Cru's LGBTQ+ Teaching Series

Jon explains the problems with clips from Cru's "Compassionate and Faithful" video teaching series used to train Cru staff in navigating LGBTQ+ related issues.
Links:
- To support Jon's work: www.worldviewc...
- Compassionate and Faithful Teaching Series: mega.nz/folder...
- Compassionate and Faithful montage: x.com/jonharri...
More Cru Commentary:
- Evidence Cru went Woke:
• The Evidence Cru's Gon...
- Former staff testimonies:
• Giving Tuesday, Cru St...
• Former Cru Intern Shar...
• Former Cru Staffer Sha...
• It Ain't Bill Bright's...
• Fired from Cru: The Mu...
- Cru19 Conference:
• CRU Goes Down the Woke...
- Cru disciplines Josh McDowell:
• Cru Shows Josh McDowel...

[@gentledove6804]

Love the tiny Bibles! I just wanted to say that, although I do not personally struggle with the sin of homosexuality, I do struggle with other sins, and I have found it very helpful to MEMORIZE SCRIPTURES that confront the sin and that encourage the upright walk for the saved Christian in obedience to Jesus Christ. Then simply repeat the scripture to yourself when you’re tempted to sin or even when you have tedious work you may be doing at that moment to maintain the memorization.

[@Mommybecca9804]

Yes, it is NOT enough to "turn away" from sin we also need to "turn to" Christ & His word! We need to not just "put off" the old life, & it's lies, but "put on" the new life (gotta know what it is, the truth found in the scriptures) in Christ. If we are "crucified in Christ" & " dead to sin", raised to newness in Christ, walking {by faith} in the Spirit...we need to *know* what that means! We need to be grounded in the Spirit {by/through the Word} so that when trials/temptations come we are equipped to withstand them.

[@gentledove6804]

@@Mommybecca9804 Amen. Ps. 119:11

[@JRRodriguez-nu7po]

I'm obese, result of the sin of gluttony. I am neither proud nor identify as it. Thus repentance is possible for me. You CANNOT repent of what you refuse to call sin. LGTBQRSXYZ is incompatible with Christianity.

[@Oceansand98]

We don't identify by our sin. That's the problem. A person with same sex attraction is struggling with sin, not identity. I don't hear anyone else identifying by their sin - "I'm a gossip; I'm a liar..." We are affected by this issue personally and it is heartbreaking. Preston's accusations are harsh. We are to love others, never accepting their sin as being okay. "Holy Sexuality" by Christopher Yuan is an excellent book that explains sexuality from a Biblical perspective. You did an excellent job discussing this.

[@DM-dk7js]

No. They aren’t. What they’re struggling with is YOU guys refusing the leave them alone.

[@hokieham]

@@DM-dk7jsUs leaving them alone? Laughable.

[@rinihogewoning6528]

Another excellent book is Fives Lies of Our Anti-Christian Age by Rosaria Butterfield.

[@buckan8r999]

or Randy Engel’s book Rite of Sodomy about church history related to church history

[@imissnickplur4964]

the guy's name is Preston Sprinkle... i mean. come on, you people are so gullible. he's an actor sent in to subvert your organizations. the fact that anyone even entertains the language used in his lecture(s) tells me you guys are in big trouble.

[@-RM-]

Thanks Jon. My wife and I were hit up for a donation to CRU last year by a young woman at our former church. She was a recent college grad and was actually beginning a job (or internship?) with CRU where she needed to raise money. We had to decline and said we couldn't support CRU in good conscience. She never responded back to us after that.

[@reys7510]

This is the proper response! Cru is also Family Life Conferences, what are these folks doing about this heresy? Crickets? Then they are guilty by their silence. Get this crap out of all of these ministries before it destroys them. Or is it too late??

[@kaymoto4023]

Loving kindness to sinners involves confronting them on their sin. We all need this kind of love!

[@Pro-j4q]

The only good thing about this Christian and Muslim nonsense about homosexuality is: This man-made religions will disappear one day with those who believe in it. Homosexuals then will still go on existing. I wish to every homosexual, that he/she finds a loving same-sex partner, marries and raises kinds in responsibility, as many already do successfully. As a Deist I send you a lot human love :)

[@Pastor_Grant]

Cru has been Woke since at least 2020 correct? I seem to remember hearing things like this back then maybe even earlier. And I agree EVERY parachurch organization needs to be under the authority of a church.

[@micahlantz905]

Earlier. Listen to the podcast regarding Cru from yesterday

[@JesusPPK]

No, definitely 2013-2017.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

We really need hierarchy. American Protestantism really messed up by leaving that behind with its various branches and splits.

[@travisstuber82]

Rosaria called them out again at the Ligonier conference just the other day, still firing away.

[@conceptualclarity]

So glad to hear it. So often conservatives will not keep up the pressure, but they apply a little and then go quiet when the job is not nearly done.

[@tinybibles]

Glad to get to be a sponsor of this episode! We are in full support of the positions you’ve taken here Jon. Thank you for fighting the good fight.

[@davidchilton4301]

As a former Campus Crusade staff member, I'm heartbroken by this. I see now what Rosaria Butterfield meant by receipts. One of the reasons I left 20 years ago was the lack of theological discernment I saw in the organization and now it's coming home to roost. I know many who are currently in Cru leadership and even live within a few miles of many of them and would still say they have lost their way in a profound fashion. A book I would recommend on this subject is Shawn Mathis' recent Is the Church Pro-Gay?

[@Indielancer]

A really good book. Very straight forward and clear

[@gmailjoe]

Also, the book Trans-Formation by Linda Seiler. She addresses the theological error behind Sprinkle, Henson, and Revoice. She also explains how SSA and transgender desires develop and can find resolve through Christ. Interestingly, Seiler was in Cru in the 90's.

[@rinihogewoning6528]

"Intersectionality confuses a biblical understanding of mercy and justice with an unbiblical one. Biblically speaking, sin causes suffering. We sin because we are sinners, not because we are victims. Widows, orphans, and the poor need soul care too. And people who are sinned against need a saviour to save them from their sins as well. The order of sin and suffering matters. Miss the point or change the order and you have bypassed the entire gospel." - Rosaria Butterfield

[@mrleemrleeohmrlee]

Our church youth just went through the Christian Sexuality curriculum from Preston Sprinkle and Jason Soucinek. Fortunately enough of the parents recognized it's problems so the leadership holding off on it and planning a different strategy. But what I noticed in that whole thing is how many people are swayed by how non-believers view Christians. First of all, so many of the perceptions of non-believers are influenced heavily by the media and the culture. So much of that isn't even based on actual experience but by propaganda. The second thing is, Christians often end up putting the comfort and perceptions of non-believers over and above the faithfulness to God and His Word. It's like they make an idol of social acceptance and respectability instead of being obedient and letting the chips fall where they may.

[@micahlantz905]

It's extremely alarming that your church leadership thought that was even appropriate or good to do! I would be looking for a better church if I were you

[@mrleemrleeohmrlee]

@@micahlantz905 Well, I'm appreciative that they were open to letting the parents view the curriculum first and then course correcting. The pastors I talked to thought it was off-base. And as far as finding a new church, unfortunately, my church is probably the most conservative and Biblically faithful in my entire region. I live on the California central coast. Currently looking at relocation.

[@designbuild7128]

Good point on last statement. Like cherry picking scripture, many people even cherry pick just one well-known chapter, 1Cor13 and buy into the worlds redefined terms, even on what Love and Truth are.

[@Mommybecca9804]

@mrleemrleeohmrlee So did the church youth group actually go thru the Preston Sprinkle curriculum, or were they *going* by the vigilant parents had been able to prevent it?

[@loiscarteaux9389]

Well said

[@anitasmith203]

33:16 they loved their sin more than God, or they would throw away this life of abomination.

[@sueh2970]

How well has this worked in their mission ministry ? How many have come to Christ and is living a transformed life and identity in Christ. No longer in sin but free in Christ ! 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 NASB95 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, [10] nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. [11] Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

[@Anonymous-cm9md]

This is a helpful video. Thank you for clarifying this issue that has succeeded in tearing families and churches apart. Preston Sprinkle is very intelligent and can be persuasive about discerning the truth of scripture, so I appreciate your critical review and expressing the gravity of normalizing sexual sin in our churches and Christian ministries like CRU.

[@Jendarben]

"Just a spoonful of 'winsome' makes the heresy go down..."

[@th6252]

Where in the Bible does it teach church is a hospital for sinners? Although the sick (sinners) are in need of a physician, that does NOT make the church a hospital. Church, in this context, is for worship of Almighty God first and foremost and for fellowship/building up of the brethren. I’ve come to really loath that expression, although I admittedly embraced it in the past until I became more biblically literate. That expression puts the emphasis on the person and not God which is blasphemy.

[@robertdagit4315]

It probably came from that contemporary song, which sadly seems how deep some who call themselves believers go

[@2ceBorn]

That would be St John Chrysostom. So yeah, I think I’m gonna trust him over you on this one.

[@Mommybecca9804]

​@@2ceBorn What specifically are you talking about/referring to?

[@MeanBeanComedy]

​​@@2ceBornDid he mean "Church" as in a specific congregation, like how Prots use it, or as the John 17 institution of a unified Body of Christ, stretching across time and space?

[@2ceBorn]

@@MeanBeanComedy He meant the one holy apostolic visible Orthodox Catholic Church. So more of the latter of your two options.

[@janethorsman194]

Preston really needs to be directly confronted about his heretical thoughts. His response videos really bug me. He obfuscates and plays semantic games. I get why Rosaria turned him down, but a conversation with someone like her REALLY needs to happen.

[@expression4424]

Seems weird to me that she wouldn’t be willing to have a conversation with him if his beliefs are really that wrong. As conservatives we should be open to debate and the exchange of ideas right? Not avoiding conversations with someone. It just makes us look in the wrong, and them in the right.

[@janethorsman194]

@@expression4424, yeah, I agree. I guess the elders of her church advised her not to. 🤷‍♀️

[@expression4424]

@@janethorsman194 it’s funny cause I think if they did talk it could be very important and powerful for the church. I think they’d find they actually agree on most things, and could maybe heal some division.

[@rnbham39]

@@expression4424Not to me, I think she should turn him down. I personally wouldn’t give him the time of day.

[@mariannerethwisch6816]

It's painful to listen to Preston Sprinkle. False teacher or even heretic would be a good label for him... sadly.

[@mariannerethwisch6816]

He is super dangerous. What deception!

[@loiscarteaux9389]

Excellent podcast, thank you. I hope everyone shares it with other parents, pastors, youth group leaders.

[@Pro-j4q]

The only good thing about this Christian and Muslim nonsense about homosexuality is: This man-made religions will disappear one day with those who believe in it. Homosexuals then will still go on existing. I wish to every homosexual, that he/she finds a loving same-sex partner, marries and raises kinds in responsibility, as many already do successfully. As a Deist I send you a lot human love :)

[@gentledove6804]

A married man shouldn’t be celibate; chaste, yes. The marriage (biblical marriage, not fake “homo-marriage”) bed is undefiled. CRU teaching is strange and unbiblical.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

Is anyone falling for this play anymore? It's not even surprising. They're using the same playbook as the ELCA, UMC, and PCUSA followed. It's just like listening to one of the non-christian Mainline Prots from 15 years ago.

[@Jo-ji1yf]

I can't thank you enough, my daughter was given a free digital copy of Secular Creed. She is 18 and only a babe in Christ. I'm worried for her because it is difficult for her to find friends that haven't partially or fully embraced this ideology.

[@Pro-j4q]

The only good thing about this Christian and Muslim nonsense about homosexuality is: This man-made religions will disappear one day with those who believe in it. Homosexuals then will still go on existing. I wish to every homosexual, that he/she finds a loving same-sex partner, marries and raises kinds in responsibility, as many already do successfully. As a Deist I send you a lot human love :)

[@djrenault]

I was involved in P2C for a few years. Not heavily, had some friends on staff, but my role was just AV stuff at a couple conferences a year. Being the Canadian arm of Cru, they've been going down the same path, and it got to the point that last fall I had to tell them, sorry, no, I can't help with this conference. One of the weirder things they got into was "land acknowledgements" - "we acknowledge that this is traditional unceded [first nations group] territory". Well, give it back or shut up. We're in the subbasement of a massive hotel in downtown Toronto. They probably don't want it back like this. And probably more than 70% of the attendees have less than 50 years of ancestry in Canada, so their ancestors had nothing to do with how things got like this anyway.

[@hephep7426]

Lol, I am non indegenous and have lived on reserve for the last 30 years. I totally agree with you regarding land acknowledgements! It's like saying , "yeah, we're on your land, na na na na na , not giving it back." Also So sad as to the lies being sold to young people while compromising God's word.

[@erinrae5119]

I don't know why more people don't talk about Rebecca McLaughlin and all the off things she says. Women take her as an authority on the Bible in the church and it should not be so. What she says muddies the waters at best, not helpful. She uses her same-sex attraction schtick to get platformed. There has been no repentance on her part that I have seen.

[@MrWholphin]

Behind all of this obfuscation is love for the world, over love for the word

[@conceptualclarity]

"Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires"--Cru and all of Side B are at odds with Galatians 5:24.

[@rinihogewoning6528]

Preston Sprinkle says "I thought the church was a hospital for sinners". There it is, the seeker sensitive church definition of what "church" is. Sprinkle doesn't know the Biblical definition of what the church is.

[@JRRodriguez-nu7po]

The Church is a hospital. As a physician any patient refusing treatment and insisting they are not sick is kicked out. Repentance always proceeds salvation. As a glutton I don't normalize my sin.

[@rinihogewoning6528]

@@JRRodriguez-nu7po A hospital for who? Redeemed sinners? Or for lost sinners in rebellion against God and who aren't seeking God?

[@JRRodriguez-nu7po]

@@rinihogewoning6528 Exactly my point, the Church is for those who are NOT proud nor try to normalize, redefine or in any other way minimize their sin. It is NOT for the Pride people or the Body Positivity crowd. It is for the humble beggar that has nowhere else to go, like me. On occasion I have a new patient who starts off how they want "natural" or "holistic" medicine (I'm a former professor of medicine and biochemistry and have yet to see a tree that puts out pill bottles so, no, none of that is natural and neither is your haircut, clothing...), or they are self diagnosed or want a specific treatment. I listen and then explain where I might or not agree with them; but that I am not here to affirm their errors. If they don't like that, goodbye, find someone else to tickle your ears. My point is not to convince you that holistic medicine is garbage (it is) but that if you come to me for healing; I will listen but then I decide. I am not your rubber stamp and I am not here to make you feel comfortable. If in the hospital, a patient refusing treatment gets discharged (excommunicated basically) and given 60 days to repent or find someone else. There's legal forms for all this. In this way the Church is a hospital. While it is true that neither pastors nor physicians are infallible, and are in fact patients themselves, their job is to decide and administer treatment for illness/sin and NOT to change the textbook to fit the patient. Unfortunately, I abide by an old time kind of authoritarian medical view of things which has been rejected by the current crop of Didn't Earn It (DEI).

[@tanyafromjefferson5484]

Guys like Preston Sprinkle all have that same cadence when they speak. I can hardly listen to him.

[@robertdagit4315]

I had to skip by after listening for a couple minutes

[@billybob-wx2re]

it's so fake and gay

[@westyso.cal.8842]

Effeminate, weak “men” are actually quite concerning. I cannot trust them.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

It's so "Beta," and I rarely use that word.

[@peregrino9154]

Andy Stanley has that cadence.

[@loiscarteaux9389]

Just listened to Jonathan Edward's sermon Sinners in the hands of an Angry God. God used this to start the Great Awakening. Everyone should listened to this. We need bold preachers who are not afraid to teach the whole council of the Word of God.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

First Great Awakening was okay. All the other ones were crap. Net-negatives for Christendom.

[@loiscarteaux9389]

@@MeanBeanComedy yes that one was a work of the Holy Spirit. Many others were counterfeits.

[@billybob-wx2re]

brother, this is so hard to watch. i don't know if i'm gonna make it i'm not even joking when i say i may just take your word for it

[@RaptureReadyPam]

Thank you! Definitely sharing this🙏🏽

[@leeshadrick3155]

Thank you for going through all of this!

[@elijahgrajkowski2505]

It works both ways with men: some men are great at sports and others aren’t-those that aren’t should be willing to learn. There are other men that aren’t strong musicians or singers, but should be willing to learn and be taught (we are commanded to sing in the Scriptures).

[@MeanBeanComedy]

Bingo. Men know this, though. Guys like that Cru "man" just pretend that it's not to build up a straw man.

[@perrycunningham1475]

Jon, thanks so much for this eye-opening podcast. Forgive me if this has been brought up before, but don't you think that Arminianism is one of the roots of the rotting tree? I know that soteriology differs among brothers and sisters, and I'm OK with that. But--the idea is prominent in CRU's presuppositions, i.e., that it is possible to convert someone by seeking not to offend. I believe that the Holy Spirit, at a time predestined, will regenerate a person so that he is able to repent and believe. This means that the Gospel seeks out the Elect, and we therefore give the Gospel "straight," without equivocation and without apology; we believe in its power to save. CRU and the mega-churches seem to dismiss the power of the Spirit and the Gospel to save those who have been predestined to salvation. They believe that a Christian has to "love" someone and convince them of the truth, so they put on virtual show-productions to draw people in. They then fail to talk about sin and repentance, because that would "turn people off." CRU is doing the same thing as the mega-churches, and for the same reason: their soteriology is wrong.

[@rinihogewoning6528]

Jon, I believe you nailed a big part of the problem in the question you posed at 1:18:00.

[@westyso.cal.8842]

Jon, Thank you so much brother for taking on this project. We are so grateful for young men such as yourself who have the courage to take the time to do the research and then call out the bad theology and false teaching. You and I have discussed just how far and wide the path of destruction is that Preston Sprinkle has brought into the church, and I am grateful that you are exposing the deeds of darkness. Keep the faith, fight the good fight, and come back to Boise and visit us again soon.

[@ruthdella37]

Suicide from shame of being homosexual sounds like the suicide of shame Judas did. Have Christians heard of the Preservation of the Saints? “All that the Father gave to me I will never cast out.” The Reformed doctrines, confessions and creeds are SO IMPORTANT, yet most evangelicals don’t know the doctrines, confessions and creeds that the early church gave us as a gift! I know I never heard of them growing up in the Baptist church.

[@20july1944]

Do you hope Judas is in heaven? I do, he really was instantly sorry/regretful/ashamed of what he did.

[@josevelarde4525]

​@@20july1944Judas is definitely not in heaven. See John 17:12 and Acts 1:18-20.

[@20july1944]

@@josevelarde4525 Does that make you happy. Jose?

[@loiscarteaux9389]

​@@20july1944he's not he expressed remorse not repentance. Peter teaches us what biblical repentance looks like.

[@20july1944]

@@loiscarteaux9389 He obviously had remorse, but tell me what you mean by repentance.

[@alic2462]

Former staff here, left in 2020. Definitely agree on the repentance bit at the very beginning. In fact I believe this is one of the key pieces to the issues within Cru. In my time with the company I rarely if ever experienced regional or national leadership repent or apologize for literally anything. Lots of excuses were made instead of actual repentance and asking for forgiveness. It’s depressing. I’m grateful that my relationship with Cru ended naturally (upon marrying someone who wasn’t on staff & moving away from the campus) before I would have been forced out due to ethical reasons!

[@betty8173]

Wow, so many given over to their delusion. We need God. Thank you, Jon, for wading through all this!

[@jackuber7358]

It is truly striking how the evil mindset epitomized by the likes of Finney have so infected the minds of people that it is assumed that one must use subterfuge to "attrack" people to Christ (e.g., go play sports to the do the whole bait and switch (i.e., mislead, lie), all "for Christ." No, God's way is clear, preach the Gospel, with clarity and love, and then preach it again, and again, and again until the Holy Spirit takes hold of them.

[@PastorJerett]

Roman 12:2 And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, so that you may approve what the will of God is, that which is good and pleasing and perfect. 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

[@Mommybecca9804]

Love that part...(1 Cor. 6:11a) "Such WERE some of you..." ☝️❤️🙌 SDG

[@Tom-bz6fg]

Preston Sprinkles = Snake in the garden

[@noelgibson4274]

1:23:07 I agree so much! "Political homelessness" shifts people to The Left. I happened to me when my former pastor taught about cultural issues in this way.

[@JRRodriguez-nu7po]

Deborah did NOT lead Israel! It was Barak that led Israel and the armies. Because Barak ordered a woman to come with him to war he lost his honor. Still, in Hebrew 11 is is Barak, not Deborah, that's mentioned.

[@TimMiller-n7k]

Who funds these guys? Important question.

[@gentledove6804]

This also goes to philosophy of missions-will it be biblical or from the imaginations of men (mankind)?

[@edeancozzens3833]

From what I know, the Navigators has always been more focused on the memorization and study of the Word of God. That tends to hold things more solid.

[@anitasmith203]

Forget man's 'language', let's promote the truth of God's language, His holy word which declares sin and some sins are declared abominations. Truth spoken is real love given, acceptance is not loving, but an actual writing off of the one unwilling to repent and turn to Christ, the Way.

[@twig1960]

Where is Shelby Abbot in all of this?

[@jaredwilliams1031]

This issue isn't going to dissipate anytime in the near future. There won't be some 'final word on the matter' made by Doug Wilson or some popular conservative youtuber that then causes the 'infiltration' to end, and all of the LGBTQ and LGBTQ-affirming people in the Church to just remove themselves from whatever Protestant Denomination they are now a part of. The continued revisiting of the subject on channels like these is especially fascinating; given that individuals like Jon feel their own smaller, individual Church communities are taking a satisfying stance on the subject, what would be the purpose of pronouncements on the 'Biblical' way to handle individuals struggling with LGBTQ issues? Is he not aware there are significant theological differences between denominations that have remained unresolved for quite some time? Does he feel he has authority to bind the decisions of Church communities beyond his own? It seems more like a kind of saber-rattling or 'preaching to the choir.'

[@longstreet2740]

Got married at age 53, now 65 in failing health. I got too obsessed with dating in my early teens, but wasn't much of a ladies man, which did cause bitterness against GOD. As trials and torments took a toll on my life, I resigned to focus on Salvation in Christ, and waiting for Rapture. The few service options open to me are Praying for others, attending Church ( KJV Faith Alone Eternal Security Church with a leaning towards late Peter Ruckman ) , and tracts distribution. Cru along with ever increasing trend in Evangelical Churches lose their affection for Heavenly things ( Col 3:1-3) Both wife and I have health issues. She Arthritis, Me Neuropathy. Wifes beloved sister recently went home to be with the LORD.

[@rdestree]

These folks are not a “people group.” To say they are is blasphemy because God makes all people groups for His glory (Acts 17:26; Revelation 5:9). Rebellion can never bring Him honor except by its repentance or eternal destruction (1 Corinthians 6:9-11).

[@MeanBeanComedy]

That's not blasphemy. They're not claiming to be a Nation. Even if they were, that's not blasphemy.

[@jankragt7789]

Well done. Excellent work. .

[@RaptureReadyPam]

I posted your video to Preston’s response video to Rosaria, Alisa and Yuan. I had about 6 people challenge me, so I gave them each your link. All were deleted. So, I posted your link again to all six people a few days later in addition to a short response. All were deleted again. I guess Preston doesn’t want his followers seeing your video.

[@anneduncanweaver6989]

Where would I find Preston’s response video to Rosaria B., Alisa and Yuan? Thank you!

[@MikeSchatzman-d6n]

I recommend you go to the Theology in the Raw podcast and find it there. While there look at Preston Sprinkle’s August 5th interview with Rebecca McLaughlin. After doing so you will find that Jon Harris grossly misrepresented Sprinkle and McLaughlin. ​@@anneduncanweaver6989

[@MikeSchatzman-d6n]

I posted a link to Preston Sprinkle’s August 5th interview with Rebecca McLaughlin in the comments here and Jon Harris deleted it. Pretty sure Harris doesn’t want people knowing how badly he misrepresented Sprinkle and McLaughlin.

[@hephep7426]

She criticized the church for focusing on marriage when marriage is God's most clear example of showing us what out relationship with God is like. Even to the point that God is the groom and we are the Bride. Also, When interpreting what the writers of scripture meant, if you have to use the words ,"per se" youre gonna get it wrong !

[@hokieham]

Sprinkle reminds me of Matt Chandler in his style………which makes me want to skip past his bilge……

[@ronbrubaker8855]

I noticed this as well.

[@anastasiaburr3959]

He is deceived and deceiving! CRU SHOULD REPENT! They should fast and pray to overcome their sinful desires rather than making those people feel comfortable!

[@ReformedRedpill]

My experience with cru is that they have no understanding of indwelling sin, concupesence, mortification, vivification, confession, or repentance. Their entire understanding of repentance is basically just tattling. Theres no righting your wrongs. Theres no asking others for forgiveness. Theres no walking things back.

[@Ransetsu]

Bill doesn't know what he's talking about. That was crazy.

[@PaulWestonEden]

I'm disturbed by the Christian normalization of sin. "Get the Bible right but get love wrong" comes right out of Rob Bell's progressive ideas in "Love Wins". So the Author of the Bible truly isn't the definitive definition of love, according to Cru.

[@davilito32]

All I hear from this people is we don't care about what the Bible says, just love, like the fact that JesusChrist spoke about hell and repentance alot. They forgot about what the old testament says about this kind of love, GOD call it an abomination, that's good enough for me. With out repentance, people won't carry their cross and follow JesusChrist, they won't deny them selfs; repent and sin no more, what else is needed. We all have sin and fall short of his glory. Pray without ceasing.

[@anastasiaburr3959]

They can fantasize though and practice in their minds! Must read the sermon on the mountain of Jesus!

[@sethevans1506]

I guarantee that if Kevin’s dad would have taught him to throw a ball (of any shape), he wouldn’t be in this video

[@chrislutz416]

Some guys just are not good at sports. I wasn't. Luckily the my guy friends in the church were more than willing to put up with my ineptness.

[@sethevans1506]

@@chrislutz416 you don’t have to be good at sports to be able to throw something with a small amount of accuracy and precision. But I’m glad for your brothers when you were younger

[@hokieham]

It’s a micro aggression to throw a ball……..unbelievable……but not……

[@rkstanton3244]

This is very upsetting..... 😒

[@billybob-wx2re]

@13:53 when he said lgbt folks have high rates of victimization, i was immediately ready to agree but i did not expect him to say that they were the real victims

[@teresaradsick7314]

LGBTQMYNAMEISLEGION

[@mattelfstrom9506]

The bible uses the term culture and manners as the way of immoral life the nations around Israel was not to adopt. Statutes they implemented which were contrary to God. I believe we need to distinguish between geographical culture and moral culture. We never allow contrary immoral statutes(culture). I will change my mind if you can help me find another word the translators should have used than culture and manners. HELP

[@edeancozzens3833]

A spoof parody on the whole thing: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qqq7fX98YrFrlZI

[@chrism.1421]

20:32 oh boy, here I go again. Genesis 25:1,5-6 "Abraham had taken another wife, whose name was Keturah... ...Abraham left everything he owned to Isaac. But while he was still living, he gave gifts to the sons of his concubines and sent them away from his son Isaac to the land of the east." - Genesis 26:1-5 "The Lord appeared to Isaac and said, 'Do not go down to Egypt; live in the land where I tell you to live. Stay in this land for a while, and I will be with you and will bless you. For to you and your descendants I will give all these lands and will confirm the oath I swore to your father Abraham. I will make your descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and will give them all these lands, and through your offspring all nations on earth will be blessed, because Abraham obeyed me and did everything I required of him, keeping my commands, my decrees and my instructions.'" 2 Samuel 12:7-8 "...This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: ‘I anointed you king over Israel, and I delivered you from the hand of Saul. I gave your master’s house to you, and your master’s wives into your arms. I gave you all Israel and Judah. And if all this had been too little, I would have given you even more." Jeremiah 3:6-10 "During the reign of King Josiah, the Lord said to me, “Have you seen what faithless Israel has done? She has gone up on every high hill and under every spreading tree and has committed adultery there. I thought that after she had done all this she would return to me but she did not, and her unfaithful sister Judah saw it. I gave faithless Israel her certificate of divorce and sent her away because of all her adulteries. Yet I saw that her unfaithful sister Judah had no fear; she also went out and committed adultery. Because Israel’s immorality mattered so little to her, she defiled the land and committed adultery with stone and wood. In spite of all this, her unfaithful sister Judah did not return to me with all her heart, but only in pretense,” declares the Lord." (the Lord gives an analogy in which he is a polygynist) Isaiah 4:1-2 "In that day seven women will take hold of one man and say, “We will eat our own food and provide our own clothes; only let us be called by your name. Take away our disgrace!”. In that day the Branch of the Lord will be beautiful and glorious, and the fruit of the land will be the pride and glory of the survivors in Israel." (this is future prophecy) Isn't it time you believed in the word of the Lord? What cause do you have to believe that polygyny has always been wrong, or that it's time has passed? Does the weight of 2000 years of Christian teaching mean more to you than the actual word of God?

[@rebeccalindley153]

Do modern Jews believe in polygamy?

[@chrism.1421]

@@rebeccalindley153 Not something I've ever cared to check, and still don't.

[@rebeccalindley153]

@@chrism.1421 Neither Jews nor Christians at the time of Christ or today practice polygamy. And, Protestant scholars have written about it, and have rejected it. Some Protestant churches, some of the same ones for the most part which have accepted homosexuality, now say in certain circumstances in Africa and Asia, that polygamy should be accepted. Is that your stance? The Bible says marriage is between one man and one woman. And the people in the OT did all sorts of things which we don't do today.

[@chrism.1421]

​@@rebeccalindley153 The bible does not say that marriage is one man and one woman. A man and a woman are to join together in marriage to be one flesh, like the torso and the arm are one flesh - and you might notice that we have two arms. This analogy in no way declares that only one wife is acceptable. Paul's advice to church overseers was given "to be above reproach" (speaking of their fellow men), and was given to a people in monogamous Greece in the empire of monogamous Rome. Do you have another passage you would like to quote, and can it stand against the ones I quoted? We do not have evidence that polygyny was not practiced in the time of Jesus. We do know that it is not spoken of in our records. We also know that the Jews of the time were under the influence of the pagan monogamous empire of Rome (and declared that only Caesar is their king) and had come out of the pagan monogamous empire of FUCKING BABYLON. Yes, THAT Babylon held to a standard of monogamy. Neither the standards of these two pagan empires, nor the standards of the Jews of the time of Jesus are endorsements of behavior for anyone with good sense. And if you are going to claim that "the people in the OT did all sorts of things" in an effort to disparage polygyny then you are blind to the passages I quoted. "...because Abraham obeyed me and did everything I required of him, keeping my commands, my decrees and my instructions." This was said of him with three wives and unnumbered concubines. (despite my best efforts, I still don't know what a concubine is. The common conception seems to be that it is little more than a term of disparagement - to designate one as less loved or respected, which makes no sense. The three actual possibilities I'm aware of are that it refers to either foreign wives, or slaves, or especially young (in relation to their husband) wives) And why should I care what some protestant scholars say? Once again - am I to hold to the traditions of men, or of God? And yes, the traditions of protestants are the traditions of men, unless I can find explicit evidence otherwise.

[@rebeccalindley153]

@@chrism.1421 All the historians and Bible scholars disagree with you. So, you must be the one reading into the Bible what is not there.

[@mariannerethwisch6816]

He calls them people group, which it definitely isn't. It's not sin to be a people group, but to be LGBTQ is sin.

[@mcfarvo]

If people group up or associate based upon some sin it is still a group of people, e.g. a criminal organization/syndicate/gang/conspiracy is a group of people, or a political movement of people that love infanticide/abortion, or sexual immorality/disorientation/LGBTQ+

[@dubyag4124]

This is absolutely horrific hopeless teaching from Sprinkle.

[@Pro-j4q]

The only good thing about this Christian and Muslim nonsense about homosexuality is: This man-made religions will disappear one day with those who believe in it. Homosexuals then will still go on existing. I wish to every homosexual, that he/she finds a loving same-sex partner, marries and raises kinds in responsibility, as many already do successfully. As a Deist I send you a lot human love :)

[@tanyafromjefferson5484]

Still love that guitar intro!

[@Yesica1993]

It's the best!

[@gentledove6804]

💯-great response video. Thanks!

[@bc5441]

Thank you for this, Jon! I can’t imagine what it must have been like to listen to six hours of this “training.” An important aspect of Cru’s organizational culture that underlies this, the earlier CRT controversy and the dismissal of staff such as the Mundells is an eleventh commandment of Cru that has existed for decades. Students and others who are involved in Cru ministries but especially staff do not have the freedom to ever question leadership. This is built on a foundation of God’s sovereignty in assembling a staff team and His placing leaders over each one of us, but it is extended to a point of making the raising of a question or an objection objectionable. It overlooks the potential for leaders to fail and when many in leadership are actually quite young (the 30- or 40-year staff member is the exception), it contributes to potential disaster.

[@conceptualclarity]

Sounds like it's essentially an authoritarian organization

[@hephep7426]

Not able to question the leadership is the foundation of a cult.😢

[@dabhidhm4093]

Preston Sprinkle's diatribe on "stereotypes" is ridiculously childish. The Bible is in a large part the record of some things that actually happened, not a prescriptive handbook for every situation. If you want prescriptive lessons, read Proverbs or the Epistles. Also, the idea that it's somehow "non-masculine" for Jesus to cry or to express his longing to gather the children of Israel together like chicks to a hen is just asinine. People on the "progressive" side act like it's still the 1950's and all our ideas about masculinity and femininity come from Gunsmoke. These people couldn't nuance their way out of a paper bag. Their exegesis and philosophical reasoning ability is on the level of a simpleton, but it's really all about a directed agenda. It's not that they're actually stupid, it's that they are dishonest and they want you to believe that every traditional value is a lie.

[@josevelarde4525]

I was just pointing out what Scripture says, since it is clear. Do I wish Judas had repented? Yes. But he did not. And God knew he would not.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

"These stereotypes come from our culture, not the Bible." ...yeah, our *Christian* Culture.

[@paulajames6149]

Long video but some great points. Just from their videos the language and complaints says it all. They did make Christians the enemy. People’s experiences seems to be more elevated than it should be. Experiences are valid but we should never build a theology around it. Sad.

[@mrappe51]

How would Mr Sprinkle handle this verse 1Co 5:11 But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler-not even to eat with such a one.

[@susanstuart2718]

Peter tells us, 'the devil roams to find someone he can devour'. The place where Satan can find the most victims is on the slippery slope.

[@dabhidhm4093]

Smuggled into all this Cru stuff and other progressive evangelical attitudes toward SSA is the idea that there's really nothing wrong with sinful desires and only narrow-minded bigots think that there is, but this is really not true. Eph. 4.22-31 clearly teaches that we are not only to stop practicing sin, but also to put off the old self which is corrupted by deceitful desires. If the action is wrong, the desire is also wrong. To identify with sinful desires is simply a sign of being unregenerate. If one admits that the fulfillment of a desire is sinful, than to entertain the desire is also sinful. No one would listen a minute to a preacher who identified as a thief, a liar or an abuser and who tied his very identity to these desires. SSA is not some privileged category of sin whereby the desire is OK but the gratification of that desire is wrong. There's some serious cognitive dissonance going on with this issue and it's not healthy.

[@rebeccalindley153]

It seems the people in CRU need to read some books like Scott Lively's "The Pink Swastika," which tells the true story of homosexuals in Nazi Germany.

[@conceptualclarity]

I'm not in a position to buy books now. Could you tell us key findings of the book?

[@rebeccalindley153]

@@conceptualclarity This book is available to read for free on the net. Just use your search engine and put in "The Pink Swastika," by Scott Lively.

[@classicalguitarschool1326]

1:34 that which pertains to a man/woman?

[@sethevans1506]

What I took from this video… is that Preston Sprinkle is a really, really cool dude and he just gets it, you know?😌

[@westyso.cal.8842]

He’s far more concerned with being one of the “cool kids,” than being true to the Word of God.

[@davidpellegrini4266]

We are all born sinners with a sin nature. We inherit from Adam. In that sin nature is the potential for all sin. Sin nature loves to sin. We are slaves to our sin nature. Sin nature can' t be Redeemed it is our old man. We need a new nature and a new man. When we are born we are made in Gods image but we are lost sinners. We need to leave Adams family with our sin nature and become part of Gods family. To all who receive him Jesus he gave the right to become children of God. WE MUST repent of our sins turn from our sins , mortify the flesh. We then are born again , receive the holy spirit, with new desires and new nature. We have a new identity. We are not stuckcwith our old nature or idenity . The same sex attraction is part of our old sin nature. This is sin which God hates. If we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us of our sins and cleanse of all our unrighteous. Jesus will cleanse us and take away our evil desires. Jesus will set us totally free . Jesus said If I lust after a women I have comitted adultery in my heart . So if I lust after a man that is not sin and I don,t have have to repent. When we are born again we have a new nature and our idenity is Christs idenity . Are we saying Jesus has same sex attraction in his nature. That is blaspheny. Jesus is holy and righteous. Love does not rejoice in wrong doing. Jesus will set you free from same sex attraction. He wants to set you free. You must repent confess. If you don't 1:00:29 repent call it sin as Paul says in Romans . God hates sin. Jesus says it in Revelation spesking to the church. We are not loving people if we don't tell them the truth. God is not a respector of persons. We have to recon the old man dead and come alive in Christ. He is the potter we are the clay. He transforms us into the image of Christ. God hates the flesh . Wd have 3 enemies the world the devil and our flesh all sinfull desires. We must be perfect as our father in heaven is perfect. God only accepts perfection. Only in Christ are we perfect . He gives us the power to live for him. We don't have a licence to sin. God does not repect persons belief they are trans, their pronounds, . We are making ourselves idols.

[@jenniferrhoades8956]

It's bad enough to go through life with a new like Preston Sprinkle, but to be this ridiculous on top of it? How does one survive?

[@brooksweaver8005]

The most offensive thing may have been that AND guy wearing a Hitler-stache.

[@abcchristian5298]

good video! Important video! Going to share it on Facebook. God Bless!

[@paulajames6149]

Sprinkle says Christians are not known for our kindness. I wouldn’t say Jesus was known for his kindness either.

[@rnbham39]

Are you joking me? Jesus was absolutely known for His kindness. He had to ability to love and convict at the same time…this is what is couched in the hypostatical union…we as humans don’t have that ability. But no, you’re wrong and it’s a hill I’d die on! Jesus was kind like no other. Supernaturally kind and he was known for it.

[@joeyrose1245]

Do you know how “Family Life Ministries” (part of CRU) handles the gay, lesbian, and transgender lifestyles?

[@anneduncanweaver6989]

Wondering the same thing!

[@MikeSchatzman]

This is a total misrepresentation of the views of Cru, Preston Sprinkle and Rebecca McLaughlin. Take one hour and listen to Preston Sprinkle's interview of Rebecca McLaughlin on Theology in the Raw, August 5th, 2024 and then ask yourself if Jon Harris accurately portrays their views. Harris is guilty of out-and-out slander.