D&D 5E Advanced guide to Polymorph

[@FlutesLoot]

We Polymorphed a chimera into a mouse, then launched it into a nobleman's guarded home as a Polymorph grenade and barricaded the door. Very memorable moment for a memorable spell.

[@leatcanned]

Forced polymorph cannot be removed without a dispel magic spell or similary useful item, It might work if it was a pet chimera, but otherwise this feels like a nice Dm moment.

[@FlutesLoot]

@@leatcanned Not sure what you mean. The duration was up at the exact moment, but even if it wasn't, concentration can be ended at will.

[@leatcanned]

@@FlutesLoot when cast on an enemy it loses concentration as a component, of the spell, this was addressed as a work around by the creators to keep polymorph bombs from happening. Which was seen as a kind of deliberate cheaasing of the rules. Also, your Dm sounds nice, as oi they want you to have fun and I'm kinda jelly.

[@jasondahfolf4325]

​@@leatcanned In RAW, it is a concentration spell that lasts up to an hour, with "up to" being the operative word. Dropping concentration or having it break effectively halts the duration. The spell is weirdly worded but there is nothing that states that the transformation doesn't require concentration if casted on an unwilling creature

[@FlutesLoot]

@@leatcanned Where are you getting your information about concentration being removed as a requirement for Polymorph on enemies? There's nothing about this in PHB, D&D Beyond, or any source I've searched. Are you sure this wasn't a houserule in your game? I do have nice DMs.

[@pokepaladdy]

Personal fun story with polymorph, the party turned a giant ape into a snail, then carried it around and hurled it into a following encounter. Ape returns and is just angry at everything, pretty much became a king kong movie for the rest of the session.

[@Ahglock]

We did the same but with t-rexes in tomb of annihilation.

[@fadeleaf845]

The one effective disable form of Polymorph is the Killer Whale. The target can't move or cast spells (presuming it's on land), takes up space that hinders the positioning of allies and the enemies can't one-tap it to revert their ally. It's less reliable than buffcasting, sure, but it *can* be worth it if your allies weaken the opponent's saving throw.

[@rhysjonsmusic]

i see you too watch "weird things you can do in dnd"

[@TheAciddragon069]

@@rhysjonsmusic or Critical Role where they did this exact thing against a camp of stone giants 2 years ago

[@giraffedragon6110]

Alternatively, a dolphin is just as effective if your only intent is to run.

[@andrewgreeb916]

@@giraffedragon6110 yes but sometimes you're trying to build a wall and a whale is a pretty good wall

[@Schmeethe88]

Use a Haungharassk when you want the enemy to be completely harmless. 52 HP is still hard for opponents to "free" them, while they literally have no attacks whatsoever, and can move at most 20ft on a turn with a dash.

[@RichMerry]

"the ultimate tanking spell". Yup, that's why there are loads of druids built around there wildshape, its just that darn good.

[@KaelinGoff]

Every creature in my dungeon is polymorphed into another creature. Every. Single. One. :)

[@PackTactics]

I might steal that idea now. I like it.

[@Oniphire]

That's awesome and it makes me want to a variant where they're all illusions or just look different via illusions

[@svenuckermann3196]

@@PackTactics All chickens in the dungeon are polymorphed monsters .. exept for the first room .. they are just chickens just for fun

[@Mr_Maiq_The_Liar]

Iv done that before. Lich took a few months to true polymorph their entire undead army into something that can’t be turn undead

[@shadow-faye]

@@svenuckermann3196 nay, except the last room, make them get familiar with the status quo first

[@Unicronsupreme]

I run a very strange campaign where I frequently give the players very strong magic items. One was a wand of permanent enlarging (only on objects) and another was a neck tie that has unlimited casts of Polymorph (but still uses your concentration). The former item has caused more harm than good for the party, the later has changed the game totally. They're only level 6 so no apes or anything yet, but the brontosaurus has made an appearance and was a lot of fun. EDIT: Forgot the best part. Krakens don't have legendary resistance, so they polymorphed one into a rabbit and then had their medusa friend petrify it. So now there's a really really dangerous bunny statue in town :D

[@Menzobarrenza]

I really like that bunny statue. Awesome.

[@Sir-Pleiades]

Or you can Cast Greater Restoration and throw a big nukes Kraken in town making an Rampage as it can breath out of water.

[@Menzobarrenza]

@@Sir-Pleiades In order for the kraken to not kill you too, you might want to set up a Glyph of Warding to cast the spell when you're somewhere safe.

[@Unicronsupreme]

@@Sir-Pleiades That's not super likely as the Kraken is currently in Medusa's private collection, but it is certainly a looming threat and the players want to un-petrify someone else in the collection so maybe there will be something then.

[@DungeonseCorujas]

The druid at my table polymorphed the fighter into a giant ape, the fighter's player had so much fun that he asked if he could be a giant ape forever and make ape noises to answer his teammates. God, i love this spell. Tip for players and DM's: Try not to use huge forms while in small places or you'll be "squeezing", and you never want to be "squeezing"

[@andrewgreeb916]

Squeeze checks are fun, although be mindful of dimensions as successfully squeezing may upset the supports around the doors and other things as you fit through

[@athanasiospapazoglou7310]

* return to giant monke *

[@xezzee]

... it was not mimic. I can already someone inside a barrel failing to get inside the town cast Giant ape polymorph and run to the town like King Kong to drop it so he can cast invisibility to get inside the castle...

[@jacobnorton7037]

Turn your enemy into an orca. Good hp, and can't function on land. Gives your party a chance to get some healing in... Also, the "homebrew" was an actual rule in 3.5, so a lot if DMs just carried it over to 5e.

[@RayPoreon]

But why an orca when something like a dolphin is less likely to murder them if they get too close? Better yet you could go with something like a clam or a barnicle(which are animals)

[@jacobnorton7037]

@@RayPoreon But the orca has enough hit points to survive a few hits if its team tries to turn it back. That gives your team time to waol on the enemy, then concentrate all attacks on the orca as a group.

[@RayPoreon]

@@jacobnorton7037 I guess that does make sense. My go-to would be to just grab up the tiny creature and stick them in a jar, after the fight ends, bury them so you don't even have to fight them. Also, didn't you mean *whale* on them?

[@TalesStahl]

I would say that it is reasonable that you can only polymorph into a creature that the caster would know of. See it read it hear about it etc.

[@pmester228]

I was pretty sure you could just pass through an ally's space no problem. Though the rules never made it clear

[@wsn111]

My DM just gave me a wand of Polymorph last session. I was so worried about having to fight a massive mobile mother brain that I didn't even stop to think of the less obvious applications. I feel a little more confident keeping the party safe now. Thanks for the ideas!

[@chriswalker7555]

Any 3HD target you use it on can be turned into a Giant Scorpion and venom-milked for probably the easiest accessed injury poison. Giant scorpion is 4d10Poison CON12/half (11hp/22hp poison damage). We used it to equip a village militia for a sudden doubling+ of their damage output in a siege, causing a raid to crash to a mouth-foaming halt. Otherwise our henchmen use it on their arrows, which placates the DM.

[@numbug1234]

I will point out that if you're at least 2 sizes larger than a creature, they can occupy the same spaces as you and vice-versa, it's just treated as difficult terrain. So a giant ape wouldn't push those creatures out of the way, nor would it physically prevent them from moving past, but it WOULD slow them down from getting there, ignoring the fact that you can try grappling them from there.

[@leatcanned]

A freindly creature. yes, an enemy no. Otherwise it is considered an attempt to overrun, which creatures 2 size catagories smaller automatically fail, due to how grappling and attack manuevers work.

[@johnnyhorsewhale3116]

Also if ypur taking only the giant ape as the best beast you can turn into vs what the tome of beasts gives you. Why be a Giant ape when you could be a giant spinosaur with legendary actions.....trust me my friends level 20 druid was pretty butthurt when his giant ape didn't work against my clerics polymorph

[@hewhogoesbymanynames]

@@leatcanned Moving Through Creatures: You may move through non-hostile creature’s space. In contrast, you can move through a hostile creature’s space on if the creature is at least two sizes larger or smaller than you. Regardless, moving through another creature’s space is considered difficult terrain and you cannot end your move in a creature’s space. It's okay to be wrong but correcting others without being pretty confident is bad form

[@caledvwych1366]

A combo me and my party did we called the jumping TRex Strat. Basically a combo of polymorph and jump onto the same person. TRex with the jump spell can jump high enough that they take fall damage. Jumping is not an action and the TRex is built to soak up damage anyway. Since jumping is not an action you can both jump and attack. Then we figured out an even better strategy. The TRex bite grapples people. So what we would do is bite first, grapple the person. Then jump as high in the air as we could. Letting go is a free action so we would do so at the apex of the jump. This would result in the person taking fall damage. Then the TRex lands on them and deals even more fall damage. Repeat.

[@rachdarastrix5251]

Hey I just remembered you said you needed more views yes? I'll just keep hitting refresh while I wait for my players to get done with their doctor visit. You deserve it for that brontosaurus tip. And uh, kinda mostly due to the fact that I won't remember I can do that unless I burn it into my skull.

[@dsghjksdgfgh1359]

Well this couldn't have come out at a better time, my wizard just recently got polymorph and this was very helpful! I have already saved my friend's live with this

[@coolnamebro7363]

Twinned smell brontosaurus in mid-air onto the head of an enemy, or 'The Double Dino Drop' if you're a fan of alliteration.

[@Mightymajin]

I thought it was called "Operation: Open the Door, Get on the Floor, Everybody Drop the Dinosaur."

[@coolnamebro7363]

@@Mightymajin The only acceptable re-naming.

[@hewhogoesbymanynames]

Are there rules for landing on enemies where the damage depends on size? The only ones I'm aware of are Xanathar's: If a creature falls into the space of a second creature and neither of them is Tiny, the second creature must succeed on a DC 15 Dexterity saving throw or be impacted by the falling creature, and any damage resulting from the fall is divided evenly between them. The impacted creature is also knocked prone, unless it is two or more sizes larger than the falling creature. where a halfling does as much damage as a tarrasque.

[@SolvableMattB]

Odin once drilled a hole in a wall, than polymorphed himself into a snake and slithered out.

[@oranos2276]

polymorph combos extremely well with sleep. the parties rogue and artificer got possessed by ghosts. the DM said that them going unconcious would end the possession. so instead of beating them up the party casters polymorphed them into an otter and a cat and cast sleep to end the combat encounter.

[@XerkDaniels]

This video is very cleanly edited. Keep up the good work.

[@PackTactics]

I spend days editing lol. Im editing almost every day.

[@oscarpine7145]

Funny thing is I was DMing for my first time and my forever DM decided to shit on my homebrew Chimera. He rolled 2 crits while polymorphed as an ape. Funny thing is he was a sorcerer so he twinned it and the wizard also rolled 2 crits. In like 4 seconds they killed something I took like 30 minutes to make

[@leatcanned]

DM tip :deploy plot armor. a normal length of a equal Cr/Dr combat should be around 3 rounds for nonboss fights, this establishes the player as strong, with great capabilties while also bloodying their nose, weting their appeitite and engaging the cost/effect cognative comparison. Anything longer and your players begin burning materials they might need for the boss fight later.

[@StrifeA217]

Ya I would fudge things a bit if they are going to one shot like that just to be interesting make it last a round or two past 0.

[@bkane573]

Saw. Good luck happens some times, and can be fun. They would however….be seeing more of them that session. Perhaps more than originally planned. That is better plot armor.

[@z4p0tek]

This quickly became my favourite channel. Thx for the videos!

[@benjloh]

"Why aren't you always using it on your friends when you start combat?" Well, some significant portion of the time, my friends don't want it, crazy I know. They think that I'm looking down on their class/performance in combat by offering to polymorph them at the start of a fight, and the only time they accept it is right on death's door when the fight is a round or two away from finishing. Ah well.

[@bkane573]

Well then, if they die, they die. You need less stupid friends.

[@Year2047]

Oh man. That time we accidentally destroyed a magic dome protecting a pixie village using a minotaur barbarian and another player polymorphed into a gator dooming the village to the blight destroying the land. Good times.

[@patrickhandley627]

Once used the giant snake polymorph because our centaur party member couldn't fit through a part of the dungeon or feasibly fit through a hole in the floor. They cruised around as the giant snake for an hour and then locked down enemies in an encounter we had, it was great. Also polymorph is great for infiltration when you need to get your rogue into places they shouldn't be able to access normally. Also pairs well with spells like mage armor.

[@andrewgreeb916]

I never thought of it as a shield spell, suddenly boost your ally with a boost of HP to get through the encounter or buff someone so they aren't wasting resources for an encounter or since it's 1hour duration an entire floor of a dungeon, maybe more. It's concentration so you can cancel whenever and you'll need to watch any heat coming your way, or turn into a squirrel and hide in the fur of your polymorphed friend

[@johnmichaelarnaud]

I love your narration style so much.

[@GalacticCoffee2077]

This channel is sublime and exceptionally good at making interesting and engaging videos on the topic of optimising D&D characters. But oh my good gracious I want to rip my ears off and eat them every time I hear something like “The expected dpr for spell x is nineteen point *fifty two*.” It just tears my nerd soul apart to have someone say a decimal that way. It should be nineteen point five two, not point fifty two! Down here I wanna make clear that I adore this content and this channel and have been bingeing these videos for a good part of the last three days and am not spreading hate or trying to hate on this channel. It’s fucking great and I will continue to watch their videos. - Sincerely a rando on the internet who likes D&D

[@GalacticCoffee2077]

Also for those who read the replies in regards to a point about Polymorph that wasn’t covered in the video. I as a player LOVE Polymorph for erasing legendary resistances. It is a win win situation, either the legendary creature sacrifices a legendary resistance to succeed a low roll or they’re Polymorphed into whatever non-threatening creature you like, which means you can either deal with minions before taking on the creature you Polymorphed, or at certain levels and depending on the creature just blipping it away with Planeshift, or dropping it from 500ft in the air with Dimension Door/some other teleport effect or sheer drop and Featherfall.

[@RaethFennec]

An adorable animated kobold talking about D&D? Alright, I'm in.

[@valasafantastic1055]

It’s STILL good cast on yourself. And it’s the single greatest and funny takedown of certain enemies such as the straight from the books unaltered statblocks of; the Kraken, or Dragon turtles!

[@dominicspagnol8765]

I had a dm introduce our party to a dungeon that had a lot of flooding when we were about level 5. I was playing a druid at the time, and I saw an opportunity. I beast shaped into a giant octopus and when our party initiated our surprise attack on these goblinoids, I crept up to the edge of the water and dived out at the spell casting hobgoblin and proceeded to drag him into the water (with a spare goblin on the way for the lols). One of my most favorite combats I ever got to participate in.

[@estebanramirez1178]

My college of creation bard learned Glyph of Warding at level 10 because the dance of creation feature allows him to make the glyphs free. As part of a “prepare for an invasion”, mission in a city, my bard spent a solid amount of time setting up glyphs of various spells. He set some up on the outside of the city for him and some of his party to use with Polymorph and transform into very big creatures that can do big damage among the invading army when they ran out of spell slots. My bard figuratively and very literally orchestrated various kaiju attacks on the enemy.

[@rachdarastrix5251]

I never really liked this spell and am usually reluctant to use it without good reason. Why can't humanoids just make their doorways bigger?

[@HandelOp6No5]

Great video. Your delivery is amazing. Excellent English!

[@tyree403]

Good work on the video! The reason why some DMs would restrict polymorph to the creatures you've seen is to reduce the CR. Making it around CR 5-6. It's still powerful despite the homebrew nerf! I think it'll make it easier for DMs to balance encounters so it doesn't turn into a cakewalk. If the caster who cast polymorph is safe and isn't dealt with, the party is highly likely to win the encounter. A CR 8 creature with over 150+ HP will likely take 2-3+ rounds to deal with it (if focus fired) before you need to cast polymorph again. With the added restriction, about 1-2+ rounds. You still gain a lot of mileage and it's still a great spell.

[@jimboxx7]

I agree with you. I've never nerfed polymoprh, but always striving for the most optimal thing just creates "monster inflation" in the end. By that I mean, The DM will boost the encounters so that the fight remains a challenge for the party. It's a bit shortsighted. And then you get into this weird mental state where using a longbow instead of a crossbow feels unplayable.. ;)

[@tyree403]

@@jimboxx7 The problem with that is sometimes you may have players with various skill levels and they may not make the most optimal plays. It can be really, really punishing if the DM design encounters for one player in the group. What should DMs do in that situation? I've been pondering that.

[@jimboxx7]

@@tyree403 It's very hypothetical, but let's be honest: it's kinda hard to break the balance in 5e compared to 3.5. So most of the time, ramping the encounter by 10-20% will do the trick. If you have to ramp to the point where the rest of the party doesn't have fun, then I would ask the player to change his build / character. I'd rather have 5 power gamers than 1 PG and 4 noobs. Also, I very rarely give magic items tailored to the party and my players know it. They know there's a price to pay if they specialize too much. To be clear, I've never had this issue before so this is all theory.

[@tyree403]

@@jimboxx7 Indeed! I’m kinda curious what DMs would do when such a situation arrives. Fair point!

[@keggotht9323]

I find that if something like this becomes too powerful rather than making encounters harder you need to make them more frequent with less rests. That way the resources become more stretched and they might not have the slots for a polymorph. Dont take it too far though, don't want your players begging for a long rest

[@oliverneville5012]

You can get a non concentration fog cloud off with pyrotechnics, or an ever smoking bottle, or just with a smoke grenade

[@Necroes]

So; That homebrew rule you talk about, the one about having to see creatures to turn into them? Yea, as part of the old guard who plays with people who have been playing since early 3rd edition was new, I can tell you why people do that. Anyone with decent optimization ability can look at this spell and see how busted it is. What's more, there's a specific spell that you can use that makes it more potent; Conjure Woodland Beings. The spell allows you to summon eight fey creatures of CR 1/4 or lower. Pixies, which have the ability to cast Polymorph, are only CR 1/4. Issuing orders to them doesn't require an action, and they have a separate initiative from the summoner. Both CWB and Poly have a range of 60 feet, so when fighting a ground-based enemy a druid capable of casting 4th level spells can essentially polymorph their entire party with a single 4th level spell slot, so long as they can speak Sylvan. What's more, with 8 pixies available, the average party of four players is going to get a total 8 polymorph spells to play with. If you think a single Giant Ape is a problem to deal with, imagine fighting an entire party of them. The built-in ranged attack honestly shines with this combo, as it means even the ape's massive size usually isn't an issue because you can just have anyone not in melee throw rocks at the target. Combine that with the fact that both spells last for a solid hour, and if you're planning an ambush, the only downside to the combo-Pixies having a single hit point-becomes a non-issue because once the polymorph effects are cast the pixies have plenty of time to hide and get out of any kind of threat range from the combat. This specific combo is generally what has gotten old-guard DMs to nerf Polymorph in general to address the issue with it being a frankly overpowered spell. The "you've had to have seen the creature" rule acts as a good soft nerf, as it allows DMs to control what creatures their players can turn into, ensuring rampant abuse of any given form doesn't happen immediately upon gaining the spell. It also handedly nerfs the combo I mentioned, as it's perfectly reasonable to assume that a bunch of conjured pixies won't know what giant apes are, being native to the Fey Wild.

[@regaleagle6533]

Or the DM could just accurately say RAW that’s not what conjure woodland beings does you don’t get pixies.

[@Necroes]

@@regaleagle6533 Pixies are Fey creatures of CR 1/4, available in the MM. CWB, RAW, has no restrictions on which creatures you can summon. It only mentions Fey creatures, and what CR. That's Exactly what CWB does raw, as states in the players handbook.

[@regaleagle6533]

@@Necroes that’s true fey are 1/4 and they are not restricted from being summoned. But you are restricted from choosing what is summoned beyond the CR. Picking specific types of creatures is very clearly stated in summon spells. You cannot select pixies RAW it’s up to the DM what 1/4 CR fey you get.

[@Necroes]

@@regaleagle6533 There isn't any summon spell that says anything about the DM getting to decide what creature is summoned. The spell says you 'choose' one of the avaiable options: summon 8 fey creatures of CR 1/4 or lower is a viable option, and Pixies are fey creatures of CR 1/4 or lower. Every version of 'conjure x' has the same wording. None of them say anything other than 'summon x creatures of CR y or lower.' I've literally never played at any table, anywhere, where any DM made the claim they get to pick what creatures are summoned when you cast a conjure spell. By your logic, every time someone cast Conjure Elemental their DM could choose to hand them a Mephit because it's an elemental creature of CR 5 or lower, and the spell doesn't explicitly state the player gets to pick Exactly what kind of elemental is summoned.

[@regaleagle6533]

@@Necroes it’s not “my logic” you play homebrew my man. You are telling me you can’t tell the difference between the words “you choose the demons type which must be of 5 CR are or lower” and “you choose 8 Cr 1/4 fey GM has the statistics”. Spells point blank tell you when it’s your choice. You could absolutely wind up with a wussy elemental off conjure elemental but I find it’s better to not be punitive about it unless the player is doing something foolish like trying to get 8 pixies. This is a pretty well known fact your odd homebrew anecdotes aside Jeremy Crawford - “I wanted to make sure the questioner knew that the DM decides what's conjured.”

[@jinxtheunluckypony]

I remember the first time I saw a player polymorphic into a giant ape as a fledgling DM. Absolutely wrecked that one shot, it was a blast.

[@kamenridertheblueknight5313]

6:36 but what if you provide a thematic in game/lore reason as to why you cast this on yourself? like say a circle of the moon druid that can wildshape into a cr 6 or higher beast but at the cost of additional energy needed? or when you're playing as Sun Wukong and use polymorph to transform into their giant ape form aka his 'giant' war form.

[@bobalmond8257]

Great video. I’m glad I stumbled onto your channel! Keep up the innovative well researched stuff!

[@demosthenes995]

You are my favorite dnd channel

[@PackTactics]

Thank you!

[@giraffedragon6110]

Ahh, my favorite 4th level spell! What I would call the ultimate Hail Mary. During a one shot session, We were fighting a T-Rex like enemy and we were losing poorly. So I casted Polymorph, it failed the save, and I decided to turn it into a dolphin. We used that hour to gtfo.

[@jasonreed7522]

@@MrBottlecapBill dolphins breath air, and i believe are small enough that unlike whales they won't crush themselves under their own weight. (A beached blue or sperm whale isn't going to last long but they wont die for "a couple hours" according to google) Polymorph ends when dropped, concentration is broken, 1hr has passed, or the creature drops to 0HP, which basically means it dies. So you can turn an enemy into something big and slow to run away from it. (Don't use a snail, it has 1HP so any damage will undo the spell, and something like a bunny or turtle will still try an attack you. This lead to a hilarious moment on CR C2 where the party got paralyzed and the cleric polymorphed the monster and it then broke paralysis by attacking the paladin with an autocounter magic item which broke the polymorph. Big and harmless is hard to come by, and apparently beached whales live longer than the spell lasts they are ideal candidates for the "run away" usage of polymorph.

[@giraffedragon6110]

@@jasonreed7522 exactly! also it was a blatant Dionysius reference.

[@talkinggibberish]

I always ask my teammates before hand if they are OK with being polymorphed in combat. Because sometimes you build a really cool, effective character and you want to spend your time playing THAT and not a random monkey for an hour.

[@jasonreed7522]

The only time i wouldn't ask would be using it as a surge of 156HP when they were on 5HP. Nobody complains about healing. (Unless they had some edge case plan involving going down to get a powerup, in which case you still ask as you cast it)

[@sixty5202]

No mention of the Paladin riding into combat on the back of the barbarian poly'd into a raging T-Rex SMH

[@marcusc9931]

Reminds me of that internet story of a 3.5 druid who secretly betrayed the team half way through the campaign, prestiged into planar shepard of the nightmare realm and in the campaign finale TPKd the party with his nightmare realm wildshape.

[@blacktiger9393]

I (as a dm) homebrew poly to "a beast you know" that way the party can use basic poly beasts that "everybody knows" like tigers, wolfs, etc. and all they have to do is go to a library and flip a couple pages in a book to aquire knowledge about others they may know have acces to yet. This also means that if i trow a beast at them that there characters didn´t know exist beforhand they aquire a know option for poly that way.

[@LuizCesarFariaLC]

The last bit about roleplaying the giant ape is some true magic on its own.

[@Awesomepedia]

Great video, thanks! Personally I could have done without the bagpipes but to each their own

[@PackTactics]

Thats me playing. Thanks.

[@starbomber]

My table tends to use this spell as crowd control. Mostly because they've had to be in a few fights where they couldn't really kill the opponent. So, they turned them into a sheep and carried them to the person that needed them.

[@BLynn]

So I know the RAW says you cannot perform verbal & somatic components for spells since you can't speak in the new form or don't have hands for the gestures, but a Giant Ape has the hands & if you are a Chain'lock with the eldritch invocation "Voice of the Chain Master" being able to speak in your own voice through the familiar sitting on your shoulder couldn't you then cast spells? I know, I know it is in the DM's hands then, but it seems like this should work, because unlike the Wildshape which simply says you cannot cast spells this expands on why which leaves the door open to interpretation.

[@Oniphire]

I don't know how dexterous an ape's hands are compared to ours but based on the rule that wearing armour can prevent you from casting simply because you're unfamiliar with how to move in it, somatic components are probably too difficult to pull off in a new form when your mind has also been altered

[@obsidiandragon1385]

sorcerer sudtle spell done and done

[@masterfreeman117]

Huge Giant Crab is an adventure specific creature from White Plume Mountain. It is most likely not available for Polymorph, for the same reasons Gishath or Traxigor would not be available.

[@PackTactics]

If its not available, its fine. I named other options.

[@TheRauzKindred]

Another fun idea, turn your barbarian friend into something tiny and with either climb or fly speed and decent stealth that can be easily missed to get them into an area where the enemies are dug in or out of reach. Wait till they're behind the enemy ranks and just drop concentration and then enjoy the ASMR of the panicked screams of your enemies immediately after hearing the phrase "I would like to rage".

[@yipeekiyaay7807]

One time I did a classic. Some dangerous enemy popped up, that didn't have Legendary Resistance. I casted polymorph on him to transform him into a snail, but he succeeded. Luckily, it was by few enough that a Woe (Stars Druid feature) was enough to make him fail. I then picked him up from the ground, and threw him into my Bag of Devouring. Don't know how difficult the encounter should've been, but one turn was enough to end it, lol.

[@Corvothing24]

Also barbarians, raging as a giant ape, is really something else

[@givemeanaxe]

One thing I just thought of.. and dont have the time to look up or verify. If you polymorph a creature, say a human into a trex. Could another person then polymorph the trex into a mouse, and have the mouse then be eaten by a creature... the mouse dies and the polymorph ends. Reverting the creature back Into a.. trex or a human?

[@noddarkwolf]

and if you have a wizard and a druid the druid can cast bark or stone skin and the wizard casts polymorph you have an beast with either decent ac or haft damage to all physical attacks

[@Spiceodog]

Kobald press has some higher cr beasts like spinosauros cr13, but some of it’s cr comes from legendary actions so it won’t scale quite as well

[@jb123581]

On the utility side, cranium rat has a rather unusual feature for beasts in that it is telepathic. Depending upon how your DM interprets it, that could very well be used for early access into a discount telepathic bond via your familiar. They’d just need to relay between the various party members. For combat, the spell is really good at what it does, though it can be a bit frustrating seeing very low int beasts become tactical geniuses. Still, I’d be very excited to see a giant ape pick up one monster and proceed to beat another with the first one as an improvised weapon.

[@PackTactics]

You cant cast spells in the new form. 1:35

[@jb123581]

@@PackTactics not a spell. The beast itself has telepathy as a language and it is technically not speech.

[@PackTactics]

@@jb123581 Ah, I see it now. Ops.

[@ItzMrCuddles]

9:37 yes we do, my table agreed to this because it makes sense, soo far they have visited every Zoo and Menagerie they passed by, they even browse pet store to find new things to become

[@rachdarastrix5251]

7:45 Ok now I'm really listening.

[@alexwirtz9780]

Polymorph is a game breaking spell. Facing a beholder? Turn it into a turtle and throw it off a cliff. Dragon fly in out of nowhere? Turn it into a snail and then stick it into a tight space so it can't get out and you can just walk away. Gotta get rid of a litch king? Polymorph them into a beatle, stick them into a bag of holding, and then stick that bag into another bag of holding. Now that litch king is floating in the astral sea somewhere and is no longer your concern. Or is it's an enemy that needs to be able to breath (which is surprisingly common) and can fit in the nag of holding on it's own, then all you need to do is turn the enemy into a goldfish, put said holdfish into the bag of holding, and wait for about 10 minutes until you can pull out a vacuum sealed corpse from the bag. Also makes for easy body disposal for all you murder hobos out there

[@DrApylon]

The T-Rex is also pretty stronk due to the bite+grapple combo and also counts as a mount so characters can just ride on its back and shoot at people. Also little known fact about turning yourself into a Giant Ape, Ape's have stupidly high grapple bonuses, enemy casters cannot cast most spells when grappled and most people dont bother using counterspell on it when the caster does it to themselves as on paper it looks like a waste. You, the giant ape, also can yeet them as you are a huge sized creature with 23 STR and most casters are medium or smaller. Also polymorphing yourself as a caster (if you have alot of spells for utility vs DPS) is very spell slot efficient during fights as there are quite a few good ranged attack options (giant ape throwing rocks? at 50/100ft? for 7d6+6 DMG? yes yes and yes), it can last up to an hour and can radically alter your toolkit to synergize better with other melee classes (rogue needs advantage? Fighter needs to be using his resources? Need more ranged attackers? A Triceratops that acts a mount who can charge, knock prone and stomp in one action?). I view it very much as a very very strong tool to compliment and fill gaps in what a party needs at a particular time, but sometimes turning yourself into the big beastie changes the fight math in just the right way and lets you conserve precious spell slots if you are light on casters in a group.

[@slipperyfish]

Twin casting Polymorph is one of the most broken combinations in 5e.

[@r.downgrade5836]

This gets even better if you can get your hands on the uncommon magic item 'Headband of Intellect'. Because, normally, when you polymorph someone they get the mental abilities of the animal, so it can be hard to use many tactics, either in or out of combat. Combat can typically be less of a problem because you can give someone the order of 'stay' or 'fight' pretty easily, and the spell says whoever is polymorphed still understands who is a friend and who is a foe, but with the headband, your INT score will remain 18 no matter what. Now, again, in combat this may not be a big deal (depending on the table). But, for utility uses like scouting, now you can have that same rat or owl flying through a dungeon or what have you, and be able to actually remember what it is you say rather than coming back to tell your team that there was a big room with lights and a number of bad guys and you can't remember the exact number because animals aren't very smart, but you now it was more than 1.

[@crunter4270]

The reason why Polymorph often isn't casted untill the end of the adventuring day is that it's also the best healing option that the wizard has, and up to the point it stays good you only have a few. I find it difficult to use my heals when they could be lifesaving later on, dimension door just isn't the same thing, it will often mean you're dropping your hypnotic pattern.

[@johnnyhorsewhale3116]

6:34 it's only really effectively bad if you don't know how to use it for yourself. For example my cleric with enough prep time can put down a glyph of warding and put polymorph into it with said designations and then viola. No concentration polymorph ;)

[@MidnightAphelion]

My tactic is to save POlymorph for utility and as an emergency heal. Let party go into battle normally, and when someone is 'badly hurt' a polymorph is functionally a 130 hit point heal.

[@hrcarinae3625]

hello pack tactics you're video is fun

[@rayclawicefire2503]

casts polymorph on dragon, dragon turns into rat, picks up dragon and drops into bag of devouring

[@Mr_Maiq_The_Liar]

To be fair about casting it on enemies. They are a helpless, portable, small immobile animal for an hour. Go throw them off a cliff, it isn’t just a 60% to shut down it’s a 60% chance to win because it isn’t hard th kills a snail in a way that would kill the dragon once the form reverts. It also doesn’t protect you from insta kill effects like powerword kill or divine word Mass polymorph divine word is a combo that can kill anyone who fails their first wisdom save, because you can turn them to an animal with a -3 charisma save that fails automatically with limited movement on land that also has less than 20 health, like an octopus, or a quipper. The cliff is way easier though if there’s ever one nearby or just a familiar that can pick up a snail fall damage caps at 20d6 and held actions come on after that Imagine if banishment did 20d6 damage! Also the held action release for a banishment or polymorph to end is worth talking about in your inevitable banishment video

[@crashoverride93637]

Cast polymorph on enemy any small flying animal... cast animal messenger to send them 1 hour away and take fall damadge on top

[@trashtulya]

I think casting it on a foe became a much cooler option (and many save or suck spells actually) with the release of a silvery barbs spell. You can get it with Fey touched feat which is super useful on any character by itself and even more useful on casters. And with it, you can use your first and fourth spell slot for polymorphing somebody into a goat with a pretty neat chance of success. Also, other characters can use their silvery barbs if the enemy passes the two checks, but this silvery barbs sequence is pretty goofy to think about. Banishment is still better with the basically same effect, but without the chance that some big brain foe will know how polymorph works and just hit that goat to make his friend free. But it can be pretty useful for somebody like a sorcerer who doesn`t have many spells known. Also, you can (arguably) use a twinned spell and polymorph your friend into something big and a foe into something small, but it`s a question to ask your dm about is it possible in the first place.

[@charleshaines9715]

One time we were in a fight with a giant 6 legged toad that was absolutely destroying us. As a last ditch effort, I poly morphed it into a tadpole. We debated taking it to the ocean, hoping the salt water would kill it when it transformed back, but we were unsure if this would work or not, so instead I tied it to an arrow and had the archer shoot it up as far as he could in the air. When it hit the ground it took the fall damage. The damage carried over, and we all had readied actions. It was a great comeback.

[@kallsusae]

You can mage armor or bark skin poly morphed forms. Or a barbarian / monk can use their unarmored defense. You know, make your barb a giant ape while fighting giants. Lots of weapons for it to use..

[@renatocorvaro6924]

Polymorph is rad as hell.

[@rowanjohnson6947]

Quick note, even though the Huge Giant Crab sounds like a type of monster it is actually a specific Giant Crab called The Guardian Of The Treasure that was magically enhanced to Huge size and given a magic copper band that grants it’s condition immunities. There isn’t even an official statblock of Huge Giant Crab as it only exists on online compendiums that assembled it from the changes to the Giant Crab statblock listed in the adventure text. You should always be careful of using or allowing monster stat blocks that come from adventures rather than sourcebooks as sometimes the statblock isn’t what it appears. You’d very likely not be able to use Polymorph to turn into The Guardian Of The Treasure in the same way that you cannot summon 8 Barnacle Bess’ with Conjure Animals.

[@jacobfreeman5444]

Polymorph: the best way to advance to crab

[@arcanavoresmanavault2637]

Regarding Homebrew. Baseline for my campaigns is that you must have a knowledge of a creature in order to polymorph someone into it. So if your character had access to an encyclopedia on monsters you could easily Polymorph into whatever is said encyclopedia. But there are creatures that exist that your character may not know exist and therefore would preclude them from utilizing. The Almiraj for instance is a rare animal native to Chult. If you weren't from Chult probably wouldn't know about it.

[@shawnenjump]

My DM does use that homebrew rule of having to have seen the creature for polymorph. Specifically the dinosaurs that are found in the source books, I'm not too sure they were running around the sword coast all that much

[@backonlazer791]

I'd argue it is fair to say the character might not have seen a specific creature and thus can't turn people into it. However, I usually allow people in my games to roll if they have seen the creature or know about it and the DC is affected by where they have lived or travelled. I also allow them to do research and use depictions of creatures they have seen in books, etc.

[@x0Vinny0x]

One thing I'd like to add to the list, is the best use of polymorph against a single target. Polymorph the BBG into a frog. They have no attacks and an intelligence of -5. Put the frog into a pouch and tie a knot in it. Fly up or drop off the frog from 200 feet above ground. The frog/BBG takes 20d6 bludgeoning damage. The remaining damage past the frog's 1hp carries over into it's original form. If you don't think that'll do the job, have everyone prepare an action to attack the BBG if it survives after reverting back into true form.

[@Femaiden]

just keep in mind, anything the players can do, the enemies can do too. the DM has unlimited resources

[@ASquared544]

Fun story about Polymorph: Our party is fighting a major boss (a literal god in fact), and this was second phase, and we were all running low on resources and hit points. Our bard had gone down, but we got them back up and my Paladin had cast Bless on them… that’s when we had a brilliant idea. Our Bard had just reached level 7 and gotten Polymorph. With no time like the present, our bard turned themselves into a Giant Ape to give themselves an HP buffer, and thanks to Bless, my Paladin’s aura, & the Ape’s constitution, it was near impossible for them to lose concentration. The Bard proceeded to carry us and body the encounter.

[@the3dluxe53]

I’d say you have to have seen the creature but it doesn’t necessarily mean you have to have seen them in the flesh. A book or scroll with a detailed illustration would be enough. So you wouldn’t have to go all the way to the jungle or happen across one at a circus to see a giant ape. That way you still get that idea of unlocking polymorphs across without having to shoehorn the actual creatures in.

[@bhupendragurram3026]

polymorph your barbarian friend into cat, cat walk into bbeg lair, once bbeg comes to pet cat, drop concentration, boom, surprise round

[@perryhayter3857]

Depends on your group... I play with a group that are all attached to playing with all their class features in tact... as such, I only ever get to cast poly on myself or an enemy. Guess I'll just have to "do it wrong" as you suggest...

[@PackTactics]

What I said was like minded individuals should do this. Now if theres a case where your friend who is attached to their character is about to go down, then you poly him. Theres no way he will say no. He wants to survive. If he says no, he goes down.

[@ASquared544]

Another thing to mention is that if you have a caster casting Spirit Guardians, they likely also have Spiritual Weapon. So, if they cast Spirit Guardians before combat and then cast Spiritual Weapon before becoming Polymorphed, they gain an extra attack!

[@PH03NIX96]

Why I dont use it? Because my DM says we're stupid animals when polymorphed.

[@shadedergu9921]

My favorite use for Polymorph is as a Sorcerer or Lore/Eloquence Bard who uses it to instantly kill an opponent. Maybe even dip into fighter for action surge. Legendary targets will lose legendary resistances either to prevent polymorph or because they were polymorphed. Polymorph will not turn a target who immolation turned to ash, neither will it stop Psychic Scream or power word kill from killing them. This is why I use it to kill a strong target, when used by an Eloquence Bard or Heightened Spell Sorcerer the DM will either burn all Legendary Resistances on Polymorph, or will lose the BBEG when they get polymorphed (which forsakes all of their abilities including whatever resistances they tried to save) once immolation is cast. Beast Shape for the Druid also has this same counter. Beast Shaped or Polymorphed into a Bear and Immolation reduced you to 0 HP? You get reduced to a pile of Ash and Instantly Die; which is again why I like using it to set up a boss kill against any boss who does not spend every legendary resistance on resisting it

[@regaleagle6533]

Why would spirit guardians have the CR or level required to turn them into something big? They don’t allow things at my table outside the rules that break the game.

[@AGrumpyPanda]

Spirit Guardians is an AoE spell, so cleric casts Spirit Guardians on themself, you polymorph the cleric into something that grapples, cleric continues to concentrate on Spirit Guardians and then uses their new grappler form to keep enemies in the range of their AoE.

[@regaleagle6533]

@@AGrumpyPanda oh haha I guess that might work could be putting the party in danger of cleric can’t cast spells or drop their polymorph. I guess it could be interesting in some situations.

[@wolfVFV]

4 sorcery points for 157 hp and maybe other advantages yes thats a good deal

[@theforgottenranger]

One time a goblin bard polymorphed the flying warlock into a giant ape while he was flying over an effreti, the DM ruled the Ape was able to knock it out of the sky with a successful athletics check while falling on it and even deal double falling damage from being crushed beneath it's weight.

[@dwreanchinotan]

5:46 THE UNEXPECTABLES!

[@alexwilliams8365]

So I have what I call plan zero: If the battle is going poorly and we need a quick out, polymorphing a opposing enemy (preferably the one giving you trouble) into a snail and having someone else be ready to stuff them in a bag of holding is a great way to quickly kill an enemy. I call this plan zero because it would only be effective against a large boss, and it's honestly more fun to kill them traditionally, using polymorph as a buff for your party than offensively in this manner since it is basically an instant kill for a lot of bosses.

[@theuncalledfor]

Wouldn't this destroy the Bag of Holding or simply dump the target back into the world once Polymorph wears off?

[@liuliukas9516]

Huge Giant Crab has 1 Int, and most other beasts have similar level of intelligence. If you polymorph into a chicken - you will maintain you moody, cheerful, aggressive, or lazy personality, as spell dictates, and you may understand, that some of the humanoids around you "feel" friendly, or unfriendly through passive insight check, but you might not care to fight (unless your alignment and/or personality wants to destroy things). A crab, even if it seems tough, might just crawl away, looking for water, or sand and SHOULD NOT have any inclination to fight either side unless specifically provoked. A t-rex with intelligence of 2 might attack all parties involved if everyone is blasting magic at each other, because who is to say, it's tiny brain can distinguish true intentions of your former allies, if they are making a ruckus all over the place (maybe roll investigation to understand what is happening to see if you are capable of understanding the situation). Some would argue, a polymorphed beast with average wisdom can be trained before combat starts, otherwise it doesn't have enough reasoning why it should even participate in the conflict. You can look at it as "Can you be trapped in a frog who does not know it is not a frog?" Giant Ape has intelligence of 7 and wisdom of 12, so there is a chance ape may understand this is just it's temporal form and it was not born this way. Only a druid using Wild Shape will keep it's mental capability and be fully aware about it's true form. PHB page 177: "Intelligence measures mental acuity, accuracy of recall, and the ability to reason." PHB page 178: "Wisdom reflects how attuned you are to the world around you and represents perceptiveness and intuition." (Perceptiveness here means "...general awareness of your surroundings and the keenness of your senses...", so ability to spot a place to retreat, figure out where the noise is coming from etc.)

[@PackTactics]

1:00 Retains its peronallity. This doesn't apply. Also, is it really a good idea to take the control away from the player's hand? What you say is correct btw but again. It doesn't apply here.

[@liuliukas9516]

@@PackTactics Yes, personality it retains (it get's to stay cheerful if PC was cheerful), think of personality traits/ideals/flaws/bonds you created for your character. If it was afraid of thunder, or extremely protective of the nature - creature will too feel compelled to continue acting so. However mentality is not personality. Polymorph is not taking player's control away, it creates opportunity for some really interesting rp interactions and lets act as a semi-domesticated beast. Preparing that crab, t-rex, or shark for a combat through the use of Speak with Animals and convincing that beast who the bad guys are, or where to scout and what to look for through the use of animal handling (conveniently druids and rangers usually have higher wisdom modifiers, as well as said spell) - makes everyone involved in such interactions! It is unfair to treat level 4 spell that you get at level 7 as CR7 wild shape. Keep in mind moon druid can wild shape only into a CR2 creature at that same level and by the level 20 moon druid will still not be able to wild shape into a Huge Giant Crab or Tyrannosaurus Rex, as both are CR8 and moon druid at level 20 is capped only with CR6 forms. This just shows how powerful smart beast is considered and how Polymorph is not meant to be used as.

[@eonmoon2166]

first proper boss we fought was a cr 15 fire/earth elemental beast, think flaming scorpion king, in a game that we started at lvl 8. we polymorphed it into a rabbit, then dropped it from a few hundred feet up via my artificers flying guardian, it splatted and reverted hurt a lot. then one member banished it to their water dimension pocket where it failed to escape over several rounds (like 2 or 3 nat 1s) when it popped back it was on last legs and our held action nova finished it off. GM intended for us to flee and gain help from the kingdoms guards, buuut we kinda nixed that n,n

[@videogameunderappreciateda8174]

I always liked that pixies get polymorph. Not for the spirit summon stuff. But because it allows pixies to have really interesting encounters with the players as they can turn them into rats and stuff for pranks.

[@VestedUTuber]

Adventurer: "Pixies? What are they supposed to do, tickle us?" Pixie: "Beep beep you're a sheep!" -Adventurer- Sheep: "Baaaaaaaah!"

[@ЛизаЗыкина-г3ы]

nice. Keep up the good work.

[@botondhetyey159]

"That's a 2 point loss in DPR, but to make up for it, you are a huge giant crab"

[@TigerKirby215]

One of my favorite moments of all time was when the party was fighting a huge sized monster that the DM had homebrewed. The Fighter (Rune Knight) and the monster were wrestling each-other while the Wizard held it down with Evard's Black Tentacles, the Sorcerer bombarded it with Storm Sphere, and I (Genie Warlock) flew hundreds of feet in the air and kept sniping it with Eldritch Blast. When the Fighter finally started to fall below 20 HP I flew down and casted Polymorph on them, turning them into a T-Rex. They then proceeded to bite the head off the monster that was now at their size. It was a really awesome moment.

[@SuaveNerd2000]

Sudden thought, Eladrin using spring fey step to launch a friend into the air and then polymorph them into either a giant ape or brontosaurus

[@braindavidgilbert3147]

Oh I saw a campaign do this. They had a dude dimension door 400ft up and turn into a brontosaurus at the last minute and completely destroy what the dm was worried would be a tpk. It was hilarious.

[@VestedUTuber]

@@braindavidgilbert3147 So they opened the door, got on the floor, and then everybody dropped the dinosaur?

[@braindavidgilbert3147]

@@VestedUTuber it was a rounding success

[@williamturner6192]

I thought that seeing the beast was default. Also anyone know if you can cast polymorph on a similacrum?

[@jasonreed7522]

Seeing the beast may be fairly common, and was apparently a thing in 3.5. However, you had to have gone to a terrible wizard school for them to not have a monster biology class to familiarize yourself with most polymorph candidates. Along with field trips to view such creatures. It can also be adjusted from "seen" to "familiar with" which makes reading about and seeing a picture of a T-Rex in a book in the library counts. This way it only gates the really broken stuff like T-Rex and other dinos to parties that have actual encountered such beasts. The most important rule for polymorph, the caster provides the stat block for creatures they plan to use. (This is to avoid slowing down the game looking up the block for an orca in your desert campaign)

[@KungfooBucket]

I don't let my players polymorph into creatures they haven't seen... But i do let them poly into descriptions of creatures they haven't seen. That's how instead of a rhino we got a chonkers grey unicorn. (with rhino stats ofc)