Classic Stossel: School Choice Rises from a Flood

Exciting things are happening in education. In some places, charter schools bucked the unions, and got results.
Hurricane Katrina made that experiment possible by destroying much of New Orleans. Now most New Orleans students attend charters, and they’re learning more.
A Classic Stossel from 2011.

[@scottmiller4711]

I imagine the Teacher Unions hate it when schools like this exist and succeed...

[@carlanderson7618]

Of course they do. Key point at Sci-Academy is the principle can fire a will. Teachers Unions fight tooth and nail against any form of teacher performance based pay system or accountability.

[@K1OIK]

@@carlanderson7618 principle ? Is that like a principal?

[@elslick]

It's what keeps there board member up late at night hahahahaha

[@robe4314]

Worst thing Jimmy Carter ever did (and that’s a long list) was cower to the Teacher’s Unions and form the Department of Education. I believe it has set our nation back greatly.

[@K1OIK]

@@elslick like their?

[@DJVARAO]

Is it OK to drop a tear of joy watching kids getting better education? Thank you, John.

[@Lue1337]

Yes

[@bes03c]

I thought I was the only one.

[@SteveJones172pilot]

@@bes03c Nope!

[@MijoShrek]

That one was genuine, the they have to do a raffle because the school is actually teaching and uplifting them and will drastically see the difference of the kid who was apathetic and is not wanting to go to college. It means they're getting a shot at getting out to a better life. Some us kids know we can't go if our grades don't reflect us being able to. We know the scams way before we deal with the loans.

[@chrishand259]

me too... wow... it is possible people... we need to demand more from our leaders... more value for our tax dollars!

[@Ryan-wx1bi]

My step brother just started teaching at a charter school. He said he's amazed at how much the kids pay attention and how he's able to actually teach the kids for once.

[@crystalkaiser1142]

It's great to hear some good news for a change.

[@narnia1233]

It makes sense. The kids and parents literally choose to be there. And I think that actually does have a big impact even just psychologically.

[@glasshalffull2930]

My son went to an elementary school and a kid was transferred in from another school where he had been expelled. This one kid disrupted my son’s class for years until he finally was kicked out. Without the ability to actually discipline a disruptive student, an entire class can be brought down. If you want to behave and learn then you should be welcomed with open arms. If not, your butt should be out the door.

[@TheRisky9]

@@glasshalffull2930 I feel this. Even when I was in high school, if a particular student was in your class, expect to learn nothing the entire year.

[@VC-co4qg]

It's amazing what can happen when everyone is held accountable, including school admin, teachers, support staff, and students! Bravo, Louisiana !!

[@jonathannelson103]

Yeah, but what about the incompetent teachers? What about teachers that just want to push a political narrative? If theres competition, they will have to find other jobs. You can't expect someone who has been teaching badly for years to suddenly become competent. This isn't the real world. Results are optional. Once you start applying standards, well, the whole system collapses.

[@keith4886]

Exactly. Now we need this to happen right across the board ...clean things up. Accountability WORKS!

[@carlanderson7618]

“Do we really think that a government-dominated education is going to produce citizens capable of dominating their government, as the education of a truly vigilant self-governing people requires?”- Alan Keyes

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

Excellent point! Yes, the only way to be a free people is to dominate government and never let government SERVANTS dominate you.

[@StickNik]

Would love a catch-up with these charter schools.

[@generalawareness101]

A follow-up is needed for sure. Where are they at now?

[@juniorvonclaire3576]

The teacher with tears said it concisely and with a sense of compassion and urgency.

[@imnotbenavery9220]

My 3 stepsons transferred to a charter and started thriving

[@seraeggobutterworth5247]

Agreed. This is great to see, but 12 years have passed since this piece was produced.

[@scallywag1716]

This is awesome! Hopefully this grows and grows and grows. Choice is always a good thing in any society and market.

[@brittanycunningham787]

This video is from 2013

[@tracybarhite1764]

Yes, it is good, but Biden and most democrats don't support school choice. The unions have them in their pockets!

[@Ziffel22]

The Teacher's Union practically guarantees failure.

[@TheRealSovereignCitizens]

The government union is destroying America

[@TheCodybrown]

I love my kids Charter School! I often say that in my life I'm not always sure I have made the right decision, but there is no doubt in my mind that sending my kids to a charter school is the best decision I have ever made.

[@Cheray_]

The rainbow after the flood! Amazing results NOLA!❤🙏🏾

[@elslick]

This is awsome more rebuild like this need to happen. School hasnt changed in 100 years its time to update our education systems.

[@kylebroflovsky6015]

Careful, charter schools are still controlled by the state government. So, even though the local dysfunction would be bypassed, charter schools must contend with the dysfunction at the state level.

[@groosbro1]

The state mandates that kids get an education, the curriculum depends on the school. Imagine that we sent me to the moon using nothing more than slide rulers and calculators, now the kids can't comprehend half of what they read, and let's not talk about mathematics and sciences.

[@M0rshu64]

Even with that in mind, they are still alot better than public schools.

[@kylebroflovsky6015]

@@M0rshu64 they are taxpayer funded. They are still public schools. Just a variation on a theme. Been there Seen it Done it

[@groosbro1]

@@kylebroflovsky6015 Be that as it may, currently schools are little more than warehouses for kids until they either graduate or age out. If the money follows the kids parents will have a choice.

[@lolwtnick4362]

​@@kylebroflovsky6015so why aren't you homeschooled?

[@IamFantastic]

I speak up every day about the indoctrination of our children with public education and how much it hurts our children! I love what this city has done! I pray these schools continue across the country. ❤

[@ragnarok7976]

When the rules are "produce the best results or die" you get the best results. These results are so good in fact that the kid was able to undo educational deficiencies from previous generations (tutoring his mom). High tides truly do raise all ships. Imagine what society would be like if things like this were the majority of cases and not the minority.

[@boslyporshy6553]

What happens when best results change?

[@kevinward7498]

The problem with these kids going to college is most of the colleges are just as useless as the public schools they once had. I hope the charter schools are steering the students to trade and technical colleges.

[@reasonablespeculation3893]

Absolutely. Skilled trades are the answer. It takes intelligence and study to be a machinic or an RN, so everyone can't do it. But unless you are truly outstanding, and ready for science and engineering at a college level, trade school is the way to go. Let's stop pretending everyone is the same.

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

True, we have enough bean counters and that job can easily be done by a computer. A skilled welder, carpenter, plumber, electrician, painter, etc. are a thousand times more valuable to any society than any "liberal Arts" or "Woman Studies" major.

[@MijoShrek]

​@@mikewurlitzer5217those kids weren't the ones who go into BS degrees. How rough is them streets around those parts. I'd rather have them move up out and forward them to continue the cycle. They can rise and get grants plenty. The change begins with that student started liking the school and taking on responsibility for themselves. That is more empowering, than saying everything is against them. We've already known this for a long time now. People have short term memories in this country.

[@charliesschroedinger]

Nice to see a little positivity first thing this morning. Thank you Sir for the upload.

[@thomashauguel6811]

I've always found it interesting that the VAST majority of teachers unions are against charter schools. You'd think that they would be for school choice since they should be in support of student success by whatever means, but that is not the case. Teachers unions exist to keep the status quo in place, which only serves to hide poor quality teachers, which in turn encourages other teacher to do only the minimum, which leads to the cycle of poor quality public education that the US finds itself in today.

[@charlesray4084]

unions are intested in protecting their workers how they make money and grow power the less power over anything semi private fire at will threatens fewer dues!

[@GM6.7]

When you care more about your teachers retirements and fringe benefits over the education of the child who attends, then you realize what the issues will be long-term. Not to mention the salaries of administrators.

[@edwardx.winston5744]

This is the first and only Stossel report that actually brought me to tears. Bravo, New Orleans charter schools! Would that a crashing red wave in 2024 sweep across the nation and wash away the blight of public schools.

[@83licata]

Ben Marcovitz, founder of Sci Academy(charter school) in New Orleans, LA, "If you walk into a school and the first thing they tell you is complaints about their facility, there probably not focused on the right things!" Ain't that the facts, stop focusing on the weather(it's hot, it's cold, there's snow, etc), LGBTQ+ theories, social justice, etc, and focus on reading, writing, math, science, home economics, gym class, and art.

[@user-mq4vo3mk1s]

Time to readjust American public education.

[@texaslibertystrong4795]

Jhon Stossel has for over A decade has been a champion of liberty minded journalism. And has used that journalism to point out ways to improve things that are either oppressive or just dysfunctional and I just want to say thank you to you John you've been a real Becon of hope amongst the sea of Corrupt biased ill motivated excuses for journalism.

[@Maxime_K-G]

Coming from a country where school choice is a civil right as this issue almost caused a civil war in the past I have always found the American system strange and a bit baffling. It only feeds into the housing crisis and regional inequality too. People don't want to live in a district with bad schools and vice versa. It might have worked when people didn't move around so much and people of different income levels still lived in the same neighborhood but right now it's completely broken.

[@XJWill1]

It is baffling. Despite America's history from the last century of being anti-communist, the public school system follows many socialist principles. It tries to force all the schools and students to into a generalized model, smoothing out any variances with the intention of keeping the worst schools and worst students above some minimum level. However, that policy discourages innovation and removes incentives for average or outstanding schools and students to excel. And you are going to pay taxes to support this mediocre system, even if you send your children to a private school. The whole idea seems anti-American, and yet the system has persisted like this for decades.

[@Lue1337]

They make it hard to find a place, funding and operating, that's actually a problem in many countries and can be easily fixed by loosing up the regulations

[@Lue1337]

Really sad to see how much stuff people have to go through to have at least decent education, all the time, money and stress is not worth it most of times

[@elslick]

Yeah it worked when the us was primarily homesteads without mass transport public and private.

[@grast5150]

Only one word needed to explain.....UNIONS

[@GEM_MAX]

It's been 12 years since this story have you done an update on this story since? Have things gotten better or worst in those schools? Are any of these schools doing better or worst?

[@GregoryTheGr8ster]

They are worse--much worse. This so-called documentary was made when everything could appear to be fine, but now it is impossible to hide the truth about these charter schools. Greedy CEOs have stolen the money while doing the minimum necessary to appear to run schools. Children are left behind. What's worse is that this Capitalist robbery is still going on right now. Barack Obama said "There are some things that we do better through government." He was absolutely correct, especially with education. We cannot allow the education of our children to be left to private corporations. Education is an essential social service.

[@bikeny]

I was wondering the same questions as you. Maybe John can come back with some numbers in a later video. Fingers crossed.

[@s.s.4170]

Better or Worse... Inquiring minds want to know.

[@thegeneralist7527]

"My education is my future". If you learn the truth it shall set you free.

[@Rosskoflex]

Put my boy in a charter school last week. His school has a garden complete with chickens, bunnies, and a greenhouse. His education plan includes emotional intelligence. This is all in addition to our public school curriculum.

[@peterbrunsgaard2012]

My favorite journalist! ⚡️⚡️👏👏

[@SardonicDog]

I love stories like this that make me smile.

[@danirichey8313]

My son goes to a classical education charter school and WE LOVE IT. My kindergartener has a Spanish class he goes to twice a week, along with music and art. He can recite the pledge of allegiance in Latin and English. There is a huge emphasis on learning American history WITHOUT any of the woke nonsense. They also have amazing after school groups like a Bible Study group that you would never find at any public school. He’s already reading level 1 level books and can add and subtract (kinda). And the best part…. Its free ❤

[@ronoliver4351]

It’s amazing what can happen when GOVT gets out of the way!!!!!!

[@z0ebella]

I’m a teacher in New Orleans and can verify this is all true! School choice is the way America needs to go!!!

[@chaserohwedder8852]

So basically it takes a natural disaster to change blue state policy. 😂

[@bertblue9683]

Dammit, if everyone would have bought a Tesla, it would have never happened.

[@denisegaylord382]

Unfortunately, it appears to be the case. But the leftist elites that control these deep blue areas, are not known for humility or good sense.

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

@@bertblue9683 It is Marxist Communist democrats who are DEMANDING you buy an EV. As one who would love to own a Tesla Model S, I demand that an EV be a CHOICE as they are NOT the best vehicles for everyone. Seems the only Choice democrats want Americans to have is to kill or not kill their babies. They think we are too dumb to chose a car or a school.

[@divinecomedian2]

It's the same in red states

[@chaserohwedder8852]

@@divinecomedian2 red state policy doesn’t destroy lives or directly get people killed.

[@Red-sm1cl]

it's so alarming how increadably successful school choice is, and how many people are against it.

[@JavyonVISION]

Imagine running a school like a business, where results are expected of everyone, focused on academic excellence and not sociopolitical ends.

[@sherricoffman]

Thank you 4Sharing!!!❤🎉 MuchLove!!!❤🎉

[@thomas6502]

(The immense pride of feeling an ownership in your own education is priceless!)

[@VerbaVolantVV]

My Kids went PPCHS Pembroke Pines Charter School. They ended up accepted in ALL Ivy League Schools. Today, they are excellent professionals working for disrupting companies. Mr. Stossel, we still dont have the foggiest idea how great this country is despite all the woke crap, left noise, etc. All my respects

[@seraeggobutterworth5247]

It’d be great to see an update on this, given that it’s originally from 2011. Have the New Orleans charter schools continued to outperform regular public schools? Have more charter schools opened? How have the teachers’ union and public school system reacted in the past 12 years?

[@michal.abramowicz]

❤ the best of John!

[@robe4314]

Worst thing Jimmy Carter ever did (and that’s a long list) was cower to the Teacher’s Unions and form the Department of Education. I believe it has set our nation back greatly.

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

True and while Carter was a nice man, with good intentions, he absolutely sucked at leading the country to a brighter future. I think Reason TV could expand their series of: "Great Moments in Unintended Consequences" by just including all of Carter's policies.

[@bryanb3352]

@@mikewurlitzer5217 Nice men don't cause the creation of misery indexes. I don't understand this compulsion to say what a nice guy Carter is.

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

@@bryanb3352 Many people have the best of intentions and hence are nice people but totally inept when it comes to leadership and that describes Carter to a T. He was not an evil man, like 99% of all democrats, but just a total bozo with failed ideas.

[@bertblue9683]

So are the families still taxed on their property and funding public schools as well as paying additional tuition at the charter schools? That's how it works here in the Midwest, if I choose to send my kids to private schools, I still fund the public school. So my cost of education is substantially more.

[@latrofu]

No. A charter school isn't a private school. It's a public school that run by private teachers and administrators.

[@denisegaylord382]

This is why so many of us are insisting that all the money for education follow the student, not the school district, for education. Some local schools would lose money as students attend other schools. But those losing schools are usually the underperforming ones to begin with. Make the school EARN their money, by turning out educated children that have a wide variety of opportunities available to them. Those bad schools will either step up, and greatly improve or go away. Competition for students and the money attached to them is a strong incentive for the marginal schools to improve. Especially with the latest statistics about how much money we spend as a nation on education. I heard a report that over 1/2 of our country's states spend half of the states budget on education. Some of these states are spend upwards of 20 to 30 thousand dollars per kid per year, yet still have marginal at best results. Which in and of its self is a pretty jarring number, but then you see what results we are getting for those dollars spent. Its pretty abysmal.

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

It is IMPERATIVE that you fight to have ANY and ALL tax dollars earmarked for education to follow the child and NOT the government school. Commie democrats and their comrades in Marxist Teacher's Unions only want you to have the choice to kill or not kill your child and you must never be allowed to choose their school or their sex for that matter.

[@bertblue9683]

So the property tax mil levy will go to the school you choose to send your children to?

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

@@bertblue9683 That's correct. And in some areas of the country that is already the case.

[@kevinclause4p55p5]

This also proves why we dont want government run health insurance.

[@freethebirds3578]

I taught at a charter school in Phoenix. The school was better than the public schools in that area, but the director was an egomaniac who didn't renew contracts of teachers who didn't suck up. Recently in Fort Wayne, when a charter school was attempted, the teachers union rallied public school teachers to go to the meeting that would have approved the charter and fight it. It did not get the charter. Indiana has strong school choice laws, but the alternatives are mostly Catholic or Lutheran schools.

[@twistedhillbilly6157]

The schools in CA are so bad, neighborhood Co-ops are setting up classrooms in garages, dens, basements, etc.. Those who have time, pitch in with the home-school teaching and learning,, those who do not have time, donate money...

[@K1OIK]

CA?

[@heatherbronner2539]

What a joy to see something positive that really does make a worthwhile difference. Thanks!

[@MorrisonManor]

This is the exact same system my kids had in California. The charter they went to was a university prep program. 10 years later, the school they went to is no longer allowed to operate out of the "normal" curriculum, hiring/firing rules and matriculation exemptions and they have to take any kid that wants to go there even if the only reason is that their friends go there. From first in the county to a babysitting academy in just a few short years.

[@themacker894]

Great video. Gives me hope for our amazing country's future.

[@dscharlesworth1]

I would be interested in seeing a follow up with these schools and the former students. Plus current students.

[@HAROLD-CORE]

All my children go to a charter school co-op. All the parents need to pay a bit, and contribute through instruction with our individual specialties. But I have never seen anything so inclusive, and it has rocketed children to success.

[@Stax-ht9md]

Good for you New Orleans!

[@hcv66666]

Students in the freest country in the world deserve freedom to choose their schools from young, not until college.

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

The ONLY approved Choice thanks to Marxist democrats is the Choice to kill or not kill your babies. After that, Marxist democrats demand the ability to control every aspect of your life. Democrats are public enemy #1 and deserved to be treated as such.

[@simunator]

power to the parents

[@keliblum6591]

I love videos like this one. Excellent! Please keep them coming. 😊

[@SgtJoeSmith]

It makes me cry to see the kids cry they didn't get name drawn for that charter school cause it doesn't have enough teachers or space.

[@Siberianhuskypuppy]

Homeschool is the way to go. Moms be a mom to your kid

[@tabs3436]

I live in a state that does not have a teacher union but believe me, the majority of teachers are against school choice! They know that their jobs will be threatened.

[@gingerdurbin2726]

Wonderful. Go Maui!

[@hyfy-tr2jy]

There is one thing not truly addressed here.... It falls into the category of "survivor bias". Because these schools see high demand from kids/families who want to see their children do better or the kids are more motivated...of course you see higher scores. Parental involvement and a desire to learn are all key factors in quality of outcome and these schools stack the deck in their favor because of this. It would be shocking, even with equitable quality of teachers to public schools, if their scores were not higher.

[@I.C.Weiner]

Parents who actually care about their children won't have their children held back by those who don't care.

[@arfarf152]

Awesome!!

[@smartman2796]

Just like any position. You protect the bad workers you alienate your good ones

[@BrianBellia]

Yet again, government just has to get out of the way. How many times do people need to hear this?

[@ruthlessreid9172]

Great story.

[@davidanalyst671]

I can't wait to see stossel cover whats going on in florida and other states that are starting to send funds to charter schools when students go there.

[@iamkesha.]

I love how all of the schools in this video wears school uniforms. As someone who grew up wearing uniforms from K-12, I support it and it is more affordable for parents. For some parents who cry about individuality, your kid is going to school to learn not a fashion show.

[@frankcolumbo4481]

Just turn your kids on to Khan Academy. Who needs teachers and classrooms?

[@denisegaylord382]

Or any number of other options. I kinda am leaning to a more Sacratic teaching style that offers kids not only the opportunity to interact with a wide variety of other kids, but also requires that they learn the skills necessary to think independently and be self governing.

[@hbarudi]

Yes we need school choice. More places should offer school choice to families and kids.

[@scorpio6587]

The real difference no one will talk about is they can get rid of the bad kids, unlike the public schools.

[@rinopw4262]

Could stossel make an update video on this, how are they doing today

[@rh9915]

Good stuff

[@TC-py3oo]

Sheldon Whitehouse and Jack Reed will never allow charter schools in Rhode Island

[@markfink7146]

Accountability and performance, unions hide that to no end.

[@blessedwithchallenges9917]

In the Seattle area i place Japanese students. There are a very few charter schools, and they have waiting lists of 6-8yrs! Mothers who just gave birth sign up on the waiting list. The public schools charge my Japanese students 20-28k, and have few foreign students. The higher performing private schools charge 12-18k, and are always at capacity of foreign to local student requirements.

[@BIGWIGGLE223]

I would love to hear the teacher's union seeth over this school and how successful it is. This should be the blueprint for schools across the nation. Where is Vivek at??? He needs to see this. I know he wants to get rid of the Dept of Education.

[@danielsurvivor1372]

4:30 We extremely need more of school choice 😢

[@nevadacario2000]

I loved online school

[@LanceMan]

This is exactly how schools should operate.

[@R_D_EYE_R8]

Definitely the best thing we’ve done for our kids. I still don’t understand why we don’t get the same funding that public schools get. My kids get a far better education without all of the government propaganda.

[@butchsilk3145]

Excellent video! Get rid of teachers unions!!

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

Even self avowed socialist FDR understood unions in the public sector would always be a bad thing.

[@PennywiseM3]

Can you do an episode on this new tip/gratuity sense of entitlement that is everywhere in America now? My wife and I just back from a two week vacation in three different European countries and no one asked for a tip!

[@glennsampson5945]

"The school choice movement is here to stay. It will never go back." Boy, I sure hope he is right. It would be great if school choice spread to all major cities across the land and beyond.

[@Zimfier3]

I recognize and don't miss those FEMA trailers.

[@offgridhomesteadingmcgarve1494]

This is how we change the schooling for our youth. I’ve always said the highest income should be our teachers not athletes. And we would have the best for our youth.

[@KM-zu9we]

Mrs O’Leary and her cow needs to visit Chicago again.

[@awsome7201]

perfect

[@sjhanksaz]

In Arizona we have lots of charter schools

[@jimpait1097]

I live in Colorado, and the top schools are all Charter.

[@SteveJones172pilot]

This is a new video, but in it they said the kids were "Class of 2013".. I wonder how the school is doing now?

[@azzir325]

Keep the teacher's union out!

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

Even self avowed Socialist FDR understood any Union in the public sector was wrong.

[@natehill8069]

Robert Heinlein, prolific pioneering science fiction author, was never reluctant to share his political views. He said the best school is a log with a teacher at one end and a student at the other. Its not about the buildings, its what happens inside.

[@CarbageMan]

God Save America!

[@Wurum]

Would love to see an update, where's Reggie now?

[@makdaddy8399]

The only people against "Choice" are either in it for the money or the power. Period.

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

You have just perfectly described GOVERNMENT and Teacher's unions.

[@boslyporshy6553]

​@@mikewurlitzer5217What about Government and Teacher's union choice?

[@TheRisky9]

A lot of people criticize charter schools because they "don't cater to special needs." Well, that is bull. I recently met this teacher who, during COVID, started her own charter school specifically for neurodivergent students who didn't thrive in that virtual environment. Hell, they struggled to thrive in public school. Within one year with her, they were passing and acing the state required exams. Even the nonverbal students. Yeah, teachers care. Let them teach! Parents care. But they're often left at the opinions of so called "education experts" who give a bleak prognosis.

[@dennislamers986]

Parochial schools around my area do well too.

[@JJones-gw9vy]

How cool would it be if colleges were accountable, too? Oh the students failed to grasp the material and didn't actually have a career lined up in their field to begin with? Then the college is on the hook for the loan. You'd see colleges OVER NIGHT drop all of the Bullcrap studies and actually focus on investing in the education of the young adult. My college didn't even require I show up to class- as long as they got paid, it didn't matter to them. And while we're at it, let's remove the ability to monopolize college textbooks and publisher company lobbying with One-time-use book codes. I'm in my early 30's and if there's one thing I've learned in the past decade, it's that there are at least two major scams in life and they mutually perpetuate each other with their lobbying. The first is hospitals/insurance and the second is college/student loans. They're co-dependent upon their respective parasitic relationships with little to no accountability to the consumer. If insurance didn't exist, bandaids at the hospital wouldn't cost 62 dollars a piece. Insurance and hospitals need each other to financially operate their scam. College and student loans are no different.

[@the.internet.guy.]

Dang.

[@lastremain7867]

4:40 Do those cities need another crisis because those cities are horrible in modern times.

[@njpfvc744]

❤

[@SteveXNYC]

Education = Ed you can't notion.

[@tpoz48]

Great idea. Level all big cities to the ground and start all over.

[@mikewurlitzer5217]

The founders fully understood the corruption created by big cities and that was the exact reason for including the "Electoral College" in our Presidential elections. Otherwise, just a handful of big, corrupt cities with people stacked up like cord wood would set all the rules. Eg: It makes sense, in a huge congested city to ban or limit private ownership of cars, while in the rest of the country that would be insane. But don't try telling that to a Marxist democrat. Oh and lets not forget how the lying big city democrats stated; "Nobody's coming for your gas stoves", right before they came for our gas stoves, water heaters, furnaces.