The King of Water Cooling and Questionable Marketing

[@Um-icky]

I've seen techies wear anti-static gloves before handling computer electronics. But first time seeing rubbing a cat for same protection😁

[@jlelelr]

that's pro tip

[@Fatpumpumlovah2]

If ur a regular viewer u would know his flooring for review build room is rubber

[@michaellegg9381]

Cats absorb static electricity ⚡⚡ every time I pat my cat I get a ⚡ so they will definitely cop the bolt 🔩 before the PC does 😁

[@jesperdalsgaard5164]

That could have been CATastrophic

[@Ruiso7]

Nah those gloves are for fingerprints and oils to get into some of the parts, if they wear anti static it usually goes on their ankle so it is out of the way.

[@undefwun2135]

The Optimus is one good looking water block. Like probably my favorite aesthetics wise. That being said. Calling Roman out for his testing is just wild. One thing I've always noticed is the strict way he tests, immaculate attention to detail and access to some equipment most YT reviewers don't. Of all the people to call out, he would be one of the lasts ones. His whole business rests on what he is known for, precision. What weirdos...

[@BleepBlop-rh9lm]

I prefer the Heatkiller. It's amazingly beautiful.

[@undefwun2135]

@@BleepBlop-rh9lm My list of parts for my next build, in Q1 hopefully, actually has had the Heatkiller (both CPU and GPU) on it for months. Their stuff no doubt looks amazing. While I do like the Optimus counterparts a little more look wise, the cost is more than double once you factor in conversion to AUD and shipping (I can source Heatkiller from a local importer), so Heatkiller is staying on the list.

[@tacticalcenter8658]

I'm calling out the testing. I want to see more than just a single 10x render bench and gaming. Give us prime95, linpack etc.

[@mikezappulla4092]

⁠@@tacticalcenter8658why. No one runs small FFTs all day. If you are checking for stability I guess you could use linpack if you are checking for stability of an overclock cpu and ram. At least cinebench is Avx which you will find in games and is not checking for ram stability.

[@optimuswatercooling]

Hey, Optimus here, glad you like the look of our blocks! Glad Derbauer approves of our block, we put a lot of work into making it :) And we'll take away the marketing guy's coffee :D. For testing, there are different ways of testing and we're very passionate about benchmarking, which is why we have a full detailed writeup about what we do. Our customers like us testing the top CPUs, like the 7950x, at full load, so 250w. The test here was at ~145w, so that 100w will give very different results because most blocks struggle at those higher wattages. We also like testing using the same interface material, because then the numbers can be apples-to-apples. The DD vs IHS test here showed the Mycro with liquid metal vs the Optimus with paste.

[@BoredDSM]

Purchased a 3090 ftw waterblock from them during launch. Received it with the nickel coating flaking off and they stated it was fine. A month later it started corroding and contaminated my loop. They said they would warranty it and said I would have to buy another block for the fastest turn around and then they would refund me. It has been over a year now and I still reach out regularly with absolutely zero response. I would steer clear of this company! They make bold claims of a 10 year warranty but when its time to honor it you are left with the bill!

[@Mildly_Amused]

Optimus claims to have a long warranty, but when the coating started coming off their RTX 3090 Kingpin blocks, Optimus told people that the blocks are out of production and no replacement parts are available. The only option was to have the customers ship them back to Optimus and have them recoated. UPS shipping with insurance for a Kingpin block cost more than having a local shop strip and recoat the blocks.

[@wahidtrynaheghugh260]

Lmfao all their talk about the special coating they do that doesn’t flake off and nobody does it because it’s expensive and doesn’t look look as nice as electroplated nickel… and it flaked right off LOL

[@Mildly_Amused]

For several years, Optimus has been saying that anyone who gets different comparison test results than they get are testing incorrectly. Its their typical response.

[@Gelantious]

Always a good idea being hostile towards their customers... Honestly just that attitude of theirs is enough for me to stay away and go with any other brand.

[@Manhunternew]

But it makes sense, another test will produce a different result? Only exactly the same test can produce the same result

[@PainterVierax]

@@Manhunternew it's only making sense if you're hiding the fact you're cherry picking the test to get the highest numbers. Claiming their product with IHS is better compared to a very performant modern direct die concurrent is wild. For them to perform an honest comparison while not breaking the thermodynamics laws (and the thermal resistivity equations), this test must be performed on very peculiar conditions which are extremely favorable to their product. If they were so confident about their marketing claims, they won't make such a typical response and let people find out where such an expensive (and well-built) product can realistically make the difference. That's very bad PR, it remembers me 5years ago the Principled Technologies debacle during the Intel 9900K paper launch.

[@BerzerkaDurk]

I knew something was sketchy when I read their website and they claimed the flatness of their coldplates was less then 25 microns of 'surface roughness'. I'm a machinist, so I know that surface roughness is a finish spec, _not_ a flatness spec. Definitely a failure of the marketing department. I bought my CPU and GPU waterblocks from them, and they are beautifully designed and constructed. The machining is phenomenal. I've been very pleased with my purchase, even though the first one I bought leaked like no tomorrow, due to the acrylic top being very much NOT flat at the mating surface. They were talking to me about it until I sent them pictures of just how NOT flat it was (0.33mm). Since then, it's been radio silence.

[@BerzerkaDurk]

​@elcactuar3354thank you for correcting my phone. well done.

[@optimuswatercooling]

Hey, Optimus here, glad you like the blocks! And you bring up a good point. We'll look to clear up the confusion about roughness vs flatness vs smoothness etc. When our cold plates get mounted, they are no longer "flat", they'll have a profile to match the IHS. However, they are perfectly smooth to an extremely high degree when they come off the machine. We believe we're the only company who does a true mirror on copper direct from the factory. And, sorry about the CS issues, we might be slow sometimes, but we'll always get it taken care of!

[@Nickles4]

@@optimuswatercoolingI feel like people don’t understand the background of your company and the insane tolerances that go into each product.

[@SmogginMog]

Those poor engineers at Optimus don't deserved to be saddled with their horrible marketing department.

[@philth7587]

I don't know that they even have a department of anything. I think it's a pretty small operation. I wanted a 4090 FE block from them. Gave up waiting though. A shame that they do talk crap instead of just letting the products speak for themselves

[@minhajul94]

It's like 3 or 4 guys lol

[@-szega]

The engineers are the marketing department lol

[@gutterg0d]

​@-szega Which is kind of obvious when you start thinking about it. They don't communicate what the customers need to know about the product. They communicate the things they want the world to think about it, which is what people proud of their work tend to do.

[@mddunlap03]

Same with amd they matched the last Gen 6800xt with a 20% smaller die and instead of calling it the 7600xt marketing said same money same performance as lest gen but 20% MORE profit...looks like almost no uplift over last Gen when it's 7800xt should be close to the 7900xt

[@DrDAC-go7hs]

Great video. I really appreciate your honesty and professionalism. Optimus are known for talking down their competition and acting shady, they've been called out before when doing so on Reddit.

[@ArmadaOne]

I love how they made the block the same size as the mounting so you don't need ugly brackets sticking out and the whole thing looks like it's part of the design of the motherboard, just bleding in and looking great. Sure, this limits the block to just one type of socket secure mechanism (AMD mounting in this case), but it just looks fantastic compared to any other cool block apart from maybe the dedicated EK full cover blocks which are often much more expensive. I also really like the quality of the product.

[@Naga2x]

Here in Europe we are not used to companies comparing themselves, but from what I've seen in the US is pretty typical to go against the competition full boar.

[@noxious89123]

My expectation is that when they tested the TG Mycro, they used KPX between the die and the coldplate, not liquid metal. Which is dumb, because anyone that is comfortable enough with delidding is 100% going to use liquid metal.

[@Tekjive]

100% this …also gota say I like Roman’s rawdog approach to not protecting the caps near the naked die as well 😅

I doubt thermal paste can even transfer heat fast enough for such a small die. I used on 5800X3D ( check OCN 5800X3D owner thread, I delided for the sake of curiosity), temperature shot up to 80C in cinebench, but on LM its well below 60. Die is so small hence only LM can handle it imo.

[@rustler08]

This is what I'm thinking, too. And at that point, it's because the TIM is inappropriate for the use-case not because the cooler is so good.

[@optimuswatercooling]

Hey there, Optimus here, very good question! The reason for paste is because the results are far more consistent run to run. When we compare blocks, in order to truly know the correct results, we will use the same interface between blocks. Using LM for one and paste for another and then comparing the results wouldn't be a true apples-to-apples comparison. Additionally, interestingly, LM on the 7950x at 250w is only a few C better than KPX paste, which is extremely good. Other blocks will have a higher delta because of how they're designed than the Signature.

[@jarnom85]

​@@optimuswatercooling Optimus's Signature V2 and V3 are fantastic blocks but soon as i saw your blatant lies in your website i desided not to buy it. Your marketing claims Signature V3 block beats direct die blocks while having original IHS attached to the CPU. With identical testing conditions (coolant temperature, flow etc..) no waterblock that need contact the cpu trough IHS will have smaller temperatures than direct die waterblock, no matter if Optimus was used with LM or not, it wont beat Direct Die because of basic thermodynamics. If your testing results say otherwise then your testing is flawed.

[@TheArilin]

Intel, Nvidia, Amd, Apple, Samsung and more all advertise directly comparing to a competitors' products. It's definitely less of a thing in smaller brands, but very popular overall.

[@Tekjive]

I gota say, it’s rare nowadays for a competitor to acknowledge all the plus sides of their competition, even commending them on a lot of those aspects, especially with what was said by that competition, seems truly objective. GN getting in on this seems like a good idea as well as he’s also as objective as they come, which is why I follow both of you. Good on you bro, that’s how you do it 🤙🏻

[@heslo8767]

Good on you Roman! I've been following your channel for a while now and your products even longer. You make GREAT stuff (content and hardware included) and if I didn't already have an IceMan DD kit I would have purchased your Mycro block. What Optimus did is pretty unprofessional to be honest so it's great you calling them out on it; the fact they even feel the need to do it speaks wonders in my book! Even though they didn't treat you fairly you still gave them a glowing review of their hardware and workmanship. Props to you dude, you're a class act!

[@reallycome1]

you are an absolute Legend as always! Keep up with the outstanding job! WE APPRECIATE YOUR TIME AND EFFORT! Best regards from London. Regards, Ian.

[@1_2_die2]

Thanks for testing against murky marketing. Shady behavior from Optimus to say the least. But now with all the other medias involved we will hopefully see the complete picture. (the world needs more cats)

[@trip5003]

Sadly there are tons of homeless ones , poor creatures

[@johngoodman5094]

Shady behavior is Optimus's specialty

[@tacticalcenter8658]

Why doesn't he just use ptime95 and more tests like it? Theres more workloads than just gaming and render.

[@tacticalcenter8658]

@@optimuswatercooling stop being brainwashed.

[@optimuswatercooling]

Hey, Optimus here, we'll have a talk with our marketing guy, he drinks a LOT of coffee :D We stand by our numbers and are very much looking forward to Gamers Nexus and other testing! As was pointed out, there are multiple ways to test. Many customers request performance testing from us at full load on the top CPUs, so a 7950x at full wattage (~255w) vs the 7700x at ~145w like tested here. Also, very stable testing for long-term performance is requested, especially if it's for business use. We like Prime 95 and similar because the settings allow for an extremely stable load at 10 minutes, which is not always the case with a 10-20 second test like Cinebench or gaming.

[@mikec1341]

Between you and Steve Optimus won't have a leg to stand on. Both you and Steve are unquestionable when it comes to ethics and testing. Thank you.

[@ChrisGR93_TxS]

14:17 to avoid using excessive amounts of lm, apply first on the die and put the block on . Then remove it and check where to apply on the block (should leave a pattern from touching the chips) and also if your contact was good enough

[@tpanther9567]

Having GN doing the testing is going to be an interesting test. I am not a water cooling person but I do enjoy the knowledge that gets put forth when the testing is done.

[@1kreature]

They are correct in one respect though: Using a chiller to test, keeping the water temperature constant and thus eliminating the water->air variance from the radiator. There is a positive feedback loop in efficiency for any radiator where higher water temperature allows higher energy transfer from water to air through radiator. What we want to know for a waterblock is simply best transfer of heat from CPU to water. Room temp and water temp will influence this a bit. You try and compensate for this by subtracting water temperature but if water temperature has changed it has changed the premises for the rest of the thermal deltas in the test. Not by much probably, but the margins are so small here.

[@Vanadium]

Welp yeah but no. If your room temp is the same you have results you can use.

[@kulilin3104]

Sadly, many Americans don't realize how good we have it with importing items from overseas. Between shipping/handling and customs fees/taxes, Europeans do not have it as good as we do for ordering tech.

[@walterrankin200]

I'm running a chiller with a 7950x3d in one pc and one pc with 7900x, both with Mycros direct die, two alpha cool pumps, a 160 l/hr chiller. high temps on cine bench about 60 degrees running both at same time. overclocked as far as i know how to. cant get them to go over 62 degrees!!! I think your blocks are killer!!!

[@walterrankin200]

oh yeah running starfield 200 fps it was running at 51 degrees

[@LunarGhostII]

I have your block, and when I saw this new block release I was very surprised at the claims. Ngl was considering getting this but after seeing your testing, you just saved me $300+. Still a bit miffed that it took so long for the Mycro to release but the product is amazing. I do think the snide commentary from Optimus is ridiculous considering your testing scenario is much more real world than their used pump speed and chiller. Its nice to see the performance from the extreme end but realistically who the hell has all that given the application.

[@saw141]

I deeply respect and value your honesty and integrity. Ever since I learned about you, you have never seemed like anything less than an honest enthusiast.

[@ominguti6345]

I'm not surprised at all 😂 I actually own a Mycro on top of a delided 7950x and the performance I'm getting out of that cooler is exactly as advertised (20C difference compared with a 360 AIO on top of a non delided cpu). I think at this point at these power levels we're really being limited by the heat transfer through the silicon the most. A bigger block is not going to help. Thinning the die would. This is the best explanation of the results for me.

[@Xamy-]

If you are game to thin the die, report back to us, lol.

[@gymnastchannel7372]

Roman, thank you for being classy as well as objective. Many of us will support companies with strong ethics such as yours. Have a good day.

[@arkratos]

Really appreciate this level of testing and discussion about different testing processes between companies

[@elviscera4661]

I do enjoy the care you invest in your videos which IMO are unmatched by any others. Had a question though. I noticed that for example at 6:32 you show a pump flow of 170.1 l/h (or about 0.75 US g/m). Is this a static setting or is it managed with PWM? Assuming static, in my systems, I have found this to be too low, I tend to use more like 340 l/h (or about 1.5 US g/m) PWM managed for such workloads. The increased flow level makes a very big difference in my benchmark temps without having the fans/pumps blastingly loud. As a pertinent example, a i9-13900KF running Cinebench R23 gives 40.5K with 82C max pkg with 26C incoming (HEATKILLER IV PRO Copper block, MO-RA3 420 w/18 Arctic p14 PWM fans push/pull). It really seems to work better/quieter with higher water flow. If I were to use that super nifty Optimus block (LGA1700 version) I'd increase the flow.

[@thomasburchsted3287]

Dude you have shown to be one of the most up front and honest reviewers. Wearing your other hat at Thermal Grizzly; I’ve been impressed with all of your products. I’ve got TG direct die on 7950X3D, and it’s been great!

[@Crftbt]

Looking forward to Steves results in addition to the excellent data you've provided today.

[@ronnyspanneveld8110]

I think that PVD coated brass with titanium alloy. The coating looks almost the same as mine, mine comes from Aquacomputer in well you know :P (it comes with a tube Thermal Grizzly hydro :P ) Mine was 180 but i got it for 80 since i am old (54) and been using their stuff since the first block :P You should try one out to mine got Vario i can adjust the bow of block with 4 screw's. got 2c by tuning it.

[@fs9553]

what baffles me and basically what Roman is saying as well is the actual product is just great so why they do all the shady marketing is beyond me. They (Optimus that is) don't need it. The quality of the product speaks for itself. Marketing is killing their own company that way.

[@michigantoga]

I have this blcok, I switched out my EK block for it. It was a big difference on my 7950X. I am very satisfied with it. Iy keeps my 7950X double digit cooler than the EK block & the 7950X is a hot CPU.

[@paskowitz]

Small note. The Aquacomputer High Flow Next needs to have a few cm of straight tube run on both sides in order to get accurate flow readings.

[@Kowalskithegreat]

I believe that only applies to the older MPS FLOW models, the manual for my high flow next pretty much says you can put it wherever, my older mps flow 200 stated the no bends before or after requirement in the manual. the flow series work off comparing pressure across a venturi so removing turbulence is much more important, high flow next uses a spinning rotor so it's gonna count the liters no matter how turbulent they are

[@alt5494]

Personally don't think you or optimus are wrong your testing methods are dramatically different. Theirs test is substantially different at significantly higher power input. It was wrong on your part to compare thermal paste against liquid metal while testing their claim. Also when comparing a practical test verses a maximum test the delta will be less extreme. Using a lower power CPU has a similar effect. I do agree completely with you it is wrong to name your competition in marketing without independent testing.

[@sentraselify]

Glad to see you playing it neutral Roman. You always seemed to play things fair. I'm curious to see results cause most of them beat my corsair xc7(I think it's a xc7). But I'm happy where I'm at. Thanks for all the work

[@rustler08]

All-in-all, I'm happy with the Core 1 that I purchased. It's a very reasonable price, it looks good, and it's not absurdly large.

[@beedoox5613]

I'd tried to buy one of these, but there's been no stock for some time - apparently while new, more cost effective designs were being worked on. The Optimus website now seems to have these updated parts - but I was loathed to purchase one after reading about the redesign, and went for the Watercool Heatkiller IV AM5 part instead. Maybe you'd consider revisiting the Optimus brand now they've gone "economical".

[@Ezz0Clan]

Really like the look of the block, think it'd be kinda amazing in all black none RGB builds. I think the "Competition is bad" mindset has kinda got them, which is unfortunate since they seemingly have excellent product at their deposit. I hope they understand that you're not here to invalidate their accomplishments, but to enhance the product both you and others manufacture create. Competition is good, and I'll definitely keep their product in mind when shopping for new PC.

[@tomhollins5303]

Perfect title for this video. A class leading product and real weird marketing

[@sithyarael6807]

Your way of testing is more real world scenario. And using the same testing across all is actually the best way to do it.

[@Thisandthat8908]

which should come as no surprise to anybody. Company or user. This is how you compare products properly.

[@johngoodman5094]

Its insane that they test under multi-hour P95 with a chiller and say that is somehow a more correct method.

[@tacticalcenter8658]

Its not more real world. I do more than just games and rendering

[@tacticalcenter8658]

​@@johngoodman5094no its not insane

[@optimuswatercooling]

Hey there, to clarify, we test using a temp regulator at 25c, which isolates the water temp and doesn't let it fluctuate, it also takes the fans and radiator and room temp out of the equation. It's a very scientific way to get extremely accurate results. Regarding P95, we do 10 minute tests, which is pretty standard. 10-20 Cinebench tests and gaming can have a lot of variation in the load (wattage)@@johngoodman5094

[@PitboyHarmony1]

An over the top example where engineers create an extreme, best of class product and their own marketing department throw them under the bus by actually claiming testing inaccuracies by Roman ... of all people ... Roman. Be8auer then says ok, lets do that then ... and hard core mic drops them with actual like to like testing, then walk off stage to send independent reviewers requests to do their own testing specifically on this. Optimus engineers just hid behind their monitors and chuckled. Marketing? Just a face palm.

[@floodo1]

Always keepin it real, never any fakery

[@CuttingEdgeRetro]

@der8auer try rotating the Core 1 block 90 Degree and retesting. Alpha Core 1 block was very heaverly Designed with Intel's Die location in mind not AMD chiplets.

[@frankd.b.9233]

Apparently no one takes continuous water flow into account, the pumps are still not good enough to do this, water can only absorb so much heat when it flows, too fast is not good and certainly not too slow, therefore these numbers need to be better regulated for stability too cool, with coolant, which does not only consist of water like a car, etc.

[@Speak_Out_and_Remove_All_Doubt]

@der8auer-en How is your delided/IHS mono-block for AM5 coming along, I watched that video 4-5 months ago and thought it looked pretty much ready but I can't see where to buy it or how the development is coming on??? Thanks Roman.

[@Simon_Denmark]

Are you talking about Mycro? It’s not a monoblock. I can see it on many retailers but it doesn’t seem to be available anywhere where I checked. Also I’m suprised that no one here talked about wire view firmare problem. I had a problem with not being able to save settings and contacted TG and they told that the wire views had a firmware bug. They couldn’t give me a date for a new one so I just got a refund.

[@Tracenji]

same question here, i hope it will be ready (and still compatible) by the time zen 5 comes out

[@der8auer-en]

we're making about 100 a month currently. The demand is just sooo much higher than expected :D I thought it's just niche and our initial 200pcs would last a while... well :D but we're working on ramping up the production

[@DanielKennedyaeos]

I have one, it's great on my 7800X3D (admittedly not a very thermally limited chip). Will keep it if AMD brings out a good 16C Zen 5 chip.

[@Speak_Out_and_Remove_All_Doubt]

@@Simon_Denmark That's exactly what I am talking about, never knew it had a name or was finished and on sale. Thanks!

[@leftcoastfunk]

Calling Roman's testing methods "wrong" is enough of a clue that at the very least one person at Optimus has NO clue what they're talking about. The most important part of testing isn't what test(s) you run, but rather removing or at least maintaining the consistency of as many variables as possible between runs and between products - which Roman is extremely fastidious about doing It's really unfortunate that such a good product is overshadowed by their own idiotic sales and marketing antics. Saying things like they want to keep things classy, while simultaneously calling out another specific product?! Super NOT classy. If you can't get sales by how good your own product is, you certainly won't get them by trying to claim how bad someone else's product is. What lazy marketing smh (especially since their claims aren't even true. Block-to-TIM temps being lower than direct die?! On what planet???) Anyway, I'll gladly NOT buy what is easily one of the best blocks out there and settle for just about any inferior product just to not support a company that acts this way. Also, it's super expensive. Double the price for slightly better performance isn't worth it in most cases

[@jihamiya5755]

That's an unbelievably calm and serene orange car.

[@cyclechris6591]

Guessing the chiller use would eliminate the water heating up a little between tests? On the other hand I think Roman just subtracts it out with difference of first run. Lets see what Steve comes up with.

[@eddieestrada5579]

You are so cool! Great context,and personal integrity as well.

[@GRCDriver23]

On a 7800X3D w/ IHS at idle, the Signature 3 is about 6-8 degrees cooler than the Foundation block I ran previously. Is that worth the price difference to most people? No.. But I wanted to try it out and continue to support a domestic brand that produces outstanding product. I still think for 99% of people the Foundation block is plenty and better than almost any other block even taking the price into consideration. If you catch a blemish block on sale all the better as their quality standards are INSANE. Totally agree about the marketing though, they need to be seeding product to real reviewers and stop posting nonsense.

[@peterwusc]

I wonder if the Alphacool waterblock is optimized for AMD (i.e. shift to match the CCD) for comparing with an AMD specific block. That alone can have like 2C difference sometimes even with AIO.

[@theaussiesuperduty]

they have offset mounts available for AMD

[@bobeyes3284]

Prime95 isn't representative of anything I've ever had to use and I don't know a single person that has a chiller. I'm struggling to see it from their point of view.

[@koford]

R23 isnt representative of anything either?

[@bgtubber]

​@@koford It is. Cinebench simulates CGI rendering workloads. It's produced by the creators of Cinema 4D. A well known and widely used CGI software.

[@rotony1]

The cat needs water cooling too.

[@choggi]

Your products are so good that other people trash talk them, congrats :)

[@EinSwitzer]

Also pulse rate for pumps to peak thermal adhesion to fluids

[@BSEUNHIR]

Between cost, weight, a more vulnerable cooling surface due to even tinier structures and more wobbly mounting... I don't think I can justify getting an optymus over the mycro. I very much hope the mycro will be compatible with zen 5 X3D, since that's when I plan to upgrade next.

It's the mounting issue. Although the die and cold plate are both super flat, the others like standoffs, mb, backplate are not the same. Check the balance level of the die, then the block see if they're almost perfectly balanced. If they do then the mounting shouldn't even need LM. This is why mycro die block performance well because the mounting is more superior compare the traditional. Smaller is better in this case.

Btw, where in the actual world can one find the mycro direct die block really? All is out of stock. It's annoying that you guys make products and none are available.

[@SimanSlivar]

To be honest the direct dies are going to not matter as much since at a point your fighting the surface area of the die not the water contact with the block.

[@RonI-qz2tz]

Great video. Thank you for testing this, And taking the time to explain everything.

[@diego1694]

The rate of energy transfer depends on the difference of temperature, so I am not sure how you can "normalize" for water temperature. It seems to me that water temp must be the same in all tests for a fair comparison.

[@volentimeh]

It's not like it's difficult to test a calibration curve with a range of different water temps on a few select blocks (to make sure the effect is consistent) then apply that curve to the test rig. A better point to argue is what flow rate to use between blocks, do you normalize that too? Don't see many graphs with different flow rates (if any).

[@Christhebearable]

I wonder if this could be related to the nickle coating issue you found recently. Maybe they were testing against a block with this problem?

[@alexmills1329]

Something that might be getting lost here is Optimus is a Chicago based company. That area has a very competitive mindset and puts themselves against anyone to distinguish themselves, it’s an ego thing. I think Optimus is just getting caught up in their roots and ego here, not that they don’t make a great product, I run an Optimus block, but that they feel the need to put down others verbally instead of letting their product do all the talking.

[@riba2233]

thank you for being so transparent!

[@EthelbertCoyote]

Thank you as always or your diligence!

[@C.M.C.B]

Thanks for tour honest approach !!

[@cdurkinz]

10:56 ya that's literally how scientific testing works. So optimus are just being jags. Prime95 for CPU is ridiculous in this day and age tbh there are almost no power-virus loads like that in real life. An argument could be made for rendering but even then most people are using CUDA at this point or QSV... so just test those?

[@KaPono2]

7700X is such a great 👍 gaming CPU, my son absolutely loves it in his PC

[@vinnyveritas9599]

Seems like they compare to the best, what should they do then? Not compare? But as to prime95, it makes sense to test with it because it maximizes heat as opposed to cinebench or games. Nobody cares about max temps at idle either. So stress-testing with prime95 is a really logical way to do it.

[@Cblan1224]

I have the V3 block on a direct die 7950x3d and it's such a beast. I had them send it to me in raw brass and I had it nickel plated

[@infango]

have considered lapping it ?

[@daigriffiths399]

That type of advertising ('we're better than our named competitors') is common in the USA but not in Europe. I was over there on placement for a year some time ago and the first time I saw an advert on TV that drew a direct comparison to their closest competitors I was like 'WTF???!!!' IIRC it was for Tylenol vs some other paracetamol/acetaminophen -based painkiller. In addition, it rapidly became apparent that if a test was not biased towards 'their' product, then the test must be wrong. It appears that you found that out with Optimus.

[@GodmanchesterGoblin]

Came here to say similar. Bashing the competition in the US seems fair game. In the UK it's very rare, and also in the rest of Europe, from what I have seen. So perhaps it's largely a cultural difference, but certainly in the UK there is very specific guidance on competitive comparisons.

[@chengong388]

If you have massive surface area with water, the naturally you want to make the temperature differential between water and the heat sink as big as possible with a water chiller, this will maximize your surface area advantage.

[@sportsfamily77]

Has anyone ever made a block that cools better mounted to an ihs when compared to direct die? That just doesn't seem possible thermodynamically.

[@ukaszsmoa8416]

Will there ever be a different version of the Mycro block, with clear acrylic top that also includes rgb? I like to see water flow through the block, but also like to have the option to have some light.

[@laurensbrantsen]

Roman, absolute class act in acknowledging the positives of the Signature V3, while also objectively showing the false marketing in a respectful manner. I find the marketing of Optimus quite hostile, this only shows overall weakness. Also, for Optimus saying that your (or any other customer's) testing methodology is wrong, is kinda sad. I really hope that Optimus will revise their PR and marketing, as from a technical standpoint, it is a very high quality product. I really hope that if Optimus's marketing departement is actually a separate marketing departement, that they will revise their strategy. If the marketing department is the same group of engineering people, please hire a good marketing person/team. Acknowledge that you are very good in developing a high quality product (that deserves respect), but that marketing is a different profession that can make or break a company's reputation, regardless of the product quality.

[@atino365]

Where are people actually buying the Mycro? I can't seem to find it in the US.

[@JosiahBradley]

Get Steve on the case Roman! Let's do justice. Third party results should settle this.

[@velo1337]

the question is, do those blocks really differ across the power range from 90w - 125w to 250w to 300w?

[@Blackwing2345635]

It is always fascinating, how management and marketing are eager to ruin genuinely great product, because it is never enough for them.

[@timmienorrie]

Imagine the engineers working flat out to produce the best in the world and the marketing dept then makes a mess of it. 😠

[@personaltrainersg]

I bought the core 1 alphacool block based on your review. It wprks great and is super easy to install on am5. Does the tg direct die frame v2 fpr ryzen 7000 work with the core 1 block?

[@robertmoore119]

First, I am an American. Second, I support American Products. I also support products from other countries. I will say the the Optimus block is very good. If I wanted a ihs designed waterblock for AM4 and I had the money to spend, I would purchase an Optimus. If I wanted a water block that was designed for direct die, I would likely purchase the Mycro. I concur with the channel here, I don't understand why someone would make those types of claims. And then to call out testing methods, rather that just say there was some kind of mistake is a bad marketing move. To be honest, the block is awesome, its biggest negative is the marketing claims. Hopefully what I hear about customer support improves. Why would anyone claim that a water block using an IHS is going to beat another that is direct die unless it is also being used in direct die form? The ihs is a barrier that design cannot overcome. It is impossible.

[@kelownatechkid]

Great video, excellent to see an investigation like this!

[@MrMaxwins]

It's a pity we didn't see tests of Alphacool Core 1 + Direct die. Perhaps this would turn out to be the most optimal solution, considering the price - result

[@PiMi91]

the main reason i agree is, why doing marketing against your product if it cost the double and perform the same? is pointless... and even if their claming where right (4° degree less), still cost the double for almost the same performance...

[@Ender_Wiggin]

LOL my main complanit with aquacomputer is that is hard to get in the US. Also they seem to always be out of stock.

[@EmoEmu]

Comparatively the Alphacool Core 1 bloack is €99 to 119 depending on if you want RGB or not. That's a third of ordering one of these Optimus Signature V3.

[@Jemmy350]

Would love to see how the modultra combo preforms, but IDK if you can use it as just a waterblock.

[@fusion1203]

Where is his water block comparison video?

[@salapolivalenta77]

Super professional tests as always!

[@wtcamer]

Crazy to see and Steve will shoot straight and call them like he sees them.

[@xDreyer]

@der8auer how does it compare to EK's velcocity 2?

[@richmanricho]

It's a bold strategy, Cotton, let's see if it pays off for them

[@panagiotisnakoudis3764]

You are a true gentleman ! CUDOS

[@josuelservin]

A pretty block with amazing performance for sure! It's baffling they decide to go against the reviewers and tarnish their image with those claims, when they could be reaping a clear cut win...

[@carlchristenisnes6763]

I think that 'derBauer' is on to something... regarding reviews, he has always 'spot on' but acknowledges that a second review would be good... kudos to derbauer for that - i trust his reviewes even more now

[@draakevil]

Prime95 is not a benchmark that resembles any real life load and is not suitable for comparing cooling solutions. It's a burn-in tool to test CPU OC stability at best. They are just mad because they screwed up their tests and now look really dumb.

[@Crftbt]

I like how der8bauer posts a video of the king of water cooling same day Gamers Nexus posts their Best CPU Air coolers video. :)

[@alexqiu1758]

I think there is also a problem with EK direct die cooling block, could you do a video on that?

[@MrDrTheJniac]

I recall seeing a test wherein the TechN block beat the Optimus. I am interested in whether you can replicate that result.

[@wvupharmd]

Do you have a direct die frame for the i9 Lga1700 socket? I have an Optimus block and interested in using this as direct die application