BMW MINI Broken Timing Chain Guides: Did the Engine Survive?

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Bmw mini cooper S with broken timing chain guides causing a loud rattling noise at idle.
Bmw mini cooper s r56 N14 turbo engine with a horrible death rattle coming from the timing chain. Found the car to be 3 litres underfilled with oil, when topping up I found a piece of timing chain guide inside the cylinder head under the oil cap. This issue applies to the N12 N14 N18 engines too. This is a PSA Peugeot Citroen engine and is used in many of their models such as the 207 gti and many others.
#timingchain #minicooper #miniproblems

[@theresdave1363]

Hi, Good video 👍 I've just bought in a 2008 Peugeot 207 convertible wirh 78k miles, full service history every 9k average, got it from car auction, bought blind obviously, but was cheap. It has the occasional chain rattle usually only when at full temp, or revved, plus up & down fluctuating idle, and a VVT fault code blaming the exhaust camshaft dephaser solenoid coherence (P11A8) (according to the service book it had a new chain at 39k) Changed solenoid for new but no difference. In fact it only made the death rattle much worse! Changed back to old one which i cleaned and tested with 12v and resistance check. (Plus i cleaned the inlet cam solenoid as well, which both had partially blocked gauzes with metal swarf/filings) but still no change. Next I took cam cover off to see exactly the same deal as to a completely missing plastic and the metal 90° on top chain guide completely missing just a jagged edge with no bits to be seen (where have they gone??) Everything else seems fine but i am by far no expert on A VVT system. New genuine top guide purchased on its way off eBay now for the grand sum of £8.99! I hope this is all it needs!? 🙏

[@maxdamage8562]

Nice. brief and informative. Way to do it.

[@dejavoue88]

i just changed one of these on a fully serviced mini with only 48500 miles .bmw are making them from such cheap materials its a joke .when you consider the original mini engines are still going after all these years,

[@Jay-mz7dr]

Yep thanks same thing has happened to my daughters Mini Cooper (non turbo) R56 N12 but not the top section just the the bottom guides. :(

[@jermainemurdoch4132]

Good video

[@FourRingsAuto]

Thanks for your feedback!

[@theequaliser8026]

I bought a 2014 Mini Cooper diesel yes the engine is so loud but I have a crankcase señsor fault when scanned, somebody said it could be chain stretch yet it gets serviced every year by BMW I personally cannot here anything untoward I chained the crankcase pulley as it had signs of wear any advice would be appreciated great upload

[@FourRingsAuto]

Services with BMW doesn't really mean anything as they go so many miles/kms. Even if you do it every year you could cover 20k miles/30k kms in a year and BMW deem that as a normal interval. If the engine is noisy and you have a cam sensor code it is very possible that it's a noisy chain. However, it could be combustion noise due to incorrect fuel timing from the cam sensor input being missing. It needs to be checked by a competent mechanic/technician. I'd find a good reputable specialist instead of the dealer. There is a BMW tool that fits in place of the tensioner for checking chain stretch, or my personal favourite would be to attach an oscilloscope to the cam sensor and crank sensor and Run the engine at idle to check the timing against a known good. Ask the workshop if they are competent at doing this, otherwise steer clear. Using an oscilloscope saves time and money, checking the timing manually requires rocker cover removal for timing tools to be fitted. Using an oscilloscope would check correct functionality of your cam sensor too.

[@neuratictoast4222]

Also how much do you expect to pay at a garage if this problem occured? thanks

[@kramregnu2945]

I was just quote $2975 by Mini Cooper Maryland

[@white_shadow_123]

So, I was planing to change the whole assembly as a preventive measure, but now I think maybe I should only change the tensioner. The car allegedly has 110k km, and if that is true, the chain should not be worn that much. I am checking the oil frequently, I don't let it go below half on the dipstick. Even on -15 C, I didn't hear any strange noises on the cold startup. I'd like to hear your opinion, as if I ask some local mechanic, I am afraid they will say I should change it all just so they will get the job, and I don't wan't to do that if it's not necessary... Also, any recommendation on what I should watch out for on this engine is welcome. Thanks. Great video, by the way! Very informative for owners and anyone looking for a car with this engine. Thank you for making quality content :)

[@jimmynich4791]

What year is your car? I think it's been sorted in newer models.

[@white_shadow_123]

@@jimmynich4791 2009. I ended up changing everything, because labour is expensive thing, chain not so much. Mechanic said the chain was fine, but the tensioner was pretty bad and would probably soon fail...

[@jimmynich4791]

@@white_shadow_123 I think from about 2012 they're okay, before that not so much. Mechanic told me mine sounded rough but I went to a different mechanic and he couldn't hear anything, my dad told me after it's pretty obvious if there's a problem then I looked into it on a forum they said the 208 is usually okay but the 207 had a lot of problems with tensioners. Guess the original mechanic was just hoping I'd go back to him and pay for a job that didn't need doing.

[@white_shadow_123]

@@jimmynich4791 yeah, this engine was first built around 2006-2007 I think, so they needed a few years to fix the problems... A lot of people are saying how bad this engine is, but I am quite happy with it and it drives very well.

[@jimmynich4791]

@@white_shadow_123 Probably just have to be really diligent with the servicing and oil level. Prince engines won't have been winning awards for nothing, I think apart from the tensioner they're pretty reliable. Certainly worse engines like those small eco Ford engines a lot of people have had even worse problems with.

[@eponymous7910]

I was considering picking up a pug 308 gt with a similar engine (1.6L) but its questionable reputation scared me off! These donks seem to have plenty of go when working as intended but when things go bad they really lunch themselves

[@FourRingsAuto]

Yep that's exactly it. Cheap car but expensive to fix. Avoid.

[@grigoreadrian84]

Hello, has a bent valve or other problems?

[@FourRingsAuto]

Not this car no. They can do it if left too long, but the car won't usually start if it has bent valves.

[@grigoreadrian84]

@@FourRingsAuto Thanks

[@Finfanpete]

My mini is in the shop. Had the half check engine light and the check engine light on the big speedometer turn on. Took it to the mini tech locally who told me the chain guide had broken. Hes confident that fixing the guide will take care of it. I am worried that there is more damage elsewhere. Is it true that it's a very laborious job? He said about 10 hours.

[@FourRingsAuto]

We charge 6 hours from memory including removing the sump and cleaning it all out. Fresh oil etc. 10 hours for a "Mini tech" is very over the top!

[@Finfanpete]

@@FourRingsAuto 😕

[@machinegenes6712]

So just bought my 2008 Mini Cooper S with 86k miles for £3000 and a month later it’s making the death rattle noise... great

[@KittenSuprise]

Bought mine for the same but 09 plate last year and its got a weird metal grating noise when accelerating. No idea what it is. Might be the chain might be something else. Surprisingly a pice of junk considering the brand. Guess BMW are coasting off mini reputation

[@Generalusuer]

Good vid but chains dont strech the pins wear and leads to a longer chain.

[@FourRingsAuto]

I'm well aware of this, but thanks.

[@Modernsoul2024]

Did it survive?

[@FourRingsAuto]

Yep it lived

[@fraool944]

There's hope yet 😅

[@neuratictoast4222]

What Exact Engine was this?

[@FourRingsAuto]

N14

[@ph0ib0s1]

Already in 2006 BMW was using those plastic chain guides in their K1200 and K1300 motorbike engines. They used to fall apart at about 70k. Looks like BMW doesn't care. Had a car and 3 motorbikes from BMW. Except one bike (which actually was only BMW in name only) all others were very expensive to maintain and very unreliable. Done with this brand.

[@kramregnu2945]

Me too...but what car is the best value? 25000 hyundai? Ford? Chevy? ????

[@diablocls55]

Even in the late 90s and 2000s bmw was using these shitty plastic timing chain guides. I know two friends who had E39 540is who’s timing chain guides literally fell into the oil pan

[@da900smoove1]

Why Hasn't Anyone Done a 3D Scan and Made the Part Out Of Metal for All BMW Engines that Use A Plastic Chain Guide????!!!!

[@TheMiloking]

You dont want to ride chain on metal... Think about it. You need metal base and nylon slider. Like honda has

[@kramregnu2945]

I'm done with my Mini. What car is better than a Mini in the US for value $25000

[@maxdamage8562]

Corolla, Chevy Bolt.

[@DukeJustet]

Why are they using plastic on an engine it should be aluminum.

[@da900smoove1]

Those were Die Cast Metal in the 80s and 90s....Why the Hell would Any Major Auto Manufacturers Use PLASTIC INSIDE A HIGH TEMPERATURE ENGINE???!!!!!

[@limpet7r63]

Just lowest cost, not fit for purpose engineering. There is no excuse for nonsense like this on a modern car.

[@sshaunss]

They should be sued in every country they pulled this shit in not just America