Conversations: Enmeshment with Ken Adams

Ken Adams joins Tim Stein, Jeanne Vattuone, Dan Drake, and Wendy Conquest to discuss enmeshment.

[@AvocadoRoyalty]

I’m so grateful for this video because it has vindicated me that I am not crazy & it explains everything with regards to my husband’s behaviors & also explains why he’s never been a genuine partner to me, he’s a provider & because of his religious beliefs he’s committed in the sense of paper marriage but it’s not a marriage of commitment to my needs or shared desires that would make us a true married couple, his obligations have always been to his mother & certain family members, it’s like a cult honestly, his mother passing 2 years ago I had hoped he could become different but it’s never going to happen, me being the wife is already established as “the enemy” only his people are good, only his people’s feelings are valid, only his people’s opinions matter, he’s lived over 50 years in what I call a cult & he’s beyond brainwashed & in some sense it’s a form of Stockholm syndrome, recently I have truly given up any hope whatsoever that I can become that person who is his partner with that type of connection & commitment but I see that mommy is dead & he can’t snuggle up to her anymore & show to me that I am on the outside, his family doesn’t live near by (Thank God) so you might not believe me but he uses our dog to create the rejection, example instead of snuggling with me or wanting to do something with me he used to use his mother as the excuse that he felt bad to that his mommy’s feelings came first well now he’s using the dog as the excuse & I know it is hard to explain in words & it probably sounds stupid I mean I love our dog too but this is a way to make me feel I am never gonna be in that position in his life, even to the point a dog can trump my spot, but listening to these videos gives me so much peace of mind knowing that it is enmeshment & it’s real issue.

[@becsalad3449]

If you don't have children please leave

[@mimi42428]

Leave dear. It will never change. Please leave. Even if you have children leave. They don't need to see their father treat their family dog better than he treats their mother. My ex did this as well. He used everything he could to make me feel unloved and that he would never prioritise me. He began to do the same to our children. Our children were just tools he could use to appease his family of origin. Tools he could use to appear decent. While behind closed doors he abused us. He made me his enemy as well and would sometimes use our children to show me that he didn't value or and resoecr me. I totally understand what you mean about not being able to explain it. I couldn't either. I thought I was going mad. After all I should be happy when he was finally finally having our children attention. But that attention only came when he was angry at me for not giving him or any one of his cult members something they felt entitled to. He would then completely ignore me and lavish our children with attention to punish me. It was maddening. Please get out

[@wilblissful]

I feel all of this. It truly is nothing but a bucket of hurt.

[@Kittyququmber]

For years I called it a cult and almost tribal. There was a cultural/immigrant factor in my marriage. But that was just an excuse. And continues to be so. You summarized it well. And 3 sisters involved. He is the only son. Very difficult. Unfortunately, years later one looks back and realizes this was not what I signed up for. His loss. Separated for three months recently. Not my choice. Devastated but he was worse shape. A numb feeling. I don’t care. His problem. Both our daughters double Ivy League graduates. Successful careers and married. My psyche and soul has changed. I pride myself on on my tolerance (not to let the witch destroy me even if it meant major escalation with my husband). I pride myself the success of my daughters (light years of where I came from) and the stability I now have in retirement. Really his loss. Pity really. He tries but my heart has been truly broken. I honestly do not think the break is reparable. An affair would have been 100x easier to get over. Good times still show up. I still am nice to him. I just don’t care anymore. I just live for myself now. I have a very close girlfriend who has been a savior to me in my lowest times.

[@JC-ul1do]

The emeshed family is not always overtly fighting. The demands are not always overt as in “ come or else”. There is a covert version in which withholding love and acknowledgement is done unless person complies with system. The system ( whatever the dysfunction) perhaps demands that all “ parts” are present to fulfil their role. For example a scapegoat. The person in a more covert emeshed family will cease to exist to the other members unless they are part of the “ play” or family drama. If they do not show up, they are dead to others essentially. Other siblings might resent their freedom etc etc.

[@jp5419]

Exact dynamic in my spouse's family. Father completely ignores him. Mother pulls away her affection. And spouse turns into a lost abandoned child. Full of rage.

[@mimi42428]

Bingo. This was also the exact same thing in my ex husband's family of origin. And he was so scared of them all not approving of him or validating him that he was willing to abuse our children and I to get their approval and validation.

[@wilblissful]

I will say my spouse was the dancing monkey for the family. He was always there to entertain and spend money lavishly on terrible people. Going on vacations I and the kids werent welcome to. We just had to suck it up. He would say he was a doting father but that was all on his own mind. Myself or my kids were never on the radar. I think in truth, only one of my kids does not see this dynamic. They are adults now but really the sting is there still. I dont know why he ever bothered to be in a relationship outside the family since they are the only people in the world to him. Also what I noticed is his identity is that family. The place where theyre from, whats the prevailing attitudes among them, its his identity. I know for a fact that he hates his mother deep down, and boy does he let me know via abuse by proxy, if theh spend any time together. And also Im pretty sure theyre all sociopaths from the pits of hell. 😮‍💨 These people are the biggest regret in my life thus far. I dont know anything that will change it.

[@MissSarahGM]

You talked about the ambivalence in an enmeshed man, no wonder my ex boyfriend has relationship OCD, doubting the feelings and the relationship, with compulsions to look for reassurance, from the mom and family members, of course!! I was doomed in such an enmeshed toxic family system. He was disengaged with me when we could have been connected in the evening, while he was chatting on his family group chat, avoiding me or reacting to me as controlling! He is 39 yo, neglects his needs and undermined his feelings for me.

[@mimi42428]

Been there. It's a horrible way to live. They don't give themselves any chance to have a decent life

[@wilblissful]

Omg, the ignoring you and then acting like youre controlling. Also the smear campaign started by your own spouse against you and your kids!!! But all the while, everyone else was allowed to have a wife and family.. the real pronlem is they dont want a family outside of their Foo, it complicates stuff for them. But what kind of family is cheering him on, thinking hes so wonderful treating his created family like that??

[@Luxuryfoodexpert]

excellent. i found this very happy and have got and read both of kens books. very insightful and recommended to anyone thats looking for answers in this very common issue of enmeshment

[@Dyanlavieestbelle]

Learning about enmeshment has really changed the relationship with my partner. Although there is still much work to do, learning about this has made me more sympathetic and less resentful towards him. Very grateful for these conversations, thank you 🙏

[@grainneowens3035]

Interrupting the expert is very awkward..you don't need to speak. Listen

[@karenortega2046]

My life with a man for ten years. His mother would make backhanded comments to me planting seeds of doubt in me about my relationship with him. I believe her to be a narcissist after she went after a church minister over her distrust of him and their status , ling term members. She had to eat crow and was threatened with slander. In the very beginning his daughter 30 at the time, married and with kids took a disliking with me and was extremely jealous over dad and used shaming to control him. Nothing is or was ever said to correct the behavior from any family member and the enabling that was taking place within the family unit was eye-opening. He would go to his mom’s weekly for years for dinner and lunch knowing she said so much to me and never corrected her and made me sit their while she insinuated his brother and I were outside talking to long and something was going on. They both just put their heads down and said nothing. I moved out and saw them more like a cult his mother is 80plus he is 63. She and the daughter have control over his emotions. He never gave me a monthly or weekly date like his mother. I see his mother bread-crumbing and so he did the same with me. I am bewildered that after all his mother said he choked it up to just being a stupid comment and told me I needed to let it go.. each time he asked this of me while saying nothing to her. He said he had hope but then would slide backwards with a lie or something that would fracture, made excuses for himself. Furthermore the mere fact that his son backed his sister up even after being told what she was doing for 10 years seems like enmeshment. Is it?

[@karenortega2046]

Eye opening

[@philipgardiner2003]

Emotional obligation is a helluva concept. The last spiritual assignment for the parent is to take the loss. HA! Tell that to my f'ing mother. May she rest in peace. Family dinners---> Watch Yellowstone on Netflix. 😱

[@mollymcdonald4326]

Philip, sorry that was your experience. I have to say, I did laugh at your Yellowstone reference. Ain't family grand and complex? :/

[@philipgardiner2003]

@@mollymcdonald4326 Thanks Molly, that it is. I saw your video of Roger Waters singing "Mother" during the Pandemic... incredible!

[@mollymcdonald4326]

Oh, I'm so glad! Wasn't that a great rendition? Without music life wouldn't make sense.

[@jp5419]

She was a broken spirit. Wish her well and heal yourself. It's never too late and you're worth it 🙏❤️🔥😎

[@philipgardiner2003]

@@mollymcdonald4326 How are you doing Molly? 🙂

[@user-iq5xi7cn9k]

What are the “ punishments “ administered by parents ???

[@Candy_Mountain]

Geez. The woman who kept interrupting 🙄

[@pauladuncanadams1750]

There's nothing in that book for me. What about when SHE'S married to mom?