Bike carbs (ITBs) on car engine - the plan

[@mrsabidji]

Great video. MAP sensor is definitely the way to go. Plus it will help when/if you decide to turbo the car. MAF sensors are just a pain.

[@d4a]

mrsabidji Definitely. The AFM on my 4age is my least liked part on the engine. Looks stupid and restrics airflow - ideal candidate for an amputation. Turbo is a when more than an if :)

[@802Garage]

Took another break. Just looked through all your links. That intake manifold is incredibly reasonably priced! The whole combined kit is pretty reasonable too. That guy should give you a discount/sponsorship for the advertising. :P

[@DanstengineeringCoUk]

He did :-p

[@802Garage]

BOSSSSSS. :P

[@TheFlyingHat]

Oh boy, you're going to have a lot of fun with needles and jets! Carbs are fun if you can get the fuel mix dialed in, the fuel delivery definitely isn't as smooth as EFI, but it gives you a little kick (kinda like a mediocre version of a turbo's power delivery) when you're at full throttle. It may also be worth exploring options for an exhaust that's tuned for your application.

[@d4a]

I have heard and read about carbs being a huge pain. But I'm looking forward to learning. I actually like the rough nature of the carbs, they sound and behave different to efi and really have character. It's gonna be fun :)

[@konerri]

i love how you planned everything out. Love the plan.

[@ali.ahmed.qureshi]

Just what I need to know, and you uploaded. Thanks a bunch.

[@d4a]

Glad it's useful :)

[@Skydmig]

I’m really looking forward to see how this works. I’m not doubting that you will make it work, but I’m unsure of how often you will have to fiddle with the setup to keep it in check.

[@d4a]

StiffWood I wonder about that myself sometimes :) We will know soon enough I guess.

[@fraymond3]

This is good stuff. Side draught or flat slide carbs, or ITB's sound like no other on a good 4 cyl engine. I built an 18RGR back in '99, in college. Ended up selling the engine but kept the 40mm Mikuni/Solex carbs it had on it. I didn't wanna part with the engine but I didn't wanna part with the carbs even more. They have Toyota parts tags on them! I doubt pieces like that are a dime a dozen these days...

[@d4a]

+ZatoichisCaneSword! Thanks a lot man. That 18RGR sounds cool. Especially for someone in college. I had a boring lame stock Opel in college. Hold onto those carbs, they are already valuable, might be worth a small fortune sooner than later.

[@nop58653]

Oh I noticed a huge mistake! The holes the injectors used to previously be installed in can't actually cause any vacuum leaks because you simply plug them with nitrous nozzles. I mean they are already machined perfectly into the plenum and ready to rock you'd be out of your mind not to give it 150 shot

[@hotspoon84]

I've been looking at this kit on eBay and wondering how/what/where and more how.. but luckily I found your videos!! I'll be keeping an eye on this build for sure! Thank you, keep up the good work and good luck 👍🏻

[@d4a]

hotspoon84 Thank you. Glad to hear the vids are informative and useful so far. I'll definitely document everything all the way to the tuning of the carbs and other crucial stuff. I've got interesting stuff coming up, glad you're on board :)

[@hotspoon84]

driving 4 answers ooh very glad to hear this! When can I expect to see your next video??

[@d4a]

hotspoon84 I already have the unboxing video of the DanST engineering kit published. I also have started engine block assembly, that video is published as well. I expect to have the engine fully assembled by the end of the month. The first vid is coming up mid October, and the full assembly by the end of October.

[@1one3_Racing]

Great vid and very informative for those just starting out down this road. Gave me lots of good ideas

[@barbeblonde9874]

Omg, now i so much want a 4 throttle body on my car !

[@d4a]

Barbe Blonde You can do it :)

[@martytix]

Jeez man good luck with all that. I'm just going standalone ecu in my gze build, gonna keep an eye on this!

[@d4a]

Martin Thomas Thank you. Stay tuned, it should be fun :) Good luck with your gze, feel free to post more about it.

[@802Garage]

Just a little comment on the title. I think I would prefer: "Bike Carbs on Car Engine" or "Car Engine with Bike Carbs" And maybe add "Coversion Plan" to the end as you have it. Could also go with "Converting EFI Car Engine to use Bike Carbs - The Plan" or similar. Throwing in ITB would be good too, since so many people search for that. Not knocking you at all, just being picky about the English and also thinking of search optimization.

[@802Garage]

4A-GE Car Engine with Motorcycle Carbs and ITBs - Conversion Plan That may be my favorite. I'm known for lengthy and terrible titles though. XD

[@d4a]

802 Garage You're right. The title was stupid. I changed it. Thanks for pointing it out, I'm not vain to be annoyed by something helpful. Appreciated.

[@802Garage]

Yeah just friendly discussion, of course. :)

[@truth1901]

We all agree that energy can slow down into physical and become conscious temporarily in the form of a human on a wetrock spaceship with an external heat supply.

[@Cywilian]

Hi, I wonder if hybrid is possible. Bottom of intake with injectors stays,than ITB fits pass that just controling air. Sounds like much simpler option if possible

[@ruinman8722]

Very ambitious plans, mate! hope you can implement it soon! :)

[@d4a]

RuinMan Thank you. I will give it my all :)

[@antrinh5525]

if the carb conversion will make the 4age even more responsive, that's awesome. are u going to use an air filter type system for it?

[@coopadupa]

great video again mate :D

[@802Garage]

Oh snap! Was gunna take a break from filming work on my MR2 to watch, but I probably shouldn't do a full 27 minute sit down. XD

[@d4a]

802 Garage I really hate the length of it. But I couldn't find a way to keep it below 27 and still keep what I think is genuinely relevant. Original was like 38. I edited the hell out of it :)

[@802Garage]

Oh I'm not complaining at all! Just mean I shouldn't spend so much time in my chair when I have so much work to do, hahaha. Excited to finish watching.

[@shure5758]

Why not just buy an intake or build one. And slap 4 1 bbl carbs or 2 or 4 bbl carb on it? I think itll be sweet with motorcycle carbs but getting the right jetting done and to keep the fuel mixture correct at higher rpm might be a huge downfall due to cylinder displacement.

[@DanstengineeringCoUk]

Cylinder displacement will not be an issue. The carbs can be up-jetted as much or as little as required. 37mm chokes are equal to (or greater than) the typical choke size found in a set of weber DCOE's on a 1600-2000cc car engine.

[@spirit4age677]

so why not just go 20v throttles? cant wait to see how it turns out tho

[@rogerwilliams2042]

Hey Buddy great video! What if The bike carb has no TPS? I mean not even from factory

[@d4a]

Hmmm. Don't buy them :) you can always use a MAP sensor for load reference

[@donavenable]

Good,video.. Please send me your 4age Tvis intake with all the fitting that you have with it. I like the explaination on why you would convert the 4age engine fuel system, into bike carbs individual throttles. But, has you explain to your subscribers to your, that this is not your every run about car.

[@michaelburnett7985]

Im doing a 86 4a-c conversion to 4a-gc, would i have to change out the fuel pump since its already carbed? Also ive heard that kouki 86's have the same trim as the gts but missing the obvious goodies. Great vids btw! You're like the only guy who does great vids on the 4a-ge

[@michaelburnett7985]

Funny thing is i had gottan all this stuff together before you put this video together

[@d4a]

+Michael Burnett Thank you! It all depends on the pressure the fuel pump generates, but I assume it should be good to go since it was carbed before. Double check that tho :)

[@michaelburnett7985]

driving 4 answers thanks brother!

[@dennisvanderben2719]

Great explanation! now i know why!:D

[@d4a]

Dennis Vanderben Thanks for watching. This is a very long video but I tried to cover everything :)

[@sasajungic89]

Isn't it easier to get 4a-ge 20v throttle body. Or is there a fitment issue?

[@d4a]

You might say it's easier, but with kits like the one I'm getting from danst engineering is just as easy honestly to get a bike carb setup. You need an adaptor plate for the 20v throttle bodies to get them on the 16v head.

[@DanstengineeringCoUk]

and full standalone EFI management - so add another £800 GBP at least, plus full mapping :-)

[@DigerCZ]

I have a single point injection system.. Do you think my MPG and emissions are actually going to get worse or better? Because what I think is, that the SPi is a piece of sh**! (So I'm thinking about bike carbs, I have Opel/Vauxhall Astra F - X16SZ)

[@d4a]

+DigerCZ I think if tuned properly, with a good afr gauge, your emissions and mpg, and especially performance might turn out to be noticeably better than with spi. I don't know about that particular spi, but I dislike spi in general as well, other than being cheap to make it doesn't really have advantages.

[@Vortrex99999]

I went through this lists of parts too once. Are you changing some internals while installing the carbs? Also, I thought adjustable fuel pressure regulators are the best option for carbs, but Dan makes those very nice fuel pumps so that's definitely a good option. But those Tomei FPR's are pretty rock solid. Also with ignition controller you mean like MSD 6AL? I didn't know you could run without them. They are also pretty pricey the new ones. PS, want some very nice carb 4age (but not bike carb) video's? Here: /watch?v=3BcNz_xIurk /watch?v=AbH0-7VVAjA

[@d4a]

I kinda wanna remove my fuel tank too and clean it out. So while I'm there I decided what the heck let's get the bike fuel pump and keep it simple. I'm sure the tomei fpr is good, tomei doesn't really make anything that's bad. The decision to go with a bike fuel pump is just me, I'm sure fpr might be just as good . You can run without MSD or any other standalone ignition controller, you keep the stock ECU. That's what I'll be doing initially, I hope it will work out :) Watch the video. That french celica sounds mean!

[@tuksee]

you dont need other fuel pump, just buy fuel regulator.

[@d4a]

Antti Tukse You're right a regulator would be a more simple solution and doesn't require me to remove the tank, but it's also less reliable and a bit more expensive. Good regulators cost a lot and even they aren't bulletproof, plus it requires more fuel lines. I also want to clean my fuel tank. But that of course that doesn't mean an fpr isn't an ideal solution for someone else.

[@wontputrealname]

There was and probably still is a company called Malpasi or Malossi or something similar who sold a fuel pressure regulator available either on its own or combined with a filter which worked very well and was not expensive. Whether it would work properly with a 3 or 4 bar input I cant say as the old type fuel pump output was only about 1.5 or 2 bar at most. Worth researching perhaps.

[@tuksee]

malpassi is not good, many has issues with those. AEM is a good one and works like charm.

[@wontputrealname]

I used one with a filter on a number of cars with both electric and mechanical fuel pumps with no problems, but these were all low pressure systems. That may account for my positive experiences. I also knew a number of people involved in competition, most of whom used these on their competition cars with complete success. I didn't hear of any problems, but this was many years ago and I may have forgotten the very few instances.

[@DanstengineeringCoUk]

you can go this route and we do offer an EFI -> Carb regulator, however it does rely on having a good size return line (required size depends on the standard pumps flow rate). Therefore it can sometimes be simpler and better guaranteed to work by simply using the bike pump.

[@AndersRamm]

More building, less talking :D

[@d4a]

Definitely. This is the first and last video on this build that will be only talking.

[@mr__No]

Interesting project. Can I put my Tomos engine into a car? No? Right. Good luck, just don't sand blast anything ever again... Just saying.

[@reneneron2971]

Enjoy your videos, but still don't understand the "why" on this one. Why not just get a 20v 4AG that gives you iTB's while retaining the benefits of a closed loop EFI set up? Same looks and sound, but better fuel economy, controlled Air to fuel ratio, etc. I do not believe a carbureted engine, even when adjusted properly, will be any more responsive that a fuel injection setup. There are good reasons that EFI is used on all modern engjnes. You will spend a lot of money on this and still make less power than a silver top or blacktop 20V 4AGE. Blacktop has variable valve timing, higher compression ratio, lighter internals, and is higher revving...generating more power than the set up you are doing with far greater reliability, lower emissions, and no need for routine balancing of carbs.

[@d4a]

Rene Neron Glad you like the vids. 4age 20v IS a smarter choice probably. Better mileage, probably similar sound, not the same tho, but no worse definitely. Problem is I can't import a 4age 20v legally. I need to own a car that came originally with it to get the engine through customs. A car that came originally with it doesn't exist where I live. I checked :) But I might still go with bike carbs even if I could import a 20v. 20v has been done to death and carbs are kinda charming and I have some weird urge to fiddle with them :), plus it will be really cool to see how they compare against efi and 20v. It will be fun :)

[@802Garage]

I had no idea you couldn't even import one! That said, sometimes making something unique is all the fun. Cars aren't all about the smartest and most economical choice, otherwise everyone would do the exact same builds. Cars are about fun and passion too. Plus, his actual cost on this build is actually going to be fairly moderate, and still probably less than buying an entire good 20V engine and supporting parts. I personally want to SR20 swap my MR2. I wanted to get it done this summer, but had too much come up. Why am I doing it when a Honda K swap will give me more power with a more modern engine? I like the SR20 and nobody has done it before. :D

[@d4a]

Spot on! "Cars aren't all about the smartest and most economical choice, otherwise everyone would do the exact same builds." This sums it all up.

[@drmikegaspwred1483]

itb (injected throttle body) so no carbs

[@d4a]

DrMike gas pwred itb stands for individual throttle bodies. :)

[@drmikegaspwred1483]

driving 4 answers here in europe all tuners use term itb for injected throttle bodyes

[@alycestapleton]

Why do this its stupid efi is much better also so many people have had blown engine because of engines running lean as fuck waste of time the fuel injection engine will out do the carby set also you can just get the itb from 20v you can get and plate to bolt the itb setup

[@d4a]

I am getting a wideband afr gauge to avoid running too rich or lean. It's very hard to generalize and say efi will outdo carbs, it depends on a lot of factors and what do you mean by outdo. It's never that simple.