Cheap 8000w Reliable Electric Inverter, Full Load Test, Review

Update: You can purchase a similar 48 volt battery to the one I used in this video. The 48v modules are being sold at Batter Hookup. Here is an affiliate link: amzn.to/30zewG4
Part 2 Video testing the new updated version of 8000 watt inverter from Reliable Electric. This inverter outputs a pure sine wave, 120 volts AC. At 34 pounds it's light enough for mobile applications. I'm powering this inverter with my new 48 volt lithium battery that I made from a used Smart Fortwo EV car.
In the previous video I showed this inverter could handle power tools and compressor loads. Awesome! This video is dedicated to doing a full load test.
1. Can it reach 8000w?
2. How long can it stay there?
3. How hot does it get?
4. Do the batteries get hot?
In order to do a full load test I have wired in a sub-panel and electric heaters.
I've also tested the earlier version of this inverter, and it failed. That video is available here: • Cheap 8000w Reliable I...
This new version works way better than the first version. Reliable Electric has upped their game.
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Reliable Electric's E-mail about the live ground:
"And For the voltage , the voltage from Line to Ground and Neutral to Ground is not the true voltage, there is no correct from them.
This virtual voltage has no effect on the usage.
If you measure it during loading , it will be zero at that time.
So please feel free to use it ."
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This inverter is usually called HF, or high-frequency. That's because there is no massive transformer inside. Usually HF inverters can't handle large surge loads such as motors and compressors. So that's exactly what I used to test it!
Reliable Electric is also known as "WZRELB" I have seen it sold under both names.
Sometimes this inverter is available on Amazon, sometimes Ebay. The links sometimes change, sorry about that.
Link to inverter on Amazon, provided by Reliable: amzn.to/2SyjCfy
Hydraulic Crimping Tool: amzn.to/2YTd90p
Multi-meter with DC amp reading: (updated version) amzn.to/2Tm3TR0
Temperature Sensor: amzn.to/31uU6Lj
There are (6) 48 volt batteries all wired together in parallel. Each battery has it's own BMS board for safety. BMS stands for battery management system.
This lithium battery came out of a 2013 Smart Fortwo EV (electric vehicle). It will be used in my DIY Powerwall for back-up power if the grid goes down. Off-Grid.
Thanks for watching. If you would like to help support the channel please check out Patreon, or use an affiliate link. Thank you.
/ davidpoz
We can chat and share project pictures on facebook: / davidpozenergy
“As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.”
Inverter in video was provided by Reliable Electric.

[@stephtronix1811]

It was doing over 8000 Watts on the input side at 9:30 minutes. Lots of rating are taken from a specific test or measurement they decide, to meet the highest numbers to impress buyers. So at 7068 Watts, your input is at 8143 Watts. Its says its an 8000 Watts inverter it does not mean that it outputs 8000 Watts it's Max rating witch will be the input side will reach 8000 Watts. That means that at 8000 Watts with an 87% efficiency will deliver 7000 Watts of usable output power. Great Video keep up the good work!

[@alexandern8hgeg5e9]

@@Bainsworth , this means 8000w at the moment. watt is power ,which is energy / time at the moment. If you have "kilo watt hours" this is a energy. for example 8000w one our long is 8kwh or 8000*3600 joule

[@John-N797]

@Bainsworth All your electrical appliances are marked with their power consumption. For example if you check behind your TV there is a sticker showing the voltage either 120 or 220v and wattage maybe 160watts or so. Your iron box will be written maybe 1200watts or 2000w. Now to answer your question. An 8000watts inverter means that ideally you could hook up and connect all those appliances at the same time and so long as their total wattage is not above 8000watts, then the inverter would hold and continue working without any problem. Of course we are assuming that your battery bank will hold. So basically that is what the 8000watts stand for in this particular case. It has also been explained to us that we should in real life consider 85% of indicated wattage as the actual usable power! I hope this explains it! lastly there is no really dumb question (: Next time you will be explaining to someone else so it was worth asking!

[@Brokendiode]

@@alexandern8hgeg5e9 that went right over his head, not a very clear answer to someone that obviously doesn't have a very good understanding of Electrical theory! 😖

[@Brokendiode]

You are right, the lengths that manufacturer's or advertisers will go to just to sell a product. Prime example, shop vacuums go into Home depot or Lowes or any place that sells them, and look at the advertisement's on the verous brands 4.8 HP peek 5.6 HP peek 6.5 HP peek. So let's do a little math hear, 745.7 watts to the horse power, so 745.7 X 6.5 = 4,847 watts / 120 volts = 40.392 amps twice what you can draw from a 20 amp circuit and just about 2-1/2 times what you can draw from a 15 amp circuit, so how do they get away with claiming the 6.5 HP peek, it is based on the instantaneous inrush that occurs at the moment the switch closes and the motor is at a stand still, for just a few micro seconds it can see that much inrush current, if the source has enough backbone, in other words, a low enough resistance. This means absolutely nothing to have great the vacuum works or how much suction it has, and is there for a very deceptive way to build up their product and make it seem like something it is not. And I don't know if you have noticed that some of these companies that make the these batteries for charging your phone or tablet or some other device, even the largest one's are rated in milliamp hours because most people don't know an amp from amilliamp from a microamp to a nanolamp to a Pico amp, and really surprises me that they're not using picoamps just to make the numbers huge, because that's what they're doing with the milliamps. I have a couple of these, one is rated at 12,000 milliamp hours, while the other one is rated at 15,000 milliamp hours. Big numbers to impress the ignorant populous, which simply put means the naive public. for those who are not in the engineering industry and don't understand terms like pico nano micro Millie killer mega giga it can be very disillusioning, to show how it sounds to someone who knows, 15,000/1000's or 15,000 X 0.001= 15 amp hours not nearly as impressive a number! But it works the other way to, it's just $39.99 because our brains get caught up on that first digit, even though it is only 1 cent shy of $40 without thinking about it, it right away seams like a lot less, works etreamly well on house wives, busy non working moms.

[@jasonbrown467]

i never thought of that, i should have known, these companies lie and exaggerate so of course they are going to use a somewhat legitimate testing method that gives better stats. but on the bright side, now i even more proud of my equipment tests as perhaps i was evaluating the data wrong

[@ScaldaYT]

I must say I have just finished watching the last 30+ videos today. And I found them very informative and interesting on all your solar and power wall stuff. Thank you for sharing it all.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Thank you for checking out the videos.

[@ricknelson947]

I am definitely not familiar with this model inverter. I can say that my 2000 watt Honda inverter generators measured the same 60vac hot to neutral and neutral to ground. The reason as explained to me was for the different NEC requirements for RV’s. I was told by the Honda dealer to tie the neutral and ground together. It worked well and now I have 120 vac load to neutral and ground and obviously nothing neutral to ground. I would in your situation, specifically get a recommendation from the inverter manufacturer before tying your neutral and ground together. Thank you for your presentation. Very relevant information and well presented.

[@carlsch9430]

David, I've found that situation with the odd noise to be a result of the type of load being run from the inverter. Heat guns and space heaters often use a diode in series with the element to allow for a "low setting". The diode half rectifies the sinewave basically halving the output power that you'd get from high power. This makes the inverter work overtime because even though the actual output power may only be 750 watts, that 750 watts is being drawn only from the positive or negative half of the waveform. This forces a significant imbalance on the mosfets trying to drive the output stage causing all sorts of crazy noise. I've always avoided running a device like this on low power setting from an inverter for fear of damaging the inverter. Hope this helps

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Thank you. That's interesting. I'm going to have to learn more about this.

[@chris-jb5ds]

Hi the diode is for the dc motor to run. Some old Eastern block heaters used to have a full bridge rectifier in them to increase the voltage from 230v ac to 325v dc to get more omth out of them for the same power input. The same used to be done in the UK in the 60s and 70s with immersion heaters they were 13a 240v AC or 9a 240v DC ( aka 338v DC )

[@mahmoudgaber5347]

It also popped up in my mind that the noise is due to the non-linear fan load, however if David try a low frequency transformer-based inverter, it would handle it safely

[@th3num83rs3]

@@DavidPozEnergy hey brotha, would you be interested in selling some of your 48v batteries? The website has run out out of stock and need some of the batteries this month lmk

[@__--JY-Moe--__]

could U say it would be best, to run the inverter. through a power isolator/filter block?

[@Nostrildomus]

Your review is appreciated . Seems as though most DYI's are running installs at 50% of capacity rate . Test Test Test

[@lifeadventures465]

Great video I enjoy learning along with you. I love my PowerJack LF 48v 15000 splitphase. Runs entire house, just got to keep it cool.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Did you get that new version with two additional fans on top of the case?

[@aspendell209]

Well done evaluation David! I agree that type of inverter could be adequate for a portable site supply. It should be sufficient for running any 2-pronged, ungrounded tools. But I wouldn't run it at over 5000w. And any sustained load for more than 30 mins, I wouldn't go over 4000w, unless you want to be replacing boards every few months. Reliable is notorious for making inverters that are way under-engineered for the ratings they apply to them. That humm you were hearing at 6800+ watts was likely the sinewave being clipped at the top and bottom and essentially putting a partial square wave through those undersized coils. If the inverter is able to even get close to 80% efficiency at those higher wattages that would mean that 20% of 7000w is being burnt off as heat. So you have the bonus utility of at least a 1400w space heater that your fans are working so hard to extricate. Well done, keep up the good work!

[@howardescoffery4950]

Interesting and deep insight make seance. My one question is if he did the test for an hour @ an average 5500w smoothly then why say it is a 4000w wouldn't the cooling help to keep the components in normal working standard at 6000w for a reasonable working life. By the way mines running my house and it is a 3000w one.

[@BertoldVdb]

The voltage you measure between neutral and ground has to do with how the inverter is constructed. There are two common constructions that give this: 1) one output gives a square wave, the other side a 'inverse-rectified' sine wave, L-N is then a complete sine wave. 2) [better] both outputs give a 180 degree out of phase signal (H-bridge driving a symmetrical filter) The fact that you measure different voltages between both wires weakly suggest configuration 1, but without a scope you can't really know. Assuming the case is grounded, this is not really a problem, although some appliances expect a neutral that is very close to ground potential, they won't work. Connecting something (eg, a panel) that bonds neutral to ground will short out the inverter. The strange sound is the internal 48V->200/400V DC/DC converter going into current limit mode. The driver PWM is varying a bit chaotically and some pulses may be skipped. This causes the transformers to make a crackling noise. It is harmless, but does mean you are at more or less the max output power. You can draw a bit more, but the output waveform will not be a sine anymore (peak power at top of the sine can't be provided). The RMS output voltage will also be dropping, as you saw.

[@LucianoBatista]

Muito bom esse seu inversor, parabéns

[@Wolfie6020]

Love your work David. Thanks for the videos. New sub here and enjoying your channel.

[@lesliegurley8362]

Good video. Very informative I'm learning a lot that I can use to make my place self sufficient .

[@peterpiso7384]

Your videos are great i am learning a lot from you please keep up the content.

[@nickcarozza3399]

Great job David. As always, I commend your performance. As a retired Engineer with more than 40 years in Practice, my ears have become "fine tuned" to identify and diagnose equipment based on the sounds that I hear. In this case, I think I know where the noise is coming from when you attempted to exceed 7000 watts. I believe that the sound is being made by either a HIGH Voltage Leak or Arcing which may occur constantly or only at a specific resonant frequency. I suggest that you perform the following test and fix to confirm the source and eliminate the noise. This testing is based on the process of elimination and works on lots of Electronic devices that make this kind of noise including your TV. This cheap repair will also bring the Voltage back up to spec when you exceed 7000 watts. The first variable that you'll want to eliminate and replace is the last load that you placed on the Inverter. In this case replace the Heater with a totally different type of device that will draw the same wattage. This may be all you need to do to confirm the source of the noise. If it works , it means that you hit a resonant frequency and the Electronics in the Inverter are not compatible with the Heater in combination with the other loads. If that doesn't work... The following is what I'd like to see you do. Reproduce this video as a diagnose & repair video using the following steps to identify both External and Internal HIGH Voltage Leaks and to repair them. Step 1 Remove the Top Cover before you bring the Inverter up to 7000 watts or more however, this time with the lights in the room turned off (this will make it easier for you to visually identify the source of the Voltage Leak). If in fact, it turns out to be an external leak you should be able to see the arcing in the dark when the lights are turned off. The Arcing will look a tiny illuminated blue thread of Lightening jumping out of the source and onto another surface. Step 2 If you do not discover the source with the top cover removed then, proceed to remove the side and bottom covers one at a time and repeat the test one time for each. Step 3 If you've located the leak, you can try to repair it by covering the surface that is releasing the Electrical Arc with a thick layer of Clear RTV Silicone, the thicker the better. I've used this repair on many Electronic devices including a High Voltage Capacitor that had burned a hole through its exterior casing and was releasing a High Voltage current that was arcing with other parts of the Chassis on a Sony Trinitron Color TV. That TV was still working 20 years later until we gave it away and upgraded to a Flat Screen TV. Step 4 If you've completed Step 3 and cannot visually identify any external arcing then the next thing to do is to look for a source of Internal arcing. You accomplish this by listening to each of the components, first with your Ear to identify and narrow down the general area where the noise is coming from. Once you've narrowed down the general area, you then probe each of the surfaces and components with a non conductive Stethoscope (if you don't have a Stethoscope you can try holding a wooden dowel or other non conductive material against your ear and using the other end as a probe). You can also purchase a cheap Automotive Stethoscope that has an Aluminum Probe for about $10-$12 at most Auto Parts Stores and then cover the Aluminum Probe with a Rubber Insulator as long as the insulation at the tip is hard so that it can mechanically conduct and transmit the sound. I used clear Vinyl Aquarium Tubing to cover the Aluminum Probe and then used a Hard Plastic Cap at the end. I would actually start by Probing the Capacitors because when overloaded they arc and slowly burn a hole through each layer of insulation and then through its exterior case. An Internal Leak will eventually burn its way through the Component and culminate by either becoming an External Leak/Arc or it's possible that the Inverter will either continue to operate at a reduced output or completely shut down instead, That's about it. It's pretty simple and I'm sure that you will enjoy your newly acquired diagnostic skills so much that, you will begin probing everything around you. Thanks Again, Nick

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Thank you for such a great comment and suggestions.

[@jimmybrad156]

I bought a cheap 3500w continuous 'pure sine wave' inverter that sounds like a hard drive clicking constantly about 5 mins after starting up, with a 70w load (a few switchmode loads.) 24v dc in, 240v 50hz ac out. When I first got it, I don't know if it was making this noise or not, because I was load testing it with a heatgun set to half power with it's about halfway using about 500w showing a power factor of 0.66 (when dialled to full and switched to 2 of 2, it pulls 1950w with a power factor of 1.00). I ran this half-waveform load for about 4.5 hours to test the battery capacity with a realistic load. The inverter's body got a few derees C above ambient. The noise of the inverter's fan and the heatgun's fan meant I wouldn't have been able to hear any clicking noise from the inverter whether it was making that clicking noise or not. With the small load the inverter first starts clicking slowly, a bit like a cricket, then sounds like a hard drive constantly accessing after a few mins. With no load, you can hear it click ~3hz, but you have to put your ear right next to it.

[@sonjakavalut]

Would be great to see how sinusoidal output voltage form is changed with increased load. Thank you and best regards.

[@nloggraficas]

Awesome job!!! I keep watching your vlog, keep it up sir!!!

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Thanks for watching.

[@lakewkidane7340]

It's totally great job i appreciate what you have shown us .Thanks Lakew Kidane from Ethiopia Addis Ababa

[@omoleogedengbe3007]

Great test, 7000w from an 8000w inverter is OK by me. u can't run 8000w continual but 7000w ur OK is nice.

[@leexgx]

This inverter should not be used continuously for more than 4000 Watts @120v (it won't have a long life) reliable post peak loads on all there inverters not there actual constant load witch is unfortunate on the 240v versions more then 4000w is more likely able to happen (as it's half the amps) but Mosfet inverters past 4000w generally don't last long

[@AS-ug2vq]

@@leexgx what kind of inverter you need for 8000w? Big iron transformer type?

[@nickdepuy7162]

I’d like to see your thoughts on running this unit with the larger gauge wire. I agree with your opinion that those wires seem undersized. Love your channel!

[@onefixitman]

I don't think I would lug all that equipment around in the middle of a field to use battery power. A portable generator works great and they usually have a wheel kit. I am impressed by all the batteries and inverters you have and have tested.

[@buyamerican3191]

Hi David, This is my first view from you. Nicely done, you are obviously intelligent in the field you are discussing (refreshing on you tube). Lots of things I could discuss with you but not enough time/space, let me commend you on using proper terminals and a proper crimper!

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Hi Craig, Thank you for watching. I'm still learning and enjoy helpful criticism, so feel free to do so. If you want to discuss more send me a message through Facebook. facebook.com/DavidPozEnergy/

[@rashmiranjannayak3251]

Good fun job, the sound seems to be something sparking from out put A.C leads.

[@MagivaIT]

awesome video (as always), i liken this to speakers and amps, my dad always bought 150watt speakers but with a 100watt amp, so the speakers would tick over nicely when the amp was turned up full. bizare analogy i know but if you wanted 6500w of power, buying an 8000w inverter would make sense, i wouldnt want to run anything at its max spec

[@ccv3237]

I love your analogy. It is a very useful one too. Who in his right mind would drive a set of speakers to their max power and expect full functionality? I wouldn't. Also, what goes in as far as power, is greater than what comes out due to overall efficiency matters. Very few machines and equipment, no matter where they are made, are rated as full output plus an extra reserve power, to be on the safe side. Taking all these things into consideration, I am satisfied with results shown in this video.

[@JR-nj8le]

18:35 this is perfect spot for "Technology Connections" guy to cut in to explain in great detail what was making that noise inside the inverter

[@DavidPozEnergy]

I hope someone can help me out with an explanation on that noise.

[@JR-nj8le]

@@DavidPozEnergy That would be great but anyway you are doing a great job and I love your videos man, keep'em coming!:)

[@gn02020202]

Usually you see the voltage on the neutral like that with a modified sine inverter. If it is a pure sine, it maybe their intent that you manually tie the ground and neutrals together.

[@robotech1990]

This is very useful info . Thank's for uploading.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Your welcome, thanks for watching.

[@justinbowles7086]

Love the video! Very helpful!

[@Rorschach00Testing]

Thorough due diligence. Bravo! Did you remove the cover and turn the lights out to rule out arcing under heavy load? Good work David. Reliable Electric should hire you! 🤑

[@DavidPozEnergy]

I did remove the cover afterwards and looked for any scorch marks, or melting. (none). I didn't think about turning off the lights, that would have been a good one to try. Thanks for the suggestion.

[@danielbuckman2727]

I'm actually pretty impressed. I mean how often do you run 7000 Watts continuously. I only run a 4000 Watt inverter now so this will be a great improvement.

[@DallasAya]

I bought a 1500 watt 120 volt heating element for the water heater to run it on generator. Come to find out the 250 volt 4500 watt element was 1300 watts on 120 volts. The resistance was 13 ohms on the 1500 watt and 15 ohms on the 4500 watt. Conclusion was to just wire 120 volts to hot-water heater and leave it as is. This works perfectly on the small 3kw genset.

[@6969smurfy]

I got to say, why would you use AC at all.....

[@nyteshdw1]

That sound is the result of an exposed conduit/connection arcing an excess of load within the unit across to the next closest conductive surface when the max load for that connection is running through it. You get the drop in efficiency because, excess flow that the line can't handle is discharging into what is probably the internal frame. Its a very familiar noise if you've ever played with a Tesla coil. ;)

[@realvanman1]

Any supply will "float" with respect to ground if it is not bonded. That is neutral solidly connected to chassis ground.

[@Brokendiode]

Just drop in a bonding screw, in that panel, and it will be just like your primary house panel. 👍😁

[@kenattagexp9871]

Very Interesting. Like you, I have purchased Reliables. The first was 24v@2000w and it stopped working (just unresponsive/dead) when I hooked the ground to the home wiring ground - I think I read that they don't want you to do this. The 2nd was 48v@3000w and it blew up (dead short on DC terminals) when I tried to run 12,000BTU air conditioner. I still have a 24v@1500w that I use (as you said) for my custom portable solar generator - e.g. day/short use. Since then, I've upgraded to AIMS. First was 48v@2000w - ran fine and now 48v@12,000w with 36,000w spike for 20secs (e.g. 240v@50a continuous output) running my home... and so far (6 months) no problem. The max I've had it is about 7,000w. I guess I would recommend AIMS or higher for 24/7 home use and pass on Reliable for that purpose. And oh yes, that #10AWG temp measurement seemed 'pretty hot' for my taste... and 65v on ground.. no wonder they don't want you to wire it home ground as that's enough to get an unexpected shock (I believe).

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Nice, you got one of the big bad boys, the Aims 12kw. That's great. I'm still using my 6kw for my house 24/6. (The 6 is an average of 6 days a week because I switch back to the grid if there are two cloudy days back to back. However, this has to do with solar array size, and nothing to do with the Aims inverter) Anyways, I sometimes hit the limit of the Aims inverter and wish I had a slightly bigger model.

[@kenattagexp9871]

Yes, what I was trying to say that as my self-energy production has moved from *fun* experimental (cheaper Reliable Inverters) to routine daily home use I've discovered I need significant inverter power and equipment that you don't have to worry about - after all its my home and family. For example, its summer and I turned on the portable 12,000BTU AC and the inverter watts shot up by 12a@120v - no problem. But then things cascaded as the wife turned on the cooktop and I was running the table saw etc... and power spiked right up to 7000w without even thinking about it. All because its become 'routine' and I've stopped thinking about individual 1000w increments. Another part of AIMS was the ETL (UL) listing - in the hopes of increased safety. Bottom Line - it seems like you are on the same track to provide whole home power for significant periods and I'll be interested to see your journey. Really appreciate your work and videos :)

[@donplumber6141]

Love the barrel with heating element good test

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Thanks. I built that barrel heater for some solar testing I was doing. I was connecting solar panels directly to the heater element. kzbin.info/www/bejne/oYfEqXScjbaDerc

[@katecapil4574]

Love to see more of these inverter tests. Both 12 and 24v. I see many 1k and 3k inverters that really cant deliver that. Edit: thanks for the video, loved it :)

[@dustinpool]

Love these videos, I've been following all info on the reliable inverters with going off grid and you. I was going to pull the trigger last year and buy one, but I thought I would hold off on to see if they improved and get a better take on that nutral ground issue. Glad I did. Looked online yesterday and noticed they are offering a 10,000 , may be it would be safe to assume it would hit 8,000 . It seems that's true with all Chinese power and inverters , and amps . I use to own a car audio business and labeled continuous rating on all amps we subtracted about 1500 and that was almost true for all of them , seems like they all label their stuff 1000-1500 more to compete with name brand stuff

[@DavidPozEnergy]

I'm glad the videos help you out.

[@mega-hb4re]

I use this for my shed to use a small welder and a mini fridge with 0 gauge wire, 200watt panels, a 200 amp class D solar battery and it works terrific.

[@texdoms]

How long have you had it for? The main questions with inverters are: 1/ how much power we can get 2/ how long do they last? My 4kW inverter power my house just blew up. I’m on a market for a new, so I’m on the fence with this one.

[@fishhuntadventure]

0-AWG is too small

[@mark_osborne]

Awesome video. To make AC from DC it's mostly a matter of switching (positive to negative) DC FETS at a frequency that gives you either 'pure sine' or 'modified sine'. Given that, those FETs have to give up the heat at a rate (that they produce)- or you'll eventually have an overheated situation. So the entire chassis, heat sinks, fans, etc, all have to be sized to disperse the heat produced. Example: Magnum inverters increase the fan speed immediately with even the slightest load. And Magnum's fans are huge! Given that, I suspect Reliable is working toward building something to compete with the larger full frame inverters - one tiny step at a time. Thanks for all you do to expose what is actually happening in the Chinese inverter market !

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Thanks Mark. Your inverter setup is great. Any hickups, or are you still running off-grid?

[@mark_osborne]

@@DavidPozEnergy All is well, no problems. I was having this 'reliability' conversation with a new off-grid friend. Did you know the early Trace SW inverters made by Schneider virtually last forever ? Early off-girders are still running them. Just imagine how many trillions of cycles those FETs made over the decades.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

I've never seen inside those old units. Was the technology similar to todays inverters?

[@mark_osborne]

@@DavidPozEnergyAs far as I know, the topography of the LF inverter is still the same pretty much regardless of who builds it.

[@JonalistTwitMe]

Thanks for using short links.

[@80Matthias80]

Great review, thanks.

[@electronicsNmore]

To draw 8000W off a 12V lead acid battery, you'd need at least (2) 8D deep cycle batteries in parallel, and some very heavy gauge wires. At 8000W you'll be pulling around 750 amps.

[@ellissmithjr6599]

667amps👍

[@Brokendiode]

Well that would be the reason that he is not using a 12 volt battery, he is using an electric vehicle battery that is a Lithium cobalt or Lithium NMC in a 14S configuration for 54 volts, so pay attention, no one is going to build an 8000 watt Inverter, that is going to run off a 12 volt battery, especially an 8D lead acid battery. That would be so incredibly inefficient that it just wouldn't make sense!!! 🤔😖

[@jasonbrown467]

but he is using 48v lifepo. and this inverter is 48v. you would need 4 of any 12 volt battery in parallel to turn it on. maybe your point was to put the amps into scale if you ran 8kw off of 12 volts? i am currently using 12v to learn, and plan very soon to move up to 48 volts. on my 12v system the most i have been able to pull was 301amps, and i think it was 11.9v x 301a = 3.5kw. that was last year and i have learned a lot since then, maybe i will try again, now that i have all new lead acid batteries, and more of them, better wires and more inverters to test. those high amps you mention is why i am quickly moving away from 12v, i couldnt imagine just the cost of the cables to run 750amps

[@__--JY-Moe--__]

you just need some capacitor Banks, and a Transformer..

[@reyortega7341]

what gauge wire would that be ??

[@timh2870]

I would try a small 120v incandescent bulb (7 watt should do) from line/neutral to ground. if the bulb does not light, then check the voltage across it. If the voltage is zero or close to it, then it should be fine to bond the neutral to ground, but don't be surprised if you see 60 volts ac or more from your battery terminals to ground.

[@bostjantrancar9605]

Excellent video.... 👍

[@ambarkdi9186]

Hi, KZbin recommend this video while I was searching for inverter..and I am truly glad to seeing your efforts and review while doing testing.. really u have done great job ..I have a concern , how many batteries you have contacted and how much volt.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

This battery is about 12kwh capacity, setup as a 14s (nominal 48v) system.

[@tommanley2924]

It's a reliable 4000watt inverter.

[@analogaudiorules1724]

They should have just listed it as a 4k inverter....

[@adon8672]

Interesting stuff David. They've definitely improved since the last time you tested their previous inverters. They still need to do further improvements and live up to their 8000W claim but it's interesting how these Chinese companies use use the rest of the world as Guinea pigs, persevere and improve overtime. By the way, do you have enough data from the DC end to calculate the inverter efficiency? I think that's another significant metric worth knowing.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

I did not plot a curve, but did take a single data point. @ 9:36 in the video.

[@ralph72462]

So maybe they mean 8000 w peak surge voltage 6500 w continuous. Thank you for your video been looking at this brand of inverter on Amazon and your video was very helpful. You are taking the guess work out of this. That is what is so hard about solar that manufacturers can be unclear and even way off on their claims. I bet that this inverter can take a surge of 8000 w for maybe under 1 minute and not burn out but that is only surge limit not operating specs. So interesting yet still needs heftier wires coming from the battery. I am looking at a model from this company of 120/240 v to run off of my 48v battery bank that I am putting together. Your videos are very helpful.❤❤❤ and 3 thumbs 👍👍 👍

[@davestech6357]

If you are testing and being that close you should have at least eye protection on. Measure the voltage drop of your wires and increase your wire gauge until it is low. That noise it makes might be over saturation on a transformer. Just a thought measure the output on dc volts and you should see dc ripple when it's over driven.

[@rogerkerkmann]

Gotta love those battery! Next gotta pop that cover, sounds like unhappy capacitor?

[@DavidPozEnergy]

After the test I did look under the hood. I saw no signs of melting or scorching. It could be a capacitor, but I don't know enough about the electronics to tell.

[@hackmaster124]

I have the 2500w version of this inverter. It often makes that noise when doing a soft start on an induction motor that has a LRA exceeding the max amp output of the inverter. The voltage drops to around 70v for a brief moment along with that sound until the motor gets up to speed and 120v is restored. Perhaps with the amount of current you were asking from the inverter it thought it needed to do a soft start and dropped the voltage and current.

[@ronmoz5815]

thank you sir for your explanation

[@lukereynolds]

Looks awesome

[@lukerediger8431]

it's good for an off grid, custom solution where you do not bond neutral to ground. Basically this thing creates a standard ac loop that alternates which leg (Neutral and Live) is +60 and which is -60 to get a total of 120 volts. problem is that the Case Ground could be bonded to your house ground, but if you hook it to a standard panel, it bonds ground to neutral which will essentially create a 60V short. Grid power doesn't have this problem because the transformer at the street has an output coil (secondary) with a center tap. The secondary works essentially as 2 coils in series that generate 120 each with a total of 240v. Where they meet there is 120v hitting -120v they cancel each other out without a short because the power on the other end of each coil has to pass through a load first. This point between the coils is the neutral. By bonding this to ground you ensure the other 2 legs from the coil are +120 or -120 while the neutral stays at 0. In grid power the neutral is bonded to ground to prevent the neutral from walking to high voltage... due to inconsistencies and noise in the line, the two legs could stay 240 volts difference in potential from each other, but could walk up to much higher voltages in comparison to ground. By bonding the neutral to ground you ensure it can't "Float" to high voltages in comparison to the rest of the world. If you want to use this as a way to feed a grid panel like a backup generator, you need to add a transformer to it. I would recommend a 1:2 transformer with a center tap on the secondary. This way you could feed the 120 volts into the primary of the transformer, (inverter neutral and live) then connect the secondary's center tap to neutral, and each live to each of your house live wires. You could tie the inverter, transformer and house wiring to ground, as well as the house neutral to ground without the inverter's neutral touching ground. This would also allow you to run 240 volt appliances. there would be some loss from the transformer though. You could use your 50KVA transformer backwards for this, using the H tap in a central spot as your neutral. (set primary for 480, secondary 240, feed into the secondary and pull from the primary, using the H Tap as a neutral at the center) kzbin.info/www/bejne/hmW6nmtpq9iXgcU

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Thank you for such a great comment.

[@williamhustonrn6160]

David, you should look into DC direct power. There is a house up here in the mountains near me that was recently built. The entire house runs off DC voltage and its been fun picking the guys brain. Basically, he designed the house with 5 voltages. The main battery bank is run as a 192v DC bank off Sinopoly cells with most of the capacity stored. The house is wired for 192v DC, but in each room he designed it so in each room there is a small panel in the wall that houses small DC circuit breakers for 192v, 96v, 48v, 24v, and 12v DC along with a smaller size battery bank mounted in the panel with some smaller sinopoly cells. He has pigtails running off the smaller 192v bank in each room that runs to each voltage breaker equally to draw down the battery equally. He did it this way to reduce the distance for high amp short burst draws off the system. Then everything in the house has been changed to run off DC voltage or rewired to run off DC. The air conditioner is a mini split system designed to run off 96v, the frig in the kitchen is 192v (170v), the stove is 48v induction unit... basically, he converted his entire life over to DC voltage and now has no inverters in the system to worry about for his entire house except for a handful of items he could not convert due to warranty or due to difficulty, so he uses smallest AC microinverters for them separately to reduce the vampiric losses. He found that most electronics they convert the AC voltage to DC voltage internally, so he would measure out what voltage the device was converting to internally, run a jumper wire with the correct resistance to drop the voltage to the proper voltage and it run it off DC voltage directly with a new power cord. For example, when he was looking into his refrigerator, he found that it converted 120v AC to 170v DC before it went into the mainboard and converted to the various other voltage levels it needs to run, so he just wired it directly, feeding the 170v directly from the 192v DC circuit.

[@coachwilson5967]

Wow that sounds amazing. Full DC house. Of course my shop with all the electric tools would be a pain so Invert there only for when a tool is running but an all DC house sounds nuts!!!!

[@michaelbatchelder]

192v sounds dangerous.

[@Robssi]

.. 1

[@tombombadil3185]

Sounds like his electrical sys. cost more than the house. Also, too much shit to trouble shoot, and the wire size would also increase cost for DC over AC.

[@michaelbouckley4455]

@@michaelbatchelder but lower current, therefore smaller wire than low voltage DC

[@kilasmabonghot4167]

Do you have the ground bus bar connected to the neutral bar in your panel???

[@voiceofinsight5811]

Hi David, thanks for the review. I've always wondered, can I connect inverters in 'series' or 'parallel' like you do cells to form a battery of inverters in order to meet my power requirements? If my question sounds silly, I apologize but I've often gotten the best insights and knowledge from asking 'silly' questions.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Only some inverters are made to be paralleled together. They usually come with some type of communication wire so that the sine wave is in sync. The inverter in this video can not be paralleled. But, I'm currently running two yellow SMA inverters in parallel.

[@meblake7359]

I am not a master electrician, but I don't think there shouldn't be power between the neutral and ground. The example I have ever seen of this was with neutral sharing where the voltage was cut in half when power was off. Hopefully, an electrician can explain it. The 2 phase explaination sounds interesting.

[@leexgx]

It's like a split phase but at 60v each live and neutral to make the 120v We say hot earth as the 60v shows when you test between L and E or N and E (the return path is to the inverter internally) , if you did the same on the house earth you still get 60v on L or N to house earth If I had not asked him to test for hot ground this video would of been magic smoke Video if he had the earth+neutral bonded inside that box (most people are not aware of the half voltage split phase setup of some inverters higher powered MOSFET inverters and get a nice bang out of the inverter when the Neutral and earth is bonded somewhere) I believe they do this so they split the amperage between both line 1 and technically line 2

[@Drxxx]

amazing and powerful.

[@tjgorla]

same as power on a boat it is an ungrounded system so you will show voltage on both the hot and neautral.

[@eagle5720]

I have this same issue with my inverter that I wire to breaker box but when turn off the breaker box there is still power going to the outlet because current still in the neutral leg which is confusing. Can this be a issue with the inverter?

[@anzachawkins3660]

Awesome like the concept

[@BajanAlan]

If you turned on an AM (MW) radio it would check for RF noise!

[@danielmiller6405]

Hi Dave thanks for the amazing videos. I stumbled across your 8000 W inverter set up. I’d like to run clean energy on my food truck. Based on your experience what do I need? Where do I start?

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Send me a private message on Facebook and we can work though it. facebook.com/DavidPozEnergy/

[@smdindustries3699]

You need to be using a low impedance meter for testing voltages on output, to confirm if it is center taped to earth or if your just seeing ghost voltages from capacitive coupling. Alternatively load your high impedance multimeter with a incandescent lamp in parallel with the meter probes.

[@tracysmith7318]

I agree. Put a 60w light bulb from 110v POS TO GROUNG and then measure the voltage to ground. . . Good vid. IF I got 7000 plus watts, I'd be happy for the price. . I'd replace the cables inside and install additional fans. . . I think the buzz is Transformer Saturation. . . . Good job. . ..

[@davidhardin1402]

I was hoping someone would come out and say that because that's what it is phantom voltage. Hit it with low impedance voltage meter and it should be no voltage.

[@child_of_god_]

The ground is fine measuring at about halfway from hot to neutral. But it won't stay there if you try to draw usable current from it. A voltmeter is not sufficient a load, and in this case it only measure the stray voltage which usually is defined by ac coupling capacitors to hot and neutral, hence the halfway voltage

[@eagle5720]

I ground my inverter to ground pole on my battery does that give good grounding or i have to ground to earth outside?

[@JB-kr5gn]

Does the 8kw inverter has a Overtemp or Limit AH alert (or shut off) should in case it gots weird like the cracking sound ? am just thinking sort of a C rate discharge info perhaps from manufacturer...#just.saying :)

[@bimmers50e30]

Impressive! Can you test an Air Conditioner??? Resistive loads are cool and all, but we love our air conditioning is number one! ! ! also if you want an idea for future videos you should perhaps investigate decision-based dehumidification. Can be useful for off-grid air conditioning

[@DavidPozEnergy]

The very first thing I turned on was my garage air conditioner. I attached it with an extension cord. In a previous video I even ran my air compressor, which has a larger compressor than my air conditioner. Thanks for watching.

[@DJRobbie54]

Dave, I've just now seen your video which you published August 10th, 2019 near the end of the video you talked about the case having voltage on it it needs to be isolated from the ground if you haven't already done that that's what needs to be done what spacers plastic spacers or rubber spacers. That is considered a negative-positive charge to the case. Which should not even be present. In other words, isolate the chassis motherboard from the case.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Thanks.

[@joseno69]

David im a beginner on the Solar Panels Systems. I like your videos they are very nicely explained. The wiring and testing are a must. I understand everything here in this video. Is there another video on how many solar panels, batteries I need to start this Job. I'm an electrician and love doing work at my house. This is one project I want to do.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Hi Jose, I have lots of videos going through the other components, but I'd start with this overview: kzbin.info/www/bejne/bWOVeIGNoaqBZ8k

[@joseno69]

@@DavidPozEnergy Thank you David I'm looking forward for this Video.

[@joseno69]

David thank you for the video it helped alot. David is there any other way to contact you besides you tube?

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Facebook. I'm @davidpozenergy

[@texdoms]

Seems like a good inverter to me. But how long will it last ? The 2 main questions with inverters are: 1/ how much power they output and 2/ how long do they last? My 4kW inverter power my house just blew up. I’m on a market for a new, so I’m on the fence with this one

[@Screamingtut]

I think the buzz might be transformer lamination buzz, I'm a ham radio operator, I used to have an old HF radio that ran 350 watts output with Tubes when I ran it a max plate current I got the same buzz. when I went back to school to get my second EE degree back in the 80s. I learned a lot more about AC power. when I am pulling 350 watts RF output in a class C Amp the power supply is pulling close to 550-600 watts on the input. there are occultations on the transformer plates. when I replaced the transformer with a very good high-quality transformer the buzzing stopped and I got a Higher output RF out (400-425 watts more output vs the 350W output, eg better efficiency). So I also would change the battery wires going from the inverter to the batteries to at least a #4 AWG. also go up at least two gauges higher wire on those on the output.

[@kayak_1]

The voltage to ground is more than a bit suspect. I If your heading to mid cost Maine, I would be glad to give you a tour of my solar setup. I have an Outback 8084A and a 10KW Solar Edge at my house.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

That would be great. I have relatives in Bangor, so I travel up 95 regularly. Can we message on facebook? facebook.com/DavidPozEnergy/

[@pedronieves9749]

Hi David, I was wondering if those BMS provide a cutoff for overcharge? It would be great if those BMS limit the charge to prevent overcharge from an inverter/charger with a higher charge voltage than the batteries can take.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Hi Pedro, Yes. The BMS boards provide several levels of protection. Over-voltage, under-voltage, over current, temperature, are the major ones. If you want to learn more here is the website: www.lithiumbatterypcb.com/product/14s-bluetooth-lithium-e-bike-battery-pcb-board-with-30a-constant-charge-and-discharge-current-2/

[@jonyalvarezltd3587]

Hey david ,thanks for the demostration,l would like to know if you can combine 2 of these reliable inverters sharing the same neutral for 2 phase?

[@DavidPozEnergy]

No, these inverters don't support paralleling. If you want to parallel multiple inverters, then try the Growatt 5000. I have paralleled 3 of them in some recent videos: kzbin.info/www/bejne/r4i4l6msiMZmgZo and kzbin.info/www/bejne/mnS0enqGqrV7ecU

[@jonyalvarezltd3587]

@@DavidPozEnergy thanks for responding,i have the 6000w similiar to the 8000w you tested,its runing one phase of my home and the other phase with the utility,for one year,and its doing great,90% is from the reliable,utility only for oven and heating showers,i got my eyes on the 8kw Lf growatt for later.

[@christophercudia8354]

hi can i run 3 3000watt inverters in parallel or under series to use 2 inverters off my bat for more power out ??

[@larryteslaspacexboringlawr739]

thank you for educational video

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Your welcome, thanks for watching.

[@markgohl2660]

If you take a transformer lets say 120 Volts to 120 volts such that the output is floating. I.E Not grounded and measure the voltage from either of the outputs to ground you may find you have 60 volts in each case. The reason is that that there is capacitance between the winding,s and the meter requires s very small current to operate. If you where to connect a load which draws some current such as a light-bulb from one of the terminals to ground it most likely will not light. You inverter most likely has a floating output (But it could be center tapped the light bulb test will light in this case) but it is impossible to say for certain without taking it apart to find out. I would contact the manufacture to ask about how you should earth this equipment. Floating outputs are used on isolation transformers such as are used for outdoor use of tools because there is less chance of an earth return path and less chance of a shock but can be a problem in a larger installation.

[@anitablades6033]

Nothing like that Magic Smoke!!!!

[@energielegresleyenergy1115]

You should run only resistive loads true it. By eliminating all motors you'll eliminate all the Var therefore giving you a more accurate representation of output watts capability of the unit. Also you didn't ground the unit at all. Ground means getting a connection the actual ground, a ground bar pounded into the earth to at lease reach wet soil or to a water main of the house that is metal.

[@computerman200]

Did you neutral-earth bond your distro box? Might explain your voltage...neutral-earth bonding is done in homes for nearly the same reason

[@mustafakhan-kq7qs]

Very good inverter

[@alexandreesquenet3736]

Great inverter.

[@luisleon9157]

Hi David, I want a inverter to move my rv recommendations is accepted and how much battery need

[@justintyme1449]

I’m wondering if this could be good for an RV, less overall power but for longer duration of use

[@1234hani]

thank you very much

[@ScubaJamaica]

Did you ground the case to a real Ground? or did you leave it floating?

[@Danielsoto9095]

In my opinion not bad for a made in china inverter. It handle it pretty well. Keep up the good vids.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

I agree.

[@oldtimeengineer26]

I hooked my units chassis ground nut to earth ground and then the voltage read correct. there should be an earth ground screw under the unit.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Yes, there is a grounding screw on the chassis.

[@ahaveland]

Good job David - still not bad performance considering. I think we've all come to expect that you can't trust the claims Chinese products make. Unless they face real consequences from trading standards bodies and the law for continuing to lie and mislead, then they'll just keep doing it. Thankfully youtube can help to expose the really bad players before they rip off too many people, so for anyone wishing to make a big investment on kit, always check out youtube for reviews first, and never buy impulsively!

[@DavidPozEnergy]

I agree Andy. I love KZbin for it's ability to quickly share product reviews.

[@ericgorder1]

Did you ground the chassis to true earth ground? Maybe the voltage was present because it was floating?

[@mightymoto2636]

Input reading and previous calc. is what you should be using and calculations on. The noise in all probability’s is one or all 3 of the coils vibrating. I personally would replace the 10 ga internal wires w/8 or maybe 6 gauge.

[@robertc.fisher3214]

According to the NEC the ground and neutral should be bonded at the service entrance or transformer output and properly grounded to an 8 ft ground rod pounded into the ground. For temp power ground should be isolated or to a ground rod in the dirt.

[@btwbrand]

Old comment. but this test set-up is not a grid tied system and is using a isolated ground. No need to bond the neutral/ground to the earth.

[@lemanxr]

Hi , David isit possibile to do by rid instalatorom grom pure sine inverter?

[@wangorukihara8457]

@DavidPoz do you know if Reliable Electric have a grid tie inverter?

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Not that I'm aware of.

[@frankz1125]

Much better test.Thanks for sharing

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Your welcome, thanks for watching.

[@frankz1125]

@@DavidPozEnergy I was looking at the 8000w 110vdc model. I hear the no load draw is 2.5a. May be too high for my app.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Yeah, 275 watts would be quite a big phantom load on the system. My Aims inverter is 66 watts in idle. But, your giant battery will probably handle it well. How many kwh was that?

[@frankz1125]

@@DavidPozEnergy 42 kwh. I think. Not quite there yet tho. Hopefully before it snows ill be running

[@DavidPozEnergy]

That's so awesome. I'm excited to see your final choices for inverter and charge controller to work with that voltage.

[@leroywarner7354]

I think you’re right on with your estimation I really enjoy your break can you give me a good work out thank you

[@jimmybrad156]

I bought a cheap 3500w continuous 'pure sine wave' inverter that sounds like a hard drive clicking constantly about 5 mins after starting up, with a 70w load (a few switchmode loads.) 24v dc in, 240v 50hz ac out. When I first got it, I don't know if it was making this noise or not, because I was load testing it with a heatgun set to half power with it's about halfway using about 500w showing a power factor of 0.66 (when dialled to full and switched to 2 of 2, it pulls 1950w with a power factor of 1.00). I ran this half-waveform load for about 4.5 hours to test the battery capacity with a realistic load. The inverter's body got a few derees C above ambient. The noise of the inverter's fan and the heatgun's fan meant I wouldn't have been able to hear any clicking noise from the inverter whether it was making that clicking noise or not. With the small load the inverter first starts clicking slowly, a bit like a cricket, then sounds like a hard drive constantly accessing after a few mins. With no load, you can hear it click ~3hz, but you have to put your ear right next to it.

[@sMASHsound]

can u run an ac/dc arc welder on this thing?

[@kadmow]

Ground the case (or the Battery 0v) and the voltage will then be referenced to 0 Volt ground. (neutral will likely connect to the same bus as "ground" (MEN) inside the unit - after any RCD/GFCI. The case voltage you describe is just from a floating ground - floating ground can be at any level above true 0V.

[@DavidPozEnergy]

Thanks.

[@freddieverreynne3344]

Hi where can a look to buy one of that and can someone tell me how much will this inverter cost in rand

[@joelcrocker1094]

I would say their is still power in the compositors in the unit