Britain's Last Ditch: Wartime Changes to No4 Lee Enfield

[@FNGof2010]

Kar98K in 1941: "Aw geez, that's horrible. I hope nothing like that happens to me..."

[@grahammctygue724]

Great job thumbs up peace

[@luqmanhakim7379]

Kar98k in 1945: "Oh S**t........"

[@mochiisntbad6762]

Oh boy

[@thecreepnextdoor7560]

Mr Germany, I don’t feel so good

[@RedDragon052]

The non-Brass buttplates were not aluminum, they were a zinc composite called ZAMAK. While they did have some aluminum in the alloy, It is much stronger than aluminum would be. With the need for brass for shells, and Aluminum for aircraft, a zinc composite makes a lot of sense.

[@Ugly_German_Truths]

I think i've seen that stuff mentioned in correlation with the overseas production, so it would be a mostly US and Canadian production aspect, wouldn't it?

[@mrbeast85]

@@Ugly_German_Truths IIRC Canadian production often had blackened steel butt plates. Its hard to tell without looking through production records of the various manufacturers, as many (most?) wartime production rifles went through FTR after the war and ended up being rebuilt with an assortment of refurb, cannibalised and/or new production components. So you can find rifles with any combination of different style parts attached with virtually no way of knowing if they are original.

[@owllymannstein7113]

Oh great, now the hi-point guys are going to start saying their pistols have a military pedigree.

[@DarrellLarose]

My Father shipped out to the UK in 1942 with a Canadian supplied aluminum mess kit, they when they arrived traded them in for a UK made tin mess kit, and the aluminum was recycled into the war effort. Can't verify the story, or if it's an urban legend. But that could be a fair amount of aluminum in each troop ship.

[@richardmeyer418]

I've seen this mentioned in lower quality lathe gears as well.

[@donnydonadio1185]

A lot better-looking than most last-ditch firearms.

[@bukitcengkeh1]

Yeah ik

[@alexeysaphonov232]

In fact the same is true about the last ditch k98. Bolt action rifles are already simple enough.

[@IceWolfLoki]

French, Belgian and Dutch last ditch rifles were of excellent quality, they just didn't know they were last ditch when produced.

[@shawnoandrew]

My no4 mk1s look better than this one.

[@bigblue6917]

Late Japanese rifles were so poor that with the bayonet attached they were basically a spear. Which was what they were going for.

[@martkbanjoboy8853]

At the next gunshow the geezer at the table will add 'last ditch' to the tag on the same grimy SMLE he's been selling for the past twenty years.

[@jontee3437]

and jack the the 1500 dollar price tag up to 2000

[@demonprinces17]

@@jontee3437 and Still never sell

[@mrmicro22]

Ageism?

[@Slothian]

geezer is a term of endearment @mrmicro22

[@Ugly_German_Truths]

If it's the same SMLE, he obviously did never sell it :P

[@ultrablue2]

“…about the bottom of the barrel when it came to British Production.” *Sten MKIII has entered the chat.

[@Amerikanskis]

Mark III made by the toy makers

[@jakemarchbank]

Hey at least it isn't an L85A1!

[@cryhavoc999]

@@jakemarchbank I'd take an L85a1 over both!

[@jakemarchbank]

@@cryhavoc999 well I suppose it still has the benefit of modern ammunition and magazines but if we compare the guns to their contemporaries the L85 is definitely the worst

[@moomeansmooable]

@@jakemarchbank yea I'd rather fiddle with a sten to get it cycling than a l85a1

[@fredbloggs5902]

To be fair, simplifying the rear sight also made training easier, which may have been an issue.

[@thenoobplaysit6923]

In addition, in my view at least, the simple sights are just as effective in real-world applications. It isn't like soldiers are sniping targets at 1000+ metres on a regular basis so these sights work just fine for most situations.

[@boingkster]

@Lassi Kinnunen 81 you just described exactly what volley fire was used for - supressing an enemy at distance. A fortification, a copse of trees, a hillside or building... anywhere you could see a body of troops or incoming fire and needed it to be supressed.

[@BerndFelsche]

One of the arguments against reduced battle rifles was from WW1 experience where the enemy might be easily seen on the other side of a valley but out of range of lesser weapons than the "full rifle". SMLE can reach out and touch the enemy at 1000 yards with a good marksman. Other users can certainly harrass which has tactical value in most circumstances.

[@jannerantanen5121]

And most iron sights of the 2nd world war were far too complex for their actual most common use cases, a sight like this is just as good for 90% of the time

[@alltat]

@@BerndFelsche The problem is that it comes at a cost. The more complicated sights require additional training, additional maintenance, and are probably going to be useless in actual combat anyway. You're not really going to be click-adjusting for the exact range while being shot at. The simpler sights are just as good under 500 meters, and engagements beyond that are a tiny minority and the soldiers probably won't hit even if the sights are perfect.

[@gunner678]

The Lee Enfield never gets old. Even in its most basic form it's a beauty.

[@joelspringman7748]

Yep. Wish I had bought one in the 80's for $99, when they were plentiful.

[@larrybarnes3920]

@@joelspringman7748 yep.

[@gunner678]

@@joelspringman7748 I know right. A friend of mine in the Pyrenees was recently given a no4 mk1 from a ww2 supply drop to the resistance, by an old resistance member. It still shoots perfectly. I saw it just the other day. A cracking piece of kit.

[@joelspringman7748]

@@gunner678 Nice.

[@pocketsand4404]

I found one of these in a pawn shop for 100 bucks. It's dated 1943 and is a No4 MK1. Strangely it has a second date ENGLAND 1983 underneath the first date. Best 100 bucks ever spent! Update: That was my mistake. The 1983 is actually the serial number on mine. And it has all matching parts which is cool.

[@phichanyaungsri6340]

Saw a last ditch Enfield at the LGS and didn’t know why it looked that way. Thanks for the video.

[@JonathanFergusonRoyalArmouries]

Just to add - if you have the square cocking piece on your SMLE, it's not necessarily wrong. That design was first introduced in 1916 on the SMLE and reintroduced for the No. 4. Also, we also tested a fibreglass stock for the No. 4. It's ridiculous.

[@bigblockman11]

What happened with the fibreglass stock?

[@JonathanFergusonRoyalArmouries]

@@bigblockman11 I have not seen any trials reports but it's so big and bulky I can't imagine it (or the metal one Ian mentions) being seriously considered by the military for very long at all.

[@bigblockman11]

@@JonathanFergusonRoyalArmouries you got any pictures of it I have yet to find it so far

[@JonathanFergusonRoyalArmouries]

@@bigblockman11 No, sorry. I'll see if we can cover these on our channel at some point and/or get them catalogued properly. It's chonky and green, with visible glassfibre fabric impregnated with a resin. It *could* be part of postwar trials rather than the wartime one Ian's talking about. I need to check.

[@bigblockman11]

@@JonathanFergusonRoyalArmouries yea this sounds like one of the ways to keep the rifle relevant postwar around the same time when A.I was making its rife

[@philipentwistle4612]

ROF is Royal Ordnance Factory, both Maltby and Fazackerly were ROF’s. There were about 100 ROF’s, but only Maltby and Fazackerly in the ROF system made No4’s.

[@1badseabee]

It’s still a Fazackerly based on serial number.

[@travisstorbakken1737]

I can not find a picture or video or anything that looks like my Enfield. R.O.F.M No.4 MK.1.1941 in my opinion it's in very good condition considering what I see in pictures of other Enfields. Wish I knew what I have.

[@nathanadrian7797]

@@travisstorbakken1737 I have the same problem, I own a Longbranch 1943 No. 4 Mk1* that is very unique. what is different about yours? Mine has a recoil reducer/muzzle brake similar to a Russian SVT 40.

[@minuteman4199]

Back in the 90s I was in the Canadian army RCEME. Enfields were still in service (Canadian Rangers, cadets) and we still had parts and service manuals for them. I never actually saw any come through the shop for service, but we could have done the work if they did. I do remember reading through the manuals and found that if any rifle with two groove rifling was found it was to be scrapped.

[@turbografx16]

Interesting, I wonder why.

[@minuteman4199]

@@turbografx16 I have seen in several places that in practice two groove rifling is as good. My guess is that that position was never officially accepted and they thought it was inferior. It could also be that by the time the war ended there was no shortage of rifles so the worst of those available weren't needed, and two grove rifling was one of the best identifying features of those worst rifles.

[@normanmccollum6082]

The No.4 Lee Enfield would go on to see Canadian Ranger use into the 2010s. I love the No.4 and was REALLY hoping the Canadian Armed Forces would adopt the Australian AIA new-production Lee Enfields they were making in .308/7.62 Nato. That was among the biggest issues it seemed, along with parts becoming scarce, is that it would be much more convenient to keep 7.62 standard instead of having the Rangers using .303. Seemed like a perfect fit! But nah, went with a Finnish rifle. I'm sure it's fantastic, but I was still left feeling a bit saddened. The No.4 Lee Enfield is even on the badge of the Canadian Rangers! Tsk... oh well. Regardless, it's thanks to the Canadian Rangers that the Lee bolt might technically be the longest-serving bolt design to be used to some extent as a standard-issue rifle in a Military branch in firearm history. 1888-2015 or so. Legendary... I love .303 but I really wanna get one of those .308 AIA Lee Enfields, and their 7.62x39 copy of the No.5 that uses AK mags is pretty darn cool as well! Aussie Aussie Aussie!

[@davehopkin9502]

@@turbografx16 presuably 2 groove barrels wear out faster as each grove is taking 2.5 times the friction induced wear

[@normanmccollum6082]

@@minuteman4199 Yeah, saw that video a while back, says the action is like glass. I wouldn't be surprised if it were inherently more accurate than Lee Enfields too, though I can't imagine being more accurate by much. It's just... "Muh Enfield." Unironically, "Muh Enfield." Wanted the legacy to carry on...

[@ianturpin9180]

February 65 two months short of my 16th birthday at hms St Vincent I qualified as a Royal Navy marksman with a Lee Enfield. 300 yards, 3ft Square target with a 9in bull. 10 shots prone freehand. I scored 78. The highest score in my mess.

[@ducomaritiem7160]

I love last ditch stuff. It's "back to essential funtions" that's why I love the Sten guns. Some pipes, some roundstock, bit of plate. A barrel. Bend, weld and rivet together, et voila!

[@grumblyone3334]

My very 1st rifle was/is a No4 Mk1*, out of Long Branch, Canada in 1943. Was just working on it a little this weekend, as the trigger-lever/bolt-catch had gotten a little sticky, & was leaving the trigger flopping. All these years later, & this is still one of my favorites. Thanks for the history lesson on this beautiful bit of British elegance. I don't know that it constitutes being "last ditch," as it's pretty slick, but I enjoyed learning about all the differences it's got with the other variants.

[@thespecialbru]

Last ditch Lee? Sounds like a good 1960s Western character.

[@jakemarchbank]

Stealing this

[@beargillium2369]

Or a Bruce Lee movie

[@Fleetwrench]

Spaghetti western character.

[@TheSmsawyer]

That is a very corny joke, pilgrim.

[@somersethuscarl2938]

Cuts to Mounty Pylon No.4 Mk1 "They turned me into a last ditch rifle!"......." Eh.....Ah?" "But I got better"

[@keithallardice6139]

Great video, as a Brit I love finding out details about our production rifles I'd never even heard of .. as a wee boy all Lee Enfields were the same to me and it's with delight and interest that I'm finding variants and sub-variants all with the most confusing nomenclature! Once again GJ has enlightened me ... blessed be his name ;-)

[@Scoope31]

As a Army cadet in the early 70s we used these rifles for drill and on the ranges, let me tell you they weighed a ton at that age(13), still remember the bruises and also throwing them into the back of a 4 tonner and I mean throwing going to and from the ranges at Altcar, great video though, really bought back the memories.

[@exileinderby51]

Brought back memories for me as well. I was in the cadets at school in the sixties and went to Altcar every year for shooting training. we also drilled with the Lee Enfield, shot with it and also with the FAL and yes, the Lee was heavy.

[@Scoope31]

@@exileinderby51 Always K range for us, loved being in the BUTTS

[@Scoope31]

@@chyza2012 Got a funny feeling you have made up for it now :)

[@DuncanInnes1956]

And yet we Cadets never suffered a rim lock…or Garland thumb…despite dropping the 303s barrel first in the mud or on the parade ground.

[@MarkRipley-h3w]

Same memories for me 1970's happy days.

[@daskriegsman7013]

Me waiting for a review on the North American Enfields: Getting closer

[@Palmtop_User]

Just goto Connecticut if you a North American Enfield

[@krisblunden1642]

I to would like a review on North American pattern ones more specificity the Canadian ranger ones

[@live4lifeeeeee975]

I have a no.4mk1 longbranch that was sporterized by globe firearms….would love to see a vid specific to North American Enfield

[@TheSmsawyer]

I think for a conscript army with little experience with firearms, the simplified No4 Lee Enfield was a good decision. I think the sights are better and more user-friendly.

[@ericsundell9978]

Was interesting to know more history behind this and how the various changes occurred. Cool basically seeing a clone of my #4 there with the savage gun. Great video as always sir!

[@someduckwithanultimax6549]

A note: at 0:38, you say Britain was the last one standing in the War on the Western Front. While not wholly inaccurate, it's worth noting that, as the USSR was still allied to Nazis at this point, Britain wasn't just the last one standing on the Western Front, they were the last one standing *at all*.

[@hurricane567]

"Gentlemen, how do we get wood?"-Blackadder V, probably

[@kentlindal5422]

"From Witches!" - Monty Python(probably)

[@razgriz1258]

I personally own a US property marked savage lee- Enfield No.4 Mk.1* from 1942, I got it a couple of years ago as a graduation gift, but unfortunately the receiver rail towards the front is cracked and missing.

[@tays8306]

I always worry about that with mine....but I guess, It made it through the war. Lives an easy life now so to speak. Range and farm whacking steel. I bought it from a fella here who restores enfields. Out of about 12 to pick from, the original wood was in excellent shape and matching. I love maltbys and faz, but I have a soft spot for savages made ones for some reason...even over long branch, and I'm canadian!

[@hansgruber9685]

@@tays8306 Well I’m American and prefer Long Branches. So…. Yeah.

[@tays8306]

@@hansgruber9685 You heard it here first folks!

[@TheSmsawyer]

Have you ever shot a Lee- Enfield imported from India? They are actually not that bad and have some cool armory marks.

[@tays8306]

@@TheSmsawyer Id like an ishapore made no1. Just waiting for a time when I decide I need another one..ha. they run about 700 to 900$ canadian.

[@Brennan_the_smith]

Holy crap thats the model lee enfield I have. It has brass on it tho

[@cherrytheprotogen5972]

Lucky, lol

[@andersjjensen]

As he said it could pretty much be any kind of metal. "Butt plate is butt plate!" meme here :P

[@alfulton5946]

It's funny 1942 to an American is early on in the war. 1939 Canada 🇨🇦was fighting so what Ian meant to say was almost half way through the war.

[@Qmeister044]

Not to mention Japan invaded China in 1937!

[@chuckhainsworth4801]

Provincial attitude. Through the Commonwealth and colonies, and similar colonial interest of France, Belgium, and the Netherlands are part of the reason that the rest of the world show are marked tendency to place the start of the war in 1939. The differences in date occur along similar lines. For example, Russian sources place the beginning of the war at the start of Barbarossa. Chinese sources, Communist or Nationalist, place the start at the invasion of Manchuria. You can guess the nationality of the single source that I have found that places the beginning of the war at the invasion of Ethiopia.

[@alfulton5946]

@@chuckhainsworth4801 I was definitely coming from the British colonial outlook being Canadian. I do realize it was basically still ongoing from the aftermath of ww1 and probably even before.

[@hasty416]

Good insight, I guess every country sees the war differently

[@chuckhainsworth4801]

@@zopEnglandzip good guess! You have my permission to go buy yourself a shot of the good stuff. You are still wrong, but it was a good guess. As well, you earn my thanks and the right to buy yourself another shot. You did this with answer that was both plausible and implausible. My compliments to you.

[@davidbrennan660]

Run in, yell “Rim lock!” Run out. The last ditch in the UK is the Channel.... best A/T ditch so far used in warfare.

[@jfess1911]

Oddly, those who used Lee Enfields seldom had this problem. Military-spec .303 British ammo has a double taper on the rim that is missing on most modern ammo. Check out Bloke on the Range's video for more details.

[@GARDENER42]

@@jfess1911 I've put thousands of rounds through various SMLE's over the past 45 years. Never once had that issue, despite being self trained on the rifle (my service issue was an L1A1).

[@jfess1911]

@@GARDENER42 As near as I can tell, the rim lock issue stems mainly from some ammo companies not following the British spec for rim shape.

[@baobo67]

@@GARDENER42 Me too. Never heard of it till KZbin where it is a huge problem for arm chair WW weapons "experts".

[@jamesrae5351]

@@baobo67 ... most of whom seem to be American .... !

[@lewisarmani4027]

My great grandfather was producing these in the factories during the war in Enfield a borough of London were they were mass produced i still travel through there now and used to live in Enfield as a child

[@minuteman4199]

The Canadian factory was at a place called Long Branch. It's now just a stop on the west Toronto streetcar line. I bet very few who travel that line now know what it once was.

[@biggerbehindthetrigger2814]

I like the great examples of fírearms that you get to handle. Me personally I would be buying all of them if I could. Back when I made more money it allowed me to collect M1 carbines. I had all 9 manufacturers and enough parts to build 5 or 6 more. Most of them I built with correct parts for the manufacturer. I only had 5 original rifles including a M2 and ME but I didn't have the battery packs and backpack. Those are truly hard to come by. I started doing the same thing with the Enfield rifles. I had 5 of them 2 being a Ishapore A2 one was cut down by the importer to make the quasi tanker rifle like the M1 Garand tanker. That Ishapore .308 cutdown was a bit too short on the stock and every 6 rounds or so the wood would fall apart and the front pieces of the stock would end up on the ground. Me being a psudo gunsmithing I put a half inch dowl rod in stock and ended up epoxying one end in and made it so it could come apart and I had to remove a 1/6 of a inch of the duffle cut to make the front band grab more of the rear upper wood of the stock. Now it's as solid as can be. My dad loved that rifle and could whack the buffalo at the Whittington center. That was our monthly camping trip when I lived in Denver for a few years before he passed away. He passed his love of milsurp firearms down to me. He was very proud of my M1 carbine collection. When I got my class 3 FFL and the tax stamp for the M2 my dad just fell in love with full automatic fírearms I had 4 of them in a trust and he was on it so he wanted a 1928 Thompson so I found a really nice one and ended up with it. My dad was able to shoot it 2 times before he passed away. I'm looking forward to expanding my collection on the Enfield rifles. I had to sell some of my fírearms about 18 years ago. I was a professional musician and made a incredible amount of money from the age of 23 to 34. I wanted to rebuild my collection but it's not going to happen. I'm happy with what I have now. I realized that I went overboard but every firearm. Was a great investment. Almost every firearm that I bought was worth 4 times as much as what I payed for them. I still have a very decent collection of fírearms but I don't have the FFL any more. I still like and want to collect the Enfield rifles and I'm getting into the k-98 rifles. Happy Safe Shooting 🇺🇸💪

[@the_once-and-future_king.]

Wow. First on a Lee-Enfield video! Hello from England. We used these as drill rifles back when I was in the Sea Cadets. They had the micrometer sight fitted, so guessing they were later production, together with a brass buttplate complete with cleaning kit hatch.

[@tokyo8236]

ROF Fazakerley! This gun was made about a mile away from my house. Just searched the locatio. Just opposite Aintree hospital. Houses there now. Had no idea an ROF was there. Though makes sense given Liverpool was an important industrial and maritime location during WW2 and was heavily bombed by the Luftwaffe

[@ermfwp]

And he nailed the pronunciation too!!

[@tokyo8236]

@@ermfwp yep. Better than locals who tend to sau Fazak-ly and not Fazak-er-ly. Including me.

[@TheWolfsnack]

...and probably haunted by the ghosts of Enfields past....

[@davehopkin9502]

Several of the SLR's I was issued with came with a scouce accent too!!!!

[@rangefinder3538]

I have this very beat-up, bruised and poorly finished old Lee Enfield with a crude rear sight that I have never seen on any other Enfield. If looks could kill this thing would be harmless. But It shoots great. I never knew it was a last-ditch weapon made in Maltby in 1941. Thanks so much, Ian for the info.

[@jamesallred460]

God I love the way Enfield's look. They're just so damn pretty! Great vid, thanks Ian!!!

[@msoden4920]

I have a Savage built version. 2 groove rifling and it is a tack driver. I would rather have the folding peep than the micrometer also. The disdain of the "last ditch" term and the imagery it lends itself to is hardly deserved.

[@shellcracker18]

I have a savage and a long branch. Both 2 groove tack drivers

[@hazratmuhazmat8831]

I just checked my 1943 manufactured No4Mk1 and it has the simplified front shroud and a adjustable rear sight that appears to have been put on later due to the wear difference. The SN is a little weird as one number is double stamped. And it is a two band rifling. Thanks, Ian for the info. I have a very rough Mosin-Nagant and Arisaka that show even more crude finish. But I can barely make out the Chrysanthemum indicating it must have been a captured gun.

[@donaldanderson3249]

Just love your videos about the Lee Enfields, I have my grandfather's sporterized rifle that he gave me when I was 12 and started hunting. Awesome rifle. It's a #1 mk 3 .

[@turbogerbil2935]

I don't think these were "last ditch" at all. Britain had an extremely well developed war production plan, and the No4 (and other weapons) had been designed so that the parts could be sub-contracted out to all levels of manufacturing capability. Thats why there are many variations in bands, woodwork, foresight protectors, et al. The "rough finish" guns are mostly just confined to Maltby production - it was a new factory - and some Fazakerley batches. Typical ROF teething issues. At BSA, by contrast, quality remained very high throughout.

[@SuperFunkmachine]

Parts an rifles could be made across the empire, places like India an Canada where makeing enough guns to meet there own needs. Add in the millions strong stock of ww1 Lee Enfields and see why more effort was in Bern and Sten production.

[@Wolvaroo]

That explains why I looked like an idiot trying to figure out how to remove the bolt on my father's No4 mk1, his was from England and mine was a Longbranch.

[@infectedvector]

My dad was a sniper in the Dutch army with one of these (not sure what scope they used). In 2020, Turners was selling these like hotcakes for $500 and even mil surplus .303 is not cheap. A few years ago (pre-Covid and the "summer of love" rioting) when guns and ammo were hard to come by, they were going for about $150.

[@garyh1449]

I have a NO 4 MK 2 with blonde stock. Assigned to the RAF but never issued. It has a A.J. Parker rear sight and it's very accurate (about an inch 5 shots at 50 yards with my handloads).

[@thebcjungle4721]

I had a 1943 No. 4... even as a semi last ditch it was a beauty.

[@Lee0568]

The Lee Enfield •303 S&LMLE will never be a forgotten rifle.the •303 and the •22 conversion was the FIRST rifle I ever fired with the Air Training Corps (ATC),40 Years ago.

[@TheOuterCircle]

Jokes about the quality aside, I have a 1942 No.4 MKI* and even with the two-position flip sight, and 2 groove barrel, it shoots like a dream. I took out the Milsurp rifle competition in January in Australia firing a combination of deliberate and snap serials at 300 and 500 yards, perfect with that flip sight.

[@martingardener90]

Of course the last Ditch was literally the English Channel !!! ( luckily it was full of water )!

[@MeshFrequency]

I really like the look of Lee Enfield rifles.

[@Mattmaster112]

People forget how much Britain sacrificed in the war.

[@gfarrell80]

They lost basically the same amount of military dead as the US. UK 380k vs US 400k. And with a population of only 47 million (UK) versus 131 million (US), Britain proportionally sacrificed significantly more blood than the US. Britain also had significantly more civilian casualties and destruction of their home cities. However, both the UK and US are not very significant when compared to the Soviets or the Polish in terms of sacrifice.

[@CAMSLAYER13]

@@gfarrell80 we did everything we could, we were just lucky to be an island

[@normanmccollum6082]

@@gfarrell80 Seems pretty spot-on, and yeah, the Soviets and Poles got railed hard. I regard the Eastern Front as the bloodiest front of the bloodiest war in human history.

[@mrbeast85]

3:45 there is also an even cheaper war expedient sight protector, made out of stamped metal which can be found. Its fairly rare now as it was one of the first things discarded and replaced when many No4s were put through FTR after the war. Further to this there are several other slightly simplified war production parts. The barrel bands (both front and back) were made out of cheaper, thinner metal rather than the more rounded, finished items. Trigger guards can also be found in a squarer slightly thicker form, which have had less machining and finishing. Butt plates were also made in blackened steel besides the pot metal type and brass. I've also noted slightly different end caps on the stock and finger guards, which use less metal at the front, but I'm not sure if this is a wartime measure.

[@jacksonthompson7099]

My No4 Mk1* Savage rifle still has the stamped front sight ears, rifle was definitely in the hands of a small armory at one point becuase the buttsock and both handguards don't match, buttstock is also marked FR (pretty faint tho) and the barrel is dated F51 and a 5 groove. Probably spent time in Korea or was lightly overhauled for Korea but never sent. Stock still has cosmoline in it and the wood is ww2 wartime so the buttstock and main stock have shrunk a little which is gonna make bedding it a issue. (Rifle has no downward pressure on the barrel and is also missing the split washer for the king screw and the new bolt needs to have the locking lugs fitted or forcefully mated with a special proof round that evidently expanded the metal, charge was 33 grains of No3 Cordite for final bolt fitting according to online forums)

[@curtwuollet2912]

I wish I had the sense to start collecting Enfields when they had them in barrels every fall at Sears and hardware stores. Could have packed away cases of .303 as well.

[@Paleoman]

i have around 30 of the cloth bandoliers dated 1949,50&51. Paid a buck each for them. The places to shoot were all closed down years ago so i still have the ammo.

[@keithorbell8946]

We had a few No. 4*’ s in our CCF. Armoury when I was at school (1984-‘89)

[@fredbloggs5902]

Historical note: My range instructor (U.K. back in the 90s) took part in the official burial of the last military SMLE.

[@icemelongreen]

My favorite WWII Bolt Gun ! I've always had one in my collection.

[@mintnak8364]

I was waiting for no4 video in a while! Thank you

[@bmcg5296]

Kiln dried wood is an extremely slow process compared to the faster autoclave which remove water fast. To dry the wood super quick. That is how they dry wood and veneers for doors architrave, skirting boards etc.

[@leebronock887]

I have a mid war Savage Lee Enfield Mk. 4 with the two grooves. Alas, when I got it, it had been "sporterized," (an early form of psychological torture.) It shoots very well.

[@HootOwl513]

I commented more about the No 4 Mk I rifle I have in your video last week, but this example is actually closer to my Artifact. It had the 100/300 yards peep flip sight, but I replaced that with a ladder sight. Also has the grooved flat-style cocking tab, and the same bolt-release detent catch. Brass buttplate. The color of wood is very light, blonde almost. Issues I have with the mismatched bolt, I detailed last week. Stamped M/1944 [Broad Arrow] on the shoulder stock socket.

[@kygunworks4982]

I'm going to look at a No. 4 MK1 * in a few days, came back to this video to know what to look for. Love having a wealth of knowledge to look back on

[@blatherskite9601]

A whole video about L-E No. 4 sights? Man, almost as pointy-headed as I am! Keep them coming, Ian! Top material!

[@eizol568]

My old Uncle didn’t a chance to make this gun when he worked for the armory, (he got to go home early one day, as it got bombed) but I wonder if he used one in Africa.

[@richardanderson2742]

I have ten of the No. 4 rifles and no two match perfectly in configuration. Between manufacturing changes and subsequent repairs/refurbishment throughout the world where parts is parts, each tells its own story.

[@RobKenchu]

This made me dig out my No4 Mk1 to watch along. So cool! I was surprised to find my last ditch isn't so bad at all! It's a 1942, with the simplified front sight and 2 groove barrel, as well as the slotted cocking grip, but the finish and weld on the receiver are quite nice and it's got the old style rear sight (I reckon it was probably installed later).

[@IceWolfLoki]

I wonder how much some of the poor finishing was just inexperienced workers doing the work and it being deemed good enough (looking at the markings and stripper clip bridge weld)

[@Stevarooni]

Maybe...Q.C. would be experienced, though. Maybe a couple of shoddily-made rifles led then to move toward a more simplified rifle.

[@davehopkin9502]

No the quality required for acceptance was reduced to remove additional fine finishing processing on the stocks after the blanks are cut to speed up production and also reduce reject rate

[@morgs456]

Probably a good point! Probably welded by some lass who had been pulled in off the streets given a day welding course and told " war effort....go!"

[@ooloncaluphid]

I have a slightly less-crude one of these, also Fazakerley, 1942. I guess it might be a little bit earlier, it has a 5- groove barrel, grooves on the striker and doesn't have that super-ugly weld on the charger bridge. It shoots really well.

[@theCANaDiAN1987]

I have one of these No 4’s. I’ll have to check if it’s a 2 groove barrel too I can’t remember now. Mine’s a 1943 Fazerkerly. The stock is a little beat up she’s definitely seen some use but it’s in great shape otherwise and shoots straight.

[@m60hog1]

This explains my No4 MK3 From 43 SOOOOO much.

[@matthewfritz7396]

My brother bought a British Enfield 303 rifle several years ago and that thing was a beast of a gun. So loud when shot.

[@GEV646]

I have a June '43 Fazakerley that is still a bit rough, but absolutely refined in comparison to a buddy's '42 Maltby, which is unbelievably crude.

[@darthmartinez]

There are also some 1903 Springfield's that had 2 groove rifling.

[@tactical_pat6449]

Ian always knows my favorite rifles and makes great videos about them. Thank you.

[@edrhodes574]

Fascinating. I bought a 303 at Woolworths in 1984 as a father's day gift . He served in the British military and was well happy, mother not so much. Paid 40 bux for it.

[@nigeleaton5715]

FEWER! He said "fewer" and not "less". Bless you Ian, pedants around the globe salute you. :)

[@MesaperProductions]

Channel your inner Stannis. You da Mannis!

[@webtoedman]

Huzzah!

[@andyjoyce603]

Highly informative. Thank you. Just found out more about the BSA Mk1/2 I've recently acquired.

[@comiketiger]

Wish I would have started a collection of the Lee Enfield rifles. Another great video. Thanks! God bless all here.

[@JohnDoe-yg6ed]

I just got a last ditch no4 mk1 for 300 beans with bayonet and 75 round of ammo the other day at a show. One of my favorite rifles to be honest

[@frickinrick89]

"Last-ditch" might also apply to the dispersal pattern No. 1 Mk. III's...I have a 1942 BSA example and it is a bit rough

[@tays8306]

Those dispersal no1s are really neat. I had to pick between a 41 lithgow and a dispersal. I picked the aussie. man does it shoot well. Ftr in 49 probably helps.

[@thesheepman220]

Love my mk 4 1950 long branch, my 1906 Springfield and my k 98 converted too 264 win mag all keepers , many thanks buddy

[@LenKusov]

Well, that cut wasn't a problem FOR A WHILE, but the front and back of the notch quickly wear down especially if you're shooting with any sort of leftward lean. Then, when you're in a hurry, you slam the bolt forward and back and at some point it gets peened over enough for the bolt head to either catch, or come out of the track entirely. The field fix, and the one anyone who's doing a lot of shooting with a Mk1* today has to do, is to take a cold chisel and a file to peen the messed up groove back over, deburr it, and then put a blob of silver solder on the ends and file it down so that you had a correctly sized notch. To PREVENT this from happening, a lot of stories I've heard is that instead of using oil on the bolt head threads on Mk1* guns they were told to use axle grease - it's sticky enough to keep it from trying to jump the track, and I can personally attest that Lucas Red-n-Tacky DOES in fact keep my messed up Savage from jamming in the disassembly cut like it used to. Feel like that's probably the reason that the Savage you showed is the only one with visible amounts of grease around the bolt head...

[@shaunparkes6116]

Great video. Minor correction, ROF is Royal Ordnance FACTORY / FACTORIES, of which Fazakarley was one.

[@charles_wipman]

I like the leaf sights but... i guess that could be because my time with the CETME-L.

[@Nick_792]

My friend recently bought a N4 Mk1, it was such a pain trying to figure out whether it was wartime or pre war production. Your videos help but I wish I had these about a month ago lol

[@FordFalcon54]

Hey Ian thanks for another video on Forgotten Weapons

[@PXCharon]

Mine has the smooth sided cocking piece and 2 groove barrel. For being cranked out of the factory a couple weeks before D-day, that's all the shortcuts they needed to take.

[@existential_sad_boi]

I got my hands on a No.4 Mk1* from my grandfather a while back, and this video is the only reason I now know that! unfortunately it has been sportered, but I have plans to possibly get it restored to its full-stocked glory.

[@AnthonyHandcock]

From the days when Hitler was still licking his wounds after Dunkirk (Capt George Mainwaring - Walmington-on-Sea Home Guard - Paraphrased)

[@sebastiandc1392]

Here goes the Meme: "Huh?...."

[@Jayhawkga]

From Dad's Army?

[@douglasturner6153]

That's right! We really kicked the blighters toosh at Dunkirk, didnt we?

[@AnthonyHandcock]

@@Jayhawkga Indeed. Not as good as my favourite bit. Mainwaring: "I could have sworn they'd never break through the Maginot line". Wilson: "You're quite right sir. They didn't. They went round the side". Mainwaring: "That's a typical shabby Nazi trick!"

[@thesheepman220]

They don’t like it up them , the Germans couldn’t knockoff the skin off a rice pudding , lance corporal Jones 😂

[@dcross6360]

That is one durty Lee Enfield!

[@jcmaxie4758]

Hairy Mary! 🐶

[@maximilianocerezo5207]

Thanks for the video. You bring great light into my savage No4.

[@hueypilot1950]

Thank you. I had one of those "property of the United States" Enfield's. I haven't seen it in almost 30 years but I remember all the details you mentioned. I appreciate you sharing the history of these Enfield's and other weapons.

[@egilskallagrimson2048]

Honestly, I'll choose any Last Ditch No.4 over any other Lee Enfield if I need a survival rifle in a post-apocalypse/zombie apocalypse scenario, maybe a Tanker Version (shortened) will be my first choice if have it.

[@jmcr71795]

I gave away my #4 custom "truck gun" (18" barrel with custom muzzle brake, scoped, Harris bi-pod, and camo paint with burlap wrap) to a very deserving person. Didn't actually need it, as I have a #5 (scoped and with a removable cheek rest). I also have 3 other sporterized #4s.

[@ScottKenny1978]

Id want one in 7.62, but yeah.

[@caeserromero3013]

Home guard had pitch forks and broom handles with carving knives tied to the end...and they were the anti-tank weapons 😂

[@stormtrooper616]

I own a 1951 long branch no 4. When I told my local rfd I wanted one, he bought me out to his land rover, opened the rear passenger door and on the back seat were about twenty no 4 rifles. Take your pick was his response. It's an ex Italian navy drill rifle, never fired, I paid £250 for it. When the zombie apocalypse comes, that's my go to rifle.

[@PassiveDestroyer]

I have had 2 No 4 Mk I* rifles. One was sporterized long before I purchased it with a rubber buttpad that hardened over time, and the forend was cut down to resemble a No 5. I didn't look too closely, but it was not expensive. The other one which I still have was not sporterized, but the previous owner, my buddy, really tried to perform "mad minutes" with it. Both were Savage-production, BTW. The rail on the one I still own is damaged at the cut out for removing the bolt, and as a result, the bolt head will rotate while cycling the bolt. It is not fun to shoot when you have to check the bolt head is in its track after each round cycled. I surmise the original extractor spring was ejected during one of his mad minute sessions, where the bolt head had rotated out of alignment, but he ran the bolt home into the breech face. I haven't the heart to sell it, since I don't want to curse someone with a damaged rifle, that also had Iraqi and British surplus fired through it, and not cleaned properly afterwards.

[@ragnaroni]

I own a Canadian '43 and when I saw some mid war British ones, they were covered in the most hideous black paint ever. I'm glad I got one with blueing! Greetings from gun friendly Switzerland

[@ajameslb]

I actually have one of these I bought that came outta Ethiopia. It was beat to all hell (lovingly used) but noticed how rather crude it was. I should have figured it was a last ditch. It shoots beautifully and accurately and is solid as hell.

[@IceWolfLoki]

All those years blaming the Ethiopians for not taking care of the rifle and it turns out that's how they got it.

[@fredbloggs5902]

If 2 rifling grooves were just as good as 5... ...what is generally used globally today? (And why?)

[@thenoobplaysit6923]

It really depends on the gun/manufacturer. From my experience guns with more grooves tend to be a bit more durable/long-lasting when a large amount of volume is put through them. So if you want to put 5000+ rounds through a gun then more grooves would be appropriate. This type of volume is rarely needed with semi-auto guns so it did not make a difference on the battlefields of ww2.

[@dreamcoyote]

I read an explanation on an Enfield group that the 2 grooves are deeper. The gist was, with 5 grooves there is x area around the barrel for expansion. With 2 grooves, they kept the x area the same by making the grooves a bit deeper. That meant that they kept the same pressure and had the same ballistics but did change how the bullet expansion into the grooves occurred (5x shallow grooves vs 2x deeper grooves). It's just what, thousandths of an inch? But the British did testing to make sure it functioned the same way. Two grooves was just for faster manufacturing. Once production was caught up towards the end of the war (thinking US and Long Branch here), they went back to 5 grooves. The people discussing those very fine differences did note different performance with boat tail vs flat ammunition but.. Generally either 2 or 5 groove could be more accurate because of other factors so you can't say outright that 5 grooves is always better (on a 70 year old gun ;).

[@jakemarchbank]

@@dreamcoyote even if 2 grooves is worse than 5 the entire point seems to be that it's easier to manufacture and it's not worse enough that it will be a problem when the main thing that is really needed is to make guns ASAP. Basically we have the men but we don't have guns to give them shit! No point in trying to make tip top engineered rifles when you don't have any rifles to fall back on

[@jfess1911]

@@dreamcoyote The fact the British went back to 5-groove barrels for the post-war No4 Mk2's indicates that they considered it worth the trouble. During the war though, a greater number of functional rifles was more important than fewer optimal ones. I wonder exactly what the differences in accuracy and barrel life would be. I mean, are we talking about 3% or 15%? Were many two-groove models turned into sniper rifles?

[@dreamcoyote]

@@jakemarchbank Agreed, but the Brits actually did a lot of testing/proof of concept in this case. It would be understandable under the circumstances for them to have just made the change and figured it would wash out, but they actually did the design and testing phases before implementing it with tip top engineering despite the urgency. Just the British way I guess ;). The fact that they moved back to 5 groove suggests there may be a slight advantage post-war (possibly with different bullet shapes/powder etc). Requirements change over time though.

[@blackfrost273industries4]

This is one of the helpful videos I am using to identify my Enfield. I love you and content as a whole. You are dare I say, better than engineering explained. As a car guy firstly, this is hard. But I think it's accurate. It's because of people like you both I was able to see and seek them obtain quality assurance position and it fits me well. I rule with the same energy you would critique anyone, as a courteous professional with a love for what they do. It shows you love your content to put in as much effort as you do. "I appreciates that abouts a you (,Katie)"

[@corditesniffer8020]

I enjoy the ease of use and quality of life improvement and modernisation of features of the No.4 rifle but I’ve always preferred the bolt track and bolt removal of the SMLE I always find as a left hand shooter if I come at cycling the bolt of a No.4 at a particular angle the bolt head clamps up on its channel because of the odd angle of force I put on it ( again as a left handed reaching over the gun ) Plus the bolt removal is a little fiddly for my liking when Compared to an SMLE Aside from those minor user grievances I have with it I do appreciate and respect the No.4 rifle

[@normann4016]

Hi, Ian, I owned a Long Branch dated 1953 marked "T" very very well crafted...

[@Trashcansam123]

Ian has mentioned “T” Enfields in the past as being the sniper variant, perhaps that was yours.

[@matthewcraver9917]

I'm wondering if the "blame it on Dunkirk" explanation that's been handed down is actually correct. The rifle in this video, made supposedly in a hurry to re-arm after the BEF lost their weapons at Dunkirk, was literally made two years after Operation Dynamo. By this time, also, production by both Savage in the U.S. and in Canada was in full flight. It just doesn't make sense, even given long leadtimes from design to production, that by this time the RA was still in "We need to rearm desperately, give us the crappiest thing that works!" mode. The British war situation as a whole in July 1942 was far from "last ditch", as well. The U.S. had entered the war and the Brits are starting their ultimately successful defense at El Alamein. The late summer-early fall of 1942 represent the tipping point of WWII, not the lowest ebb as is stated.

[@toddy2519]

Ian, I have a Savage-made, No 4 Mk1*, (marked US Property). I don't know or can tell if mine is birch or beech. How can you tell the difference?. The date mark is either 1942 or 1944, I don't remember which as it's in the safe which is a little difficult to get to at the moment. I also have two bayonets, a cruciform, and blade, which is correct, Ian? The rifle is in very nice condition with the bolt face marked 1 with correct headspace. I've only had it to the range twice to sight it in and from then on has been sitting in the safe (except when I pulled it out to install a scope mount made by Sun). I replaced the flip-over rear peep sight with a micrometer-ladder sight I managed to get from England, cost me about 25 British pounds, not exactly cheap but I like that sight much better. This was approx 30 years ago.

[@tommyc5740]

As someone that has made traditional archery equipment, it never ceases to amaze me how many people in the arms industry are incapable of properly kiln drying wood and waterproofing it.