Book CommuniTEA: Basically, Romancelandia Needs To Get It Together [CC]

[@stephaniehauenstein9123]

The whole M/M vs F/F also applies to readers of M/M fiction too. I once saw pre-reviews on Goodreads for a sequel to a M/M romance that was going to be F/F and many readers (mostly women) announced that they wouldn’t be continuing the series because they didn’t like F/F romance or it didn’t do anything for them. Like how fetishistic can you get

[@JessOwens]

🤢🤢

[@evies.1018]

I saw a comment on the Goodreads page for The Perfect Crimes of Marian Hayes about how the author is writing “another MF historical romance” and how they “don’t want to lose a few reliable authors who write Queer HR to MF” and all of the comments on the post are talking about how they’re “disappointed” and “sad to see this” and like ???? First off, the MCs are both confirmed to be bi so you’re not “losing” any queer rep, you’re just mad you won’t be able to fetishize a m/m relationship in this book and being super biphobic :/ also it’s so gross and entitled to try and say an author is being “lost to MF” because they chose to write about two bi people in a m/f relationship.

[@abigase135]

@@evies.1018 they just won't admit that, they'll say they're lgbt supporters but the only thing they support is gay por n

[@Dasha-pv1xk]

Jack Edwards is such a nice dude, people getting angry at him just to get angry cause they're triggered that he said what he said.

[@jeans4108]

It’s cute that people think greedy ass publishers will charge less for synthetic voices. 😂 They’ll come up with “reasons” why they need to charge the same.

[@lyltomlinson3275]

This is it right here ^

[@siginotmylastname3969]

YEP this is so so true. They've seen that abled people will pay a lot for audio so now disabled people get stuck with the price increase, it's the story of everything accessibility.

[@JessOwens]

LOL you right tho 😭

[@leedorashinee]

"I'm an American, what do you expect?" we love a self-aware queen.

[@JessOwens]

I am a product of my environment 😭

[@muskaan3711]

People be getting mad at Jack for no reason 😂 tbh the "big man" in romance is why i dont like to read the genre. Literally every male love interest is 6 ft abs chiselled jawline etc. Where are the short guys, thin guys, fat guys, dad bod guys etc.? There's not much body rep for male characters. (Plus I'll never simp for a real life man but Jack Edwards is really a man written by a woman. If you're a regular viewer of his you'll know he's not the kinda person to dish on any genre) Also the "big man" gives me gender stereotypes. Like women have to be small and delicate, and men have to be big and strong. And it irks me too that *some* cis women only write mlm romance. And many cis women readers seem to be only obsessed with mlm books and couples. Just see when pride Month comes you'll mostly see cis white mlm books everywhere.

[@_DarkEmperor]

They are in friend zone.

[@JessOwens]

Romance really lacks varied representation of male bodies, it’s a shame

[@RuthMadisonAuthor]

Thankfully I am indie and can write whatever I want. My new book’s hero has spina bifida and is very small ❤

[@heabooktubes]

The “romance reader is an oppressed identity” dysmorphia is REAL. 😬🙄

[@JessOwens]

Let me give them their scoop of oppression 😒

[@jonnie7891]

Sis, your acting skills 🤣🤣🤣 You need a separate video called “He is so big” monologue. Jake Edwards isn’t wrong tho. Anyone who is upset probably feels called out for their subpar writing. And Jack Harbon calling out cis het yt women who solely write MM is so important and needs to be addressed. I too found it odd and they are fetishizing MM relationships for profit. It’s weird. Romancelandia and their selective outrage is still going strong in 2022, I see.

[@JessOwens]

Ok let me write my “he is so big” monologue 👀😂

[@MsEleanorShelby]

The question, why straight female authors write exclusively M/M romances is easy to answer: Because there is a huge market of female straight readers who love to read it. These authors mainly don't write for queer readers, but for fellow straight women. And being a straight woman myself I admit, I also like some of those books. We as females have to finally acknowledge that there is a female gaze that is fetishizing men. All men, not just gay men. That's why every male body in romance is described as big and huge and why on indie romance covers there are so many shirtless men with abs. Let's just say goodbye to the illusion that the straight female gaze is better than the straight male gaze in this regard.

[@aallix]

Some videos back this topic also came up and there was reference to the difference between M/M fiction v Queer/Gay fiction with M/M not being intended for people in M/M relationships

[@Kayla_P99]

What kills me is when those stories are toted as queer representation when as you said, they're written for straight audiences.

[@dragonuprising8378]

@@Kayla_P99 Yep. It just really sucks

[@StephanieSlumdog]

We can tell the difference between MM books written by LGBTQ+ authors (or even straight authors with good intentions) and the ones written by straight women who are fetishizing gay men. I know the author who started this discussion and she falls into the latter category.

[@ScorpionFlower95]

Who is she?

[@Kayla_P99]

I (personally) feel like there is a group of white women who basically are like "how dare you judge me for fetishizing a marginalized group! Don't you know as a woman I am already persecuted, please ignore intersectionality for my convenience" but like unironically, as if a bad behavior is only bad when men do it

[@MrGreyseptember]

I'm an LGBTQA+ person and write queer fanfics and one of my friends also does it. She's a cis straight woman and writes only MLM stories, and when I asked her to read one of my WLW fics she refused, saying she doesn't interested in women. it was then I realized that she fetishizes relations between men, and is not interested in the lgbtqa+ representation in general.

[@dragonuprising8378]

@@MrGreyseptember Exactly! There one excuse is that "there not interested in men". Like ok but you're interested in gay men? Who wouldn't be interested in you in that regard because you want to fetiszies them? Alright

[@moustik31]

Jack brought up a good question: straight women are erasing gay men out of their own love stories, out of the money to be made and out of the power to control their own representation. He also asked about the harm these women's representation of gay men and gay love cause to the queer community. So yes, these questions will make you feel uncomfortable, if you are keeping strong with the White Feminist Koolaid. But, as a I said earlier, when you write/read about a population in 2022, you will get feedback from said population. White women have been using their power to give cis straight men feedback for decades now. The fact, that they feel entitled to be "spared" accountability just bec. straight White men oppress them makes no sense. #RepresentationMatters

[@KD-CD]

The way a man writing lesbian rep would not be tolerated speaks volumes when discussing how women get away with writing gay rep

[@moustik31]

@@KD-CD Exactly. And this power/privilege in itself: the privilege not to be questioned/held accountable. Edit: I just realised that Awkwafina also used this exact same privilege to try and get out of being held accountable for using a Blaccent for years.

[@marymik7372]

Jack Harbon is so right too about how the MLM books written by cis women are often toxic or traumatic relationships. That's something I was thinking about recently after reading Hanya Yanagihara's new book To Paradise having also read A Little Life. In both those novels, its the role of the gay men to suffer, and suffer "beautifully". And the icing on top is that A Little Life is regularly referred by the news as to as "the Great Gay Novel" (it's even the first result if you google that phrase), meaning this novel written by a cis woman is being touted as the first and best gay epic written.

[@excruciatingsleep]

I've been reading a lot of the Yanagihara criticism because I honestly don't understand the appeal, and everything she says is utterly unhinged. She is terrified of therapy but also thinks it's totally normal to desire death regularly. She only writes gay men, and their lives are slowly made worse until their lives "aren't worth living" (in an ableist way, naturally). There's some kind of conflation of whump/hurt-comfort with how life isn't worth living. There has never been someone whose own statements make me more troubled for them.

[@valerieosborne5285]

lol Jack Edwards is right tho...i started reading romance last year and the BIG male lead thing immediately became my pet peeve. Like i swear some of these romance authors must feel it's their mission to hammer it into their reader's brain that the love interest is sooo HUGE and the main character is really itty bitty bc they'll literally bring it up every other page and it's so ridiculously annoying. Small men and big women deserve love too lol.

[@abigase135]

i really got turned off recently by a book where the fmc kept mentioning how huge the mmc was, i forgot the title because they're all blending together at this point. notice how the hero is always the biggest in a group of men, even in YA romance the mmc will be a 6ft+ guy towering over everyone

[@JGVIllustrations]

OMFG you really committed to that reading, what a performance XD I was dying with you and nearly choked on my smoothie. That was amazing but also what terrible books wtf. And yes literally so many romance books the hero is BIG, I have yet to read one where he’s short or his bigness is not mentioned. He should be allowed to explore the genre, he’s usually pretty good with providing fair critiques.

[@JessOwens]

I hope you are ok, can’t have yall dying on my watch !

[@thisisabookchannel]

Women writing gay romance also love the “gay for you” trope which is icky

[@adamnreader4599]

i have had to gag everytime i saw someone mention they like the 'straight turned gay' trope because first of all, NO!!! and second of all, it's like they don't know that other sexualities exist!! and there is never characters questioning their sexualities. like they are not aware that people don't just wake up one day and go 'yes, i'm gay for this person'! i've only seen queer authors do the whole questioning your sexuality thing correctly. the difference lies in 'i'm representing this specific sexuality' and 'i only know this sexuality and it is convenient for me to fetishize it'.

[@hanasheik]

I still don't know why anyone thought the "gay for you" trope could be, like, a thing.

[@LiminalBookkeeping]

Disclaimer: I'm a queer man. But I don't think the basic concept of "gay for you" stories are bad. Because that is some people's real experience. I feel like a lot of people aren't aware of how messy the queer experience actually is for a lot of people, how messy relationships are especially beyond heavily cishet amatonormative representations of them. Of the long history of things like queer4queer attraction, of gay men and lesbians hooking up not because either other of them is bi (which we need a ton more bi representation and that's a large issue with the "gay for you" trope) but just because you can be in various types of relationships with people you are not attracted to but care about and/or love, etc. And I *love* queer stories that explore that messiness and the inherent queerness of queer experiences. But cishet women are not the people writing that kind of thing and showing that side of queerness. And I hate that that side of queerness gets overlooked and unintentionally shaded when people rightfully talk about the issues with the "gay for you" trope.

[@sarahfolger5232]

I have to take a moment and pause at 19:39. I have tears in my eyes. This is incredibly funny and uncomfortable. Jess needs some sort of booktube award for this!

[@JessOwens]

Someone send me a plaque or something plz 😂

[@amy-suewisniewski6451]

I wonder if audio books could survive with both? Like, having a narrator could be like the hardcover edition comparable to the synthesized being like the paperback? Just giving those different price points and making it accessible but also letting people pick their preferences because they will.

[@sheramelton3583]

I am traumatized by that dramatic reading, but also laughing my butt off! I would have been so embarrassed to read that out loud. You did great! And the titles of those books! Roaches!!?? Absolutely not.

[@jkpiowa]

I love Jack Edwards and I also read a fair amount of romance. Can confirm the bigness.

[@JessOwens]

The bigness is everywhere

[@QueenOfMoggies]

as a former cis wlw (now trans guy) i do get the appeal of writing/reading stories between queer men (and as said in the video, my situation is usually brought up to defend “cis” women in the genre) but there’s not even a thin line between a well-written love story between queer men and fetishisation - it always feels so blatant and uncomfortable

[@adamnreader4599]

this, absolutely! honestly it's very apparent from reviews, in my opinion. most of the times, mlm romances which are fetishized will only have reviews on how 'hot' the characters are while genuine good romance has reviews mentioning what they like about the general aspect of the relationship/the tropes used in the book. like you can blatantly see when a romance is treated as a romance and when it is just a premise for two characters who have no depths in personalities to get it on.

[@amberdiorable]

Lord I was drinking sweet tea just as you read " Slob on that cat PASSUH" and I choked so hard that I have tears streaming down my face... wish I was lying

[@JessOwens]

OMG I HOPE YOU ARE OKAY🤣

[@sophiedoornebos240]

I personally rather have a book not translated than it be read by a robot and second thereof there a enough voice-actors, just sounds like they don't want to pay them or do the work to find them. Which again should be that hard because most languages are spoken by millions of people and enough of them are probably a voice-actor or want to be a voice-actor. (sorry for bad wording English is not my first language.)

[@BreakingStubad]

Completely agree… that point about AI opening the door to more languages sounds like some people don’t know voice actors/narrators exist in most languages Edit: also, most of us have used google translate… so we can probably agree that AI translations are not very good

[@Rochele18]

JESSSSSSS!!!!!!!! My jaw dropped at literally the first line! I clutched the mess outta my imaginary pearls as I screamed 😯

[@JessOwens]

You probably broke your pearls 😂

[@MsNoMeGusta]

It'll be interesting to see what happens with the Children of Blood and Bones movies...when I finished the book I had the strong feeling that she had no idea where that series is going. After book two, I'm confident I was correct.

[@gemmaberlanti3508]

Book 3 was supposed to be released last years and its been two years since the last book. My advice to any authors is have an outline even if you are unsure so you will have direction for later books. outlines changes for most writers but at least have something that to conclude your series.

[@MsNoMeGusta]

@@gemmaberlanti3508 That is great advice and I wish someone had shared it with her. I tried to give the author the benefit of the doubt but I know 'lost in the woods' when I see it. It's sad, the premise had potential.

[@angelawesneski5029]

Your reaction was the same as mine when I saw the Jack Edwards situation. There were also a whole bunch of indy authors I've never heard of resounding with "Not true! My 3rd book in my second series of novellas doesn't have this trope." That made me angrier than any other part of the situation as an avid romance reader.

[@imaginary_oranges]

I mean he's not WRONG about Spanish Love Deception. I read a LOT of romance, and SLD struck me as ESPECIALLY heavy in those aspects. It's a thing generally in romance but SLD was waaaay over the top.

[@kristenbell5214]

I love these long videos. It feels like I'm going out for coffee with you, but I get to just listen.

[@JessOwens]

🥰🥰 the chattiest coffee date you’ll ever have 😂

[@HouseHooligan]

I could possibly add something meaningful to this conversation, but instead I’ma tell you this: I’m not feeling well today, and when my husband checked on me I said, “I’m just gonna lay here and watch Jess.” And he said, “Okay baby; you watch your spicy book girl.” 🤣🌶

[@angryotter9129]

I am always in the mood to throw everything away. That bit about regret stopping me is slowly losing the battle and I’m gonna be in an empty house some time soon. I can feel it.

[@MichellesLibrary]

Lol somehow I missed the Quan Millz stuff but now I wish I had never seen it lol omg

[@tahliae]

The “bell pepper nose” had me crying and wishing Quan would go touch some grass while one of us sneaks in and steals their computer so this can end 😢😂

[@MichellesLibrary]

@@tahliae LOL! I can’t even believe it’s real? But also this is the timeline we’re in so yeah

[@JessOwens]

We must strip Quan of their rights, immediately!

[@JessOwens]

We’re all suffering together 😘😂

[@Kayla_P99]

Proving why we need real people reading audio books is necessary with that dramatic reading also I haven't heard black characters sounding like that since I read Huckleberry Finn in 7th grade.

[@JessOwens]

RIGHT !

[@dragonuprising8378]

I definitely agree with Jake Edwards that it is weird that straight,white women only ever write MLM romance...almost 90% of the time in a toxic way. It's one thing to write something you want to read but this...is taking it to a whole other level. Unfortunately,on the topic of what they gain from it,it's lots of money and sales and they know it. Which is why they write it only. Also yes,the lack of diversity of men in romance stories is kinda ridiculous. Those kind of books aren't my cup of tea anyway but I don't like it's that hard to make small,thin,pluz sized men in romance books as love interests rather than always a 6 foot muscular man

[@georgieoshea4676]

With the caveat that I prefer f/f and/or genre fiction, but whenever I see discussions of "why do women write m/m?" (it's one of the cyclical discourse topics, sometimes beginning with a genuine question and sometimes with just misogyny), I tend to see people say that women writing takes away from queer men (which, I would argue, is also the publisher's fault) but I don't see as often people boosting m/m books by queer men, and even less often books from non-major publishers. There's an argument to be made about where publishers choose to put their marketing money, but I do wish there was a bigger effort to boost those authors than complain about female authors (no issues with complaining as a general concept! I love complaining! Just wish it was paired with examples of what people want more of). Anyway, Dreamspinner Press exclusively publishes m/m gay romance, and there are a number of gay male authors churning out a variety of books and series. Lethe Press does weird specfic, with multiple m/m books by queer male authors. Obviously there's TJ Klune and Jay Bell, but there are so many more authors who could potentially explode, popularity-wise, if the right person or group pointed people their way. I think it's an important conversation to have, but it's also one that involves multiple axes of identity, which means it's also very, very far from a clear good/bad yes/no dynamic. It's (assumed, always assumed) [default sexuality] [minority gender] writing [minority sexuality] [default gender], and from there...there's no right answer

[@RespektTheBovril]

Perfect video to watch with my morning coffee, thank you Jess 💖

[@lora5030]

I refuse to believe that anyone who engaged with Jake Edwards' or Jack Harbon's tweets negatively and tried to jump on them with various accusations acted in good faith or misread them. I know some claim it but like... how. Also, Nigel is just the cutest. I know we all know that, I just felt like I need to say it after that wonderful ending haha

[@heyimsasa]

i love your entire look, demeanor, and just everything about the dramatic reading you were subjected to for our entertainment 😂💖 sorry i haven't been active. i haven't been participating on booktube but i watch every now and then! love your content and i hope you're doing all right 💖 thanks for another great one, jess!

[@JessOwens]

Never apologize, take care of yourself !! But I always love seeing your comments 🥰

[@bi-indigenous-baker5865]

I admit as an unpublished romance author, I do have one pair that does fill the “tall man, tiny girl” problem. And their story is my favourite to write. 😂 I feel like I do combat it a bit with him being not being particularly muscular. And the main reason Heidi (my protagonist) is small is I have a scene where they are held hostage in a bank robbery, and I just adore the idea of this 5 foot tall woman yelling at a man who “could be mistaken for the Rock if he wasn’t white, and ugly.” And actually intimidating him due to her ferocity. And it is kind of integral to her because it affects how she handles situations because she isn’t going to be able to brute strength her way out of trouble. Plus they are kind of reversed when it comes to traditional gender roles. Heidi is the fighter, she’s protective, athletic and hot headed. While he’s a lot more patient, gentle, and definitely more levelheaded; even though he does have a little bit of a jealous side. But most of my pairings don’t fit that at all and it would be nice to have more variety in body types in romance. And I would DIE for more disabled and indigenous representation. I would never stop reading those books. Lol

[@RuthMadisonAuthor]

I’m all about the disability rep! ❤

[@FromJulieReads]

I was watching the whole thing with Jack Edwards go down on Twitter and was just baffled 😅 I actually watch his videos and he critiques everything he reads so it made sense and like you said, his tweet was accurate 😂😂 love you covering alllll the things! Take care of yourself! 💜

[@Books-and-coffee0]

This is very off topic but I've been watching your videos for a while and I think you're the most likable and charming booktuber out there.

[@nobbynobbs5319]

I totally agree with you on the audiobook. I'm from Germany and we have amazing voice actor and they read the books so amazing that I could never imagine an IA be as amazing they are. I do understand the money aspect but sometimes it is worth the money and you can always rent the audiobook in your library. Jack literally has a degree in english literatur and has one book channel and one vlog channel and I love how you defend him. Your points are so good and I wish more people would stop attacking people for other opinions.

[@cynthialovesbooks]

OMG! You really did suffer with that dramatic reading. (Thank you, by the way.) When you shared those titles, I looked them up on Amazon and saw that they had so many reviews. You're totally right about Twitter and everyone needing to take a breath before responding, though I think that's good advice every time we want to respond to something. And I relate to your hoarding (aka fear of getting rid of things in the event you may need them one day) problem.

[@bentheoverlord]

Bloody good talk ! You reading the extracts from the romance novel had me cackling !

[@marianotyourbusiness]

The impression that I get from women who write mm romance and say that they won't write ww romance is that it's at least partially related to attraction. So the author is like "I am attracted to men and can write about them as the objects of sexual attraction", but they're uncomfortable with doing the same with women because they aren't personally attracted to women. This is admittedly due to fandom experiences over the years where fic authors/shippers in general would express discomfort (or even disgust) at the idea of writing women together for that reason. Unfortunately some people aren't willing to engage with their own thoughts and beliefs or step back for a second to go "hey, why do I feel like this????" (Side note: I feel like every single discussion on Twitter is a sequel to arguments people were getting into on Tumblr in like...2012. I am constantly a mix of Bilbo going "I'm old, Gandalf" and Aslan saying "Do not cite the deep magic to me, witch. I was there when it was written".)

[@Ashauni_Iman]

The way my jaw DROPPED as soon as you started reading oh my

[@mikouf9691]

I was sitting in a room apart from my household and I was STILL embarrassed by that dramatic reading. 😳. I wonder if Jack Edwards has ever read books by J.R. Ward. The bigness is off the charts in her Black Dagger Brotherhood books.

[@shelfaddiction]

Parts of this video has got me laughing so hard, especially that clip of you dramatically reading. Thank you!

[@moustik31]

Decluttering gives me a lot of anxiety. I have been training myself to do it regularly for a couple of years now and I dont regret it. Everytime, I throw/give/recycle some stuff out of my home, I feel like a weight is lifted out of my shoulders and I make breakthroughs with mental health issues. I cant explain it but it happens each time. Start small: pick ONE thing to declutter a day. I do follow Marie Kondo's principles and ask myself if the object brings me joy or if I have used it at least once these last few years.

[@mglarson5936]

Marie Kondo changed my life! I’ve struggled with OCD from a young age and used to throw away/get rid of all of my stuff when I was feeling overwhelmed. And then I would just have no clothes left 😬

[@moustik31]

@@mglarson5936 I'm so glad to read that. I know, it's "cool" to mock her but she really is helping people feeling good about their home and developping new habits.

[@mglarson5936]

@@moustik31 I don’t know why she gets so much hate. A lot of the hate I’ve seen is people being ignorant about her religious background (she was a Shinto priestess before starting her business) and so a ton of her advice stems from that. That, and just classic racism. 🙄

[@moustik31]

@@mglarson5936 I think you are right. I always thought, people didnt like having their overcrowded houses and their own spending habits pointed out. Not in a society, where consumerism is seen as a positive thing, as a coping mechanism/or a way of bragging or as both.

[@JessOwens]

I’m gonna try and declutter something this month 🥴 maybe 👀

[@teatunesandtales]

On the topic of bad/problematic romances (*cough*abuse*cough*), I'd love to see more YTers, call out Redeeming Love, especially since it's now a "blockbuster" movie. (Especially YTers who have significant following).

[@angryotter9129]

Omg I love how you put on makeup and a nice sweater to do that dramatic reading. I am deceased.

[@bicho6313]

There's a long history of women (particularly but not exclusively white women) writing male-male romance/erotica for other women. Some researchers have suggested that it has partly to do with women wanting to explore sex and romance outside of strict gender norms, like relationships where there is no man and woman, kind of like exploring relationships without the patriarchy baggage. The issue, as the tweet tried to point out, is that by playing with real identities that aren't yours, especially marginalized identities, you run into fetishization and exploitation, which further marginalizes people with those identities.

[@MsAwesomeSaucey]

Looool Jess, I’m finished with your reaction to Quan Millz picture on Goodreads 🤣☠️☠️

[@JessOwens]

I just have so many questions

[@cmwsparrow]

I'm someone who almost exclusively listens to audiobooks (minus graphic novels) and has for 10-15+ years. I think accessibility was greatly increased with apps/websites such as Libby and other library apps, Audible, etc. With the tapes and CDs, you were pretty much stuck listening to it in one room of your house or could only listen to it in the car. And if you wanted to take it anywhere you had to bring all 12 CDs or the giant box all the tapes came in. I have been able to read so many more books now that I can listen to them anywhere! I think this is a great example of how audiobooks were made more accessible without losing quality. Additionally, I have seen more books as audiobooks since this development as I imagine they are cheaper for libraries to purchase and demand increased. For the AI Reading: I am with you that I am not interested in listening to a robot narrate a book. There are so many books I want to read but simply never will because of the way it is narrated. I recognize that I have preferences so not every audiobook is going to work for me the same way not every author's writing style is going to interest me. However, I think there is a difference between my preference for different voice actors for different stories and an unhuman AI. I think that access is very important (lowering costs, increasing the number of audiobooks available, having more diverse narrators, increasing the number of languages for an audiobook) but I don't think it should come at the cost of quality. Without audiobooks, I might read 1 book a year and more likely 0. Listening to books I read with my eyes as a kid, I have realized just how much of the book I actually missed. Although I do not have a diagnosed disability around reading, reading entire books with my eyes is simply not accessible to me. I recognize that I still have the privilege of being able to read a physical book if absolutely necessary. I know that publishing is an industry and out to make money but I firmly believe that reading should be enjoyable! People who cannot read a physical book (due to disability, language barriers, lifestyle, etc) should be able to have an option that has good quality and is enjoyable for them! Although I too have not looked at the numbers, I am suspicious that big publishing houses have the money somewhere to invest in a wider variety of audiobooks (esp. from diverse authors -- I have so many on my TBR that I just cannot find as audiobooks) while still using human voice actors and paying them well!!

[@oceanroyalty7408]

speaking as a brazilian person, i feel very icky thinking the way to get audiobooks to non english speaking countries is to give it to AI rather than actually invest in a country’s voice actors like… just say you dont wanna invest ANY money in our market

[@AdyGrafovna]

I DNFd The Love Hypothesis because I just couldn’t read another sentence about how big the guy was. Well…. That was ONE of the reasons. Since then, I have tried some other romances and have seen the same thing. Apparently, only big men get written about.

[@JessOwens]

You mean you didn’t love how big Adam was ? How big his hands are ? How big and ripped he is ? How big and smart he is ? 😂

[@RuthMadisonAuthor]

I promise there are others out there, they just don’t get much hype 😢

[@martinaanne2709]

“ the trauma I have endured” oh my gosh I died when you did the dramatic reading

[@mrejj04]

Nigel is giving "I'm just here so I don't get fined" and I love it, lol.

[@WildeBookGarden]

I also thought the "big" thing was really funny and true!! if that's a male lead's first or primary descriptor I get bored 🤷🏻‍♀️ didn't even realize the tweet made a bunch of people angry until a few days later because it seemed so innocuous (and again...kinda true? lol. At least in my limited romance experience) "I feel like people take Twitter as if they only have 10 seconds to decide" OOF YES

[@JessOwens]

Maybe their Twitter app is different ? Like is there a countdown timer ??

[@emieloo76]

I absolutely adore Jack! I watch both of his channels (the second is called Jack in the Books). He’s also not wrong! Lol

[@halimamuslimah]

I have so much to comment on in this video, that if I did, it would be a novella. Thank you for all the work you put into this.

[@JessOwens]

🥰😂

[@themusicsnob]

Nigel reminds me of my cats. Keeping me up all night and then sleeping as much as they want while I work to pay for their fancy cat food 🐈 🐈‍⬛ lol

[@JessOwens]

These animals are so rude 😒😂

[@ohladysamantha]

Okay I love our girl Amari up there!!! Prominent placement is what she deserves.

[@JessOwens]

You know it !!

[@MoJordanReads]

No, we will never get to that place and there will never be a platform for that. Not even in real life, lol. People are ALWAYS going to be sensitive or assume or get defensive or SEEK a way to "take a stand". People are ridiculous. On a separate note, I know you've discussed some struggles you've been having lately and I just want to tell you that your videos continue to brighten my day. I hope you are finding things that bring you joy and help you get through your tough times. Thanks for sharing your awesomeness!

[@shironerisilk]

James Somerton commented on his last video [about shipping] that a woman sent him a DM telling him she enjoyed reading toxic gay relationships because she didn't have to engage with that same abusive dynamic with a woman in the abused position and deal with the implications of that. I was appalled. What the actual hell.

[@JessOwens]

Ewwwww what!

[@redfishies]

that's actually a very common explanation I see alot to why some women enjoy mlm with problematic tropes. They feel like they can disengage with the trauma of it more? E.g. student-teacher relationships. It often comes down to they've had bad experiences as women they don't really want to read about it?

[@amotleyartwkatherine]

Lol --- I just finished reading a book Empire of Desire where the author seemed particularly hung up on describing the male interest as big and the female as small. I thought to myself I know there are more average to small dicks out there but whatever....lol. I figure as the reader I can adjust the sizes of the characters how I want. She did have one line where the man says "well she isn't small but much smaller than me". I was like wtf mean? The rest of the book definitely made reference to this woman being skinny but with a chest. We still have a lot of work in Romance books for having regular bodies and not internalized misogyny white boy fantasy bullshit. I have been reading romance since the late 80s and it is getting better. I love Jack Edwards...he only said what a lot of us are thinking. He is most definitely a booktuber in my book. Great video as always!!!

[@harisa-esquiredtoread7367]

Thank you for all you do for us. That dramatic reading was true sacrifice.

[@JessOwens]

I do my best for y’all 🥰😂

[@reeyuhbeegale]

I seriously didn't like how some romance readers reacted to that tweet. 😞 It was funny and it's a fact I can't even deny since I roll my eyes and skim to most similar descriptions whenever I read. Once again, thank you for catching us up on the latest in the book community! ❤

[@k.d.r.3980]

That Quan Millz mess was a hate crime. I'm calling the Feds. And whatever, Jess, I'm judging the hell outta anybody who reads that mess. Adding...The reason the m/m romance tweet went left is bc the women who write that genre solely, know it's a fetish and don't like getting called out.

[@JessOwens]

CALL THE FBI!!!

[@gosia4473]

"i need to decluter but im scared im going to regret it" is my life mood honestly

[@JessOwens]

I can’t let go 😭

[@fuzzielogic2002]

New subscriber. I'm not sure if we have the same tastes in books but I love your content and energy! I agree with your insight. This is a topic I never thought about, mostly staying away from romance/erotica. (I do dip into literotica for the weird/horror erotica with aliens, werewolves, vampires, sentient plants.)

[@rz5293]

Instead of using synth voices to make books more accessible in other languages...could we make voice acting/narration more lucrative as a profession? Or both?

[@JessOwens]

That seems like the best option to me !

[@moustik31]

Jake Edwards is just starting the women-write-men trope and I'm sorry but these romance novels writers could use some feedback from actual cis men. It's how the game is played, you write about a portion of the population, you get feedback from said population. Go Jake! 😂

[@angst-i-et5373]

True! Constructive criticism is a two way street.

[@babeinlibrary]

If there were booktube awards for spilling tea and telling it like it is on KZbin…this would be my submission for 2022!

[@b2ksflyhoney]

Where are those bookshelves from? Every time I watch I’m like 👀👀

[@JessOwens]

My ones behind me were built by my husband ☺️

[@b2ksflyhoney]

@@JessOwens welp can’t pick that up at the store 🤣. They look great!

[@RuthMadisonAuthor]

I don’t tend to read m/m and I’ve never wrote it but I do wonder if it’s bad that I’m loving the slow burn love of Good Omens

[@enchantedlight]

Towards the beginning of the video when you said "things that happen on the twitter", the CC said "things that happen on the torture" 😂😂😂 Considering all the twitter craziness you were reporting on, I just thought that was hilarious. loved the video!

[@akossiwak]

"His everything... SO BIG!" Please send help. I'm deceased. 🤣🤣🤣

[@BreakingStubad]

I see Nigel has finally run you off the chair… Edit (I really need to stop commenting before the video ends): James Somerton just posted a video where he talks about the women writing gay men romances thing... I found it really interesting Ps. I too feel the urge to share my pain… but this Quan Millz thing was too much

[@lovealways_kayla]

i'm sorry, "big bell pepper nose"???? mr. quan millz... whoever you are... please escort yourself to jail immediately bc............☠☠☠

[@JessOwens]

STRAIGHT TO JAIL!!!

[@vanl3n177]

The romancelandia section is hitting hard right after James Somerton's video on shipping (which is great, you all should watch it). There is SOOOO much to talk about when it comes to fetishization in queer relationships (straight men fetishizing queer women and straight women fetishizing queer men) and I probably can't get into all of the reasons but here are some that I've seen. Disclaimer, I am biromantic asexual woman so take that with a grain of salt. I do study media representation though, so that's something. Most people are trained to socialize and empathize with a man's story than a woman's. It's kind of why stories about men are geared for "everyone" but stories about women are pigeon-holed into romance or woman's fiction. That being said, even in romances, people can generally relate more to the male character because male characters are given more leeway to be messy and human whereas if a female character shows any backbone, she is called a b*tch. Male characters are allowed to be more interesting and complex and this is pivotal in a romantic relationship because a romance is the dynamics between two people. If one of them is boring, nevermind both of them, the romance is going to be boring. There is however a HUGE PROBLEM with woman who write mlm romance so they can write abuse, but that's not my area of study so... yeah... Another thing is perceptions of media, versus experience, versus romance as a broad concept. There are definitely straight women who write mlm romance to fetishize gay men, but with the benefit of the doubt (and a fanfiction background), I think a lot of women write mlm romance because they think they have more to work with. At least in fanfiction, a lot of male leads in animes/shows get shipped with the other male leads because their characters are more fleshed out than the female leads (the sexy lamp trope is a trope for a reason). I'm sure people also ship them because they're hot but... I'm ace so I'm not paying attention to that. I can see how it translate to written works because even now a prickly, mean female character is somehow way worse than the male version. tied into the more interesting dynamics of a relationship, it all comes together for marketing and visibility. Anyway, that's just a general vibe. We need to platform more queer people to write queer stories, but there's always going to be someone (whether white or straight or whatever) who gets to do it first. Thanks to anyone who read this far and please do check out that shipping video from James Sommerton. It's like perfectly timed.

[@lua_ferraz]

OMG, everything you said about Jack Harbon's tweet! I actually had originally bookmarked it because silly me thought it could spark some interesting conversations and I wanted to get back to it and read replies. I do think Twitter's format makes it difficult to have actual conversations, but I also think that if (mainly we whites) people weren't so unwilling to listen, half of this nonsense wouldn't happen. I don't understand why everything has to be an attack, it's exhausting. And about Jack Edwards (how funny it is that they're both Jacks?), I actually loled when I read that because it's ACCURATE! That was one of many reasons why I started to get into indie romances, because every male LI in trad pub is actually the same guy. Lastly (sorry about the long ass comment), I had already forgotten about the pastor book, but that DRAMATIC READING, I'M TRAUMATIZED 😂😂😂😂😂

[@JessOwens]

Welcome to the trauma club 🙂🤣

[@bookslikewhoa]

That reading… ☠️ I have passed away and been revived by that dramatic interpretation

[@JessOwens]

LMAO MARA 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@pinpilinpaux]

I’ve always wondered about cishet women who are only into mlm ships and the only answer I’ve gotten is that a lot of them aren’t straight but asexual and do not wish to see someone like them involved in a relationship. Which I understand. So they prefer to write/read about two men. That said, that’s not everyone but it’s an explanation I’ve been given when I’ve wondered about it.

[@joylynn0620]

Your dramatic reading of that book made my day. It was terrible. And thanks for warning me not to look for it on Kindle Unlimited. Because I don't want the making it into the algorithm and seeing similar books recommended to me. I already am regretting reading Neon Gods for the same reason.

[@sarahno899]

I agree, it's weird if people only (emphasis on the ONLY) write about a group they don't belong to because it does automatically beg the question of WHY that specific group? And it seems to be the answer is probably either a) fetishization or b) profit and either way....yikes. I have seen, though, quite a few men judging women for reading and enjoying any male/male romance (I saw a lot of that with TSOA and men shitting on women for liking it). They're quick to call that fetishization when, from my own perspective, I think a lot of women are interested in male/male romance because sometimes they're more balanced (not always, obviously). I've seen a lot of het romances in books and movies and television that leave me begging the girl to ditch the jerk and that's so normalized and romanticized that it does make me hesitate on consuming het romances and gravitate towards male/male where I've personally found more balanced relationships

[@jeannasmith5093]

Girl you had me laughing so hard 🤣🤣. As you were reading, I was doing some work and I had to stop. What the Hell 😱😱😱 . Sitting in my with my mouth open.

[@shannonquinn]

I don't know how you did that dramatic reading without losing it. Ma'am, you deserve an Oscar for that! Now the book itself....wow. Ummm, I just.....I don't.....no. Just no. As for Jack Edwards' take on romance, he's not wrong. I thought his tweet was hilarious and thought "where's the lie?", and moved on. It was just good humoured fun. To those who got upset: relax, it's not that deep. Leave the man alone. 🙄 Loved the video, as always! Take care of yourself!

[@QManagerin]

I'm a romance reader- and I agree...everything is big (when it comes to the male love interest). I just roll my eyes because it gets really ridiculous at times. Just because we love something doesn't mean we shouldn't criticize it.

[@YasmeenKhan]

Hey have you ever looked at the Kate Clanchy mess in the UK? I did a search and couldn't see anything so apologies if I missed it. anyway, it's well worth looking into, I think

[@RespektTheBovril]

Nigels face in reaction to 13:03 😂

[@futchslug]

Also wrt what Jack Harbon said: he specifically brought up how often times the mlm relationships written by these women are abusive or fetishistic & like even if those women later came out as trans men or non-binary that wouldn’t make what they wrote any less bigoted or harmful like 🙄🙄 someone being part of a group doesn’t make them immune to espousing or creating things that are offensive toward that same group

[@Amber-zg4zo]

I was waiting for you to go over Jack Harbon's tweets! There are virtually no big names in the genre that are gay men. Gay men aren't getting to tell their own stories. The top read and recommended books are almost exclusively written by women, cishet or otherwise. It's a HUGE issue with mm. There were some really good threads that came from Jack's tweets and the discussion around it, and it brought up an opportunity for people to highlight some queer male authors as well.

[@carolcorreia1245]

i love romance books, but the "big problem" is a thing.... a big bad thing.

[@mplbooks]

Twitter is useless for asking serious, in-depth questions. (I will, if a question pops up on Twitter that I feel needs a considered answer, go write a blog post about it. Or just move on if I'm feeling too lazy to write a blog post, cuz there's zero point in trying to answer on Twitter 😂) But as an author, I do feel that push to "validate" myself and what I write--as if you need credentials in order to write certain kinds of stories or characters. It's a very gray area, littered with mines and potholes. There is no one, easy answer.

[@RodgersReads]

Omg I’m dying that dramatic reading left me scarred. Your mission was accomplished we are now suffering together… so….. thanks? 🤣

[@bri9317]

Lol I can definitely relate to the fear of decluttering. I don’t want to throw things away because I will feel like I will need it later and have to buy another one. I already don’t really listen to audiobooks that much. But when I do, I rather hear the author or an actor than Siri or Alexa. I understand the benefit of having it for other languages and getting the books more accessible but I feel like it would be creepy

[@JessOwens]

Exactly, I hold on to so many things for this reason

[@ik1149]

Nicholas Black's video " When a gay fanfiction is obviously written by a straight woman " is so funny and accurate is sad

[@becausereadingis]

I completely relate. I have so many plastic bags and gift bags that I cannot part with because I might need them someday...

[@JessOwens]

YES. Because once I throw them out, ima need one !

[@wistfulwriter7]

I screamed through the entire dramatic reading! I am dead.

[@lydiawalker0714]

The only time I choose to listen an AI voice read me something is when I'm trying to rush through a reading/peer review assignment for school. It's never as thrilling as Bahni Turpin's narration. However, I do think e-books should have the option of AI reading assistance.

[@TheGoofy1932]

😲 I was wildly entertained by all the background drama. Just where was Nigel trying to dig to, exactly?! Does your 💺 have a Narnia portal or something? 😆 So Siri will be reading the audiobooks soon?! Gonna have to pass on that-but I say that as someone who doesn't read with audiobooks much at all ( I like the Dresden Files as James Marsters from Buffy reads them and Poirot as David Suchet or Hugh Frasier read those otherwise I usually pass on audiobooks) Most audiobooks for me, particularly romance come off as 🧀. Although I can see where it would open up access to other countries. It might also help bring down the cost a bit for those who choose to purchase them. 😉 OK now, Nigel is mixed coat. Nigel has a beautiful black and white coat (representing mom and dad). Be proud of All his heritage. 🐕 #SuperPup Side Note: Have you told him he's adopted yet? It's a delicate discussion to have when the time is right. 🤣 Have to agree with you, if you're reading Preacher Yam I'm judging you a little bit. 😏 Sorry, but if you're reading those Meh Contemporary Romances(Spanish Love Deception, The Love Hypothesis)with the cartoon covers then you are most definitely getting what was advertised. I wish those "authors" would so be able to locate a thesoris. But to each their own. 😱 Twitter took something out of context? No?! Say it isn't so. They Never do that. 🤣

[@JessOwens]

Nigel is digging for Narnia I guess- no clue where he tried to go 😂. And we’re waiting till Nigel is older to tell him he’s adopted

[@Emily-fh8en]

Omgggg those book titles im crying WTF. Omg the dramatic reading lmfao that may be more funny than your reading of the love hypothesis. Candied yams really?! XD