Bojack Horseman: Does the voice go away?

From season 4 episode 6 "Stupid piece of shit."
Oh ya, so, massive spoilers in this.

[@justincruz5720]

I love how once BoJack tells her the voice goes away, she stops lighting and dumping the matches. She then just sits there at ease with a smile on her face, comforted by his “lie.”

[@nesta1777]

😢

[@TheDudeLebowski]

It's not a lie, it can go away, but you have to shut it, in Bojack's case, it's almost impossible

[@nesta1777]

Sometimes it’s better to die alone

[@justincruz5720]

@@nesta1777 I don’t see how that’s relevant.

[@andresluz4973]

It does go away for Hollyhock though, and she lives a happy, healthy life with friends and meaningful relationships. So even if it’s not true for BoJack when he says it, it is a true statement and real positive change comes from it when he says it to Hollyhock. Maybe all BoJack needs for it to be true for him to is believe it as much as Hollyhock does and see how it changes the way he treats people, including himself.

[@BencyTube]

Everyday it gets a little easier, but you have to do it every day. That's the hard part

[@justincruz5720]

But it does get easier.

[@davida12345]

I love the Bojack community

[@peter042]

O

[@marlom7882]

There’s actually *2* hard parts: 1) Getting started 2) Staying consistent with it

[@barsgul9370]

@@marlom7882 thats the whole thing

[@Lavender4237]

I feel so bad because hollyhock isn't his daughter and they have a similar issue with voices in their head.

[@Gamer_Horse]

Must be poison they both inherited from their father.

[@jjturner4424]

It might have been passed to them from their dad.

[@alonealien1474]

@@jjturner4424 Yeah, I think so too. Like Lord knows how many of my and my siblings insecurities come straight from our dad! He was a great dad, but sometimes I wish he hadn't had us because of the issues he passed on to us.

[@JohnSmith-mz2zo]

You mean...anxiety?

[@Draknfyre]

It's not literal voices they're hearing like they're psychotic, they're referencing that inner voice we ALL have in the form of insecurity and doubt.

[@TheAllcreatorLiveArchives]

Bojack and Hollyhocks relationship was so tragic. Bojack and her were exactly alike, she just had the misfortune of stumbling into his life. When he read the letter and realized she was gone, he wasn't upset that he lost her, he was upset because he wanted to go with her and he felt like he lost the only person who could help him escape his own life. All Bojack wanted out of life is to know how to be a good person, sadly there is no answer for that. So the letter was probably an admittance to him, that she doesn't have the answers he needs. After he reads the letter, he realizes there is no hope and succumbs to being a terrible person.

[@monochromayhem7422]

Being Borderline and having known that a lot of BPD people relate to BoJack, the voice doesn’t really ever go away. It shifts and changes, it’s your in we critic. In a healthy mind, it tells you to think twice before going forward with an action that could be dangerous. In an ill mind, it sees something fundamental about you as a source of the screw up and thus turns to criticize you as a person. There’s this old saying from my writing days- when getting criticism during writer’s workshop, it’s ultimately the author who decides what criticism is useful and what can be discarded. It then becomes a matter of understanding why the critic says what they do. This includes your inner critic. I promise you, whoever needs to hear this- while it doesn’t go away, it does get more tolerable with time and effort. Long ago I would fold like tissue at the first sign of conflict with the voice. Now I’m comfortable challenging it and trying to understand its rationale.

[@alspezial2747]

Accepting that everything just is the way it is did wonders for me

[@jesselochner412]

This comment means a lot. I have BPD too. I'm in therapy and it's slowly getting better. I don't hate myself anymore. DBT and therapy and medication does wonders.

[@kristakemp2658]

I honestly as a borderline relate more to diane

[@suraru95]

I also have borderline. That's why I love this scene so much.

[@mordi9286]

It goes away for some people. For others it doesn't and they make their peace with it. Hollyhock's case? I think it will. With time. A lot of time.

[@MoffinMouse]

Errh errrrrh she ded

[@Leon1910s]

@@MoffinMouse what? She doesn't die in the show.

[@jpiny4854]

And bojack can go to shit

[@SantiagoSebastion2077]

times arrow neither stands still nor reverses, it only marches forward

[@jarodgolgori3137]

i think you need to stop being a pathetic loser that identifys with netflix shoes

[@thegipper1215]

The nicest thing bojack ever did. In a downward spiral that was his life that was catapulted by him lying for himself constantly, he finally decides to tell the truth and then lie for somebody else’s comfort, knowing the nightmare that it is mentally on himself when the truth is present. GOAT show

[@ScoutMouster]

I spent a long time avoiding this show because I was certain it was going to be another Family Guy. But it seems like it's pretty good.

[@angeloalvarez5520]

It was kind of like family guy for a little bit in the first season

[@CabezasDePescado]

Nah is not, and is the best adult animation show since the good seasons of The Simpsons, and South Park

[@roller_waifu]

Saaame!

[@alyssapinon9670]

Nah there’s a reason why family guy keeps trashing Bojack along with bobs burgers. They’re what family guy wishes they were

[@Scottyy788]

@@alyssapinon9670 in family guys defence it does have some actually good scenes/episodes but is mostly just bad

[@mx9226]

‘You shouldn’t be here. No one wants you here, especially him. I just want to get to know my dad. It’s just going to take some time for him to get use to me. Oh, you think he needs to get use to you? You barge into his house, his life, and you think he has to adjust everything around you? God, you’re unbelievably selfish! No, I just wanted to find my real dad. “Real dad”? Guess the 17 years you spent with your eight adoptive dads meant nothing. That’s not true. Yes it is! The moment you found out Bojack was your biological dad, you didn’t hesitate to move in with him. You abandoned the men who raised you. Guess you and your mom have that in common. You turn your back on what’s important and don’t care about what happens afterwards. She hated you. Your dads hate you. Bojack hates you. He’s always avoiding you, so of course he hates you. Get it? Everyone in your life hates-!’ Where do you go? When you disappear all day?

[@TotalAnalyst2]

This is underrated and deserve more likes and even relatable seems like something that should have been included in the show

[@annafowdy]

Her mother didn't hate her.

[@ezra8075]

The worst part about this is what he ended up doing to Hollyhock

[@GP-ed2ch]

Technically him moms fault right?

[@getsuryu7227]

You mean what his mom does to her?

[@willymillynilly4501]

@@getsuryu7227 She drugged Hollyhock’s coffee with weight loss supplements until Hollyhock had to be taken to the hospital after fainting. Oh wait, misread sorry about that. But yeah, might be weird autocorrect.

[@angief6364]

If it is about that Hollyhock went to the hospital because of intoxication, that was Bojack's mother's fault, and let's not excuse her, because she appeared to knew what she was exactly doing, she wasn't having a dementia episode at that moment. The worst part is when Hollyhock decided to cut ties with him off screen, even though she has already knew what a toxic jerk Bojack is.

[@willymillynilly4501]

@@angief6364 I think it’d be more painful for her to say it to his face that she didn’t want him in her life anymore. Not only that, Bojack might’ve tried to convince her and eventually make her backtrack on her decision to break things off. So a letter might’ve been the best decision for her.

[@markarmage3776]

It never goes away, but you can continue going on knowing that those voices aren't true, and there needs to be people to remind you so. To think one individual can be happy by themselves is not understanding human nature at all, sure you can be "alone" and "happy" when you've been through no test, no hardship, but everyone has a limit. The question is what you need to do when you've reached your limit and you can't go back. That's when you need others.

[@clovertheinfomationbroker1755]

With who? Every time I sought support and understanding from other people (friends and family), I ended up disappointed. Whenever I raised my concerns they just minimized the problem or directly imposed their ideas on me instead of listening to me. It's very hard living like this, but honestly I don't feel like I can count on anyone, most of the time.

[@markarmage3776]

@@clovertheinfomationbroker1755 Then the answer is quite simple, you need better friends. Family are bounded by blood but there's absolutely no guarantee whatsoever that they will understand you. Like I said, if you still need others, it means you haven't found the right others. Search harder. Most people pay a "therapist" to pretend to be that other person for them, it's cute but it still works.

[@jeffbrownstain]

@@clovertheinfomationbroker1755 AI is better people than people. Don't knock it till you've tried it 🤷‍♀️

[@Weaklytune]

​@@jeffbrownstainI agree

[@spacescribs5838]

It goes away when you bully it back

[@creeper1003]

yo wait, imma try that

[@daniell5662]

Exactly

[@hyde5213]

Or just make a Jackie Chan tulpa to beat it up.

[@stevieavail5773]

This whole episode hit really close to home.

[@autumn9978]

Glad I’m not the only one with the voice like this. It can muffle down, especially if you build the positive voice

[@vgonzalez4565]

I found the voice doesn't go away but if you can learn and put in work to talk back to the voice kindly. Like spitefully kind. Repeatedly. It's hard cause the voice is so cruel but if you go back to it and talk kindly to every shit remark the voice has it eventually turns into a funny nice conversation of insanity that can be more amusing than ruining of my life. Christ I feel insane explaining how I deal with it but it's been working for me so hopefully anyone else with something like this intrusive ridiculously cruel voices gets some help from it. Talk back to that voice with kindness. Even if you think the kindness is a lie do it anyway. Like how Bojack finally said something kind to hollyhock here when she talks about her inner voice. It's not really a lie. The voice does go away. It comes back and will go away again. And the voice can change to something new even.

[@cookiesyruplover]

I like this because mine does the same. It's why some days it's harder and sometimes I forget it's there. This also makes it so that BoJack isn't lying. Though it might be the case just to comfort her as he did with his mother in their final moments, I like to think he thought he could overcome it. When he became a better person before his past came back to haunt him, I think he could found himself overcoming it that time.

[@xcaluhbration]

Now THAT is a new way of dealing with it to me. 🤔 I’m gonna try that. Thanks

[@vgonzalez4565]

@@cookiesyruplover yeah I thought in the end he was improving because he was listening to other kinder voices, princess Caroline or his NA therapist or the help from inmates or other supportive voices plus his own personal development, in his mind and that helped. Looking back on my comment I want to add that nothing lasts forever, not even those negative intrusive thoughts. I feel better at handling them now. Life is doable. This too shall pass. Negative and positive thoughts included. Don't underestimate the mental work required but you can change. We all can. Best of luck in being a calmer version of yourself.

[@marchofthepigs36]

Why would he lie about that? It never goes away, you just learn to make peace with it

[@huskyfluffers9017]

Who says he's lying. Not everyone hates themself forever. She has no reason to hate herself like bojack does.

[@saurabhshivhare8579]

@@huskyfluffers9017 well you've certainly never had depression and anxiety

[@huskyfluffers9017]

@@saurabhshivhare8579 or perhaps at one time I was depressed but now I am not?

[@saurabhshivhare8579]

@@huskyfluffers9017 i was referring to you saying she has no reason to hate herself

[@FilmmakeroftheFuture]

Maybe some overcome it better than others.

[@jeocarrillo8656]

The voice never goes away, but it can change, and for it to change you have to change with it, it can be your worst enemy or your greatest companion that will never leave you

[@kirklandsignaturebarbarian3814]

It doesn't go away, but you learn to know when its wrong.

[@GlizzyGobler_goblin4]

0:09 this hits home cause my dad was a alcoholic (I’m aware he’s her brother-) plus I have thes voices that fight just like this-

[@itwasaliens]

Honestly hearing stuff like that fucked me up more. I was always told by the time I left high school or by the time I got out of college everything would be fine and I would feel better. That didn't happen and made me feel like a weird outlier and too fucked up to bother with anything ever.

[@Marlin123]

Proud of Bojack for this, he knows what to say because he has proper experience. Though this was very situational

[@starwoodanime1532]

I relate to both characters so much

[@ash155]

It's hard for Bojack to admit to her that it never goes away 😭

[@Vllenastime]

It doesn't go away it keeps getting louder and louder

[@guilhermeteodosio40]

"Everyone hates you, and they're right to feel that way" "That voice... it goes away right?" "It's a dumb teenage stuff... right?"

[@_Chessa_]

This is what I was told as a teenager. That the S thoughts would leave me and I wouldn’t have to deal with them or the voice telling me it would be better if I ended it would vanish one year. It never did. And it does not go away. Sometimes you’ll get manic from it. Straight up Panic attacks from it even. Medication helps it be quieter but it’s still there and way better at planning the end because now the meds help it focus on that ending. The brain in my case is weird. That small snippet of what Bojack had with his thoughts have been my thoughts since I was a kid. It doesn’t go away as you get older but you can bargain with it and you can tell it to shut up like what Bojack did. You can ask it why do you feel that way.. and it will be silent because you are asking yourself, why do you want to end it so badly. It feels like it would be nice for everything to go blank like sleeping without dreaming. A relief from the constant voice telling me I’m a failure over and over again. There is hope with the newer studies happening right now for those with constant impulsive and excessive thoughts of wanting to end it. If you are reading this and have this happen to you, continue to distract it with good things. This is the best method I’ve done when it gets really bad I force myself to care about who I am. I force myself to see how embarrassing it would be for someone to find my body. It’s embarrassing enough that it really works. But distractions like comedy and books and videos really have helped my brain.

[@HalfBlindProductions]

as someone who had a shitty dad, sometimes their voice becomes your internal dialogue and you gotta recognize it and reject it if you can. I know I'm still trying.

[@venomase5572]

I adore that this is the first time in the entire show where bojack does something truly selfless. Hes not trying to look better, he's not telling the hard truth, he just tells her a white lie to make her feel better. This begins his slow redemption

[@gabespiro8902]

How do you feel good if you know you aren’t a good person? I’ve been shitty, and this isn’t the depression talking I’ve done shitty things. I feel like I deserve to feel like shit

[@TotalAnalyst2]

I understand that feeling I was told you have to ask some people your close to a friend a loved one what they like about and write that down or type it memorize it because people like us are more likely to see the worst in ourselves

[@gabespiro8902]

@@TotalAnalyst2 thank you

[@TotalAnalyst2]

@@gabespiro8902 you're welcome also what are these shitty things you done

[@robmeyer8082]

thats really prolific. Sends shudders down the spine.

[@c00mgoblin]

One of the only times BJ did something for someone else out of the goodness of his heart without expecting in return.

[@papertigerworkshop1174]

I feel for Hollyhock. For some, they don't go away and being isolated with nothing to occupy your attention allows them to creep in. She needed to go back to her dads and know that she is not the product of her father's malteachings, like BoJack is.

[@shortycareface9678]

Might not go away, but you learn to counter it. 🤷‍♂️ At least, that's my case. I still find myself dealing with cases of imposter syndrome on a semi-regular basis... but I'm learning how to deal with it. Usually by simply reminding myself that "I'm doing better now than I used to"

[@misteraskman3668]

For me, it never goes away. I have had to deal with them everyday. But it gets easier.

[@committingharakiri8968]

you're very strong! just keep going

[@elenchanted9904]

Mine never went away but it doesn't control me anymore. That's the difference between people who end up like Bojack and people who don't. Bojack never really did much to help himself, just blamed his bad behavior on his voice and his trauma until his life was burned to shit. Hollyhock's voice will never go away but she will learn to deal with it, she'll learn to ignore it, she'll learn to make it less of a force in her life.

[@jasonwu3941]

Epic for shadowing with the doodle hollyhock drowning,bojack saying there’s poinsettia in her

[@proudzerzurancitizen]

bohorse jackman

[@djudju8047]

music is : K.Flay - Blood In The Cut

[@SirGriefALot]

The voices in your head are you. And please stop clogging my pool filter.

[@KIYAIZM]

i love bojack

[@InsertNameHere911]

This scene would’ve been so much better if BoJack was just like “no lol” like everyone on tv makes things so complicated

[@isatherebel1520]

Yo even though Bojack ain't the dad I would've wanted, he definitely the dad I needed, at 22 I still try to find that father figure around even trying with my own stepdad but it ain't ever work

[@bacr4103]

"Yeah".

[@bluefootwalking]

It 100% does NOT go away

[@amiiredhead2676]

That is why I created another voice in my head that tells me about all the things that are awesome about me. And this voice also has the appearence of spider demon Angel Dust.

[@wetsock7790]

It can

[@amiiredhead2676]

@ferret Angel Dust is just amazing. He is somehow a comfort character to me. You should hear the voice impression of Laz Briar here on KZbin.

[@hyde5213]

@@amiiredhead2676 Be careful to not let Angel Dust go rogue on you, or you're gonna have to make a Jackie Chan tulpa to beat it up.

[@iankravitz5723]

Yeah, that voice does go away.................. but only if you let it go away. Only if you move on. Bojack doesn't.

[@priam9376]

NOPE. Unfortunately, it never goe away.

[@furiousfellow1583]

I'm 30 and in my 20's I really was hoping voices to go away once I hit 30...

[@adaurysalmonte7196]

It went away now idk if t should have I felt like yeah was bad but it pushed me now I hear nothing

[@peanut2764]

I stopped hearing the voices when i realized the spotlight isn't on me and that no one cares about a random person because they're too worried that the spotlight is on them. But there's no spotlight

[@billlee3851]

Other shows' pep talks: hey you can do this, I believe in you. Bojack's pep talk: I'm shitty and it's not your fault. Somehow it works way better

[@Ambipie]

that's why Sarah Lynn died. What are you gonna do to her? Almost kill her boyfriends girlfriend.

[@InsertNameHere911]

It’s weird to think about that “voice” because it’s MY voice. It’s a real part of me, it’s just not a good one.

[@AngrySinn]

As a schizophrenic I can relate

[@joaovitormachado1982]

no, it won’t

[@HamburgerTime209]

Did he do the right thing, lying to Hollyhock about that?

[@digitaldream1629]

It does not

[@naomiwexlersaulgoosman]

I want to have se with bojack so bad

[@Nixonforprez68]

So the matches into the pool… is Hollyhock gonna be Walter White?

[@elijahbaker781]

0:23

[@clovertheinfomationbroker1755]

Has it been addressed on the show why Holly has that voice in the first place? I mean, I guess everyone has it, she's a teenager, nothing out of place there. But is there really a compelling reason? At first I thought it was because of her messy family (polygamy is messy, no offense), but she says all the time that she grew up with loving parents and is fine with their lifestyle. She is kind, determined, doesn't care enough about her appearance or what people say, she's fine with passing relationships (she doesn't form codependent ties), and she doesn't seem to have any type of trauma (except for amphetamines). So what exactly is it that upsets her so much? I can not understand it? (I envy that she can be so calm after being emotionally and sexually exploited by that intern, though)

[@emmuzboosh]

Well it kinda points to that she’s not as ok as she claims sometimes lol. I guess it’s part of being human. Even tho she’s a horse

[@camnunes8847]

I think its her rising anxieties Moving to the big city so she's out of her element, and she's also probably missing her 8 dads. Could link her thoughts of abandoning them with her thoughts of her mother abandoning her. She's also probably worried with Bojack thinking that even her own biological father hates her too, if he treats his dementia ridden grandmother like the devil what is she supposed to think? For all she knew Bojack could turn on her too and kick her out. Plus you could sprinkle in some idea that she's also getting anxiety from losing so much weight from the pill overdose she's unaware of I dont think she's had this voice for long, maybe she's only had it for the time she's spent with Bojack.

[@ZombieBacon13]

This show depresses me.

[@rosenti]

Aww Boo-hoo. Being rich and famous must be sooo "hard".

[@ohno2480]

lol what

[@rosenti]

@@ohno2480 Exactly. As there may have been interesting concepts and themes in this show. However it seems centered around someone spending all their time whining.

[@ohno2480]

@@rosenti I think you missed the point. Bojack is a flawed person, we aren't always supposed to be rooting for him, and I think the show plays into this well. The entire thing is surrounding the consequences of his actions, the way that the things he's done affects other people, even if he may have had good intentions. He's constantly manifesting childhood trauma into everyday, minoscule things, like his constant need for praise and approval. Sure he's rich, famous, and sometimes immature, but he's also incredibly vulnerable.

[@rosenti]

@@ohno2480 Oh I get the point. It's the perfect show for self-pity while you stuff your face with luxuries. It's a show that makes people feel relatable to the character as you do such things. That's it.

[@ohno2480]

@@rosenti I do feel as Bojack wasn't in the wrong for feeling as miserable as he did. No matter how rich you are, you can't buy away your pain, unless it's anti-depressants or something lol