Critical Race Theory: Can Christians Agree to Disagree? (Conversation with Samuel Sey)

[@sdh4557]

Samuel, you may be more comfortable with writing, and you have a gift! But, like Moses, I believe the Lord is calling YOU right now to come forward and speak on these things! You are humble, clear, and informative to listen to.

[@honeyspoonbeewrangler4550]

He got better at communicating once he got going, his passion took over his judgement on himself.

[@lmdrn06]

@@honeyspoonbeewrangler4550 agreed!

[@clairesteel4928]

Amen

[@Demitriavelo]

What a humble young man. I appreciate how much critical thinking is involved in his responses.

[@lambyoung]

"We've already been reconciled. We simply need to believe it and act like it." Amen! Thank you, Samuel!

[@katiesmith5149]

If you don’t read his blog already, I would encourage to go read his stuff. He is so so wise and has a gift for words!

[@alexlindstrom555]

A-freaking-men!!!!! I’ve noticed CRT to be a strictly humanist and cynical way of viewing the world.

[@oprophetisfake9482]

@@alexlindstrom555 CRT is worse than just humanist. It is a form of retributionist communism. It promotes a general communist idea but says that before establishing a communist system or within it those who are seen as the oppressor groups have to be punished or put down.

[@alexlindstrom555]

@@oprophetisfake9482 like French Revolution style. I hear ya!

[@Calatriste54]

Nailed it LY! "We are All recovering racists" (author not recalled).

[@joemonday3908]

As a white person and a Christian, I have to say that the furor, indignation and fear from my fellow white brothers and sisters over CRT rings hollow to me. Especially when I consider the heavy political activism that has dominated the white evangelical church over the past several decades. The conservative, right-wing agenda has always been seeping with an underlying sense of white superiority which favors the rich and ignores (even despises) the poor. Any thought of reparations for slavery, acknowledging institutionalized racism, justice for the oppressed (especially victims of police brutality) gets the average white evangelical foaming at the mouth with rage and disgust. Why? Did not Jesus come "..to preach the gospel to the poor...to heal the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives....to set at liberty those who are oppressed.."? I don't give two cents for any man-made organization like BLM or any theory or philosophy like CRT. But as a follower of Jesus, I must care about my own position in relation to others. I must walk in humility and service. I must always fight for justice and stand against unrighteousness. In other words, I must Iive out the Gospel. We as white people really need to get over ourselves and stop being so afraid to put love into action. Here is a more in depth discussion/debate on the subject: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gZPdgXelesyCldU

[@sdh4557]

Love Samuel Sey!!❤️🙏🏻 I absolutely love that he pauses every time before he begins to speak. Wouldn’t we all be so much better if we did that?..

[@veronicaspencelocke2003]

Amen!! (I'm including myself in that "Amen" We should be able to be slow & thoughtful before we speak!)

[@sean3280]

Appreciate Samuel’s boldness in speaking truth with extreme clarity. Been impressed with Samuel ever since I came across his writing. This is EXACTLY where I’ve landed with regard to these particular issues of the day. I’m praying to love my brothers and sisters who disagree and do not see the fallacies of these ideologies. Thanks for having these insightful & edifying conversations! Much love and respect to you both. Lord bless you!

[@gen2917]

This interview is GOLD!👏🏻🙌🏻

[@keridavis2623]

I love listening to Samuel! His basis in the Bible gives me joy and hope, and I love his perspective on our own personal sinfulness and how we view others. God is doing amazing things through him!

[@Calatriste54]

A very bright light in this dark world..

[@HARDBODYJTIMO]

I find it completely ridiculous how “evangelicals” would interject CRT, Cultural Marxism, Social Gnosticism into the discussion of “race” issues instead of addressing the sin of partiality aka “racism”

[@jamestamz]

You don’t know what you are talking about. Jesus was a Marxist, he supported the removal of social hierarchy [all men a created equal].

[@SNAPLINKSLLC]

@@jamestamz You are wrong brother. Saying Jesus was Marxist is almost like saying Marxism is the perfect standard of God which it isnt. Not only that but the bible also said that God is the Head of Jesus, Jesus is the Head of man, man is head of woman and woman is head of children. So He isnt against social hierarchy and though we may pretend that hierarchy isnt true for a while, when a crisis its us, we go immediately to God. We start taking the image of Jesus as men. Women look to the man to protect them and children look to the mothers for protection. Something about our suffering and more specifically Jesus', is beautiful. It shows the nature of our spiritual reality the best.

[@danielmiller2069]

I really believe the church will meet failure after failure until we cut away the fancy misdirection of our culture and cut to the heart. Partiality is so much bigger than "race".... we are different tribes one race anyway. The whole thing is silly in the light.

[@duncescotus2342]

Hard body, I like your spirit here, but can you rephrase that in another way, clarify your position a bit? There's 4 comments running with your hand-off, care to QB this huddle?

[@DavidJohnson-dp4vv]

To be honest with you as a society we should accept that there is racism entrenched in our institutions. So kids should learn about it in schools so we can actively do things to try our best to fix it. You could even argue that's it built into the American church considering the racial and ethnic divide in certain denominations. If you look at things historically even church's that were ardent abolitionist, they still wanted their service's segregated. You could even argue that racism in entrenched in Southern Baptist considering they were the ones fighting for slavery and later on fighting for segregation. It's ironic that they are currently some of the Christians who are fighting hardest against critical race theory. People should learn about things and so should kids. You could even argue it's built into plenty of left leaning institutions, the medical field. The most we can do is improve it not put our heads into the sand.

[@MakingChristKnownMedia]

Christians are called to be like the watchman on the tower, but if we are not careful the enemy can keep us distracted with cultural issues to the point that we lose focus of our ultimate mission. Should we talk about race issues? Absolutely, but not at the expense of the gospel of Jesus Christ. We should allow the Word of God to guide us when we discuss racism and racial discrimination. Love God and love your neighbor.

[@evanhadkins5532]

In Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek - talking about 'race' (ethnicity) is right there in the NT.

[@isabelleclasen6607]

So so good Samuel and Sean! Thank you for the time spent preparing for and filming this and for the gift of your biblical wisdom on this issue. God bless you both

[@SeanMcDowell]

Thank you!

[@FaldieChandler]

This young godly man is such an example and an inspiration of someone who is being guided by the Holy Spirit to see Truth and obey in loving God and neighbor. This was my favorite conversation on this channel, so far. I will look forward for the follow up conversation with Samuel. Thank you.

[@elissabellajoy]

Wow, thank you so much for introducing Samuel. What a blessing to learn of such a Bible centered, sober minded brother. I praise God for Samuel's life and work in Christ. Thank you, Sean for yet another great interview. The Lord bless you both and your families 🙏🏻🙏🏻💙💙

[@theshepherdpath]

I love how Samuel speaks about God .

[@chantellecunningham8899]

I’m so glad you had him on! His content is so well-prepared and thorough. I appreciate him and his work so much.

[@SeanMcDowell]

Me too!

[@jezreel916]

@@SeanMcDowell Wow, I just watched the Voddie Baucham conversation. But I find Samuel Sey's answers to Sean's probing questions, very impressive and clear. It's really not easy to answer Sean.

[@benjiradach347]

I'd never heard Samuel Sey speak before. He is so clear in making his points biblically. As a Christian, I'm grateful that he is speaking out for biblical truth and against lofty human opinions. As a black man, who also grew up in Africa, I'm similarly concerned about truth--the drift toward unbiblical leanings and thinking is way easier than many Christians seem to think.

[@wachukamugenyu3743]

Hello, i am a black woman from Kenya and was eager to hear a good conversation from The great Dr. McDowell and this young man. Firstly, I would commend both of them on their measured, intelligent and respectful conversation because I was finally given a chance to hear what people meant by CRT. I am very curious about this discourse as an African woman and was eager to hear why the American Christians are in an uproar about this. I am confused by the argument that it is unbiblical. My immediate thought was, "so is capitalism but we still ascribe to the economic system!" This is a very weak argument but i guess because we are Christians we should always have God's view. I think that CRT has deep flaws and we should not follow it whole-heartedly but to dismiss it as finally as Samuel has is intellectual laziness. Are you saying that you do not believe that there are racist laws at all? ! am in Kenya and we still have remnants of racist law from our former colonists! We are trying to remove them and have done a commendable job. And there is also a big difference between laws and policies and can be looked at as two sides of the same coin. I am in great conflict because I feel the American Church are doing the same thing they did at the time of the Civil Rights Movement. They accused Dr. King of being a Communist and Marxist! They refused to be part of the movement in any way and were/are judged for it. I implore you brothers and sisters of the faith, please just keep an open mind to the theories of others. Just listen and don't dismiss all movements as bad, listen to the concerns. CRT is not Christian, nor is capitalism, republicanism, political affiliations or public policy. But you know what is Christian? listening to the Black American Christians. Edit: I am not bashing American Christians at all and I am not for or against CRT. I just want us Christians to be known for doing the right thing and bear good witness for the gospel to EVERYONE.

[@marvingarcia5169]

"I heard a Christian say she doesn’t believe in Capitalism. She believes there ought to be an equal distribution of wealth. She thinks this is what Jesus said. She thinks this is ‘standing for what is right’. She said we ought to maintain morals. She said we should give to the needy. But when you think about it, she’s contradicted herself on at least two points. The very fact that she mentions ‘giving’, is an endorsement of Capitalism, because Capitalism is defined as the ‘economic system where ownership and control of capital is in private hands’. Without Capitalism there is no such thing as private property; and without private property, there can be no such thing as ‘giving’, because in Socialism everything already belongs to everybody. (You can’t ‘give’ something to someone if it already belongs to him or her.) The Bible talks about ‘giving’ to the poor, which means the Bible acknowledges the notion of private property, which equals Capitalism. She said we should keep our morals. But that’s possible only with Capitalism. In Socialism there can be no such concept as stealing, because everything already belongs to everybody. (You can’t ‘steal’ something if everything already belongs to you.) Therefore without Capitalism there can be no concept of ‘sin’ against God, only of crime against the State. There is no longer any such thing as morality. But when the Bible commanded, ‘Thou shalt not steal’, it was to protect the moral value of private property, which equals Capitalism. Without private property rights (i.e. without Capitalism) the concept of ‘giving’ is replaced by the concept of ‘redistribution’, which equals Socialism, and denies the Biblical concepts of private property, giving, stealing, sin against God, and replaces it with the humanist concept of the State being supreme. The forced, legislated, equal redistribution of wealth - is tantamount to theft. Jesus never commanded such a thing. The Bible reaffirms the morality of private property. And it commands us to help the needy. The best way to help the needy isn’t always to give them money. Doing that creates welfare dependency. A better way to help them is to provide them with paid employment. But to do that, you first have to own a business - which equals capitalism. Without capitalism, you can’t lift up the poor - in Socialism (i.e. without private property rights), you can only bring everyone else down to the level of the poor. The redistributionists claim to be compassionate - but in the long term, their methods do not really help the poor; and in the meantime, they perpetrate an injustice against the hardworking, rightful creators and owners of the very wealth which can be used to give the poor a chance to work and improve their status." - John Edward's

[@wachukamugenyu3743]

@@marvingarcia5169 again, socialism or capitalism were not created in a Christian context. Capitalism may have ties with Christian doctrine but it is a secular concept. So, why view CRT as something to be whollistically trashed without examining it OBJECTIVELY and taking what is needed for the sake of reconciliation?

[@touchofgrace3217]

I hope this brings clarity to your confusion about why Christians are in an uproar about this. And why all Christians, not just Americans should be sounding an alarm. People who don’t understand CRT and its origin in marxism think “ whats wrong with justice “? “Justice is biblical”. Christians who know the Bible understand that justice doesn’t exist outside of God. Trying to be just without God is not possible. We recognize that CRT and its liberation theology is a false religion with its own woke false prophets. Here’s the reason Christians reject it. Woke/Liberation theology expressly denies the sovereignty of God, the authority of the Bible and the sufficiency of the Gospel. Any one of those would be a dealbreaker. Woke theology is a man centered false gospel that elevates man rather than God. There is nothing in the Bible to substantiate doing that so woke pastors are forced to severely mishandle Scripture or largely ignore the Bible by using extra-biblical sources, arguments and emotionalism. They often get frustrated when they are told to “just preach the Gospel” because in their eyes the Gospel doesn’t have the capacity to deal with the sin of racism. One of their false prophets, Kelly Brown Douglas, has even gone so far as to say that a person can’t be white and follow Jesus which obviously denies the deity of Christ. God IS sovereign. The Gospel IS sufficient. To accept CRT is to reject Christ. Therefore CRT must be rejected. Not only do Christians have a reason to be in an uproar about CRT but we also have an obligation to contend for the faith by refuting it. 2 Corinthians 10:5 We are destroying arguments and all arrogance raised against the knowledge of God, and we are taking every thought captive to the obedience of Christ, Romans 16:17 I appeal to you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and create obstacles contrary to the doctrine that you have been taught; avoid them. Jude 1:3,4 Beloved, while I was making every effort to write you about our common salvation, I felt the necessity to write to you appealing that you contend earnestly for the faith that was once for all time handed down to the saints. For certain people have crept in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand marked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons who turn the grace of our God into indecent behavior and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ. I agree with you that we should be openminded as long as we test everything against Scripture as our ONLY authority.

[@azngurlrulz]

Wow! Gotta get him back for another interview!!

[@SeanMcDowell]

Yes, for sure. He was GREAT.

[@Calatriste54]

@@SeanMcDowell Fabulous interview, Doc!

[@lisakincart6872]

This is such a great interview. This is the second time I’ve seen an interview with Samuel and he is amazing. He speaks with such clarity and gets to the point. Love, love, love!!!

[@jpascua3824]

@Black-Skin-is-Amazing! we #ADOS males da GREATEST keep living the victim and in bondage.

[@BrianDonato]

CTR is bad enough for white students but even worse for non-white students because it encourages victimization & low expectations. How any parent of a Black child can go along with this nonsense is beyond me. I'll also point out a very simple example of how CRT actually plays out in real life - Because I find often when people discuss it (on both sides), they never provide examples and simply talk “fluff”, or they discuss some minor part to CTR that is irrelevant to the part people like me find harmful. To set the stage though - The main premise of CTR is that systemic racism is embedded in society AND any unequal distribution of anything by race is evidence of racism. So in order to fix this, the theory calls for drastic measures to change outcomes to create an equal distribution ... What this analysis fails to realize is that it's impossible to equalize everything because people are different. There can't be equal distribution in every field /area by race, gender, family background, personality, eye color, health problems, fair color, culture, income level, college experience, etc. because that is IMPOSSIBLE and CTR doesn't utilize much analysis past skin color anyway to consider any of these other factors. What you're taught in elementary school is that you can only compare #'s/outcomes when all the other variables are the same. CTR doesn't abide with this & neglects the fact that it is IMPOSSIBLE to keep variables the same from human to human precisely because people are different to their core. The example is: School discipline often disproportionately affects young boys in school, let's say at one school the distribution is "Black boys are disciplined 3 times as much as White boys" - Therefore CTR would say that this is evidence of systemic racism since it should be equal. Oddly enough, by the same logic it would be systemically sexist against boys also if more boys are disciplined than girls - but of course no-one would publicly say this (This correlation proves the whole CTR is illogical to it's core too since logically they are the same ideas & both don't make sense). Of course it doesn't account for the actual unique situations or why there is misbehavior or anything like that, or perhaps the rate of discipline is actually just unequal amongst people with different home lives or 2 parent household vs. 1 parent households, and that accounts for all of the difference. But none of that matters - All that matters is skin color. So by CTR and the equity officer's agenda, they would need to create structures to get this closer to even - In other words, manipulate discipline and have lower expectations for Black students for behavior, let them get away with more because as noted - the distribution must be equal. THAT IS HOW IT ACTUALLY PLAYS OUT because there is no such structure/strategy to create equal distribution without utilizing unfairness. Therefore, in this school - Black boys are not disciplined as much as white boys for the same behavior. They are not taught how to behave. The teacher is softer on them, etc. etc. Which very literally compounds the negative behaviors of boys then .... So if you're a parent with a Black or mixed child at this school (like myself), you have the school very literally having the bigotry of lower expectations in terms of behavior for your child simply because of their skin color. So they have a "lower standard" of behavior for Black students. And the last thing any parent wants is for their misbehaving child to be "let off easy" by the teacher because then their misbehavior is condoned and they're not taught how to act, etc. .... This is EXACTLY how CTR plays out in reality. The whole theory takes group averages and then they actively manipulate the data on an individual level OR they make generalizations about the individual from group averages. It very literally is not just racist, but stupid. This is just ONE EXAMPLE, but CTR affects everything because the basic premise that any lack of equity in anything is sign of systemic racism is illogical to it's core. IT MAKES NO SENSE through simple analysis. The same theory would say the prison system is sexist against men because of unequal distribution, or the NBA is systemically racist against Asians or White Players. It’s all BS. I could go on with several other examples but just wanted to mention one. I discuss it more on my channel though. I find very few advocates of CTR even listen to the criticism of it & are even OPEN to feedback on this. This allows this foolishness to keep on going & for the brainwashed that go along with it to not question it. So unfortunate but I hope more people speak out against it because it is making things worse for everyone, no matter their skin color.

[@JesusSoldierMC]

That was beautifully spoken. I ll love the example with the tunel. Awesome interview! Thank God for Brothers like you Samuel. Stay humbled in the WORD of GOD Brother. We will look up and Support your blog Brother! Much Love and prays from Jesus Soldier MC.

[@paulajames6149]

I am a little asian woman. I am a survivor of sexual abuse (6 years) and I could not be around a man (all race) by myself without panic. I would have run away in that tunnel. Thank you Sam and Sean. Great conversation!!!

[@SixTenVisuals]

Best response to CRT I've seen so far. I'm in total agreement with Samuel.

[@SeanMcDowell]

Thanks for watching!

[@helenwilliams6773]

It's SO helpful to hear a conversation RE CRT discussed rationally rather than emotionally. This kind of discussion is what's missing in media and public issue discussions.

[@fernandoalarcon8534]

Sean, one of your best interviews. Please have him back.

[@AString95]

My basset hound just passed away. Your profile pic reminds me of her.

[@ryanwiersema7251]

I was too busy with work to listen live and only caught the end. I was able to listen to the complete episode after work and just finished it. Samuel Sey was an AWESOME guest!!! He speaks the truth in love!! Please have him back. Praying for him, you and all of the others speaking the truth in love. May we boldly live out the grace of God and the obedience of faith that Paul wrote about in Romans!

[@thejohnsonshomeschool]

Thank you so much for bringing Samuel on. He was a breath of fresh air bringing God's truth in humility and kindness. I cant wait to read his work.

[@grido58]

Amen Amen Amen Hallelujah! What a fantastic interview. O Bless The Lord! Both of you are divinely blessed @Sean McDowell and @Samuel Sey 🙌🏾🤗🥰

[@ccelms6581]

Samuel Sey, I’m hoping to hear from you a loooot more! Your humility and wisdom are refreshing. You’re a sharp, sharp brother in Christ! God bless you and, again, I hope to hear more from you!

[@Elvtow]

Samuel always speaking based on biblical truth. what a blessing this interview is and yes bring him back!

[@janek59]

Samuel's heart brings tears to my eyes. What a beautiful expression of Christ in him. Lord help me to love people and put them first, make my heart more like yours, Jesus. 🙏

[@carlab4868]

You are a 🇨🇦 national treasure Sam.

[@SeanMcDowell]

Agreed!

[@richhazeltine1413]

​@@SeanMcDowell I appreciate these discussions very much, sir. this one, in particular, provoked deeper thoughts. I read somewhere that the root of the word satan is something like categorizer. You probably know the truth about that. Satan is a divider at any rate and contrary to Jesus, the unifier. CRT to me is a divisive issue and seems to me to be smoke and mirrors. What will we do differently if CRT has "Marxist roots?" Our nation has abused people of color since its inception. While there has been progress politically the damage has consequences still. Every attempted movement forward provokes pushback. My concern is when Jesus followers get caught up in this confusion, the real biblical problems are not addressed. The maxim "Sunday is the most segregated day of the week in America" is true to this day. Can you tell me if there was a time when the Church, the called-out ones were lead by mostly people of color? Was there a time when that leadership became mostly "white"? We are, of course, a "nation from every tribe and tongue." Do we have a capitalistic world view or a communistic world view? How do we even decide which is better? I hope you can clarify this for me. Keep up the good work.

[@johnkaraphillis754]

Samuel is wise beyond his years. I’m going to find his blog. He is a voice of love, truth, and unity!

[@nutricoach7947]

That was fabulous! Thank you, Sean and Sam! This is one that’s def worth a re-listen. Thanks again!

[@Chaozaamz]

wow! what a great interview. Thanks Samuel Sey. And great Questions Sean. Amen to 15:00

[@rayestone919]

Love this interview! So happy you had him on.

[@titosantiago3694]

One of the most important, impactful, and necessary conversations today. Thank you so very much!!!

[@imlistening3218]

Awesome interview. Both of you. Thanks Samuel, so blessed by your viewpoint. Fellow Canadian here, I wish they'd let you speak in our public schools. We desperately need it

[@shawnaroachford5754]

Wow my heart is so full of joy listening to these two men who fear God and love His word. Thank you Jesus 🥰🙏❤

[@plaidpaisley5918]

This was amazing! Thank you both so much!!

[@Candican2]

Amen, brother! Didn't know I had a fellow Canadian brother discussing this! Definitely going to check him out! Great conversation!

[@shawnaroachford5754]

Please bring Samuel Sey back🥰❤🙏

[@katiesmith5149]

I first heard Sam speak on another podcast. I didn’t know he was a writer at that time. He has a gift from God for both speaking and writing. He is wise, and I appreciate that his thoughts are so deeply rooted in the Bible.

[@garysweeten5196]

Refreshing and insightful. So many current issues trying to find our identity in gender, race, performance thrust them into despair and anxiety. They lead us to shame and fear instead of freedom in Christ as God’s child.

[@diggsjf]

Wow! That was amazing! Samuel helped cut through the questions I’ve wrestled with answering well. Thank you for your obvious commitment to grace and truth, brother! Sean, thanks for having Samuel on! Amazing!

[@altitudemanagement]

I don't know if Samuel doesn't understand CRT or if it's me that's mistaken, but CRT is a lense you can view things through to understand how the long shadow of racism continues to effect minorities today. There was a time when laws in the US were explicitly racist, allowing slavery, then later enforcing segregation. Even if not a single person at the time was racist, the system itself was racist and allowing it to exist was wrong. CRT helps us understand that the lived experience of the majority culture is different than minority cultures. When minorities tell us they are having a hard time finding a job, and apartment, and are treated worse by police than white people, we should believe them. CRT should not lead anyone to conclude that white people are "more fallen" than BIPOC, it should lead us to understand that not being white is a little bit harder than being white and and that isn't just the result of natural genetic inferiority but instead is the intentional result of explicitly racist history. Recognizing our county has a racist past that still impacts the wealth, health, and wellbeing of minorities in our country today isn't a gospel issue at all- it has nothing to do with Christianity. The intersection with the gospel isn't in recognition of BIPOC's greater struggle, it's in how we respond to it. Everyone should recognize that racism did exist and still makes life harder for minorities. The higher calling for Christians is that we need to do something about it. Denying it exists is antithetical to the gospel and makes you exactly mirror the goats who say "Lord, when did we see you hungry and not feed you, or thirsty and not give you a drink, or sick or in prison and not visit you?"

[@daydreamerz]

First, Samuel makes good points. But keep in mind that his experience as an African immigrant is quite different from that of Blacks Americans; just like being American is a different experience from being French. He's correct in many ways, but many of his views are informed by his culture as Ghanaian. For example, he said he felt more at home in a predominantly white church. FYI - that's actually very common among African and Caribbean immigrants. Not common among Black Americans. Wonder why. Second, it's remarkable how obsessed Christians have become with CRT. They're happy to use their platform to combat that flawed worldview, but not to combat racist views in their pews. Throw CRT in the trash, but don't use it to dodge calling out racism amongst your flock. Have they challenged people to honestly inspect their hearts and actions for the sin of partiality? Why is 11am Sunday still the most segregated hour in America? Why did people go straight from church to klan rallies? Why did Bob Jones Christian Univ ban black students until 1971 and interracial dating until 2000? Why don't they forcefully denounce the worldview that caused those things? CRT is just a convenient way to ignore the role the Christian church has played in promoting or permitting racism in its pews. Yes it's uncomfortable, but we need to acknowledge these not-so-distant sins and reconcile amongst ourselves before we tell others what to do.

[@helenaholcomb3004]

Voddie Baucham grew up in Los Angeles read his book Fault Lines

[@daydreamerz]

@@helenaholcomb3004 I've heard plenty about what Baucham has to say. My concern isn't about the flaws of CRT. My problem is that pastors expend immense energy denouncing CRT, but no energy denouncing the past and present racial issues within the church. They are using CRT as a 'get out of jail free' card.

[@helenaholcomb3004]

@@daydreamerz I believe Sean addressed that perception of CRT criticism I thought Samuel gave a biblical response/approach to how the church should respond to these real problems.

[@ifeifesi]

I thoroughly agree with you here. I'm black and hate CRT. However I did a search on those pastors here on KZbin who are speaking passionately against CRT to see whether prior to this they had preached against racism from their pulpits. I saw none that had. This to me is telling that they are sensitive to threats against the white race and care none for hurts against others. So much for love your neighbour a key commandment of Jesus.

[@velvetstitching3631]

This is probably one of the BEST interviews I have seen on CRT and its "offshoots" (the Social Justice Movement, Systemic Racism, And Intersectionality!) Thank you! Samuel Rey is a wise young man - because the wisdom he shares is the timeless wisdom of the TRUTH of God's Word! (therefore, Samuel is sharing GOD's wisdom which is always true, perfect, holy, and filled with loving Grace!)

[@alexlindstrom555]

I loathe CRT with a passion. I think it’s toxic and gaslighting. But I often wonder...what are alternative ways to discuss race outside of the “privilege vs oppressor,” “white fragility” narratives?

[@nicolepettit5120]

I don’t think the concept of privilege is bad in and of itself; it only becomes bad when it is used to shame or marginalize the allegedly privileged, like it’s your own fault for how you were born. Or, it is bad if you assume that being privileged automatically makes you an oppressor. The concept of privilege can be helpful if it leads to humility. For instance, if you are white and you happen to live in a nice house, and you meet an African-American who lives in a slum, you shouldn’t automatically assume it’s because you are smart and worked hard while the other person is lazy or dumb. It MIGHT be because your life was easier in some ways (aka “privilege”) that added up over time.

[@reflectionsinthebible3579]

@@nicolepettit5120 there are rich black people too.

[@marythomas5869]

I am blessed listening to this. Opened up an understanding of the issue outside the main narrative people have been saying all along

[@australiainfelix7307]

Amen, Samuel Sey. God bless you.

[@loiscarteaux9389]

Thank you for having Samuel on. My husband and I are new to your podcast and trying to learn about this issue since so many are into CRT and are seeking churches that promote this.

[@fayelewis5476]

You should read Voddie Baucham's book, Fault Lines.

[@loiscarteaux9389]

@@fayelewis5476 we just got it!

[@fayelewis5476]

@@loiscarteaux9389 Wonderful! So eye opening. I'm still working my way through it.

[@cleofewhite5551]

Thank you Sean for inviting Samuel. He is really objective.

[@fshepherd8149]

Dr. Sean I really appreciate your openness to eclectic points of view. I've learned a lot from you and your guests. These discourses have helped to solidify and broaden my Christian worldview.

[@malefetsanemabote3655]

May God bless Samuel with more wisdom! What a humble soldier of Christ

[@jaymartin4182]

Amazing show God bless you both

[@marvingarcia5169]

Great job Samuel. I'm sure you have been called horrible names for speaking truth. But keep going. The world needs more people like you! God bless brother 🙏

[@alishachurch9021]

This was incredibly helpful! Thank you for the great questions, and thoughtful answers! And thank you so much for having the comments on. Im sure it can be a minefield, but it can also be beneficial.

[@tb8987]

🐄 Holy Cow 🐄 - Grand Slam Interview! Thank you Sean & Samuel for present the heart of Christ while yet honoring the crisp fresh fall air of Biblical Truth on a clear September morning in the mountains (a little over down analogy 😉)! But I'm super thankful for such a great message on a significant current event while "rightly dividing" God's Word. I was blessed and encouraged to face this challenge both with compassion but also Biblical truth. THANK YOU!

[@kathyfalk3249]

I've heard many interviews on the subject of CRT but this may be the best. Great questions and great answers. This is one I'll be sharing. I agree with the commenter that Samuel may think that his gift is in writing, but our country needs to hear him engage on this subject in interviews like this. Samuel, you are an excellent communicator--thoughtful, precise, succinct, and most important, Biblical. Godspeed!

[@retrojazzdanceandmore]

So happy to see Samuel Sey on the show!

[@steveobrien3673]

Wow, Sam. Your heart really comes through. This was excellent.

[@robwesleylivingston]

Really helpful discussion - thank you Sean! Hello to your wife, mom and dad and sisters! I wish I could have a Julian Apple Pie again!

[@brawlins6]

Very insightful! and informative. Two godly men discussing the truth of the Word..

[@Lana1054-o5u]

This type of conversations is so necessary in my country South Africa, absolute eye-opening, I'm a white SA woman and at this stage white guilt in all spheres of life is sowing havoc in our beautiful country.

[@patisigns]

Wow! This is SO insightful!!! "People with unique experiences will tend to see things a certain way, but it doesn't mean they're right, and it doesn't mean that other people can't see them and challenge them because we ALL have biases."

[@jgrdunc1081]

Thank you brothers. This was a very helpful conversation.

[@ratman1101]

I deeply appreciate Mr. Sey's thoughtfulness, and his deep commitment to thinking and acting Biblically. God bless him in his ministry.

[@vlademtrueblack5230]

I am so glad to call you brothers in the Lord. What a great interview! God bless you both!

[@ajaybaines7654]

Sean & Samuel. Thank you so much for this. What an incredible conversation. Two brilliant men. Much appreciated.

[@JessicaStarks1]

What an amazing blessing to hear from Samuel Say. Thank you for sharing your views, they truly set me free from the bonds of CRT and drive me to Christ as a humble sinner.

[@aluke6059]

Sam hit it out the park and off the planet 👏🏾 when he said, the Bible is THE anti- racist book. Jesus dealt with the issue at the cross. We need to teach, preach and share the gospel 🙌🏾🙏🏾👏🏾

[@ClauGutierrezY]

Wow Samuel, so much to think about. Thank you so much.

[@navinkharmai5639]

What a gift from God Samuel has...I understood CRT and racism in general a lot more than before.

[@janettemarabella3221]

This man is amazing and so brave 👏

[@chloemsmithh]

So good! Love Samuel Sey! CRT is a false gospel.

[@cryforrevivalgospelministr5543]

CRT is not a gospel but a theory

[@chloemsmithh]

@@cryforrevivalgospelministr5543 It’s a worldview that replaces the gospel for those who believe it.

[@MegaeffinGarchomp17]

How exactly does CRT replace the gospel? They are two completely different worldviews not at all in conflict with each other

[@papasmurf986]

@@MegaeffinGarchomp17 one tells you to find your identity (good or bad) in your race and promotes unforgiveness, and racism while the other tells you to find your identity in christ. They are opposed. Gal 3:28

[@jimpollard113]

@@MegaeffinGarchomp17 CRT is a new religion, but one that embraces neo-racism, while rejecting redemption and forgiveness.

[@jeffspearman5678]

Good answers Samuel. May the Lord continue to bless you and your ministry. 🙏

[@alecvillareal450]

Hello Sean! I'm Alec from the Philippines. I just want to say that you and your dad Josh are a blessing to me. I remember back in 2019 when you, Josh, and Francis Chan are guest speakers in our Church (CCF). I learned a lot and was blessed, I like your atheist character challenge. Man, I remember having a photo with you with my friends, missing those days. Anyway, I have a question. What are your thoughts on watching Marvel, anime, or DC movies. Is it okay for a Christian like you and me to watch those kinds of films? Because like you. I'm a fan of Marvel. Thank you so much. God bless!

[@SeanMcDowell]

Great Q. Bring that one to my next live Q&A and I’ll unpack it!

[@alecvillareal450]

@@SeanMcDowell Wow, thank you! God bless.

[@6.0hhh]

This was awesome. God bless you both! Hey Sean, would love to see more on this topic. It would be cool for you to get an interview with Voddie! Also, Dr. James White has had a lot to say about this over the years too i think both of you would have a really good and in depth interview. Tom Ascol at the founders ministry deals with this a lot also. Just a few recommendations! Keep up the great work!!

[@SeanMcDowell]

Great suggestions. I’d LOVE to have Voddie on!

[@6.0hhh]

@@SeanMcDowell Sean, i knew you could do it! 😅 I see you are having Voddie on! Very excited for this one!! God bless and keep up the great work!

[@rosemarycarlson1349]

I wish all believers could hear Samuel! God bless him and his work!

[@dirkscott4966]

Best dialogue i have ever heard on CRT. It gives us the why CRT is a problem. I also love your humility and desire to speak to truth. Bless you brother.

[@joannegaribay4802]

Sean, excellent interview and thank you for your response to Ruslan. I support Ruslan and wish he would have someone like Samuel on his channel! Keep up God's ministry - love it! Gma Jo

[@SeanMcDowell]

Thanks, I’m so glad you enjoyed it

[@rebecca42734]

The best thought provoking discussion from a true biblically based gospel centered worldview on this topic. So thankful for this valuable resource. May God bless you both! God has reconciled mankind to Himself through Jesus Christ. Samuel could not have said it better! "Man cannot reconcile better than God. "

[@nancythornton8300]

Thanks so much Samuel. I have been reflecting alot about the question, "is there anything good in critical race theory.". I think you have demonstrated so well the only apparent good as you have contrasted it with the gospel. The gospel shines so brightly against it as you brought out the great virtue of impartiality that our God possesses. It also makes me reflect on my"privilege", and everyone has it. God doesn't give us privilege because he is partial but because he wants us to serve him with it, He makes some less privileged not only so the privileged can help the underprivileged , but so that we can be happy for others and look to God to supply our needs, this being the widow who is truly in need We will all stand before the judgment seat. Thanks for your wonderful words of wisdom.

[@fernandoalarcon8534]

Samuel Sey speaking with more clarity and truth than any politician. A man living the true word of God, very refreshing and inspirational.

[@elviramercado9010]

Thank you Samuel for this stand for the Truth.Thank you for covering this Sean.

[@leftykiller8344]

I love this discussion. I've researched CRT, and I agree with Mr. Sey that CRT is correct, in that race is a social construct. That is a fact. Race is based on perception, of not only skin color, but where people are from. This leads to preconceptions, most often based on stereotype. I am a white male, and the most benefit that I have had in reviewing CRT is challenging myself as to why I believe what I believe, and what I think what I think, when I think it. But I also think that all people, regardless of race, can benefit by asking these questions. I've experienced racism, against me, on two different occasions that I immediately recall. It creates racial fear. "Fear is the mind killer," to quote Frank Herbert. The challenge I had before, having experienced racism, is not letting those experiences effect my future thoughts and interactions. When somebody does something against you because of your race, you cannot let yourself assume that all people who look that way, feel the same way. That is the challenge that all people who experience racism have. And the more you have the same experience, the more difficult it is to overcome. To get into the neuroscience behind it: clusters of neurons fire when an event happens and they wire together, and if something similar happens they fire again and wire together even more. This is horrible. It can cause predisposition because of repeated experience, and I feel for those people. This fact, however, does not make CRT valid. There is evidence that suggests systemic racism when you look at the excessive use of force toward minorities, especially in comparison to conviction rate statistics. This does not sat the whole story, because I think each use of force is base not only on the particular cop's state of mind and experiences, but also on the situation of the instance. The reason I bring this up, is because if half of these excessive use of force instances are because of racism, then that means that the majority of instances where any force is used, are not racially motivated. Yes, racist people exist, but it's not because they are of a particular race. Racism exists because we are people, and sometimes people let their experiences dictate how they react to things. That explanation, however, is no limited to race.

[@kwall1464]

Thank you for sharing this with us, blessings brothers!

[@amosp.wellington6124]

Critical Race Theory is a framework by which we can view and then discuss historical, systemic, systematic, practices that have ostracized Black people in and out of the church in North America. Instead of talking about CRT let's dismiss that and discuss these historical crimes. Let's as a body of believers deal with the truths of the history in the USA. Yesterday was the 4th, do we need to agree on CRT to recognize that the words of the constitution were at best aspirational and at the worst flat out lies? Please don't ask me to forgive The founders for their crimes against humanity without acknowledging that their works were crimes. Samuel, Black people cannot be racist. Racism and prejudice are not the same. Racism is systematic subjugation of one group by another. Black people cannot subjugate white people. Of course Black Christians can be prejudice or bring their experience into their faith walk, just as White people have done. Show me a racist law, you then go through the "Color blindness" that has taken over the courts. Is God Color Blind? Of course not He made us all, different intentionally. Sean, I have a comment Crack- the race involvement in those Crack and Cocaine laws were clearly divided and multiplied for Crack versus Cocaine sentencing. Sean "the George Floyd incident"? A citizen who is allegedly innocent until proven guilty was MURDERED on a public street. It took the full presence of the holy spirit to endure this episode of Gaslighting. Robin Diangelo is not a Christian leader, neither is Ibrahim, or Kimberle Crenshaw. God did not subjugate Black people, He started this entire experiment with us. You can deny the sin of the church by pointing at CRT, but you cannot deny the history of lies, murder, hypocrisy, lynching, theft, by so called White Christians historically against "your brothers and sisters in Christ". When you do so you're holding up white supremacy and holding back the advancement of the kingdom.

[@jherried.1845]

So good! Yes, speaking truth from God’s word! I love the perspective starting from 20:22 about Critical Race Theory in your example 21:00 God bless you!

[@duncescotus2342]

I love this question that Dr. Sean raises. A tool like a hammer, can be used two ways. He rightly points to justice as the pertinent issue, something we as Christians should be have in our education, if not as a major, then as a minor.

[@solotechoregon]

Great discussion!

[@acrane653]

Preach, Brother! What a great discussion. Thank you both so much for sharing!

[@9darkwizard1]

Fantastic job Sam. Very well spoken.

[@theshepherdpath]

I hate I feel like white people need a black representative to discuss thing like crt .

[@AlexADalton]

can you elaborate?

[@mazza8408]

I think it's pretty clear

[@AlexADalton]

@@mazza8408 How do you interpret it? Is he saying its bad to get someone from the black community to discuss race issues?

[@mazza8408]

@@AlexADalton nope but it is wrong to get a black guy or girl to confirm what majority of white conservative people think or believe

[@AlexADalton]

@@mazza8408 That's what I'm not getting. Why would it even be wrong for a black person to agree with conservative views? If he was supportive of CRT, he'd just be a guy or girl confirming what the majority of black and white democrats think or believe. Either way, you can make claims of bias.

[@franco634]

Sean I disagree with much of what you say but you are a gentleman and a credit to your beliefs. I wish you all the best and ask you to continue to call out anyone who uses their beliefs as a weapon against others. Peace.

[@jobrown8146]

Thank you. Very helpful.

[@zeblis]

Thank you! My repentance cannot atone for another’s sins. Racism is a sin against God first and foremost, before any other sinner.

[@gedixon7]

Thank you for your thoughtful questions and discussions on this subject. I agree that CRT is both an analytical tool and an ideology. Maybe for those who are motivated by the love of God it can be used as a tool. However, for those with impure motives it becomes an ideology that can and will promote division.

[@alexdoerschel]

Outstanding interview! Samuel is thoughtful and biblically based and it’s so refreshing to hear.