Comics Media Won't Let X-Men Not Be Gay Fanfic

[@lisaroberts8556]

Scott & Logan doing things? 🤮 Those are not my X-Men!

[@iwatchDVDsonXbox360]

Chocolate Cyclops vs. Regular Cyclops, who will come out on top? 😂

[@CultureWorrier100]

I find it hilarious that Marvel's policy post Krakoa is "Whatever happened on the island, stays on the island!" Hahaha. Marvel is about to learn that these weirdo fans they have been cultivating aren't going to like it. Serves them right. This is the fan base they wanted.

[@Gotten1888]

a few people on twitter that kept shouting about wanting the gay and never bought a comic in their lives and now telling them that is not front and center? nahhhh

[@themultiversalmagpie7827]

I think they need to reboot the whole of marvel rn, maybe take it back to the early 90s or 2000s, but Idk if they can because their writers suck

[@rocketraccoon1976]

To the media: These books are no longer made for you, so don't buy them. It's just that simple.

[@Loislikes]

"You get to be gay, and YOU get to be gay. EVERYONE gets to be gay." Is essentially what comics have become everywhere.

[@Hal70jordan]

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@mattmartin6493]

Super realistic and reflects real life, o sorry I mean the echo chamber of 25 industry people that call anyone with a different perspective fascists.

[@AgentDeCamp4]

They need to have Moira do a reset and then pay John Byrne a couple mill for the stories he has completed and go from there

[@JustaMetalFan]

I remember last week when the final Krakoa era book came out, there was a "mermorial service" going on on Twitter. They had the start and end year and everything. Aside from thinking, what was so special about Krakoa that they had to have a eulogy, the replies to that thread made me realize the idea of people who like the Krakoa era only started reading X-Men from there more clearly. I don't usually crap on people for liking what they like, we all like things that can be or ARE considered bad, but the glazing of this era and being touted as the best thing to come out of X-Men really just paints a picture of how young these new readers are and how they cared more about things like diversity, and political themes revolving around what they deem is correct than good writing and story telling.

[@Gotten1888]

did they actually read it though?

[@garthwhitely9012]

If they didn’t care about the sales 3-4 years ago they sure as hell aren’t gonna care now. They poisoned the well years ago, pushing out garbage and insulting the actual X-Men fans that were buying comics consistently over decades. Now it’s too late and no one wants to write for the X-Men anymore because of the bullshit that tainted the X-Men line.

[@Loislikes]

Yea, comics are not in their golden age whatsoever. If they cared, they would bending to the comic fans base, even the old old boomers. But they don't care, which says it all.

[@EvandroACruz]

Modern writers are vandals that poison everything is good,pure and heroic in these fictional characters. What terrible times we're living in nowadays.

[@davidfarrington4308]

I just want to go to the gas station and pick up a copy of Marvel Team Up. Maybe Daredevil helps Spidey fight Electro and Sandman, but Sandman’s heart isn’t in it. Something like that.

[@robertfalcone3025]

AGREE 💯

[@dennisbalch2217]

​@@robertfalcone3025 Man do I agree. I really miss fun stories like marvel team up used to provide.

[@johnevans4867]

This times a million. YES.

[@terryquinlan499]

Man wasn't that great. Go to the local drug store spinner rack. Sure miss that.

[@BrianRidgway-u5g]

Plus a Baby Ruth bar. Then all will be right with the world!

[@icarusdei6592]

As Hickman himself has said, canon isn't just what makes print, but what is remembered, cherished, and survives in future storytelling. Regardless of whether the "throuple" was on the page or not, if it's a dumb idea that audiences and future creators don't pick up on, then it's not canon.

[@davidgantenbein9362]

The throuple was recognized by the complete remaining fandom, I‘m pretty sure it’s among the things people will remember for a while. If future writers will pick it up, that will be seen.

[@Bazscoobz]

[ And professor X wakes up, "ahh it was all just a bad dream!" ] Fixed it no more krap-oa

[@powermasterjazz]

"The Krakoan Era was a breath of fresh air." No, it smelled like ass.

[@robertfalcone3025]

I blame Hickman for that Wolverine..Jean Grey & Cyclops DEBACLE in the first place.

[@camila_costa12]

It actually all started with Chris Claremont

[@joeparrigen4982]

​@@camila_costa12 What issue? I don't remember them willing to share Jean.

[@camila_costa12]

​@@joeparrigen4982I'm talking about Jean's fetiche for wolverine only, and their love triangle, that's how it all started

[@camila_costa12]

​@@joeparrigen4982if there was no love triangle, than this throuple thing would never happen

[@joeparrigen4982]

@@camila_costa12 ok. I got you.

[@uxm4life94]

Mystique and Destiny caused Days of Future Past timeline and the nightmare future of Nimrod and Sentinel domination in the 1st place. They did this by assassinating Xavier and Moira. Krakoa is a continuity train wreck.

[@EvandroACruz]

Modern writers just choose ignore past storylines.

[@InfamyOrDeath-__-]

They need to just create a gay line of comics, like manga does, go look at seven seas page and see all the Yaoi manga they publish, and look at the comments. It has an extremely thirsty audience. Stop cramming all this stuff into the mainstream, you won’t see lots of this in regular Shonen, you’ll actually see barely any of it. It’s all in it’s own genre, comics need to do the same. Because although it has a thirsty audience, it’s tiny compared to the people reading the big Shonens that has none of it.

[@ColeMacGillivary-zi9wq]

You're a genius. Let the mainline be straight and let the Crap be its own thing.

[@greendaleforever]

Yes, let all those who hate themselves stay together....in a very teeny tiny corner nowhere near me 😂

[@ColeMacGillivary-zi9wq]

😂😂😂

[@brianerickson6775]

The problem is Hollywood thinks "Gay Comics" is main stream. Its just "those" people are (insert "-ist" insult). Good idea, but not going to happen.

[@davidgantenbein9362]

While it’s clever to actually write for the right target audience, that’s not what activists want. They want to smash their opinion into the wrong audience. And DC/Marvel seemingly don’t pay enough anymore to hire anything but activists. That said, why has none of these LGBTQ+ writers started their own thirsty gay label? I mean one of them should at least try, they can’t all be just plants hell bent on gender bending Superman and Batman. At least one of them should actually be in it for writing the gayest comics ever.

[@ColeMacGillivary-zi9wq]

The entire Krakoan age was a fanfiction.

[@GIANLUCANABBO]

I disagree. Fanfiction, as the name implies, is something made by fans.

[@ColeMacGillivary-zi9wq]

I was joking I didn't hate it it just felt like a fanfic.

[@GIANLUCANABBO]

@@ColeMacGillivary-zi9wq don't worry, I knew it, it's just that you jokingly gave them more credit than they deserve. We're joking, these people write not out of passion but only out of contempt, they are truly miserable.

[@maxmazzotti6651]

It never happened

[@EvandroACruz]

Yes a very bad fanfiction. The biggest characters assassinations in Marvel history.

[@brianerickson6775]

"The MCU will never revisit the Krakoa era" two words: Star Wars. Never underestimate Disney ability to crush your hopes and dreams. Disney is willing to die on the message. Hope you are right, but....

[@markhowd7117]

It can always and probably will get worse

[@brianerickson6775]

@@markhowd7117 100% agree

[@EvandroACruz]

Marvel's biggest mistake was not doing a complete reboot of Krakoa. The franchise is now forever tainted and these douchebags plan to return with Krakoa someday, because this was the end of "The First Krakoan Age". The X-Men don't are true good since the late of the 90's. Everything started gone wrong since the ending of Morrison run. Even nostalgia cannot fix these characters anymore because all them are just plant clones of the original X-Men at this point. Corrupted versions of the X-Men. Just the scene with Jubilee burning down some bigots car or seeing Kitty "Murderer" Pryde like a barista serving drinks and looking happy after all your actions in Fall of X make me don't have any hope for "From The Ashes". X-Men are dead in the comics. X-Men 97 is the only X-Men for me now.

[@Superhead_collectables]

The 90’s had some of the best and most recognizable storylines ever for the franchise. Fatal Attractions, X-Cutioners Song, Age of Apocalypse, Phalanx Covenant, and Operation Zero Tolerance were all huge. They had great stories and art.

[@brianelam9297]

Marvel has really let me down as a life long comic reader(started reading in 1991). Everything since the mid 2010s has been bad and the Krakoa area was what finally made me stop. Cyclops is my favorite X-Men character and to even hint they were going to do to him what has been done to Iceman was the last straw for me

[@EvandroACruz]

Cyclops was ruined to me when Marvel turned him in the new Magneto in the Utopia Era. I never liked Cyclops again after that.

[@uxm4life94]

The same hypocrites who have utter contempt for fans that care about continuity and demanded nonsensical changes are outraged that the X-men they pretended to like are changing again?!

[@Dunebat]

Given what Xavier did at the end of the Krakoa run, I'm surprised any of his former students still want to bear his "X" on their clothes.

[@EvandroACruz]

Don't make any sense. The dream is dead. The X symbol is tainted with blood. The mutants need start again with a new fresh team.

[@burne27]

TC always giving me catnip via the Krakoan era As a lapse fan, there’s nothing they can do to bring me back now. HOX/POX was the end of a 40 year arc that started w/ Giant Size and I was genuinely happy they got a the island and “grew up”. So my head cannon is that last shot of Mags & Xavier with the fireworks in the back, is the literal end of the series. Marvel Comics officially ended literally w/ secret wars. Everything after that is a new universe that I’m more than comfortable stepping back from.

[@demetricsmith471]

It baffles me that the members of the Brotherhood of EVIL Mutants are confused with heroes/heroines. How readers consider Mystique, Sabertooth and Magneto to be "good guys" is beyond me. The line is broken at present. I haven't enjoyed the books since the House of M and the Decimation.

[@PrivateCitizen84]

No it doesn't baffle me why they do this. This is happening in all forms of western entertainment to the point it is a cliche. Marginalized groups/people can't be shown in a bad light.

[@badmrbox]

I never saw Jean being spitroasted so that whole polyamory was just a troll to get the twitter maffia happy. The whole krakoan era was a tumblr fanfic that destroyed everyone. Dunno why they just dont reboot the whole thing away because it have to be memory holed anyway for anyone to have interest in the characters ever again. NightCrawler - devot catholic who turned to blasphemy and created his own sect (that somehow got forgotten by the writers along the way). Then he he murdered people happily left right and center and grabbed a few eyeballs along the way. Collossus - kills his girlfriend under mindcontrol. Never shows any emotions about it after he's no longer brainwashed. Cracks jokes while killing people happily. Kitty - turned drunkard and psychopath. Beast - character homocide until he was rebooted. Xavier - dude gotta have been mindcontrolling everyone because of everyones different behaviors from the norm. Turned into a psycho at the end of the run. Storm - she's no longer a character just a deus ex machina. Trouble brewing? Show Storm in a panel and she solves it by the power of strong independent woman. i could go on but this is enough. The krakoan era did this and the comics media is upset because their tumblr orgy fantasies are no more? Jaysus what a bunch of idiots.

[@Skywalker3248]

The worst thing is, this should be what I hate worst about Krakoa but it's actually the least. The X-Men becoming mutant supremacists, extorting the nations of the world, having unrepentant villains like Apocalypse and Sinister in their government? Kurt okay with Apocalypse killing de-powered mutants so they could be reborn with their powers, giving up Catholicism, and becoming a merciless killer?! He was the conscience of the X-Men, the morally best of them all, and they destroyed him. Same to most of the others (Hank for instance, what hell happened there, he stood against Scott back during the Utopia storyline and schism, and they turned him into Mengele). Sigh, I wish the orgy stuff was the worst destruction they did. (Long rant below about the triangle, feel free to skip ;) ) As to the whole cringe polyamorous Scott, Jean and Logan thing, that was dumb as soon as I heard it. You can tell someone thought this was some brilliant idea to solve the triangle but all does is damage all three characters. It's not anything any of the three characters would ever want or agree to. It's not in their established moral code or approach to romantic relationships (yes, even Logan), and all are smart enough to know it wouldn't give them what they want, a love all the way and exclusive not one to be found sharing. What some of these writers don't want to admit is sometimes in life to have what you want, means someone else doesn't, be it love, a job etc, or sometimes you have to choose. Jean used to be portrayed smart enough to know she needed to do that. In terms of the triangle itself, I didn't mind it way back, it had its purpose in the soap opera element of X-Men (like Spiderman) but it's gone on far too long. Way back it had elements of Arthur, Lancelot and Guinevere to it, but should have been resolved. It's long been an albatross around these characters neck (maybe because they feel need to keep resetting these characters they never let them get over it because they feel new readers expect it but I think even normies are getting tired of it). There hasn't been a point to it for a long time. While I've enjoyed the occasional alternate universe story featuring Logan & Jean together it was never going to happen in 616, whatever Claremont wanted at the end. As a Wolverine fan I already wanted him out of the dysfunctional drama that is Scott & Jean's relationship before Krakoa came about for a long time. And as a wider X-Men fan I wanted them to just stop with the endless triangles and drama bs that always happens with Scott & Jean. Beginning from the 60's with Xavier, Scott & Jean, then Warren, Scott & Jean - this lasted until the wedding, Logan, Scott & Jean of course, Maddie, Scott & Jean, Betsy, Scott & Jean and finally Emma Frost, Scott & Jean (and I'm sure I've forgotten some). It's exhausting. There was one moment for a short while in the 90's when it looked like Marvel was moving them all on after Scott & Jean got married. They closed the book on the Warren, Scott and Jean triangle, and so it seemed with Logan, Scott & Jean. Logan seemed to be moving on, even becoming friends with Scott (something they used against the Herald of Onslaught, who assumed they would act as the rivals he expected). Then the 2000's came, Logan, Scott & Jean got stirred up and Emma Frost came into the picture and I remembered sighing. Scott & Jean were back to business as usual. And Wolverine was never allowed to move on, keeping him stuck in this pointless soap opera bs. But no matter what I never thought anyone would take it to the Krakoa level of sheer and total stupidity. And (since I never read the ongoing Old Man Logan) it's even more unbelievable when I dipped in briefly to find out Mariko is alive again. She, Wolvie's would be wife (his best love interest by far imo) is alive, and they have him in a threeway with Jean and Scott! I hate current Marvel lol I'm glad they saying it didn't happen now, I just wish they'd have the wisdom to retcon everything in Krakoa. Otherwise it's dead Jim. All of it.

[@arcasa73]

And by the way "Mystique and Destiny... they've been lesbians all the time..." I'm not sure they were originally intended that way.

[@alexc8873]

They originally had a mother/daughter type which Mystique tried to emulate with Rogue in the 80s b4 she became good.

[@chrisdymmel2934]

According to Claremont, he intended for them to be lesbians, editorial shot it down and we got the mother/daughter thing instead.

[@arcasa73]

@@chrisdymmel2934 Interesting. Thanks!

[@spinningtornado4543]

I'd say Mystique and Destiny were more bisexual than anything : Mystique had many relationships in her life with men and Destiny had her own biological families whom she cared about.

[@jamichealruiz]

See I Have No Problem With Mystique Being Gay But To Make Wolverine Gay Is Unforgivable🤦🏽‍♂️

[@511.Maximus]

Who tf runs Screen Rant? Why do they pretend to care about things that real comic fans loathe?

[@robertfalcone3025]

I grew up buy Marvel Comics off the Spinner Rack in my local Brooklyn stationary store... when the fact that the Fantastic Four & Avengers would argue with each other..& Spider Man having typical High School problems & the ENTIRE Marvel Universe being based in the REAL world... mostly in my native NYC ...wss all considered a HUGE deal ..& when i see WTFs happened since then it doesn't seem real..😖

[@camila_costa12]

Bobby Drake is still straight to me.

[@EvandroACruz]

Prá mim também. O retcon do Bendis nunca fez sentido algum.

[@CinemaKingTheaters]

I don't think the movies will do well honestly.

[@corndogburglar8698]

I don't know. What we can be sure of is Marvel/Disney is going to race swap a bunch of X-Men and use lesser known characters. Which is crazy because X-Men is already one of the most diverse teams in comics. They have tons of awesome diverse characters. But they will still race swap.

[@bigtomboye]

I share that vibe

[@markhowd7117]

Not if they call it the Mutants

[@bujindork]

Idk the main team isn't diverse, Cyclops, Wolverine, Gambit, Colossus, Prof X,Magneto, Quicksilver,Beast,Iceman,Pyro,Jean Grey,Rogue are all white. Storm is black and Jubilee is asian. Unless 12 out of 14 being white is diverse to you.

[@tosweetdelight]

Age of Apocalypse was a breath of fresh air, too - but the writers/editors knew that it needed to have a definitive beginning and a definitive end. That's how the Krakoa era should've been written: a year, maybe less, then Moira dies after a huge failure with mutants being segregationists, so we can get our merry mutants back into the mansion, fighting for Xavier's - not Moira's or Magneto's - dream. The fact is, Moira's only lived 10 full lives - how many infinite possibilities are there? A lot. The best one being the X-Men being the X-Men.

[@andrewprowant6999]

They don't need to undo anything. They just need to focus on superheroes doing superhero things and make that the story.

[@afcansf5996]

it isn't only about eroding the various franchises, a lot of people have been seriously insulted, hurt and their reputations and livelihoods destroyed. Things have gone far beyond companies doing stupid things, I really doubt that they can fix this by making good products again.

[@gregoryfloriolli9031]

You have to go back at least 30 years to find a time when the X-Men were good. It boggles the mind.

[@EvandroACruz]

Yes X-Mne stopped to be good since the late of the 90's. This is main reason of why X-Men 97 was so aclaimed by the audience.

[@daishikaze3986]

Currently in the middle of Claremonts run on X-Men, midway through Classic New Mutants, I've read 2 Volumes of Excalibur, that is some quality work right there.I fully intend to grab the remaining Omnibuses of the Claremont Run. After that, thats where I dropped out (roughly, I got a bit in befoire noping out). I'm hoping more Omnibuses from the 80s comes out, like Gruenwald's Capt America Run among others, thats what I want to read, fun adventure stories about people trying to do the right thing and helping people, Not Gay Fanfic.

[@ThatJohnKillion1970]

The X-Men books will never recover from this disaster.

[@DIOBrando-ij2bp]

There is something pretty funny about that CBR article post X-Men ‘97.

[@invisibleshuffle]

You say that they shouldn't go with any of the Krakoan era stuff in their films because it failed in the comics, but they did 'Lady Thor' (a laughable failure) Ms. Marvel (a tripled down failure) and the worst Captain Marvel (a complete failure of a previously tolerable character) in the MCU. Don't count out their dogged insistence of stacking failure upon failure. Disney Star Wars still hasn't course corrected despite billions in losses, so I'm certain that if they don't reset the MCU with "Deadpool 3" we are going to see the worst of the modern X-Men on the silver screen. Be prepared for 'X' themed rainbow merch and a Krakoan float in next year's pride parade.

[@gavsmi6452]

Most comments I read supporting this era start with something like "Krakoa is what got me into X comics". These are clearly new fans. Nothing wrong with that in itself, but the problem you will have is that their specific tastes are so different from long term fans. They prioritise 'diversity' and 'inclusion'. They enjoy seeing traditional heroes broken down and deconstructed and like stories which try to justify bad guys actions. Create a niche spin off universe for them if you want, but the bigger audience is surely more into the traditional super hero storytelling.

[@MightyThorngren]

Just rediscovered this channel after it popped up after watching a different channel's comic video. I mean I totally get and agree with so much of what's being said here. And i like the idea of hust moving on and ignoring the worst bits. But I find it really weird how upset dude is at not just the idea Scott double teamed his wife with Logan, but that the two dude's balls might have touched when it happened. Like, some people are comfortable enough with themselves that sort of thing wouldn't make them insecure about their sexuality. Haha. I would if we could, time travel reality wipe away like One More Day did, but rewind to when Cable and Hope we're hopping around and redo where things went from there. Maybe tie it into Moira. But big reset. It could undo a lot, including Bendis stuff, the direction of Scott, what happened with Phoenix, and rehabilitate Sinister from the clown he's become.

[@TonyBaseballs23]

"They were not going to go down without a fight." Oh yes they will.

[@jonynitro1756]

Totally agree @11:50 Hickman had a legendary concept on his hands with Krakoa era, and yes I was of the many haters of X of swords event critiquing wtf. However, despite that bump in the road doesn't mean Hickman lost his magic. He could've took that era above and beyond with other and intended arcs to a true Finale as icing to the cake. Hickman is definitely not to blame for Krakoa's downfall. Higher ups choked big time chasing Hickman away.

[@phantomjim2380]

Rewind it to Giant Size #1 and explain it off as fever dreams of the original team trapped on Krakoa.

[@Anchor1981]

Unfortunately, they started veering down as slippery slope and I don’t think, at this point, that they’re going to be able to stop. In fact, if Jonathan Hickman built the slope, Jordan, White greased it and his minions cut the brake lines so there would be no way for anyone to stop it.

[@Drixenol86]

I miss the old Krakoa when it was an actual threat. 😢

[@zenvariety9383]

Honestly as an outsider looking in the entire continuity needs a reboot. It would be better to establish a new main universe tbh

[@walterlucero5757]

A lot of readers had high hopes when we found out Hickman was writing X-Men because we just came out of that gawd awful "Age of X-Man" event.

[@antwonsmith8931]

I ain't missing much on X-Men but I am reading some of their old stories.

[@raulzavala9061]

So glad I stopped buying the X-Men titles nineteen years ago, so much trash was going on what with Grant Morrison and Joss Whedon writing crap, i had a sense that Marvel was keeping the X-titles in hibernation and focusing more on Iron Man and the Avengers due to their live action movies being huge.

[@PeterParker-ff7ub]

The new stories sound like they make characters completely different people.

[@djchrisg1124yt]

Lol the “ 12 idiots “ on twitter 😂😂😂

[@ChrisSalinas-v5k]

My shop told me that am the only one that has order any X-Men books in the pass 3 months.and those are cover buy for the new runs.

[@ascorvinus]

Can the industry survive long enough for the stink of the Krakoan era to fade, so that X-men can go back to attracting talent and making decent sales?

[@milestrombley1466]

The only good X-Men we got so far is X-Men 97.

[@guardiansoulblade2673]

And they fired the writer, wasn't he gay too?

[@Slitheringpeanut]

And it's not really all that good. The amount of Magneto dick riding it does makes my wonder how the hell the writers are still walking straight.

[@brianerickson6775]

@@guardiansoulblade2673 yes. he was.

[@EvandroACruz]

X-Men 97 is better than anything that was published in the latest 20 years or more.

[@Skywalker3248]

I don't even think that's all that good. Too many storylines speed-run through, things popping up to be forgotten the next episode, consequences largely forgotten. Inferno storyline done in one episode (why is Maddie even called the Goblin Queen there?), mutant massacre folded into the fall of Genosha (Hellfire gala *faceplalm*), Fatal Attractions shoved into Operation: Zero Tolerance, so you get little bits of both but no proper adaption to either (finale felt like a mess of parts of two different finales awkwardly put together). Outside remaining Apocalypse storylines (origin, Red & Slim, 12 mutants, Gambit (& Logan?) Horseman of Death and Onslaught what left to adapt given the original 90's series adapted most things from the 70s-mid 90s? Maddie was brought in only to get rid of her again when inconvenient (and most people didn't even notice when it happened). The comics weren't better with her character, but given I was praising them for handling her character better before Ep 5, yeah it was still bad, then she's just forgotten Jean taking her place. They should just have made Jean Nathan's mother. The whole soap opera with Scott & Maddie's psychic affair and Jean kissing Logan is drawn out of Grant Morrison's run just to have them, there's no follow up or consequences. Rogue would have killed Trask, then betrays the X-Men, siding with Magento who had just murdered probably millions of innocent people and was going to see everyone else human and mutant die. But then it's all okay, she's back on the X-Men side with nothing said, I thought we must have missed at least a scene. And Magento himself, kills millions, was going to genocide the Earth, rips out Wolverine's skeleton, but then has a last minute change of heart and all's good again? Rogue's character was largely assassinated (due to Demayo's love of Magento, and Age of Apocalypse and their thing there), Logan's not much better (rendered an extra, despite being one of the main cast of the series they're supposed to be continuing), Morph just there for cameos (lifedeath, Storm losing her powers terribly adapted), Storm and Jean suddenly like sisters (yes in the comics, but in the series she was closer to Rogue and Remy). They have the scene where Kurt is attacking Prime Sentinels with swords alongside Logan but where the last episode confirmed Trask was still in there (so their not mindless machine zombies), and he doesn't know they can repair themselves. But he's stabbing them through the heart and cutting off limbs. So for all he knew on the first few strikes he was potentially killing people. Kurt, potentially killing people (and remember he's a priest in this). Is the scene cool? Yes. Does it ignore Kurt's moral core and character? Absolutely. Stuff was put in like key-jangling to say "look, this scene was in the comics!" but so much is throwaway. The finale is where it came off the rails for me and my hype glasses fell off. The series has no real pacing at all, some blink and you'll miss it, others drawn out. Things crop up, then vanish, allot of stuff just there because it references a comic but there are either no follow up or consequences and/or mediocrely to badly adapts storylines (Lifedeath, Mutant Massacre, Inferno, Operation: Zero Tolerance and absolutely Fatal Attractions). So some characters came out good (Cyke and Jean), others it harms (Logan, Kurt in different ways), and Rogue's character is assassinated because of Demayo's Magneto fanboyism. And that lead to perhaps the worst bit. Allot of people are coming off this saying Magneto is right. The guy who must have killed millions with his EMP, and was going to continue to genocide the whole world. That's a clear message in this. An X-Men show that does that has failed as an X-Men show. I say all this as someone fully hyped by the season up till Ep 5. Is there some good stuff? Sure. But the show has major flaws and the hype around it reminds me of the Mandolorian. Allot of people getting caught up in the hype for an overall average to just above average show. Could it turn many of these issues around next season? Maybe, but I'm not holding my breath (and there are things like the Magento is right message that make me feel like Krakoa lite is in it). Is it better than almost anything in the comics currently? Yeah, but that's not a high bar. For me the show needs to address a lot of issues in it.

[@Bav92]

Ha! I swear I came up with orgy island in a rant comment years ago 😂😂. Regardless of who said it first I’m so glad I’m not the only one who sees it this way.

[@bZman]

The fact that they had NIGHTCRAWLER of all people create the mutant religion when he is and always has been an INCREDIBLY DEVOUT CATHOLIC is fuckin insulting

[@Bav92]

@@bZmanI agree. I noticed that too.

[@bZman]

@@Bav92 I hate how marvel hates the xmen. They threw them away cuz Fox owned them, bought Fox, then decided to make them into gay orgy island and destroyed EVERY characters personality. Nightcrawler lost his religion, Xavier welcomed all mutants and forgave their crimes, Wolverine was now best buds with Cyclops and waaaaaaaaaaaaaay too friendly with him and Jean. Cyke and Jean were perfectly happy and Emma gave no shits about her previous relationship with Cyke. The Moira BS was a slap in the face to anyone who loved Claremonts Moira. The only way out is Xavier is evil and tampered with EVERYONES minds before reincarnating them on krakoa.

[@spinningtornado4543]

​@@bZman Nightcrawler creating a mutant religion was the tip of the iceberg of all the stupid out of character things he did during Krakoa... Which can all be traced back to HoX/PoX when he created a law about mass reproduction in the spur of a brainless moment, as he used a randomly picked Bible quote for it and the law was as an answer to Mystique taunting him to do something in the mutant government he was hired at. That law was made on an island with no hospital and where all mutant villains that ever graced X-Men's pages roamed freely amongst the civilians, many of which have mindcontrol powers like Empath. Nightcrawler made that law knowing fully well who was on the island, which included Azazel.

[@bZman]

@@spinningtornado4543 AMEN

[@raiderbear1]

Awesome work mate

[@drizzo4669]

Marvel stopped producing X-Men comics (at one point) and started pushing Inhumans, because Sony had the movie rights and Disney didn't want to give them any new material or promotion to profit off of. Once they got the rights back, that all reversed.

[@ChrisSalinas-v5k]

There only some run of X-Men I still reread. Exiles original. Petter David x factor and X-Men from the 90s.

[@hassanmcmillian]

Now that Marvel lost money with their Franchise X-Men have been a staple for most of my life as soon as Jonathan Hickman left those books turned to shit I’ll take a look at the new titles but if they suck I’ll obviously nope my way out of this bullshit good video Wes I appreciate you brother

[@Julius.Council3]

Never do I ever wanna hear Wolverine being the meat in a sandwich ever again.

[@KainGerc]

X-Men 97 proved that there is interest in good X-Men stories. not that the show didn't have issues, but the stories it told mainly focused on the things that fans wanted from the franchise.

[@EvandroACruz]

Yes we wanna see the X-Men like superheroes again. But just a reboot can fix the things now.

[@JBirdInfo]

Tbh, i wish they bring back the inhumans, the only inhuman media i watch now is future avengers

[@charlesharrison1907]

I would have reboot X-men start it from 2011. Anything from 2014 would be memory clean, I care about making money and all the characters are going to be factory reset.

[@arcanask]

In the comments in a previous video of yours someone brought up a very good point. Moira's mutant power is resurrection or whatever, right? All they need to do to return to a better timeline is kill Moira. I'm beginning to think that was Jonathan Hickman's reset button for all the shit X-Men did on Krakoa. I'm sure many would think that's a copout, but it's actually somewhat clever as the X-Men are known to travel down these bad timelines again and again. Only to revert back albeit with some minor changes here and there to the "last known good".

[@spinningtornado4543]

The finale prevents them from killing any Moira again because there's none of the clones left and she is in another dimension that won't make her reset the timeline if killed.

[@arcanask]

@@spinningtornado4543 Yeah? Damn. I wonder at what point the writing pool went off the rails that Hickman had set, when he decided to peace out and leave them to their trainwreck.

[@EvandroACruz]

This make me sick. These jerks wasted the last chance to reset the timeline and erase Krakoa from 616 for good. Damn you Marvel.

[@Superhead_collectables]

The Moira thing was stupid anyway. If all of reality resets when you die, you’re not a mutant, you’re a god.

[@arcanask]

@@Superhead_collectables At the very least there was likely a plan for it beyond what the legion of doofuses did with it. It's possible that loophole could have been resolved much better in the original plan. maybe it wouldn't have, but I do believe it still would have been better than what they did give us.

[@locusmortis]

"The krakoan era was a breath of fresh air...".....which turned into smog and acid rain....

[@warrensloan3467]

I’ve never understood why anyone thought this was going to work in the first place.

[@Moultdog]

The only thing that's going to save Marvel and DC are hard resets that completely undo most of what's come out of the last 10 years. Take it back to basics, where the characters are their iconic selves with adventurous stories and good artwork. Cut back on the DEI plots and Slice of Life word vomit story lines with terrible self inserts. How about they do something under a different imprint, like with the Ultimate Universe, where they keep their stories and characters go from straight to gay in an eye blink and see how that works versus the more traditional comic book stories for the mainstream and see how the sales work for each.

[@Barada73]

I started reading X-Men in 1987 and, for me, the "last known good" was back when Chris Claremont was writing Uncanny X-Men and Louise Simonson was writing X-Factor. However, I don't think the franchise can be salvaged by going back to those days. Most likely the X-Men will just be forever ruined. Because the characters today might have the same names, the same powerset, and the same general appearance; but they are completely unrecognizable to me.

[@spinningtornado4543]

Some characters got their entire powerset retconned into something else.

[@EvandroACruz]

All they are killers now.

[@stevehnatko1050]

With the exception of a few things here and there like Remender's stuff and HoX/PoX, 2nd Coming was probably the last time X-Men was mostly good to great across the whole line. They don't have the talent to pull anything like this off.

[@EvandroACruz]

Astonishing X-Men was the last true good X-Men comic.

[@Coach-sn8um]

It's very appropriate that in 2024 we Make the X-Men Great Again!! How ya like those overtones 😂

[@VALonYouTube]

Testicular fortitude. 😂 Love it.

[@havokan45]

but wasnt it really Emima , Scott , Jean then Cyclops , Marvel Girl , Wolverine . Scott got to have Emma on the side so Jean got Logan on the side . to me it seem the X Men writers where trying to make Jean and Scott love a joke in the Krakoa era . it seems they X Men writers are always messing with Summers family happiness . im am a big Havok fan i think he should be with Polaris i don't mind him with Madelyne Pryor he is going to join the new X Factor book what they do with Madelyne now i do like her better then Jean

[@arturoalvarezkawai6773]

Honestly, I stepped down from the X-wagon long before the Krakoa storyline started. I sincerely believe the Lobdell-Nicieza period is overrated, except maybe for the "Age of Apocalypse" storyline. But the whole "a world that fears and hates them" motto over and over again, and then again ... well, I just got bored. Anyway, I tried the Morrison period and didn't like it. Many rave about it even to this day, but it wasn't for me. Whedon's time with the book was a high point in my opinion. But then came X-MEN GOLD and Wood's X-MEN. Man, what a bummer! Horrible, horrible books. And don't take me wrong. I had high hopes for both, but not even Kitty Pryde leading the team in the former and the Dodson's covers in the latter could save those trainwrecks. To date, I don't even understand what the stories were about!

[@sardomarcrowe5723]

They MUST reset with an explanation that 1) it never happened - like time travel, and 2) it was mind control OR 3) just openly declate it trash and go back and pick up the storyline BEFORE the fanfic retconned it. It is now TOXIC. I will NEVER buy X-Men again without a complete public dumpster fire, firings, denouncements, apologies, and literally go back and pick up at a specific issue including numbering.

[@Seedmember]

The best news for the X-Men and mostly Cyclops and Wolverine, is that Marvel vs Capcom 2 will be released on PCs after 22 years from its original release

[@lotsalube]

Nostalga IS working-chis clareremont is doing 2 wolverine mini-series set in his era & it's fot me collecting it. The last x-series i collected was X-men Legends, which was a shame that it ended.

[@egonnn244]

The mere idea that Logan (or any sane dude with an ounce of self-respect) would go for this type of "arrangement" is ludicrous. But the comic book media "journalists" are ridiculous too, so I guess the idea fits in their heads like home. The Orgy Island may be gone, but I'm afraid the stink of it will follow X-Men for a very long time. If not forever.

[@Awakeandalive1]

I remember the X-books in the '90s. On average they had good stories & good art -- sometimes amazing, sometimes meh, but on average both were good. It feels like now we have awful art & awful stories.

[@ellesse3862]

Good luck to them, it won't be easy getting rid of the stink or getting back a lot of the fans driven away over the years.

[@EvandroACruz]

The old fans are done with X-Men and Marvel at this point.

[@mikefleming5247]

I liked X-Men better when it was BDSM under Claremont.

[@jimgray9169]

If we're talking nostala and were talking about going back for the X-men if you wanna go back how about when it all began back to its hay day when they first came out all the way back in 1963 when they were simple, consertive easy to understand limited members less is more you know the old saying everything old is new again Power Rangers keeps changing their members, but they always keep it simple amd if were talking about gay I believe Jean Grey put that thought in Bobby Drake's head she made him believe he's gay. This is why I'll always love the classics.

[@gilbertgutierrez5560]

Marvel should have know that changes all the characters backgrounds by making them gay or bisexuality or only made fan angrm

[@Jaymalkin980]

The Claremont run and some select other bits are enough x-men to enjoy. Fan who aren't just obsessed with race and gender can say no thx and stop buying even if is bittersweet

[@jaylambic1627]

Have to disagree on one thing: the '90s X-Men may have been hugely successful sales-wise, but that was mostly on the back of everything developed during the Claremont era, previously.

[@glarepherson]

They realy released a jubile comic with her fighting vampires and bigots..who the f^%%$ wants this garbage...she's a side kick stop trying to make her a main charecter..she became a mom..let her go be a mom ..she's the comic equivalent of " fetch" ...stop trying to make it happen ...if I wrote xmen..I'd have the krakoa age morias 9th life..and it ended..and her as a child would be her part of the existing timeline we all followed all along...she meets charles..helps him make the school..helps with new mutants..deadly Genesis....muria island saga..the legacy virus..etc..all we saw all these years was actually the 10th life..that way both continuties happened ...like age of apocalypse was a diffrent time line..morias 9th line was kraoka ..it failed ..so now we have the history we've always known..and her powerless .because she lost them in life 9..fall of x ..

[@feliciasteward777]

This is exactly why I don't read modern comic books marvel is hiring people that don't know anything about these characters or even care about their history All they have hired now is a bunch of activists who want to push their woke BS down people's throats That's why I only read the older stuff over this trash that marvel and DC is putting out now marvel and DC can share learn a lot from they're older comics and what drew people into reading their comics in the first place both companies used to be all about character development and storytelling now it's about pushing a bunch of identity politics and woke agendas to please a bunch of weirdos they need to fire these activists that they have writing for these comics and hire people that know what the hell they're for these comics and hire people that have respect for these characters and their history.

[@Jonderlei]

I know the stuff is necessary for stories and all sometimes but fuck I usually would be annoyed by any romantic relationships in this stuff so the last thing we need is tons of gay romance when even alot of the straight ones would annoy me. Any time Ive watched deadpool 2 after the first time I usually skip the first third or so of the movie cause I just cant care

[@loudtaste1046]

Just rebooted it dc style

[@jbbrolic]

Marvel are doing the exact opposite of what you claim.. Fall of rise of house of powers of X and the announced writers make it clear From the Ashes is Krakoan era without the island

[@davidgantenbein9362]

I don’t think that’s the full picture. Tom Breevort seems to throw everything we ever had as X-Men era at a wall to see what sticks. It’s kind of a „best of everything“ buffet in terms of ideas of the past. But obviously they don’t suddenly have new and talented writers. The highest profile writer they got to join them is Gail Simone. So the writers and what they value, will be the same as the Krakoan era, so it will not feel really different. As such, it will be pretty much an extension of the Krakoan era. But I think it’s fair to say that Tom Breevort tries to get away from the Krakoan era, he just doesn’t know how, because he may lack the means to pull in the writers this would require. X-Men may have lost a big chance of a revival, when Jordan White broke Hickman‘s X-Men run. That seemed to have been what broke the camel’s back and there is no return to form on the horizon as Marvel seemingly can’t find a top writer to right the ship anymore.

[@EvandroACruz]

@@davidgantenbein9362 There's no hope to the franchise while Krakoa was part of the canon. All the X-Men were tainted beyond any repair in Krakoa Era.

[@davidgantenbein9362]

@@EvandroACruz That may be and I myself left X-Men before, the discussion point though was if they just do Krakoan era 2.0 here. Personally I think it’s possible to get readers that don’t care too much about canon, if the books are good. I stopped reading Marvel due to the canon as I care here, but I read some DC as I don’t care at all for DC canon (it got crisis-ed away so many times, what is even DC canon today? I don’t know and I will not invest time to find out).

[@chrisharrold2292]

Retcon for the win!

[@SlashTheWeasel]

Will Marvel learn?

[@wraithx7]

I said it before and I'll say it again, the X-Men went off the rails 23 years ago under the Quesada/Jemas regime. The first mistake Marvel made was letting Morrison increase the mutant population (which missed the whole point of mutants being rare), having the X-Men's school and their secret identities being revealed to the world, cat Beast, and getting rid of their traditional looking superhero costumes and replacing them with those awful looking movie inspired leather costumes. The second mistake Marvel made was telling Wolverine's origin (which sucked IMO). Things got even worse after Morrison left. Wanda and Pietro being retcon into not being mutants and then being revealed not to be Magneto's children, Deadly Genesis, X-Force kill squad, Wolverine being a father, the introduction of X-23, retconning straight characters into being LGBTQ+ (Iceman,Rictor,Psyclocke,and several other characters), killing off/turning evil/maiming/depowering the few ORIGINAL POC heroic mutant characters they had, over powering characters (Wolverine and Storm), hiring Chuck Austin to write the X-Men, the origin of Longshot written by PAD, aging teenager characters up and making them parents, allowing Hudlin to have Storm get married to Black Panther and revealing that she was of royal Kenyan blood, and Hickman's (and latter writers) Krakoan storyline (which essentially turned the X-Men and mutants in general into the Inhumans) are several things that have ruined the X-Men and need to be retconned and made non cannon and never mentioned again.

[@Superhead_collectables]

I 100% agree with everything you said here.

[@jbbrolic]

I consider Morrison among the comic writing greats but with a cut off of 2000 as where he jumped jumped the shark (with a few exceptions.) His X-Men and Batman runs were both incredibly destructive to the characters.

[@lloydlandrum3040]

to be fair x-23 was first a original character for a cartoon and was such a fan fav they decided to bring her to the comics as far as I am aware

[@spinningtornado4543]

​@@lloydlandrum3040 That is true.

[@wraithx7]

@@lloydlandrum3040 yeah, I know. However, she is a symptom of one of the problems with current Marvel comics, which is the creation of countless derivative knockoff characters. The ONLY version of X-23 that I liked was the Age of Apocalypse version of the character from that AOP WEAPON X one shot written by Larry Hama where that version of X-23 was the daughter of Wolverine and Mariko. IMO, X-23 is a character that works best and should only exist in either an alternate present day timeline (like AOA) or in an alternate future timeline. Other then that, Marvel needs to stop with these derivative characters and stop introducing younger derivative versions of their most recognizable and popular characters set in the present day continuity.

[@tmmle7]

Kind of reminds me of Superman’s New krypton storyline. Group of self perceived superior people lording over people. Villains on both sides trying to mess with the other.

[@Warraci]

Whenever they go gay or black, the usual suspects are engaged, and the mindless NPC drones demand that they remain so forever.

[@Bamfism]

SPOT-ON ..,💯

[@deviousj5868]

When Jonathan Hickman hopped off, so did I. When HoxPox ended, I got my final volume and walked away. I'm so glad i did. Marvel took a dump on Hickman's setup and work. I disagree that the entire Krakoa era was a failure, not when Jonathan Hickman did such great work. When he left it went downhill.

[@kaspercole7]

Hey Wes. I know you have to report the bad comic book news with the good comic book news. But why are all of these videos recently so negative? Why can't we talk about positive, hopeful stuff like the amazing Gi Joe A Real American Hero kickstarter campaign that is going on right now? You can't say this is not newsworthy. The campaign now holds the record for most money made in 1 day for a graphic novel or comic book compendium. As we speak, they have already made over $2 million dollars with this campaign. But let's not just focus on the money they are making. The attention this Joe compendium is getting will definitely spark some more awesome new GI Joe content from Image and Skybound. And hopefully, the publisher can come out with the rest of Larry Hama's GI Joe: ARAH run when it was it different publishers prior to the relaunch with issue 301. Let's also talk about how much Image is killing it of late. Between the Energon Universe, Ghost Machine properties, the relaunch of GI Joe: ARAH, some stellar Tony Fleecs series, and the staying power of the Spawn Universe books, Image is presently in a very good place.

[@SpikeValentine]

The last good X-Men is easy: Second Coming/Uncanny X-Force vol. 1.

[@EvandroACruz]

No, was Astonishing X-Men.

[@SpikeValentine]

@@EvandroACruz, it wasn't.

[@EvandroACruz]

@@SpikeValentine The Messiah Trilogy sucked. This Era turned Cyclpos in a extremist. I hated.

[@SpikeValentine]

@@EvandroACruz, he wasn't an extremist, brainiac. 🤣🤣🤣

[@AL-ws5yi]

Honestly, I’ve read better fan fiction than whatever’s going on in these Xmen comics.