British Army war games at 'awe-inspiring' German urban battleground

The Royal Welsh have become the first British battlegroup to hone their skills at Europe's largest urban warfare training facility, Schnoeggersburg, in eastern Germany.
Supported by Challenger 2s from the Royal Tank Regiment, the troops from the armoured infantry regiment have been enhancing their skills in urban combat inside the facility which looks deceptively like an ordinary sleepy small town or village.
The infanteers' training mission was to liberate and defend Schnoeggersburg.
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[@peterm.2385]

As a German, used to negative media coverage of Bundeswehr, it is always nice to learn from foreign media about things that going well or like in this case are best of class...

[@thomasmargis9808]

Naja was man wieder sieht, ist unsere deutsche Überakkuratheit und Bürokratie. Anstatt man das als militärische Übungsbauten befreit von allen Auflagen, gelten für diese "Gebäude" zivile Bauvorschriften. Ist doch irre. Völlig überzogen. Machte alles unnötig teuer und langwierig. Völlig unnötig.

[@yoschiannik8438]

We have the biggest urban combat training facility, yet our soldiers have to yell "Peng!" when training becouse we have litterly no ammo

[@djneverblock7300]

@@yoschiannik8438 was für n müll redest du denn bitte? fallschirmjägerregiment 31 hatte letztens ne riesen übung hier in der gegend. bestimmt 50 fahrzeuge. da wurde geschossen ohne ende. halt doch einfach deine fresse.

[@felixalbion]

Germany has a black history but has changed so much and as a Brit it's good to see that our 2 countries are now Allies and work together.

[@selenajohny5382]

Its funny because the bundeswehr had 3 weeks ago one of the biggest Training Operations since birth of the bundeswehr there and no one did even notice.

[@cjjk9142]

Average day in Luton

[@rob_m]

😂

[@RJM1011]

Or Boscombe ! 🤣🤣

[@ilricettario]

Anywhere north of Watford.

[@nickjohnson710]

Really? That's a hella lot more interesting that happens up north....once you seen someone drinking a 9% can or someone sleeping in a shop doorway when you're walking to work you've seen it all! Oh, and seeing the the odd dead body, think nothing of it! .....

[@RJM1011]

@@nickjohnson710 Last year I had a woman tell me Boscombe was better to visit and be in than Exuma. Since then there has been stabbings, six rapes, three murders and one body was found the other week chopped up and dumped all over the place in Boscombe ! Mean while in Exuma it's been beautiful with clean beaches and clean sea water to swim in.

[@8fledermaus8]

Happy to see this cooperation. Greetings from Germany

[@BunnyUK]

🇩🇪 🤝 🇬🇧

[@phnix6242]

Like last time haha

[@polishedmeat6399]

@@phnix6242 looool😂

[@rkaussner]

Excellent and fascinating reportage by Forces News... As a former U.S. Army officer who has trained with both the German and U.K. military, I continue to be very impressed with the quality of both nation's military forces. The U.K. and German militaries both have my utmost respect!

[@djneverblock7300]

really appreciate the kind words sir! sadly the appreciation for at least the german military in its homeland has massively decreased since the 90s...but our boys still do a fantastic job imo.

[@jimmyhillschin9987]

Thanks to the Germans for providing the training area and offering such a good opponent.

[@Fritschepedia]

well, we already did so 80 years ago 😜

[@jimmyhillschin9987]

Haha, yes.@@Fritschepedia

[@faselfasel2864]

​@@Fritschepediabetter they train in Altmark than in Dresden xD

[@BananaRama1312]

@@faselfasel2864 hahhahahhaahahhah syk 🤡🤡

[@OriginalOmgCow]

Germans have been using the British Urban combat facility in Germany for decades, it's very nice that our partners are now doing the same for us. Thank you Germany!

[@carlseddon2392]

I think it's brilliant the way Germany lets its NATO partners use their battle training areas. The German army is a very well trained and motivated army. It's great to see a partnership like this.

[@raymondpoh]

They are NATO just don't understand what's so brilliant about sharing and training together

[@bretth4135]

I think the comment above references the fact that just because several countries are allies or a part of the same international organization doesn't mean that they automatically cooperate/work well together.@@raymondpoh

[@raizenxdd]

NATO is US. We are their puppets @@raymondpoh

[@carlseddon2392]

@@raymondpoh because that's my opinion, NATO work together to defend democracy. Do you love the Russians do you.

[@tomrabe8037]

​@@carlseddon2392You don't have to love the Russians to hate the Jewish Anglo-Saxons.

[@lukedelport8231]

A place like this is great for the army for all units it helps them to gain a taste of what the real situation will be

[@sluttybutt]

Never heard of Imber? I grew up with Salisbury Plain literally at the end of my back garden and would routinely ride my bike along the MoD roads as a kid with armored columns trundling past. Imber village has been used for this purpose for decades and even featured on Top Gear. This is clearly bigger and better featured, but not like there was nothing before.

[@panameraporsche3065]

It is good to hear that Great Britain is practising with us. 👍 Especially in these times, learning from each other is very important. Kind regards from Germany. :)

[@Klausi-uq4xq]

everytime i stayed in the German CTC aka GÜZ (Gefechtsübungszentrum) during Mission Preparing for ISAF, NRF, EUBG it was a blast.. the huge amount of place for training, OPFOR, Sensor based Simulation of casulties etc... Former OR-8, light infantry!

[@polymorphesquirrel]

Great! I love the idea of allied forces training no only cooperation, but also against each other. I hope our soldiers get invited some time in the future, too!

[@paul0gb1]

I visited royal welsh fusiliers as a cadet in the summer of 1990 in Berlin. they took us to Fighting City Ruhleben in Berlin for a exercise. It was a great experience and a great time to be in Berlin as we saw some of the soviets leaving Berlin.

[@Kkkk-cv5wi]

My family lives like 10-15km from there and every time I visit them I can hear the tanks roaring, always amazed by that

[@ndie8075]

Natural allies.....🇬🇧🇩🇪

[@billklatsch5058]

🤣

[@sirbonobo3907]

Together with the frensh WE are really Brothers in blood plus netherlands and scandinavia

[@ara9914]

@@sirbonobo3907 To me all NATO countries are brothers in blood.

[@Im.Nobody.-]

@@sirbonobo3907 genetically, every NATO-Country is a Blood-Brother. (Turkey not so much tbh, they have a lot of west-asian admixture)

[@BananaRama1312]

@@sirbonobo3907 tfyou talking bout france is germanys arch enemy, british ppl are litteral island germans

[@erdbeerkeks8263]

I'm actually stationed there in the German army and I'm gonna be going on a lot of excersises in the future, it's a ton of fun but also very demanding. Sadly I just missed our British allies by a few weeks, would've been really exciting to get to train and do excersises with y'all. Thanks for coming over and greetings from germany

[@michaelneuwirth3414]

The permanent inclusion of Bundeswehr units as "opponents"(3:03) is simply the best form of "re-enactment" that one can imagine! The fact that the British soldiers can't help smiling when they respond to this makes me particularly happy.

[@zhufortheimpaler4041]

its just a regular OP-FOR Unit but with modern equipment. Still they have all the equipment the Bundeswehr has acess to, and thus they can be a pain in the butt.

[@michaelneuwirth3414]

@@zhufortheimpaler4041As a member of the AAA (association for the abolition of acronyms), I want to add: OP-FOR Unit = opposing forces unit

[@rogerrees9845]

Staggeringly real, it seems the best way to learn and acclimatise for the challenges of warfare..... Roger.... Pembrokeshire UK

[@stuartnewman6968]

This is really good for both countries. 👍👍👍

[@robstafford8306]

From the uk. Great to see that the British Military are being challenged, learning and growing in capability. Thank you the German military for providing such a special, diverse and challenging environment. Not a military person but like the similar places in the US they have a group of guys who know the terrain……train hard

[@jububoobaroo67]

The leopard is easy mode, try finding a wiesel.

[@ileftmybody]

You don't find a wiesel, the wiesel finds you. Damn critters! ;)

[@Vatnik_tschistilka]

00:59 Holy cow. That's quiet the area. Easily enough to house like 5k people

[@fantomas5614]

Great !!! Civilized nations must stick together ...!!!

[@dasmaurerle4347]

And where does the UK comes into the game?

[@graceygrumble]

@@dasmaurerle4347 Ooh, get her!

[@RalphBrooker-gn9iv]

Remember Sennelager. That was fairly tough infantry training. There was an intact tower from the 1940s, maybe earlier, on the area which was called Hitler’s Tower as I recall. Sennylager was no-nonsense infantry training.

[@carlseddon2392]

Brilliant Fib training area that. Well done to the Germans.

[@RespectTheGanja]

Has to be one of the most important training

[@chrisburke624]

Now that BATUS is all but closed down, and all the kit moved back to the UK - this seems like a fantastic training area & a lot closer!

[@mrbomplastik]

If its "a bit anxiety driving" it truely must be a good replica of a small German town

[@user-el4mn4dm2d]

Wow thats so cool, great training for you people Also very different saves you doing the same thing when you know the area. N.Z. CHEERS

[@TheFlatlander440]

For more realistic training, half the town should be nothing but rubble and other debris. Most towns liberated in the Ukraine are already devastated piles of rubble.

[@indybruining]

There's an argument to be made that fighting in other places will not have as much rubble. Different factors like better ability to strike opposing artillery and a less drawn out slugfest of a war (more maneuver warfare) would leave more buildings intact. Maybe they could have both areas with rubble and more pristine areas to train in?

[@Mk1Male]

What is your point? This is not about training in already devastated towns. It's about learning to not make them get devastated.

[@markcummings6856]

@@Mk1Malethe point, is a valid point. Realistically, there would be ruble, from a little, to a lot.

[@FacitOmniaVoluntas.]

NATO doesn’t fight like Russia. Russia would realistically lose 90% of their forces before getting anywhere near a city. Their artillery would be vaporized by aviation.

[@TheFlatlander440]

@@FacitOmniaVoluntas. Only if NATO held air superiority over Russia which would be unlikely. Russia still has a very powerful air force to deal with.

[@Rodaportal]

The collaborative effort between the Royal Welsh and German forces in honing their urban combat skills at Schnoeggersburg is impressive! It's heartening to witness nations come together to enhance their military capabilities and understanding. The training area's design seems effective, but adding more 'random' elements like fences, bushes, and cars could enhance realism and tactical complexity for the troops. The mutual learning and training for potential future challenges are essential for a safer world. 🌍💪 Keep training hard, fight easy! 🙌

[@TMFShooting]

Great Stuff💯💥💥💥💥💥💥💥💥💥💥💥💥💥💥

[@phucknuts.7065]

“Gortex til endex “ that young tanky has been taught well😂

[@sabinusrobmarguerite4689]

You work for 40yrs to have $1M in your retirement, meanwhile some people are putting just $10K in a meme coin from just few months ago and now they are multimillionaires.

[@jamesryan8152]

I got an issue any help team or support here?

[@susanmodum500]

Making money is an action, Keeping maney is behavior, but "Growing money is wisdom"….

[@abubakarmusa8802]

The best thing to do with your money is to invest it rightly because money left for saving always end up used with no returns

[@abubakarmusa8802]

​@@jamesryan8152yes you can get helped here🎉

[@atimsamuel]

You are right. Been thinking of going into gold and cyptocurrency

[@craww1990]

crystal maze was sick

[@tommyh4116]

Would make an epic airsoft arena

[@ploed]

Same. But in Germany, it is forbidden to play Airsoft or Paintball outside of Closed Rooms.

[@carlseddon2392]

Looking good boys and girls. That capability is looking sharp

[@neinnein9306]

A side fact: ALTMARK includes MARK. A Mark or Marke was a border area in not-unified medieval Germany (which only came together against major external enemies). A Mark was a large area whose purpose was to serve as a buffer against attacks from the east. A Mark's task was to warn the Reich and slow down the opponent until the main empire forces rallied. Altmark simply means old Mark. And other well-known Marken are Mark Brandenburg (after which came the Slavs) or the Ostmark (East Mark), which is now just called Austria.

[@kodor1146]

Glaubst Du allen Ernstes irgendeine Sau interessiert das hier?!

[@neinnein9306]

@@kodor1146 Schade, dass man heutzutage für ein Geschichtchen drumrum direkt angegangen wird. Vielleicht brauchst du es mal bei "Wer wird Millionär?"... Aber wenns dir jetzt besser geht, dann hatte es ja auch einen Sinn. Schönen Tag noch.

[@kodor1146]

@@neinnein9306 Danke, aber es war mir bereits bekannt, dass die Grenzmarken im 9. Jhdt. gegründet wurden um die von den Deutschen jenseits der Elbe-Saale-Line eroberten Gebiete nach Osten hin gegen die heidnischen Slawen abzusichern. Nur was, bitte sage es mir, hat das hier verloren? Du schreibst das sogar noch auf englisch. Welchen Nichtdeutschen soll das interessieren?? Noch dazu in einem Video, dass mit diesem Thema überhaupt nichts zu tun hat!

[@malte8975]

Auch ohne "Wer wird Millionär" hat mich dieser Sidefact interessiert. Ich finde so eingeschobenes Zusatzwissen nie verkehrt. Danke dafür :)@@neinnein9306

[@Xerlash]

​@@kodor1146ich bin z.B. ne Sau dies interessiert. Wenn du unter jeden kommtar schreibst, der dich nicht tangiert, hast du wohl deine Lebensaufgabe gefunden. Gut für dich :)

[@aran5033]

Look , the soldiers are having fun!

[@ThisGuyAd.]

He had me at the Crystal Maze reference 😂 💯

[@nihil-baxter]

Germany welcomes its ally... We stand together no matter what!

[@ewenmacdonald3262]

lol the way the royal welsh fusilier's beret is sitting on his head made me LOL. 02:12

[@peterh4381]

Made me cry.

[@Anakin_Sandy_High_Ground]

The British Army needs to ban all ‘hat’ regiments from wearing their berets like paras

[@Ferne345]

With what hes saying out of context it really does look like a movie skit or something similar

[@EziPzi]

"The heighth. The depth!"

[@Twirlyhead]

Knowing my luck I would wander in there by accident and set up a squat in one of the buildings. It looks so nice.

[@XxthetanklordxX]

Pretty cool stuff Germany. Love from Poland

[@romeo9017]

And the cooks overlooked once again!

[@funkmachine9094]

that "smuurrrgushbord" looks really cool!

[@SashaBlightWing]

bro dropped a Crystal Maze reference! ahh the memories (":

[@ghostrider19451]

This ,, Village" Looks even more better than any other british once xD

[@indybruining]

This looks very cool but doesn't it seem like the town could be improved by more 'random' clutter? More things like fences, bushes, cars, all things that could provide extra cover for the troops to give paranoid glances at. Very good to see the forces training 'against' each other!

[@swunt10]

It's still under construction and will be finished in a couple of years. some cars, trees, fences will surely be added I would imagine. But right now they are still in the building phase with new quarters being added. I heard an airport and industrial area will be added as well. Some "destroyed" buildings would also be great in my mind since you have to fight through rubble as we can see in ukraine.

[@indybruining]

Ah thanks, i was wondering if it was in construction but i couldn't make it out from the video. And agreed on the destroyed houses being an important addition.@@swunt10

[@alphakevin687]

Let's just use some city in Belarus. Much cheaper. Heard there are also volonteers that want to play opfors

[@tavish4699]

somebody needs to take care of all those cars bushes and bla bla that costs money the town as it is now doesnt cost anything for the next 15 years for sure then they might need new roofs and new tar on the road but thats not much

[@godmode8687]

@@tavish4699 Those roofs will hold for a very long time. Like 50+ years no problem. Main problem I see is that fences wouldnt really stop a tank normally. So either the tanks move through them in training which means a lot of repairs, or they dont which then doesnt add much realism.

[@Mk1Male]

Nice to see the cap badges showing the King's crown 👍

[@innerlight7018]

You're welcome! 💂‍♂

[@jpcrichton2280]

Time for the UK’s Defence Training Estates to up their game. Copehill down and Cilieni village although good facilities are a now a bit outdated and lack scale. More investment needed to enhance these places and make them representative of current theatres.

[@jammiewins]

Love the shot of the guy piloting the surveillance drone 6 ft in front of himself. Obviously it's to get it all in one shot but it just looks so silly.

[@Holdit66]

Interesting that the German soldier at 5:56 says that the British are more flexible and the Germans can learn from this. In WW2 it was the British approach that was more rigid and the Germans who emphasised flexibility and small-unit initiative.

[@theacme3]

you have to read between the lines. He said "here" he is doing counter forces training. He didn't necessarily speak in general. COuld also be that the training the British do is more flexible. not the action it self.

[@patta8388]

Flexibility and small-unit initiative is still an important thing. Down to Squad level. Atleast it was this way 15 years ago, but I doubt it has changed much.

[@djneverblock7300]

i mean, flexibility comes from the ability to adapt to different forms of approach. even tho the german army has some really good tactics there is room for improvement everytime. thats what he is referring to i think. its a thing of respect and interest in foreign warfare.

[@hhhsf4357]

Bet all of those are of a better build quality than our new builds

[@IVAN_ENT]

that quad needs some pid tuning or some new props haha

[@mwnciboo]

Warriors....still...

[@RJM1011]

One of the BEST IFV's !

[@alanmadsen1588]

And how would those tactics work with the planned Boxer replacement for Warrior?

[@johola]

"Schnoeggersburg" is the most german sounding name ever XD

[@polarstorm5986]

The fun thing is, how the brits pronounce it, to my german ears it sounds very scandinavian. :D

[@arozes8324]

i have been there :)

[@timphillips9954]

This just like back home in the Rhondda, Ton Pentre or Pandy. Home from home.

[@chapman9230]

Fochriw

[@peterfeeney721]

I am sure that the TAT will have picked upthe need to train harder in the following areas, the need for which is screaming from the video: Commanders not commanding closed down; Tank killed by an anti-Armour team - because he had no dismounts out doing close protection; No use of air burst mortars to drive the enemy underground while transiting the facility; No anti drone drills, or equipment.

[@sabahtaha1746]

none more.professional than british army. respect fr uk germany and us. love from lebanon

[@MBO_Bama]

CBRN suits, honking

[@al-jw6cd]

and purely by coincidence it just so happens to be a perfect replica of moscow

[@mw9297]

Not just training for nothing, they know what they’re training for.

[@wudruffwildcard252]

A little Red Square would be perfect! 👍😂

[@jhwheuer]

Gosh how many scrapes and bruises I got in Hammelburg…

[@Mishima505]

Why spend money on building a special training area when they just could have used Ludwigshafen instead? Might actually improve the place too.

[@Bob10009]

To make it more realistic, they are going to pound it with artillery, non stop for a month, then sow 10,000 land mines and have loitering munitions and reconnaissance drones buzzing around overhead whilst artillery open up the minute the troops enter the town.

[@takendrs]

Imagine a airsoft event, that would be so fun !

[@djneverblock7300]

there are really really big scenes in germany. private forest areas are used all day for this. especially in bavaria and southern germany in general there are INSANE terrains for this. hills, mountains, trees for hundreds of km^2. you should visit :)

[@Admodeus]

How come they are wearing DPM camo?

[@CupcakePunisher]

Netherlands tried this type of exersise aswell. Did not end well...

[@samuelsamenstrang6069]

how? why?

[@Zatarra48]

I would have never thought that an american serviceman would praise a german site for its size. Its usually the other way around :D You are all very welcome here.

[@gillianaustin5849]

Is it silly to ask if there is coal below that training area? Could that training area use a water obstacle such as a water reservoir? Good use of land could mean multi-purpose. Some coal mining buildings added to said training area and training paused when replenishing seams of coal push upwards ready to mine, and, a water reservoir added to help agriculture and nearby townsfolk. My Regards Mr. Dominic James Austin.

[@Hurricane2k8]

There is no coal there. If there was any, East Germany would have extracted it because it was heavily reliant on coal for their energy production. In the east and south-east of the GDR there was coal, which was extracted in huge surface mines, most of which have been turned into lakes in the last 20 years. Actually, I've been swimming in one of these lakes just today.

[@gillianaustin5849]

Thankyou for your reply.@@Hurricane2k8

[@dargus1718]

Even if coal would be there the green lefitst from West-Germany would go on a hunger strike to prevent any type of mine.

[@godmode8687]

Dual purpose is hard. It any rare species start to live there for example, chances are good the entire training area is put into question. So its better to keep it as close to pure military use as possible, if you dont want some judge to rule that its not a nature reserve or something like that. And coal? Its not there, and even if it were, not worth it to start new mining operations. Even existing ones will be closed in the coming years.

[@bollewillem1]

00:35 for a Brit it looks like an average town. Imagine what an average British town looks like.

[@ziomal7538]

monster zero ultra so based.....

[@maxsoon1097]

Training grounds

[@rasin9391]

literally my hero academia training area

[@maxb5957]

Max was here

[@oskarprotzer3000]

Glad we are working together and letting our friends use our training grounds. Anglo-Saxons back training in Saxon :D *Welsh soldiers may not be Anglo-Saxon but you get the joke

[@balintnemes6774]

Imagine the amount of birds that will make home in those empty structures. An unintentional animal sancuary.

[@zozita.]

❤👍

[@perryedwards4746]

Pip Pip!!

[@latch9781]

Interesting how many were wearing DPM and DDPM

[@RJM1011]

NBC gear ! Loads of it made just as well use it.

[@Surv1ve_Thrive]

NBC/CBRN

[@renes9966]

I was also wondering why they were wearing the old style DPM camo. Can someone explain it in layman’s terms?

[@RJM1011]

@@renes9966 They are NBC suits/gear thousands of them have been made just as well use them like they did in Salisbury a few years ago with the poisoning problem there.

[@Surv1ve_Thrive]

@@RJM1011 yes

[@richardtodd6559]

Great place for airsoft tournament

[@dieterdodel835]

Nope, only real men get entrance!

[@georgegeorgakopoulos5956]

These professionals accumulated a lot of experience,send them to deal with russian convicts now.

[@Rohnski]

Anyone know why some of the lads are wearing DPM?

[@MalumZeth]

CBRN suits.

[@RJM1011]

NBC gear ! loads of it made just as well use it up.

[@garagenigel]

Time travellers!

[@phnix6242]

Schnüggesburg? Cant be real

[@mykolamykhaliuk]

Light fpv drone comes from around 5km and boom. They are not ready for new era war. Unfortunately.

[@prechabahnglai103]

Maybe to simulate urban combat, some area to represent an after shelling city rubble would be nice. Not real destroyed buildings of course, those I suspect wouldn’t pass the German regulations.

[@johncrichton4341]

The UK had these resources but the tories cut the funding and closed them all other than Hythe...

[@emilsinclair4190]

Honestly countries specialising is much more resource effective.

[@jpcrichton2280]

And Sennybridge, and Salisbury Plain, and Otterburn, and Dartmoor, and Longmoor, and Swynnerton, and Caerwent, and Garelochhead, and Cape Wrath and all the other Defence training estates that are all over the UK. There are loads of training areas of different scales. We should actually look at reducing some of the smaller less relevant areas and reinvest the funding into some of the others and make them far more usable.

[@andrewevans6172]

A bit bigger than tin city, that I remember

[@cthree87]

Do they train with mines everywhere, under heavy shelling and FPV kamikaze drones coming through the windows? Seems this would be the new normal

[@MajinOthinus]

Mines everywhere and heavy shelling is essentially only in Ukraine because both sides are doctrinally stuck in WW1.

[@L1m3r]

Square miles?! That can't be right! It's in Germany so it must be km² I'm sure. ;-)

[@IGotBoergs]

Bro of course our training facility is called schnöggersburg… It‘s like letting an American come up with the most cliche German city name he can imagine

[@FrontlinerCdV]

Might've been an inside joke to troll both English and French speakers which do really bad with the pronounciation of our words.

[@marcromain64]

The name wasn't made up. The village of Schnöggersburg existed there until the Nazis relocated the inhabitants and tore everything down to build an artillery training area.

[@Gevea11]

How times have changed. I was in the army when counter terrorism was our mission. Our Army trained to fight terrorism. When I went to training our simulated villages looked like something out of the middle easy. Our OPFOR were guys who wore traditional wear. None of this is prevalent in today's basic training. Training has slowly transitioned from a counter terrorism based mission, to coventional. The US does no see our future wars being fought from village to village, versus a bunch of guys in their traditional islamic garb.

[@user-zi4mn6tf1e]

I think the British should really have a regiment dedicated to purely Gorilla warfare, as that seems to be the most fighting we do in a war now.

[@USDAselect]

Guy at 3:18 sounds like the late Stephen Hawking.

[@weirdough6254]

Defenders of Schnöerkesbörg, rise!

[@cas1652]

Lessons from Ukraine: 1) Buildings don't last very long and most fighting happens amongs ruin and heaps of rubble. 2) Tanks explode when they get too close which means they function more like short range artillery. 3) Your doctrine needs to account for and utilize drones or you'll lose, badly.

[@MajinOthinus]

Especially the first part is not really true. Buildings last quite a long time actually. It's just that Ukraine and Russia are currently essentially reinacting WW1, mostly because neither side has sufficient troops, doctine or training to do anything else.

[@cas1652]

@@MajinOthinus if it was NATO fighting Russia it would look similar except less infantry and vehicles and instead more artillery, bombs, rockets and mortars. The buildings would turn into rubble even faster.

[@MajinOthinus]

@@cas1652 No. If it was NATO fighting Russia, it would look nothing like now. NATO is capable of and chiefly geared for war of movement. We would see massive tank, vehicle and infantry formations, far larger than anything seen in this war, breaking through the front at a speed that doesn't allow for the systematic destruction of buildings. This environmental destruction in Ukraine happens, because both sides there are incapable of wars of movement and just throw artillery at the enemy to cause losses.

[@cas1652]

@@MajinOthinus the front in ukraine is mines, anti vehicle ditches, anti tank barriers and trenches top to bottom. If you assaulted this with massive vehicle formations the result would be heavy losses. Unless you flattened everything before hand. QED This is not to say russia stronk or whatever. I actually think there wouldn't be much direkt fighting, just artillery strikes and bombs until they are either dead or give up.

[@MajinOthinus]

@@cas1652 No, you would not, or rather NATO would not. Iraq literally did the exact same thing as the Russians have done, it didn't help them. You break such defenses by way of massive combined arms tank assault. You do not win a war or even a battle by methodically destroying every single enemy unit, that's WW1 tier thinking; you win by breakthrough and encirclement.

[@TibyanRasya]

I'm Rasya i'm from indonesian 🇮🇩

[@TenOutOfTenIGN]

This could be rl backrooms level ngl.