Can we DIY ultra efficient UFH with a heat pump?

This is an experiment to see if we can build an extremely energy efficient underfloor heating system with a DIY air source heat pump install. Our hope is that you can learn from our experience.
If you found that interesting consider supporting us by getting something from our Ko-fi shop: ko-fi.com/flow...
Useful references:
MCS heat loss calculator: mcscertified.c...
MCS heat loss calculator guide doc: mcscertified.c...
Urban Plumber's video that shows how to calculate UFH pipe and flow
rate to achieve a certain delta T : • Step-by-Step Guide to ...
This is the source of the graph at 09:55 it's also a good article about UFH pipe spacings: heatpumps.co.u...
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[@guyhawkins557]

Great to see someone else exploiting the benefit of multiple short loops with close spacing. We went a bit nuts with 3000m of pipe with all loops less than 50m length and very close spacing. The pros laughed at us but with good double insulation we heat the house at 22deg with water input temperature of 24 deg.

[@affieuk]

What was your spacing?

[@guyhawkins557]

@@affieuk Spacing was 50-75mm, but crucially the pipe lengths are kept short, less than 50m per section, so lots of manifolds! If you have an idea of your insulation levels and volumes, along with the external temperature range, then you can calculate the required pipe length, spacing, and corresponding input temperature requirement iteratively. One point to note with small spacing is that you need to ensure the shap is strong enough to avoid cracking - we used a fibre-reinforced shap so no issues with this aspect.

[@affieuk]

@@guyhawkins557 Thank you. Did you go for larger pipes? I think in a heat geek or urban plumbers video there was a suggestion to go with larger pipes, up to a limit, to improve efficiency.

[@pppjunk]

@@affieuk I used 20mm PEX pipes instead of the usual 16mm, spaced every 100mm. Flow rate is high, I'm using low temperature water (25°C) so the heat pump runs efficiently.

[@affieuk]

@@pppjunk Thank you. I want to focus on efficiency but, me and my family prefer a cooler home so getting this down would be great. Would be interesting to know if people are running their heating at 19-21°C.

[@tjwatts100]

Wow. That's a more professional install than the professionals!

[@Asdayasman]

Professionals only have to care until the paycheque clears, (or warranty expires). If you live there you have to care for your whole life.

[@raytry69]

Professionals works for money in least time possible (usually). Owner works for quality.

[@xxwookey]

@@raytry69 Which is why it is so frustrating that govt grants are never available to DIYers directly. All of FIT, Green Deal, RHI and BUS were/are only available to professional installers.

[@gnillut]

"the only true skill is patience" That is a fantastic way to look at it! And true in so many ways!

[@ComplicatedStuff]

Wonderfull quote and so true for many projects 👍

[@timbrown9305]

Your understand of thermal conductivity is critically important. Even the way you checked for the coverage of the adhesive shows your competence. Very well done and enjoyable to watch.

[@xoso599]

For the labeled pipes that your wrote on, I'd strongly suggest making tags and either laminating them or putting them in plastic bags and attaching them to the pipe. Ink on paper is more visible a long time in the future than writing on a a pipe. I say this with experience working maintenance in a hospital build in the early 70s and having to try and figure out pipes running all over. Someone made tags using a typewriter and it saved us so much time. We later updated the tag in the bag with plastic medallions that had the info carved into them and then had a contrast filler put into the carved out letters so they should last forever.

[@FloweringElbow]

Good thinking :D

[@CURZONDAVID]

I bought an electricians printer from Screwfix, brother make, the labels are printed and topped with a protective layer.

[@IgorPellinen]

Surprisingly quality video. Keep it up, man! You're living my dream, I'm lacking of DIY and small but own detached house. Hope getting there soon. I see many commented on extra insulation inside this wooden floors but I don't think it will really matter until you'll face like less than -10 Celsius outside. Would be great though hearing about your winter experience next year with all the numbers etc. Thanks in advance.

[@Hichamhasan]

Greetings from France, I don't usually watch 45 minutes videos on a normal speed, but I kept attached to the very end :) , I have no technical opinion, but I'll say that it was mesmerizing video, I congratulate you on what can be considered an out-of-reach achievement for most people like myself who are unable to complete projects of this magnitude themselves.

[@FloweringElbow]

Aww wow, thank you so much Hichamhasan. That means a lot to us - it's loads longer than our regular (ok I mean previous) uploads, so a bit of an experiment. Really pleased that at lease one person got through it :D Thanks again, Bongo & Sam.

[@laserrooster]

Your absolute dedication to seeing issues in your flow and trying to remedy them is both admirable and mirrors my own. Watching a lifelong learner learn is a honor.

[@meb07ch]

Your knowledge and ability is amazing, where have you learnt these skills? Plumbing, building work, flooring, just knowing what materials are needed before having to use them! Mind is blown.

[@Evergreensands]

Wow, what a ball ache, doing all that work...but it looks supreme...top job and very smart. Awesome 👌

[@woodennecktie]

the grant for having it installed is almost everywhere that what you get from the gouvernment goes straight in the pocket of a plumber who follows his path of good enough work. and thats a lightyear from the work you both achieved , kudoos !!!

[@philmccracken2012]

What an awesome project very impressed with both of you! Thank you so so so much for not putting annoying music in your video. Seriously, thank you.

[@Supanova7G]

Great you shimmed the heat pump level. If they are out of level then the fan bearings will fail earlier than they otherwise would and become noisy.

[@dylanevans5644]

Was gonna say this. Saw a series on Skill Builder where an out-of-level heat pump had caused the fan to turn into a noisy beast. From my understanding it makes a huge difference to the lifespan of the bearings.

[@toastydave1]

When I heard that from heat geek, it sounded like a bloke in the pub said it statement, it make no sense at all.

[@MrGentlebutfirm]

May I challenge that statement? This is absolute not normal for fans to be that sensitive to orientation in other applications. If the rotor itself is balanced - that's important - I would be surprised if if meant anything to have it completely level.

[@jimr2053]

I agree with the other challenges. But this may have come from a shred of reality though not related to this installation. The fans on the wall mounted indoor units of common mini split systems have long tangential blowers. These normally have no axial load on the bearings and maybe have marginal thrust bearings. If they are out of level, side to side, then there will be unexpected axial loading. So, to another comment someone in a pub overheard the words mini-split, out-of-level and noisy fan bearings, and ran with it.

[@pmbpmb5416]

I presume you mean the rotor being balanced correctly in the factory, or is it possible to adjust this afterwards. Forgive if it’s a stupid question I am getting to grips with everything related to installs with no engineering base .

[@GlenS123]

Your the first I have ever seen do custom boards, but I LOVE the idea. Makes me want to get a bigger CnC...

[@perw12345]

And the great Cymric scrapyard wizard returns. That looks like an incredible amount of effort, but seeing the results makes it all look more than worth it, that's a lovely little cottage you've restored there.

[@davelowe1977]

I installed wired underfloor many years ago in my man shed. The subfloor was chipboard with the wire laid on top in a 5mm thick screed of powdered rock salt, with the finish floor laid on top. Sodium chloride is an exceptional conductor of heat. It acted as a heat spreader and 24m2 worth was about £5 (sold in 25kg sacks as path deicer.

[@pulporock]

I do this for a living. Excellent job, extremely well explained. Cheers from Oz

[@chrismorrish130]

Thanks for this. What a brilliant job you've made of it. The care, patience, range of skills and attention to detail are amazing. Really interesting to see a DIY heat pump install. No gas safe or f-gas certification required for heat pumps with R290/propane I guess.

[@biomagic8959]

sweet baby jesus, the amount of patience to make all this with your 2 hands! bravo sir

[@spencereaston8292]

Added in floor radiant heating 10 years ago to a 150 year old house in the US New England area. I am so glad I did. Warm feet makes winter so nice. I use it as primary heat and it works well down to -35C,colder then that we're stuck at 20C without extra heaters. We run it off a 100k BTU on demand water heater.

[@FloweringElbow]

Fantastic!

[@GiannisKaralis]

very nice work, i like you describe the internals of heatpump all correctly!

[@julianmills9954]

Hi, Like your CNC UFH process, I used 12mm ployplumb pipe at around 120mm pipe centres and no more than many circuits of 40m to ensure we have good flow rate. The 12mm pipe was held in position/spaced by strips 12mm thick MDF 110mm wide leaving 12mm gaps to fit the pipe into. The whole lot was covered by 0.5mm thick galvanized steel sheet to further improve heat spreading. The finish floor covering is laminate, our existing floor is wood T&G with a 100mm Kingspan. All is currently running of a gas boiler at 35deg flow temp, will move to a heat pump at some point, Keep up the good work.

[@FloweringElbow]

That's really interesting. I like the method, and no CNC required! Good luck changing over to a heat pump- sounds like it will be ideal at 35C flow...

[@swecreations]

It's interesting seeing this catch on elsewhere outside Scandinavia, here our 16-year-old house has under-floor heating powered by a ground-source heat pump.

[@lescooper4720]

I did my floor 21 years ago with 16mm Unipipe. 3 x 100 m Loops over 50mm cellotex, then 125mm concrete + 200 x 200 mm Dennis Ruabon quarry tiles. I still love it. Whan I did it, there was so little info available, but I knew I wanted to switch from gas to heat pump at some point. I think that will happen quite soon. Thanks for a really great vid. I couldn't agree more about "approved installers"!

[@ComplicatedStuff]

Good call about not including the hot tap water. I’ve tracked my energy consumption for hot water for my heat pump installation, and compared to the energy consumption of heating it’s almost nothing. Just not worth sacrifying a lot of space for a boiler and doing large investments for. Contrary to what installers and ‘professionals’ want you to believe. Keeping it simple is also worth a lot for reliability.

[@markthomasson5077]

Depends if you like having baths!

[@ComplicatedStuff]

@@markthomasson5077True! I don’t have a bath. But if you do, and have kids it might be very different.

[@CURZONDAVID]

Really interesting point. The rated efficiency of the underfloor heating within a ASHP system that incudes domestic hot water … might be the sweet spot of ASHP then !

[@ramsaysg]

blimey was just thinking yesterday we hadn't seen you for ages

[@FloweringElbow]

hello :D

[@CelataForCongress]

So freaking awesome! And heat pumps are so freaking cool! I'm designing my own geothermal unit myself. Maybe one day I'll start making them for others. Love the efficiency! Great job keep filming!!!

[@psuu1]

Great build. I understand finishing up the loops on your birthday, what a great gift! I've never seen writhing on the floor in a positive light before, I now aspire to heated floors someday!

[@FloweringElbow]

hahaha. Writhe baby writhe!

[@Caxaho]

I thoroughly enjoyed all 45 minutes of this video. Amazing stuff! It has encouraged me to get on with my woodworking project!

[@MarkSpohr]

I installed UFH using a product called Warmboard (in the US). It's thick plywood subflooring with channels for tubing routed in. The bonus is that they stamp a piece of aluminum sheeting into the top. This aluminum sheet spreads the heat from the tubes. Love UFH with air source heat pump!

[@MichaelJ674]

I’m looking at WarmBoard, too! No way I have the skill or patience to do all this myself 😊.

[@SwimBikeRunFastest]

I loved that video. Great perseverance and attention to detail. I did mine 15 years ago, and it still works perfectly.

[@StephenBoyd21]

I thought that I’d fallen asleep and woke up 6 months earlier. Welcome back, long time no see.

[@FloweringElbow]

Thanks Stephen :) Been a touch busy.

[@techheck3358]

a water tank would pay itself off if you have a tracking electricity tariff like octopus agile - you can heat the tank when energy is cheaper without necessarily heating your rooms, then the heatpump stays off when electricity is more expensive - that said, would require a lot more configuration to make it work just right. either way, great job on the install you two! first time coming across your channel and i like what i see ☺

[@FloweringElbow]

Hey @techheck3358, thanks for watching. Yes, we are on an Octopus tariff and attempting to configure our usage to the cheap spots. The thermal mass of the cottage (has some concrete internal walls as well as the solid floor) is helping to ride the peak times quite nicely. Yes, it's the space that is the main constraint with the tank. Phase 2 is to get some solar up and running...

[@techheck3358]

@@FloweringElbow awesome! cant wait to see :)

[@jibcot8541]

They said space was the main factor, didn't want to lose 15% of thier living space to a water tank.

[@Felix-st2ue]

People tend to overestimate how much energy you can store in a hot water cylinder. Unless you push the temperature really high it's not worth the effort. And if you push the temperature you loose efficiency. In the end it's better to either use thermal mass of the concrete and the whole house or use battery storage.

[@Hellsong89]

As master tiler, that is rather impressive result for a amateur. My advice would be yes use the gap sticks or what ever is your preferred method to control the gaps even in floors, even if the building education states its to be used on the walls only. Never understood why cause you can then concentrate to first of all have no air pockets below the tile cause that increases chance... certainty of tile snapping later on. Secondly you can concentrate to keep things level, producing higher quality end product, though running the gappers, does increase costs both material and time lost, but for me it has always been worth it. Personally i like to use string to control the gaps since you can get it cheap, its useful for other purposes later on, it gives larger control surface so if there is any abbreviation with in tile dimensions or some sort of texture, it evens it out and lastly its both easier to remove and prevents partially the mortar from coming out between the tiles if you press it against the strings while with slight movement press down to its final position and level, instead allowing it exit from open sides of the tile layer you work on. Also when ever running piper, radiation heating or what so ever that gets hidden under something, mark it both into drawings with accurate measurements on the scene and not theoretical ones, marking on what point the measurements was taken cause if someone adds insulation inside that changes the dimension and also on the surfaces that are next to it or come over it. For instance to walls below the baseboards, under the door board etc, where there is possible to locate it while doing renovations. This way next guy can find spots where not to drill or screw that causes damage. Its little thing that does not take much time but can save someone lots of time and head ache.

[@TheCoooool123]

You could drill holes in the board that was creaking and and inject epoxy that cures solid and you'd create supports that would elevate the creak and ensure it never comes back without having to mess around lifting the board back up

[@Thedar561]

I did it in my floor before and drilled and injected with spray foam, it worked wonders drilled in different spots and injected a few squirts, the floor was solid after it

[@grumpychops8113]

Hurray!.. Flowering Elbow are back... :)

[@daver9571]

What an incredibly satisfying job, well done!

[@BobHannent]

As someone who's just moved house and is wanting a heat pump, I wish I could hire you to make a custom heated sub-floor! This is amazing.

[@davideyres955]

You could have tried blowing air into the extraction area. Have a look at how the flymo garden vac works. Can’t remember the aerodynamic principle but if you are blowing air on the outside and the suction is at the middle will also help cool the bit. You effectively have an air out of the vacuum so you could capture that. Personally I think you are the best of British bonkers doing this. Fantastic work. New sub.

[@bikerchrisukk]

If I had a CNC machine, I would totally do my own UFH channels....I'd probably end up making a bath too😆 Thank you for sharing your UFH info 👍

[@FloweringElbow]

@@bikerchrisukk thanks for watching, I wish I had room to make a bath! Maybe an outdoor one, one day...

[@fredio54]

Thank you for putting this interesting video together for us. I learned more than a few things that I need to know for future projects. Great to hear your voice and see your warmth (no pun intended) again, too. Not to mention the awesome CNC machine making a welcome comeback :-) love that thing!

[@FloweringElbow]

Hey Fredio! Great to hear from you, you are so welcome! Thanks for all your encouragement :D

[@markthomasson5077]

Definitely with you on hot water. It pains me that most systems you end up wasting four times as much water as you use! I have an under sink unit similar to yours. It just about copes with the washing up. To start i switched it off overnight, but realised it is so well insulated you can leave it on 24/7

[@NickLaslett]

Fantastic video. Great job, very impressed. You did the right thing avoiding the MCS grant. You might have been able to split the £5000 with the installer, but there is no way you would have got all of it. The MCS would force certain things, which would have conflicted with your analysis, like how to interpret total heat loss, forcing you to have a larger heat pump. I did my own UFH and ASHP install.

[@FloweringElbow]

Hi @NickLaslett. Thanks for watching and great to hear from a fellow DIYer that we aren't entirely mad! Yeah, the heat pump is still slightly oversized as the cottage is so small and we couldn't find a smaller heat pump that seemed convincing. We'll see what kind of SCOPs we get from this first winter...

[@justinstrik7125]

Thank you ! In the Olympic games of home improvement and general "making" you and @NewYorkshireWorkshop are both worthy of Gold! ( not sure what his farming skills are like...)

[@mattsan70]

Towel Rail was exquisite! Very steam-punk-esq. Couldn't help but wonder about mice etc getting inside the heat pump - they love chewing on wires. The bottom seemed quite open to me. Excellent video as usual - well done on the progress - look forward to the next installment:)

[@FloweringElbow]

Appreciate that Matt. Yeah, mice are quite the destructive force at times, I suspect they could get in there (with difficulty). Will have to keep an eye out for signs. Was considering making a short (more like 10 min) video of the towel rail build, have all the footage, but need to find the motivation/time to make it into a video... Thanks for watching. Peace.

[@mattsan70]

@@FloweringElbow definitely make that video I bet it will end up being one of your best watched.

[@klausnielsen1537]

Rodents hardly ever enter heat pumps because it's noisy, cold, damp and unpleasant in there. Ex. Installer experience.

[@DidGTakeOutTheTras]

maybe in the coming months or early next year you could DIY or install a water treatment along with water heater? I have plenty of videos to watch for construction techniques and processes, but I'm sure the project will be coming up or you may want to test your skills... I'm loving your page for my own construction understanding and you present an excellent process to problem solution architecture and DIY home-renovations.

[@eirenwhelan3312]

Really apriciafe the effort you’ve put into making the video, on top of all the effort you’ve put into the house. Please please keep it up, you’ve immortalised your graft and it’s fantastic to see your workflow. Makes me want to get my own hands onto a project asap

[@FloweringElbow]

Thank you very much, great to hear :D

[@davegeorge7094]

Much more expense/trouble than forced air but you get continuous quiet heat luxury and a the coolest utility closet.

[@fredflintstone7715]

I learned to mill effortlessly using advice from you

[@FloweringElbow]

lol, you're doing much better than me then!

[@BurninVinyl]

Man, a lot of compliments to you. You really have golden hands like it's said in Italy. Cheers!

[@joshuadelisle]

Nice work 👍. I'm bodging a very simple version myself and testing a proof of concept using a diesel heater. Cheers J

[@g_glop]

Skipping the accumulator tank was a good idea because for an inverter heat pump it's always more efficient to produce the lowest heat possible as constantly as possible, which exactly matches underfloor heating.

[@nvanderhoff]

Do consider modulation range and minimum runtime at "higher" outside temperatures

[@vman2kay]

Love the floor rolling about at the end :D Great video and another channel to subscribe to as well!

[@FloweringElbow]

@@vman2kay welcome aboard!

[@britzwickit]

lovely work, the house looks beautiful already

[@antoniiocaluso1071]

GREAT storytelling (and job)...from an old N. Italiano ECOhome Designer/Builder in SW FL, USA 🙂 I can FEEL the wonderful Energy in your work here!! sub'd/liked, to see the rest! buona fortuna!

[@erikowren7894]

If you ever need more of that dusk shoot bristle material you can also order a door sweep. It works great. 👍🏻

[@YippeePlopFork]

Great to see another video from you! Hope you're well and having fun! You're getting close to winter... I know you know that time is against you to get the cottage ready before the really foul weather, so if you need a hand let me know. My daughter and I are just down the M4 from you (Henley on Thames).

[@FloweringElbow]

Hi @YippeePlopFork. Thanks so much for the kind offer. We are in and nice and warm so far, but we'll keep it in mind for future projects, it's great to have more hands on deck when things get really crazy!

[@Aphova]

Loved this 👌 Made me start to wonder how much of my own renovation I could actually try do muself!

[@amwphotos]

Excellent video as usual, and a brilliant job youve done too. Weve got an ashp to radiators, its great, installed by a good team, but still isnt anywhere near as thorough an install as you've achieved. Top work!

[@nak_attak]

i completely forgot about this channel but buy am i glad i subscribed

[@FloweringElbow]

appreciate that nak_attak :D

[@Pav_1983]

Thank you, it just shows that DIY still wins. Quite often ASHP installation by 'Pros' is extremely overpriced, and doesn't work that well!

[@jamesg2987]

Properly impressed. I've gone biomass on my build. All wet underfloor heating though

[@David_11111]

just found your channel... so impressed with your working. now I need to watch all the others :)

[@FloweringElbow]

Welcome aboard David. Thanks for watching :D

[@manic_tinkerer]

Nice, I did this myself too, twice so far. Both times similar to your system, but instead of grout boards, just ziptied the pipe to the reinforcing mesh and poured grout or concrete on it for downstairs, its not moving once that's gone off but you have to remember to water fill it before pouring or it pops the surface with bouyancy. Upstairs first time round we put trad insulation in, then multi foil insulation to form a trough between the beams on top of it, then screwed pipe clips to the beams and clipped the pipes in. It gave out good heat, but not much inertia upstairs and difficult to give a constant temperature without the control compensating constantly, compared to downstairs because of the lack of heat storage in the floor. Second time round we ran radiators upstairs and ufh water pipes downstairs in the slab from the same heat source with mixer circuits and arduino monitoring to provide the different water temperatures needed. Your grouted boards seem far too sophisticated and a lot of work for my get it done quick slapdash style so I can get back to working on fun stuff instead of houses, but some of the UFH companies offer pressed thin alloy plates in a similar way to disperse the heat more effectively in upstairs situations. Could be really cool to route out some chipboard, then use a bearing burnisher in the spindle to replicate these using the chipboard as a negative mould to press into on your machine. As you have a jcb, did you think about gshp in place of the ashp? they're a bit more efficient when its really cold I think and you can use them to cool the house in mid summer (not sure you have as much problem with this in Wales though).

[@FloweringElbow]

@@manic_tinkerer thanks so much for sharing your experience. We'll see how we go this full winter, in terms of the upstairs, so far it has been promising. Wood floor is, like you say, not going to hold the heat as well, but the ambient temp of the rooms on cold days is perfectly fine with the hp going 👌. I guess water hols a fair bit of heat and that circulates through the downstairs slate... Thanks again 😀

[@dinendale666]

I’ve just done my bathroom floor with 12mm UFH pipe , I manually routed the 12mm channels with a mini router in chipboard over 50mm PIR.

[@FloweringElbow]

Good for you friend. I don't envy you the hand routing, but for one smallish room I bet you finished the job quicker than I would have ;)

[@JackButlerVideos]

Always enjoy your videos. thanks for taking us along!

[@FloweringElbow]

Our pleasure!

[@johnmcclane4430]

For what seems to be a first time project the result is pretty clean. Would have routed the pipes a bit differently but it may not matter much with the small footage. Either way nice job.

[@JoshuaStringfellow1]

Only watched the first part of it and skimmed through a bit more as I'll watch the rest later, so might embarrass myself if you address this later in the video, but I am a bit concerned that you're routing the pipes in the chipboard without a heat spreader, and then have wooden flooring on top - that's likely to have quite a high tog rating and wont perform as well as typical underfloor heating installed within a screed, so if you're using that as a basis you might be in for a shock come winter. The concrete bit looks better, although the aluminium doesn't run underneath the pipe which would be ideal. Hopefully the system performs well and I'm just being a pessimist, certainly amazingly impressive work! Edit: Finished the video and looks like my concerns were misplaced, phew, great work!

[@FloweringElbow]

Thanks for watching. Your concerns aren't entirely misplaced perhaps. On the solid concrete floor the alu does go under the pipes but it isn't fully continuous, there's a small gap, probably not ideal, but couldn't find anything better. The suspended floor, well it's an experiment in cutting down material use without using a spreader. We're thinking of trying a few experiments with the bits we haven't skirted yet with taking out the underlay and trying just a straight spreader over the top of the pipes. For curiosity. So far, though winter hasn't fully arrived, results are seeming quite promising as it is.

[@wimoweh]

I've missed this "Hello, friend!" by far too long! Welcome back!

[@FloweringElbow]

Hey, thanks :D

[@markottaway6899]

Great video, so many things I want to know more on, so I shall check out your other videos. On the subject of hot water tanks, Heatgeek designed one that can fit inside a normal kitchen cupboard, as new houses dont have an airing cupboard.

[@danielseddon3177]

I did a similar project, but routing channels in to XPS insulation with a hot knife. Afterwards I slotted aluminium spreader plates in to the slots afterwards.

[@chandreshvarsani2190]

Great video and well done. I guess one of the main benefits of using an approved manufacturer ASHP installer is that you get extended warranty of upto 7 years+ e.g. Vaillant Advance and this can sometimes cover the controls also for the same time period. 🙂

[@FloweringElbow]

Great point!

[@K44r31]

31:22 True. Getting perfect fit takes a lot time and patience.

[@alxace]

I find this statement to be true to all jobs, not just woodworking or laying floors. Luckily my wife knows by now that everything takes 3 times longer than expected or planned initially. It took me about 5 years to make her understand, but life is a lot less stressful now that she finally does :)

[@DIYBuilds]

Yey, you're back! Great project.

[@FloweringElbow]

Hey, thanks!

[@LesNewell]

The commercial UFH boards often use wide, quite thick aluminium tape laid into the grooves. This helps spread the heat out over the board, giving better efficiency and more even heat. You could also lay tape over the pipes after installation. When I was looking into doing this myself I found a few suppliers on eBay that sell heavy duty aluminium tape. Edit: I see later in your video you use insulated boards with aluminium foil. The same sort of foil on the chipboard would work well.

[@FloweringElbow]

Agreed, and at the time I ummed and arred about it. In the end couldn't find any wide tape with any reasonable thickness to it. And time was ticking... But yeah, if I could do a re-do...

[@barrettabney]

@15:20 you declared the room, done. I laughed because the memory of my wife reprimanding my daughters that they couldn't "done" their food popped immediately into my head. Ahh, the memories of our youth.

[@MacLimitRange]

Considering that radiant heat/cooling do under floor, need specific insulation under the cement deck and self levelling cement on top, good job! That how not to do a radiant heating.

[@DooMMasteR]

Doing the heatpump setup without a tank is also more efficient if you want a tank. A 270 L hot water heat-pump is just ~1700€ and the pump is more efficient at higher temperatures so it makes sense to just separate the circuits at that point anyways. Their lower overall capacity also allows you to use them to cool a storage room, dry a basement or use the heat of the roof that collects in an attic (even in winter). I would however always provide a way to at least exhale the cold air to the outside, in areas where it can get below 0°C.

[@moconnell663]

16:35 I love that cute little flat expansion tank. I don't think i've ever seen one like that over here in the US.

[@NicoSmets]

A new floweringelbow video. Exciting!

[@simonyapp]

THIS IS A GREAT VIDEO, pleased to have found you :)

[@FloweringElbow]

@@simonyapp welcome welcome

[@Saminvent05]

Great to have you back Stephen.

[@gary_glover]

Thank you for sharing! Really liked the comment about patience @ 31:30. Reminded me of James 1:2-4. Also loved the chat gpt observation! Haha

[@FloweringElbow]

Hey friend, thank you, that's nice to hear: I very nearly cut the bit about chat gpt, thinking it a bit indulgent, in what was already a very long yt video. Thanks again :)

[@andrewb6]

Good video! Thank you! Should you be so inclined, an update video, after the coldest months are past, might be a good one. If you can get your neighbors data, a comparison of costs might be interesting, too. That could become apples v. oranges, but there still might be some good info there.

[@runejonassen3893]

34:46 What a beautiful color.

[@dunkfordyce]

Glad you're back friend!

[@stinmw4621]

wow, masive amount of work. Well done

[@FloweringElbow]

Many thanks!

[@dtec30]

Congrats on the job very complex

[@mumblbeebee6546]

Good to see you! Tidy project, loads of work, congratulations!

[@FloweringElbow]

Thanks 👍

[@alanbain5779]

Ive installed this style of infloor heating in a residential house. In a commercial space I think its great. But in a residential home..... the pex pipes expand and contract as the hot water flows. The home owners describes it as the marching of the Ants as the hot water starts pumping through the system. the pipes make a noise as they expand in the routed channels. Not very loud during the day, But quite loud in the dead of the night

[@FloweringElbow]

@alanbain5779 Hi there, thanks for sharing your experience with this. I must say we have not experienced the same... Perhaps because the whole system doesn't run above 35 degrees 🤔 . Either way, it's completely silent except at the manifold where you can hear the water being pumped round.

[@jaanush]

Here in Sweden we have under floor heating using heat pumps everywhere. You have got some of the concepts wrong. First you use small dimension pex piping and combine that with very tight spacing. The latter I guess has to do with trying to achieve better heat spread. The way we do it is using thin inexpensive aluminum heat spreaders that wrap under the hose and fit in the fiberboard slots. That combination gives high throughput, less hose and very good heat spread.

[@jaanush]

Another tip is to heat the pex pipe with a hot air gun for sharp bends to avoid kinks.

[@x_ph1l]

That was quite a big project. Awesome!

[@hypothalamusjellolap8177]

Nice, I would have tried sand with 3/4 to 1 inch thick cement tiles. That CNC is heavy duty, make some intricate door patterns, vaulted ceiling, gothic door with massive ring to knock on the door. Maybe use ethanol with distilled water in the pipes as anti-freeze instead of glycol.

[@thomasl2974]

Laying underfloor heating seems to have changed a lot since 2004. I laid our underfloor heating in a 12 cm concreate slab downstairs with floor tiles everywhere except in the sleeping room. The heat conductivity is excellent. Upstairs the underfloor heatings is baked into two layers of floor plasterboards with strips cut out between the pipes. I intenianally left quite much room for the pipes. The ”grooves” were filled in with tons of cement based tile mortar and normal mortar. I don’t remeber the mix ratio but i think it was well over 300 kg of dry mix. The layers of boards were then secured with screws. The the heat conductivity of the top most board is much worse than in the concreate floor down stairs but still good enough. The climate here is so that the coldest days are -30 C. The insulation both in the walls are what you nowadays almost would call a passive house but not completely airtight. The heat curve is set so that it pumps max 35 degrees at -30 C. That keeps the tempreature inside easily around 22-23 degrees. Most of the heatloss is through the windows and the mechanical ventilation although it has an heat exchangerfor the winter months. We warm the the 210 squaremeter house with a geothermal 2-8 kW inverter heatpump. The well gives 7 degrees in the autumn and goes down to 3-4 degrees when have the true winter temperatures. Good insulation, floor heating and a heatpump is the way to go especially when buildning a new house. There is a high investment cost but with the energy prices we have today, and also for the envronmental reasons it is worth it. As we have some own forrest we top up with some fire wood heating for the cosiness factor. With the geopolitical situation and the risk of frost damage wood burnining is also a good complememt.

[@FloweringElbow]

Hey friend, thanks for watching and for sharing your experiences. Sounds like you have a great heating system, and can be super cosy in winter :)

[@thomasl2974]

@@FloweringElbow Up here in the north the heating system is a higher bragging factor than what car you drive. The firewood pile design and execution really shows if you are a man. Google pictures for vedhög or polttopuupino and you find some samples of how to stack the firewood to impress🙂

[@miscbits6399]

"Shop Vac" is your problem, as you've said. What you want is a woodworking dust extractor (which are much the same price)

[@revotrades3020]

impressive. more professional job than a pro. punn intended.

[@silverpl1]

The challenge here is that for the efficient floor heating, you need large heat capacity. Wood and wooden plates are an isolator. It's not that it won't work here. It will, but heat is not going to be well accumulated in the floor. In other words, if you have a wooden floor, it's batter to use traditional heaters or electric floors heating. In the case of water-based, this heat must accumulate somewhere, and the best is cement/concrete floor with tiles. I have this solution in my house, and my heat pump operates on 35°C at most and heats the whole house (over 250 m2) very, very well while operating on ideal heat pump range. During spring and autumn, water temperature is even lower (it scales automatically with external and internal temperatures ), and like 25-27°C is enough.

[@christophersmith108]

A beautiful job, and fascinating to watch the process. Would it have been much easier if you had one of those vacuum attached handle gizmos when preparing and tiling the floors?

[@FloweringElbow]

Hey Christopher, thanks :D It might have been useful for the upstairs - I'm not sure how they grip to the surface of chip board (anyone experienced?). The chipboard boards are 2.4m long but narrow enough that they are not too difficult to carry. I doubt it would have been any good downstairs, because the 6mm cement boards have a grid like pattern on then that would prevent the formation of the vacuum, and the slate tiles were riven, meaning the surface was not smooth so would probably have the same problem. It may have stuck to the aluminium layer on the overlay boards, but then they were very light and small enough to handle. I imagine something like that would have been very useful with the kitchen worktop though! Thanks again, Bongo

[@Iceeeen]

Verry nice to se a diy under floor heating. The basement really looks perefectly done. 🙂 But laying the pipe in just boards without heating sheild under is big no no. You loose a lot of efficeny and need to run a much bigger flow temperature, not really noticeable in "mild" weather. But when temperature drops to double digits bellow freezing it is. Just ripped out a firends floor due to just this miss to correct it

[@TheHuntermj]

Try a bouncy castle inflator as a dust extractor, they are really cheap and give a great deal of airflow!