Chen Style Taiji compared to Yang Style (Master George Xu)

[@fudochi-dojo1527]

I used to practice with him twice a year when he cam over to Germany. Very smart, knowledgeable and really a fighter. He changed my Art over the years on a very deep level. Thank you George..we miss your visits.

[@mikeclark3030]

So very interesting. Thank you for sharing your knowledge, not so many teachers are able/willing to demonstrate this and able to put into words.

[@arnaudh4789]

Very important video to understand different main styles.. Thank you Sifu George Xu..and thank you Golden Lion Tiger. :)🙏

[@azlaroc12]

This is the peak of the art. I am grateful for those alive to teach show this.

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

Thanks. I passed that off to him.

[@travisdominguez5638]

this is not the peak of CHen Tai CHi. Kam Lee, Chen xio Wang, George never had a true chen coach. Anyone who knows him knows this, His long sleeves style is his best stuff.

[@travisdominguez5638]

enjoy...FIrst for from the 16th Lineage holder of Chen Tai Chi. kzbin.info/www/bejne/qGnYqJZ_ZbSmhKM

[@asswuppin]

@@travisdominguez5638 As a novice, I don't know what I am seeing. Would you mind explaining? Does this have practical martial applications?

[@travisdominguez5638]

Yes absolutely. Someone with a deep understnding know that for EVERY SINGLE MOVEMNT there's a (Throw, a lock(or break), a kick , and a punch) but you need a REAL master to actually train with in order to understand the movements. If you want to learn Tai Chi applications from a video Yang Xwing Ming is my teachers teacher and hi's videos really take the time to break down the movements. I've never found better applicatioinal videos by anyone ever. He's a wizard. My coach could really do it but I think he doesn't put up videos like that out of respect for Dr. YAng.@@asswuppin

[@Flatland_Heresy]

I appreciate the explanation, how distinctly training for real fight, differs from the overly soft training seen in modern public Taiji practice.

[@nineyardssongs1015]

Wow that's really good explanation.I just started learning Chen Style so it was really interesting to know..Thank you for sharing.Much appreciated 🙏

[@robohippy]

Hope you are doing well. I did get a short work shop with you at Sifu David Leung's school here in Eugene. I really wish I could have started this at a young age. I will remember your presentation forever.

[@stephenengstrom5611]

Former student like most of you. He looks great and gives(shows) some excellent examples of how to train this stuff!

[@RocknRollkat]

I've been practicing this for years. Most Tai Chi "practitioners" think I'm nuts. But this is REAL Tai Chi, not the Mao Tse Tung stuff you see in the park these days . Bill P.

[@asswuppin]

When you say "real" .. do you mean that it has practical application in combat? If so, would you mind elaborating? I'm interested if your are willing to share. For someone like me who is uninitiated, I can't see the practicality in the movements. I would love to learn more about it .. but without insight, I'm just kidding myself. Any help?

[@RocknRollkat]

@@asswuppin Tai Chi was originally a martial art before Mao banned ALL martial arts in 1949 (seriously). He brought it back in 1955 as a health exercise, which is what you see today. Do a youtube search for "tai chi combat applications" and see many videos loke this. Enjoy ! kzbin.info/www/bejne/a3m0n6iNjpZml8U&ab_channel=IT%E4%B9%90%E6%89%8B

[@madjidchouarbi3921]

@@asswuppin Hello ! If you want to learn about Tai Chi Chuan's fighting techniques, I recommand you the book from Dr Yang Jwing Ming. It's about Yang School and really shows how Tai Chi Chuan is a legit and practical Kung Fu style.

[@lgv3051]

Great! Who else is teaching this on KZbin? No one. Thank you Master George 👍👍

[@madnessbydesignVria]

I've done many workshops with Master George. If you ever get the chance, I highly recommend it. His energy is tremendous, and he's very generous with his knowledge (and he can be very funny). I'm glad he's still teaching, and someone is recording these lessons... :)

[@antarshakti3093]

Very nice and important video on Tai Chi. Thank you Sifu 🙏💐

[@fireatwill8143]

What a great guy! 👍🤗 .

[@ShredST]

I like this description of Yang style as ball with two dragon claws.

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

Gotta have those, right

[@georgcantor7172]

I have a bronze statue of a Chinese dragon carrying a globe. The dragon has a big smile on its face and doesn't look menacing at all.

[@stonehand49]

I got to do a seminar with him and his teacher years ago. Changed my life❤

[@huwhitecavebeast1972]

What a knowledgeable individual. Very proficient. He may be old but his legs are still strong.

[@Painfullyshy5650]

Tai chi has kept your body young. You are still very supple with amazing movement, graceful and powerful. Thank you for sharing your knowledge.

[@mikeykostelny6817]

Good morning grandmaster do you ever come to California or LA anyway I like the dragon forsure

[@jackalofalltrades8705]

Amazing explanation I love it ❤

[@Ador828]

What he said about Yang Lu Chan , (who purportedly was amazing at taichi and spear )and softening it for court people is true. also Yang Cheng fu changed big frame yang style 3 times each time making it easier more accessible. Old yang style was very martial. Master xu is really a master.

[@AM-lh7rw]

Oh, that is interesting 🤔, about Chen and Yang. Met Master Xu when he was in London during the late 90's and again in the early 2000's in taichi seminars.

[@C-handle-r]

Do you know the 13 Luohan Qi Gong postures? It seems to me as if those movements are in alignment with how the Chen style is meant.

[@TaoistMovementArts]

Very nice

[@steveg219]

Excellent demonstration of the difference between these two styles

[@amakrid]

This man knows his stuff and he is very persuasive.

[@mikeykostelny6817]

I would like ask both of you to do a video together to catch Chinese culture

[@johnbishop9000]

Gratitude ! 🤜🫷☯️

[@grrmtthgrrmtth3000]

Just beautiful

[@dvblove]

Can you recommend some one in nyc

[@asswuppin]

I second that. Although I am a complete novice to internal arts.

[@gregoriocaragan1246]

Most Yang Style Tai Chi focuses on health now a days. fighting techniques are secondary. Hence, it's the most popular

[@wallybingbang4350]

Zhan Zhuang will benefit your health 10 minutes each morning is all you need ☮️

[@CottonBoxer]

when i teach yang style, i always teach them hand to foot. i also let them feel me all the way to my foot. granted many times it's not taught that way. many teachers simply don't know this element. their focus on their empty form is what they give them. ewl lol

[@JAHLEADINI]

he is so healthy!!!

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

Yep. At 74

[@Abbbb225]

can you do the videos without the cuts? it would be easier to track what he is saying

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

You can watch the whole lesson on Patreon, no cuts.

[@nephilim2051]

I started with Yang, then moved to Wu style. Every morning for a decade, which includes my entire highschool, I'd go to the park and observe the old Chinese masters train. One eventually noticed me and took me in. I've trained in many styles since then. Including Krav Maga and taekwon do, which I have a back belt in. Kicks aren't prevalent in southern kung fu, hence I did tae kwon do for leg techniques. No one style has everything.

[@georgcantor7172]

Did you do BJJ and MT too?

[@ミュラートム-l9g]

徐谷鳴老師 陳式太極拳上海架、心意六合拳、攬手拳、八卦掌、凌空神勢門名家

[@DrunkenDarwin]

Great kung fu I came to the same conclusions about the two style's conceptualization.

[@dwainmolinaro2350]

Thanks for Trying😊

[@GordiansKnotHere]

Beautiful movements and extremely powerful... Thanks for this! EDIT: Subscribed IS this teacher still with us and where does he teach?

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

Thank you. Yes, that lesson was recorded a few weeks ago. He’s in San Francisco. Currently, his lessons are on Patreon. He may teach an occasional private lesson.

[@andrewc1236]

brilliant

[@ozsvathlaszlo6805]

Véry very Good and interesting!!

[@johnpeck5268]

For 60 year I have focused on just 2 basic movements that flow into many variations. Very simple.but drift effortlessly into different animal forms instantly with no conscious thought. The Green Dragon Society claims 2400 different moves. Too complicated! Master 2 simple systems & you will master them all. Repetition makes them instinctive. Cloud hands & the corn grinder.

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

That’s awesome.

[@johnpeck5268]

Much of the beautiful moves in Aikido can be made from these systems, It is worthwhile to study both for Aikido may have evolved in a similar way.Both stress more on control than on strikes.@@goldengateliontiger8972

[@johndough8115]

You can not Over-Simplify everything. Some things need to be complex, and always WILL be complex. Furthermore... you can not perform highly precise movements, without developing each individually... and developing specific Attributes for each skill / movement. As example, could be as simple as training an Eagle Claw movement, to Grasp an Arm or Adams Apple. The Attribute training, would include: Max Limb Acceleration, and Max Limb speed. As well as Max Grip Strength + Finger Crushing Strength. Then there is drills to develop Pinpoint, repeatable, Accuracy and Control. As well as lessons and practices, in learning how to set up the Opponent... so that you can get the Grip, without them being able to easily evade, or escape. Then there is further instruction and practices, of how to transition from a partial grip / lock... (as the OP is actively fighting to escape) ... into a completely different grip / lock... to prevent the OP from easily breaking free. Now... While some Athletes are very good at doing many different athletic tasks... they are usually unable to match the performance of someone that Specifically trains a certain discipline / skill. For example... An Olympic Gymnast may have incredible acrobatics, muscle strength, and bodily control... BUT... they cant throw a baseball as Fast.. nor as accurate, as a PRO Baseball Pitcher. Nor could they run and jump the Hurdles.. as well as an Olympic hurdle runner. Each specific Skillset, requires specific Masteries. I like to think of each Skill, like a TOOL in a toolbox / workshop. While you can cut a lot of things with a Simple Axe... Its far more effective to cut certain things with a Handsaw, Bandsaw, or Tablesaw. In some cases, you might even use a Chisel, or maybe even a Japanese Flush Cut saw (for cuts where you dont have room for large tools). The same is true of your martial arts tools. If you want the most simple.... learn an art like Muay Thai. Its very basic and general movements... that are very easy to quickly master. HOWEVER... when pit against a much higher level arts methods... the Muay Thai fighter wont have any working answers. I used Wing Chun's advanced "Leg Fencing" methods, to easily nullify Muay Thai kicks, without having to take any Impact damages to my own legs. And my Trapping hand skills... made it very easy to break down these sport fighters guards... and be able to hit them... while they were unable to hit / counter me. That said... I developed all of my skills to Masterclass level. Where as most modern people whom train in the Chinese arts... never master a single thing that they were taught... and something that isnt fully mastered, tends to FAIL when put under the speed, power, and stresses, of heavy contact sparring / fighting. Now... Im not saying that there is no way to Improve, Consolidate, and Speed up developments. There are ways to reduce some complexity... while maintaining the correct developments and attribute building. Its just that... more often than not... when people try to reduce things... they often remove Critical things, which ends up making the Art "Inferior" and or completely breakings its sum-total combat level functionality. One final word about "Instinct". When you have trained something repeatedly and intensely enough... no matter how complex or "Weird" it may initially seem... it eventually becomes EASY, and NATURAL... and you can preform these things Flawlessly without any "Thought" involved. But again... this requires a hardcore combat mindset. The willingness and willpower, to train that long and intensely... to be able to go from "Worthless", to "Decent", and eventually arrive at "Flawless / Perfection".

[@spinningdragontao]

An interesting video. I'm not sure I would agree with the characterisations so much but I notice that Master George Xu said "I feel" a lot in his explanations so his opinion is valid but it is only an opinion, (like this is mine). I think the origins are murky, I think that scholars are trying to discover more but that timelines, distances of specific places, modes of travel etc mean that the accepted history may indeed not be the actual history. Regardless it has no effect on how we train today.

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

Thanks for the comment. Martial art origin stories always have to be taken with a grain of salt. I had only heard the official story, but the two styles sure do look different.

[@TheTwsa]

I simply cannot get enough of this guys tai chi. amazing!

[@oumski6893]

😊😊😊

[@mikeykostelny6817]

Now he is working all the time so currently just working

[@MrSinusu]

Whether it is Chen style or whatever, is it practical? Martial art should be martially effective.

[@eprd313]

Yes, people used taiji to fight in the army. The thing is, people think they can learn how to climb and do backflips before they learn hownto even crawl. In order to understand taiji well you need to already know how to fight decently. Then, taiji principles (which are internal, ie. Very subtle ot visible to the untrained eye) will become the most powerful tools you have. But again, you need the basics and you need practice. Training only forms won't help. Training only push hands won't help. You need to spar too, an be flexible, and have stamina and strength, and know how to punch hard so that you can refine that until it becomes as efficient as humanly possible. And for that you need time: slow movements, high awareness, develop sensitivity, balance, calmness of mind. That is taiji: the supreme ultimate fist.

[@eprd313]

Look up Chen Ziqiang if you want a better demonstration of martial applications. And in MMA there are two great Chinese fighters that train taiji that I know, one is Weili Zhang but right now I can't remember the name of the other guy.

[@congdothanh9316]

Appreciate! Dragon or Ball!

[@ffod123]

This is the real deal. No nonesense wisdom.'

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

Thanks.

[@mikeykostelny6817]

It's all true what you say is hundred percent true

[@tanchiiann4237]

I feel like you were very exhausted playing Chen Taichi😅😅😅 R u ok ok?

[@philmachineman8927]

Sir.. This was excellent, but your shortness of breath is concerning, for the level of exertion.... Hope you are in good health.

[@TheDub7]

Definitely a little short of breath as he is older now, not sure what age, you will be old someday too, life is a circle. Having said all of that, I still wouldn't like to try and rob him in the post office for example, he still has enough power to render you unconscious which you sound like you are a bit anyway ?

[@deerock2374]

dont touch my ball😂

[@mikeykostelny6817]

My shifu is Lijun wang of the chen style combat he is really great with chin na's

[@gracepoint-vo1hy]

❤❤❤

[@thedoctor7151]

I guess I was only taught dragon

[@Typhoon911]

Don't touch my dragon ball.

[@snmailist1470]

Just knew that Yang Luchan was real person. I thought he just character name in the movie, Taichi Zero.

[@northkoreamania]

2:00 2:10 3:20

[@alexchen5811]

if you don't spar, any family's style is an empty form. Even Chen style is useless if you don't train realistically or spar.

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

That’s essentially what M Xu has said before. But he doesn’t use the word spar. He says “test.” You test so that you don’t have to fight. But he’s known for fighting too. On one of the lessons he tells the story of how he came up with the tests as a way to bring the old masters together.

[@JS-ob4oh]

A lot of hearsay "history", but no actual definitive proof. Ask 10 people about Yang style and why it is what it is and you will get at least 10 different answers.

[@selimdemirkol8333]

Çin dans sanatları

[@Gieszkanne]

I dont think that Yang Luchan learned the family Chen boxing in Chenjiagou. Yang style is much to different from Chen style. Also the older forms that are linked to Luchan or his sons. From the storys Yang Luchan could also fight and defeat other martial artist. Some say that he was even better then Chen Fake.

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

Interesting. I didn’t know that there was any question about Chen being the origin Yang style.

[@Gieszkanne]

@@goldengateliontiger8972 Luchan learned something from Chen Changxing there is no doubt but the question is what did he taught him. Its said that Changxing learned also a style from a Jiang Fa. And in the family genealogy ist not mentioned what style Changxing did practiced. You can read about this in some blog articles and even wiki. Yang style Master Wang Zhizhong wrote a book about Taiji. The first 100 pages are almost just about this issue. Its very interesting. I think that simple farmers from a small village are the creators of Taijiquan is communist propaganda. By the way Yang Luchan was the first who called his style Taijiquan.Before that he called is Cotton or Soft Boxing. Chen Fake was the first who did call the Chen family style Taijiquan after Yang Luchan did.

[@oskarlindberg3711]

@@Gieszkanne If you practice both you can easily see that the Yang long form is based on the Chen yilu form.

[@ambulocetusnatans]

@@Gieszkanne People were saying that long before the Communists. The Chen village had several various routines, and *in my opinion*, Yang LuChan learned the first set of Long Fist and some supplementary exercises like push hands. Yang then took this long set and added some weapons that he learned from another source to make it a style. This is why the empty hand routines of the 2 styles are so similar, but the weapons are so different. Once Yang's art started to get popular, the folks back at the village took all of their various routines and collected them under the umbrella term of TaiJiQuan. Chen Fa Ke was born after Yang LuChan was already dead. Yang was the first to call his art "TaiJi", but the folks back at the village had started using that name by the time Chen Fa Ke started teaching. It just wasn't that well known yet.

[@Gieszkanne]

@@ambulocetusnatans Doubts that the Chen style is what Yang learned in Chenjiagou were long before China became communist. 1917 Wu Tunan traveled to Chenjiagou to study the history of Taijiquan. He wrote a book about this and came to the conclusion that Yang didnt learned what is known as Chen style. He researched a lot and interviewed Chen Xin. They called their style Shaolin Paochui. As I wrote in the book of Wang ZhiZhong are around 100 pages just about this subject. You can also find similarities in other long fist styles. This say nothing. There are masters who know both styles very well who think that Yang learned something different.

[@Pddy-je8pn]

SUUUUUBscribed!

[@goldengateliontiger8972]

Thanks

[@mooselee902]

You sit in a really wide ma

[@misterlau5246]

Sifu, chou zan Ok I see what you are doing here. I don't want to disregard your historical knowledge because it is something that we read... Oh, and I'm not a taijichuan ren, I'm the disciple of late sifu Segundo Hsieh Who lived in Vinces, Los Ríos, Ecuador... Wing chun Chuan from Yip Man lineage by William Cheung branch of the art. Close range only wushu, I mix it with plain external boxing, and being a Guangdong descendant, I've seen LOTS of choy li fut 🤕 and animal forms, siulam and all those monkey styles 😅 (IMHO better suited for modern needs than the fancier ones) and the eagle, tiger, snake, dragon... Yeah those are tricky... I agree with being more like dragon and spiraling internal like snake and forward like tiger. 🤔 😬 But you know dragon "ball" no pun intended, but the chi ball, that movement where you grab the ball and do a turn.. 😬I was told in that dragon style sample from my elders 😲🤯 that ball is opponent's head and the dragon just broke his neck with those 🤔 I don't know if this can be visualized as anything else than the dragon jaws getting the ball and turning from the ground up 😬😬😬 The way I saw it at work was a ingenious contraption that simulated a human head with neck. Solid build 😬 well, the dragon definitely broke the contraption's neck. So it's very likely to kill the opponent if trying to perform this technique 😬

[@henrytep8884]

I thought the man was going to legit shoot a kameha-meha

[@danguillou713]

I've been training tai chi and other fighting systems for two or three decades. I watch and read and think about this stuff quite a bit. I'm not an expert, but I am a good student. And I didn't understand a single thing he said. So either he's a really bad teacher or it was all bullshit.

[@smithystube]

Seems to me you were a really bad student then. If you practice any neijiaquan for more than say 3-5 years and you dont understand what Master Xu is takling aout then sorry but you wasted your time.

[@françoishainry]

Chen style : canon fist until 1952. After it's become Taiji Quan ! I am all right with Gieszkanne : “I dont think that Yang Luchan learned the family Chen boxing in Chenjiagou. Yang style is much to different from Chen ”.

[@oskarlindberg3711]

If you practice both you can easily see that the Yang long form is based on the Chen yilu form.

[@françoishainry]

​@@oskarlindberg3711thanks for the advice I studied the style with “Wang Xian” in 1989 and tried again with “Huang Kang Hui” in 2005 and got bored, Sorry

[@oskarlindberg3711]

@@françoishainry it's fine to get bored, it's not for everyone. And depends on the teacher also. :)

[@françoishainry]

​@@oskarlindberg3711 Wang Xian ( 19th generation of Chen style Taiji Quan Grand Masters. Wang Xian is a globally recognized reference. In recognition of his dedication, in 1977 he was elevated by the Chinese state to Grand Master of Chen Style Taiji Quan and National Advanced Wu Shu Trainer. He occupies the highest position of responsibility for the teaching of Taiji in Chenjiagou.) Huang Kang Hui (6 time champion of China in Chen style, who is now a chef from the taijiquan department at Beijing Sports University.)

[@ambulocetusnatans]

@@françoishainry Unfortunately, the best martial teachers are not always the best historians. Wu Yuxiang, a student of Yang Luchan and the eventual founder of Wu (Hao)-style tai chi, was known to have briefly studied the Chen Family small frame system under Chen Qingping. Wu told Chen that Yang's style was becoming popular and they were calling it TaiJiQuan. Of course that doesn't prove when the Chen family started calling their style "TaiJi", but certainly they were calling it that by the time of Chen Xin (1849-1929)

[@cantan111]

no dragon, dragon is a commie

[@timemanagementisinvesting]

So both are nonsense, right? Yet both look good for health. 👍🏼

[@yongxianhuang540]

The demonstration is not so good!

[@trobson9952]

Yong why you say that ?

[@round69]

He may be a nice guy,. and don´t get me wrong ,. from yang style he don´t understand anything,. neither the movements and certainly not inner principles,.. yes he is right it´s about ball ,. but thats it,. better go to yangstyle masters from this line

[@mustamuri]

Not Tai Chi ...he don't know nothing...

[@aapiElder]

Too many master of none. Big bs'er.