Choosing the Perseus over the Polaris?

Are you new and want to play Star Citizen? Use my referral code STAR-LLVH-YMVM and get an extra 5,000 UEC (you'll need it trust me) to spend in game! see you in the PU!
Zeus MKII MR Giveaway • Zeus MK II MR Giveaway...
You can now support the channel by becoming a member, click the join button and select a tier. i am planning members only streams and play sessions!

[@AuricNova]

I chose the Perseus for many of the same reasons as you. Also the operating cost of a torpedo boat is going to be so much higher and I already have an Odyssey which, is basically the industry/exploration equivalent to the Polaris. I just need a low crew tank to guard my industrial endeavors with.

[@Marlax-101]

i have picked up the perseus today and ill give my reasons. 1. its a large ship so it can go the same places as a large fleet. and wont be forced to take capital jumps. 2. it isnt only a ship but anti air battery for land bases. 3.more viable in atmo esp from a landed position. 4. working with a large fleet the only function i wont have access too is the brig. 5. i see it more as a armored cruiser and in game it was phased out by the idris so i would assume its capable of simular tasks. 6. crew size- even when fighting something like an idris ect lets say they have 30 people- you can fully crew 5 pers and get close enough to take down the idris most likely. 7. easier to maintain and have redundant parts between ships. 8.style points.

[@geronimo5537]

Its really the fun size of large fighting ships. You can take hits without shields and still get away. I think its going to shine with pyro. Though I do hope we can fit more than just an ursa in the hanger in its final form.

[@Marlax-101]

@@geronimo5537 i think people obsess a bit to much with vehicles in ships. something like that i would probably load it down with ammo. it has to load internally so that 20 s5 torps and teh guns ammo is equal to how many rounds you have inside. you could have 200 torps in there

[@generalrendar7290]

The Polaris isn't for everyone. Neither of the gameplay loops are in the game right now. The Perseus requires less crew and the Polaris is designed to fight capital ships. The Perseus can fight larger and smaller ships than itself and can easily operate with a couple heavy fighters. Server size need to increase significantly before the Polaris is viable.

[@marcuswynn89]

Also I think the crewed gameplay needs to have an advantage over being solo, although I can see people trying to solo their capital ships lol

[@terrandysart3587]

Man i don't even care ill play pretend in that thing ifni have to for the next 5 years lol. It's the perfect bounty hunting homebase. I'm also definitely going to solo my capitol ships if i have to lol. But I'm sure my org will be more than happy to ride along

[@captainharlock3998]

Polaris will come in the verse in 2024 though, Galaxy next, and Perseus last. viable or not, Polaris will be much earlier in the Verse. And there are plenty of targets : 890, Reclaimer, HH, anything 100m and up really. Overkill? Absolutely, but viable.

[@jedi_drifter2988]

My decision for pledging the Perseus was crew size, 4 in safe space, 6 in hostile space. The second reason is overall cost. Everything on the Polaris will cost up to 3 X as much, especially those Size 10 torps, not to mention the Capital components. You might only be able to pick up the Size 10 torps and Cap. components in certain systems that have Capital repair/manufacturing ship yards. Whereas large components can be found almost at any decent space station or landing area, although size 7 ammo could be a slight problem, but is easier to store in your hold and still cheaper in price than size 10 torps.

[@krokenlochen]

I love my Perseus, and I wish it would take precedence over the Galaxy. But it is what it is. I want to get the Polaris for more utility reasons.

[@lordsheogorath3377]

I like the Polaris because of it's logistical abilities. The Medbay, cargo capacity, and hanger make it a good choice for a small org. For the most part we won't be using it as a front-line combat ship but as a mobile base. I think the Polaris will be optimal with around 8-10 people. Add AI to some of the turrets and the issue with crew become much easier to solve long term.

[@marcuswynn89]

Yeah there is no telling when ai turrets will be in the game though.

[@captainharlock3998]

I'll use my Polaris solo with 100% AI blades and NPC crew. I know they won't be here for years. I'm aware of that. However CIG was clear that we WILL be able to use only blades and NPC for the Hammerhead, which is about as crew intensive as the Polaris, and I am waiting to wait to fully enjoy that Carrack on steroids.

[@themanyouwanttobe]

Much of the gameplay isn't in game yet. To plan something like a capital ship purchase around current gameplay is shortsighted. NPC crew will play a significant role in crew and fleet compositions. A single captain fully reliant on NPCs may not be effective compared to a player crew but filling out every position with a human player may be an inefficient use of what will be a fleet's most valuable resource.

[@captainharlock3998]

@@themanyouwanttobe You're right, and while CIG did say that player crews will be better than NPC crews, they also did say that there will be different tier of NPC and the best ones would be quite competant at what they do. Also, one must consider that now EVERY turrets need be manned on every ship. If I has a Hammerhead with NPC crew, I'd blade 4 turrets (like they said would be possible with stock componants) and use 2 NPC, one engineer that would jump in the bottom turret if needed and a pure gunner for the top turret. While the Polaris sprouted more turrets than before, that does not mean every single one need be manned. As long as you have one on top, bottom, larboard and starboard, you're good to go. Blade them all and save the NPC crew for other stations, like torpedo.

[@nazaxprime]

​@@captainharlock3998 Me too, but blades vs an actual well trained crew running the aame vessel is going ro be a bloodbath. Luckily, there are lots of outfitting options so were going to see a variety of encounters, but yeah, I don't have any illusions of overpowering groups with equivalent material asset compositions.

[@USIGNLOOFID]

The crew size is important, but I like the speed offered by the Polaris. The ability to engage at long range and stay out of trouble if needed. The Polaris also offers a larger range of mission capabilities. Med bay and hanger for a start allows for search and rescue missions.

[@strongback6550]

I wouldn't bank too much on the speed as the matrix of lies and brochures are quite inconsistent with end products, especially in regards to ships this big.

[@USIGNLOOFID]

@@strongback6550 Well at the moment, that is all we can really go on.

[@adamconner9302]

You touched on what matters most, viability. You'll be able to create more opportunities to actually use a perseus hands down. Logistics are a really big deal

[@nuclearsimian3281]

Well, they do have different roles, and one very good use of the Polaris is one-hit KO'ing NPC ultra high tier bounties in ERT missions, you hit an Idris with those Size 10 torps, its gonna die quick. Then you immediately roll into the next mission. If you have a smallish group that wants a good bounty running session, that's how you do it, its an ultra-Eclipse in that regard. Right now it might only be best for farming cash, but it will have a role when it comes to groups having the people needed to man one, or several to take out an opposing org's Javelin or Idris gang. A wolf pack of Polaris corvettes is an astonishingly insane concept.

[@nazaxprime]

It depends on the organization really. I can see orgs excelling at even capital level ops, but for most, we need to keep our expectations tight.

[@redfiredrag5544]

The design of the perseus is just perfection imo... I would love to have that ship one day

[@alphacentauri3069]

The Perseus has some pretty glaring flaws. Like it’s remote turret placement and almost total lack of effective anti fighter deterrent.

[@marcuswynn89]

@alphacentauri3069 if the Perseus is bad then the Polaris is worse

[@redfiredrag5544]

@@alphacentauri3069 considering the role of the perseus it HAS to fight in a small group out of fighters protecting the perseus, while the ship itself fires the cannons on something bigger

[@santobell]

The crew size is only an issue in the short term as NPC crew and system blades will be a thing and as both are S42 components it's likely to see them in the nearer not further future. Glass has been confirmed many moons ago by Chris to not be any different structurally than the the hulls of the ship as it's "Not Glass" but a transparent alloy in the same vein as the transparent Aluminum we have in use today in bomb proof vehicles. Also the Polly sits in a ship size that makes it a scary thing to see in game, it's not likely to be the first ship people want to toe with when stumbled across out in the black. Lastly and my personal main arguments for the Polly over Perse is the Hangar and Med Bay. This positions the Polly as a home base for operations that will become more and more important as the game expands. I have both ships, in fact I have most RSI ships (I love struts), so I don't really have to face the option but I would still pick the Polly in this matchup. I'd take a Galaxy over the Perseus even at the loss of the big guns to once again get a Med bed and small hangar.

[@jedi_drifter2988]

My decision for pledging the Perseus was crew size, 4 in safe space, 6 in hostile space. The second reason is overall cost. Everything on the Polaris will cost up to 3 X as much, especially those Size 10 torps, not to mention the Capital components. You might only be able to pick up the Size 10 torps and Cap. components in certain systems that have Capital repair/manufacturing ship yards. Whereas large components can be found almost at any decent space station or landing area, although size 7 ammo could be a slight problem, but is easier to store in your hold and still cheaper in price than size 10 torps.

[@Cheesebread42]

@3:22 "it's got the 28 size 10 rods from the Lord Christ Roberts himself"

[@ShadowGirl-]

One thing that's important for the Perseus is that it has customizable ammo, it may be able to electromagnetically charge the ammo to do extra shield damage instead of penetration, or something designed for disabling, or perhaps extra armor penetration. Personally however I see myself as a Polaris captain, with so many options and possibilities open to me. You mention not using it in atmosphere, but I think it's meant for it with the folding wings for control surfaces, and the nice side ramp. Although I can picture myself storing a C8x or C8r in the cargo area, as a nice little shuttle craft, in addition to a Scorpius and 85x up top or maybe a hawk someday for bounty hunting. The capital class radar in the smallest ship still able to do atmospheric flight decently, will be nice for more peaceful exploration trips, although in combat mode it seems to fold these in so it doesn't seem ideal for atmospheric battles (given how master-modes are set to change things). But the Scorpius with it's 4 wings should be amazing with upcoming atmospheric flight changes. So it's not only the fact that it has many options/facilities, but the capital class components. I believe far down the road we will be focused on science gameplay where we make/upgrade moduals that slot into ship components, and the components able to use the best/biggest/most moduals will be capital sized components. I just feel like this is the biggest all-rounder ship before you become unwieldy to manage or land anywhere. And when "death of a spaceman" becomes serious, having a hit-run attack style will equate to longer lifespan. The inforunners did a couple videos on how you'd defend a Polaris and how you'd attack it, and in general unless you can really pin it down, it can just run to safety every-time.

[@laurent3805]

Good analysis, I may reconsider my choice between those babies! Polaris make good point for long range journey but Perseus will certainly be more useful on a daily basis … cheers from France, really enjoy your content

[@charlescassels3826]

CIG recently said that they want all ships to be solo-able, even capitals. I’m not sure how that’ll work out for them, but I could at least see the turrets manned by blades or NPCs, which helps the crew count. As for the hanger, I plan on using it for either a 2-seat fighter that I can carry an extra person in as a runabout, or a Pisces to be able to run down to planets and save fuel.

[@marcuswynn89]

i doubt that given the engineering gameplay

[@casselsc]

I totally agree. I don't see the AI being responsive enough to properly prioritize and execute engineering tasks. At least having AI gunners would reduce the crew requirement back to the high single digits. I don't count the fighter as an additional crew requirement as I don't plan on using it in combat. @@marcuswynn89

[@FoRm4t123]

solo-able if npc crew and ai blades ever make it into the game, but you will absolutely get destroyed by real players, i can solo a hammerhead in a gladius witch is supposed to be anti fighter.

[@ThePearlJam]

@@marcuswynn89 they have stated multiple times they want "all" ships to be solo-able. Now, what that actually means is debatable - could be that you can "solo" it with NPC crew and AI blades, but the default programming of the blades/NPC crew is such that you can't really get into any kind of PvP with them. basically you can "get by" in PvE with just hired NPC/blades. But this is CIG and SC - its not like they've changed their minds before...

[@wafflesinsanity]

They have NEVER said that capital ships will be "soloable" they have said that a person could pilot a capital ship. But you will never effectively solo any capital ships, they have repeatedly stated that the longer you have a ship, the more difficulty you will have utilizing said ship. Anyone who thinks NPC blades or AI will remove the requirements for multicrew is simply coping. Ill say the same thing Pirates say to Haulers when they complain about game features "just hire an...." engineer, gunner, pilot, etc.

[@kilozulu2413]

You make good points about the Polaris. I own one, and I've always been concerned about how effective the torpedoes will be. If they're easy to shoot down, or jam, the Polaris becomes a sitting duck. We'll have to wait and see, but it already sounds like the torps are going to be the size of a small ship, and cost as much as one.

[@charlescassels3826]

I’ve been hoping they make a railgun Polaris, I’d get an upgrade kit for my Polaris in a heartbeat.

[@rahlap2449]

I agree with the crew size but one thing where the polaris takes the cake is that hangar. I think everyone needs a ship to fly their small ships around eventually. I own the Gladius and Sabre Raven as my small ships that cant fly long distances on their own. The only ships that can transport them are: Odyssey, Merchantman, Polaris, Idris, Javelin. Out of these I think the Polaris is the best choice.

[@Anjiofchaos]

I got both, looking forward to them both! 😊

[@chrisweiland4549]

Good comparison. As an owner of both (well, currently) there are a couple points I have a different perspective on. First, I think the Polaris cockpit has the edge. IRL, we spend way more on windshield glass per square cm than we do for the hull of the shuttle. It's meant to withstand hypervelocity impacts, crazy stuff. In a sci-fi world, they usually just call it "transparent aluminum" a la Star Trek and treat it like an extension of the hull. More important I think is their location. While both don't allow for rear views, the Perseus blocks the entire lower hemisphere from sight. In terms of awareness, the Polaris doesn't just have the edge from it's cockpit, but it's capital class radar will see ships well before our eyes do. That's huge. The other is the crew. The Polaris was originally 8 min 24 max but was reduced to 6 and 14, and most of those 8 extra crew are probably better as NPCs anyway. Stuff like a hangar tech, a medbay doc, and turret gunners might be fun to play for a little while but not for hours on end, and NPCs won't have RL distractions or get bored. Their mins are both 6 on paper, but running skeleton I'd say 4-5 for the Perseus and 5-6 for the Polaris given what we know. Not a huge difference. RL cost (for now) favors the Polaris because you get a lot more ship for $75. Op costs favor the Perseus big time, large ships are affordable but a capital will need an economy to support it.

[@marcuswynn89]

You are getting a lot more ship what happens though when you’re torpedos get shot down or do hit their target you really don’t have the means to stay in the fight, I think the Perseus does a better job at sustained fighting overall despite not having the med bay and things of that nature. I do expect the Polaris to increase in price

[@thefarmgames]

Hey man, just wanted to say, I love your videos man. Love your comparisons. Great stuff.

[@kay31095]

i feel like your point is very valid, but when they add AI crew that big "14 man" number becomes a lot smaller

[@TheRedEyeChannel]

FYI, the glass portions aren't supposed to be glass. It's transparent steel and is actually stronger than the rest of the ship and is more expensive to make

[@ThaFiggyPudding]

Great video. I'm really excited about both these ships, but I agree that we need the supporting game loops and an easier way to crew up before it makes sense for most people.

[@ricky6608]

The ‘glass’ is actually the strongest and most expensive part of the hull - its transparent adamantium

[@geronimo5537]

robertium

[@ricky6608]

@@geronimo5537 it’s Copium alloy

[@marcuswynn89]

@ricky6608 that’s a good one

[@Stratobrick]

5:00 you are right about the safety of the bridge being midship. Although I believe in lore, the. "Glass" is a clear alloy that is just as strong as hull plating

[@tonyjohnson8362]

we are on the same page! I have a Perseus! can't wait til its released.

[@marcuswynn89]

Let me borrow a dollar so I can get one too 😂

[@honeyspringshomestead1411]

My personal choice was Perseus too. My thinking was it fit what I wanted it to do. Big guns, check. Cargo hold for Ursa, check. Landing planetside, check. Low crew count, check. So yeah, it can do many things and not pigeonhole someone to one or two roles only. I suppose the downside we know about is no medical beds, at least for now. Time will tell if it gets med beds and if the bespoke cannons can be changed out or not for something else.

[@nuclearsimian3281]

Picked up a Polaris myself already, gonna grab a Perseus when I have the next chance. If I need something that hit and fades, I'll take the Polaris. If I need a brawler, I'll take the Perseus. It all depends on how many people I have available, what the gang wants to do, and how we want to approach it. If we want to make some dosh, we'll be using the Polaris and running group VHRT/ERT missions, everyone benefits from getting as many done as possible, thus torps are the best option for rapid hit and kill tactics. If we just want to do Xenothreat or the like, then Perseus, get the hell up on the target and just BRRT it to pieces.

[@bloodstoneoperator5372]

I’m in the same boat as you. I’m glad the Polaris is in the works, look forward to seeing it. But I doubt I’ll ever be able to crew it, and would enjoy tuning on other capital ships more.

[@dereksherwood3794]

In re: command center glass. I forget where, but way back when, King Roberts the Warden of the North Star, clarified that cockpits and windows aren't glass, just transparent metal of the same strength as the rest of the ship. So, the material isn't weaker. But it IS an easy visual bullseye for enemy gunners to target the command crew. It really should have an armored visor like the Carrack.

[@philipp1716]

Would be nice if u can just put another Metal layer above with displays

[@nubbinzawyer]

I remember hearing this too. The reason the material isn't used in more of the ships is because the transparent metal is more expensive...

[@macaw172]

All very good points, crew size has kinda solidified the Perseus for me as well. the cost of rearming the Polaris and torpedo quantity is another thing to consider and the Perseus armed with large energy cannons will allow you to stay in the fight much longer. if you want a ship throw a fury in the storage compartment. If you can muster a crewed hammerhead to fly close formation with the Perseus the hammerhead will provide antifighter support and they are effective at intercepting enemy torpedoes. the compliment each ship will provide will make it a very potent force.

[@wrextheblind3787]

Idk how I can across this channel but I enjoy this style of video

[@michaelarnold6848]

I chose the polaris, not to be against you in any way. I want to explore large crew dynamics and the org i am in allows me the diversity to do that. I feel that the polaris for me will be a perfect fit for that.

[@NerdyWolff]

I personally chose the Polaris because of 4 things. 1, I like Capital ships that are tanky, the Polaris has 1 Size 1 Shield Generator. 2, I won't always be using the Polaris as a Combat ship, mostly it will be a mobile base for me so that if I'm operating around crusader I'll just park my Polaris somewhere around there and leave it unoccupied in the middle of nowhere so that no one would find it, while I have a cutlass blue in the hangar to go and do missions and stuff, I think the Polaris will be quite good at this. 3, when I am using it in Combat I can swap my Cutty for a F8C and have that covering the blind spot so that no tiny light fighters can stay under there and deal critical damage (Mainly when fighting unprepared players like someone that it isn't worth wasting missiles on e.g. Reclaimers because even the size 9s are expensive) 4, Rule of cool, the Polaris is almost as big as the 890J, If I saw a Polaris approaching, I'd be shittin' myself whereas the Perseus is smaller than the Hammerhead atm. And also I believe It says "min crew: 6" meaning that's how much crew you need to make it combat effective idk though and also the "max crew: 14" is just the maximum amount of crew you can realistically have (because there's 14 beds) you can still man 4 / 7 turrets, Pilot, Co-pilot, 2 for missile loading, locking and firing, 2 engineers and that's total of only 10 crew. But I am in a large org so when I'm on combat operations I will have enough crew for all 14. But that will obviously not be all the time, and I'm under no illusion that AI crew will be able to do everything as well as a real person does. Great video btw. Good reasons too. I definitely don't blame you for not choosing the Polaris xD

[@SCTimbal]

"It's got the 28 size 10 rods from the Lord Christ Roberts himself." I died. 😂

[@sumosuperstar5588]

1- Love the content. You may have influenced my decision. 2- Good point about the nose being a hot spot for landing hits on the Polaris. 3- I will roll with you... and if you got all the spots filled... then I will escort... See you in the ʻverse.

[@The_Opinion_of_Matt]

According to official game lore the "glass" used in ships isn't glass like we have today. It is instead a transparent diamond laminate that is stronger than steel or whatever metal that is used for the hull. "Great, why not make the whole ship out of it?" you say. The tranparent diamond laminate is extremely expensive. Not a problem for rich boy Origin enjoyers. All other ship makers use a lot less of it.

[@Eraktab]

Holding on to the Polaris CCU from Perseus. Worse case is I melt it. But holding on to it in case in-game I find myself loving the Polaris. Although, I doubt it. Hoping for more Perseus/Arrasta-sized ships. In the end, I'm actually the biggest fan of the RSI Galaxy. Perfect Star Destroyer vibes, hangar, base building, refinery, medical, etc.. It just has everything needed for me and my friends to run around doing different gameplay loops.

[@marcuswynn89]

This is a good idea

[@The_Opinion_of_Matt]

A Polaris, Persus, and Hammerhead would make a formidable hunting party. Throw a Scorpius or Hurricane in the Polaris' hangar and a flight of Vanguards as a fighter screen and call it done.

[@Gaigebacca]

I have a Perseus, and I view it as the rock-paper-scissor to the Capital-Corvette ship dynamic. To me, a Perseus is a Polaris killer, as much as a Polaris is an Idris killer. It should be small enough to out maneuver the Size 10 torps on the Polaris, while still large enough to tank enough of the Polaris' turret fire, to hit back with the 4x S7s and its own arsenal of torpedoes. I also just prefer the aesthetic as sold with the concept of the Perseus, of the classic Navy styling with the decals and angles. I think the ideal role of the Perseus will be as an anti-corvette escort for Cap ships.

[@KnyfFite]

Absolutely man. I love the Perseus, it's just the right size for a small crew. Can't wait to see it out in the verse, but I was really sad to see them put it at the end of RSI's dev plan.

[@marcuswynn89]

Yeah I felt like it should be out before the galaxy

[@KnyfFite]

Me too. Hell, I want it before the Polaris. They're racing towards capital ships, but it's like you said. Only the big orgs and streamers are going to be able to muster the crews for that kinda stuff. It'll look cool and all, but I don't think most of us will get to play like that.

[@tomtato0815]

Ccu from a cheap bmm,if you get one. I also love the persus for it's relative small crew size. It probanly fits in a big fleet, but also with fighter escort as a main ship for ERTs and sutch things. I hope the armor will negate some insta deaths against big torps to some degree. Also the big point for the perseus is the changable ammunitions types

[@RobertP-zk8vh]

the percy is not a solo ship it must be in a fleet with support ships

[@Biggiejohn]

With this statement in mind you would then in fact be better off in a Perseus with 8 other light/medium/heavy fighters on your flanks than just crewing a polaris.

[@artsolano6762]

This is so an point Marcus. Its about crewing it. If you can’t get 6 people on a Polaris, it can’t be run effectively. These ships might end up a hanger queen. Perseus all the way! One thing though I view each ship designed for a different role. The Polaris isn’t meant to stay in a fight. Fire torpedoes and get out. The Perseus is meant as perimeter defense and is strong at a distance. It’s a brawler. The Polaris could be a flag ship of a small fleet having a hanger for repair refuel and rearm. PS I have a Perseus .

[@BesteWare]

I like your content! Greetings from germany! :) To add some grain of salt - 14 people is for manning a ship for some hours, but we'll have missions which will take a few days in our lifetime which means you have to organize shifts with other people and have somebody to jump in etc.

[@gandigooglegandigoogle7202]

frankly speaking i like how you speak clearly, i'm not from an anglophone country, i'm french, and i can say i anderstand you very well, thx for that, thx for us, your comment are interesting!

[@marcuswynn89]

Merci!

[@ncgrave4586]

from playing with a ares inferno and ion and seeing what size 7s can do. then thinking about 4 of those? yeah, they will shred anything below capital class in less than 5 secs of sustained fire.

[@elloco9135]

Have been in the same situation and haven`t found a final solution between Polaris vs Perseus yet. Im gonna wait and see what other ships that size will come in the future.

[@g8trdone]

Neither of these ships are the end-all/be-all of ships, even fully crewed. They are still only doing one part of a fleet's duties...

[@kryllykomar6851]

I feel I should tell you that the glass on these ships most likely is an alloy. They've got transparent aluminum, it's an aluminum alloy compressed into a crystalline structure that is as strong as NY other metal and as crystal clear as glass. But... I still wouldn't put it on the nose of the ship, that's the one spot that gets struck more than any other.

[@jasongiles7897]

Question....would you upgrade from Orion to the Persus for the 25.00$

[@marcuswynn89]

Hell yeah I would

[@amigo3284]

Depends, do you like combat? Or do you like large scale mining operations? As of what we know so far alpha 3.22.1 and the real world money cost of $600-675 Pursues, $750 Polaris: If you like bounty hunting, search and destroy, close/long range combat, bunker missions, escort missions, large ships, engineering gameplay, some medical gameplay, traversing the unknown, small/medium crew, multi role gameplay, potential large cost to operate, large stocking cost (not just amo, but food, meds, armor, guns, fuel, etc.) I would go with Polaris (the ship hanger gives you lots more options) If you like patrolling, escort missions, search and destroy missions, smaller medium/small size ships, medium/close range sustained combat, bridge placement and ascetics, some engineering gameplay, small/medium crew, specific role gameplay, less cost to operate, less to lose when ship is destroyed or stolen, I would say Perseus. If you like large scale mining, non combat income, large cargo, mining in safe zones (have to have escorts if mining in hostile zones), huge ships, industrial look, Aliens movie ship interior (or Dead Space’s USG Ishimura), I would go with the Orion. Keep in mind, CIG will be adding in slave turrets, the ability to higher NPC’s. Slave turrets and NPC crew will be necessary for the longevity of the game. As well as NPC’s being a money dump to keep people playing the game.

[@EC_USC]

Loved the comparison. Thanks for sharing your point of view. 👍

[@roberthoffman7130]

Im your new sub from the CL comparison...binging on your vids i like what i hear.. good job as usual.

[@eugenejackson1358]

There is no glass on the ships. It is translucent steel... or so they have explained. Though I am sure it doesn't count as armor, I am not sure about that. I totally agree with your selection.

[@nazaxprime]

Independence is valuable and the operations cost of larger ships will be pretty prohibitive if not backed by the estimated crew compliments. I'm definitely interested in operating a Polaris, but realistically, given my IRL schedule, running one EFFECTIVELY would likely be an insurmountable challenge. These larger ships will be serious bridge commander simulation commitments. Theres so much more to the game, and not too many go deep into games like that such as Pulsar, or Bridge Commander/etc... Finding a pickup crew, even in SC, is going to be difficult if you want to have anyone that understands the vessel, mission, etc... A crew is a unit and takes time and relationship to run well. This can not be overstated. And remember, if its a 14 man crew, you also need a B team when your crew has to go offline. Rust is a perfect example of what we should expect things to look like when this game really hits the broader community of gamers. It's exciting, but seeing it in action is going to be terrifyingly awesome.

[@arrclyde4325]

Very good critical thinking. Crew size will be a thing. But as said before: max crew is max crew. You need a bed for logout for each crewmember. Also is the life support designed for max crew. Little thing though: CIG has made it clear from very early on that cockpit glass is not a weak point and is as robust as steel.

[@4syates]

I love the Perseus. I assume that in day to day play it will be more fun to have a ship with big guns. Not sure how often you will need those big torpedoes.

[@durrem]

Perseus is designed for ramming Hammerheads! Full speed ahead! Let's go Baby!

[@marcuswynn89]

Perseus gonna smoke a hammerhead

[@stinkratgaming]

I really like everything about the polaris on paper/in my imagination. Having full crew amenities including a tier 2 medbay, a ship hangar that can repair and refuel escort fighters, decent cargo (can theoretically hold fuel, ammo,spare parts etc.) all sounds great and like you could have a nearly self sufficient ship with the armament to put up a good fight against most threats. The reality check though, is how hard to reliably crew it would be, and how expensive it likely would be to maintain a capital ship. Who knows if it would even be profitable to run capital ships? What circumstances would they make the most sense to use? Hard to know when a lot of the gameplay mechanics and ships that these extra large ships are supposed to fight are not in the game yet. I hope CIG has an actual plan and has actually thought about this stuff.

[@Mike5Brown]

Yeah crew sizes are going to become very important and the low crew requirement is one of the things I really like about the Perseus. Although, I kinda feel like CIG needs to just accept the fact that military ships will alway require huge crew complements and basically double it for every combat ship. They need AI crew up and running and also a good way for players to act as officers for them.

[@slikke3794]

Very valid point about the bridge placement that I didn't think about.

[@RiseUpFightForRight]

Great video, youve got a new sub! I've been hung on this decision. Cheers!

[@marcuswynn89]

You’re welcome bro

[@OnionsAndPaste]

great point with staffing problem.

[@brandonlt6434]

The argument always comes down to this for me. I run with a group of 2-5 friends on the game on an average night. That means in theory I could take a Perseus out and have fun with it pretty much any night I please. Now as amazing as the Polaris is, with it's huge crew requirement I see that more as a raid tool. It's the kind of ship that even with proper scheduling and prep might only be a once a week thing. So even with the Perseus being almost as much as a Polaris you still get more bang for your buck.

[@TheJudgeo7]

really interesting thoughts on that, you just got a new subscriber. Looking to buy a Perseus as well soon(ish). cheers!

[@richardweyland2467]

The gun boat is a toe to toe fighter while the missile boat is a long range sniper. The gun boat is a real fighter. It gets my vote too.

[@Nianfur]

I'm wondering what they will be selling the Perseus for. I have a Retaliator Bomber. Not sure if it's a keeper or an expensive LTI token.

[@austin.t5557]

I Promiss you the Polaris is going to be massive. Honestly when you look at whats on paper, I think the size is underestimated, CIG even said they had to blow it up a little bit to fit all the components in. I down graded from a Polaris to a Galaxy and Andromida because yea the crew size, and its 100% combat focused.But its going to be a deadly ship for sure. There some things that need to be pointed out that make the Polaris a little bit of another class of ship all together. things like the latest demo of the Polaris shows it hanger having a Scorpius in it, that's a lot of support fire, also the Polaris has a prison Cells, and a medical wing. Will note, the Polaris had a estimated crew size of 18 for the longest, so I really don't know how much smaller this will be when compared to a Idris. The Persues for sure, is the better small crew ship. Now that's not to say the Perseus doesn't have some issues that could be a deal breaker. The issue a lot of Perseus owners have is the small arms on the ship don't cover enough to protect the ship from large torps, especially on its naked underbelly.

[@Gaigebacca]

The Perseus is small enough, that it should be able to out-maneuver the larger size torps. It is smaller in length than a Carrack. Now, it might grow some, but still... I think the biggest concern torp wise for the Perseus will be size 6 and below, ones that are small enough to be more nimble and fast. So a Harbinger, or a Tali could be a major pain to a Perseus. But one-on-one against a Polaris, I think a Perseus wins that fight most of the time.

[@strmshadow8411]

​@Gaigebacca Pretty sure it unrealistic to think anything that's not mid to fighter size is gonna dodge torps or missiles lol. Its just gonna have to tank it, just like every other near cap ship.

[@Gaigebacca]

@@strmshadow8411 they have actually said otherwise previously. Torps are not missiles. Missiles are relatively low payload with high mobility/agility/speed vs torps being very high payload with low speed/agility. Even from their demo at CitCon, you can see how relatively slow the size 10 torps from the Polaris are to turn and move. All of this is dependent on them staying true with what they have said in the past. Doesn't mean it will be able to out-turn ALL torps, but size 10s, most likely.

[@strmshadow8411]

@@Gaigebacca And I agree with everything you said, but if you think the Perseus or any other large ship is gonna be nimble enough to dodge anything, you might be in for a rude awakening. I think once you get near carrack size your dodging on hopes and dreams. I think your best bet would be to be fired upon at a weird angle and hope the torp has to correct itself by a large amount, or is fired at an extreme range, other than I'd say your out of luck.

[@Gaigebacca]

@strmshadow8411 ofcourse engagement distance will have an impact, and I have a Carrack and a Reclaimer, so I know the handling on larger ships is slow, but so will the torps be also. Reality is, we just won't know until they are in game, it's all speculation until then.

[@hbutler2]

I like both, but i finally came to the conclusion that the Polaris is a bit better because it is more well rounded. I see the polaris as being better at pushing enemies off a desired spot while the perseus is going to be a hold position against attacks. The hangar, med bay, armory, 4x cargo are among the things that will draw more players to join you. I like that the perseus will require less help, but it has less flexibility. In the future A.I. crew will help offset the crew requirement a bit. And i think finding a rando to man a gun for the initial engagement, but let him/her switch to their gladius after big targets are down can entice help. A medical person can man the guns until his help is needed. And the brig will allow bounties and the cargo will allow for real pillaging. If armor ends up being extra important or the perseus sneaks in some additional size and/or features the balance can definitely swing back for me though. I don't think people will have trouble manning either. I like them both better than the hammerhead and getting 10-15 people on an idris starts to add to sound like real work managing people and schedules. Getting an org together with a polaris and a perseus sounds like more fun.

[@fallingangel13]

good info thanks.

[@findern2arm62]

Agree with the glass area, doesn't matter how you rotate the ship and the shields to avoid damage, if you do a role to one side so the top is now the bottom with the perseus, the polaris is still glass..

[@ro0140]

I have all the mentioned ships Perseus, Polaris and the Idris. So I like to think I'm not biased but we all knows that is not true nobody no matter how much you claim to be not bias. Now I don't know how these ships wil preform until they are in-game that's why I have pledged for all of them. We don't know a lot of things about game play with players, npc's, bed amount, etc. If the Idris really need like 30 to 75 people to operate it will be a ship we don't take out unless the Org wants to field one somewhere for some sort of purpose. Now Chris Roberts once told us that the big glaslike panels on ships are specially grown crystal that are for all purposes ingame indestructible but only for bigger ships and bigger panels, this does not count for smaller fighter cockpits. This answer came after the community asked the following question about boarding and the difficulty on breaching ships through the hull or by hacking doors that might lead into a direct fire fight and if they couldn't just blow out and just shoot the big glas windows. So that big cockpit in front of the Polaris might be the only indestructible object on the ship ;) Anyway CIG and Chris choices change a lot if the technology is available and it makes sense to implement it to give an example Chris once told us that there will not be grav boots and gloves for outspace so you can walk on the hull of ships. We have seen grav gloves and a character crawling across the hull of a ship in space so... Another thing I would like to add is that The Perseus is slow mainly because it is very heavily armored. The Polaris is very fast and has almost no armor so the Polaris has not staying power. The Perseus Size 7 turrets are slow to turn make them useless against fighters. The Polaris Size 10 torpedoes are slow and armored so probably only effective towards Capital Ships. The Perseus has no medical bay or ship hangar. The Polaris has a medical bay and a ship hangar. Both the Perseus and the Polaris have the possibility to take a ground vehicle for incursions, fire support and transport of troops. I think the game shows us today, How future missions will change from space to ground and back again. I personally would sooner take the Anvil Carrack than the Perseus as a daily driver with a small group of friends and if the groups grows on certain day's and we have more bodies walking around I might take the Polaris out. Again all things might change with what we know now and when the ships get released. I might melt a ship or two if the gameplay is not there for me and my friend to enjoy. --- For anyone if you do not have one of both of the ships and you want to buy them, but think the price is too high at the moment try to pick up a cheap CCU to lock in the price of the ship before it comes out the prices are only going up. Also just to put it out their for people who do not understand it CCU stand for Cross Chassis Upgrade so you can upgrade one ship type to another. these can be bought separately and often with a discount so it safes you money. Also ships above 1000 dollars cannot be CCU'ed towards you have to buy them as is and every ship above 1000 dollar has automatically LTI or Life Time Insurance. Ships below 1000 dollars do not get LTI but can be upgraded to LTI from a LTI token. A LTI token is a cheap ship you buy that has LTI on it if you upgrade that ships with a CCU to another ship the LTI will transfer so your new ship will have LTI. There are a lot of good guides on KZbin on this.

[@evobsm2328]

Polaris is like the perfect patrol ship. It has a fighter bay. Bigass torpedoes and enough turrets to keep most fighters at bay. The best allround ship BUT. For smaller orgs. A hammerhead or perseus is the perfect ship. And the perseus even more so since it has less crew requirements but more than enough firepower to make up for the lack of crew. I can deffinitly see smaller orgs work togheter or even work with bigger orgs who own idrises and such.

[@LootGoblinArmy]

Biggest thing I keep running into with these larger ships is... how will I convince that many people to help me man it with any amount of regularity. The Polaris is cool and all but it'll be WAY easier to convince my friends to go do a Perseus patrol than convince 1/6th of a server's worth of people to be on one ship doing not necessarily exciting work. It's a question of how often would you like to actually use your big shiny? Also the Gunship just looks way cooler imo!

[@Smok32049]

I think there is an argument for both ships, the Perseus is designed to fight hammerhead size ships and below, the Polaris is designed to fight Capital ships and will be able to defend itself against anything smaller than it. I would think the Polaris would offer more in the way of money making ability being able to go after bigger targets and therefore would make it easier to gather the funds to buy a perseus than it would be the other way around. Personally if I could afford it I would have both

[@0311matt]

to me the Perseus sounds like a ship for a group of friends to run, where as the Polaris sounds like a fun ship for an Org to run.

[@ottosalo4575]

I was thinking of getting rid of my BMM in exchnage of polaris/perseus started leaning towards Perseus mostly due the lesser amount of crew needed to run it

[@donhearn2248]

liked and subscribed my dude....side note...the glass vs metal has been commented on before. As far as CIG is concerned Glass is no different than hull, it will not be a weak point any more than regular hull is. Unless that has changed, that was a previous talking point. What will be interesting is how actual armor is put into the game, there was scuttlebutt from a Bar Citizen how armor and shield meshing is going to play out. The rumor was ships will not be one big HP box to hit (that has since been confirmed), but different parts of the ship will have different resistance to fire based on armor and shield layout. We could end up with make or break ships based on how and more importantly where armor ends up on ship hulls. What and how we end up attacking ships in the future will probably be effected by the armor profile of the ship. The rumor was... I believe ...to breach capital armor (like on the Polaris) you need size 6 or 7 ( I forget which) So how and where armor is put on the hull is really going to matter. Polaris could end mostly immune to regular fighter fire on the majority of the craft....but end up taking a ton of damage right though it's hanger door from the top...no telling. Or like you speculate right on the bridge of the ship. It is hard to tell at this point. The lore tells us the Polaris wants to get in and get out...ie not tanky but quick compared to other capital ships. The Perseus lore tells us it is more stationary and more tanky, so even with out capital armor it might have much denser armor coverage. We could end up in a situation that one or the other is great on paper, but once you know how to attack it, it is not as cool as it once seemed.

[@ezarhon1002]

Fair point mate. Size is detrimental for a small crew, or solo play.

[@dukeversewalker8962]

Good channel. Good analysis

[@Raazik]

*According to Star Citizen lore, the “glass” of ship cockpits is some kind of super material, almost stronger than armor.* *Of course this is stupid and is added into the lore to justify the design of CIG ships with a wide view from the bridge, however, glass in Star Citizen is not a weak point.*

[@Riskmynuttz]

Optimal use is primary to me. The crazy thing is that 14-man ship would need a major game loop for it. The Perseus would be the ship.

[@FoRm4t123]

everyone wants to be captain Kirk or weapon officer Worf. good luck finding red shirt number 15 that only get to shoot the shitty turret at the back. Perseus for me too.

[@krokenlochen]

Why choose, when you can have both? Lol fr tho, I regret my A2 and I’m gonna change it into a Polaris this week. The Perseus is my baby, I love it for cool factor and for the fact it’s got awesome guns. It’s a gun boat through and through. But I’m not really a carrack guy, and other capital ships won’t be around for awhile. Realistically I’m trying to get a reliable transport through Pyro that has more teeth than what my friends have. I think the F8C will fit in the Polaris, which will make it more of an interesting fight if I get ambushed. So far, I’ll be the only one in my friend group to have either of them, and while I probably won’t torp things as often as I’d like, I want a more combat focused mobile base that’ll be coming soon.

[@marcuswynn89]

The way my bank account is currently set up I can only ccu up to a Perseus

[@krokenlochen]

@@marcuswynn89 Understandable honestly.

[@volkanmert9149]

I feel like when they finally make the perseus. It'll end up bigger than what it is right now. Curious to see if it'll be bigger than the hammerhead.

[@chrisgatlin5832]

I feel like the Polaris is going to come out years before the Perseus so I’ll do the Polaris first and when the fest comes out in five years, I’ll do that one next

[@marcuswynn89]

i think we are a year off from the perseus

[@Glorymoon97]

I have two ships I want to get. The first one, my main ship is an RSI Galaxy, mostly because I know numbers and logistics is my game, and the Galaxy is a versatile ship which can be configured for hauling supplies, and collecting resources on the other end of that spectrum. Not only that, but it can also be used as a hospital ship. My other choice is an Idris; a good general purpose ship that can be used for pretty much any role. Need a bullet sponge? Got it. Need an escort carrier? Too easy. Just need a hammer? Lets gooo!

[@Gladdi80r]

Got both, how many org members bring online will dictate what gets pulled

[@kristoffernordlund8392]

I like this, its nice to hear speculation on ships at times. Its been a long time since I enjoy it. I think CR have said that glass ain't a weak point its translucent metal, though it was so long since I've heard it, I could be wrong. Anyway translucent material can be more enduring then alloys, it depends on how its created. Carbon is a hell of a material as an example. Still I can see why someone prefer a to bridge, toward a front bridge, a top bridge is good for a assessment of the ships hull, a front bridge might add some focus to hunting a prey. For me its not an either or, its when to use what. From your point I think you have done the right choice. As I see it, the polaris is a moving forward base, and perseus is a patrol ship. When it comes to combat I think the Perseus is a ship you stay in combat with, while the polaris tries to get away from combat after dropping its torpedos, The polaris is more versatile then the perseus but it requires more resources, while the perseus is more purpose built for combat. The problem with the perseus as I see it is the slow speed, and lack of point defence, 2 dedicated turrets for that feels a bit little for its size, and makes the side vulnerable for pinching maneuvers and ambushes. ofcourse this is just speculations of the ships, as none of them are in.

[@der_ruge]

Any ship just got half of its turrets when flying broad side, the Perseus can fire with all 4 size 7 broad side, i think thats a huge benefit

[@mattp1337]

There will be a lot of undercrewed ships of every type out in the 'verse, even once we have NPCs and blades available. And this will be more true the bigger the ship. It will require effort and organization to deploy a big ship and have it be effective. And for anyone tempted to own a big ship, let alone the biggest and baddest, they have to weigh that against what they're getting into. Large/capital ships are like puppies: don't get one unless you're willing to take on the commitment.

[@walther007]

Before I start watching the vid....I agree with you due to the unseen costs of running the Polaris. Torps alone could cost a million per shot which is why I bought the Perseus. Now, to watch the vid. It is odd they classify the Perseus as a Frigate now when the original concept had it as a Heavy Gunship on RSI. After the video reaction: First off, I don't see these as Capital sized ships. They may be Capital in terms of a Player's fleet but in a military fleet, a Capital sized ship is the largest or lead in a given fleet. So an Idris...which is a Frigate would be Sub-Capital and even the Javelin as it's only a Destroyer.... The Bengal however and its now known sister ships which are Cruisers and perhaps even Heavy Cruiser variants as seen in the recent SQ42 video and would thusly be their Capital Class vessels. (Both Cruisers and Heavy Cruisers/Battle Cruisers were mentioned in the original fundraising goals.) Regarding the Hanger issue, I wouldn't look at the Polaris as needing a fighter in the bay. Perhaps you want a scout ship like a Terrapin or just for a small cargo ship. Many other uses than just one fighter. The Perseus is akin to the Ares series...although their weapons aren't fully matched to their level currently, they are size 7's as well. CiG has stated before it will take a wing of Ares fighters to disable...."disable" an Idris. So the same would apply to the Perseus. The fire a Perseus can bring to bear is equal to 4 Ares.

[@chrisajokinen]

Once server blades are in, I think the Perseus can go as low as 4. The Polaris will still need more even with blades. The 4 would be pilot.2 turret gunners and an engineer

[@thefettofthevoid]

I thought that the lore was that the "glass" isn't glass and has similar traits to the metals used in the hull but is typically stronger due to thickness of the windows?

[@jt4185]

I can’t imagine getting a big group together on one ship when I could get a big group together with several ships. I assume that will change with engineering, but who knows? Nice breakdown though.

[@TheIamfrustrated]

I choose Polaris specifically because I have an unhealthy fascination with slinging torpedoes on to foreheads deserving of such attention. I understand where you’re coming from with that. Regarding crew numbers, another point for the Perseus here. I recall watching a lecture by a retired USN Admiral who was heavily involved with the design of the Ford Class Carriers. He made a point that you could get carried away with cutting down crew numbers and that presented problems with fire fighting and damage control so even if you could operate the ship with minimal crew I doubt you’d actually want to.

[@malikthebarbarian6815]

When it comes to crew size we'll have AI to fill out positions that matter less. But tbh I'm specifically looking for a big group on launch. So if my current org can't fill positions I might start looking for a different org or try to work with other orgs we know pretty well. Giant fleet action is really what I'm looking for from this game. Like eve but more interactive and immersive.

[@Syphirioth]

I take Perseus. I don't give a damn about usability or not. It's the ship I want the most because it triggers my senses. The cockpit on top and not on front. The shape. The gun like a real battleship/frigate. I just love it. So I hope the price will be nice and not limited sale. I will hate if that is the case cause I need to work.

[@MineyM0]

I'm still not sure which ship I would prefer, but I'm leaning towards the Perseus after hearing your points. That being said, the need for crew/engineering support for these larger ships has me spooked a little...

[@wafflesinsanity]

One thing that CIG has said in the past is that a single torpedo from the Polaris would effectively cost the same as a Titan. Just take that and consider it for a moment. That's over 700,000 for a single shot from the Polaris. You won't be out there. Just slinging those torpedoes for fun, there will be intense levels of economic consideration for you and your crew every single time you want to take it into a fight. On top of that, I see many folks in here talking about how crew will be much less necessary once we have NPCs and AI blades. But I hope they know what those will cost, and that CIG has stated multiple times that those will only "supplement your crew" not replace it. AI blades will be very, very resource intensive for your ship. Ship. In fact, many ships don't even maintain the processing power for AI blades. (Things may change in the future, but right now AI blades will be dictated by the 'computer' stat that you find on all ships) and those computers will dictate how many AI blades you can have. NPCs will also be incredibly resource intensive, whether they require payout, or have to be maintained through use of food, water, and if you like playing the sims but in space.... See a lot of people saying that. CIG at some point stated that capital ships will be "soloable" but that is simply not true, newer players should not be given false information. They have said in the past that capital ships will be flyable solo. Meaning you will be able to sit in the pilot seat and fly the ship. You will not be able to fully utilize the capabilities of a capital ship as a solo player without practically a dedicated organization funding your ship alone, or through some sort of intense strategic commercial enterprise within game

[@marcuswynn89]

that makes a lot of sense though i cant wait to go out with my perseus crew and clap some solo capital ships

[@wafflesinsanity]

​@@marcuswynn89 ​hell yea brother. Me in a couple of the guys are pretty excited for the day that we see all these solo krakens littering planets being used as bases by pirates because some solo player tried to take it out alone. Lol

[@marcuswynn89]

@wafflesinsanity can’t wait for the spectrum posts lol

[@davidconnor-rn2br]

I got the Polaris But have My own Reasons .. And i can Always have both so that the beauty of it , I prefer a Polaris at the moment because I'm not necessarily a Combat guy , i like having a million HP and Capital shields and a real deterrent to being attacked , and staying power if a am . the Polaris to me is like a super Carrack but maybe just more refined , i have the odyssey as well , and almost passed on the Polaris , but i think the Polaris has allot of the same positive attributes as the odyssey , but might end up being a better long range super cruiser and over all safer ship to be on, time will tell where i end up in the future but I'm liking all the options so far , i don't think its a mistake for you to choose the Perseus , you have your reasons and probably is the ship that will give you the game play loop you are looking for

[@marcuswynn89]

Deep pockets don’t rub it in

[@AccidentalFriendlyFire]

Love the point about crew size. I strongly disagree with the idea of "but at only $XX more, why wouldn't you pick [bigger ship]?" Because i don't need that much ship and can't get the crew requirements nearly as easily, and if i can get 14 people together I'm pretty sure two Percys and two Ares will both do a better job wrecking an Idris than a Polaris could, and could also wreck a Polaris.

[@Spork82]

Great points. I see the Polaris as a very big target and agree about being at a disadvantage when out of torps. I look at having laser vs ballistics the same way. If you're out of ammo, you may be out of options. I also agree with crew size. I know I can count on 5 other players and am in sync well with them. 15 other players is really stretching it on being able to work well and understand each other or anticipate direction etc. I've been in the Percy camp for all reasons listed. I also see the Percy as much more maneuverable than the Polaris.