Bill Maher RIPS Free College In Smug Elitist Rant | The Kyle Kulinski Show

[@JB-qf5ep]

Right, let me get this straight. College used to be cheap enough that you could work a part time job during college and graduate with no debt, and graduating with virtually any degree could get you a decent job enough to support a small family on a single wage, all at a time where sexual liberation and 'hippy' philosophy were peaking. All that was earned? But nowadays, college is shoved at us if we want a snowballs chance in hell at success at a low level job with more job requirements than ever before, college debt is so insane that most of us will die without paying the full amount off, house prices are through the roof, people are forced to have 3 jobs and/or live with their parents/7 roommates into their 30s, people can no longer afford families and 2 incomes are necessary, and we are about to have reproductive rights taken from us, and these smug pricks sit in their pampered little studio thinking that we will only have 'earned' less debt if we give at least 2 years of our lives to the military industrial complex and maybe get blown up in the name of imperialism?? Will we only earn the same standard of living they had at our age if we die well before our time? The parents they had before them that did everything to provide for them would be absolutely ashamed of how they ruined the lives of younger generations. Bunch of shithead pricks.

[@citizenx8710]

Boomers don't know how much better they had it than the generations that have come after. The great generation of the Depression and WW2 handed everything to them on a silver platter. You can add climate disaster into that mix that increases the chances of more pandemics, famine, and economic strife. And their generation sits on their collective asses because they will be dead when the worst of climate change occurs.

[@rh81454]

Yes, and then the government got involved with guranteed loans. The government is the problem.

[@michelleamatulle6378]

🙌🏽👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

[@susanmozda910]

Absolutely!! Not to mention they get paid millions to get pampered to be in front of a tv camera just spewing their beliefs rather than objective facts, for an hour or two a week. 🙄

[@SadisticOtters]

2008/2009: If you don't go to college you're a loser! 2022: You went to college? What a loser lol

[@silo18]

This feels so accurate.

[@darwinxavier3516]

The first part was definitely already around in the 90s. Then again, so was the anti-intellectualism.

[@pseudo_ra]

😂

[@princea5886]

The key is to not worry about what rich people on TV think about you. Live your life as you like.

[@scifirealism5943]

@@princea5886 oh okay.

[@AgxntAqua]

Imagine Bill's "liberal audience" clapping for the old "join the military" talking point. His fans are friggin clowns lmao

[@GustavoRodriguez-qr5po]

Why did you quote “liberal” he’s a perfect liberal enlightenment era capitalist

[@Dan16673]

everything should be free. like europe where houses, cost of living, abortions ahhhh wait all of those things are more difficult there. hmmm

[@slycat956]

Uh imagine being a Kyle fan and then saying Bill Maher's fans are clowns. The irony

[@50jakecs]

@@Dan16673 Hmm, someone on the internet making up stuff. I never saw that before.

[@nowshipping]

Kyle is the fraud here. I actually saw this full episode. Glad to see him do this segment and respond. However he left off all of the stats Bill called out like how the number of people with debt is small, those who are in debt are usually for grad degrees, the majority of people were NOT impacted, etc. They went on to say how they support free community college. I am calling out Kyle’s BS here because he deceptively edited the clip. It’s because he can’t respond to the actual data. I thought he were better than this. Play the full segment and respond…. Obviously he has no answer which is why he cut out the data. He called it a losing issue because when you look at the data it would kill Dems in swing states and help a single digit portion of the population who are mostly paying off grad degrees or elite schools… not quite the working class when you look at the data. Pathetic.

[@AllTimeScary]

Imagine being against education. Imagine being against the idea of learning more and improving your life and society. College and trade schools should be available and free to all Americans, period.

[@mtn1793]

The economic benefit alone should be enough reason to advance education. It shows how far our culture has fallen that they can’t see it.

[@sheldonspider86]

Its not against "education" its against the method of pay. I would be very happy if you and your family had an exquisite dinner tonight. I would be very upset if you made ME pay for it simply because you found it to be too expensive.

[@bbkmitch]

Depends on what those people are being educated in. Is it your proposition that the public should pay to for a gender studies major? There’s a spectrum of meaningful studies.. if you could cut the BS ones and only pay for useful studies then it might become a reasonable option. But you likely can’t stand up to those people to tell them their majors and courses are junk. For fear of being called some type of phobe. That’s where a spine would come in handy.

[@scottzaun8865]

Imagine liberals taking some self responsibility and be accountable for their choices and not asking the govt to pay for everything

[@mtn1793]

@@sheldonspider86 We pay to educate soldiers in the ways of war and destruction. Why would we balk at educating “soldiers” in the ways of production? We’re not talking about subsidizing frat rats and bimbos. We’re talking about serious students of serious subjects.

[@importantoldnews5414]

Bill Maher is an English major who went to college when it was much cheaper than it is now. The current price of college is a policy choice, not an inevitability.

[@millennialsecularandauthri3338]

Yes! The government created this problem. I personally would benefit from debt forgiveness and thus support it. But I don’t see how anyone can’t realize that we need some sort of serious action, even if it comes in just allowing bankruptcy ore removing interest.

[@infidelheretic923]

That is half true. It is an inevitability of the current policy choices. That being unlimited non-bankrupt-able government loans for any degree from any university. That doesn’t give the universities any incentive to control costs.

[@Scott-xb1ku]

The government stopped subsiding college tuition. Bill has most of his paid for by government.

[@WeezaY5000]

Maher has also mentioned many times that he ended up selling weed to pay for Cornell, so I guess that is what people need to do. Failed state.

[@goblue193]

He went to Cornell though, not some run of the mill state school

[@DarkManSonian]

Well to them, they didn’t support free college when it was 25 bucks and now they don’t support free college when it’s 30k on the lowest end, they don’t see a difference.

[@luodeligesi7238]

Paul Begala has a Bachelor of Arts and teaches Public Policy at Georgetown. Bill Maher double majored in English and History. But the two hypocrites want to complain about college students going to college to take "useless" classes.

[@thatgui88]

Yeah the college bubble is getting out of hand

[@bidhrohi12]

You didn't learn enough in college to know that simply paying off the debts will be an incentive for colleges to drastically increase tuition.

[@imnotmike]

@@bidhrohi12 I learned enough in college to understand that the debts aren't owed directly to the colleges, so paying off the debts or not paying off the debts won't change a thing for those colleges. They've already got their money. Yes, we also need to address the problem with increasing tuition prices. But forgiving the existing debt is the very necessary step that we have the ability to take right now.

[@darthbrandon2149]

@@imnotmike Actually, I get what Rebel Poet is saying. Buy paying the outrageous debt, college students are definitely signaling to colleges they are willing to pay even more. Intended, or unintended.

[@PennisDrager]

We should apply Paul’s logic to high school, middle school and elementary school. Those kids should be EARNING that diploma; there are coal mines and textile mills which would absolutely devour the free child labor.

[@MartianManHunter7]

Its different because you're forced to go to school as a child and it against the law to not get your kid an education. College is a choice that you're making as an adult. If we were to get free college government would probably get more involved just like they do in grade school

[@jimmytimmy3680]

@@MartianManHunter7 And that is why the technologic and scientific breakthroughs in the coming decades will be in India/China because they graduate university people by the millions.

[@DarkManSonian]

Oh they earn it because they are funneled into a pipeline of being the lowest paid yet highest taxed people on earth.

[@forbushmike2482]

@@jimmytimmy3680 quanity over quality is all it takes?

[@MartianManHunter7]

@@jimmytimmy3680 Yeah because China the authoritative country is the country to look up to. Free college comes with more government involvement and that government involvement can be republicans in charge. Do you really want republicans in charge of the college system?

[@RJones-es7ur]

Maher's audience are such seals. They have literally no idea how to react and are waiting for cues the whole time.

[@imnotmike]

He does literally stop the show to scold them if he doesn't find their reaction satisfactory.

[@yvad1517]

@@imnotmike wow, and he's got the piss-shitting nerve to call out my generation for being 'entitled'.

[@mystman7722]

He'll get a standing ovation if he farts.

[@TheDivayenta]

I think alcohol is served before the show. Just listen to the obnoxious horse laughs he gets for nothing. Or maybe there are buzzers in the seats? 😂

[@Subbedhunter]

1 in 10 degrees completed are in social sciences or history. Business degrees are 1 in 5. Health degrees are 1 in 10. I don’t see anybody crying about the excess of business degrees or healthcare professionals when this conversation is brought up. People that oppose free college because of Maher’s points are useful idiots to the rich. They’ve been duped into focusing on fringe minor degrees like “gender studies” and oppose the opportunity to pursue individual American dreams and a personal education. If you do, you’re not pro-liberty, it’s antithetical to the American concept of pursuing happiness.

[@informer3evans797]

It is not that people a problem with free college or some kind of subsidy for college. They have a problem with paying for loans that others willingly chose to take out. If you are going to say free college, you have to make it available for everyone. You can't just tell fiscally responsible people ha ha, you should have been irresponsible because we are going to reward those people with your tax dollars.

[@moestietabarnak]

@@informer3evans797 ha ha, you should have been a lunatic sociopath, because they're are rewarding the one making weapon for wars with your tax dollars.

[@patchwurk6652]

@@informer3evans797 Get over it. We pay for shit we don't want to all the damn time, you people tell us to suck it up. You don't want to pay for college? I don't want to pay for these stupid fucking wars. Why is there endless money for blowing up foreigners, but suddenly paying for college is "too much" for you people?

[@cristianproust]

I have a question for you. That is an interesting point, because I thought that the problem was the commoditization of degrees, because I met an endless list of Americans with those useless degrees. Double major in biology and sports, marketing and business, et. and they overwhelmingly ended as English teachers here, because they didn't have any specific real competence for the market. They told me that going to college was seen in the US as automatically having a good income (because it was not as common in the past). Since tech made degrees less valuable, they ended up with a ton of debt and not real qualifications to produce in return (because it became massified). You are telling me that you have "engineers suffering"? "MDs"?. I want to understand what stats you have , because my ex-girlfriend's brothers they are all engineers and they have a seriously good income, even having college debt. She on the other hand studied biology and sports, and she starved in Madrid as an English teacher with 100k in debt from St. Louis University that she will never be able to repaid. She does not make money, because she does not know how to do anything. She read books but she was not an actual specialist in anything. I imagine degrees in history, biology and the myriad of similar degrees that in Europe we consider "vocational" and are assumed to have low salaries (or teaching oriented, with well known salaries),in the US should be the same, but nevertheless people apparently assumed a gargantuan debt when they enrolled in them as if reality didn't exist, because they thought college=money. A dangerous gamble. I want to know your stats, because from our distant perspective, those who wanted an easy ride with impractical degrees are the ones who want to be bailed out by the working class, when at the same time they socially look down on them. Are your engineers or MDs poor? or just the bartender at Starbucks that studied history, psychology (without clinical specialization) or biology who truly don't know how to do anything and the market simply can't find anything more for them than pouring coffee? If you give me the stats, I would love to change my opinion, because I love free college, but in countries with a McDonalds-type college where education is commoditized to make it more appealing, seems immoral making the poor responsible for subsidizing bad investments of some. I truly mean it as a question

[@patchwurk6652]

@@cristianproust Well that was a long-winded way to say "People got degrees, they took out the loans, make Them pay for it" as a position. A nation needs specialists in order to function, you either pay for an educated populace or you get the dipshit nation you currently got. Like seriously, do you want to fix the damn problem or not? Because either you people suck it up and pay for the education as a country, or you'll continue to keep paying the massive debts and exponentially More expensive education and insurance privately, relegating an education to be an exclusive privilege of the rich over an uneducated impoverished masses.

[@luodeligesi7238]

Top 10% mechanic salary = $59,000 Median entry level MBA salary = $100,000 There's a reason they want YOUR kid to be a mechanic, while THEIR kid gets to go to college and get an MBA. Edit: for the people below saying "well I know a mechanic that makes $100K" - yeah, that mechanic is in the "top 10%" as is anyone making $59K+. The median MBA makes that much just out of college. Edit: for the other person saying "well some people want to be hairdressers, mechanics, fire fighters, etc" - yes, and it's in our country's best interest for them to have that training without going into debt. But some people also want to be doctors, lawyers, engineers, teachers, scientists, accountants, etc. and it's ALSO in our country's interest for them to have that education without going into debt.

[@_audacity2722]

Bingo. This is Bill complaining about not being able to find a cheap enough mechanic.

[@ikerivers1795]

I think they were using mechanic as a catch all term for tradespeople. A lot of those people make good money,above 100k, and tend to live in less expensive places.

[@Boobalopbop]

Not everyone is capable of achieving an MBA though. And that’s not elitist, it’s just the truth. But trade schools should also be free or next to nothing.

[@cwillott]

@@Boobalopbop Not everyone is capable of mastering a trade and making a good living at it. Those folks should go to college & get a bachelor's degree at a minimum.

[@Boobalopbop]

@@cwillott OK, what I meant was that not everyone is an academic. And maybe it’s a waste of their time to study biology, French literature, and statistical analysis. Some people want to become hairdressers, mechanics, fire fighters, bakers, chefs, child care, etc. In Germany (I am American, living in Germany for 9 years now), the final year of high school kids can choose to do apprenticeships part time that will lead to a job after high school. They can choose to do that instead of study only which is meant for kids who intend to go to college for at least a bachelors degree. Associates degrees aren’t really recognized here. I wish the US embrace this way. So many jobs require a bachelors degree in the US, and it doesn’t make sense. Do you really have to go 40 grand in debt to be a police officer? No you should learn that job and train for that job.

[@THEEVANTHETOON]

You know someone is about to make a great point about higher education when they bring up "gender studies," which amounts to a whopping 0.4% of all bachelor's degrees.

[@GreyRock100]

Which does actually prove a good point. And that point is that if the rest of those degrees are "quality" degrees, then we don't have room in the economy to supply those degree holders with appropriate jobs. So too many people got paid to go to school compared to the people who could actually benefit. That's math. We can't just pay our way out of that.

[@shooterlescanettes4010]

Wokeness, Open Borders and Socialism, HAS PUSHED PEOPLE AWAY FROM THE FAR LEFT, Biden Bro Kyle Kulinski. You policies now come at a TERRIBLE PRICE,, Biden Bro Kyle Kulinski But be happy that Bill Maher has Trump Derangement Syndrome, like you Biden Bro Kyle Kulinski

[@HellYeah.McKracken]

Sadly I still think that number is awfully high

[@찬칯]

The Domestic Violence Advocate in my office has a gender studies degree. I think one of the HR Coordinators for Diversity and Inclusion also have a Gender Studies degree (or something like that). Both are damn good at their jobs.

[@THEEVANTHETOON]

@@HellYeah.McKracken I agree that gender studies is worthless as a degree and as a subject, but the point people are tacitly making when they disparagingly bring up "gender studies" is that higher education as a whole is unnecessary.

[@bobbymeade2099]

The irony of Paul Begala talking about working class given that he helped elect the President that signed NAFTA.

[@darthbrandon2149]

Isn't strange how Begala grifts from calling himself a "democrat", but he sounds exactly like a Rethug?

[@t221000]

He sounds just like Marco Rubio

[@rayveck493]

And you shit on the people that voted trump into office who nuked nafta

[@shyphyre]

@@darthbrandon2149 Just like the Clintons, Obamas and so many others

[@darthbrandon2149]

@@shyphyre I like Bill and Barack, but damn are the FOS. 😉

[@Alex-fx5es]

A good chunk of the working class that didn't go to college would have gone to college if it had been affordable. And many of them have children who will go to college eventually. Some may be against tuition free college, but most are not.

[@darthbrandon2149]

Pew Research Center : "Free" College (provided by the states) : Democrats / Leans Democratic voters = 85% popularity. Rethugs / Leans Rethug voters = 36% popularity. Overall voters = 63% popularity. Very interesting note : When a Rethug voter makes less than $30,000.00 a year, the popularity of free college with that group goes UP to 60%. Go figure. But if Boomer Bill had his way, there would be no free college.

[@hectorvega621]

@Jack L No we don't fund the National Government. Local and State yes, because they don't own/make the currency. However, the US can do it on it's own. Our Taxes are just their to create more demand for the currency.

[@futurehistory2110]

The fact Maher mentions gender studies is just so cliché and dumb. It's like terms like 'snowflake' and 'woke', buzz words that people throw at others to disregard their policy stances. It's like, can we actually discuss the actual issues here or are they just going to throw all these clichés out that apply to a small tiny percentage of cases. It's just getting tiresome and silly at this point.

[@shooterlescanettes4010]

Wokeness, Open Borders and Socialism, HAS PUSHED PEOPLE AWAY FROM THE FAR LEFT, Biden Bro Kyle Kulinski. You policies now come at a TERRIBLE PRICE,, Biden Bro Kyle Kulinski But be happy that Bill Maher has Trump Derangement Syndrome, like you Biden Bro Kyle Kulinski

[@boejiden7093]

Agreed. They also teach mechanical engineering, physics, chemistry, math, statistics, computer science at colleges too. Not just gender studies

[@YourLocalCopiumDealer]

I believe Bill was talking political strategy and not policy. He's paraphrasing what a swingvoter would say and deliberatly used buzz words to make a point.

[@PhreakPhantom]

His point is that going into debt over social gender studies with professor Vaush probably won't help you pay for your loan.

[@thatgui88]

Yeah the right keeps mentioning snowflake/gender studies but their is also stem careers aswell.

[@msnewsenior]

I'm really getting sick of the "Gender Studies," argument. I honestly don't know anyone with that degree, most everyone had a degree in Business, Psychology, Computer Science, Pre-Law or in the Medical field that I went to school with.

[@lakersfansince1991]

Those are high paying jobs, why should someone who didn’t get those degrees subsidize those who did?

[@jimmytimmy3680]

And that is why China and India will be making the next scientific breakthroughs in the future. They graduate by the millions.

[@lakersfansince1991]

@Mr JH You shouldn’t make people who didn’t go to college pay for those who did. I don’t think that’s a controversial statement.

[@lakersfansince1991]

@Mr JH why do you think I’m saying we shouldn’t have college?

[@jimmytimmy3680]

@@lakersfansince1991 It is called being a decent human being. I am sure you probably don't help your friends or family. The selfishness and individualism in the US is astounding.

[@kashishimotohoward]

I'd rather my tax dollars go to reducing college debt, than feeding the industrial military complex. I'm a 51 year old veteran and a mechanic. These people are fuckin insane. Most of the people who need debt relief, are my age. How are they paying back student loans 30 years later?!? They just want to keep the working class working longer than they should be. I know I'm going to die working.

[@legendkiller8706]

I wonder if that 2 trillion dollars that was wasted on the war in Afghanistan could've been used instead to fund for free college just a thought idk I might be crazy.

[@--..-...-..-.--....]

I've been saying this too! Now that we're out of Afghanistan, where is that money being used for now? Peace ✌️

[@legendkiller8706]

@@--..-...-..-.--.... precisely btw free college would only cost about 1% of the federal budget a price tag of about 800 billion dollars to give you some context the war on terror has a total cost of about 11 trillion dollars that might be the biggest scam of the century to be honest with you its complete and utter nonsense when they say who's gonna pay for that? Where were these accountable people in the last 20 plus years?

[@lakersfansince1991]

We printed trillions of dollars for covid why not print trillions more? Since apparently there’s no consequence to creating money out of thin air.

[@jimmytimmy3680]

The US Military Industrial Complex is the biggest threat to the world, without exaggerating. They profit out of war, death, misery of humans at war. And like any corporation, all they care about is their cancerous, increasing profits. More wars, more money. Sound familiar with Russia?

[@FunLovingPotato]

If all 3 million veterans of Afghanistan and Iraq were given £50,000 worth of free college, that would cost £150Bn. For reference.

[@peytonsnyder997]

I grew up in a super blue collar environment. Dad was construction worker and then a mechanic. Uncles were all HVAC techs and electricians. Neighbors were plumbers. Every single one of these men in my life encouraged me to go to college. Blue collar work destroyed their bodies. They’ll have to retire a good bit earlier than white collar folks and by their forties were already struggling with work-related health problems. And the culture is hard-there’s hazing, rampant substance abuse, lots of “toxic” misogyny, etc. The talking heads don’t understand that the trades aren’t for everyone, probably because most of them come from the elite class and have never thrown a hammer once in their life. Bill Maher would never make it in that world, lol, no doubt in my mind. I’d love to have a real honest conversation about the future of work and education in America, but very few pundits are willing to dig into the details and acknowledge all the facts of the situation. So there’s really very little reason to waste our time talking with them.

[@Johnywang1]

actual faxx btw. also what none of these guys understand. (and i say that as someone who is Canadian) summer is the time when most people employ alot of plumbers/construction/home reno workers. not to mention the lawn/roofing work. working under the sun for that many years does alot of harm to their skin. like it doesnt end with just their hands, knees and joints.

[@boycemallas8190]

My dad was worked as a cable installer during the late 90's, and when the home internet boom happened, he was on the frontline teaching people and showing people how to install and setup home internet. He alone boosted a family of 5 into high middle class just on his income. He was set to make more than a triple figure income, but one day he blew his back out. Once a tradesman's body gives out, there are no backup plan. He wasn't able to work, he got fired, and it sent my family into a long long long road of debt and poverty. After that my family knew I should go to college and get an education. School is not for everyone, and just like you said, neither is construction or welding or being a mechanic. Give people options.

[@lucianomezzetta4332]

YES. I grew up in the same environment. Much of the left hates workers.

[@blackalien6873]

Thanks for making this point. Not to mention the fact that blue collar jobs have lost all protections because of de-unionization of the American workforce, and are now one step above indentured laborer.

[@blackalien6873]

@@lucianomezzetta4332 Bill Maher and the Dem establishment are rightwing. The GOP is far right.

[@bloo9699]

bout time for Bill to hang it up and sit on facebook all day posting "back in my day" memes

[@saltking2715]

pepperidge farm remembers

[@siqmadiq2171]

Thats what Bill Maher should rename his show as, “Smug Elitist Rant”.

[@coconutmacaroon4907]

He's always dealt in false outrage. And he's not really funny. You nailed it.

[@cristianproust]

Nah, he has a point, actually a strong one. In countries with "free college" (I live in one),people don't study the impractical degrees that Americans have in the "market". Since it cost a lot of money in the US, universities "commoditized" them to make them more appealing, because they wanted customers not students. Before tech made them progressively less valuable, having any degree meant to have a good future in the US. Universities took advantage of that "momentary truism" that college meant money assured, but when you make it massive , the average IQ would necessarily drop, and with the buffet-type- degrees you have people for whom there is no use in the market, and they have bad jobs and a ton of debt. In Europe the requisites are high to be admitted and people either study something that will give them a job (that is always talked about, the "more demanded degrees" every year), and if you study Medieval literature or Gender studies, it is accepted you will be a waiter or bartender. Options are clear, nobody complains. Free college is great, because poor people know that if they work hard, they can have a good income, and if not, they can study a trade, since salaries are not so polarized as in the US, there is not a pressure to go to college. Being a plumber is way more profitable than study history. So people choose their vocation, and don't complain. To make college free in the US you need to stop the commoditization, and those who studied nonsense and are earning what they are worth, do not deserve condonation, because they never cared about actually producing, they wanted being part of the American upper middle class just because they could afford to go to college (engineering is hard, impractical degrees wanted an easy ride). The working class in the US see them as people who wanted an unfair advantage, while seeing them beneath them at the same time (your academics always talk down to working people, even if their degrees are ridiculous ) and now that the investment it didn't work (and they work at Starbucks), they want that risk is absorbed by the poor, that is Maher's point. Not cool, and alienate the vote at the same time. Change your system first, and assume your responsibilities in case of having studied impractical degrees. There are no engineers, MDs or plumbers being poor in the US, only those impractical degrees that the market sees no use for (as it should be). You should have thought twice before thinking the working class was going to save you when you never cared about doing something truly productive in return

[@Oscarnunn]

I personally like " Smug Elitist Prick"

[@kielmessersmith1956]

Or "Real Elitism" Hosted by the out of touch suit.

[@coconutmacaroon4907]

@@cristianproust Because he said something true doesn't make what he said right. That is a trick.

[@OrlyYaRlyK]

Bill Maher is the most smug person I have ever seen and I really don't know why he is so smug.

[@BigSnipp]

Well, you're wrong.

[@ottz2506]

Whenever someone says “I didn’t move, it was the left/Overton window that moved” now, I assume now that they’re lying and they actually have moved right.

[@RunBayou]

The left has absolutely gone insane since I left high school. There's no doubt about it

[@ottz2506]

@@RunBayou there are crazy elements of the left but they certainly don't have the power you think they do.

[@bibsp3556]

The Overton window has been moving, just the wrong way for their argument

[@nas84payne]

Principal Skinner from The Simpsons “is it me that needs to change? No. It’s the kids that need to change” vibes 😀

[@boejiden7093]

“We need more mechanics not MBA’s.” So that means you’re in favor of a living wage right? Because mechanics dont make as much as MBA’s.

[@lakersfansince1991]

Mechanics make a good living. So do welders and electricians. It’s the government that steals their money.

[@bbkmitch]

Competent mechanics make great money FYI..

[@proudbrogressive315]

He wants more mechanics worling for $1 usd an hour. That's the neoliberal dream. We all work for crumbs, while asshats like Bill Maher earn a nonillion dollars a year.

[@luodeligesi7238]

The elites want YOUR kids to be low paid mechanics, but THEIR kids to be MBAs

[@luodeligesi7238]

@@bbkmitch top 10% mechanic salary = $59,000. Median entry level MBA salary = $100,000. There's a reason they want YOUR kid to be a mechanic and THEIR kid to be an MBA.

[@johnwatters3431]

Gotta love the implication here that the working class doesn't have student debt. Check the average cost of tuition in 1960, and then check today's cost against what one would expect it to be via inflation. We got a problem here.

[@stevemalek2970]

There are plenty of working class people who have debt and have to pay it off and are doing so. Not sure why you need to time travel to the 60s to make a point. If you take out a loan be prepared to pay it, if it's too expensive change your coarse of action and do something that is not as expensive and crippling. It's not that hard...

[@scifirealism5943]

​@stevemalek2970 if all colleges are too expensive, what course of action do you take to go to a college that's cheap?

[@jk22222sd]

What the hell does Bill Maher even know about people in the working-class and their struggles? The dude is worth over $100 million!! He has no place to even speak on this whatsoever!

[@MrBlair56]

"We had to be slaves so everyone has to be slaves!"

[@scifirealism5943]

Just-world fallacy.

[@nosondre]

Bill is who he used to make fun of. Way to go, Bill!

[@johnthompsonjr7188]

SO True. I can't watch him anymore.

[@nosondre]

@@johnthompsonjr7188 May as well watch Stewart Varney.

[@johnthompsonjr7188]

@@nosondre UGH... I'll watch paint dry. LOL

[@CoolMoeDea21]

The man with an Ivy League degree who thought Amy Klobuchar was a viable nominee definitely isn't conservative.

[@jakes658]

That's a true statement...

[@lawsonj39]

Oh, like Amy Klobuchar is a wild-eyed leftist? GTFOH

[@Scott-xb1ku]

Cornell isn’t ivy and the acceptance rate was much higher when Bill went.

[@jakes658]

@@Scott-xb1ku Cornell is an ivy league school. You know you can look this shit up before making a comment...

[@AholeAtheist]

LOL

[@mazzb305]

“They earned it with the GI Bill” Tell that to the overwhelming majority of Black Men who were locked out of the GI Bill. I guess they didn’t work hard enough. 😒

[@robertmatthews2009]

Who was locked out of the GI bill?

[@ass4sale2]

@@tumtumtumtum you have no idea what you are talking about. I just finished 6 years of going to college full time all paid for by the GI Bill. Plus I got a monthly housing allowance. I made money going to college. The GI Bill 100% covers tuition cost at state schools.

[@ass4sale2]

@@robertmatthews2009 the people who are locked out were black people back in the 40s Truman fixed that in the 50s when he desegregated the military. so basically if you aren't a WW2 Blackman you haven't been left out.

[@zhitchcresttail3387]

@@ass4sale2 what made you even want to join in this country? Maybe for another one, but not ours

[@ass4sale2]

@@zhitchcresttail3387 yeah I came from a country who's military offers 0 benefits so joining the US military made sense. If you are referring to having to go to war. I can tell you unless you actively volunteer to be deployed you aren't going to a combat zone. It is very competitive and most people don't ever even leave the states. So what are the downsides?

[@moff181]

As somebody from the UK, I think we have a good compromise position (it definitely has its issues but it's good enough). - You take out your student loan with the government - for a standard degree this tends to be about £50,000 - £60,000 for the whole time you're there - You don't pay anything back until you've finished - Once you're done, you effectively get a new tax. This new tax is 9% on everything over £27,295 (which is around the median income) - After 30 years, anything you haven't paid just gets written off. - If you pay it off early (because you're earning a lot), you're done This means that you're only paying back for your degree once you're earning a decent amount - if you lose your job, you stop paying it until you get back above that threshold. You can't go bankrupt due to student debt over here, and it doesn't take an extortionate amount of your pay. Most people will never pay off the whole thing with interest (which is quite high), so it's still partially subsidised. It's not a perfect system but, from what I understand about American student loans, it's a good step in the right direction as a moderate position.

[@scifirealism5943]

Right.

[@scifirealism5943]

Us could do even better than that. Since us is global reserve currency then it could give out loans that could be forgiven to make all colleges free.

[@SnowyNightFlyer]

Bill’s moving into the Dennis Miller school of smugness.

[@charleskra]

The trajectory is remarkably similar. He's been trending toward smug, conservative old fart for a while now. At this rate, Maher will have a show on Fox in 3 or 4 years.

[@saeedhossain6099]

I'm guessing bill is trying on bowties

[@mtn1793]

The thing about “free” college is we so dearly need intelligence and educated citizens to do the important work that must be done to meet the challenges of our future. It’s not even a choice. We ignore this at the peril of our economy and the future of our species. Their Lies have to be silenced.

[@deus_vult8111]

College doesn’t give you intelligence it gives you indoctrination

[@frevazz3364]

Well said. It should be talked about as an investment in our citizens, society, and our economy. It makes sense to give your society as well an educated and prepared citizenry as possible, it's an excellent investment, instead it's become another way to extract wealth from people for the benefit of the few while chastising those people that took on debt when they were told that's what you needed to do to prosper in our society.

[@royalukas8144]

Bill Maher is your average drunk uncle who you’ll never invite for dinner again.

[@Benable7]

Bill Maher went to Cornell and Paul Begala has a Juris Doctor from UT. Hypocrites.

[@robertmatthews2009]

Did taxpayers pay for their college?

[@WeezaY5000]

@@robertmatthews2009 No, bull Maher selling weed did. Seriously, look it up. He has mentioned it a lot.

[@jayray1714]

That was a rough episode to watch. Watch the discussion on RvW they had. The democrat was enraged by what was going on, the republican was smug; and bill didn't seem to care at all.

[@DonnyTinyHands]

Can we all agree that Bill Maher is just a right winger.

[@GordieKat]

By any relevant metric, yes.

[@nuclearcatbaby1131]

At least he doesn’t support Hitleresque vaccine mandates

[@YourLocalCopiumDealer]

No. He changed his opinion on certain issues, but his core principles are still the same. Ask him about religion, freedom of speech, gay marriage or abortions. You can disagree with him, but never as much as the right wing does.

[@mehdihatami3391]

@@nuclearcatbaby1131 COVID has killed 6 million people. Anti-vaxxers like you are a lot more Hitleresque than people who support mandates

[@jvhee]

Bill Maher is Shapiro's best friend now, what a sad old man

[@shooterlescanettes4010]

Wokeness, Open Borders and Socialism, HAS PUSHED PEOPLE AWAY FROM THE FAR LEFT, Biden Bro Kyle Kulinski. You policies now come at a TERRIBLE PRICE,, Biden Bro Kyle Kulinski But be happy that Bill Maher has Trump Derangement Syndrome, like you Biden Bro Kyle Kulinski

[@mattiassoderlind5848]

I've always loathed Bill Maher, I'm just thankful that I don't have to endure the awful taste in my mouth that I used to get whenever I agreed with his smug face on an issue anymore, seeing as he's wrong about absolutely everything nowadays.

[@MarnelGarcon]

Thank you, for all that you do. We need more voices that speak truth.

[@Hatchbasic]

It’s funny how it comes out that Biden may actually do something with some forgiveness and I just so happened to see tons of articles of idiots trying to say it’s a bad idea

[@myhaikaratesmellstillrocks6823]

And, if I know Biden, he'll wilt under that pressure and decide to do nothing instead. LOL

[@darwinxavier3516]

@@myhaikaratesmellstillrocks6823 Considering Biden's rant against young people before he got elected, I seriously doubt he'll go through with it.

[@myhaikaratesmellstillrocks6823]

@@darwinxavier3516 Yep, he's a bastion of the older generation. "I almost died going to school without a polio vaccine - so should you goddammit"!!!!

[@bernardstiegler]

Way to be anti-intellectual Bill.

[@MarkusXC94]

I did two years of AmeriCorps and I still think people should get free college, Paul. Part of the reason I did AmeriCorps is because I didn’t have the money nor drive to go to college when I was 18. That doesn’t mean I think people should be punished for having that motivation at 18.

[@ComradeChyrk]

What i dont get is why these people in there 40s or 50s feel that this only benefits people fresh out of highschool. When i went to community college, our classes had people of all ages from 18 to litterally 70. Your never to old to go to college.

[@scifirealism5943]

They oppose policies which reduce poverty.

[@raxio8369]

All conservatives argue that Americans don't want to spend 'their money' to send YOUR kids to college. But if you ask them what they want from their children's future they sure as shyt want THEIR kids to go to college too. 83% of Americans say they can't afford to send their kids to college. Instead of presenting it as paying for everyone's else's kids, we'd be better off pushing the fact that if taxes paid for college then we would be paying for OUR children's college education in an affordable and sustainable way. Colleges couldn't gouge if government handled them the way Medicare is managed. Stop giving the rich tax loopholes and ensure they give as much as they take from the community. A million here and there is not the same as millions rightfully paid annually. If we all help carry the weight of the responsibility we'd stop crushing our our future into dust that the wind blows through our hands.

[@jesse_cole]

Just to put it in perspective, if you watch the episode, Bagala makes the most left-wing points of the night. He used to be a cohost on Crossfire with Tucker Carlson, and he played the lefty role on Real Time. That's who Maher is.

[@nas84payne]

That’s where I recognised his face from! From that infamous episode with John Stewart 😁

[@Benable7]

College graduates make up like 36% of the population up from 8% in 1960's. So it affects a lot of people.

[@osas2888]

The most privileged 36% of the population. Why should the other 64% pay for a college degree that is only meant to signal to employers that they are more worthy of jobs than the other 36%. Because that's all a college degree is - a signal

[@aaronhumphrey3514]

And there’s also many people with student loans who failed to get a degree for one reason or another.

[@Scott-xb1ku]

Bernable7 Bill thinks 36% of the country are upper middle class lol

[@scifirealism5943]

@@aaronhumphrey3514 yes...

[@TXCLIPPER]

The fact that they would even say that students should have to serve in the military to pay off their debt is disgusting.

[@jjstraka1982]

So sick of hearing about the "working class" which clearly just means "white guys who carry a thermos to work" and literally no one else.

[@avabarker7774]

Getting my associates degree got me off of welfare, into a good paying job and the ability to support our country by PAYING taxes and rather than TAKING taxes. To date I have paid back more in interest than the original student loan itself… and I’m still not done yet.

[@rebeccawoolfolk5377]

Who are the people in the audience laughing and applauding?

[@catibethp5745]

This argument is like if someone said Free the Slaves!? What about all those that had to live their whole lives as Slaves! How is that fAiR!? - its not, its still the right thing to do.

[@sonicpsycho13]

My 800-student Vermont high school has a free vocational and trade school in it. Starting your junior year, you can elect to take vocational courses. Something like that should be in every high school in America.

[@ghostf6321]

I really hate how amongst soo many people especially boomers, everyone who went to college was majoring in gender studies. When I was in college in 2016 out of 20,000 students the gender studies dept wasn't even in the triple digits. The vast majority of students were STEM or business. Also even if you don't think college should be free, can we at least acknowledge it is way too expensive relative to other 1st world nations. Kind of crazy how in other countries educating the youth is seen as a priority but to many in America they just think: "yea fuck the future lawyers, Doctors, engineers, and scientists"... That is unless you have rich parents of course lol.

[@Dennzer1]

💯

[@tomaszwida]

that is so true, people go to the field that gives most opportunities to get hired, that gender studies even humanist majors, are on a low 25% of all graduates, but these idiots parrots talking points, also to a STEM, and business, I would add healthcare(Nurse, pharmacy ) field is also big graduate populus

[@50jakecs]

you are such a liar

[@scifirealism5943]

Politicians oppose policies which reduce poverty long term.

[@Dennzer1]

@@scifirealism5943 Depends on the politicians. The House in Canada just unanimously passed a disability benefit for disabled Canadians to go on top of their far too low provincial disability money.

[@markishill3707]

It's funny how he says college shouldn't be necessary when he only invites on people who have college degrees... I would say there is a correlation but I didn't major in statistics.

[@mariarubino5220]

Exactly. My daughter went to school to get an A.A. to become an electrician. After one term, she's already $15,000 in debt. Community college.

[@scifirealism5943]

Too much.

[@jimmyringz2550]

We pay over 10 trillion in taxes every year. Reallocate the fucking funds to do the things that we want. Stop fighting wars with countries that don’t even have a Navy or an Air Force

[@mikesatteson1534]

I would not be surprised if a large number of wealthy families already have their college educations heavily subsidized by the public, in the form of tax breaks. One of my college roommates was a tax break for his family. He got tuition, room and board and a healthy stipend from interest on a tax sheltered financial instrument set up by his CFO father. If the rich are already free loaders on the system, it's a non-argument to say that free college for all massive subsidy for the rich. They already have theirs.

[@scifirealism5943]

Gross.

[@magoo9279]

Wow! These rich people have no idea what a working American wants.

[@endcorruptio]

"Earn it"? The masses do ALL the work that creates the wealth, and that wealth provides all tax moneys. We earn it everyday. And a college graduate, besides creating wealth for other people and providing products or services for society, pay over a million in taxes on average, throughout their life time

[@ikerivers1795]

The Dirty little secret is that Europeans test all the time. Students have to QUALIFY for the programs. If the Federal Government becomes involved in Higher Education, no on the “college experience “ crap.

[@endcorruptio]

These are earned benefits being denied. Tuition free college is an earned benefit. We need to start calling it as such. the masses do ALL the work an innovation that creates the wealth.These are earned benefits

[@robinvik1]

Nothing pisses off the working class more than knowing their kids can get an education without crippling debt.

[@TheEnigmaProductions]

He's a smug elitist what do you expect

[@BCTTV_DTJ]

I went to truck driving school for "free" in 2009. Actually, 20+ years of being a working guy in this country paid for it. I had lost my commercial printing job in 2008 when the economy crashed and used the Workforce Investment Act to go to truck driving school. That program was fully funded under President Obama and cut severely when Trump took office and people still wonder which party is more for working people...

[@bigwill6089]

More people would go to college if it was free or at least affordable! That dude on the Panel said he went to college in Texas and it was very affordable for him! I think "working class people" want to send their kids to college, but can't afford to!!

[@MWhaleK]

People WANT to go to collage, they WANT their kids to go to collage because "everyone knows" a higher level of education means higher wages and a better job. In other words UPWORD MOBILITY!!

[@taylorhanson1814]

I would rather have taxes cover the cost of college than bail out Wallstreet again. I think most people feel the same.

[@Shtoops]

Am I the only one who has memories of him advocating for free college like 6 years ago? I'm pretty sure he was on that train with the first Bernie campaign.

[@jessewood3196]

It's really funny when Bill fu**ing Maher is sitting there acting like he knows the working class.

[@maskmaker6374]

Ok kool but as someone who really wanted to serve my nation but was told I physically couldn't where can I earn my GI Bill

[@pweasel]

I stopped watching Bill Maher a while ago, after he got money back.

[@Hectic00]

What should happen is, no more school loans if you major in gender studies

[@boejiden7093]

He might as well be a Trump supporter

[@Hatchbasic]

If trump runs again it wouldn’t shock me if he is by Election Day 2024

[@kwizzledizzle4513]

Whatever bro. I'm not that big on Bill Maher, but he's been shitting on Trump for years. You 'everyone who's not 100% on board is a conservative Trump supporter' people are getting pretty tiresome and predictable...

[@boejiden7093]

@@kwizzledizzle4513 no, Bill Maher agrees with Trump on pretty much all of his policies. Every single one even the Muslim ban. So i’m not sure why he’s so anti trump. He literally agrees on everything Trump has said and even did. In fact, Trump’s policies have helped Bill Maher more.

[@bourne817]

Why is it either free or it stays the same? Why can’t it be reformed?

[@plasticsoul9051]

I would love to watch you and Krystal go on his show or have him on your show, and just absolutely dismantle him. I would have more respect for Maher is he just came out as republican at this point

[@footbal218]

Krystal was on once, owned it, and never brought back

[@plasticsoul9051]

@@SkidRowTrash So a Republican with less draconian social beliefs

[@adampetruccione8718]

Don’t you think Biden should cancel teacher and nurse student debt first from a political perspective?

[@vicr.5725]

You need a certificaton from a college to get a good job as a mechanic. Hence, free college is not just for bachelor's degrees.

[@scifirealism5943]

Correct.

[@blackalien6873]

I love how they just assume working class people don't have any higher education ambitions. Either for themselves or their children.

[@scifirealism5943]

Correct.

[@charleswomack2166]

Now that my daughters are in/ about to go in to college very soon, this issue directly affects me! Luckily for me, my baby momma has a few properties to use to pay for their education!

[@AkuaWalters]

This man brings up the GI bill and brushes over the part where black people were excluded from that....

[@AndroidCovenant]

Real Time is basically become like any other talk show i.e. The View

[@jaym9729]

Free trade school should be a thing

[@TROBassGuitar]

Both should be

[@helene420]

I wish Kyle would have also addressed the part where Bill said that there's only 16% of the population are in college debt. Trying to prove his point that it's such a small amount of people who are in debt that it's a losing issue because there's not enough people who would even vote for it. I don't know where he got that 16% figure but that's completely BS.

[@MrWebweaver]

Why would you think it was higher? People in debt from college are likely people between ages of 22 and 40. 60-70% of them went to college and even if they all have debt that would be about 16%. Total population of that group I’m talking about is 20% of the total population of the US. It’s a loser issue because the people that it benefits most also do not vote in large numbers.

[@osas2888]

@@MrWebweaver the person assumes this because everyone around them has college debt. Which is why progressives think poor people paying rich(er) people's turbo booster in the social hierarchy (a college education) is a progressive position

[@jimmytimmy3680]

@@MrWebweaver They do vote, but in a corrupt republic, voting is useless when lobbying, aka corruption, is legal.

[@luodeligesi7238]

@@MrWebweaver converting a non-voting 16% of the population to actually vote for you is more than enough to dominate an electoral process that's been increasingly decided by 70K votes in a couple select states. That's not even taking into account that those 16% of indebted young people have parents, uncles, aunts, grandparents, etc. that would benefit from having their family members not swamped in debt. And then add the number of working class, non-college educated families with young kids who hope to send those kids to college someday. Sure, the parents don't have debt to pay off, but their kids will if things don't change.

[@MrWebweaver]

@@luodeligesi7238 so you are in favour of paying for votes? Grants would be fine if there were conditions attached. Like graduation, minimum gpa requirement, getting employment that pays a reasonable wage. Asking the public to pay for more gender studies majors is not a winning formula.

[@hosseinjavanmard4544]

This is so dumb, these guys don't actually talk to the working class then they would know that these people have children and they want their children to go to university...

[@codbdup88]

You used to pay for annual college tuition by working a fast food job over the summer.

[@scifirealism5943]

Right. That's not possible now.

[@charleswomack2166]

If it is a PRIVATE college than by all means! Charge an arm and a leg! But if it's a public College, it should be absolutely free! And I would even settle for a much more generous state-funded scholarship program! That would be a step in the right direction! Of course, it would not have to apply to underwater basket weaving or art history, but all of the STEM majors plus economics and business should be absolutely free! With a $500 /month stipend!

[@scifirealism5943]

Wow.

[@davidcunetta4081]

It could all be solved with just a rebrand, “paid college and technical training for everyone”. But as usual it is a show meant to divide. If you want to be a machinist, training will be paid for. Simple as that. No one could argue. There would be zero opposition. This silly argument would be voided.

[@charleswomack2166]

Excellent point sir! Reframe the question. That was what got Trump into the white house in 2016!

[@stuffnuns]

I like it.

[@jasonruggles4622]

To miss the point where they want you to pay for it they don't want their taxes raised they don't care if it's college and Technical School they just don't want to pay for it the rich only stay Rich by keeping their money and you people making excuses for them are the reason why we still have extreme poverty in America because you defend people causing it

[@eragon78]

Honestly, the idea of Trade School ALWAYS in my mind was covered under "free college education". Why wouldnt it be? it makes no sense for it to NOT be. This attack is only a device used by people as a trick to attack the idea of free college education. Any rational person already considers "Trade School" or any equivalent as under the umbrella of free college or free higher education.

[@NJdaniels96]

The people against free college don't want free trade schools either. I agree that trade schools should be included with free college but it's not the failure of finding the right magic combination of words that's standing in the way of it getting passed.

[@TheDivayenta]

I had an excellent education at UCSC in the 70’s for NOTHING! Tuition in California was free if you were a state resident. Reagan changed all that.

[@scifirealism5943]

Wow.

[@scifirealism5943]

I hope I can finish college....even though I'm poor.

[@BigRed77777]

In Maher's mind, "the working class" is a bunch of mechanics with dirty overalls and greasy fingers from the 1960's. The lack of societal awareness is shocking.

[@gregbrown8586]

Maher doesn't seem to understand that it's the working class that are going into debt sending their kids to college. And Begala, one of the people who ushered in the get-cozy-with-Wall-Street Democratic policies of the 90's, is the last person I would take advice about the working class from. Just a couple of millionaires complaining about poor people wanting a break.

[@haroutunsarkisyan8050]

i got the gi bill from serving in the army, and im still for universal college. its better to have an educated society, it makes a better electorate, less crime, more tolerant society. i thought this was obvious. and i have 0 in student loan debt.

[@princea5886]

Thank you for your service. Germany was the most educated country in the world in the 1930's. Simply teaching people isn't enough, we need to look at what these universities are teaching.

[@haroutunsarkisyan8050]

@@princea5886 thank you. Yes it depends what they're teaching too

[@scifirealism5943]

​@@haroutunsarkisyan8050made me cry.

[@haroutunsarkisyan8050]

@@scifirealism5943 dang :o

[@scifirealism5943]

@haroutunsarkisyan8050 brother. I'm at community College now. My dad didn't want to help Pay for my education. Even with financial aid, I can't afford living expenses like food. I have to use a food pantry to be able to eat. How can a country wealthier than every other leave me without education affordability?

[@tomthorsett1433]

Rich people always so worried about being infinitesimally less rich.

[@scifirealism5943]

Correct.

[@Unitos_]

"The Dem's are getting more leftist, I've been the same all along," is a right-wing thing to say.

[@jimwallington437]

How can any politician who cares about people not want the happiest, healthiest, best educated populace possible? It seems to be that this should be the goal of every politician.

[@scifirealism5943]

That isn't their goal though. They exist to perpetuate poverty and financial institutions.

[@seriouslyrelax]

Maybe that factory worker would have gone to Stanford himself if he had free college.

[@GreyRock100]

Maybe the idiot wouldn't need a bail out if he didn't get a handout.

[@MishaFlower]

Factory workers were radical as fuck. Read the stories about unions back then. They used to burn entire towns down. Literally.

[@scifirealism5943]

Correct.

[@petedog9581]

What did college cost in 1975 Bill? The only people against eliminating a big chunk of the national GSL debt are people who already paid. That is just like not wanting to pay taxes for schools any more after your kids have graduated.

[@RJ-qs6nm]

I wouldn't be anywhere without the 2 bachelor's degrees I have. This whole "college is pointless" thing is relevant in some circumstances but not all.

[@fmbbeachbum8163]

Too many people that are'nt qualified for college go to college, because it's all about the money now.

[@nuclearcatbaby1131]

@@fmbbeachbum8163 And that’s why scientists these days are stupid enough to allow experimental vaccines to be approved.

[@Jukantos]

"We need more mechanics, not Bachelors" - then MAYBE those mechanics should earn a living wage? Such a hack xD

[@mofishin2648]

If you are going to throw a bunch of money at something that will benefit everyone, universal healthcare is that issue. That should be the focus.

[@50jakecs]

I believe we also need universal healthcare, but why can't we fight for universal healthcare AND education at the same time?

[@NJdaniels96]

The people in power against free college are also against universal healthcare. It makes zero sense to act like these ideas are in opposition to each other.

[@theredestbull]

German University Degree: costs about 25000€, that is including the cost of living, usually in an apartment with some roommates. Actually the cost of the education is about a few hundret euros per year, cause universities are part of the education branch of public services and payed by taxeuros. The loan is mostly for cost of living. For the bachelor as well as the master degree anyone can apply for a "loan" issued by the government (BAFöG) which is payed out monthly and the amount is based on the income of the parents (the higher their income the less one gets) The "loan" is free of charge and one only has to pay back 50% of it or the cap of 10000€, whichever is lower, plus one gets a 20% disagio if one is able to pay the entire amount back within the first 5 years after the first degree. The pay back rates are set at about 110€ per month, but there are a number of reason for a postponement, also free of charge. Similar for trade school, but correct me if I am wrong