Cards We Got Wrong | Commander Clash Podcast 108

[@MrBoyler1]

Richard coming to a podcast titled 'Cards we were wrong about' and bragging about how right he is about Cartographers Hawk is peak Richard

[@nathangardner4084]

God I love Richard

[@bronythekight7369]

Another positive of the hawk that they didn’t cover is it can trigger your white weenie draw (mentor of the meek, welcoming vampire, tocasa’s welcome) over and over like a white mane lion. Turn two hawk, turn three white weenie drawer, attack and bounce, turn four if nothing better to do drop hawk and draw.

[@mbogs5814]

Richard: "Mine is Cartographers Hawk" Everyone: "Thank god he finally sees it's bad. Richard: "I was totally wrong, it's the best white ramp card" Everyone: *eyes twitch* "Whaaa?"

[@Suppaichu]

Although, he does have a point as in "well designed" is different from brainless broken, 0 though on using it or not. I think it just looks bad in comparison because the normal IS brainless broken head empty 90% of the deck is pre-build just from staples. Honestly, i just wish its trigger was a may.

[@aramfingal]

I love how to, rub it in, the editor put the uncommon version of cart hawk. 😅

[@jamesmoore1476]

Richard might finally get a land off of cartographer's hawk if he paths it!

[@nathangardner4084]

seeing seth melt at richards explanation for being wrong on path sent me

[@TinyLegs15243]

Ill never understand his insane takes on spot removal. He's the guy at the LGS that expects everyone else to do his work for him.

[@RLKC8]

@@TinyLegs15243 The thing is, it works.

[@Kryptnyt]

The first deck I took to FNM for standard had four copies of Path and four copies of Khalni Garden so I've definitely been down this line of thinking before. I still path my creatures from time to time but it's far from the reason I slot it in decks anymore. Also swords doesn't deserve slander, it's extremely good

[@lucasbreton4143]

Where this he sent you?

[@kyleellis1825]

@@TinyLegs15243 He's the guy who figured out the multiplayer format best and can't rate threats as 1v1 cards.

[@seandun7083]

Hey Richard, if you use path as removal it lets you use your white ramp since they have an extra land now.

[@dee-wreck]

Holy crap it's SS tier

[@commanderpower99]

0 is the number of times I've seen Richard pathing his own creature to ramp 1 is the time he got owned by Swords to Plowshares, and it was glorious!!!

[@ColdSake00]

Which ep

[@TMidander]

The General theme week, cant remember the number :) he was playing a portal 3K mono blue general (Lu Xun?). @@ColdSake00

[@julianalvarez4231]

@@ColdSake00 i think it's a commander clash moment. The one with Jeweled lotus and his six mana commander

[@DHGcrimson]

i do remember that

[@MAXFightMan]

​@ColdSake00 season 11 ep 15. Also a short called 'what every jeweled lotus player deserves'

[@frederik360]

We are actively seeing Richard descent into madness. I am partly shocked and partly laughing my ass off.

[@aklepatzky]

Hes going From dumb to mad?

[@bye1551]

​@@aklepatzky"oh he has terrible takes but I can see the awful logic that brought him there" to ".... What? Like it's just wrong, there's no justifying this it's just objectively incorrect and you can't even justify it because the logic is incoherent."

[@NoNo-qt4ov]

I find Richard and Crimm are like kindred spirits. They have absolutely brilliant takes sometimes and then will follow it up with the most outrageous comments lol

[@Zanzibawrr]

Seth’s utter despair when hearing richard’s take on path to exile is what i live for.

[@jamescooley5241]

Richard: has never ramped with cartographers hawk. Also Richard: You can ramp 2 times with this in one game!!!

[@natpoynepya]

1:02:10 The hilarious thing about this is that if you were to path the hawk in response to its trigger you'd still only get the one land because hawk only ramps you if you return it to your hand lol

[@Kryptnyt]

"Consider the fable of the greedy Tomer. As his budget grew, so did his competitiveness; He gamed, and the Fade Away faded away." -Karn, Silver Golem

[@hopposai787]

After watching this episode im no longer convinced richard actually knows how to magic.

[@kyleellis1825]

No, he knows how to politic amazingly but his threat evaluation for the cards themselves is pretty terrible. Removal is something everybody has some of. If you can get someone ese to use resources getting rid of something, that's a free spell you cast. But 1v1 or a team battle and Richard's thinking is completely backwards.

[@Suppaichu]

@@kyleellis1825 I think richard's threat evaluation goes like this: is the game ending right now? no? then i still don't care, i'll just continue developing my gameplan yall deal with it if you want to (and people usually want to). I think he just doesn't care if he ends up losing because no one had a way to stop it, he prefers taking the chance and doing his thing. Maybe it has some logic to it, in a 4p game you don't win by defeating one player, it's like the logic of stripminning someone, you put yourself behind together with your opponent by spending resources to fight him. I think his idea of a flow in a multiplayer game is that if someone becomes a problem, the other three can gang up and take them down, if they can't that's all there is to it. Of course depending on power level and the kind of deck and wincon that can change drastically, let blue combo deck get infinite mana and cards and you're definetly not stopping him.

[@logansmall5148]

The joke about settle the wreckage for ramp... You can cast it after damage has been dealt.....

[@shibbyxdiex]

Now there’s a magic player…. The surface lvl Timmy’s that see us use next level lines to kill you for wins. One of my personal favs is when someone tefferis protection out of game thinking there safe I have a questing beast or slam him and insta leathal them cuz I attacked with commander n they are 21 (; right when the phase in they lose the phones come out n ppl are in disbelief n thinking about cutting the card get wrecked

[@bye1551]

No but genuinely I've been thinking that for years. It's a 4 mana mass ramp spell. Swing with 3-4 small dorks, kill them all at end of combat. 4 mana ramp 3, better than explosive veg which is played a tonne and it can go even higher! Plus, tokens count so play those 2 mana a creature and a tokens is just free value

[@25_Cats_in_a_Trenchcoat]

​@@shibbyxdiex🧠 shuffles my library too

[@zweis]

​​@@shibbyxdiexYou need something that prevents damage from being ignored if that's the line you're going with

[@shibbyxdiex]

@@zweis hence why I say questing beast in my comment read card please 🙃

[@AstoranSolaire]

I actually saw the back side of Wandering Archaic cast this week for the first time ever... don't get too excited though, it was just to eat the counter from a Jin Gitaxias.

[@Farycane]

Cast Path on Cartographers Hawk, Search for a Basic, hit the searched Land with Chaoswarp, get a Random Zetalpa

[@matustrophic]

Every game

[@MrMalorian]

Path to Exile is better than people think. They see the land as a massive drawback but if they have a game ending creature (that you would be using this on) then they have plenty of lands anyway

[@wedgearyxsaber]

I think alot of people see it poorly only because against commanders means the commander tax goes from 2 to 1. Personally, my games against my friends are commander-centric that require them heavily. Path aren't the best against them. I however believe the cards still good

[@bradwhiteuk]

Path is fine, yes. Swords is better in the vast majority of cases though, IMO.

[@Muongoing.97c]

You haven’t lived if you haven’t chaos warped into the removed card.

[@Swaytje]

Elesh Norn is actually played quite a bit, 35k decks or 5% of the decks. The number Richard said (0.138%) is with Elesh Norn as commander, not in the 99.

[@PaulSzkibik]

yeah, if it wasn't played, it wouldn't be 20 bucks.

[@andrueurbane7361]

Thanks to Tomer's insights, I have regularly used Paths to Exile and Settle the Wreckage as modal ramp in my angels and tokens deck to great success.

[@Red-Tower]

It's honestly such a big brain play, especially if you have expensive things (like angels) you want to ramp out.

[@skykur]

ive done this in my adeline deck, ramped myself 10 lands XD

[@MakeVarahHappen]

I think the problem with lithoform engine is that everyone was super excited about copying permanent spell and neither the players nor wizards understood what that should actually cost. Immediately after we got double major from strixhaven and Osgir from c21 and we keep on getting permanent copy spells since.

[@kemperfranklin1935]

I agree, but it’s repeatable. and with so many modes, usually they print versatile cards with a higher cost, hence the backside of MDFCs usually costing a little extra for the same effect other cards have.

[@MakeVarahHappen]

@@kemperfranklin1935 Yes, but copying a permanent once with Lithoform is literally more mana than Jin Gitaxias, Progress Tyrant, which does it every turn. We have a lot of ways of copying permanents, many of which are repeatable.

[@kyleellis1825]

Isochron Scepter did it in a pretty balanced way.

[@MakeVarahHappen]

@@kyleellis1825 Not a permanent spell. Not even sorceries. That was just one spell.

[@HRPufnsting]

The copy permanent part of lithoform engine is a distraction. People should use it to copy significant activated or triggered abilities like say a PW ultimate. 6 mana for that can definitely be worth it

[@trikovi1628]

So about temple of the false god, recently I was watching a lrr stream and Ben Wheeler who's a member of the cag and is pretty good at magic said that in commander decks you should start at 38 lands and ONLY go UP from there. And that got me thinking, so I've been playing like 39-40 lands in more of my decks and it's honestly felt great, just play a couple more cheap card draw effects like spirited companion and nights whisper and you won't get flooded. Plus you get to keep greedier opens cause you have more lands and card draw for those lands. And now I think I'm gonna try temple of the false god in some of those decks cause I've got 40 lands plus wayfarers bauble or green ramp so it's pretty much gonna be live all the time

[@Kestral287]

The general quality of lands and pseudolands going up has helped in that regard; I adore the LotR land cyclers for that reason. But I'm still not at the point that I'd call Temple a land rather than a very slow ramp effect.

[@Bongus_Bubogus]

Everyday that passes is another day I think Richard needs to be put in a home. At this point he’s trolling harder than Crim

[@MTGGoldfish]

I really don't think he is. If you look at his decks he backs up his takes with what he plays.

[@towelociraptor]

​@@MTGGoldfishI don't think he's trolling exactly, but he definitely hasn't used path to ramp in any of the hundreds of games I've watched

[@aklepatzky]

@@MTGGoldfishhes just bad at the game

[@Entropic_Alloy]

​@henrilitor1646He wins the most because the threat assessment from the others is terrible. He is good at the politics of "let me play terrible cards and have everyone else duke it out, and I'll clean up the aftermath."

[@travisbrown9936]

@@Entropic_Alloywouldn’t that make him good at the game but bad at deckbuilding

[@erikallen4923]

There is some sort of 4 dimensional chess going on with the Commander Clash metagame where Richard is literally so wrong about every magic card that he somehow becomes right again. There’s no one I’ve ever seen in content that I agree with less about card evaluation, but it seems to work for him, so 👍

[@vinnythewebsurfer]

There was this period of time with wotc trying to fix white that had some of the most backwards cards I’ve ever seen between Cartographers hawk and Divine Gambit and every rare/mythic from commander legends that wasn’t Akroma’s Will and the chair. Cartographers hawk especially reads like a card printed in 2002, it’s wack.

[@AraAraAraAraAraAraAraAraAra]

I swear I tried to build a commander deck where Divine Gambit was the wincon. It just wound up looking like a spellslinger variant of a Zedruu deck, except Krark and Ishai were at the helm. The goal was basically to Divine Gambit so much that your opponents either become wary of putting new permanents into play OR they empty their hands of permanents, then you yoink them with theft effects. Super bad and all I learned is that I don't like Krark much.

[@Belena711]

You guys have gotten really great at these podcasts. Super entertaining with great conversations. 🙂

[@jamesmoore1476]

Never considered using path on myself but it really isn't a terrible idea. I use both swords and path though because you absolutely need to be able to exile problem creatures. Richard only gets away with it because he is so good at playing the goldfish team off each other so they leave him alone for the first half of the game.

[@Crunchatize_Me_Senpai]

I don’t use either because so often, the problem permanent isn’t a creature. 1 mana exile a creature with minor downside is a good rate, but it does nothing against a large number of permanents. I’d rather pay more mana for more flexibility. And Richard is actually the one that converted me on that. But I do legitimately think Richard is half-right here, too; using Path on your token in specifically a token deck is really good. 1 mana instant speed Rampant Growth is wild, and I’m going to start running it in those decks mainly for that reason. It really is like an MDFC there: ramp or removal. I wouldn’t use it on Spirited Companion or whatever because if I’m playing that, I’m most likely abusing it and don’t want it gone. But for tokens? Hell yeah. Usually Richard’s takes are insane, but in relation to Path specifically, he’s pretty on point imo.

[@kyleellis1825]

I was agressive with in in Alara block as easy mana fixing in Bant/Esper that also was spot removal. In OG zendikar landfall, same thing. Was exiling my own creatures for the landfall trigger.

[@Suppaichu]

He used to say he tests these crazy theories in random games as well and that even secret rendevous and skullwinder rarely backfired on him even on games with silent chats. idk how much he plays now that he's a dad though. I remember them mentioning he won every commander game he played in vegas or something like that. It's kinda wild, but in a multiplayer enviroment, not looking like a threat and letting people beat each other is a big advantage and it seems to work regardless of the group, maybe he's onto some kind of game theory stuff that makes it consistent. Maybe the card being kinda okayish but mostly laughable is part of the strategy xD it has to look very bad but kinda be able to do its thing without being noticed. Overall i think tomer is the most logical of them and often has the best card evaluations, but richard has a very good idea about game theory concerning a multiplayer free for all games.

[@starmanda88]

Hahahaha Seth’s reaction to Richard on PTE was amazing. I was doing the same thing Seth 😂

[@kyleellis1825]

At least when richard said it was basicaly a DFC, Seth kind of understood what he meant and was kind with his disagreement instead of snarky.

[@OlAgony]

As someone who DemonicTutors for lands, i fully approve of using Path as ramp 😂

[@baconsir1159]

If it’s a Cabal Coffers or a Nykthos, that’s totally sensible lol

[@Kestral287]

I've definitely had awkward hands that had to DTutor for Command Tower or Zagoth Triome. There are occasions for Pathing your own thing for sure but in a lot of Commander metas I do agree with Crim; exiling removal is often at enough of a premium to warrant holding it. The extra land is often not worth the risk of being exposed to combo. If it's badly needed for you to function though then sure, there are worse lines.

[@bradwhiteuk]

Do you ever tutor for a basic though? Big difference.

[@PaulSzkibik]

@@bradwhiteuk I really think a card that just said "1 mana - sacrifice a creature - ramp a plains" would be completely playable. The next orzhov deck I play, I'll definietly try out Path to Exile on my own tokens.

[@abhinavjha8770]

I still believe in Circle of Loyalty!

[@-homerow-]

I play it in Historic Mardu Knights! Good way to get through bronze and silver on the ladder!

[@raccoonhatcity7627]

It's just a few cards away from being busted!

[@zackkelley2940]

Circle of Loyalty is a GREAT card.... If you're playing legendary knight tribal.

[@PontificatingPanda]

They need a commander clash episode where they build decks with all their controversial cards and see who is right.

[@PikachaoArt]

how did richard's path to exile takes get more insane? 95% of the time use it to ramp????? this has to be a troll

[@julianalvarez4231]

Someone has to make a stats vid on how many times Richard uses path to ramp

[@AngoDecay]

yeah at this point i cant take anything serious he says does he even play the game?

[@baconsir1159]

If you think about it, 1 cmc to sac a creature and land ramp at instant speed is a pretty insane rate. Exiling your own is worse, but not by much if it’s a token or something.

[@julianalvarez4231]

@@baconsir1159 You have to use a card in your hand tho. And it still takes work to make tokens

[@swiftdragonrider]

Basically what he is saying is the early game doesn’t matter cards don’t matter if I have lands in play and I am not a threat I will win the game later

[@brandonchristner1520]

Can confirm I have path to exiled my own token in my Rhys deck to get a land since I was stuck on lands. Not far fetched from Richard here

[@xeat35]

I feel like Fade Away is a bit different from other board wipes in that it's very strong earlier rather than later, when an opponent's board is developing and they only have a few lands. you can generate so much advantage from that single card when opponents are ahead of you in the early game -- forcing them to sacrifice a developing board or some lands when they only have 5 or 6 The saccing lands proposal to counter it is only a viable strategy in late game

[@edhdeckbuilding]

i still can't figure out why wandering archaic isn't played more.

[@alexscott8799]

Maybe too salty? It's a Baller card. cEDH staple in creature decks

[@Dimenti0-S]

​@@alexscott8799I think you're probably right. It's a pseudo stax piece cause no one wants to cast any good spells into this.

[@JelloBrand]

It's very commonly a 5 mana 4/4 do nothing. It's the same as any cards that give your opponent a choice. They get to choose how good your Archaic is. They can cast instant and sorceries, and pay extra or they can not cast them or they can cast them and not pay. Why would they let you get free value beyond political situations. Pretty mid-tier card, not awful but definitely can see why it's not played when you can just put cards that further your own gameplan without relying on opponents.

[@imaginarymatter]

In normal games of EDH the most commonly played Instant/sorceries by far are cheap (1-2 mana) interaction, cheap tutors, green land ramp, or board wipes. By the time you can cast Archaic most players are done ramping, can easily pay the 2, or don't care that a board wipe is getting copied. There is a non-insignificant amount of time where Archaic is a five mana do nothing vanilla creature.

[@Red-Tower]

​@@imaginarymatter So I've seen one argument (which I think they mentioned during the podcast) that holds pretty well in that it makes for a decent political tool/way to deal with an archenemy at the table. Someone offering to not pay for it as long as you don't point your copy of their spell at them or two-for-oneing the most threatening board are pretty fun options. My one counter point to what you said as well though, is that it does encourage a board wipe, which can actually be helpful. Like say you've already used one and someone has built up a wide board again, you throw this out and suddenly people are more likely to just wrath everything instead of spending extra mana on their spot removal to get rid of it.

[@DeadN0va]

If the goldfish crew ever gets that big youtube budget, they need to animate richard's takes. love it or hate it, they're the biggest laughs ive had in a while :D

[@ardras4649]

1:04:43 : THANK YOU Tomer. I've always run Chaos warp in all my red decks, not because the card is good (It's not garbage, but it's not insanely good either) but the risk attached to it makes it SOOOOO fun.

[@dh47376]

One of the big problems with Elesh Norn is her intense nonbo with bouncelands; as Richard says later, white relies a lot on catchup ramp, and bouncelands are part of that. I have a UW blink deck that plays all the bouncelands and I don't run Elesh Norn for that reason.

[@Kestral287]

Sometimes they can set up actual combos; Kodama of the East Tree plus a landfall token maker plus a bounceland is infinite of that token. But adding Yarok or Norn so you can loop an untapped land too can actually make a difference there. Not a thing every white deck can access but it is notable that sometimes you want those cards together despite the obvious nombo.

[@Saetanigera]

if you don't want to bounce two lands, target the same land twice. there's literally no downside.

[@dh47376]

@@Saetanigera doesn't target

[@Saetanigera]

I need to pay more attention the next time my friend has ancient greenwarden out@@dh47376

[@davidarmstrong3964]

Wandering Archaic is a great politics card. I use it to talk people into casting removal without paying the 2 so we can deal with two things in the archenemy board

[@emerson685]

Tomer has been a favorite because of our shared love of Fade Away, but I've also been cutting it 😢. I don't think it because of improved board wipes though. For me, it's because the ridiculous amount of treasures and additional token permanents people can sac. They either have pay because of the treasures, or they have some random food or clue tokens. Or maybe they have a saga that's already gotten a lot of value. It's just gotten worse.

[@ky-antran653]

The group's conclusion on Elesh Norn, Mother of Machines is partially based on faulty information. Elesh Norn is played in 4003 decks (0.138%) AS A COMMANDER. This makes it the 197th most popular commander which is actually decently high. As a card in itself, it is played in 34579 decks or 5% of eligible decks. So in actuality Elesh Norn, Mother of Machines DOES exist in casual magic and is being played, however I do agree with the general consensus that it is slightly overrated.

[@noahestes3394]

Fadeaway + Thraximundar is super fun. It's a great sac outlet (and a way to make sure your opponents don't have open mana to respond to other stuff you cast after it resolves)

[@KellyUnekis]

The Sandworm Convergence moment you made a clip of is one of those amazing Chaos Warp moments. It getting Richard on that occasion. Tomer is so right about the card.

[@justbecausemc2757]

Fade Away really is the recurring joke of this podcast 😂

[@highlander7462]

Richard is completely right about Path To Exile. The floor is slightly lower than Swords, but the ceiling is miles higher.

[@disafear3674]

I love how everyone descended into madness with Richard's take on Cartographer's Hawk

[@burningpapersun1]

Okay im on Richard's path mdfc white ramp. Its just crazy enough to make sense in my mind.

[@krimson459]

I am seeing Elesh Norn Mother of Machines in so many games and it just dominates.

[@nathanw4692]

Yeah, in my playgroup its kept in check by the player playing it becoming the archenemy, thats what makes it not good, the fact its too oppressive for about 50% of decks. It shuts off Landfall decks, and enchantress and most creature etb and blink value,.. it kills a lot of combos. Usually 2 decks in the pod just hit it and knock the player out super fast, or do nothing and lose. Doesnt make for good games.

[@dontmisunderstand6041]

Pretty much every midrange deck is shut off by Elesh Norn, and most control decks as well. "Kill the one playing x color before our decks stop working" is not a fun meta to play in.

[@jturn314]

Richard: “You can get two plains with it!” ….. Also Richard: has literally never gotten a single plains off the Hawk

[@stevenjones4953]

I do see what Richard is taking about with Cartographer's Hawk about the delayed ramp. Tomer's comment about how you just Loyal Warhound on turn 2 for the instant ramp only works if someone else has ramped before you and you go after. On the flip side. Say you go first or before the green player, (assuming no extra ramp assistance happens) Loyal Warhound doesn't work because the green player Rampant Growths after you. On the flipside if you play Cartopgrapher's Hawk, you still have the opportunity to catch up ramp even though you went before the ramp decks. While the option to play it multiple times may not be the desirable play, it's nice that its even an option compared to the other catch up options.

[@Scriibble4]

The amount of shade being lightly tossed at each other here is priceless

[@renanaraujo5435]

But one thing to consider about Settle the Wreckage: you can cast after damage is dealt, before the ending of combat, so you can deal damage with your creatures and ramp after. I'm not saying is a good play, just pointing out an option.

[@BloodMoonGo]

Wait this isn't an April Fool's eipsode?!? Richard finally sees the light with spot removal

[@bryonflaten6619]

I love Pathing my own creatures. In my feather deck you get out a young pyromancer or monastery mentor and then on each opponents turn path the token. When my turn comes around I’ve ramped 3 basics in Boros, Literal heaven.

[@kandjar]

@Richard After hearing your arguments about Secret Rendezvous; and now about Path to Exile, I have a fantastic suggestion, the absolute best white card draw ever printed, so good that it won’t be reprinted as it has been placed on the reserved list… that card is: Martyr’s Cry.

[@marshallscot]

Strixhaven Stadium kinda feels like a roundabout way of doing poison counters. You would definitely have to build around it.

[@path2plowshares274]

I play path in my feather deck, specifically for this. Looping it every turn with monastery mentor is glorious

[@amarauk9687]

By the way the video started, "Richard slander" would've been a more fitting title lol

[@orpheos9]

The sac a creature get a land comparison is not perfect because most decks that play village rites are doing so because they get death triggers or want to recur the creature getting sacced

[@Red-Tower]

I did think that at first, but honestly I feel like if there was a one mana instant in black that said "as an additional cost to cast this spell, exile a creature you control. Search for a basic and put it into play tapped" it would be a really solid option, and path is better than that because you obviously can use it as removal instead depending on what you need. I think this is the biggest brain idea Richard has ever given us on the podcast that actually makes some sense.

[@Infernoman64]

Richard wins games because he's playing 4D Chess INSIDE a game of EDH!😂

[@efnfen]

Someone said he's so 4D he goes all the way back around to 1D and they were so right

[@borislibaque1558]

Your Strixhaven Stadium example Seth is hilarious, because I've had the exact same experience but intentionally. Its in my Darien King of Kjelder deck where the challenge in that deck is to actually get people to attack you and endure it so you can hit them back harder. I learned quickly people just see Darien and don't attack unless its for lethal. So you have to either incentivize them with cards like Coveted Jewel, scare them with card like Stirixhaven Stadium, or trick them into thinking you're vulnerable and use cards like Blessed Reversal. Strixhaven Stadium has never really got me a win where the army wouldn't also have got me the win, but it has shaped games for me in the back and forth way the designers seem to have intended and its been a lot of fun

[@Belena711]

I play fade away in a couple decks, @Tomer. It always makes people cry. I'm with you. 👍

[@TheGtDragoon]

Ok Richard you reeled me back in, cart hawk is actually cracked, tested and confirmed.

[@billiumdollars]

I have literally only played path the way Richard described for years and im glad someone else finally gets it!

[@thomhix]

Path is also fixing mana. If used in a two color deck. Any basic land. Great card

[@gabe3704]

honestly temple is fine in high land count decks imo, especially on more of a budget with higher cmc commanders

[@steveme6664]

I legitimately count path to exile as a sometimes ramp card in my feather the redeemed deck. If I have feather and young pyromancer on board, that is 4 lands/ turn cycle.

[@wemf2]

I like Cartographer's Hawk. The key to white catch-up ramp is to play bounce lands, Lotus field/vale and similar lands, which reduces the number of lands you control, but does not penalize you on the mana produced. This way, cards like Cartographer's Hawk can always fetch you more lands.

[@zeroclout6306]

Richard's use of path is my new normal. I'm converted.

[@roronoa1243]

Richard saying Swords is a bad card fits when you think about how Richard plays (never making himself archenemy and making everyone else around him have removal so he never has to use it himself), but it also is super hypocritical and an absolutely insane thing to say because every game Crim has to use Swords to deal with the biggest threat is a game Richard would have immediately lost lol

[@MakeVarahHappen]

I need to see the stats on how often Richard paths his own creatures compared to how often it's in his hand because I don't think I've ever seen him actually do this. That being said, Crim is both hating way too hard on downside removal and trippin about MDFCs. No one plays jawari disruption because they think they will make a choice about using it as a counter. It's a land 99% of the time and once in a blue moon your opponent over extends on an X spell after you've flooded.

[@wesleywyndam-pryce5305]

mdfcs are mostly bad, tapped lands are bad.

[@totakekeslider3835]

@@wesleywyndam-pryce5305 Now that's a hot take

[@MakeVarahHappen]

​@@wesleywyndam-pryce5305This is an incredibly simplistic view that is not relevant.

[@jadegrace1312]

If it's a land 99% of the time, that's bad. Then you're just playing a mono color tapped non-basic land with a small upside 1% of the time.

[@jadegrace1312]

@@MakeVarahHappen It is relevant though? Cause we're talking about tapped mdfcs.

[@dyne313]

I loved Cartographer's Hawk from day one in my Ephara deck where the bounce mode makes it even better.

[@mitchellmiller5064]

As a heavy agro player that loves going wide, the settle the wreckage and path ideas are amazing to me. My Anim Pakal deck welcomes those cards with open arms. Just imagine a Settle the Wreckage into a next turn Ojer Taq and some extra drops on turn 5-7 insane. 🤯

[@aydjent]

Richard's dream turn is hitting with the Cartographer's Hawk and immediately Path to Exiling it

[@matthewscheifer1169]

Doesn't work cause of "if you do" though

[@henryackerson7138]

Richards opinions aren't wrong they are just highly specific to his playstyle and his play group. Pf course spot removal rots in his hand when he can talk crim into using his almost every time

[@Unknown360DD]

Fade Away is my favorite meme card from this podcast. Tomer CANNOT stop playing it.

[@ranmuke]

I had too many times in modern that I had to flash and block with a snapcaster then PTE itself on T3 because I really need to cast Supreme Verdict when my turn comes back. It matters more now since there are 'counterspells' like Reprieve and you might want that 5th land for a spell pierce when you cast your verdict.

[@faerie7dragon]

I never thought I'd live to see the day where Crim gets outrolled, but Richard keeps doing it, unreal. Seth realizing that a card saying "win the game" or "player loses the game" makes it worse in EDH is priceless.

[@AnHugeNerd]

I think the best use of Path has to be a Feather, the Redeemed deck. There are so many token generators like Young Pyromancer and Monastery Mentor that pump out a token on spellcast that its a non-issue to always have a creature to hit with Path. In the ideal world you get to ramp a basic every turn of the game as long as you have the mana.

[@michaelcollins4534]

The path argument from richard is pretty legit. Imagine this was the card instead. W, instant, sacrifice a creature to get a basic from library onto the battlefield tapped. If thats what the card said it would be the most played white card no contest. Even better when you're throwing away a token

[@zemineriver8043]

Richard, the first time I played cartographer's hawk I got a land off of it and flipped my dowsing dagger in the same swing, thank you Cod father

[@mattpotts995]

I’m with Seth on Strixhaven Stadium. Took me one game to realize I’m needlessly public enemy no. 1 as soon as it hit the field. First and last time I played it.

[@buddybc3]

Richard is absolutely cooking. I use Path as infinite ramp in my feather deck more than I use it for removal

[@dcnole]

Great Richard episode. Really ran the gamut. His Path explanation was oddly persuasive, and funny. His Hawk argument was so bad that it gave Tomer had a minor seizure at 57:02. Hilarious.

[@Mabozi]

I had one evening lately where chaos warp was cast twice on me: one time just for shuffling my library after I stacked it with goblin recruiter for a winning combo and the other time removing my blocker for a lethal attack but flipping into a Teferi that allowed me to phase out the attacker with instant speed and win me the game. Always fun times 😁

[@thomaspetrucka9173]

Cartographer's Hawk is great at a mid-power table. You can guarantee cast your 4-drop turn-3 if you delay your land drop to your second main phase. I'll admit it's not as good as Loyal Warhound, but in singleton? It's great!

[@windwaker01]

If I had to use my removal for ramp more than every once in awhile I would think there's something wrong with my deck

[@ConManAU]

I can’t wait for Richard week on Commander Clash where everyone plays a Cartographer’s Hawk/Path to Exile combo deck.

[@fernmarbo7717]

Fun fact the artist for "Cartographer's hawk" is the same artist for "Cartographer" Donato Giancola. One of my favorite mtg artist.

[@Bleuchz]

Richard "We admit when we're wrong" Tomer: cheezin

[@AgonalRhythm]

Richard is a mad genius. Not for his takes but for how upset the comments get at his reasoning. Of course Crim and Richard see this differently! They have totally different playstyles and priorities in games. Richard views the game in terms of card advantage and every card has to proactively contribute to the board and/or replace itself. Crim is playing super reactively and wants to hinder opponents before getting ahead. Given those goals, their opinions on Path vs Swords make sense to me.

[@jkattack2640]

Temple of the false God is totally playable as soon as you treat it as a ramp spell instead of as a land. I play it in my 39 land UW control deck because that deck already just wants to hit its land drop every turn, going +1 for free t5 is great

[@ctomsky]

Is... is Richard okay?

[@joshreed316]

I've done the same with Temple of the False God only including it in decks with significant land ramp only. I've had very little issue with the card since then.

[@str4ypanda]

I like having Wandering Archaic in my Animar deck. Lots of fun! Definitely agree it does have a place, but other than that it is really not necessary.

[@Poenas]

Path to exile is one of my favorite cards in my Feather, The Redeemed with a token theme. Young pyromancer makes a 1/1 elemental, path to exile it, get a land and another elemental to path next turn. Another bomb in that deck is contraband livestock. Decent removal in a pinch, but I like turning my 1/1s into an almost 100% guaranteed buff to 2/2 and often 4/4

[@brendans1983]

Best encounter I've had with my Species Specialist was choosing vampires against an Edgar Markhov deck with a skullclamp. It was insane 😂

[@allenjohnson7355]

I run Elesh Norn in my Garth, one-eye blink deck, and it does WORK

[@kingfuzzy2]

Tomer I do love fade away in pauper/ commander I've blown nearly as many people out with it as comeuppance/ aetherize/ floodgate has in my other decks.

[@andrewpayseur]

@20:00 I use this in my Kroxa and Kunoros deck. It's a little bit spicy there. Casting it for 5 does feel bad. Reanimating it for "free" is super solid.

[@michaelscarn6297]

*Richard Every Episode*: "Ramping is the most powerful thing you can do in Magic" *Richard talking about path*: "1 mana to ramp is insane!" *Also Richard*: "Fade Away is bad because people won't sac their creatures and will just sac lands"....

[@stronggreenflame]

Tomer is slowly turning into a chaos mage