Buffy the Vampire Slayer Reaction | S3E17 | Enemies

[@allisonlussier248]

If you rewatch that library scene, Giles thanks the demon for coming to him and for the impressive light show. Presumably, the mayor summoned the demon, and the demon went to Giles to give him the heads up because he owed a debt of gratitude.

[@fiddiehacked]

That's how I've understood the scene. It also underscores how many experiences Ripper Giles might have in his backstory.

[@wacky_uncle]

got it....right...makes the most sense.

[@bernardsoul5186]

Yeah, it seems like a very lucky coincidence, but if Giles has his ear to the ground in the demon underworld, he was bound to get lucky eventually--just think of all the other times somebody schemed with the demons and he didn't hear about it. The part that doesn't make sense and seems to be just written for the audience is Buffy and Giles hiding the plan from Willow and Xander

[@jala1551]

The timing with the demon's death was suspicious, as well as the detail of Faith knowing her way around the demon's apartment too well (knowing where the light switch was, etc). It made Buffy suspicious, and then Faith coming onto Angel the way she did was also suspicious since they had JUST discussed the risks of sleeping with him POSSIBLY making him lose his soul... So Buffy suspected. And then when they summoned the guy who did the light show, he reached out to Giles to let him know what was going on - debt of honor and all that. From there, they had what they needed to put their plan together. This is one of my favorite twists in all of Buffyverse

[@wacky_uncle]

It was a great twist...completely surprised me.

[@peterd9698]

6:40 Yeah Im not sure on the timeline of this one. How about this: * In the Demon's room, Buffy notices Faith seems to know the location of the lightswitch. * Buffy talks to Angel after Willow tells her too. They put some stuff together and wonder if faith is up to something. * They go talk to Giles, who tells them a contact (that dark mage guy) has given him a heads up about the Mayor reaching out to him.

[@wacky_uncle]

that seems to be the consensus...

[@dennicaid7682]

I think this is my favorite episode of Season 3. Every time I hear that "Second best"... CHILLS.

[@wacky_uncle]

It totally got me! really good one!

[@migmit]

Back in season 2 Xander already called it a “Scoobie gang”, in that episode when he and Cordy first kissed, “What's my line”. Originally Faith was supposed to kiss Buffy on the lips. The network vetoed it. And no, sex is not incidental. Nobody was saying that. Everybody was saying “it's not JUST sex”.

[@gungho1284]

He absolutely could have had sex with Faith because it would not make him happy. Just the opposite and he'd feel bad. He would consider it betraying Buffy.

[@wacky_uncle]

Got it...really? dammit....I thought that may have been the first time. I don't recall the xander one.

[@wacky_uncle]

exactly...good point.

[@wolandbegemotazazello]

Actually, it is quite clear. The magician came to Giles, who he owed a debt of honour, and told them of the mayor and Faith’s scheme. This visit, of course, tipped him off to Faith’s covert operations. Giles got togethr with Buffy and Angel and they concocted this little show. As Angel said, he, not Faith, is the word’s best actor.

[@wacky_uncle]

Ahhh that makes a lot of sense...for some dumb reason I was thinking Giles contacted the magician first and set up the mayor....which makes no sense. Thanks!

[@reneeg9406]

10:29... They probably wouldn't 🤷‍♀️ but Giles knows Xander well enough to know that question would be the easiest way to shut him down 🤭

[@wacky_uncle]

Right lol!

[@leesmith9299]

the magic dude went to giles off screen after he spoke to the mayor knowing he would be involved.

[@wacky_uncle]

Ah yes...someone else suggested that....I think that's likely.

[@leesmith9299]

30:27 no, the mayor is just mistakenly thinking rumpy pumpy with any lady would give him a moment of true happiness but we know better. the only plot hole there is the mayor claims to be a widow who loved his wife dearly. you'd think someone like that would understand the difference between sex and making love.

[@wacky_uncle]

That's a good point. He did come off as wise in the ways of love there for a second.

[@StephenRansom47]

This whole Faith arch is SO Anime, I just can’t … This show, it’s really hard to explain the vibe; captured public interest like nothing else … all groups, demographics, and movements hopped on the Slayer’s Bandwagon. It was UNIFYING. 🤷🏼 different times

[@wacky_uncle]

Interesting....I remember it being out and some friends watching it back in the day but kind of naively scoffing about it...little did I know....

[@becca1189]

Emotions aren't rational. Knowing that Angel was acting doesn't keep Buffy from feeling hurt. Seeing Angel intimate with Faith also feeds on the insecurities that we heard Buffy talk to Willow about earlier in the episode. Insecurities that Buffy & Angel didn't have time to hash out because of the Faith/Mayor drama. ❤🧡💛💚💙💜

[@dennicaid7682]

Not to mention that Buffy has to have some significant trauma from the whole Angelus arc in season 2 still lurking in there - this time I specifically noticed her facial expression when Angel grabbed her arms and said something about how "there must be some part of me deep down that still remembers and loves you".... that was so similar to the scene in the high school hallway where she said that to him and he said "Dream on, schoolgirl, your boyfriend is dead" and then slammed her into the wall... the pain on her face was very real.

[@wacky_uncle]

Very true...though Angel is pretty adamantly in love with Buffy as Willow points out.

[@wacky_uncle]

Yeah that was great scene to re-watch....knowing what was really happening.

[@Buffy8Fan]

Great episode. Great review.

[@wacky_uncle]

Aw thanks!

[@leesmith9299]

i enjoyed the heck out of that reaction

[@wacky_uncle]

Hey Thanks!!! Appreciate you watching it!

[@mithroch]

I don't think the sex is incidental to breaking the curse... but I don't think it's the only part. Since Faith and Angel didn't get it on... we have no way of knowing if it would have worked... but I suspect it's not that simple.

[@wacky_uncle]

I agree...probably a combo of love and sex to get happiness.

[@RedundantHuman-CandyBites]

They’ve said it a few times “a moment of perfect happiness”, not “s€x”. It wasn’t just Angel having s€x, it was s€x with Buffy. At least that’s how I’ve always interpreted it.

[@ernesthakey3396]

And not even the moment of it, but later, waking up beside her, feeling only happiness. The other characters in the show are unreliable narrators, some of them think it's just the sex. But Jenny's uncle, the one who was most likely to know, put it best. “Vengeance demands that his pain be eternal, as ours is. If this - this girl - brings him even one minute of happiness. That is one minute too many.” ―Enyos Angel's guilt plagues him constantly, which is why he broods so much. Physical release isn't always pure happiness. In fact, most of the time it probably isn't, even though it is hopefully very pleasurable. But for a moment, he woke up next to the woman he loved and was happy... Now, it is certainly possible that such a moment could happen during sex. It could happen during other activities too. So I'm on board with the idea that just being around someone he loves could at some point cause a relapse. Also, there's no way Angel did it with Faith. She might have been grinding on him, but he wasn't enjoying it, even if he was taking it.

[@RedundantHuman-CandyBites]

@@ernesthakey3396 ⬆️ 💯% agree with everything you wrote there above 👆🏼👌🏼👍🏼

[@wacky_uncle]

I agree...and I like the reference to the unreliable characters. That's certainly consistent...to think that the others would think it is the sex.

[@dennicaid7682]

@@ernesthakey3396 Also Jenny's uncle: "Angel is meant to suffer, not to live as human. One moment of true happiness, of contentment, one moment where the soul that we restored no longer plagues his thoughts, and that soul is taken from him." The gist of it is, he was so content after making love with Buffy that his guilt for his past left him alone for a bit... and *bam*, the curse broke.

[@ernesthakey3396]

@@dennicaid7682 exactly! I was unable to find the full quote, thanks!

[@Lpace3]

Plot, shmot., I just loved this episode because of the increasing presence of the mayor. Golly-gee-willickers! A psychotic bad guy who needs miniature golf and hand sanitizer. Never seen anything like that before.

[@wacky_uncle]

I do think I started to like the mayor's character more...and sadly...faith's character a little less in this one.

[@wacky_uncle]

well...not her character...which is great...just what she was doing was kind of a drag.

[@ShadowThundercat-u1e]

Huge cool points for your violent femmes shirt, dude.

[@ShadowThundercat-u1e]

And i think it's kind of a sex with your true love thing, since angel has been a vampire for a couple hundred years and im thinking he fucked fairly regularly. But there's who the fuck knows what special connection between angle and Buffy, so something and whatever and magic.

[@wacky_uncle]

Excellent! lol. Was re-listening to them recently and almost had forgotten how great they are.

[@Lpace3]

Arrghh! One of your last statements hit me hard and made me laugh. I so much want to say something but don't want to spoil it for you in any way.

[@wacky_uncle]

Lol...no please....no spoilers. I'm intrigued...I'll find out eventually.

[@larissabrewington9065]

I think the awareness of Faith working for the Mayor happened during Faith's first visit to Angel in the episode. I think that after Buffy saw them together, she came back to the scene and didn't exactly confront Angel, but he told her what happened. We know Faith is rather sexual and that is pretty much how Angel is meant to lose his soul. HOWEVER, at the top of the episode, he tells Buffy that it's nice to just feel. So, sex isn't all or it. He has to be 'happy' or have feelings about the intimacy. Faith and the Mayor don't know this part of it. I think Angel put it together and told Buffy that Faith had tried to seduce him to get him to lose his soul... but why? And they then just assumed it was the bring Angelus back, but I don't think they cemented exactly what for at the time. Buffy went to Giles. Giles knows the Mayor is powerful, and obviously supernatural, so he assumed that if Angel didn't lose his soul naturally, the Mayor would outsource. He's done it in the past with Mr. Trick via Ethan Rayne. When Buffy and Faith visit the demon's apt, Faith turns the light on, like she knew where it was, and without looking, like she'd been there before. Buffy saw that. It's SUPER subtle, but I caught it the first time. (It's like when she grabs Buffy's arm in the library --which isn't as subtle-- and it tells us something's up.) I think this sorta cemented for Buffy that Faith was up to something. I do wish the scene where Oz mentions that the Mayor is hundreds of years old would have come sooner. I think that would have been another hint. Because at the end of that scene Giles tells Buffy to be careful in a "our plan needs focus to work" way... I think Buffy and Angel think that they can just be together without real physical intimacy, because that's their interpretation of soulmates. (Angel is old and romantic, Buffy is young and despite showing duty maturity, lacks life maturity) But I feel that the writers understand the impracticality in situation by throwing hints that they too find this to be ridiculous. I think Buffy gets upset or spun by Angel's fake intimacy with Faith because she knows that he could be physical with Faith, and feel nothing still be Angel, but he cannot be intimate with Buffy and stay sane. Deep down, she knows this is NOT doable for life... Side Note: Eliza Dusku said that she was kissing David B after the transformation scene and kept getting cut by the teeth. She was actually kissing, with tongue and all. So she told the director, "I keep getting cut." And he asked how, and she told him...the kissing. She said he looked at her oddly and said, "You aren't supposed to be really kissing...with tongue. Are you kissing with tongue??" She said that she was so embarrassed. She said it was because she was new and no one had ever explained that you don't do that! Meanwhile David was in the back somewhere giggling because he wasn't ever going to correct her...

[@wacky_uncle]

That's a funny anecdote lol....and I think your analysis is likely the situation...

[@reneeg9406]

That's a dirty trick to not teach her😠😠 I'm disappointed in David for that 😤😮‍💨 although.... can't really blame him, but still 🤷‍♀️

[@larissabrewington9065]

@@reneeg9406 He had a reputation for constantly trying to take his clothes off on set of Buffy. Back then, you know, before MeToo, people just laughed it off. But he was always a little problematic. He also had sexual allegations brought against him by someone from Bones. And to be honest, I'm kinda surprised he was able to bounce back after all that.

[@killianlpc]

Enemies was a super episode where the arc of the show kept building towards Graduation Day. Again we see Faith kill the Demon in cold blood, as Angel had said previous once she had the taste for killing she would not stop. The twist with Angel pretending to have turned again to Angelus was superb. Faith realising at last what she is up against is brilliant. The build up to the finale in S3 is incredible. All is gradually being revealed with the Mayor and Faith against The Scooby Gang. The second half of S3 is really when BTVS became a stellar show! Man you gotta watch the last two together if you can, two stunning episodes for The Finale.

[@wacky_uncle]

Actually I was thinking about making the reaction be a two parter....i think you just convinced me of that.

[@reneeg9406]

​@@wacky_uncleyes please do. Some episodes it's killer to wait between.... This is 1 set.

[@lenr112]

Buffy saw Faith reach for a hidden light switch in the Demon’s apartment. She realised that it was Faith’s handiwork and Faith had been there before. That’s where the connection to the Mayor came from.

[@wacky_uncle]

hmmmmm....I'll have to re-watch that.

[@Emburbujada]

I don't know where people get that Buffy notices Faith turning the light on, she really doesn't seem to. That detail is just for our benefit. It's really just the guy going to Giles to tell him about the Mayor's plan, because he owed him one. Anyway, such a good episode. I love that we're kept in the dark. If you rewatch, you notice how David played Angelus just a little bit off, because he's faking it =)

[@wacky_uncle]

Yes I get it now. I was kind of thinking Giles contacted the magic dude first...which is definitely wrong.

[@lukeleia7616]

It was Giles from a few episodes back who said Faith wasn't a good liar. If Giles suddenly gets a dose of, oh Faith is now redeemed, that would be the stretch. All in all I bet Willow went to Giles and spilled the beans that Faith was trying to snag Angel. Since Giles also knew Faith doesnt respect any guy she can play then presto, why is she after a good Angel. Ding ding Mayor possible connection.