6450 Жыл бұрын

The internet enables easy access to... ...profane and vain babblings (1 Timothy 6:20) ...oppositions of science falsely so called (1 Timothy 6:20) ...the wresting of the scriptures by the unstable and unlearned (2 Peter 3:16-17) Lies of the above type oppose God's word and seek to supplant the truth from men's hearts. As men are susceptible to believing lies, God warns us away from them.

@epochalypsemeow5732 Жыл бұрын

@@sdlorah6450 Yeah, no religious institutions ever tell lies huh?

@alstewart6870 Жыл бұрын

Ha ha, in the book in acts over 2,000 years ago a guy said the same thing! Not gonna go to well for u…..

@alstewart6870 Жыл бұрын

@@chadtyrone And how is he 2K years late? Can u give evidence please since we are wanting facts…..

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

@nuttysquirrel8816 Жыл бұрын

I stopped the video after 3:07 - 3:23 to comment: *Derek is an awesome person* 😀

@_Omega_Weapon Жыл бұрын

The fact that institutions like SBL and the like require people to sign a statement of faith shows they're not interested in truth, merely reinforcing their beliefs and presuppositions.

@timothymarkonis3630 Жыл бұрын

In the abstract philosophical and/or spiritual realm of rational reason-based intellectual discussion, any system of thinking or believing that requires an a priori expression of faith or conviction other than that which is firmly grounded in the precepts of the rationally objective and rigorously empirically based Scientific Method is tantamount to putting your thumb on the scales from the outset of any further intellectual inquiry. Something that is not only irrational, but ANTI-rational.

@jefffarris9238 Жыл бұрын

Congrats on 100k subscribers. Just noticed that!

@tw9472 Жыл бұрын

Very interesting conversation. Our everyday life is based on compromises - someone who doesn't want to compromise is being perceived by majority as extremist and by default extremists are bad. The majority still accepts to higher or lower extent existence of divine being behind our world. Well, Copernicus was an extremist too. I wonder how many percent of current biblical scholars present currently the position of people like Drs. R. Miller, D. MacDonald or F. Stavrakapoulou? Perhaps all these rational biblical scholars should somehow get together and initiate a new field of study. Derek, thank you for another great interview!

@johnnehrich9601 Жыл бұрын

Too many universities are dependent on donations from wealthy alumni, etc. who are going to push their biblical studies in a direction which might be contrary to what the administration themselves feel is good (assuming they even see this need).

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

@johnnehrich9601 Жыл бұрын

@@ChristianSoldier71 There are 783,137 words in the bible. Do you really think your couple of paragraphs are going to convert me and any non-believer who reads your comment when all those words that supposedly god wrote didn't? What hubris!

@ChristianSoldier71 Жыл бұрын

@@johnnehrich9601 I planted a seed in your heart that will never go away. The great thing is that you came back for another and now I have the opportunity to tell you once more that Jesus loves you and He died for your sins. Once you die, it will be too late to repent. Jesus Christ is the only one who can save you from the fires of Hell. Repent and put your faith in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior today, we are not guaranteed tomorrow. Have a great day!

@jefffloyd9671 Жыл бұрын

I'll be heading to patreon in a few. I have to hear everything with this man.

@A.--. Жыл бұрын

Ma'Sha'Allah Alhumdullilah. This accademic evidence based approach is the right one. Quran 17:36 tells us the same. Unfortunately lots of Madrassa sects also hate accademic evidence based approach.

@jamessizemore6180 Жыл бұрын

Wow...I just know Jesus walked off the pages of those old religious stories and transformed my life from addictions and pain...Jesus didn't come to establish theological schools but save the lost...I guess that message is to simple and beneath inflated humanistic academics...have a great day!

@mickeydecurious Жыл бұрын

Jesus didn't save you from addiction! You are a idolatrous because you're giving your glory to a man and not to God! Only God himself saves 🤔💭

@michaellane9579 10 ай бұрын

💯

@donnievance1942 7 ай бұрын

The fact that convincing yourself of a supernatural helper aided you in kicking your addictions says nothing whatever about whether the supernatural helper actually exists. Ever hear of the placebo effect?

@jamessizemore6180 7 ай бұрын

@@donnievance1942 you are wasting your time buddy...have a great day though :)

@jimyost2585 Жыл бұрын

There's a huge difference between churchianity and genuine New Testament Christianity. Most people have never seen real Christianity, and that includes most professing Christians. One night in Sept. of 2017 I was sitting on the side of my bed praying right before getting in bed, and as I was finishing up praying I asked the Lord to please send the end-time outpouring of the Holy Spirit. As soon as I said it he spoke to me in my spirit and he said: "Many of my people are praying and asking me to send renewal, but when the outpouring comes they aren't going to like it." That was all he said. I waited to hear if he would say more, but there was nothing else. But right then he gave me a brief anointing by the Holy Spirit to understand why they aren't going to like it, and what I got was that the reason they aren't going to like it is because it is going to be so radically different (and infinitely more powerful) from anything they've ever seen that is associated with Christianity, that they won't be able to relate to it and will be afraid of it and will reject it. That's what always happens during an outpouring of the Holy Spirit. And too, whenever the Lord sends an outpouring of the Holy Spirit he purposely leaves the system church leadership out of it, which outrages them and makes them exceedingly jealous of those who he does include in it, so in order to save face they declare that the outpouring is demonic. It happens every time. Also during that brief encounter with the Holy Spirit he revealed to me that another reason (a big reason) they aren't going to like it is because it will reveal where everyone is at spiritually, and most Christians want nothing to do with that.

@spiritualanarchist8162 Жыл бұрын

It's fascinating how an honest man from an extreme religious American background needed to go trough so many doctorates , PHD, etc only to come full circle to what ( Essentially ) most born Atheist learn at a young age. That's religions are just the same old stories told over and over again in new ways.

@kjmav10135 Жыл бұрын

100% YES to this. I was in the AAR part of the AAR/SBL marriage, and I avoided those SBL people like the plague for the very reasons he is suggesting.😂😂

@kjmav10135 Жыл бұрын

Oh my word. You really are confused about the difference between science and religion, aren’t you? Very creative, mixing categories of knowledge like that, but chock full of logical fallacy. Maybe you would benefit from a logic class or two.

@debrawehrly6900 Жыл бұрын

Can a person be a "free thinking Christian "?

@cipherklosenuf9242 Жыл бұрын

Sure. Depends on how one defines the terms. Some would argue no one can really be a free thinker…it depends on definitions.

@battlerushiromiya651 Жыл бұрын

As a still living religion, it is strange if adaoting the message to todays time is something not accepted. That should be plainly obvious thing to happen at divinity schools. It is not like other religions dont get to tailor the understanding of these texts to their religions growth and survivial. If you want to be factually honest, go to a history department or classics department, let divinity schools help in people grow in faith, as they were intended to be.

@SomeFinnishGuyJukka Жыл бұрын

My life got permanently better when switched from SBL to SQL.

@waderogers 8 ай бұрын

About the only way we could know the methods used by Mark, Matthew, Luke, and John to write their gospels would to be to have lived during the time the gospels were compiled and to sit with the authors while they were researching these early 'Jesus' stories, incorporating Greco-Roman myths and legends into an obscure new religion, having people find resource material regarding the history and geography of Israel, etc. Then, and only then, could we know their methods and motives for writing these semi-historical religious docudramas. I've heard it said that people like Luke and Mark, and others, would have had access to libraries for source material, staff or helpers to fetch documents for them to read to garner some historical and geographical information, a patron who funded their writing endeavors and who funded the people who made copies of their works, etc. This evokes images of scrolls in libraries, staff scurrying to and fro, candles on tables, discussions with other educated people who knew the classics, etc. What Dr. Miller is saying is that his work is an attempt to peer into the methods used to compile the gospels stories without necessarily agreeing with the theology contained within. This is purely a historical literary secular exercise whose goal is to find out, from a neutral perspective, how these documents were put together and where did the literary elements originate.

@NoWay1969 Жыл бұрын

Some of Dale Martin's Harvard classes are on KZbin, and he's Episcopalian but he starts his classes explaining to students that the class isn't a faith-based class. He makes a distinction between his faith-based reading of the gospels and an academic reading. Many people of faith do that kind of compartmentalizing.

@RichardMiller-ym5jc Жыл бұрын

Well.. they claim to do so..

@NoWay1969 Жыл бұрын

No, they really do. You necessarily have to compartmentalize magical beliefs from a wider understanding of the world. @@RichardMiller-ym5jc

@RichardMiller-ym5jc Жыл бұрын

@@NoWay1969, I was once one such person. I think those most honest, however, invariably find their way out, particularly those equipped with modern academic resources.

@eternalism8274 Жыл бұрын

15:30 "in classics, I could write freely" - no, you cannot write about myth as depiction of psychedelc experiencing.

@torreyintahoe Жыл бұрын

This is very interesting to hear but not surprising at all. Religious studies are a lot like gender studies. They're usually conducted by people who are motivated by an agenda.

@Tymonie Жыл бұрын

So people of faith are biased and less than academic when they engage sacred texts but secular humanism is unbiased and intellectually superior. Priests and pastors are "shamen" and theological commitment are a "spell." What an unbiased view! This could have been stated far less offensively by distinguishing the study of biblical literature and history from theology.

@michaellane9579 10 ай бұрын

💯

@isawp5199 5 ай бұрын

You seem to misunderstand something. Richard Miller gives the example of witchdoctors and shamans, because you can't use the thing you're talking about as a metaphor for the thing you're talking about, you have to use a different thing. Imagine explaining 'penguin' to someone by saying 'a penguin is a bird which looks like a penguin'! If he simply said "lots of people in Biblical Studies are also super religious, and Biblical Studies often have an extremely religious nature", lots of people would miss the point and go 'so?'. And in essence theology IS shamanism, just with more books and more people and less anthropologists making notes. Scholars like Robert Sapolsky have talked about how anthropologists and sociologists took a while to realise that and be less biased in the study of religion. Do you even know anything about shamanism, or do you just know it's something everyone 'knows' is 'ridiculous' and therefore any comparison is insulting? But I digress. It's not that Christians can't be logical and smart and fair, Miller didn't say that, it's just that we've found lots and lots of evidence that people have a much harder time making good arguments, break through taboos and process counter-arguments when they're really invested in a thing being true or false. Smokers downplay evidence of smoking being bad, most adults don't like evidence of caffeine related health problems because almost every adult drinks coffee or tea, and a lot of adults like to share articles about how a bit of dark chocolate or wine is healthy. And that's just stuff we consume. We don't expect a group of coffee lovers to do an unbiased study about the effect of caffeine on the kidneys. Not when everyone related to the study is in the 'We Love Coffee Alliance' and comes together weekly to drink coffee and talk about how much they love coffee. Also secular doesn't mean humanism, and a secular approach doesn't mean 'non-religious peeps only' either. Anybody who can distance themselves from the theological, emotional and cultural meaning of the text can work secularly. This is NOT about superiority, but about how scholars need to fight against their AND each others biases all the time, and how difficult it is when nobody is taking care to separate the theology from the academic pursuit. Again, we don't trust the We Love Coffee Alliance to do reliable research on caffeine, not when the teams comprises (almost) entirely of their members all the time, even though every individual could be completely unbiased in their research on the effects of broccoli on liver function. For crying out loud, the text is HOLY to Christians, that's on a completely different level than caffeine addiction. Nobody is insulting Christians by pointing out they have big feelings about the Bible. And historians are perfectly capable of being respectful AND honest about historical works, this isn't leaving the Bible to haters, if that's what you're worried about.

@markmanenator Жыл бұрын

I'm like him. I need raw data. Understanding the origin can not also lead to visibility, but can calso bring us together in a modern context. Those were people. They were trying to understand their world, or not. We lost the Library of Alexandria to fanatics, today we would lose our freedoms, the true God given right to exist and thrive.