ContraRant: or "What Does BreadTube Even Do?"

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00:00 Intro
00:35 Delays and Workload
08:05 BreadTubers: Arch-Capitalists
13:14 What Do They Do?
19:55 Sour Grapes
24:48 Outro

[@QuatMan]

THANK U for making these. SO sick of folks acting like CP is some sort of intellectual powerhouse!

[@Vertaeufelt]

I have no idea what could cause a long time alcoholic and opium addict to miss deadlines.

[@KC_Streams]

My working theory is it might be the opium

[@stopthephilosophicalzombie9017]

I was witness to the alcoholism but I didn't know about opiates. Where did you hear that?

[@Vertaeufelt]

@@stopthephilosophicalzombie9017 Contra posted it on Instagram, you can probably still find it. One of many drugs Contra is a fan of, whilst earning $90k+ per month. Must be long rendering times.

[@stopthephilosophicalzombie9017]

@@Vertaeufelt Like he was smoking an opium pipe on Instagram? Well given his ridiculous income/popularity, it would stand to reason that the "rockstar" notoriety would lead to drugs if he already had substance abuse tendencies. Never mind the creeping guilt about propagandizing the trans cult to vulnerable teens.

[@stopthephilosophicalzombie9017]

@@KC_Streams Weirdly many artists and musicians have had their most productive periods whilst addicted to heroin, so that theory might not hold water. Perhaps the equation is different when you aren't an artist as much as a creative grifter like Contrapoints.

[@katieandnick4113]

Contrapoints is a narcissist?!? I’m shocked!

[@billmartins5545]

It's hard to be self motivated to put 40h a week into things if you don't have external deadlines. I can see how Contra's videos are more than 35h of work: it takes a while to explore an idea on your head, write around it, write a script, think about the characters and concepts, the sets, gather all the supplies and build the sets/costumes. Then you need to record and edit. I'm arty/crafty and I also have an advanced degree and a lot of experience in academic (natural sciences) writing so I have related experience and knowledge of the work involved. HOWEVER: does it take 4 months of full-time work to make 1 Contra video, especially when other people are involved? I don't think so.

[@ggreen5943]

Nothing wrong with doing nothing! That's my dream and I'm not ashamed to say it. It's just a shame these people get the accolades and get paid so much for doing F all 95 percent of the time or more.

[@KaiDecadence]

But don't you think that would get boring in the long run? Waking up every day and doing nothing except eating sleeping, and maybe watching tv/netflix?

[@ggreen5943]

@@KaiDecadence Well I consider 'nothing' as in nothing profitable. So I paint in my free time, but I don't like selling my work. Think of all the things! Walking, rock climbing, swimming, exploring, camping, the nothingness is endless!

[@alexwright4930]

@@KaiDecadence Not personally compared to how boring some jobs I've had are. I like freedom from coerced servitude. Never felt bored once between temp jobs or when I broke my leg in comparison to work ;) (Well stir crazy when I broke my leg.) In my present job I'm allowed to wear earphones doing data entry which helps now.

[@ggreen5943]

@@alexwright4930 Yeah, I think it depends what kind of jobs you have had. Mine have either been mind numbingly boring or extremely stressful. I have come to the conclusion I just despise work.

[@KaiDecadence]

@@alexwright4930 Fair enough~

[@deathtothesystem]

God, yes. I've thought about this so much. Anti capitalist? Really? When you're living off your KZbin channel with a team that you pay to do most of the work?? Really. Really? Really.

[@katieandnick4113]

And not even providing the people who support you with content? I can’t imagine having loads of Patreon subscribers and not feeling very obligated to make content for them.

[@zah936]

Hey! Don't make him produce more 'content'. Isn't it better for everyone if he never creates another video?

[@XKenny77]

At least $24k/month on Patreon to fund you and your mates to produce a video every month or two. Contra and Lindsay Ellis have really nailed this whole game. Nice work if you can get it.

[@matthewpowers3746]

And in the mean time tweet about your herculean, utterly exhausting efforts to produce the quarterly video: cash and sympathy too, almost have to respect the grift.

[@SidBlackheart]

I get that it takes a while to script longer videos and that they've been slowly running out of ideas for the past two years, but still, that doesn't explain the horrible upload schedules of most Breadtubers. But I'd definitely agree with the idea that their mode of production is thoroughly capitalist.

[@Dr3Mc3Ninja]

I thought that myself. An hour-long video, filled with fluff, satire, seemingly unrelated tangents, vague insinuations, strawmans, and pointless, flashy cut-aways that distract from what they are saying. The whole point that people pay them, is so that they can keep YT a full-time job, and pay researchers/editors etc, so that they can pump out videos faster. It's absurd.

[@lidahall5928]

"You can't rush art!". Hmm, perhaps you can if you have a workforce as large as I hear Contra has...

[@maryjanerx]

does it take that long to put on make up and then feminize the face on every frame? thats my guess why it takes so long. or most likely, they're busy fapping

[@Markunator]

She doesn’t have much of a workforce.

[@maryjanerx]

@@Markunator He doesn't?

[@Markunator]

@@maryjanerx *she

[@maryjanerx]

@@Markunator a man cannot become a woman anymore than a man can become a bat.

[@VeeraMirjam]

My understanding is that Contrapoints struggles from alcoholism and other addictions? I've also wondered about the amount of money ppl give Contrapoints, do they feel like it's a cause worth giving money to if Contra is not uploading.. Where does the money go then? I hope it doesn't go to fund Contras addictions.... Then the supporters are enablers and not supporters..

[@faealike4748]

It has been known to happen, if you’ve heard Taylor Nicole Dean’s story she lays a pretty good pattern of behaviour, money goes up, someone who enables comes along, the addiction ramps up, and the content gets worse and more sparse/suspect, the addiction ramps up because things aren’t going well... etc. I think the money ruined him, but I figured that after I saw what he did to his face.

[@edricawebb1578]

Interesting questions. I would add, Do we know who all of the patrons are? Who they are, the amount they give, and for what reasons? It seemed she ducked out, after the JKRowling video,... started doing low key interviews with media personalities and even Noam Chomsky. Now there seems to be a lot of pressure to do another theatrical video defending the trans ideology. If, like you say, she's struggling with addictions-- and is in thrall to the big money patrons-- it would be a perfect explanation as to why she keeps putting off making/releasing the video. She just doesn't want to do it... but big money patrons are demanding it. Never thought I'd be defending this person, but for all my flaws, I'm typically VERY observant, intuitive, and able to put the two together to figure out what's going on behind the scenes.

[@stephaniemoore8013]

Obviously the money contrapoints makes is used on drugs and alcohol(alcohol actually is a drug). Its the only money he makes as far as i knoe

[@faealike4748]

@Stephanie Pappas To be fair, it also goes on his other, more expensive, addictions, like having plastic surgery

[@stephaniemoore8013]

@@faealike4748 of course. Im just saying when you have an addiction(which I used to have) obviously you pay for your drugs with your only income.

[@happilyretired2868]

Hey, nice royal robe, King Critical! I hope I am the first one to catch that~

[@KC_Streams]

Nah somebody just beat you to it!

[@EllaAndrophobia]

I like it too♡♡♡

[@stopthephilosophicalzombie9017]

@King Critical Did you listen to that cringey Contrapoints interview with Chris Hayes? It was so full of weirdness Adam and Stich managed to make a multi-hour chat about it. Contrapoints is an object lesson in gameable opportunistic transexualism. I suspect that he didn't get the notion to 'transition' until he saw the correlation between viewcounts and eyeliner/wigs/false eyelashes. (Though he may be an autogynephile also, but either way it's creepy).

[@KC_Streams]

No I didn't see that. Sounds interesting though!

[@stopthephilosophicalzombie9017]

@@KC_Streams It's worth checking out, especially given your Contrapoints expertise. Hayes alternately insults and compliments Contrapoints through the whole thing. It's an interesting psychological document of the elite left.

[@faealike4748]

I legit thought Contra was gearing up to detrans, I figured all failings aside he is actually intelligent to figure out he’s been duped. Clearly wishful thinking on my behalf, I saw his twitter and the hope left me immediately.

[@Fuckyourselfgoogle]

I don't think he cares about getting 'duped' because he doesn't actually believe he is trans. He's just a huge narcissist and figured out he can get even more attention like this

[@faealike4748]

@Fuckyourselfgoogle We can only really speculate on the internal workings of his mind. But to me Contra reads like an Aspie sex-obsessed guy who fell into the trans pit, I’ve watched him for a long time and the narc traits and tactics seem to have come after the transition rather than prior. I’d wager some money that his relationship with fellow man woman Therein is where he learned a lot of that. Meanwhile Therein and other transtube stars like Robert “Blaire” White and Ollie “Abigail” Thorn I’ll happily bring down the hammer of narcissism upon.

[@faealike4748]

@Fuckyourselfgoogle Side note, I also think he actually has too big a humiliation kink to be a genuine narc.

[@KaiDecadence]

Even if he desisted the trans lie, I don't think he'd admit it, at least not for a good long while lol.

[@faealike4748]

@Kai Decadence Detransition is definitely like swallowing a bullet, even if it happened I don’t think he’d ever go public, just take the grift money and run

[@joandarc4643]

also lmao this video kicked me out of slump - i'm writing notes/proposals for my next project and promise to spend tomorrow applying for admin jobs ha

[@KC_Streams]

That's good. Although applying for jobs is hell because there's not always a clear corollary between putting in effort and actually achieving results. Sometimes it does just feel like throwing time and effort down a hole.

[@nanyabusinessss]

His AGP Probably has him distracted and he's using the videos to look at himself.

[@gregutz4284]

"Thats just how you grow in the game" King Hustle Critical

[@seto749]

Perhaps some people emulate Mr Wilde, who once claimed to have required a whole morning to insert a comma and the afternoon to remove it.

[@joandarc4643]

See how Tom Scott is uploading on a weekly basis?! his videos are shorter but the actual work you can see he does! Even random costume maker/sewing people I watch upload weekly/fortnightly, and the videos have so much substance! BUT HEY - I challenge you to make a contra/PhilTub style video at some point, it would be amazing hahaha

[@catferatu9736]

Only as a parody I hope, I hate these overdramatic spectacular videos without any substance 😆 would be hilarious to see that

[@HorseyWithNoNamey]

King Critical with some useless over the top props and drag queen make up that have nothing to do with the subject. That would be funny.

[@jstevinik3261]

1. You are mostly right on the first part. Philosophy Tube uploads once a month and each of her videos are usually half as a ContrPoints video, so Contra is taking longer than two months to produce a video (usually). BadEmpanada agree with this: kzbin.info/www/bejne/a4ukiWtnq7F8bpI However, ContraPoints does script her work, which would take time, given that her videos are usually 30-60+ minutes. That and rehearsal to memorize parts of the script so that there is no need to edit every 10 seconds. Costumes do take awhile especially given how elaborate they and not to mention make up, which... takes... a while. Not to mention that directing crew members require constant communication, in which I am not surprised Contra would be inefficient since he never had any filmmaking background prior to KZbinr. It could be possible that she has an issue with mental health is causing her to works inefficiently. On the sleep deprivation, I would say that is incredible inefficiently, such as rendering after crunching work for 12+hours. At 7:06, as far I can tell based on that part, you would hardly script and do improv without need to direct crew members. 2. 8:39 Self-employment counts as a job, as far as bank accounts, landlords, and governments are concern. 9:30 I am not sure content creators you are referring to, but most small ones do not do KZbin as a full time thing (while some full have full time education or employment). As result, most smaller creators lack the time to research, outline (to structure arguments), script, record (with some rehearsal to reduce constant audio edition), decide visuals sources, and edit. You may have a point for larger creators since they could afford a teleprompter to record an on-camera performance in a couple days. 10:30 Most of the money comes from viewer donations (most notably Patreon) because Google ad sense is not as reliable as it used to (money per minute) while political content has been "deprioritized" in the KZbin algorithmic (such as limiting algorithmic reach of "borderline" content) and monetization policies (on controversial/sensitive subjects or keywords in Google automatic transcripts). No. Capitalism entails the extraction of surplus value form workers, which is their criticism if applicable. The scripting, acting, directing, and editing is done by these creators, so they are working (just not efficiently in the case of Contra). They do not exploit employees because crews belong a commissioned company (that wants to be paid their full worth to make profit, along with exploitation of their workers by their owners). If anything, Google Ad sense exploits the creators since KZbin's rendering services is less than 30%( of ad revenue) of the advertisement value of each video. Also, lack of effort put in content production is not applicable to the exploitation of workers in the case of content farms. Also, they vague and ambiguous at most in their criticism of capitalisms to the point they are more likely social democrats who are more concerned with healthcare policy than wage labor and commodity production. This applies to Contra and Hbomberbuy while Shuan advocates (for re-nationalization of railways though that is not enough to form a socialist economy) and PhilosophTube (criticism of the housing market). 3. 17:30 Large channels do have to maintain making content that gets high views because shifting to content that gets lows would decrease algorithmic advantages, putting channel longevity into question. This is why you will not see PhilosophyTube do less mainstream topics (such as the videos she started in 2013-2014). 19:42 Maybe you are projecting on how it takes to edit your content but for scripted KZbin videos, "Most professional editors will say about 1 to 1.5 hours per minute of edited video changinglanesrv.com/ufaqs/how-long-does-it-take-to-edit-a-video-how-much-work-is-running-a-youtube-channel/#:~:text=Editing%20is%20one%20of%20the,video%2C%20and%20that's%20about%20right. The amount of editing to polish a reaction that would be suitable for a live stream is nothing near to a scripted video where editing is fundamental feature of the entertainment value, especially for those that do voice-over (i.e. Shaun) where visual component needs more visual flare than a PowerPoint presentation. 22:05 I would also say the same with the likes of Tim Pool who reacts to article that he barely reads without background research and outline writing while the only editing is simply just selecting stream clips to upload. BadEmpanada goes into detail on how streams take less effort but high financial gains (due to live donations) compared to video essays. I already linked his video. Most of the effort of video essays is into their research, argumentized outlining, and word choice scraping, and entertaining visual components (for the voice over ones). Trying to construct sound argument (without rush) out of research that usually does not have the agenda to express persuasive arguments. People give Patreon to the likes of Contra because of a parasocial relationship where they fund her existence/life instead of just videos. This is because they think funding her existence is persuading against the alt-right. Overall, the criticism is applicable to ContraPoints, less so on the likes of HBomberguy and Shaun, but not for smaller creators with less than 100k subs. The reason for the large ones to get premiant is that they gain the algorithm with a few viral videos that counter broad topics associated with the alt-right (i.e. culture war subjects, to get as much as attention, even in the algorithms of right wingers). I look forward to see replies to my comment.

[@MIurbex]

shut up nerd

[@soph1e]

his

[@stopthephilosophicalzombie9017]

Re your point about how often Breadtubers "should" upload a video, I suspect that they have witnessed no decline in subscriptions by teasing new videos and delivering them more and more rarely. It's sort of a false scarcity tactic or intermittent reward conditioning or something. I'm sure they are acutely aware of how little work they actually have to produce to keep their rabid fans hooked. ShoeOnHead is another notoriously sparse uploader with millions of subs.

[@catferatu9736]

I have noticed this with a lot of KZbinrs that got bigger. For instance, Shane Dawson uploaded less and less often, before that he used to upload several times a week (and then he eventually got cancelled lol). They absolutely do it on purpose because the fame gets to their head and they become entitled and of course lazy

[@KC_Streams]

Yeah I mean in some sense it's definitely true that if they did upload more often they would get fewer views per upload. And it's also true that getting videos from everybody I'm subscribed to every couple of days would probably be too much. Honestly I'm a pretty big fan of what some film review channels do where they'll be months between big uploads, but then those uploads will often be 2, 3, 4 or even 5 hour long analyses of media.

[@stopthephilosophicalzombie9017]

@@KC_Streams Yeah I guess it really depends on what the content is. With Contrapoints there is so much style and so little substance it does feel like he's ripping off his followers/patrons.

[@cakeface8414]

Don’t forget philosophy tube is an “actress”. Can’t believe I’m defending him. 😂

[@cakeface8414]

And a professional victim

[@KaiDecadence]

Is he really though? lol

[@cakeface8414]

@@KaiDecadence identifies as an actress 😂 I guess he gets paid to play a part so technically, put definitely a very poor actor. Transitioning was clearly partly a career move for him.

[@faealike4748]

@Cake Face He identifies as an Actress 😂😂👏🏻 I love how terms like actress are “outdated gendered language” until a man wants to use them

[@cakeface8414]

@@faealike4748 EXACTLY!! Most female actors refer to themselves as actors now. It makes no sense for the profession to have a gendered word. But of course PT gets a nice little 🍆 feel every time he calls himself an actress 💁‍♀️

[@Jamie-bu9cq]

"how can you be such a transparent grifter" - I was thinking that then you said it. 😆

[@alexwright4930]

I presumed a lot of them get much or most of their income from Patreon these days? I remember film critic Chris Stuckmann being surprised at the amount of patrons he got when he joined after complaining about KZbin ad revenue. Lindsay Ellis - if she's considered a Bread Tuber - did write a novel too I guess, and did some literature videos with PBS.

[@vasilyfamilienko4318]

ContraPoints' Patreon is 13120 members with minimal payment of 2 pounds. This means that per month Contra gets at least 26 thousand pounds, it is if everyone is paying minimal. However, 10 pounds or more has "you will be in credits of video" - and there few hundred of people, so clearly not everyone is paying minimal, so Contra is getting more than 26 thousand pounds per month. UK average income is around 28-30 thousand pounds PER YEAR. And Contra is getting more than that every month. This means that in a year Contra get half a milion at the very minimal estimate. And it is not considering advertisement money from KZbin views, from partner program with youtube, from streaming, and so on. So Contra is millionaire, while doing nothing (I bet even script is written by someone else, so Contra only speaks it on camera, while everyone else doing all the job - like it stated in titres), and yet crying about "how hard I work" and about "I am marxist and with working class". Also, I bet that problems with mental health are from not doing anything - when you are lazy for weeks or months, it really hurts mental health.

[@vasilyfamilienko4318]

@@the.meandering and it is MINIMAL estimate. Most likely it is around twice as much, up to 60-70k per month (as there youtube views, advertisements, streaming, and many people not paying minimal).

[@vasilyfamilienko4318]

@@the.meandering Ah yeah, plus afaik Contra owns some business outside of youtube too. So some money would come from that too. Contra is just millionaire.

[@KaiDecadence]

This is one of the biggest eyebrow raising things that I've had with Contra and many of the other "Breadtube" people. Most of them rarely upload and the video production isn't even that good to warrant that it takes a month (or 3-4) to get done. I was another person who thought that Contra did all the video editing by himself until I noticed the production credits as well and that made me scratch my head even further. With all the money he's made (and continues to make), it's no wonder why he was able to really go deep with his alcohol consumption. I think that you're right, these people really must not be doing anything with how inactive they can be for months and when they drop their videos, it's really nothing special at all. This makes me think of a KZbinr whom I'm subscribed to who is a gaming review channel who goes by the name Nitro Rad. He started from the bottom working a job he didn't really like while making videos when he could for years and when he finally got to a point where he could quit his job and work on videos full-time, he's really been living up to that. He releases videos, at least 1-2 a month and the production is worth it because he does all the editing by himself and he's been doing that for about 2 years now. It's inspiring really. So that's why when I look at people like Contrapoints who become more or less grifters, it's pretty sad to see. With Contra , it's just mind-boggling what kinda lifestyle he must live because as you said, you'd think he'd be a streamer or something to keep himself occupied when not doing videos but he doesn't do that. I can't imagine living a life like that where I just don't do anything at all, that sounds like an incredibly boring and uneventful way to live...

[@globalist1990]

I find this perspective a bit weird to be honest. We don’t know what they do outside of youtube. Maybe they do whatever they’re into? If they’re making enough money, why would they keep a second job? Is this a puritanical Protestant work ethic thing, where you’ve always have to be working otherwise you’re wasting time?

[@Wandering.Homebody]

How do you know what they do or don't do? And would you care, even in the slightest?

[@hereforit2]

Is this a kimono? Looks awesome on you!

[@elise4359]

"It takes way longer than 2 hours to edit" okay but that isn't months worth though

[@domenicodiniro413]

Seriously she posted a insta pic saying a video would be out next week... Almost 3 weeks ago. No way would I ever pay for this . I enjoy her work .. but really

[@GretaZ-dd3lu]

Are we sure Contra's not a trust fund baby, and therefore, inherently lazy?

[@cakeface8414]

Yet to get in to the video, but I love your, is it dressing gown? Or to least what I can see of it.

[@jamesgeorge2299]

I think for Contra, everything is a dramatic production, even Contra's own state. Whatever truth is in there is well buried in self mythology and dramatic performativity. I imagine that postmodernist performance art, right down to the cloying teases for further empathy, is part of what a sizable proportion of the channel's Patrons are looking for.

[@matthewpowers3746]

This is probably a fairly accurate summary of the underlying dynamic for all concerned, Contra and his/her fans.

[@lovelifeanarchy]

You sound like me five years ago. I'll give you another five years till you're wanting to put these grifters up on a cross.

[@b1daly1]

Contrapoints arguments are terrible but I think you are vastly underestimating actual video production takes. Have you ever noticed the long list of credits at the end of even a short movie? Contra also writes actual scripts and tries to at least present novel discussion points.

[@doberchic]

GC male gets a sub from me...

[@somegenerichandle]

lol. yes, welcome! I've been following King azariah (sp? his former channel name) since before he switched from movie to gc stuff.

[@sebastiankruse1009]

I suppose you might have thought about that, but maybe you would want to do live reactions, streaming on youtube, just when the videos are released. That way you skip a lot of the editing and you can follow up on any video by making a video of your own that addresses a specific topic you feel necessary to prepare for. It means making a catalogue of arguments in video essay form that is distinct from the reactions, as your points are mostly made in response, but can't be referenced outside said reaction videos. This would also prevent the accumulation of a backlog, because any content you produce that is derivative would be produced immediately as soon as you decide to watch the video. Its also the point at which it has the highest relevance and can be combined with people asking you specific things about the video.

[@ALBUMOF2008]

Have you seen Owen Jones’ bunch’s weak response to the Laurel Hubbard situation? I can’t believe they’re able to believe their own bs… delusional…

[@KC_Streams]

Yeah I've been following that sort of silently honestly. I also am intensely apathetic towards the olympics. Too many sports for my liking. Needs to keep focused.

[@mandy3404]

This video is so rambling. You could have made your key points in 5 minutes, rather than half an hour. This is one thing contrapoints does well - every sentence counts and there isn't this repetition talking around the same point over and over again. Trying to be more sussinct could help you take your channel to the next level. The point you were making - that breadtubers have become a bunch of capitalists and are not working 40 hour weeks - was really valid!

[@Evangeline185]

While I appreciate that you don’t want to leave anybody out regarding recommendations for who to support on Patreon, I am always looking for suggestions for channels to subscribe to, so I’d love to know what GC channels you follow.

[@happilyretired2868]

Mary Jane, look for Karen Davis of You're Kiddin', Right? as well as The Mess We're In with Graham Linehan also de trans channels, The Honesty Project and Mack Wells and Sinead Watkins, recent post by Maya Kaye with Bob Withers. All on YT

[@Evangeline185]

@@happilyretired2868, thanks, I already follow Karen and TMWI, but I’ll check out the other two.

[@mandysymons2142]

@@Evangeline185 posy parker. Peak trans. The state media and have you watched any magdalane burns

[@KC_Streams]

Here is a list of every GC or GC-lite channel I'm subscribed to, in the order they appear in my KZbin sidebar: RubbleOfEmpires Angie Speaks mrmenno The Cancel Council (OK this is actually a channel I run with a friend, but we touch on gender issues) Ella Androphobia Radfem Black You're Kiddin', Right? Meghan Murphy Radical Responses Plebity Average Centrist GenderMapper Actual Feminism Rose of Dawn GNC Centric Peak Trans Grace Adetoro Yung Terf Constant Disappointment Miranda Yardley Mancheeze The Great Magdalen Berns Jenny Kiss Philosophy Lines Some of these channels are now basically abandoned so... that's unfortunate

[@KC_Streams]

Oooh hello that's some interesting formatting. I guess that's what happens when you copy and paste a load of text from a dropdown list

[@kickinitwithmydawg]

If Wynn only makes videos every 3 months, she/he should have the patreon set to pay out only when she uploads a video. I see no problem with that as long as her views still feel that the quality is good. If she is being paid monthly for producing nothing...yeah, I'd say he would lose paying subscribers. Unless they are idiots.

[@stephaniemoore8013]

Well, they are idiots. They believe men are women.

[@globalist1990]

People love to pay for the most absurd things

[@NotADood]

The Deprogrammer has some well produced content, but she doesn't upload very often. I've heard of feature length Hollywood movies that have been shot in 5-6 months.

[@billmartins5545]

Have they also been developed, written, planned, scheduled within those months?

[@matthewpowers3746]

I love the super polite, understated, quintessentially British way of calling out these content creators for their utter hypocrisy.

[@cassandrasbox1241]

1:25 This is one reason I don't monetise Cassandra's Box. Of course the other is very few readers. Then again I have an actual job. XD

[@MoralGovernment]

I could see writing the script being hundreds of hours of research and writing.

[@jovialnobody]

Honestly, I wouldn't mind an infrequent upload schedule, one of my fav KZbinrs is Gaming Historian and he doesn't upload often but when he does, it's a thoroughly-researched , well-produced video. Contra's videos may be high in production value, but they're very low in quality when it comes to writing and arguments being presented. personally, I'd rather the latter than the former.

[@OZKitchen]

Correction, just repeats himself the whole time

[@TheSequentCalculus]

I generally like your videos, even those I disagree with, but I think this one is just bad. "Bread Tube" ranges from videos consisting of webcam recordings of unkempt people's unscripted rants to videos illustrated with still images to full-blown animations or tightly scripted acted scenes. You have experience near one end of that spectrum. Professional editors, for example, budget 1-2 hours of editing for every *minute* of video. That's just editing. A "Bread Tube"-video will take less time to edit, but how much less depends on the specific video and "Bread Tuber", but the claims you made about the effort that goes into "Bread Tube"-videos have no empirical basis. And I'm not talking about your brief foray into the economics of intangible goods as sufficiently equivalent to English mid-19th century capitalism, but purely about the labour that goes into video-making.

[@zooborg]

Commenting for the algorithm. Keep doing what you're doing, King!

[@pablofernandezortiz7460]

I’m a youtuber and in my videos I’m working hard to make them the best I can, and I don’t have any kind of financial support, but I always try to entertain my audience beyond just talking.

[@hitoshura2800]

Your profile pic 🤣 👌

[@cassandrasbox1241]

I would feel mega guilty if I pulled what these guys are - getting free money off people.

[@elise4359]

Your jacket is awesome

[@OZKitchen]

First 8 minutes is just repeating yourself

[@heysemberthkingdom-brunel5041]

If you want to look at a "talking head" YT channel with a film school background who does actual film school stuff (like drone shots and cuts and whatnot) and *has an actual day job* (namely playing American Football and having won the German championship more than once with his team... And the dude is still able to put out videos quite often without moaning about whatever, look no further than @nalf

[@maldarchives7995]

always thought the same thing.

[@ElDrHouse2010]

You could host debates one day lol. Just be moderator.

[@myfeelshurt]

it just takes him time to come up with all that bs when his head is empty of thought

[@joncavalier8875]

Mate nice kimono

[@erilaz7449]

Been saying this.

[@somegenerichandle]

The Deprogrammer puts a lot of time in editing. They are rather infrequent, but i appreciate the quality. I think in CP's case the costumes are a distraction from his non-logic. It may be of interest to you that there is a channel called Contrapoints Archive that started reuploading a ton of his old videos. The one on dysphoria i thought was interesting, Nick obsessing over his hair line and the like. Anyway that and the long-form video about him on beige frequency are enlightening. Another recommendation might be Karen on You're Kidding RIght?, she uploads daily and is a musician. She is a middle-aged black woman, who i am glad to hear the perspective of.

[@Sakushishii]

old vid but youre definitely right. he fools ppl bc ppl just dont know that its not that hard to make contrapoints' vids.

[@gaelledr2213]

Maybe he has bored himself into a non-clothes-changing coma? I mean the schtick does get old...

[@renny3816]

I’m Hetero, you are Hetero, everybody is Hetero! We are Heterotrophs as humans, while men are Heterogametic. “Hetero” isn’t just a word for “heterosexuality” or being “straight.”

[@pipersolanas3322]

CP is a grifter if I've seen one

[@salttrader2920]

clearly it takes a lot of effort to be that narcissistic

[@tenmanX]

*@King Critical* ... I can't stand most of Contrapoints' (at best) mediocre arguments, but this here video of yours is just pure oblivious cringe. Just when one thinks one's seen it all, one come across an "adult" on KZbin whining about someone else not releasing their work to his schedule; therefore, BreadTube sucks!? Contra's upload rate and her patreon income is a matter between her and her patreon supporters to work out. And since you call yourself some kind of Marxist (in this video's comment section), what kind of Marxist analysis begrudges a worker their market determined value? Possibly the non-dialectical materialist kind, like yours, that Contra disingenuously reduces the Marxist critical/revolutionary tradition to in her ridiculously simple-minded and dreary ENVY video. Contrapoints is not the only shark in the online identitarian "leftosphere" to play remora to, mate. GTFU!

[@mafertejeda9897]

Your channel name should be based king. Subscribed.

[@mafertejeda9897]

King based* wow I’m leaving my humiliation up for everyone to enjoy

[@zah936]

Gaming is not work.

[@KC_Streams]

I would rank it above some activities in terms of productivity in that at least it's in some way structured and does offer an authentic sense of achievement. But yes... even if I were to ever establish a gaming presence on KZbin (and I might... who knows. Maybe I could play through the Harry Potter games in honour of JK), I would consider it a leisure activity taking a break from my work.

[@clownworldhereticmyron1018]

In itself, no. But doing it to entertain others is. Or in some cases participating in competetive tournaments.

[@zah936]

@@clownworldhereticmyron1018 Yes.

[@sugaree71]

Contra’s videos were great before transition, before content became trans or trans-adjacent all the time. And, live commenting, mental health = being productive.

[@JasonQuackenbushonGoogle]

ok so i just started watching Wynne’s latest video, i couldnt get much further than the unintentionally ironic and deeply misogynistic assault on female celebrities who are famous for being pretty. I hope we get to see yr take on it before long.

[@jbeiler55]

F Lol, this is hilarious and I love it. I'm sorry you're so far down stream from those lazy bread-tubers that you're stuck making videos about them. Maybe try working harder and growing your channel? I love the back and forth of how different your channel is from theirs and how much production value they provide but you are basically doing the same thing because they have people that work for them.

[@mycterism]

LOL dude in a robe on his gaming rig whining that someone who takes a full theatrical approach to her videos takes too long to upload her videos so he can't ride her coattails into the algorithm

[@seb267]

Still trying to understand why you care at all about this? Your opinions about the value of someone’s content are entirely subjective, and clearly a lot of people disagree with you as demonstrated by their supporting her content and liking her videos. Why do you feel entitled to her content to respond to in the first place? And call her lazy for…taking longer than you want for her to post? This is just as stupid as saying Kanye West or Tame Impala or Banksy is lazy because they take years to come out with new albums or art installations. You have no idea how much time she spends researching, reflecting, writing, or editing her scripts, how much time it takes to film and do other things. Neither do I for that matter. “She just sits and talks in-front of a camera with higher production and costumes,” yeah, does that mean she’s compelled to put out content weekly basis as to not be lazy? Like what? People support her patreon because they like the content that she makes and the stuff she does, not because it gives them ownership over her time, or entitles them to regular and frequent uploads from her. Nobody is compelled to pay her for her content, she provides it for free to everyone on KZbin. Sorry more people don’t support you, since that’s really what this seems to be about, but maybe that’s because more people resonate with her ideas? Then you follow up by criticizing leftist influencers as being capitalists without meaningfully speaking about that at all? “They own their KZbin channels and hire staff to do work so they’re capitalists,” like bruh what? You aren’t even saying anything meaningful beyond “leftist creator hypocrite” and you call her lazy? We could have had an interesting discussion about intellectual property when it comes to KZbin and influencers and the worker within that context, but instead you make the most superficial observations and leave them to sit there without any meaningful examination. Is it because you’re afraid to go there? Because you’d have to critique capitalism as a whole? This is intellectually lazy content, you’re just whining about what you consider to be others’ undeserved success. Honestly your “intellectually superior” act isn’t convincing anyone who is actively thinking about what you’re saying. I’d suggest thinking more about things before you post about them. Might take you a bit longer to make videos though.

[@Wandering.Homebody]

What's your point? Is she adamantly claiming to work a standard work week? I can't imagine she does. Her patrons, surely, are free to unsubscribe at any point, if they start expecting more. And while she comes across as very smug and annoying to me, and I wouldn't watch any of her content unless it's being dissected on your channel, she certainly doesn't owe YOU any regular uploads. This is the most bizarre insinuation I ve ever heard you make, honestly.

[@youtoocat3953]

This is such a strange video. You really don't seem to have any insight into what it takes to achieve the production values displayed in a Contra Points video. And here you are, in a video with production values that are frankly in the toilet. And I'm not criticising how you do your videos - I listen to them like a podcast and that's handy when I'm on the move. You do you, keep prioritising the sense-making. But I *watch* a Contra Points video. I really enjoy watching them, even if I don't agree with the premis of the content. Does it take months to make these videos? I don't know. Maybe Contra has a really slow working progress. But your ignorance when summing up the creative aspects is really grating. As well as whatever source subject research is done, there's Lighting, Sound, Camera, Scripts, B-roll, Costumes, Props, Editing, Permissions, Insurance, Catering. If you have a crew, there's making sure everyone is a available the day you want. You don't say whether Contra employs people full time. Maybe they have day jobs, families, lives. The criticism of Contra being a capitalist: mate, I work in the arts and we're sick of people thinking it's ok not to pay us for our skills. I sincerely hope the Crew is getting paid. And the last I knew, Contra the evil capitalist isn't forcing cities to offer tax breaks to set up shop somewhere. It's practically a cottage industry. I'm sorry but in this video you seem to just be having a go at Contra for being Contra - when it was the development of their production values that got them noticed. No, it's not Hollywood, but most of their videos are an hour or more, and trust me, it can take a lot to create an hour of visually interesting telly. Criticising Contra as abusing the Patreons with a slow release schedule is ridiculous - no one is forced to contribute, why do you care? Any way, that's my reaction to your video, dealt with in the form of this irritable critique. But compliments on the kimono, it's very natty.

[@kam-lw4ez]

Valid criticism. However, do you really think it takes 3 to 4 months to create a single 1 hour video? With a bunch of people doing most of the work for you? Of course, no one is forcing people to pay for Contra's content but if Contra keeps saying "oh guys it takes so long to make this video" while actually not doing any work that is an obvious scam. As people have pointed out Contra is a millionaire and has substance abuse problems. This may be a deeper issue of supporters getting scammed and actually unknowingly enabling someone's addiction, do you not see this? I don't think the main point of KC's video was to criticize the upload schedule, it's more about the implications imho. Just my two cents

[@KaiDecadence]

@@kam-lw4ez This is what most really mean. It really doesn't take 3-5 months to make one video that happens to be an hour long. I mean sure, if the person had other commitments like an IRL job or was a caretaker for a relative or something like that then yeah, it would take a little to get a video done. Don't know if Contra is a caretaker but he doesn't have any other job besides KZbin so that's why it's kinda ludicrous and a bit of a scam.

[@oddbobproductions781]

Contrapoints’ mental health has been steadily declining since 2008. I would really enjoy a deep dive into Natalie’s 13+ years long presence on the internet. I think Contrapoints should just get off KZbin. And twitter. Entirely. It’s destroying her. She admits it yet she’s dependent on it. It amazes me how she’s still getting paypigs every month for literally ONE VIDEO A YEAR AT THIS POINT

[@LiliS319]

I personally prefer capitalism over socialism, I think private property cultivates ambition and prosperity, and even despite resulting in bigger disrepancies, it results in better quality of life for more (and most) people in practice. So I think money doesn't lie, if C only has to put on a show once in a while, that's C's subscribers' making. But for them to then preach socialism is hypocritical. Vaush is probably the worst offender of them all but they're all pretty barf.

[@KC_Streams]

My general opinion is that both capitalism and socialism can work depending on the surrounding policies. So while I tend to present myself as an unambiguous Marxist communist, I'm actually of the opinion that there's a wide range of economic systems that could be perfectly fine if they're intelligently managed.

[@JasonQuackenbushonGoogle]

i suspect that what you mean by private property is not the same thing that term means in the Marxist proof of capitalism’s unsustainable exploitation of nearly everyone on earth in order to subsidize the parasitic obscene wealth of the ruling class. which, if that’s right, means that you probably aren’t comparing apples and oranges and so might find a deeper examination of marxian economics surprisingly amenable to your values and preferences.

[@LiliS319]

@@JasonQuackenbushonGoogle I'm listening to Thomas Sowell's book titled "Basic Economics" right now. I really recommend it if you haven't read it, to at least use as perspective. You can find the audiobook version on youtube for free.

[@JasonQuackenbushonGoogle]

@@LiliS319 I’ve read a lot of Sowell. He’s very smart and very wrong about economics. Its really important for leftists to take Black conservatives seriously and understand their ideas about politics and society. Thinkers like Sowell, or my favorite George Sowell, have a valuable perspective that we should not dismiss out of hand just because they are so wrong about so much.

[@LiliS319]

@@JasonQuackenbushonGoogle Do you not agree with his inferences or is it more so that you believe they are incorrect? And is it something specific or just in general? How about even before that, do you hold that his interpretation of data is wrong, or maybe misleading, or incomplete in some way? Of course, I'd like to listen to him with a grain of salt, but because he makes so much sense to me I need to know what to watch out for 🙂 Is there maybe an economist who does a good job of explaining how he's wrong?

[@javierlisto4991]

I'm starting to think that you fancy her a little bit

[@KC_Streams]

Eh.. I don't object to the suggestion. But I think if there's some subconscious affinity for contra that motivates me then it's at least secondary to the more obvious reason that making response videos gets me clicks and contra is the most obvious target for me to respond to. Definitely I would do fewer responses to contrapoints if I didn't think it would increase my viewcount and subscriber growth. I think the big issue with the theory that I'm secretly attracted to contra is that I'm actually quite comfortable, when the topic is brought up, that I find a decent number of trans-identified males to be decently attractive. I have neither a fetishistic lust for TIMs, nor an intense aversion to the suggestion of finding them attractive. My video on superstraights touches on this.

[@javierlisto4991]

@@KC_Streams It just seems obsessive to me to do a whole video about the reasons why Contra does not release her work, like who cares

[@KaiDecadence]

@@javierlisto4991 He brought it up because Contra is one of the most prominent and lauded men in the Breadtube sphere. People act like he's above criticism and practically untouchable or so he thinks. King also talks about gender extremism and again, he's (Contra) one of the most prominent voices of that ideology so of course King will have a few things to say mentioning how myopic and shallow Contra's videos really are.

[@Alsyoutubeaccount]

You think you deserve the financial success of contrapoints? Lmao for doing what? She may be a horrible procrastinator and addict who clearly hasn’t been working hard for a long time, but she’s created FAR better content than anything you’ve done.

[@dougdimmadome4841]

he*

[@faealike4748]

For telling the truth, since I’ve rarely seen Nick doing that in HIS videos. It’s basically crowd funded pretty man flouncing at this point, even if it was very funny when he cried about being a “lesbian”.

[@somegenerichandle]

Well, you got the addict part right. I do see how King Critical's point was a bit brazen.

[@harrietpotter649]

This comes across as very sour grapes to be honest. Contrapoints is a very small fish in an enormous pond. Breadtube is tiny and basically irrelevant. If it annoys you how much money Natalie gets for the work she does, then for God's sake don't look into PewdiePie or Disney Funtoys Collector. I don't think you realize how much money is flowing through KZbin, and how little of it actually accumulates in or around BreadTube. These people are incredibly small fry, and clearly the only reason their success gnaws at you is because you see them as your natural peers. Edit: Also calling her out as a capitalist? Uhh, Contra's not even an anti-capitalist. I'm sorry that her success annoys you, but this is very clearly a you problem.

[@virginwrists4960]

If you were a ("cis") woman, with same */10 looks, you would already be big Feminism has still long way to go :(

[@katieandnick4113]

Are there any GC KZbin channels with over 50k subs?

[@graciebabyy]

You can't even call what contra does editing ... It's drag and cut ..

[@graciebabyy]

Hehe cross dressing pun

[@graciebabyy]

He has to space the videos out or you might catch on he only talks about one thing