BioBros: The Supraphysiologic Man Episode 2 | HCG on Cycle? | Allopurinol & Uric Acid

Leo and Longevity
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TIMESTAMPS:
0:00:00 - Intro Teaser
0:00:36 - BioBros: The SUPRAPHYSIOLOGIC Man
0:02:07 - To HCG, Or Not To HCG, That Is The Question (On Cycle)
0:04:46 - Testicular Size & Testicular Health
0:06:04 - Leo's Experiences With HCG On Cycle & FSH Post-Cycle
0:10:34 - Fertility Protocols On & Post-Cycle
0:14:57 - 19-Nor Derivates & Selective Progesterone Receptor Modulators (SPRMs)
0:16:03 - Testicular Fibrosis Due To Prolonged HPTA Downregulation & Fertility
0:17:30 - Bypassing Potential LCHG Receptor Downregulation
0:19:53 - Neuro-Steroids; DHEA & Pregnenolone
0:23:53 - Prolonged Hypogonadal States & Measuring Testicular Volume
0:25:39 - Post-Cycle Therapy Discussion
0:28:11 - Blocking Sex-Hormone Receptors With Mifepristone
0:29:54 - HCG Vs. HMG On Cycle Conclusions
0:34:31 - Enclomiphene Citrate Vs. Clomiphene Citrate
0:37:04 - Baseline LH & FSH Measurements Before Starting PEDs
0:40:31 - Reversing Epigenetic Changes On Cycle With Extended PCT
0:41:13 - Off Topic; Rich Asians, Singapore, Dubai, Japan
0:46:40 - Off Topic; Club Scene
0:50:23 - Allopurinol & Uric Acid Levels
0:53:10 - Off Topic; Informative Videos & Podcasts On KZbin
0:50:23 - Allopurinol, Uric Acid, Gout & Kidney Stones
1:01:39 - Off Topic; Comprehensive eBooks
1:03:25 - Off Topic; Dante "DOGGCRAPP" Trudel
1:06:01 - Citrus Bergamot, Red Yeast Rice, Statins; Serum Lipid Concentrations
1:08:42 - END!
#vigoroussteve #leoandlongevity #biobros

[@VigorousSteve]

TIMESTAMPS: 0:00:00 - Intro Teaser 0:00:36 - BioBros: The SUPRAPHYSIOLOGIC Man 0:02:07 - To HCG, Or Not To HCG, That Is The Question (On Cycle) 0:04:46 - Testicular Size & Testicular Health 0:06:04 - Leo's Experiences With HCG On Cycle & FSH Post-Cycle 0:10:34 - Fertility Protocols On & Post-Cycle 0:14:57 - 19-Nor Derivates & Selective Progesterone Receptor Modulators (SPRMs) 0:16:03 - Testicular Fibrosis Due To Prolonged HPTA Downregulation & Fertility 0:17:30 - Bypassing Potential LCHG Receptor Downregulation 0:19:53 - Neuro-Steroids; DHEA & Pregnenolone 0:23:53 - Prolonged Hypogonadal States & Measuring Testicular Volume 0:25:39 - Post-Cycle Therapy Discussion 0:28:11 - Blocking Sex-Hormone Receptors With Mifepristone 0:29:54 - HCG Vs. HMG On Cycle Conclusions 0:34:31 - Enclomiphene Citrate Vs. Clomiphene Citrate 0:37:04 - Baseline LH & FSH Measurements Before Starting PEDs 0:40:31 - Reversing Epigenetic Changes On Cycle With Extended PCT 0:41:13 - Off Topic; Rich Asians, Singapore, Dubai, Japan 0:46:40 - Off Topic; Club Scene 0:50:23 - Allopurinol & Uric Acid Levels 0:53:10 - Off Topic; Informative Videos & Podcasts On KZbin 0:50:23 - Allopurinol, Uric Acid, Gout & Kidney Stones 1:01:39 - Off Topic; Comprehensive eBooks 1:03:25 - Off Topic; Dante "DOGGCRAPP" Trudel 1:06:01 - Citrus Bergamot, Red Yeast Rice, Statins; Serum Lipid Concentrations 1:08:42 - END!

[@joshuahall433]

Ledgend

[@moi3868]

hello I have been following you for 2 months I saw your video dir the pct guide and I would like to know what frequency and dosages of hmg at the end of the cycle? Cordially

[@Optimization_Coach]

2 genuine guys that are transparent and knowledgeable. 2 of my favorites for sure.

[@nakefatty9167]

Leo is the first person in the industry to rock long sleeve black tops and gold little finger rings. to my knowledge: nobody else is rocking this. these elements have been observed separately but Leo is the pioneer of combining them: At least in the bodybuilding community. I Love you guys

[@Nightxslayer420]

True playa pimp master level of this section of medical knowledge. Homie Steve rocks that hairstyle and look along with his voice out of something from new Eden. Legit big brains in this specialty

[@natec3925]

great content, I like how Leo explains everything to audience before just delving into the subject. Only negative is that he kind of doesn’t let Steve speak

[@Nightxslayer420]

I love how Leo gives genuine credit to Steve. “Yeah you’re the first one to have spoken on that no one else has.” That’s legit credibility. Such bond. Such knowledge. Masculinity. Freakin Leo the Rico suave role with his accent and pinky gold ring damn lol

[@1DEADBEEF1]

Bro he died :(

[@kevinbaublitz7994]

Love the knowledge! Saving balls all around the world 🌎 👌 🙌

[@juanvaldes1837]

A very important contribution to mankind

[@braedenvallejos9855]

Thanks for the shout-out Steve I have to say you did a better job at pronouncing my name than my school teachers! It is pronounced (Vai-ye-hos) it is a common last name in Spanish speaking countries being the diminutive and plural of valle meaning valley. Leo I commented supraphysiological because that is the term that Derek and his comment section use more frequently. I definitely prefer it to be titled "The Supraphysiologic Man" as the compound suffix -ical is redundant in this context. I have definitely seen both supraphysiological and supraphysiologic in my personal research as well as confirmed they are both frequently used through google scholar. It's actually an interesting phenomenon as nobody would say genetical, diabetical, or acidical.

[@denatra7144]

Indeed.

[@nickdipietro7797]

Vigorous Steve and Leo Rex !! 2 Brilliant Minds 🥰🥰

[@fondrees]

many rare gems of knowledge in every derek video and many times off topic knowledge thrown in for context thats why u have to watch everyone

[@buckallison7279]

Been digging into this the last month. Learned more here in 1 hour. Great video

[@ryanb1757]

Love how far you guys have come!

[@Bobbydigtail17]

Tons of great information! Thanks for this video, gentlemen.

[@gabrielepirovano3529]

Amazing 😊 Love you guys! Can’t wait for more podcasts! I should be studying right now but cutting time to not miss it :)

[@WeSkatePN]

It’s really wonderful to listen to you two . Thanks for the video

[@jimgoer808]

I love the podcasts and extended videos, at work I’m alone every now and then, so it’s perfect for that and I’ll relisten and catch the things that I missed

[@oliverrivera-pessi]

Two great knowledgeable guys in a fruitful discussion! Love it! Thx Leo and Steve

[@swolenation8550]

Best advice here to always get your blood work done! Great content BioBros!

[@RussScala]

Excellent job guys we need more of your research

[@whossane592]

Coach Steve, I'm really grateful for the amazing content! we will speak with in the near future.

[@KJW742]

Biobros: supraphysiological man. Nice name. Excited to listen to all the great content you both are producing

[@welanduzfullo8496]

7:30 hCG and LH have a very different structure only the Alpha-Subunit (non-binding site + does not have any known independent biological function) and the Beta-Subunit are the same from (h)CG to LH, the proteins look very different though, they have different additional non bidining protein domains, different conformation, different glycosilation patterns and groups etc. . (h)CG/HCG acts as functional analogue, not a structural one ...

[@vonworms0]

one of the best podcasts ever

[@jibrankhalil4837]

Steve, citation desperately needed for FSH causing LHCG receptor upregulation in human males.

[@Caspaah151]

Goeie podcast. Indeed a companion in less social times. Steve, How did you amass your "Medical" knowledge? Do you also have a history on forums? maybe an interesting topic to touch on for a future podcast.

[@redtrek2153]

You're right that progestogenic compounds are directly suppressive to the testes, as opposed to the usual thinking that it's all about the hypothalamus. I'm also not convinced about LHCG receptor down regulation per se, but would instead consider oxidative stress that could occur with very high doses of HCG.

[@gif24gt60]

Great video but a separate video should be made on Singapore and Southeast Asia. The tangents can be very distracting.

[@barrie888]

Fascinating and practical stuff

[@papibuilder]

Dave plumbo = 10 years of anabolics + 10 years of hrt and now he is completely natural for last 5 years

[@zachhayes4954]

Another topic I’ve really wanted to learn about lately

[@seanclement2721]

When minds 🧠 collide! 🔥💪

[@juanvaldes1837]

Top notch info

[@gif24gt60]

What are the brand names for rLH? Is there a recombinant FSH & LH combination so u don't have to buy two separate medications?

[@jabba2007]

Just what I need to watch, currently taking hcg thinking of switching hmg. Comment for algo 👍

[@pharmfurion4969]

The stark difference between LH mimetics used in androgen deprivation therapy and HCG is the kinetics- not the dynamics. This is the reason why each of the therapeutically validated LH mimetics use pharmaceutics that allow constant steady blood concentrations. Even with a t1/2 of >24hrs - the fluxing of rHCG serum concentration would undoubtedly have less implication at the nuclear level- seemingly to the extent of little tachyphylaxis.

[@ryanshearsmith1627]

Have you got any videos on PCT vs Cold Turkey and in what situations each way may be adopted or more preferred? I've personally tried Cold Turkey once and found the benefits to be quicker and my bloods looked great. However, it was rather intense for a short period.

[@danieledwards9856]

Manila is a strange place- I hated it the first time I went. Then went back and loved it. Can’t wait until travel is possible again, I’ll be travelling back to Manila + Palawan ASAP.

[@bigred2433]

I would be keen to hear Steves take on what is happening with Bostin Loyd and the peptide that caused his kidneys to fail. Loving the new podcast guys!

[@dansmith9724]

Thought his kidney function dropping was due to his untreated chronic hypertension? Peptide he used without knowing the dosage to use, wouldnt have helped anything.

[@bigred2433]

@@dansmith9724 being that his creatinine went from 2 (not great) to 6 (kidney failure) in the space of 6 months I wouldn’t think indicates untreated hypertension. Would imagine it isn’t a coincidence that he was used a peptide which in all rodent and monkey models caused widespread kidney injuries and failures might have been the catalyst.

[@dansmith9724]

@@bigred2433 my thinking is the peptide is the unknown quantity and you might be right. But he had some rediculous blood pressure readings for along time, dont quote me but along the lines of 180/120. Those sorts of numbers for a few years can do some harm to the kidneys.

[@notimebusy8384]

Yes, the ebooks are very helpful..I thought there was one coming on pharmacological approaches to fat loss?

[@VigorousSteve]

It's in the making buddy! Will release soon!

[@randysavage8963]

Two great minds

[@chriskaram5687]

I was looking for this! Nice job guys, thank you

[@BrainsandGainsPodcast]

This was a great podcast man. Regarding HCG and HMG, most patients will not be able to get a recombinant version. To my knowledge there hasn't been any evidence of prion contamination from these urine-derived versions, but theoretically possible as seen in cadaver GH used decades ago.

[@amdimilker5773]

So should I use hMG or not? I'm definitely gonna use hCG during cycle. But what do I do for the PCT? hCG suppresses natural LH production, so what's the protocol for getting off my first test cycle?

[@BrainsandGainsPodcast]

@@amdimilker5773 Are you trying to get pregnant / someone pregnant ?

[@amdimilker5773]

@@BrainsandGainsPodcast No I'm just trying to cycle safely. I'm 22. Is it overkill? 😛

[@BrainsandGainsPodcast]

@@amdimilker5773 I'd say overkill

[@amdimilker5773]

@@BrainsandGainsPodcastI want to take moderate dosages of test E and certain DHT derivatives. I live in a socialist country (Scandinavian) so I can't get access to TRT. Leo is tempting me with the idea of avoiding shutdown by using hCG and possibly rFSH or hMG during cycle. But even if I took *hCG during cycle* I'm not sure how my *natural LH production* would recover after the cycle. Not with MORE hCG I assume? *What would the PCT look like if I included hCG on cycle to prevent testicular atrophy?* But since I'm young I think I could allow myself to shutdown and my natty test levels would recover fine. Is this what you're "recommending" for my lab rat? Or the hCG during protocol? I'm just confused as to how I should cycle safely test E + primobolan. Like what should I incorporate and when? *hCG, hMG, nolva, clomid or enclomiphene + an AI (letro or arimidex)*

[@Mikaeel84]

I'm on Trt and is it better to use HCG to keep DHEA and Pregnenolone levels at the top of the range or supplementing with DHEA and Pregnenolone instead? Thanks.

[@Alpha_fitz]

I knew old Mifee Pristone in high school. She was an antagonist for real.

[@markblack9520]

The best BB content on YT - 100%. I can't believe your subscriber count isn't off the charts! The next bloke I talk to at the gym, that isn't subscribed to your channel - I'm going to punch them in the dick. 👊

[@VigorousSteve]

Just kindly ask them to Sub to our channels, leave the Testicles be brother :D

[@fedeuma]

Started TRT although Test levels were not considered low enough for TRT. I'm doing this for performance purposes. My question is, should I get on Gonadorelin/HCG knowing that I do produce a good amount of Test?

[@Singhh691]

This is heaven on earth

[@BrandoTheMando87]

Been on hCG at 150IU every other day to maintain my fertility as best as possible while being on TRT. Have been using this protocol for about 16 weeks since I have started my TRT. Looking to add hMG or recombinant FSH now that I am a part of a clinic that has access to these medications as impregnating my wife is a priority at this time. Hopefully, the price of recombinant FSH warrants its use. So far I have noticed no testicular shrinkage on this dose of hCG.

[@talex5459]

Hey there! This is the protocol my husband is using now. Did this end up working for you? And if so how long did it take for your wife to get pregnant? I appreciate your feedback!

[@Artifexmaholifts]

Thank you so much for this. After 3 months of TRT (And 200mg of primo/w) ive came off primo and started using HCG along with 200mg of cyp. I really appreciate what you doing for sports community.

[@kylecolmar964]

Love my brother Steve

[@SC-jd7ql]

Does HGH use effect testicular shrinkage? Lets say you were on Gh for 6 months and ran DECA or NPP and no shrinkage compared to same cycle of NPP or DECA with no GH and then experiencing testicular shrinkage. Have you experienced this or could this be your case Coach Steve? Could having elevated IGF effect shrinkage aswell?

[@gif24gt60]

Is topical dhea and topical pregnenolone a safer more natural methodology than orally?

[@talex5459]

My husband is taking 150 mg test per week plus HMG 75 mg every other day and HCG 1250 mg per day. Is this a good protocol for fertility? Does the type of HMG matter? I didn’t know there were different types. I believe he uses the premenopausal one.

[@gif24gt60]

What are the brand names of rFSH?

[@KoltonLukes]

So would HCG and/or HMG improve pregnenalone, DHEA or progesterone levels?

[@Raggyham]

Yes

[@nickdipietro7797]

What about Cardarine for good cholesterol?? Is that superficial too ??

[@billbilson230]

Ironic how we make ourselves more masculine while compromising the one thing that makes us men...

[@Human0906_]

What is the difference between hmg and gonadorelin?

[@86srki]

Where do you guys get RFSH ?

[@ChowhallmsqdcUSMC]

Hi doctor. 15 months ago I had injected Testosterone enanthate for 10 weeks at 100 mg to 200 mg weekly, I quitted and came off and never was advised for PCT, HCG, HMG or and recovery prescriptions because we don't have good endocrinologists in Afghanistan. My balls relatively did shrink and were fulfilled by its size by taking no medications. Nowadays I am experiencing so much depression in frequencies. Could you please give an advise for me 😔😔😔??? Can I start PCT after those 15 months. Or which blood tests should I consider to make ???

[@emerson-sheaapril8555]

So I'm a fat guy that wen on TRT, I have every conceivably measure of metabolic syndrome, my t was 160 and I was diagnosed by an endocrinologist with secondary hypogonadism are you saying I could have just taken some HCG and then lost weight? I actually asked her something along these lines and said no. I will say though I have dropped a lot of weight and am much healthier since being on T. But this question if a negative feedback loop as been on my mind.

[@covertcat9696]

22:50 Pregnenelone and concentration

[@NoQuarter01]

I’ve been on TRT about 2 months. They asked if I wanted to go on HCG and I said no. But I just read an article about the benefits and I think I’ll ask about starting HCG. I literally just thought I noticed yesterday that my testes feel a liiiiiittle smaller. That I don’t care so much about but apparently it can help with cognition and libido. Any thoughts?

[@simranjitsingh5631]

go on hcg and hmg. otherwise you will still experience some testicular degeneration. HMG #1

[@hfslattst4]

Leo whats your favourite snus?

[@miceen1399]

Very good

[@gif24gt60]

Is there a recombinant FSH and LH combo so you don't have to take two separate medicines? Does the recombinant FSH and LH downregulate natural LH and FSH? Is topical or oral pregnenolone a substitute for rFSH or rLH to prevent testicular atrophy?

[@mikeg3577]

HMG is both LH and FSH combined. Better for fertility, but it's expensive. Hcg is a more affordable alternative. Yes taking fsh/hmg/hcg will supress your natural production. If you're on trt then you are already suppressed. If you're not on trt/cycle then something like clomid would be a better option imo to increase LH. And no pregnenolone will not prevent atrophy when on trt.

[@ezthepezerator]

Rest in peace leo

[@cv9672]

Usually i speed youtube videos up, i had to slow this one down :P

[@Nightxslayer420]

This sounds like how medical doctors should sound when speaking with each other full of energy. Two super villains/heroes of the medical field. Again not advise just them hypothesizing using empirical and evidence based research but damn…. Blessing to us they are! Just look at Derek more plates more dates homie got hooked up on knowledge thanks ti these two brainiacs

[@christianroman2632]

Both Derek and Greg stopped making natty or not vids. A good thing!!

[@jarrodsimmons5349]

If I'm already using hcg at 500iu twice a week and wanted to switch to hmg for the fsh benefits what would my dosage be? I already know what the fertility dosage is but I'm asking for the dosage to go with my trt?

[@brentdraper4382]

GOOGLE. Such a simple question.

[@jarrodsimmons5349]

@@brentdraper4382 first thing I did... I couldn't find it. 🤷

[@Rotatez]

How long does it take for hcg to clear completely

[@nn-dj2nu]

about one week i think

[@Rico_MC]

36:00 Great to know no eye flotters with AIs, only with SERMS.

[@masongoodwin7641]

Other than Joe Rogan this is the first pod cast that managed to keep my full attention. Although Lee Priest has came close.

[@Simon-zo2vo]

Hey Steve, what's the best PCT in your mind? Thanks

[@VigorousSteve]

I have a whole eBook dedicated to that subject buddy!

[@Simon-zo2vo]

@@VigorousSteve excellent, where can this be purchased? Also is there any cons using HCG during cycle?

[@brentdraper4382]

@@Simon-zo2vo Google vigorous steve dude. jesus christ

[@sweetartoffighting279]

Real intelligence

[@JustChuck1t]

So what is the perfect fertility protocol?

[@samiryan214]

The natty protocol.

[@tedmurphy5516]

You guys should get taeian Clark on to talk about fertility

[@tedmurphy5516]

Leo and Longevity because he has unique protocols

[@KoltonLukes]

Regarding HCG and HMG, would the use of these on exogenous hormones provide an improvement to sex drive?

[@VigorousSteve]

In most cases it does, as it restores Sex-Hormone & Neuro-Steroid balance in the body to levels comparable ratios as when the individual was drug-free.

[@KoltonLukes]

@@VigorousSteve provided the goal is improved sex drive, what would you recommend as far as dosing? Would you prefer supplementation of DHEA and pregnenalone instead for this situation?

[@VigorousSteve]

I have an Article and corresponding video on this topic buddy. Give my website or channel a search ;)

[@lukehobson7486]

Typical Brits abroad. We're the worst when we drink 😂

[@charlesahearn5262]

Leo would love to hear your thoughts while on HRT. The benefits of hcg while taking 200 mg test cyp if their is any cognition benefits?

[@Thedb18]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/majPZWydht19j7c

[@Thedb18]

He has a video on his thoughts about TRT, hopefully covers what you’re looking for!

[@1NOHERO]

If I use 250-300 mg test e for 20 weeks for my first cycle to see how my body react, how much HCG do I need to take EOD, if at all for that small amount of test?

[@mikeg3577]

Depends person to person. 500 iu twice a week would be plenty for most people to maintain some testicular function imo. You could use less or more though and be fine

[@1NOHERO]

@@mikeg3577 what are the down sides to adding hcg in test e only cycle

[@mikeg3577]

@@1NOHERO you'll have a slightly higher estrogen conversion. Some guys on trt do not do well with hcg added because of this. Most people from what I've read feel better on hcg than without it though, myself included. Maybe keep an AI on hand just incase you have high estrogen side effects

[@1NOHERO]

@@mikeg3577 what do people mean hcg EOD is it like 3 shots a week? And can I pin hcg same time/spot when pinning test

[@mikeg3577]

@@1NOHERO yes it would be mwf&Sunday for example. And if you're new to this I wouldn't recommend putting both test and hcg in the same shot, just pin them separately to keep it simple. In my experience hcg and test together in one shot works the same as seperate shots. But you have to be careful not to ruin your bottle of hcg by getting oil from the test in there. There's forums and I think a video up still showing how to pin both together

[@Thedb18]

Algo gang

[@Nightxslayer420]

No one has ever spoken of that for real… capitalize it brother

[@janverschuren593]

Steve uses hcg nowadays !

[@iamthemobey]

Get on the 4k guys. I want to see your beautiful faces in amazing detail.

[@dansmith9724]

As for podcasts , Lee Priest type ones are entertaining. The informative videos save me reading books. I use to read alot but i find id read 2 pages and was brain dead and have to go back and reread. Podcasts just replace me having to read books .

[@TheBroSplit]

Talk about the arimindex toxicity. All the trt channels make ai's the devil. Trt channel with gil tai is second to non.

[@1988NickF]

Yeah, it's a certain type of British person, but yeah. Mostly just drink an obsene amount, straight to blackout drunk.

[@joethepirate1]

Vigorous Algorithm comment.

[@joshgreenfield2187]

Algo comment here

[@arg1606]

algorithm comment 💪

[@jordixboy]

hrt is FAR superior than TRT alone.

[@pursuingtruth13]

W

[@generalflames1]

Algo comment

[@Mikaeel84]

Supraphysiological man sounds better

[@devonhopkins2122]

Leo we all know Lucy is pregnant. Your clues are too strong.

[@jevgenirusai9069]

Algorithm comment.

[@juanvaldes1837]

Tren beats HCG everytime

[@mikep932]

First

[@adamcool9318]

Blah blah