KTM close to Bankruptcy | what does that mean for the 390 Adventure R?

[@williamhudson3208]

Hi Solid. Hope you’re feeling better soon. KTM is a typical example of business management when their attitude to their customers is “we don’t mind and you don’t matter”. I see this in our uk dealerships. So bike industry, beware, your customers will bite you if you get arrogant and dismissive. Thanks for the analysis. Regards William.

[@chroniclesofsolid]

I’m doing better every day 👍

[@Gud-y2s]

They are no different than the others, it's just that they used to be better once upon a time, when they made fewer bikes that were uncomplicated and just very well designed.

[@ferkuzuel]

I think ktm tough that the pandemic fever of having extra time and buying a new motorcycle was never going to end, but the reality is that there are still some new 2022 ktm models sitting on the showroom floor , after all the most common reason for selling a bike on the used market is because they don't ride as they would like to .

[@ianjenkins6250]

Ktm, tough shit. Questionable reliability, over expansion, and contempt for customers. You can only point to how they have been managed. I had a chance to buy a ktm until a good friend told me of his issues with his bike and his reply was " don't buy it". I'll keep my suzuki thanks

[@Gud-y2s]

@ianjenkins6250 That's usually where the hate comes from. People who never owned a KTM.

[@_hold_the_line_]

KTM charges a premium price and offers questionable reliability. Not a great recipe for the current economic climate.

[@tharalalnun4364]

Plus a fuck off after sales service and im doomed resale value, from what I've heard

[@brunocarmona4958]

Precisely this. They want to compete with BMW and Ducati in price but can't offer the same brand cache as these brands. That and other very questionable decisions took them to this situation.

[@miro_s]

This is a myth! The issue is not price nor reliability but customer service.

[@snowgsadventures3232]

@@miro_sI agree. I’m a former BMW owner and current Ducati and KTM owner. BMW and Ducati have been less reliable than my 1290 but the dealers are professional and make you feel cared for. KTM cares for you precisely zero once you’ve paid for the bike.

[@miro_s]

@@snowgsadventures3232 my experience too… never had a problem with ktm, my only one very minor aesthetic warranty claim was approved quickly. When I had problems with bmw in the past it was all very easy and smooth…

[@thevtadventure1062]

They have been on the edge for years, that with price and reliability is a big reason I never got one. Yamaha and Honda for the win.

[@mt1885]

Agree and Suzuki - they have great quality as well.

[@thevtadventure1062]

For sure and with the new DRZ and a new Kawi smaller Adv bike. Things are looking good now we just need a Honda 450L Rally or a smaller lighter Tenere 500.

[@Wombat_Astronaut]

Ok sure, Yamaha and Honda are great in the realm of motocross I would agree. But there's a lot of enduro riders like myself who live by the 300 2T bikes. Beta and Sherco are great but KTM group bikes are the most accessible.

[@thevtadventure1062]

@ true but now there is Fantic 300 based of the Yamaha 250 2T. Trust me I love a good 2T !

[@r.j.bedore9884]

The 390 Adventure R is one thing, but I think KTM really screwed up by not releasing the 490/501 parallel twin platform of bikes. That segment is exploding right now and KTM had several models announced and ready for production, then scrapped the whole thing a few weeks before they were supposed to launch. If they had launched I would have a Husqvarna Svartpilen 501 in my garage right now, but instead I'm looking at the cfmoto 450MT and that new BMW that was recently announced.

[@davidc1961utube]

CF moto took that ball and ran well with it.

[@bcgal0004]

I think the releasing 390 to beginner riders is the least of their problems.. The reason I didn't jump ship and buy a 890 is all off the reliability horror stories. They already have a premium product.. they should've spent their R&D on reliability, then they might actually sell their products. Oh, and their extra subscriptions to unlock things like cruise control

[@miro_s]

Still going on with this fabrication of subscription model? At this point is hard to tell if people like you are lying haters or just ignorant idiots.

[@ewganhoff]

​​@@miro_s You seem to be getting hung up on people calling it a subscription. It doesn't matter what you call it - paying extra to unlock features and hardware that is already on the bike is completely, irredeemably, unforgivably, bogus.🤮 I'm surprised no one has cracked the software to turn it on for free. Although, that would void the warranty which with KTM is a very bad idea😂.

[@miro_s]

@ well you seem to be hung on abusing the language to mislead: if you pay for it only once is not a subscription, but an option. Surely you must’ve heard of options every brand has got them, BMW are kings of this, that when you finish configuring your bike is 5K more expensive than when you started. Yet you don’t moan about it, do you? PS. Also most of the times dealers throw these in in the discount package so not a big deal is it. Definitely not a subscription model

[@paulhope3401]

​@miro_s You are correct, its not a monthly subscription model like the Manufucturer Zero has on some of their bikes. That doesn't mean we all have to like the DLC model either though.

[@TheIdlesurfer]

​@@miro_sit was enough to put me straight off any KTM and I've had 7 KTMs, since about 2005. I'm not paying for someone to switch something on which is already on the bike I've just paid for. It's exactly the reason I wouldn't buy a BMW car, not that I've ever bought a BMW car, or wanted one.

[@trevorgodfrey5745]

KTM should have produced the 390AdvR two to three years ago when everyone was screaming for it. Could have gone a long way to potentially saving the brand. I had the old 390adv, loved it but since moved on to the 450MT. Might have been different if the new 390 was available...

[@RC-br1ps]

Spot on. Austrian arrogance on display. Ignore a huge market and lose customers, because China will step in.

[@Gud-y2s]

I don't know how much profit they have on bikes made by Bajaj and sold in Asia? It's not a huge market in Europe. They probably make more money on a "tech pack" on the big bikes than they do on a 390. It's pretty stupid to talk about national "arrogance". The market exploded in the covid years and then it died in the recession. The market for big bikes in the big market of Germany is pretty dead. I rather talk about sponsoring the Chinese government that sponsor Putins war on Europe. That's not what i would do right now.

[@sayithigher]

How does the 450 feel after the 390?

[@chiboreache]

@@Gud-y2s there is no chinese money, it's poor russians money and printer ofc, inflation is extreme and war not putins, but murricas, this is the only country that fires up conflicts around the globe, to make maga, and gather specialists and move production lines to the cheap gaz

[@trevorgodfrey5745]

@@sayithigher to me the 390 was a good bike, mine had quite a few mods so felt quite capable. Took that bike into some insane places, alot more capable than people think. 450 is a more substancial bike, bulkier and a little heavier so on road it feels way better, especially in windy areas. Feels solid and way more comfortable, KTM was twitchy and hard on the butt. Havent done any major offroad missions on 450 yet but sure it will be good, suspension is way better. And the sound of it with aftermarket pipe, the grin factor is huge in comparison

[@bulthaosen1169]

No one will bail them. The debt is way too much. 3 billion euros(2.9 to be exact). How the heck did they rack up such a debt. They are waiting for a sell off to buy KTM for cheap and get full ownership. No new buyer wants the old leadership of KTM. The final buyer will probably be bajaj or cfmoto. And they are waiting for KTM to fold to get it for cheap.

[@finesoul677]

@@bulthaosen1169 greedy shareholders. They would rather not lose that extra million each and put thousands of jobs at risk. That’s human greed for ya!

[@pabloricardodetarragon2649]

The debt represents 30 years of normal benefit.

[@bulthaosen1169]

@@finesoul677 they have no obligation. They weren't running the company.

[@Ozsmallbore]

@@bulthaosen1169 Exactly!

[@paddy6859]

Nobody on this thread has a clue what they are waffling on about, not a clue, it’s actually embarrassing

[@Bandit-Iggy]

Thats why i ordered a 2025 Honda CRF Rally yesterday, its a georgous bike, i went to my local KTM dealership for the new 390 Adv and finally got fed up with all this bs, i was working at KTM when they went bankrupt in 91-92 when Ktm Netherlands and Italy bought them to save the company, decided at the Bangkok motorshow no more KTM for me, been there done that, it almost cost me my leg due to reliability problems during early 90's.

[@paddy6859]

Stefan Pierer took over the company in 92

[@Bandit-Iggy]

@paddy6859 Yeah but that was after Brouwer KTM from Zwartebroek NL and the Italian importer forget their name bought and saved them in 91 to stay afloat for awhile, because there was to many riders in the nationals, including me that needed the parts to keep on going, KTM riders was still a family back then.

[@paddy6859]

@ Think you’re wrong, in fact I know you are it was an Austrian investment trust managed by am Austrian politician Josef Taus that bought the majority shareholding in the company, that failed and Stefan Pierer the took it over and the rest brings us to where they are now

[@Bandit-Iggy]

@paddy6859 All i remember from that time was that the Dutch importer, Brouwer from Zwartebroek, the Netherlands and the Italian KTM importer, forgot their name, met up in Austria and Italy back in the days and brought together money to save the brand and keep them afloat for a few months, lot of the developing of KTM back in the days was also done in Netherlands with Kees vd Ven and Leon Giesbers and White Power suspension, i think Corrado Maddi was involved as well side ways, after that KTM turned orange to honour the Dutch/ Italian intervention. I don't know if you remember it, but ktm was a very small brand back then, its not way the size it is now. The main branche in Holland was basically a double private home, built into a showroom with a big garage in the garden.

[@Threedogsinatrenchcoat]

There really should be more kdx 200 style bikes, well suspended reliable trail bikes, but thats against most corporate strategy of padding the parts market and creating urgency for the newest products.

[@garyib7200]

Three + months ago KTM notified me that I was eligible for reimbursement for the cam repair job I had done 2 yrs ago. Still waiting for the money. I had written it off. Now I'm just passed again because they got my hopes up by offering reimbursement but not pay it.

[@johnthero2517]

im looking at buying a 790 duke then i heard about camshafts and was turned away, then i read about the reimbursements and now want to buy the bike again then i read your post lol can you update if you ever receive it?

[@alfredk471]

I guessed they were in financial difficulty when they not just refused to take responsibility for their cam wear on their parallel twins but denied there was a problem, it just reeked of desperation.

[@n03m9]

Just an insight from an Austrian guy, kind of familiar with this company and knowing how "that" works in our country: Due to the fact that any insinuation would have legal consequences for me, I would like to emphasize that the following statements are pure satire and should be understood as such: People like P. from the company are very well connected to parties like the ÖVP and unofficially they are called “family” in our country. He, the former Federal Chancellor, the current one and a few other friends like B. (who currently has legal problems himself and a penalty order in Italy) have repeatedly staged stunts in recent years to feed companies like K. with public money (be it Corona - but here this also happened with other companies) or other financial injections. Now to my actual satirical point: a number of people will be made redundant, production in Austria will be abandoned in the long term and production will happily take place in India. The bonuses will be paid out in full and the state will step in, among other things. --- How is that important for this video? 390 Adventure R won't have any problem being produced - it is just greedy people doing greedy stuff.

[@mrzclips]

if the price is right im gonna get a 390 adv, i only worry about spare parts but they should be there since its based of a duke 390. am i right?

[@mermerac]

EU at it's corrupt best. Long live the scam.

[@n03m9]

@@mrzclips Certainly. I see no issue here, even though I personally ride a lovely Honda. The main point is that this company will be unexpectedly rescued by a substantial infusion of taxpayer money, which will be directed into the business in some manner. However, for the official narrative, a compelling story is still necessary-something along the lines of establishing a clear objective, implementing strategic adjustments, and being supported by a renowned investor and a team of highly respected consultants who have conducted thorough research, ensuring that everything is now on the right track.

[@MrRodwatson]

@@n03m9 It's funny how "life experience" tends to give us a type of X-Ray Vision 🤔, as we age we begin to see through Bulls$$t. Be assured….the bonuses WILL be paid….regardless of how much tax payer money is "invested" 🙄.

[@elgringoec]

Humans doing human stuff, got it. What I wonder is whether the financial injections are into the cylinder directly, or into the airstream via the throttle body.

[@anthonya7066]

Solid I respectfully posted in one of your prior KTM uploads that their situation in the financial markets was dire, and much worse than you thought. Once it reaches this stage of self-administration, KTM is already dead in the water, it will no longer exist in the form you currently know it. The vultures are circling and they will pick the carrion apart in such a way that wealthy people will become more wealthy and the junk parts are either junked or the state via the ordinary person will be left holding the can. It’s just the way it works, history just keeps repeating.

[@Angry-Lynx]

F ktm as corporation, but it's sad customers and workers will suffer as always, not greedy management assholes who made that situation in the first place..

[@davidcauchi2837]

Thanks for the review on KTM and its financial problems; It seems The Board has failed to mange its affairs and its also failed to respond to consumer demand; Customers want good value for money and NOT an over priced item. I hope you respond to your treatments and get well soon. David...Adelaide...Triumph Scramblers 1200x and 900

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Thanks David 👍

[@mattingray5651]

This is what happened when you only target a small percentage of customers - tall folks (where every mfg also competing for the same one). I had been long interested in KTM but can't never find one suitable. I ended up with BMW instead, BMW make standard/tall and option to lower (for majority of riders).

[@pauln6803]

While certainly not perfect (a couple of electrical issues), my RC8R hasn't been too bad over nearly 10 years of ownership. I had to sell my Duke 690 as a repair project due to a problem with the engine dying and my local independent being unable to identify why. It's the KTM dealership's attitude and labour charges that meant I felt the need for something Japanese for my daily ride.

[@jimthompson717]

I think KTM is like many post pandemic companies. They charged high prices to offset the cost of poor management. Customers paid these outrageous prices in a quest for adventure. The same is happening with BMW . Arrogant greedy dealers could sell every bike at full MSRP. Now sales have fallen and they are in denial. It will get worse before it gets better.

[@WyDave]

Appreciate that you communicated some "positives" about KTM. First positives I've heard - thanks. And a humorous side note, if you went a few rounds with Tyson we'd see a bandage on your ear!!!

[@happyday4929]

Ktm need to change many things to get the trust of customers back. Premium price for 890 adv r and you need to pay extre 1000eur to unlock riding modes..

[@juxtarepublic6106]

2.9 Billion euros worth of debt and roughly 100 Million euros a year in profits.... They are gone for all money.....

[@davidc1961utube]

If those numbers are accurate, you are right.

[@miro_s]

Yep, it would take 30 years for an investor to make the money back… not happening. Also difficult to see how they could repay that much money. Apparently they have 100,000 bikes unsold, they’d need to sell each one of them for 30k each to make up that sort of money. Only way forward seems to be default on debt by bankruptcy, and restart a new company under new ownership on the ashes. Or government intervention with partial state ownership, like they did fr banks, only I believe that sort of thing is explicitly forbidden by EU competition rules…

[@bulthaosen1169]

​@@davidc1961utubeI think they made a loss of 200 million in FY2024. The 100 mil profit is FY2023. So it's even worse lol

[@Ozsmallbore]

@@miro_s It's clear that the debt holders are going to take a bath. If those numbers are correct, bankrupcy is the only answer, KTM will get sold off to a competitor (CFMOTO) or investment group and the creditors will only get a few cents in the dollar(euro). KTM will then get fully restructured with product rationalising, and offloading of Huski and Gas Gas etc. With proper management it can be viable.

[@miro_s]

@ indeed. Unless the government steps in…

[@stevesane800]

A great informative video COS . Hopefully, you're on the road ro recovery! Im afraid KTM will fall. My half full glass says damage was done with camshafts & turning off options. Trust is broken. Faith is for fanatics. I was burnt by KTM about 12 years ago over a AUD$20 engine ball bearing they didn't warrant & was superceded by a needle roller bearing from the factory.

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Thanks Steve, it’s going to be a fun ride watching this play out

[@lachy1709]

Good to see you back solid. I feel like they got big fast, I mean Ktm husquvarna and gas gas are all the same bikes in different colours, they have a wide range that is bordering too large when it comes to CC, and their recent habit of refusing to acknowledge their reliability issues are all hitting the company hard On top of that, the 390 adv realistically has very little competition until the last few years. With the ibex, new Himalayan, and all the other new midweight adventure bikes that have been coming out, suddenly the adv390 isn’t the most attractive option

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Thanks mate, it’s good to be back 👍

[@pieterrossouw8596]

Some beancounters probably looked at this business a few years ago and said: If we just slash warranty repair budget, we'll be more profitable. If we just add monthly subscription revenue to customer's bikes, we'll be more profitable. If we just reduce stress testing budget, we'll be more profitable. Never let beancounters ruin your company. If you're a premium brand, make sure the product and after-sale service feels like it.

[@leighhill9185]

Bean counters ruin every company these days including mine and most of our customers. Absolutely fucked. Meanwhile top end management just get richer and richer.

[@pieterrossouw8596]

@ it's all about incentives. These managers just go from company to company and are able to say "I reduced operational costs by x% at my previous company", which is true and attractive to the budget-managers on the the interviewing committee. Doesn't matter if increasing profits is actually detrimental to the company's medium and long-term future... it's all about this next quarter and by the time the company or brand tumbles, these managers are long gone. Back in the day when people worked at companies for 10,15 20 years plus you couldn't do this - you were screwing with your own future employment. Until incentives are fixed this will only become more common.

[@leighhill9185]

Thanks for the vid Solid. Get well soon mate! It must really suck to be a KTM dealer right now trying to make monthly budgets! I've never owned on and never will but it would be sad to see them go under. They seem like the greatest bikes out there....when they don't have reliability issues. I'm still loving my Yam WR250R :)

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Thanks Leigh 👍

[@ianparkes2538]

Nice to hear someone talking sense , Iam fed up with all the dodgy KZbin barrack room lawyers with click bait titles saying ktm have gone bust , let hope all is good , ktm bikes are the most engaging bikes I’ve ever owned

[@virupakshawalla5734]

Not the most engaging company to deal with though. Bought one then realised company are shit and predicted they would go bust to showroom

[@davidz8]

A really accurate synopsis of the situation with both KTM and the 390R, non of this click bait rubbish. Thank you.

[@choompa]

The 390s and small displacement motorcycles will save KTM. KTM also needs to get rid of the subscription and add-on-based features.

[@ygio]

I once owned a KTM LC4 640 Adventure. The engine blew up at 30'000 km after the camshaft bearings failed. A common issue apparently due to poor quality. Dealership was just awful. Had a check, said they couldn't do anything and gave me my bike back with a box with all the parts they removed, charged me 500dollar to tell me the engine was done. WHAT A FREAKING great quality of products and service, I had to rebuild the engine myself. I am glad that they have improved (SARCASM). I will never buy a KTM again in my life. Sure they are fun and powerful. But I want something to ride, not constantly repair& maintain and spend huge amount of money on.

[@Bicycle_Fungi]

Great summary Solid. It’s a funny world and a funny sport/hobby/obsession. So much speculation about the “next big thing” and the hunt for the elusive unicorn, but i guess it gets the clicks. So many good bikes out there already to have fun and adventure on for many years to come. Maybe the timing is ripe for the big four to come through with a clean sweep and dominate the marketplace again…

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Be nice to see a Japanese resurgence 😎

[@JamieBroughton70]

🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏Ktm comes throught . I'd love the 390 r here in Australia

[@easy4steve]

thanks again for the update solid , as im a big KTM fan and ride a 2023 KTM 690 enduro r , and thinking of buying a 890 next year , i am definitely staying with KTM !! . they have my support !!! . cheers Steve/Geraldton

[@algee8228]

Yes Solid we have been waiting too long already for the 390...if it doesn't show up by spring I think it will be a DR-Z4S for me...which might just be the better choice anyways for what I want. That 390 sure is sexy though!

[@finesoul677]

Not surprising. Far too many models, 25 different models of ktm, Why? No one needs that much choice, it’s ridiculous. In the duke range alone, 200, 390, 640, 690, 790, 890, 950, 990, 1050, 1090, 1190, 1290, now the 1390. Seriously why so much choice?🤯can you imagine the complex production and logistics and the cost of all those spare parts. Customers and manufacturers got greedy now it’s the manufacturers paying the price.

[@vimalprince4467]

You left out 125 and 250 segment, mate.

[@drd3816]

Very good point that destroys the bottom line then add on top owing several redundant motorcycle brands...who the hell thinks like this? RE is making what 3 motors for 30 bikes? The 350/450 water cooled and 650.

[@miro_s]

But these are models over the years, everybody does it, starting with the gs. Yet you don’t mention it

[@murlyn2]

THIS!

[@finesoul677]

@@miro_s no only last 5 years or so

[@josech]

90 days? I thought KTM was all about 6 days…

[@milerale5286]

They already closed numerous showrooms across UK

[@bwlyon]

Hey Solid hope ya heal up quickly. My experience with sinus surgery was mostly good except the first 2 weeks. The rest was a cake walk and man was I able to breath easier through my nose. As for KTM, I’m torn on their situation. Part of me says it’s going to be hard to find someone who’ll be willing to step up to the plate, unless they are willing to give up lot of control. I don’t think the Motorcycle market is very strong right now and I see no that changing for the foreseeable future. Folks don’t have spare money anymore for toys. Although, that new 390 could help if they could get the pricing and profit margin to help. I think everyone who is thinking about ADV Motorcycles are thinking smaller and more affordable is the way to go. The 400-500cc market is red hot figuratively speaking, and possibly soon to go literally! Heal up fast.

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Thanks mate 👍

[@tymobyrne4451]

Sure we do, i just bought two new yamaha's and a new honda, notice what i did there, buy japanese, its like putting your money in a bank.

[@billcotton1551]

I always thought that KTM was over their skis, by buying Gasgas and Husky.

[@EMILIA-t7g]

It could be another player from India with deeper pockets or like you said likely CF Moto or another Chinese company, either will definitely wait till the financial situation gets a lot worse to get the most bang for their buck.

[@andrewreebel6418]

KTM will close its doors and the Austrian government will license out the technology and R&D to other Euro companies and China. There is no way to restructure 3 billion in debt when your most profitable year was 100 million in profit.

[@6226superhurricane]

people should be reluctant to buy a new ktm on hearing they owe 3 billion. especially a new model that could end up an orphan with next to no parts availability like the bmw era pre ktm husqvarna. established models like 690cc, 500cc and 300cc 2t have a better chance of parts availability into the future due to enough bikes already being out there to make a case for an aftermarket niche to form.

[@bulthaosen1169]

390 is made by bajaj so that one should be safe. The others are a coin toss.

[@6226superhurricane]

@bulthaosen1169 I wouldn't count on it.

[@Ni3K]

I saw a statement from KTM, that the 125 and 390 will be produced and sold as planed, but no mentioning of 990 or 1390 models. The smaller bikes are produced in India by Bajaj Auto not in Austria, also 790 (motor) is made by CF Moto in China.

[@miro_s]

Yes, they announced a production freeze in Austria, not surprising they’re making no commitments on Austrian made models. In the meanwhile the 390 is in the showrooms in India, or on its way to…

[@craigguy5756]

Massive discounts here in New Zealand on new 22, 23, 24 models. But, what about future support and warranty ?

[@verlinswarey507]

I think we’ll see this bike!

[@thelonewolf666]

ktm 390r---will never hit the stores bmw will be next as greed kills business

[@pieterrossouw8596]

At least BMW can be kept artificially solvent from the parent company - so they can stay greedy for longer. I just hope the big 4 Japanese manufacturers look at this KTM dumpster fire and don't make the same mistakes.

[@thelonewolf666]

@@pieterrossouw8596 100%

[@lonecoyote5454]

KTM has way too many road legal models. The next global economic downturn will be hard enough on the Japanese let alone KTM with their enormous debt and poorly run business. I love how they present their chairman sticking around as a positive, he sucks.

[@ashmite]

I feel like Triumph could be a good fit to buy (or invest in) KTM. They really want to expand into the off-road market. They make premium bikes, and they operate in the black as far as cash.

[@Dan-56]

I could never understand why KTM, Husky, and Gas Gas had the very same bikes in their lineup with a different paint jobs and a few parts upgrades/ downgrades. It would seem as if they were in competition with themselves for the same customers. 🤔 Add to that the truly awful customer service from dealers and the importers, (I have personal experience with that 🤨👎!), and it all seems like a recipe for financial disaster. I’m expecting CF Moto to come to the rescue with manufacturing moving to China and India in the long run. 🙁

[@BahWeepGranahWeepNiniBong]

To me, they are all just white, red and orange Ktms.

[@nicknili3511]

Hello 😊 You are #1 Nick

[@chroniclesofsolid]

👍😎

[@888jimmy]

Hope you're on the mend. I think that it maybe a case of too little too late for KTM..... I hope I am wrong as the 390 ADV R was high on my list also and has the potential to be a cracking bike in the real world. If KTM is saved and the 390 makes it to market how much faith and trust will the buyer have in the brand moving forward???

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Thanks Jimmy 👍

[@RioHelmi]

Almost switched to KTM a few years ago, when i wanted to downsize to something light but capable. Then they rolled out their first 390 adventure. What a dissapointment. I didn't even finish my test ride went around the block and gave it back. This is the bike thry should have produced then, they had the means and tech. So they futzed around and CFmoto's 450MT has blindsided them. They don't have a lot of bargaining chips besides this new johnny-come-lately 390 adventure

[@Juku9000]

They just don’t need 3 versions of each bike. Just go down to orange. I’ve got the 701 enduro and literally bought it because I preferred the looks. But running 3 versions has got to be an unnecessary strain. I hope they sort it, I still want a 500 😊

[@Danger_mouse]

9:00 Just buy the CFMOTO 450MT. CFMOTO aren't going anywhere except up, they're stable and their products are well priced and reliable.

[@acegear]

one word reliability is what ktm skip if a customer have a bad experience from the bike he got even if its still in warranty , he might send it to back and buy another brand no one wants problems during specialy the frist year of buying, feels like they just run test in a lab runs fine and sell it

[@pauln6803]

"test run in the lab..." Yes, this is something I've suggested before. In other words, there's perhaps little wrong with the engineering side, but the production side suffers from penny pinching and outsourcing to firms that will do it cheaper than others with stricter standards. I say outsourcing because it's becoming increasingly common for automotive factories to be mere assembly lines with no machine shops of their own. Triumph have certainly outsourced engine production and frame fabrication for various models.

[@acegear]

@@pauln6803 or maybe they just skip the the lab test and goes straight to the selling part . this happens when you promote a marketing guy above a engr guy

[@steveh545]

I was all hot to buy a GasGas Ranger, when PMG bought GasGas and dumped the bike. About 9 mos later I bought a Rieju Ranger. Same bike. So, even if KTM goes tits up, the 390R could still show up with different graphics, less orange.

[@constantinosschinas4503]

Buying a 690 SMC R tomorrow, hope this helps! lol

[@kai-uweoch1159]

Another important question is: What will happen to two other brands in the Pierer group, the white one and the red one? Will my 701 soon be obsolete?

[@istra70]

Too little, too late ...

[@TwoMotoKiwis]

The gangster look isn't too bad mate, interesting to say the least with Kato, let's hope it doesn't end badly

[@chroniclesofsolid]

😎👍

[@shubhromu]

Why KTM ignored the Indian market is a mystery. They only recently launched their big bikes in India and then went ahead and went bankrupt. Perfect timing for buyer confidence!

[@davidc1961utube]

Missed you last week, and I hope this surgery produces a permanent fix at the expense of your current temporary suffering. My observation is that, in the absence of oversight and accountability, all large organizations are run by the people at the top for the benefit of the people at the top. Business, government, military, religions, etc. The motorcycles are incrementally profitable to make, so someone will keep making them, and the guys at the top will have golden parachute contract clauses that ensure they get rich no matter what. Life, and motorcycling, will go on, and that is what matters...

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Cheers David 👍 Making up for it with another vid tomorrow 👍

[@juanv7822]

This happened when a company started to believe that it was the best in the market and making the bikes so expensive, plus charging more money for the software. Some people learn in the hard way.

[@uncletom1971]

Where's the problem? KTM borrowed money, spent it and can't pay it back. The chinese (or India) will buy the remains, and everyone is happy! Pierer is old enough to retire, which he will be doing in wealth and health buying his own private island where he can plot the plans for a new world order. Meanwhile the chinese are more than qualified to manufacture motorcycles, as we've seen over the years. All new bikes will be from India and China, either way the only thing that matters is the motorbikes. Who makes them, where it's made, isn't relevant.

[@constantinosschinas4503]

@@uncletom1971 Thailand as well. Kawasaki, Honda and i think Yamaha manufacture there.

[@CosmicSeeker69]

Unless you are one of their long-term workforce with a family to support.

[@Ozsmallbore]

@@CosmicSeeker69 The future is looking bleak for them.

[@uncletom1971]

@@CosmicSeeker69 RIght you are. Every one can't move to China. It will surely be a terrible loss of competence.

[@sandrider1406]

They should never have built bikes out of China, they have oversupplied the market and also mis interpreted the need. A classic case of mismanagement.

[@cyclopathic998]

Any news on KLE 450?

[@SuperOle2011]

Just look at how the VolksWagen Group has managed to transform Ducati. Now Mercedes should just add the entire KTM Group as their motorcycle subsidiary.

[@xeeded]

9:08 - Looks shorter than the Duke 390, and the front brake line routing looks like a nasty little snare. Can’t imagine this bike being the saviour of KTM. While I wish them the best of luck in finding their way, it seems very unlikely. The company’s net worth seems to be reduced to a nostalgia of what the brand could have been.

[@RealHooksy]

Bring on the CFMOTO 390advR or the Royal Enfield 390advR. One of them will buy them out and my money is in the Chinese seeing as they make most of their motors anyway.

[@terrarecon]

More like RE450 ADVR

[@easternyellowjacket276]

Almost bought one. Glad I didn't. They will never be the same after this. Might get a YZ250X.

[@guyonacub4335]

I'm told they are involved with the new CF450 Moto Not sure what the involvement is but I would imagine that could come to an abrupt end

[@brunocarmona4958]

Bajaj has already said that the KTMs and Husqvarnas built in India will continue to be manufactured. If KTM goes bust I believe either Bajaj buys the KTM brand or rebrand the 390s as Bajaj

[@Angry-Lynx]

Yay, finally ktm 950 adventure prices will go down. Not that i intend to buy one but still 😂

[@vincebuc6700]

I hope for the best for KTM despite the many crazy mistakes. But I’m actually prepared for the best of the customers. Banks are still giving credit to KTM and Indian and Chinese can’t wait to take their part because the new bikes are still super appealing. I bet we will see many 390s on the road soon.

[@Angry-Lynx]

F ktm as corporation, but it's sad customers and workers will suffer as always, not greedy management assholes who made that situation in the first place

[@michaelsupple6081]

Interesting! Our local KTM dealer just expanded from two dealerships to three within a hundred mile radius. Wouldn't you think they'd be mildly knowledgeable of this impending doom. Maybe they know something we don't. Time will tell.

[@q062am]

How many of the critics here have rode any one bike with the 1290 or 1390 engine. I guess no one. These are incredible bikes and if you ever get to ride one, there won’t be much to complain about. The V twin 10- and upward engine is just fantastic. Just did a valve check on my 1090 after 37k and the cams look like new…

[@garnet4846]

Fantastic, a sample size of one. Nevermind all the bankruptcy talk, it's all good because this guy's cams haven't failed. The Japanese make incredible and reliable bikes.

[@leanit5756]

I had a 1290 ADVR, 1290 SDR, and now a 1390 SDR. All great bikes and no problems. 1390 SDR, I think, is the best street-sport bike ever produced, and sold in the US.

[@FXSTB]

Solid, what do you think about the possibility KTM finds a buyer for their stake in Gas Gas? Although highly speculative that KTM would make this move, perhaps the restructuring of the MotoGP team is an indication of this move?

[@magyarvandor1221]

Get better bro.!

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Thanks 👍

[@SanketKambli]

390 adventures R and S were showcased at India Bike Week 2024. And are rumoured to launch jan 2025.

[@adaptableadventurerider]

Gws mate I think KTM need to sort reliability an stand by the bikes that’s what’s effected stuff we bought 2x 390adv’s had a 3 month battle with the dealer as both were riddled with manufacturing faults dealer did the right thing at 147 and 269 miles KTM were 0 help. I’d never buy another again an from what I’ve heard we are not the only ones that had those issues, the cam problems again put us off the Norden to,

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Cheers 👍

[@Liberty4Ever]

Over four years ago, I was planning to buy a KTM 390 Adventure based on specs and performance but got a bad vibe based on perceived reliability. That was mostly a problem with the larger KTM bikes but the KTM reputation for reliability issues put me off buying the 390 Adventure. I bought a BMW G310GS, got a great deal, and never used the 3 year factory warranty. Zero problems. I do all the maintenance.

[@adaptableadventurerider]

@ thanks for the reply liberty that’s good to hear about the 310, on the 390s we had issues with the tubeless rims not sealing, fly by wire issues, condensation in the displays to the point you couldn’t read them, Ktm put a line in the warranty book on the uk trying to wash there hands I got them rejected due to asking the dealer at point of purchase if there had been any issues with the bikes model wise. So when the warranty book came to light we were able to reject them. Dads also stalled in the fast lane of a motorway N no hazards wouldn’t restart total nightmare we had a similar situation with a Himalayan as well, so we’ve gone back to Honda an BMW now, letting my 1150gsa go soon due to a nerve injury for a 2nd nx500 :)

[@Liberty4Ever]

@@adaptableadventurerider - Sorry to hear of your 390 Adventure woes. All bikes can have issues. The first couple of model years of the G310GS had some issues but BMW fixed them. In fact, I got a good deal on my G310GS because BMW pulled a bunch of them back from the dealers to fix the welds that were breaking on the kickstand mounts and I think they also did a brake upgrade to prevent premature corrosion and maybe replaced problematic stators? My bike was one that was returned for repairs. I bought the 2019 in late October, a few months before the 2021 models were going to hit the showrooms, so the dealer came down US$400 after BMW Motorrad knocked off $1000. The bike wasn't that expensive to start with so that was a very good deal on a new bike with a three year factory warranty. As I mentioned, I didn't need the warranty. The bike has never been back to the dealer. I do all of the routine maintenance per the BMW manual. So far, for the first four years, it's been cheap to keep - gas, oil, tires, and brakes. I have spent a lot on farkles, though. :-/ As I mentioned, all bikes can have issues, but it's how the dealer and manufacturer address those problems that matters. BMW has a reputation for being a bit more expensive but they also have a reputation of fixing problems. When they're on the hook to make it right, that keeps them focused on avoiding problems, which is best for the manufacturer, dealer and customers. I was afraid KTM was in trouble when their twins had premature cam wear (the so-called cheese cam problem) and KTM tried to ignore it as the expensive problem became exponentially more expensive as they continued to manufacture defects because they refused to acknowledge they had a problem. Now, they have a bad reputation... for reliability AND for support. KTM is going to have a very difficult time climbing out of that hole they dug for themselves.

[@adaptableadventurerider]

@ yep I 110% agree with that I had a 1200gsa dealer destroyed the engine on service under the extended warranty and bmw stepped in an sorted it always the best indicator of a good company how they deal with issues as you say anything made can always go wrong.

[@pbrigham]

Ofcourse you will, the only change is that the Chinese can take full ownership at a much cheaper price. And by the way, the same will happen to a lot motorcycles and cars brands, they are only waiting for them to go bust to buy them.

[@KP-xr9sl]

@chroniclesofsolid wish you a speedy recovery mate, how do you think this news will effect resale value of current 2nd hand KTM's, Gas Gas & Husky's?

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Cheers mate 👍

[@patauger1193]

Can't wait if they show up in Dakkar race....

[@N1lav]

390 Adv R and S is stated to reach Indian showrooms by Mid January. You wont have any problems finding those since Bajaj is in charge of production

[@marcochavane3124]

Its a shame. Just when we were on the cusp of them delivering a smaller displacement flickable trail bike with decent off road manners that we have asked for for decades. .

[@randyadams4054]

I love KTM I hope they make it....

[@herethereandelsewhere1941]

I would go for "Prepare for the worst an d hope for the best." Seems to be more realistic in their situation...

[@MikiedarkensvtSmith]

I would really like to see CfMoto step up and pull KTM out of the waters they are in. Doing so I would like to see CfMoto be sold at KTM dealers across the states giving them more grown of dealerships which CfMoto is lacking

[@sourjya2004]

Just launch ktm powerparts and keep the prices high, like 30-35k for akra or remus slip ons (road legal) and watch money fly.

[@oxfomoto]

Saw this at Motorcycle Live here in the UK and thought it was a nailed on cert to be my next bike. But then the news broke and I went and put my money down on a MT450 instead.

[@slakk5093]

Soo. Doubt we will be seeing the KTM 390 R in March like planned. Considering KTM is shutting down all manufacturing in JAN and FEB 2025

[@pauln6803]

The 390 platform is built by Bajaj in India. Bajaj is a major stakeholder in KTM. Whether it will be worth it for Bajaj to launch the Adventure model is a different question.

[@ronboe6325]

With KTM depending upon Bajaj and CFMoto to produce bikes what is prevent them from waiting for KTM to go away then produce those machines on their own? What does KTM bring to the table for them? You have the known KTM brand (which has taken a hit lately but assuming it's still on the positive side). I'm assuming, have no idea really, but KTM has the engineers to actually design engines and chassis so for long term development I'm not sure Bajaj or CFMoto could carry the torch further - but there are options out there (Rotax). I've been so out of touch with the industry that this has been a shock so it makes me wonder how the rest of the manufacturers are doing. Perhaps you can get some white plastic framed sunnies next - have a play with them while you recover. :^) Hope you recover quickly.

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Cheers Rob

[@ronboe6325]

@@chroniclesofsolid Who's Rob?

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Rob is your name when I fat finger my keyboard😅 Apologies mate

[@elgringoec]

Interesting how one culture treats a company as a plural noun while another treats it as a singular noun. Praying for KTM to resurge.

[@kevinarmstrong478]

I want CF Moto to buy KTM and produce the 390 at a good price with good reliability. So they will have a lightweight and midweight adventure bike. And they would get the 890 to compete with the Kove 800

[@smiththers2]

i like the looks of the 390 enduro, but why would they run the exhaust under the engine? thats a street bike trait... its about time these companies make exhaust systems better and less prone to slamming into rocks....

[@ronlawson5819]

If they figure out a way to keep things moving forward…..they have to produce the 390 line up…..look at the success of Hondas 300L and the Rally 300.Im sure their investors have

[@enriquejaimes3368]

That 390 can definitely save KTM if they price it well and meets expectations. I'd would get one :)

[@Ozsmallbore]

It's going to take a lot more than that.

[@soviethog7874]

Hello chroniclesofsolid According to the information I've got and a fellow investor myself. Bajaj and CF Moto are in talks with KTM. Unfortunately I don't really know about the information regarding CF MOTOs standing on KTMs current situation. But I get a bit of news from Bajaj that they are in talks. Bajaj is a very meticulous company, they take things pretty slow and take a long time to come to the conclusions. But to my knowledge Bajaj is indeed looking to hold some KTM shares. Please take this as a grain of salt.

[@aatee5840]

At first I was like, "oh no!" but then after I checked that now we have the new 450MT, 400DRZ, CR300F, BMW450whatever, and who knows what else is up-and-coming for the segment, I am now "anyway"

[@chroniclesofsolid]

Yer, sucks that it’s happening but the segment is booming without them.

[@kevinconville9258]

Every time I've considered a KTM over the years, reliability issues kept my wallet in my pocket. I'm just not that dedicated to the gain in performance to overlook the pain in the ass factor. But if you're 6'8" , 30 years old, 250 lbs of muscle, and have serious chops, they do have a giant 150 HP dirt bike for you.

[@cowmath77]

Toyota just had to recall 100,000+ trucks due to critical engine failure due to poor manufacturing compliance. I have a feeling that won’t stop anyone from buying a Toyota and still making fun of BMW for reliability. People like to hate on KTM because it’s a performance leader in a market of heavier and slower Japanese bikes that requires a higher price of entry.

[@fpaquet]

Japanese bikes are cheaper than ktms generally no?

[@noidreculse8906]

I haven’t owned a Toyota since my 2008 4 runner 💩

[@cowmath77]

@@noidreculse8906 I own a 2004 GX470. I also own a Triumph and Ducati.

[@AkshaySingh-jk2uf]

Bookings are already started here in India for 390s