Corvette Dyno Day - LS6 Intake vs Dorman LS2 Intake

[@charliecadaver666]

Fyi for all... If you have someone dyno tune your car. Watch if they take baseline in sae then final #s in STD. If you change them no matter where you are or mods done... They read different. Its just a drop down box on the computer/laptop and you scroll thru couple settings. SAE reads lower than STD. Bad tuners that want to impress you will take baseline #s in SAE and final pull in STD to look like they found you more power. You've been warned!

[@ScrufsGarage]

Agreed, it's important to be aware of the difference between SAE and STD numbers; and to make sure the before/after numbers are in the same format. There are a lot of variables that can impact the exact hp numbers generated on a particular day (temperature, humidity, altitude, etc). SAE correction helps adjust the results to a standardize set of parameters, allowing dyno results to be a bit more comparable. Often STD numbers will be higher. We looked at the STD numbers from one of my dyno pulls, and I believe it was in the mid 420's, but honestly I didn't even write them down. The SAE numbers were what I wanted. And of course it's important to not get too hung up on dyno results; it's just a measuring tool and results can vary from one dyno to the next. What's important is how the car runs and performs.

[@charliecadaver666]

@@ScrufsGarage of course nature's variables. I would hope 99% people know that even if its their first rodeo. If they know what a dyno is to want their car dynoed or dyno tuned, they should know that. I have never had to explain heat to a customer being in the edge of the desert. But sae and std, only tuners generally know. Was the first gag I learned to tease customers with when I was showed on my buddy's dyno when I started working with him to do the GM tuning since he was a ford guy. However, that was back in 2013 and have since focused on lsx swaps and turned a ford guy straight lol. Less than 6 months in the shop, his notchback recieved a 5.3L heart since his ford block was too thin for 500hp. Ahh good times in Cali

[@aaronpeople101]

Very impressive, all that hard work paid off.

[@ScrufsGarage]

Yes it did! And it was definitely a lot of hard work. But the car is running great. The weather's been nice, so I've been driving it to work pretty regular lately.

[@mrallande105]

Awsome stuff man. Love ur vids. Big help to my engine build. Thank u for the amazing info and demonstrations in ur viddos

[@ScrufsGarage]

mrallande Thanks for watching and for the kind words. I’ve really enjoyed making and sharing the videos. Glad to hear they have been helpful to others!

[@lzeta28pep90]

Sick video bro. Getting my 02 my z28 dynoed this week. Did 385 on a slipping clutch and faulty sensors few months ago. Swapped to ls6 intake throttle combo fixed my clutch hydraulics hoping for at least 400 to the wheels

[@ScrufsGarage]

Awesome! Can't wait to hear how she does on the dyno!!

[@crw3673]

I love the comparison, but correct if I'm wrong. The factory ls6 intake has a 78mm opening compared to the dorman 90mm. I think it is obvious that the dorman will fair better than the ls6, once the rpms goes up! Which prove my point in the dyno. As the rpms goes up, specially pass 4k. The dorman fair's better. So is the dorman a better intake, because of the internal makeup? Or is it simple better because it has a bigger throttle opening?

[@ScrufsGarage]

Correct, one of the key benefits to the DLS2 intake is that it allows you to run the larger 90mm TB. The larger TB has the potential to flow more air... so long as the intake manifold can also flow the additional volume of air. So the TB/intake have to work as a system. If either is a restriction, it can negate the benefits of the other. To me, the more useful observation is that the DLS2 TB/intake has gains in the upper rpms, without losing power in the lower. Often intake manifold changes that produce top end gains, come at the cost of lower rpms as the torque curve moves upward in the rpm range. It would be interesting to see how this would have compared with the more expensive FAST intake. And it would have been interesting to see this test on a higher hp motor. My guess is that the gains would increase on a motor that could use the additional airflow.

[@michaelslack6891]

Thanks for your knowledge as always! I think I will stay with the stock LS6 intake, t.body and injectors. I'm doing a camshaft swap only with all the bolt ons in my 2002 WS6. If, during tuning, we determine there is alot of power not being realized, I might think about more air or fuel modifications. Its a street car only, so unless I'm not realizing 30+ horsepower and or torque measurements, I will just leave it at that. Thanks again, Mike in DFW

[@commandokell]

Cool vid and good info, I currently have an 03 Z06 with full bolt ons (still running stock ls6 manifold), vararam intake, full exhaust, ported factory heads with dual springs, injectors, and a milder 218/224 cam and it put down 415hp 390tq, been looking at getting the doorman ls2 intake (I have the ls2 throttle body waiting already) for a while as a cheaper alternative to the fast ($$$) 92 intake, goal right now is to get to 420+ hp and 400tq and looks like this intake and a tweak to my tune should probably get me there. Eventually am gonna step up to a BTR stage 2 cam (227/234) and hopefully that will get me closer to 440-450hp range and 410-420tq.

[@ScrufsGarage]

Sounds like a plan. Definitely come back and give us an update as you make progress! Thanks for watching.

[@invertedpolarity6890]

That is an excellent Hp/Tq curve. Torque is amazing. You have 325 TQ starting from 3000 rpm up. You probably have 300 TQ form 2K rpm’s. Pretty damn good.

[@ScrufsGarage]

Thanks. I'm really impressed with how broad the torque curve is. I am also happy with the driveability of the cam. I was worried that it might buck at parking lot speeds, but it really isn't bad, even with the light weight flywheel. VERY happy. :)

[@Gr8erh8er]

I thought the ls2 ports were different than the ls6? I have an ls1 with a 600 lift cam and would like to change the intake but can’t afford a fast intake

[@dekesone1]

Great comparison. Certainly makes a compelling case for the Doorman LS2 intake and T/B. Your torque curve is impressive for a cammed engine. That thing probably pulls hard (or lights up the tires easily!)

[@ScrufsGarage]

Thanks! I'm very happy with the power curve. I actually drove the Corvette to work today and as I was sitting in rush hour traffic, I was thinking how happy I am that I didn't go with some massive cam that ruins driveability, haha.

[@cody72rs10]

What injectors did you use? And did you have to use adapters? Thanks!!! You're curve looks awesome.

[@ScrufsGarage]

I used the FAST 36lb injectors. No adapters needed for the injectors. Thanks, I'm very happy with how the car runs.

[@cody72rs10]

Did you end up using your ls1 fuel rails and ls1 style injectors as well?

[@ScrufsGarage]

Yes, that's correct. Reused my original fuel rail, and used ls1 style injectors.

[@ScrufsGarage]

I used FAST part # 303608 amzn.to/2X12UqX

[@cody72rs10]

@@ScrufsGarage awesome dude. Thanks a lot!!!

[@oillife2115]

Great video very good numbers I do have the Dorman intake soon to be installed. if you don't mind what injectors are you running?

[@amindnew527]

what fuel pump / lph gph? I'd be curious what a TRUCK intake / rails aka BREADBOX TBSS, would make, you'd have to take off ur hood no doubt, but a stock truck intake / rails is supposedly the best power to $ there is bar none

[@ScrufsGarage]

I'm still on the stock C5 fuel pump. Not sure how the truck intake would do. I've heard good things about it, but since it doesn't clear the hood, it isn't considered much in the C5 world. But other applications could benefit from it.

[@kenm724]

Something to note, Mayhem’s dyno reads low. Always has. Take it over to RPM and it’ll probably put down another 20 WHP

[@ScrufsGarage]

Good to know. The car pulled really hard and had a nice smooth torque curve, so I was very happy with the drivability. I've since sold the car but it would have been interesting to see if a different dyno gave a different number.

[@chemicalspore]

I bought an ls6 valley cover from improved racing. Got it quick and priced fair.

[@ScrufsGarage]

NoneSponsored/BunkAssMechanic Awesome, that’s where I got mine too. They’re great to work with. I also bought all the components for my oil cooler setup from them. And my oil pan baffles.

[@chemicalspore]

@@ScrufsGarage nice. I am about to get a melling oil pump and a whole bolt and head gasket kit since I'm going to cam swap my vehicle

[@ScrufsGarage]

NoneSponsored/BunkAssMechanic awesome! I’m having good results with the smelling 10295 oil pump. I also recommend getting the ARP head bolts. The factory ones are single use TTY whereas the ARP ones are both stronger and reusable. Best of luck on your build!

[@chemicalspore]

@@ScrufsGarage thank you. That is the exact pump that I want. Going with a 222/226 cam. Just perplexed on what size rods I need with 241 heads.

[@ScrufsGarage]

NoneSponsored/BunkAssMechanic do you mean push rods? I did a video on how to measure for push rods that might help. But if you’re only changing the cam (no change to the heads, gasket, etc) then you’ll most likely need the stock 7.400” push rods. Talk to the cam manufacturer though to make sure they didn’t change the base circle of the cam which could change PR length.

[@backdoormailman]

Going from a ls1 intake and 78mm throttle body to a 92mm throttle body and dorman ls2 in my ls1 f body. Looking forward to it

[@ScrufsGarage]

Awesome. Be sure to share your results!

[@backdoormailman]

Check my new comment....?

[@raythemanroe]

Will the Dorman not run the 90mm throttle body?

[@ScrufsGarage]

The Dorman intake uses the 90mm TB. The LS6 intake uses a 78mm TB. So part of the benefit of the Dorman LS2 intake is that you can run the larger TB.

[@chrisbryant1657]

Does the LS2 Intake manifold fit a 1998 z28 LS1 without modifications?

[@ScrufsGarage]

It will require some modifications depending on your application. I did a couple of videos to help show what's needed. kzbin.info/www/bejne/mZetmWZ-o9tpiKs and kzbin.info/www/bejne/gWe6aKqdmKaGrpo I also did a video on porting the Dorman LS2 intake manifold that you might enjoy. kzbin.info/www/bejne/qKnafXSVpayFbbM

[@bigal878]

Good videos I like them 👍🏻Without knowing how much $$$ the Dorman intake cost I’m not sold that it was needed for your combo especially for a street car. It has made a bit more power and torque but it has moved up in the rpm range, good for a strip car (the extra rpm may suit you for circuit work) but in my opinion the LS6 intake would have been fine for your combo. 👍🏻

[@ScrufsGarage]

Given the harness adapters needed for the DLS2 intake, it will likely cost a bit more than a used LS6 intake, but should be cheaper than a FAST intake. While the intake did shift the peak power numbers up in the rpm range, it still made more power at any given rpm and didn't lose any power down low. So regardless of the intended usage, that's a win. There's definitely nothing wrong with the LS6 intake, but I had a chance to try the DLS2 so I wanted to see how it compared. I think the power gains would continue to increase on a larger displacement motor, forced induction, and/or a big cam as you could take advantage of the increased air flow. Thanks for watching!

[@dangerousfreedom4965]

How or who ported the intake?

[@ScrufsGarage]

407ForRent I did the intake porting myself. I linked the video I made about it in the episode notes. I also linked 2 other videos on making the Dorman LS2 intake fit correctly.

[@daviddelacruz7496]

If I get the dorman ls2 intake since it's bigger I wouldn't be able to run the cai i have on right now?

[@ScrufsGarage]

You might need a different size coupler to go from the intake tube to the 90mm tb. That’s all I needed to change and was able to keep the rest of the intake.

[@daviddelacruz7496]

@@ScrufsGarage cool man thanks 👍

[@jeffborud3443]

Was this after porting the manifold? What did you run for a maf?

[@3rdGenGuy]

the Doorman ls2 intake was a good deal at $400, now it's $1,000+ cuz the viru*s stuff so FAST intake money

[@ScrufsGarage]

Yikes, I hadn’t priced one lately but you’re right, they’re getting expensive and not really much cheaper than a FAST intake!

[@nathanhamilton5078]

What motor/ displacement? Had it on track yet?

[@ScrufsGarage]

It's a 5.7L LS1. Haven't be able to do a track day yet. By the time I got it dyno'd, the weather got cold. Hopefully I'll be able to hit the track in the spring.

[@gabrielgonzalez8272]

Why did you go to 2 different dyno shops?

[@ScrufsGarage]

Same dyno shop for both intakes. Swapped the intake manifold while the car sat on the dyno.

[@RacedGuy]

Was this with the doorman ported ?

[@ScrufsGarage]

Yes, that's correct. This is the stock LS6 intake with an 80mm BBK trottle body vs the ported Dorman LS2 intake with a 90mm LS2 TB. Both running FAST 36lb injectors.

[@invertedpolarity6890]

What are your cam specs?

[@ScrufsGarage]

227/232 - 113+4 LSA - .612"/.595" www.cammotion.com/camshafts/titan-4-ls1-camshaft-227-232-113-4/

[@BowtieClusters]

Shit i doing a cam motion 228/232 620 604 113+3 on a 4.8 ls ill find out tomorrow if it even runs haha

[@dangerousfreedom4965]

Victor Lopez does it run? Should be nasty in a 4.8

[@BowtieClusters]

@@dangerousfreedom4965 we will find out tomorrow Saturday 11/24 if it does

[@YoungerPrice]

I got a 224/230 in a 4.8,it's coming out soon.

[@mcfero1]

Nice finally!!!

[@ScrufsGarage]

mcfero1 Yes, long long overdue! I’ve been traveling a ton the last 2 months (Taiwan, China, California, NJ) so it really delayed me in getting the video edited. It’s so nice finally having the car running and tuned... and finally got my state inspection, haha. All in time for winter when all the tracks are closed.

[@firstlast-yn4qg]

too bad you can't find them

[@amordeweso]

The ls2 just bolts on?

[@ScrufsGarage]

Yes, this is the Dorman LS2 intake manifold (the GM LS2 intake wasn't very good). It sorta "bolts-on." There are some modifications you need to do. I did a video series on what it takes to install this intake. I also did a video on porting the intake runners. Check those out, I think you'll find them helpful.

[@jeffsloane8628]

Great video. Thank you for creating and posting thumbs up. IMO C5's need to have their dyno pulls done much lower because their daily driving range is 1000 to 2500 RPM. I know for my build I'm really focused on not loosing tq in that lower range while working to build area under the curve and higher peak numbers. Best to you in your build.

[@ScrufsGarage]

I agree. When picking out my camshaft I was careful to get something that wouldn't lose low end torque. I think a bigger cam would definitely make more power at the top end, especially with the ported heads, but I think it would start to come at the sacrifice of low end torque and driveability. No right/wrong way to do it, just depends on where you want the power for a given application. Good luck on your build!

[@C6Z_Bob]

I really wouldn't worry too much about your low dyno numbers. Trap speed in 1/4 mile is a much better indicator of horsepower. My Camaro made 413 rwhp with stock 853 heads, and LS6 intake, 1 7/8" headers with a 232/234 .600/.600 cam, but I would bet almost anything that your Corvette would easily walk away from my Camaro. BTW, thanks for posting these videos, I learned a lot, specifically I learned how to install an oil pump, which I did with my cam swap last August.

[@ScrufsGarage]

I agree, dyno numbers certainly aren't everything. Hopefully in the spring I'll finally get to do a track day with it. With the old motor I could hit 146mph on the back straight at VIR. I'll be curious to see how it does with the new motor.

[@streetfighterracing1583]

Scruf's Garage pretty close to what i made with 231/242 .600 lift “stage 3” 412h 418t I’m lookin into heads and intake upgrades now.

[@miguel300ish]

hey great numbers!.. my c5 made 380whp and 420lbs torque with a 222/225 howards cam

[@ScrufsGarage]

That's a great torque number! And that size cam should have great driveability too.

[@miguel300ish]

@@ScrufsGarage thanks ! And it does that's the main reason I got it .. since mine it's an auto I didn't want to change the stall .

[@bobisthebuilder3982]

looks like the Doorman was the winner especially for the money.

[@backdoormailman]

So I'll start by saying this video inspired me to buy the dorman with plans to run it on my ls1 f body. I've been sanding the whole intake down to prep for paint. paint (and remove the ugly tq specs and other writing. ) after shining a light in the first intake port, a very clear problem appeared. The intake does not seal properly internally. Where the 2 halves are sonic welded (basically melted) together, there is a small gap where the 2 pieces never touched. The first 2 intake runners on the left and first 1 on the right all have this problem. Which is the exact issue the oem ls2 intake had. Very disappointed and there's no way I can return it now. If I wouldn't have inspected it very carefully I would have never noticed. Just a warning to everyone that thinks this is a good idea. Some may have installed without checking this. Dorman quality is very poor. I expected to clean up the casting but aside from doing patchwork I'm not sure there's anything I can do

[@ScrufsGarage]

That's interesting... and disappointing I'm sure. Are you sure the parts are actually leaving a gap/hole for air to leak through (more than just a step in the material)? You probably saw my other videos on porting my intake. I removed quite a bit of material in each intake runner and never came across any gaps. I have no affiliation with Dorman, but I have been to their facility in Colmar, Pa. They have an extensive 3d scanning, 3d printing, and development test lab. Maybe you got a dud though? If you emailed Dorman directly with some pictures, they might be able to assist? Sorry I can't help more.

[@backdoormailman]

@@ScrufsGarage emailed dorman today hopefully they can help me out. If not anybody wanna buy this intake or trade for ls6?