CAPCOM MATH: 2+8=5 | New Capcom Cup rules changes hitboxes forever

Hitboxes are now required to have 2+8=5 / U + D = N. What does this mean for the competitive scene and hitboxes? I try to break this down for beginner and intermediate players and explain exactly what this means and how inputs are parsed by the game.
This video was recorded March 30, 2023, and may have since been updated.
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00:00 Intro
02:08 Explaining input handlers
05:28 Non-FGC Examples
06:41 FGC Examples
11:39 Enforcement
15:11 Nerfs from this change
17:39 Buffs from this change
21:11 Neutral changes
22:22 Final Thoughts

[@Hotdogvendr4life]

ty for establishing a new, irrefutable standard for evidence: can it be demonstrated in among us?

[@YohosieFGC]

the among us index of input priority

[@genuwine21]

I updated my mixboxes (even though it has no effect for me since I can't hit up and down very easily at the same time) and I like that the firmware updater for Brook came out very fast and still allows for switching to non-tournament if you want to still use the previous cleaning by running the update. I know you didn't cover it, but I found it weird that Hitbox the company made a huge deal out of not wanting the standard to change when the other 2 major boxes are complying and working on getting firmware updates pushed out (although they do both use brook boards so it isn't so difficult). You are probably right that new titles will likely follow Capcom's lead. It makes sense to have one standard across all the titles at an offline event since there will be multiple games played. It also helps that Capcom has a very large prize pool further incentivizing players to update.

[@leoryzap]

love the presentation of this. thanks for the update

[@darth-umbrex]

This is a great socd for dummies video. I have a strange solution to socd if you press and hold left then press right it will continue left until it is released and vice-versa.

[@publickip]

well presented video, glad this exists to educate folks

[@bucketradio502]

9:58 that was so real of you

[@RiverWilliamson]

Lots of nuance, thank you

[@manutdfan231]

Thanks for this! I definitely have a better understanding... Though I'm not even a pro so this problem doesn't apply to me. I switched over cause I'm tired of my poor thumb hurting on pad lol

[@poggakage57]

I mainly play hotbox because I wanted a jump button and I wanted to have more control over what I am inputting (my dp input for strive was 236236S on pad. Now on hotbox I socd to do 623S). I don't mind these changes at all I just wish I didn't have to switch my controllers output between GG and SF6

[@redmagebr]

The intent behind GG is to also have D+U = N. The game has its own SOCD cleaning which turns any SOCD into neutral, so if they felt like they could make rules, the rules would be either "just send everything and let the game handle it" or "make it neutral like the game does" - which is kind of what Capcom did right here. imo, this is probably what will follow for every other fighting game, using CPT rules is just very convenient for TOs. If their SF5 wasn't a broken mess, they'd probably have done these rules to begin with (SF5 was weird in that it treated down+up SOCD as "up", but it treated Left+Right as "Forward", which was far too smart and something that shouldn't be).

[@poggakage57]

@@redmagebr whatever people decide as long as I don't have to do anything is fine by me. Seems like neutral sodc for 8+2 opens up more things than I thought. More options I'll never use :)

[@jaynyc154]

Thank you

[@MrDangerMoss]

this is gonna be interesting seeing who still shows up to cpt events

[@bigbroitachi4434]

Great vid

[@Kiumbra]

the title for this video is so great

[@JFLunch]

You know what I found funny? DBFZ interprets 8+2=2 Devs definitely knew what would happen to 22 inputs. If the Capcom ruling becomes standard this buffs my characters SO HARD it's not even funny

[@Ratel3000]

This only applies to Street Fighter. 360s are easier than you think if you aren't required to hit the diagonals, but you're right about 720s. To do a 360... Slide your index finger across the 6,2, and 4 buttons (Right, Down, and Left). Tap 8 (up)+attack.

[@servebotfrank4082]

It might make tiger knees easier in some ways (not stuff like 6239 but that's not really a thing anymore) since a very common input error for tiger knees is hitting up way too early and getting 239 instead of 2369. However with neutral SOCD cleaning you would never not finish the quarter circle.

[@YohosieFGC]

In most games 8236 and 2369 is the same thing because of jump startup, but any tk installed grounded moved will be slightly harder. BBTAG and UMVC3 has this, but gear doesnt

[@theoidums2085]

On the flip side i kinda agree with the rule but then again let people play with what ever controller they want to use at the end of the day skill will carry the good players forward but what do y'all think😊

[@YohosieFGC]

I am indifferent, some hours I am OK with the rule, some hours I am not OK with the rule. I sit at, "I think I'm fine either way, let's just talk about it differently"

[@theoidums2085]

@@YohosieFGC yeah tru that But then again Tekken tho Hit box makes wave dashing in tekken a little bit easier for me i dont know about others but from what ive heard other tekken players say the same

[@shockZ146]

Will shortcuts for DPs be affected? For example, I DP by holding 6>4+2>P. Thank you for the in depth explanation about everything else. This is very useful.

[@YohosieFGC]

It should not since you're not doing 6~2+8 (639)! but I'm not sure that shortcut works in sf6 regardless. I don't use DP shirts so it's hard to say, the brooks update is available if you'd like to test yourself!

[@Ratel3000]

The 6,3,9 uppercut will self clean to 6,3,6 causing the shortcut to still work. Also, defense against overheads that don't cross-up will be easier, as you can just hit up to block.

[@christianpr5]

Nice video! You said they can't do this software side but couldnt they just made it so the game doesn't register the Up input until 1frame or more has passed?

[@YohosieFGC]

It might work but it would be extremely janky. You can move from 2 to 8 in 1f in some situations

[@Gameup2332]

does this affect online play just for a normal player

[@YoTerrako]

U won’t heart this I love u and I’m so glad there’s more representation in the FGC❤

[@doifu]

I was tested it yesterday.I think I like it because I play zangief 720 is very easy than before.dash 720 is very very easy now.

[@justice8718]

On neutral box?

[@2frikinbeast]

Boxers rise up

[@bunnybreaker]

Capcom needs to take some actual responsibility and do the SOCD handling in software. Controllers should send raw inputs and have no say about cleaning. MVC3 allowing both side blocking on stock controllers was the height of Capcom oversight 🤦🏽‍♀️

[@Jadinass]

Why is nobody talking about first hit wins? To me that sounds like the most obvious method if the goal is to nerf leverless.

[@YohosieFGC]

Thought about this, would need to test to see how it interacts but seems like a decent idea

[@justice8718]

I don’t know about “solutions.” It would mess up tons of precise inputs and limit fighting games even more as seemingly easy-mode unresponsive messes. Half-circle motions and 360/720 motions will have to be scrapped for the sake of preserving the audience. Fighting Games need the neutral SOCD (especially for left and right) to clean up inputs and allow for more precise and cleaner inputs that specials need. It was an absolute pain to input half circle forward motions.

[@XenFPV]

Why don't Capcom just enforce NO SOCD cleaning and they can let their game handle it however they want and however they deem fair? Let the software handle it. Makes it easier to enforce and easier to understand.

[@metalsadman]

then hit box would just find a way to break it. they can't do it at software level.

[@bunnybreaker]

​@@metalsadmanThey absolutely can and should do it in software. All controllers should send raw inputs and the game should decide what to do with them.

[@Fidel_Cashflow]

guile players deserve this.

[@derekstephens1529]

I don’t think capcom Is getting at the functionality, They want a more even ground between predictability among players. It’s not cheating it’s consistency. Are you more prone to counter hits extra damage on hit box?

[@Troonielicious]

Trash rules, controller players need to adapt or else. Reverse this idiocy now

[@partymantis3421]

Leverless controllers have a signifficant advantage to sticks & d-pads. Glad Sony is putting down some ground rules to even the playingfield