Cut-Rate Commander | Ahoy Mateys Precon Upgrade Guide

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Grazzet MTG

Grazzet MTG

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15K Giveaway - • Cut-Rate Commander | B...
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Cut-Rate Commander - Precon Upgrade Guide for the Ahoy Mateys Precon from Lost Caverns of Ixalan & its commander - Admiral Brass, Unsinkable . #mtg #edh #commander #mtgixalan #MTGLCI
Hey folks! Submitted for your approval, we have the 1st precon upgrade guide for Lost Caverns of Ixalan - this time covering the Ahoy Mateys Precon and its face commander - The Pirate Queen of Ixalan - Admiral Brass, Unsinkable.
In this precon upgrade, we'll be primarily focused of getting extra uses out of our commanders ability to reanimate our pirates as 4/4's by removing the pesky finality counter she brings them back with, allowing us to reanimate her crew over and over again if/when they're dealt with. As such, we'll be including a fresh wave of counter removing options to remove said counter while allowing the reanimated pirate keep its new 4/4 statblock, usually while netting us value in the processes. And then, to help refine the build just a bit, we'll be adding new priates to the build to help empower our hard cast and reanimated pirates even further, more ways to generate value off of our pirates and to get them into the bin to be reanimated, and, lastly, giving our landbase an overhaul with the now much cheaper slow lands and checklands to better fit with our aggressive playstyle - leaving us with an aggressive, hard hitting pirate crew worthy of the mightiest pirate to every sail the seas of Ixhalan.
Let me know if the comments below if you agree with my choices and/or what you would add to the deck instead. Also, be sure to stick around until the end to see how to enter the giveaway for your chance to win and how to unlock sweet upgrades for it too!
Decklist - archidekt.com/decks/5819531/a...
All art used is copyright of Wizards of the Coast
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CHAPTERS
00:00 - Introduction
01:06 - Commander & Playstyle
06:33 - Upgrades
16:05 - Breakdown
20:32 - Closing Thoughts

Пікірлер: 104
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Hey folks! Please see below for the full list of upgrade suggestion made in the video, check out the link in the description for the full decklist and link to the 15k Subscriber Giveaway (if you haven't signed up already) and let me know in the comments if you agree with my changes, disagree, and/or what changes you think I missed! --------------------------------- Remove Counters --------------------------------- Azure Fleet Admiral >>> Hex Parasite Daring Saboteur >>> Soul Diviner Blood Money >>> Hexavus Distant Melody >>> Fain, the Broker Evacuation >>> Goldberry, River-Daughter Commander's Sphere >>> Power Conduit Nephalia Drownyard >>> Nesting Grounds --------------------------------- Loot/Graveyard Setup --------------------------------- Arm-Mounted Anchor >>> Malcolm, Alluring Scoundrel King Narfi's Betrayal >>> Glint-Horn Buccaneer Windfall >>> Big Score Port of Karfell >>> Unexpected Windfall --------------------------------- Pirates --------------------------------- Don Andres, the Renegade >>> Captain Vargus Wrath Captivating Crew >>> Dire Fleet Neckbreaker Fathom Fleet Captain >>> Forerunner of the Coalition Dire Fleet Ravager >>> Kitesail Larcenist Captain Lannery Storm >>> Breeches, Eager Pillager --------------------------------- Pirates Matter --------------------------------- Pitiless Plunderer >>> Kindred Discovery --------------------------------- Land Overhaul --------------------------------- Thriving Bluff >>> Stormcarved Coast Thriving Isle >>> Shipwreck Marsh Thriving Moor >>> Haunted Ridge Evolving Wilds >>> Dragonskull Summit Terramorphic Expanse >>> Drowned Catacomb --------------------------------- Additional Upgrades --------------------------------- Ghost of Ramirez DePietro >>> Pirated Copy Blasphemous Act >>> Raise the Palisade Icon of Ancestry >>> Coat of Arms Spectral Sailor >>> Ragavan, Nimble Pilferer Enterprising Scallywag >>> Dockside Extortionist
@thebookscollective8543
@thebookscollective8543 8 ай бұрын
Honestly, this is one of the most comprehensive upgrade videos I’ve seen 👌🏼
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad to hear it! I generally want to folks to understand in depth why I make the changes I make, so I'm happy that folks appreciate that!
@lorenzorossatti5918
@lorenzorossatti5918 7 ай бұрын
Found a new subscriber today! Amazing job, also it's a pleasure to learn more about the lore of the game in such an interactive way. Keep it up!!!
@TheRaptorJohnny
@TheRaptorJohnny 8 ай бұрын
This formatting is awesome, and I appreciate the work you put into this. You still cover the reasons why the cuts and go in-depth on why the inclusions were chosen. Amazing work on a fast upload! I'm excitedly waiting on when you cover the dinosaur Precon, myself. 😄
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad to hear you enjoyed it and thanks for the feedback. Dino's are coming up after vampires - so stay tuned, because that build is arguable the strongest out of all the ones of tested so far.
@fulgerion
@fulgerion 8 ай бұрын
They didn't format the list of cuts. It's a good format otherwise
@pirachist551
@pirachist551 8 ай бұрын
So looking forward to getting my hands on the precon. Fantastic upgrade suggestions!
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad you think so and best of luck to you when you do get it!
@ObieNet04
@ObieNet04 2 ай бұрын
Thank you for this analysis! I was trying to find ways to remove counters outside of power conduit. Video was detailed and organized.
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 2 ай бұрын
Glad it was helpful!
@Maecii
@Maecii 8 ай бұрын
I really like the pirate tribal and the idea of changing a downside with finality counter to a upside due to the right choice of cards and work around. But...... This deck won my heart with the second commander Don Andres. I hope you have the time to build around Don Andres with a grixis thievery theme. :D....As usual nice work, keep your pace, stay healthy. much love
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Fair enough - Don Andres is indeed a fantastic build around and I would love to take a crack at building a deck with him at the helm - so expect to see him in an upcoming poll once the precon upgrades are completed!
@piotraugustyniak6591
@piotraugustyniak6591 8 ай бұрын
You can add spell from merefolk deck, what phase out creatures with counters for protection.
@connorbax7767
@connorbax7767 8 ай бұрын
Don Andres is going in a soon-to-be built Evelyn the covetous. I think its a neat boost to the deck. Evelyn does the theft part very well, and the potential treasure generation is a nice feeder for more spells.
@4oWhat
@4oWhat 8 ай бұрын
Definitely this format is completely fine for precon upgrades, you still went though the strategy and how the cards work within the deck. Can’t wait to try out the new pirates, hopefully some theft will still remain a part of the pirate theme looking forward for that secondary commander as an option too. Thanks for the fast upload on the new video!
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad you enjoyed it and thanks for the feedback on the new format!
@chetasaur
@chetasaur 8 ай бұрын
i love this series, i cant wait to see your take on the merfolk precon! merfolk have been one of my fav creature types sense original Ixalan block standard so i cant wait to get the precon and start making upgrades for it!
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad to hear you enjoy it! Merfolk are actually going to be the last of the 4 precons I'll be covering (due to the order in which they were spoiled) but they should be out by 11/18, so hopefully the wait won't be too long.
@nathaniellee6934
@nathaniellee6934 8 ай бұрын
Awesome work on this list I never considered the amount of effects in grixis that remove counters to maintain value from the reanimation. Looking forward to the next video, also I really enjoy the new format for the videos making them more streamlined. Keep up the fantastic work.
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad to hear you enjoyed it and thanks for the feedback on the new format!
@stebann5350
@stebann5350 8 ай бұрын
Dude you're one of the best MTG upgrader deck haha, your videos ar alaways so cool and usefull to watch and you're rlly fast, like ty Grazzet !!
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Thanks for the kind words and happy to hear that you enjoy the content!
@CaptainZone1337
@CaptainZone1337 8 ай бұрын
Arrr! Awesome as always Grazzet!
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad you like it!
@Ironaho
@Ironaho 7 ай бұрын
Looks like 2 pirate commanders I’ll be making! This and Don Andres. Love my pirates
@PierruMirmo
@PierruMirmo 8 ай бұрын
Awesome content! I'm a new subscriber and I find your channel very helpful. Keep it up! Looking forward to more of this.🙏
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Thanks for subscribing and glad to hear you enjoy the content!
@4oWhat
@4oWhat 8 ай бұрын
Wow didn’t expect this out so early!
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
I am to please! But seriously, I've been working on these since the full lists dropped, so I'm hoping to knock all of them out within 2 weeks to get back to our regular deckbuilds.
@codumus
@codumus 4 ай бұрын
After a decade long exodus I have just gotten back in with this deck. I picked it because of the pirate theme and after playing a handful of games ive come to love the pirate theme. No wanting to mess with the deck a bit, this video is super helpful at providing a place to start. I dont know if its just the NZ tax, but the cost of all the upgrades is significantly more expensive atm. But i picked up most of them for the budget. Thanks for the great vid! subbed
@eltrollex5687
@eltrollex5687 8 ай бұрын
Amazing video as always
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Happy to hear you think so!
@Lyzarion
@Lyzarion 8 ай бұрын
As someone who tries to get into magic from yugioh, i think your channel is one of the best for deck profiles for commander. Idk if i am blind but i barely find any deck profiles for commander here in yt. If I find one then they include like one of the most expensive cards and their deck breakdown isn't like yours. Your videos are great, you try to keep the cost down and you still find good upgrades or sidegrades for the decks, which is really good for beginners.
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad to hear that you enjoy that content and thanks for the feedback. As a previous YGO player myself, I'm happy to hear that these video's are easy to follow for folks coming over from it to follow, even if they're relatively new to magic.
@jeremiahjones9940
@jeremiahjones9940 8 ай бұрын
The quicker precon upgrades are nice. Longer videos are more suitable for custom builds. Thanks Graz 👍
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Thanks for the feedback! Much appreciated!
@barrysetser3909
@barrysetser3909 8 ай бұрын
Nice; the new format works well
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad you like it and thanks for the feedback!
@jacks7991
@jacks7991 8 ай бұрын
Stellar video man
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad you enjoyed it!
@MidgarMerc
@MidgarMerc 7 ай бұрын
I had decided to avoid precons til the Fallout set but this video is definitely tempting me
@4oWhat
@4oWhat 8 ай бұрын
if there is voting for future commanders I would love a Don Andres, the Renegade build!
@Emalculator1
@Emalculator1 8 ай бұрын
I would love to see you make a commander deck with Admiral Beckett Brass. Her playstyle is so different and interesting from this commander despite being the same person. Awesome video
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad you enjoyed it! Sadly, between the precons, my backlog of poll winning commanders, and now having to edit the video's myself - I simply don't have the time to tackle older commanders. Still, if enough folks request it, I may throw in some "retro" polls to make builds with older commander reprinted in precons / the main set to make builds with them.
@alexyuvia
@alexyuvia 8 ай бұрын
Great video!!
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad you enjoyed it
@ufojoedude
@ufojoedude 8 ай бұрын
Pretty cool. Was looking forward to the closer look at this commander. Even if it was cut, Don Andres actually looks kind of interesting as well. Shame it creates tapped treasures, but it still could be a neat card to experiment with.
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad to hear you enjoyed it. Sadly Don Andres did get the axe here, but only because he deserves to have a build of his own (and this build lacked enough theft effects to make him reliable) - so expect him to be on an upcoming poll to get his own build coming soon!
@Polemion
@Polemion 8 ай бұрын
Really good upgrades! I copy your Decklist add more ships such as The Belligerent, Subterranean Schooner and Magmatic Galleon and will have hopefully a wounderful pirate adventure. :)
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Can't argue with that logic! Every pirate crew needs a ship after all!
@Millus1987
@Millus1987 6 ай бұрын
Siren's Ruse looks like an interesting card to add, it protects our pirates from targeted removal, reuses ETBs, and "removes" finality counters
@UgoneTheBest
@UgoneTheBest 8 ай бұрын
Thank you so much for this video! I dunno if I should pick this precon up or not, it seems way behind the other 3 and it's like the pirate tribe isnt really "glued" together
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
No problem! I can see the argument to skip this one if your strictly interested in tribal synergies - since vamps and dinos have a LOT of self synergy and merfolks arguable have one of the most self synergistic tribes (next to elves) - though I would say that power level wise this one fall in line closer to the vampires deck, but behind dino's and merfolk out of the box.
@burningprodigy
@burningprodigy 8 ай бұрын
merfolks next pls
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Sadly they are going to be last - since they were the last deck to deck spoiled and I am tackling these in the order that they dropped. That said, if everything goes according to plan, they should drop by 11/18, so hopefully it won't be too much of a wait.
@kismet8010
@kismet8010 8 ай бұрын
​@@GrazzetMTG;_;
@xr9790
@xr9790 8 ай бұрын
@@GrazzetMTGWhat’s the next deck then?
@sero271
@sero271 8 ай бұрын
im just getting into magic and edh, and had no idea you can remove fatality counters, thats so sick
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad to hear I brought this fact to your attention - especially since this set has multiple sources of them and we can expect to see them in both standard and commander moving forward.
@stevebell7273
@stevebell7273 8 ай бұрын
Let’s go Dinosaurs 🦖 on the next one!
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Not next but they are after vampires, so stay tuned!
@HalcyonAcorn
@HalcyonAcorn 8 ай бұрын
Wow!! Getting ahead of the game, we’re going to have to call you Teferi!
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
I may not have time magic, but I may as well when it comes to deckbuilding!
@piotraugustyniak6591
@piotraugustyniak6591 8 ай бұрын
Great video.
@piotraugustyniak6591
@piotraugustyniak6591 8 ай бұрын
I would add Identity Theft. No pirate but helps with remove counters and gives extra enter battlefield trigger after exiled creature return.
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad you enjoyed it
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Good suggestion! Identity Thief works nicely to retrigger our pirates ETB effect for extra value while removing the finality counter from them, so I can see it being included if we don't mind having said pirate lose its 4/4 statblock.
@piotraugustyniak6591
@piotraugustyniak6591 8 ай бұрын
@@GrazzetMTG great you like IT. IT works in my first ixalan set pirate tribal. I will also add military intelingens- if you attack with two or more creatures draw a card. Very good cheap enchanment for aggro deck. IT works well in my rouge tribal precon deck.
@piotraugustyniak6591
@piotraugustyniak6591 8 ай бұрын
@@GrazzetMTG IT is better to lose 4/4 stack instead your card go to exile.You can always reanimate again.
@kylebene4749
@kylebene4749 8 ай бұрын
I have to be truely careful watching these or my over sized collection continues to grow
@michasolowski7630
@michasolowski7630 8 ай бұрын
Great video! What is your fav precon deck from these 4?
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad you enjoyed it! Honestly, of the ones I've built and tested so far, it would have to be Dino's. The value and board presence they can generate is insane and, at the end of the day, I enjoy the simple pleasures of dropping gigantic creatures on the board.
@ProtoSkullX1
@ProtoSkullX1 8 ай бұрын
Can’t wait for dinos!! Is it next
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Dinos coming up after vampires, so expect them to drop next week.
@OrochiBorgieman
@OrochiBorgieman 8 ай бұрын
It's a nice build, but I might buy the precon for the alternate commander Don Andreas and build around him.
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
I really wouldn't blame you - Don Andres, the Renegade is a fantastic build around that I wouldn't mind tackling myself!
@saiyaboy85
@saiyaboy85 8 ай бұрын
I really like the upgrades, but the only issue I got is the lack of cards that can protect our commander. Since the build is heavily focused on her, and got a mid size CMC, a couple of removals can ruin the whole gameplan, once the table realises this weekpoint. Even some counterspells and/or equipments that give protection to Brass would help a lot in my opinion.
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Fair enough. You not wrong regarding it being very annoying for us to lose our commander but, at the same time, in my experience, Brass isn't generally going to be the biggest threat at the table and will usually be removed incidentally due to wipes rather than being picked off herself (unless we're ahead of course, but then we may have reanimated pirates in play that may be more immediate threats than here). Still, if your table is keep on picking off commanders, slotting in boots, greaves, and/or even a counterspell or 2 would do no harm in helping us keep Brass alive.
@masterhedgemon5381
@masterhedgemon5381 8 ай бұрын
Huh didn't expect It that fast tbh, Dino's, vampires or merfolk next ?
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Yep, been working on these as soon as they dropped to try and get them our ASAP (so we can get back to regular builds)! The plan now is vampires next, then dinos, and merfolk last - but they'll all be dropping within the next 2 weeks so hopefully there won't be too much delay between them!
@masterhedgemon5381
@masterhedgemon5381 8 ай бұрын
@@GrazzetMTG personally I got all of them besides ahoy mateys cause I'm not the biggest pirate fan, but generally I see big potential in playing elenda the dusk rose as your commander instead of clavileno, she seems awfully solid
@lancekidder9011
@lancekidder9011 6 ай бұрын
Can someone explain to me why removing the finality counter? Let's keep the upgraded stat total. I thought it's the finality character that gives at base 44
@fredwedvaldes2720
@fredwedvaldes2720 8 ай бұрын
Please Mur folk next.
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Yeah, sorry but the fish are actually the last on release schedule this time around - expect to see them on 11/18 after Vampires (up next) and Dinos (after vamps).
@stefanschmid1357
@stefanschmid1357 8 ай бұрын
There is one thing i want to say: when it is fact that many many cards tells you: When.. Whenever...At... (Triggered Abilitys) and also Admiral Brass says that.... GO FOR STRIONIC RESONATOR.
@soyhurok3050
@soyhurok3050 5 ай бұрын
Hi mate, can we have one for Don Andres the Renegade?
@dachivale5319
@dachivale5319 8 ай бұрын
A question, sorry if I am asking you. But I am kind of confused about Admiral Brass herself. She reanimates a pirate as a 4/4 with haste and a finality counter. I figured you have to sacrifice the creature she reanimates at end of turn. The card however doesn't say this anywhere? A finality counter also doesn't make you sacrifice it as far as I have found. So do the creatures she returns stay in play? Sorry maybe a bit off-topic, but figured you would know. I rather be certain before I have this wrong. Thanks in advance if you would answer and also thanks for the guide, you actually opened my eyes to some cards I had long forgotten like Power Conduit. :D
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Good question! You actually do not have to sac the pirate she reanimates (you may be thinking of unearth, which is a different mechanic). They stick around like any other permanently reanimated creature, with the caveat that, the next time they would die, they get exiled instead. So, TLDR, they stay permanently until killed again, and are THEN exiled. Hope that helps!
@dachivale5319
@dachivale5319 8 ай бұрын
@@GrazzetMTG thanks for the answer. It is very clear now. Should have been clear right away, but the finality counter made it confusing for me. 😅
@nicolamariconda2583
@nicolamariconda2583 8 ай бұрын
Special mention: Buccaneer+ Malcolm against all 3 players= gg. Glint Horn pay Red,ping opponents for 1,malcom makes 3 treasure token,use the token to pay glint horn ability again and again. Actually i Run temur Pirates Deck cedh,i love it. This ixalan one i ll take it for casual Games. But i m Not sure If Upgrade in that way or in stealing Things from opponents,combat and then sac for not giving Back 😂
@Galchoo1
@Galchoo1 8 ай бұрын
YARR HARR FIDDLE DIDEE- um, I mean, amazing deck upgrade as always! Also hey, Vampires are next! Man, Aristocrats sure suck, huh? I'll see myself out. Day 800 of waiting for the face reveal. Ever heard of The King of Fighters? Because I randomly realised how similar Oswald from that game franchise looks to you.
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Glad you enjoyed it and thanks for the support as usual! Yep, vampires are up next on the blood alter - with them being the ones losing blood this time around for a change - but at least they get to turn into demons in the process, which is cool I guess? And regarding King of Fighters - I have heard of the franchise but I was not familiar with Oswald until I looked him up. And yeah, there is a uncanny resemblance there - purely coincidental, but it is there. Now I got to watch my back for SNK's lawyers.....
@kennyboi01
@kennyboi01 7 ай бұрын
What does cut rate mean
@piotraugustyniak6591
@piotraugustyniak6591 8 ай бұрын
I would switch Black market for exquisite blood. One of weaknees of aggro decks is no defense or no life gain. If you hit people they hit you back. Black market is way better in lifegain vampire tribal precon you what even feel life lose from enchanment. It will be almost free staff.
@MikoM1111
@MikoM1111 8 ай бұрын
Kindred discovery price is wrong! I wish it was only 20 cents haha
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Whoops! Sorry about that. Looks like an editing mistake fell through the cracks now that I'm handling this all on my own. The price IS correct on the final pricing though - so thankfully everything is still good. Thanks for letting me know!
@Chillzo_o
@Chillzo_o 8 ай бұрын
Please Vampire next
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
Already in the works - expect to see the Blood Rites Precon Upgrade by this weekend.
@hanoi_revolver
@hanoi_revolver 8 ай бұрын
Very disappointed in the pirates available as commanders. None of them do what i want them to
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
That's a shame. There are a few pirate commander out there now, so there are some very different playstyles that we can use them with. What playstyle are you looking for specifically?
@hanoi_revolver
@hanoi_revolver 8 ай бұрын
@@GrazzetMTG i would love a Pirate CMD focused on making pirate tokens to crew ships and getting treasures or stealing cards each time a vehicle inflict damage. I love some of the new cards like The Indomitable and Francisco, but it doesn't feel like they have pirates buildt around them that much. The fact that Francisco makes you lose 1 color if you play him as partner is so sad to me. Also this deck is kinda splitting the pirate tribal between too many gameplay elements imo. Also this is less of a gameplay issue, but i wish we had a Pirate commander that looks like a cool bearded captain lel.
@Zeromus5555
@Zeromus5555 8 ай бұрын
WAAAAAAY too many counter removing cards. Its nice to have a couple, but more than that youre looking at bricking and dead draws. She only brings back 1 pirate per turn.
@GrazzetMTG
@GrazzetMTG 8 ай бұрын
That is a fair criticism - as the conistancy of the deck does need to be taken into account. That said, in testing I found that we would see - at most - 2 - 3 of these counter removing cards throughout the course of the game - more often than not falling into 1 - 2 even with this ratio, which ending up being a good balance between reliably drawing into them each game and not being flooded with them - though I could see the argument for cutting 1 - 2 of them for more pirates/pirate payoffs/loot effects if that is really a concern.
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