Can YOU help identify these wooden flutes??

Over a year ago I bought a couple of old wooden flutes from eBay. The listing was vague and the photographs were even vaguer! They also smelled absolutely terrible- so I've waited a long time for the smell to go away before making a video about them!
The thing is- I don't know what exactly these flutes are- where do they come from? How old are they? What specific instrument are they? (besides flutes, of course!)
I've asked some experts, but no-one seems to agree on just what these are. But i'm sure there will be plenty of people who know all about these flutes- so I've made this video in the hope you might be one of them!
Can you help identify the mystery flutes?
All I know is:
A lady left them behind when she emigrated from the UK back to her home country over 50 years ago.
The flutes both have 6 finger holes with a 7th hole under the single key.
They seem to be made of hardwood.
Both flutes are in two pieces.
Find me on Instagram: @claythorpemusic
Thanks for watching :)

[@baroquewinds]

They’re both 19th century English military band flutes. They’re in the key of Bb (as in all holes closed is Bb) and D but likely much higher than A440, maybe A455 or so. The larger one is probably cocuswood and the metal will be nickel. The other looks to be stained boxwood and the warping certainly would suggest that. £50 is about what they’re worth, they’re very common and not usable in any kind of ensemble due to the high pitch. They could be restored somewhat easily if you wanted to, I’d be happy to give some advice on how to do so. They are often erroneously called fifes although they are not. TL;DR British military band flutes.

[@ttaibe]

What's the difference between these and fifes pls?

[@rreagandebusk633]

These are just different terms for the same creature. “Fife” comes from the German word “pfeife” which just means pipe. Band flute is the English name. Here in the US it is just fife. A fife is a smaller version, most commonly in the keys of b flat (used for military music) and d (more commonly used for folk music) of what people these days call an “Irish flute”, which back in the days before the Boehm flute was invented was called “German flute”. Fifes are always transverse. If it isn’t transverse then it will be a whistle, flageolet, or a recorder. kzbin.info/www/bejne/bYa0gGeNhcdpapo

[@ttaibe]

@@rreagandebusk633 ty.

[@marcusmicksch]

Mmmmh, delicious! You can really imagine the last mold come creeping out through the airy sound at the end. I give you 5 out 5 stars for "Playing the moldy wind instrument"-category! :D

[@joegroves2517]

Happened upon your channel while starting recorder and looking at different instruments and quite enjoyed your videos. Hope you're still enjoying music!

[@Saffiji]

Fifes, hardwood. You can use waxed thread or even dental floss to fix the joint. If there is mould I would not recommend playing. You could use surgical spirit, oil with almond oil once completely dry, but any sign of mould don’t recommend getting it in your airway

[@Scottyp1100]

Yes, the best place to find waxed hemp thread is from a bagpipe supply store. I’m also of the opinion they are fifes but I’m not familiar with the extra brass key. I have a fife but it’s one piece with no brass key.

[@baroquer]

@@Scottyp1100 Same here - I own a very similar top quality ebony(?) KEYLESS military/marching fife. Alas, no any markings, who made it

[@kelanth462]

Well... They're very decorative...? Maybe super glue a magnet on them for the frig?

[@ryanadrianh]

They remind me of baroque flutes/traverso, 6 finger holes and one key, except piccolo sized. As someone mentioned one way to know what it is... is to actually play it... covering all 6 finger holes and raising one by one should give you a D major scale (Pitched one semitone lower if in baroque pitch aka A=415) IF it were a baroque piccolo. I've never read of folk instruments of having keys. In the renaissance transverse flutes had 6 finger holes, no keys, and a cylindrical bore, and could not play a full chromatic scale. Baroque flutes was when someone (Hotteterre I think) added one key (the Eb key), made the flute into a conical bore (head joint is cylindrical, but the body joint tapers towards the foot) and could play full chromatics. Baroque flutes tend to be made of different woods and the sound quality changed with hardness (i.e granadilla vs boxwood). Plus the blow hole looks baroque-ish, oblong, oval-ish I want to say that those flutes are from the baroque era, judging by the bore, number of holes + keys, the blow hole, the cork + threads. Also comparing my traverso with the shorter of the two, the finger holes seem to be more or less equal relative to it's size I don't recall Hotteterre making a piccolo? Maybe it was Grenser or Rottenburg or the other flute makers of the period. I'm stumped at 10:00 when both were held up. Seems like the on on the left is longer? Might be because they're different pitches. Different keys I don't believe since the consort for traversos are usually piccolo in D (one octave up), Flute in D (At pitch), Alto flute (fourth lower), Bass (one octave down) . At the same time baroque piccolos are quite rare I believe.

[@richardsmith5249]

We had a very similar instrument languishing in the sideboard drawer when I was growing up in the North of Ireland, 60-odd years ago. It was referred to as "the piccolo". Northern Ireland had and still does have a strong tradition of marching bands. The only way I could get a convincing sound out of the thing was to blow sharply and aggressively across the hole. It's not a drawing-room instrument.

[@Scottyp1100]

There’s a site called lark In the morning that has some antique flutes and they have one very similar to those. It says circa 1860 and they want 250 u.s dollars for it.

[@1anatiti]

Are there letter marks under the keys? If there are, maybe googling "Flute key marks and makers" can be of help

[@MagSanJon]

I was cringing the whole time. Thanks for sacrificing yourself for musical science/history. 😂

[@1anatiti]

Look at the second flute at "The McGee-Flutes Research Collection"

[@gaynorandrews1684]

aw hun. they were totally gone. did you complain to ebay? such a shame. how dare they advertise them as good condition..... I'm so sorry for you. but thank you for posting. it's really important to show people things like this for them to be on their guard against bad sellers

[@AnotherGenericChannel]

Baroque Piccolo and flute, easy enough to find people that will make a replica of those piccolos (for a lot of money...). First search for me when I search for baroque piccolo on here brings up a modern replica of that piccolo. The flute, not sure. Could be a wider bore, higher key, both. One keyed-flutes.

[@Jesuswinsbirdofmichigan]

S T O P ! 08:13-08:20_ eye yam Rollin in laughter. Great audio enhancement! Now, back two the shoe,.

[@Jim-iw1yd]

Lauren more than happy to help you out on this one. These are neither flutes, fifes or any other such like instruments held out to the side and made of wood. These are ancient and practically unknown "Pirate whistles". .Played by often one legged eye patched Pirates on a happy merry eve after a successful bounty grab of a hefty booty . . . God bless them, though the devils more likely their friend. They can't be played and were never meant to be, it's a kind of ironic twisted joke that Pirates like to play, them and their bitter way's. If them Hearties and the ships crew do not dance to their bad music then it's curtains for them, in the dark of the night. It was known as a "Rave by Dave" - inspired by Davy Jones himself no less. Talk about grudges, "go figure" as The Pittsburgh Pirates might say - who incidentally changed their name to "The Steelers" . . . nice one, . . ironic . . ., subtle play on words. The mildew isn't mildew by the way but Pirate halitosis scrapings , little particles of can't be destroyed Pirate breath. Actually they liked to breath on most things as it worked as a highly effective anti theft device. Again the irony, Pirates think eveyone are of their ilk and can't be trusted. Glad to be of help, burn them is my suggestion . . . I know, a terrible thing to say about a thing that looks like a musical instrument , but hey Pirates being Pirates do such a thing, "Down with the Ensign up with the Jolly Roger ". It's a thing of the night, a darkness discomforting , a tuneless wonder of a black soul made flesh. And on that cheery note I'm of to wet my "whistle" with a little rum or two. Aye Aye me Hearties splice the mainbrace . . . glad to be of help.

[@tacovanderwaal5252]

Well, I think with a little practise and a LOT of airing it could be playable. Did you try flute oil? A good marinade in that may be beneficial? Buuut judging by your choice of words and general handling, you really really do not love them :-) The joint could be made a bit better with some sticky tape? Not very delicate perhaps, but work with what you have

[@gaynorandrews1684]

tried a museum? tried Sarah team recorder?

[@ogcontraband]

I hope you left a bad review/comment for the seller, that's dishonest rude selling there.

[@Jesuswinsbirdofmichigan]

Sew much eye waa'nah say! 6:20- we're stopping just to comment. Great use of add-ons/forgot their proper title.

[@mantistoboggan2676]

Im pretty sure Ive seen irish flutes similar to the larger one but Im unsure.

[@rolandscales9380]

The moral is not to trust Etsy or eBay. There is a strong chance that the vendor has no idea whether the instrument is any good - or might actually be dishonest. Wandering off post... Warning: there is no such thing as a cheap hurdy gurdy, and if there was, I wouldn't buy one from either of the sites named above. There are some prolific vendors, one based in China and another in Oregon, USA, who turn out the most frightful old rubbish: expensive firewood, in fact.

[@theunconciousmind7314]

Hello i have got a question. I have bought 2 jacaranda wood native american sounding flutes. They look almost exactly the same buy sound completly diffrent. 1 has a much more airy but also more penetrating soynd, while the other one has a much clearer sound, but i think much less highs. How could you identify the quality of each flute?

[@ПавелАнуфриев-т5р]

От запаха флейты можно обработать хлоргексидином (Chlorhexidini bigluconas).

[@mantistoboggan2676]

Youre so funny haha

[@ralphminervino9686]

Your flutes would be hard to actually identify without a stamp or number on them..Of course I’m sure you know how to get the keys with a tuner.. I have 2 of these old flutes and I cleaned the insides of with linseed oil with one of those green non abrasive kitchen scrubbies on a flute cleaning rod which worked well.. one of mine was coated with some kind of a black substance which I remove with linseed oil and lots is elbow grease ( I think using a scrubbie… The wood underneath was beautiful, don’t know what kind of wood.it is..As you probably know, all these old flutes are made of hardwoods because they are denser and resist moisture..Have fun!

[@seanslavik]

scary!

[@victoryinhim9689]

😊😊😊😊😊😊🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉.

[@percyp9069]

I cannot deny that your videos are good, however, you don’t look at the camera lens, only your own image in your viewfinder. This gives the impression that you are looking over the viewers shoulder. It can be disconcerting. This is a critique, not an attack.