Did Anyone Believe in the Trinity Before Nicea?

Recommended Reading - "The Forgotten Trinity" by James White: amzn.to/3Rls3bi (affiliate)
A charge that I have encountered in my comments is that nobody believed in the doctrine of the Trinity prior to the Council of Nicea. There is a half-truth to this in that, in the early days of the Church, the language of Trinitarian doctrine - namely, 1 God in 3 Persons, etc. - was not fully developed yet.
The linguistic understanding of the Trinity that Christians hold today comes largely from the Cappadocian Fathers - Basil the Great, Gregory of Nyssa and Gregory of Nazianzus - who lived around the latter half of the fourth century. Piggybacking off of the work of Athanasius, the great defender of Christ’s deity in the wake of Nicea, the Cappadocian Fathers would give the most detailed expression of what Trinitarianism affirms, that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are three co-equal, co-eternal divine Persons with one common being, substance or nature - that being of God.
It would be anachronistic to look for the fully articulated language of the doctrine of the Trinity prior to the ministry of these men. Nonetheless, what we can look for in early Church is the teaching of the core principles of Trinitarianism; that there is only one God, that Jesus is truly God as the Father is along with the Holy Spirit, but is nevertheless distinct from the Father & Spirit in His Personhood.
One of the preeminent early Church fathers was Ignatius, bishop of Antioch and a student of the apostle John. Ignatius wrote many letters before he was martyred in Rome in the year 107AD. In his letter to the church of Ephesus, Ignatius states in his opening, “…by the will of the Father, and Jesus Christ, our God…” This statement is proof of two things: 1) Ignatius believed Jesus was truly God and 2) Ignatius believed that Jesus was distinct from the Father. He makes a similar statement in chapter 18, while also referring to Jesus as, “the Son of God who was begotten before time began, and established all things according to the will of the Father…” In addition to overtly stating his belief in the deity of Christ, Ignatius also ascribes eternality and Creatorship to Him - these two attributes being ones that are only found in God. In chapter 19, he goes so far as to describe Jesus as, “…God being manifested as a man…”
Ignatius reenforces these beliefs in his letter to the Romans:
“…to the Church which has obtained mercy, through the majesty of the Most High Father, and Jesus Christ, His only-begotten Son; the Church which is beloved and enlightened by the will of Him that willeth all things which are according to the love of Jesus Christ our God…I also salute in the name of Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father…who are filled inseparably with the grace of God, and are purified from every strange taint, abundance of happiness unblameably, in Jesus Christ our God… to the Church which has obtained mercy, through the majesty of the Most High God the Father, and of Jesus Christ, His only-begotten Son; the Church which is sanctified and enlightened by the will of God, who formed all things that are according to the faith and love of Jesus Christ, our God and Saviour..."
These statements again affirm that Ignatius is a monotheist (he believes in only one God) while attributing that one essence of God to both the Father & the Son and, at the same time, maintaining a distinction between the Father & Son. This is Trinitarianian belief before the advent of the term Trinity.
“For our God, Jesus Christ, now that He is with the Father, is all the more revealed.”
“There is one Physician who is possessed both of flesh and spirit; both made and not made; God existing in flesh; true life in death; both of Mary and of God; first passible and then impassible, -- even Jesus Christ our Lord…our Physician is the only true God, the unbegotten and unapproachable, the Lord of all, the Father and Begetter of the only-begotten Son. We have also as a Physician the Lord our God, Jesus the Christ, the only-begotten Son and Word, before time began, but who afterwards became also man, of Mary the virgin.”
In this single statement Ignatius affirms: that Christ is truly God, that Christ’s unique office in the Godhead is as the Son and, simultaneously, that Christ is truly man. All of these beliefs are at the core of the Christian faith through the present day.
The Trinity is not a doctrine invented by men or a corrupt Church. It is the clear, consistent teaching of the entirety of the Christian scriptures and it was affirmed as such by the earliest generations of the Church.

[@AChristianGuy]

September 2024 - I am producing an updated series on the basics of Trinitarianism (better editing, narration, etc as well as expanded content). You can watch Ch.1 here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/r6DVXq2HdryNjbc You can also watch my old lecture on the doctrine here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/noKpY6J_YrF9n7c

[@jwsanders1214]

Thank you for your viewpoint , I agree . I made the mistake of thinking your viewpoint was against the deity of Christ , my mistake , God Bless You !

[@IAMtheLORD-ThatIsMyName]

Greetings! It's interesting that everything you quoted supports Oneness doctrine. Until Christ is fully formed in us all -james

[@HopeFaith7777]

Sir with no disrespect respect to you there is no such thing as trinity. Read kjv bible do what it say and God will reveal his truth to you. kzbin.info/www/bejne/iKrEk6BvftWdf5Isi=Hfq_nJQTKQLi66VV 1 Timothy 2 (KJV) ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯ ⁵ For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; ⁶ Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

[@pragasamanthony3251]

The Bible teaches, There is/was/will be ONE and ONLY ONE [ MOST HIGH ]GOD and ONE and ONLY ONE REDEEMER and MEDIATOR between GOD and MAN.

[@IAMtheLORD-ThatIsMyName]

@@pragasamanthony3251 Thank you for your opinion! But where is your authority and proof? "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness" (2Timothy 3:16). "Prove all things; hold fast that which is good" (1Thesalonians 5:21). Until Christ is fully formed in us all, -james

[@TheMOV13]

Before Isaac Newton formulated the theory of gravity, people used to float up into the air.

[@sun2620]

Good One:)

[@maciiol2]

Funnily enough Isaac Newton studied theology all throughout his life and rejected the trinity doctrine completely. He was inherently unitarian.

[@KFish-bw1om]

@@maciiol2 Yeah well, his theory of gravity was also wrong so...

[@KFish-bw1om]

@@maciiol2 Never read it. Not a Catholic. Wouldn't be surprised by any nonsense the RCC says, as they teach a false gospel anyway. Your argument has no weight whatsoever. The trinity is clearly represented in scripture, and was understood by the early church, long before Rome ever started making up nonsense about Mary or selling indulgences. The best argument you have is also the dumbest. "wElL tHe wOrD iSn'T iN tHe Bible!". Yeah, that's because it's a descriptive label applied by people to summarize the nature of God that has been clearly revealed to us in the Bible.

[@xxrandmlinksxxbruh2419]

@@maciiol2no it doesn’t😂

[@lcenteno262]

I used to be a Trinitarian in one of the world’s largest religious denominations for 53 years and taught and raised my own family the same for 18 years. I continued in this teaching right up until the day God had mercy on me and sent me the Holy Spirit who led me into all the truth (John 16:13). What does the Spirit have to say about this? If you have eyes to see and ears to hear, listen: “At that same time Jesus was filled with the joy of the Holy Spirit, and he said, “O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, thank you for HIDING THESE THINGS FROM THOSE WHO THINK THEMSELVES WISE AND CLEVER, and for REVEALING THEM TO THE CHILDLIKE. Yes, Father, it pleased you to do it this way.” (Luke 10:21) “Truly I tell you,” He said, “unless you change and become like little children, you will NEVER ENTER the kingdom of heaven.” (Matt. 18:3) Now, remember that show, “Are you smarter than a 5th grader”? Are you willing to be humble and be like a child? Take the test yourself and find out. The topic is based on the doctrine of the Trinity. This doctrine declares the Godhead is triune being comprised of Father, Son and Holy Spirit who are “co-equal” with each other and “are all God”. Without being a bible scholar or having to twist scripture, this is really quite simple. Ready to test yourself? Elementary 5th grade reading and basic 2nd grade math show us the truth of this matter; hence being like a child just like our Lord said: Open your Bible, go to the gospel of John and read the following verses for yourself: John 1:1-3. Now do the basic math. How many God beings do you count? 2 or 3? Having established that both the Father and the Son are God from what you just read, now read the following verses: John 5:17, 5:19, 5:20, 5:21, 5:22, 5:23, 5:26, 5:30, 5:36, 8:28, 12:50, 10:30, 14:6, 14:23, 14:28, 15:10, 17:3, 17:5, Rom. 1:1, Rom. 1:27, 1 Cor. 1:3, 1 Cor. 1:9, 1 Cor. 8:6-7, 1 Cor. 15:27-28, 2 Cor. 1:2-3, Eph. 1:2, 5:20, Philip. 1:2, Col. 1:3, 1 Thess. 1:3, 2 Thess. 1:2, Phil. 1:3, Heb. 1:8-13, 1 Peter 1:3, 2 Peter 1:2, 1 John 1:3, 1: John 5:20, 2 John 1:3, 2 John 1:9, Rev. 3:12, 7:10, 21:22-23. Now do the basic math. How many God beings do you count? 2 or 3? Now, ask honestly ask yourself, where in this world does 1 + 1 =3? The Spirit can keep going on with many more verses just like this. If you have the humility to be honest with yourself and what you just read, you will see the plain truth and the trinity doctrine is debunked. If the Holy Spirit was in fact God, why was he left out of all those verses? What happened to being co-equal? Little children truly believe in Santa Claus in all sincerity up until the day they discover the ugly truth of the matter, right? This isn’t any different. Why anyone would continue to believe in a lie after the truth has been revealed with the preponderance of overwhelming evidence? Ripping the band aid off hurts, doesn’t it? But, “the truth will set you free” (John 8:32). So now that you have read and seen the truth for yourself, do you still believe in the false trinity doctrine or did you fail the 5th grade test? If you failed it and still believe in the doctrines of men and not God, go to your Bible and read John 8:47. That is the harsh reality friend. Another biblical fact: Nowhere in the Bible does it say that the Holy Spirit is God. Nowhere! Christ also said, “the Father is greater than I” (John 14:28). Clearly, Christ by his very statement of fact said they are NOT co-equal! This totally scotches the doctrine of the trinity that claims the Father, Son and Spirit are co-equal. Who on earth would dare call Christ a liar? It’s sheer foolishness! How can anyone believe in the false doctrine of the trinity after reading the gospel of John? The gospel of John and other books of the Bible clearly testify that the doctrine of the triune god is a lie (John 1:1-3). The word “trinity” isn’t even written anywhere in the Bible, why would anyone believe it? The world foolishly says about the Spirit of God that he is “God the Spirit”. Christ tells us that “God IS spirit” (John 4:24). Do you see how foolish this is already? Why does God need a Spirit if he already IS spirit? It is the Spirit of God. The word “OF” being paramount as the Spirit belongs to God and Christ; the word “OF” denotes possession/ownership. They own it and they sent it (John 16:15) Don’t know who the Holy Spirit is? Simple, read John 1:51 and Hebrews 1:7, 1:14, and Psalm 104:4. There is our Helper in plain sight yet most are so blinded by the years of false teaching and lies they can’t see the truth. Angel of the Lord, Angel of God, Spirit of God, the Spirit of the Lord, the Spirit = Holy Spirit. Read Hebrews 1:7 and Psalm 104:4. Now go to the Book of Acts and read Acts 2:1-4 (The Coming of the Holy Spirit). This isn’t hard to figure out. Still can’t see? Paul cautioned us about false humility and the worship of angles (Col. 2:18). The Holy Spirit warned John twice in the Book of Revelation that he should not be worshiped (Rev. 19:10, 22:8-9). Let’s really simplify this: If a fallen angel is a demon spirit that belongs to Satan (Rev. 12:7), then an angel of God can only be what? A Holy Spirit because he belongs to God who is holy (Lev. 11:44, 1 Peter 1:16). Think about it, if the Holy Spirit was a single 3rd person of the Godhead, how is it even possible we can we all have him? See how foolish this is already? Do I get the Holy Spirit today and borrow him to you tomorrow? Can you see how foolish this world’s wisdom is. The answer is found again in Matthew 18:10 for it is written: “Beware that you don't look down on any of these little ones. For I tell you that in heaven THEIR ANGELS are always in the presence of my heavenly Father.” (Matt. 18:10). The words “their angels” (Holy Spirit) shows ownership. The Holy Spirit for each one of us was not sent until Christ came into his glory (John 7:39). Let the Bible explain itself, it's quite simple and straightforward. The teaching is very simple without having to twist scripture and believe in something that just isn't there like the word “trinity”. Biblical truth is solely based on the word of God (John 17:17) It’s time to unlearn one of the greatest lies of so called “modern Christianity”. Believe in what Christ said and taught. Believe in what is actually and clearly written in the word of God and not in the invented mythology or eisegesis of men. Get this, if you are worshiping the pagan invented god known as the “trinity”, you will never, ever receive the Holy Spirit (Acts 5:32) as you are breaking the 1st Commandment, a spiritual law of God’s coming kingdom (Rom. 7:14, Rev. 11:19) by creating your own god made up in the mythology and eisegesis of men. “that their hearts may be encouraged, being KNIT together in love, and attaining to all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the knowledge of the mystery of God, BOTH of the FATHER AND OF CHRIST, IN WHOM are hidden ALL the treasures of WISDOM and KNOWLEDGE.” (Col. 2:2-3 NKJV). Whom has ALL the treasures of wisdom and knowledge as you just read? The Father and Christ. Again, how many God beings do you count? 2 or 3? Lay down your pride and what you think you know about God and the Bible and unlearn the lies. Repent and let God through the Holy Spirit teach you. Unless you become like a child, you will never enter the Kingdom of God. Forget what you think you know as the Lord has sent me to reveal the simplicity of his teaching in spirit and truth. Finally, let’s read Proverbs 30:4 together: “Who has ascended into heaven, or descended? Who has gathered the wind in His fists? Who has bound the waters in a garment? Who has established all the ends of the earth? What is HIS NAME, and what is HIS SON’S NAME, If you know? One more time, how many God beings do you count? 2 or 3? Still don’t believe it? Let’s continue reading the rest of it: “Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. DO NOT ADD TO HIS WORD, Lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar.” (Prov. 30:5-6) FACT: The word “trinity” isn’t found anywhere in the Bible as it is “added” to His word. So now ask yourself, who is the liar? If today you hear his voice, harden not your heart! Repent for the Kingdom of God is near!

[@crazypuncher88]

Spitting facts, I’m Muslim but thank you, the trinity doesn’t make sense.

[@InvestigadorTJ]

language is NOT a barrier if you’ve known the doctrine. These aren’t kids learning to speak and not know words.. these are grown as men who are trying to fit a belief based on scriptures that contradict their own teaching but they want to still put it together….

[@israelcowl6764]

The Father is the only true God.

[@AChristianGuy]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/jV6wpYhoZZyDmcU kzbin.info/www/bejne/noKpY6J_YrF9n7c

[@SamC_182]

AND JESUS CHRIST WHOM HE HAS SENT. Finish the verse

[@SamC_182]

@@tongakhan230 you clearly don't understand the tri-unity of God then. Jesus can be God (because the bible says He is) and be Sent by God because the doctrine of the Trinity affirms the Jesus is NOT the Father, (Cos scripture already makes that clear too). If scripture affirms both things, how can we reconcile it? Answer: Trinity

[@jwsanders1214]

@@SamC_182 Yep

[@jwsanders1214]

@@tongakhan230 The Holy scriptures , old and new are about Jesus

[@DavidDrew-n6z]

Funny that God would not clearly state such an allegedly important doctrine in His Word. It took centuries of imperfect men to sub out the language of that doctrine and the further in time from the apostles you get the more complex the thought. Kinda like it was all from the thoughts of man alone.

[@HenryCoule]

Ya and I know these mere men are nothing but liars. The apostle who were with Jesus didn't even know the person they were with was God almighty and Jesus if this was true and so important, didn't even mention it to them so we can all keep it and remember it. Just bunch of liars. I believe in God the one true God who is ONE. the one who doesn't have some other people with him. Jesus is his name

[@lazywarriortv3096]

Try to state such doctrine to a 1st century uneducated Jews. Christ gave them the teaching which they needed at that time

[@bioeless]

If you read the Bible, you will find many verses that affirm God's triune nature. The problem was not that the Bible didn't say that God is trinitarian, but that Christians had lots of ways to say he was trinitarian, or many "Christians" rejected the idea of trinitarianism. Due to Roman persecution, Christians were unable to gather and lay it all down until Constantine legalized Christianity. Also, God did not write the Bible.

[@rubiks6]

The trinity is found clearly in Scripture over and over and over. The baptism of Jesus Christ was recorded in all four gospels, making it a very important event. In all four records, you will find all three members of the Trinity present at the baptism. You're just being hard-headed.

[@scottblow7154]

Prove it Polycarp was taught by John and protested trinity. Clearly saying it was pagan. He was martyred

[@shahidrasul6210]

There is ONLY ONE GOD! HE has NO partners! HIS sovereignty over all! FOR him is all gratitude! HIS power DOMINATES ALL. No eye has seen HIM, HE is Eternal and Self Sufficient. He Depends on No one. He is not physical , never has been!

[@mustafaisa2096]

GOD is one &only one not Subdivided into 3 parts call it 3 persons ,,,,JESUS is just human being not a god nor a son of GOD just one of Great prophets not greater than Abraham nor Moses. . . . . .

[@pantelispanopoulos]

@@mustafaisa2096 Then ice, liquid water and steam are not H2O! They are three different substances!!!

[@russelaitkenhead]

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made.” ‭‭John‬ ‭1‬:‭1‬, ‭3‬ ‭ESV‬‬ The Word is reference to Jesus Christ

[@robertd9965]

@@russelaitkenhead Seems rather like conjecture to me, since there are quite a few other parts in John that would contradict this conclusion.

[@russelaitkenhead]

⁠@@robertd9965 Which other verses in John’s gospel seem to contradict this? See also Hebrews 1:2 “but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.” ‭‭(ESV‬‬)

[@jacobmathew710]

Beautifully presented ..Gbu brother 😊Shalom from India 🇮🇳 ✝️ 😊

[@Maestro7228]

What the fuck

[@s48y]

Why can’t you just believe in one God like Jesus himself believed.

[@tyowongndeso]

We do believe in one God. Your mistunderstanding about trinity make you think we dont

[@mustafa-vf1in]

​@@tyowongndesothat's a lie yall worship 3 persons and the three are gods so yall have 3 gods

[@Player456London]

Unfortunately Christianity adopted pagan polytheism from Egypt, greece and rome.

[@glennlanham6309]

because Thomas worshipped him in John 20 and He let Him...

[@HopeFaith7777]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/iKrEk6BvftWdf5Isi=Hfq_nJQTKQLi66VV

[@colinmilton8823]

I only counted 2 in the video, not a 3. A twoitty

[@spiritualhammer392]

Hardly anyone knew about the trinity until well AFTER the Council of Nicea.

[@GodsWillYeshua]

Tertullian 155-220 coined the phrase. Well BEFORE the council of Nicea.

[@imbored6638]

You sure? Or do you just believe everything on atheist TikTok

[@Chadwick-k7x]

@@GodsWillYeshua And....? Tertullian didn't "prove" the Trinity.

[@tekashiii]

The fact that you cant ever use the bible to defend the trinity just says it all. Yes there are verses trinitarians use but it always relies on a certain premise or preconceived meaning that they have like Genesis 1:26-27 and Matthew 28:19. Either that or just blatant wrong translation like hebrews 1:8

[@buzzard6410]

According to Tertullian (father of trinitarianism) in his writings "AGAINST PRAXEAS" (c.200AD), the oneness belief was still what the majority of Christians believed.

[@kenowens9021]

Nobody even heard of a rapture until a few decades ago.

[@davidmccarroll8274]

Go to revelation chapter 4 verses 1 and 2.The rapture is clearly described but the word rapture is not used .In our modern day culture we have a habit of finding a way of reducing things to a label for easy reference !!!

[@kenowens9021]

@@davidmccarroll8274 The 'rapture" is supposedly a physical thing, but scientific and natural laws prevent physical bodies to float to outer space. And since God is the author of all laws, God will not break them. God said the physical body will return to earth while the spirit goes to the spirit world to live forever.

[@Stanbott]

150 years ago

[@abeychan1970]

Because knowledge increased after K J V was available.

[@davidmccarroll8274]

@@Stanbott If you are referring to the rapture only being heard of 150 years ago then go to revelation chapter 4 verses 1 and 2.The rapture is clearly described without using the word rapture .Nowadays we have grown into a habit of giving things a label to simplify and give easy reference !!!

[@dashriprock5720]

Isaiah 9:6 For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.

[@jwsanders1214]

G-d talked to , led , blessed Abraham , Issac and Jacob , and He became their G-d , but he never told them his name . Centuries later , He told Moses His Name , I am . G-d has revealed Himself gradually over thousands of years . Jesus is the exact Image of The Invisible G-d

[@jwsanders1214]

Yes Jesus is The Image of God@@tongakhan230

[@kevin8360]

Actually... You're incorrect. God did not say that His name was "I am". You stopped reading one verse too early. God made a declaration of existence to Moses in Exodus 3:14. "Am" means "existing" or "a state of being". This is opposed to all of the gods Moses was exposed to in Egypt. God actually tells Moses His real name in the next verse... Exodus 3:15. Unfortunately most English translations do not put in the name, they use "Lord God" instead. This happens like 6,800 times in the KJV. Except in a few verses, like Exodus 6:3, where they insert the most popular guess as to what the name is. When God's name is in the bible, it's called the tetragrammaton. It's 4 Hebrew letters... with letter(s) missing. That's why some say Jehovah or Yahweh... they're just guesses, but the tetragrammaton is God's actual name... that He certainly told Moses. And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, the Lord God (

[@jwsanders1214]

@@kevin8360 actually…..my point is that Jesus is the Name of The Father , Son ,and Holy Spirit Matthew 28:19 baptizing them in the NAME of The Father ,and of The Son , and The Holy Spirit …….. Jesus said to do it this way , but you will not find anyone baptized into any other name than the name of Jesus , the only name given under Heaven by which man might be saved Jesus is the name above all names , according to the Bible

[@kevin8360]

@@jwsanders1214 Ahhh… the Acts 2:38 misunderstanding! Gotcha! What does baptize mean? Hint, they did it to dishes in Mark 7:4. The Greek literally means to immerse, but is used for washing or cleansing. That’s what John the Baptist was doing… “washing” people of their dirty ways. What does “in the name of” mean? If an army goes to battle, in the name of the king… they’re representing the king. They fight for the king. If your lawyer goes to court, they’re going in your name… they represent you. They can speak for you. So who were they talking to in Acts 2? Jews, there for Pentecost. And what does the second half of Acts 2:38 say? They’ll receive the Holy Spirit! So the command is to wash or cleanse representing the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit… nothing to do with the actual names, its representation! Again, they were talking to Jews… who were there to celebrate Pentecost. They were already “washed” by the Father. They knew the laws. They were introduced and taught Jesus as Messiah… and “washed” by what they learned. And finally, they would receive the Holy Spirit… which would lead, guide, teach… and “wash” them. All 3 are there! And again, talking to Jews… and Peter mentioned both Jesus and the Holy Spirit. 1+1+1=3 And it’s pretty clear (not 100%) that Jesus name was Yeshua (Joshua)… since him and Joshua of the Old Testament are iesus in the New Testament Greek… so why was the name Jehovah/Yahweh used in the Old Testament? Why wasn’t it the same as Joshua in the Old Testament? He had a sudden name change? And seriously, don’t you think information that important would have been told to the disciples by Jesus? And possibly recorded in the scriptures, other than by one single verse that would be extremely unclear at best, if that was actually the case! I love how people have these “amazing mysteries that are necessary for salvation”, but no one just comes out and says it in the scriptures!

[@jwsanders1214]

@@ErwinMager OK

[@twynv]

Imagine believing that We need a man (ignatius or others) to clarify to us the word of god (if the word of god is unclear, its not the word of god). 'Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one! You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your strength.' And these words which I command you today shall be in your heart. You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, when you walk by the way, when you lie down, and when you rise up. "(Deuteronomy 6). I don't need a Phd in philosophy to know about god

[@pantelispanopoulos]

The Didache of the Apostles, one of the earliest Christian books (albeit very small) does mention Father-Son and Holy Spirit and that everything should be done in their Name!

[@MichaelTheophilus906]

You believe that the Didache is authentic and unaltered?

[@pantelispanopoulos]

@@MichaelTheophilus906 Unless one can prove otherwise, then yes, I do! This applies to whatever we consider "Scripture". The Didache is a very small book and considered authentic (it even made it into the Canon in the early Church but was later removed). It does give us a very good idea of early Church practices.

[@hargisP2]

@@pantelispanopoulos It's already been proven that it is from the late 3rd century. Obviously never seen by the Apostles.

[@pantelispanopoulos]

@@hargisP2 Wikipedia says otherwise! I copy paste: The Didache (/ˈdɪdəkeɪ, -ki/; Greek: Διδαχή, translit. Didakhé, lit. "Teaching"),[1] also known as The Lord's Teaching Through the Twelve Apostles to the Nations (Διδαχὴ Κυρίου διὰ τῶν δώδεκα ἀποστόλων τοῖς ἔθνεσιν), is a brief anonymous early Christian treatise (ancient church order) written in Koine Greek, dated by modern scholars to the first[2] or (less commonly) second century AD.[3] (This was taken from the Britannica Encyclopedia). If you still disagree, then I rest my case. God bless!

[@ibezag0]

That isn’t the Bible, not found in the Bible nothing needs to supplement the Bible…..do not add nor take away……father son and Holy Spirit are titles and functions…..nothing in the matthew 28:19……. “Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the NAME of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: teaching them to observe all things WHATSOEVER I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.” ‭‭Matthew‬ ‭28‬:‭19‬-‭20‬ ‭KJVAAE‬‬

[@thomasbradley512]

The New testament itself does not directly state the trinitarian doctrine. In fact the word Trinity is not found anywhere in the New testament. However the New testament does allude to the fact that the father is God the son is God the holy spirit is God three persons one being. God allows us to discover him over time. By the end of the Nicene council it was well understood that God is three persons one being and that Jesus is fully God and fully man, two natures one person. The trinitarian doctrine is fully embraced by the entire Catholic Church Orthodox church and Protestant church.

[@davidmccarroll8274]

I do not disagree with the majority of your comment but I would make one simple request .Please be careful referring to a number of churches as the protestants church .In this issue for example most churches including mine believe in the trinity .Jehovah's witnesses and the church of latter day saints I believe do not !!!.

[@benbenwards9999]

"By the end of the Nicene council it was well understood that God is three persons". No, at the time only the issues about the Father and the son were debated. The issue about the holy spirit came up and the council of Constantinople was presided by Theodosius in 381 AD after the death of Constantine. After that council Theodosius issued an edict that those (other christians groups including the followers of Jesus' disciples) that won't recognize the trinity and everything that were agreed upon in those councils would be branded "heretics" and would be banned/killed. Those councils were presided by pagan Emperors Constantine and Theodosius. What would result? Pagan doctrines.

[@johnhamilton2914]

@@davidmccarroll8274 Unitarians as well.

[@johnhamilton2914]

Yes they all fully embrace all pagan origin teachings trinity, hellfire, celebrate Christmas and Halloween...yes all fully embraced paganism following in the footsteps of the apostate, pseudo Christian church. Well done! Maybe it would be good do obey Jesus words to be no part of the world as he is no part of the world. Paganism fully embraced and true Christians are persecuted just as our Lord said.

[@thomasbradley512]

@@benbenwards9999 you are aware that I have the notes of all the councils from the fourth century to the 9th century? You're aware of that right? As far as the council of nicea and other councils bringing in paganism that is absolutely false. If anything they reinforced the teachings of scripture. I've studied the council's off and on for many years. Nice try though.

[@bloodmooncomix457]

TRINITARIAN: ✝️ Notice that although God did not fully push the doctrine of the Trinity to be in the old or the New testament but permitted (in the fullness of time) the trinitarian doctrine was allowed to develop over time! This doctrine simply displays God's omnipotence and his omnipresence in preserving and maintaining the gospel relevants throughout time! God is the ultimate / undefeated champion of the game "telephone" 👊😔

[@Kurfuffle]

The complexity and the ambiguousness are clear indications of the truth. God is one.

[@thesavvybassist]

Philo of Alexandria wrote about the concept that the Jewish God is three Persons in one God before the birth of Jesus.

[@jdwagman]

Valentinius (c. AD 100 - c. 180) was the first one who successfully promoted the 3 in 1 concept to the early Christian church. According to Tertullian, Valentinius was a candidate for bishop in Rome. His teachings permeated the early church, especially in the western part of the Roman Empire. It was arguing against Valentinius that prompted Tertullian to come up with the term "trinitus" or trintiy in English. Valentinius could have very possibly been influenced by Philo. He is probably considered one of the church fathers for Christian Gnosticism. Only if he had not been criticized by Tertullian and Origen he could have probably be the main church father and proof of precedence for the Trinitarians.

[@moosa86]

@scotvessell9716 Are you able to provide a citation or quote to support your claim about Philo?

[@jdwagman]

@@moosa86 I don't know about Scot finding any citations but from my studies I can confirm Philo of Alexandria did have a very similar trinitarian idea. However the trinity concept was something familiar to all the religions which had leaders who were heavenly influenced by Platonism. The Jews, The Gnostics, The Christians. But not the Muslims, they had their own philosophies. Descendants from Ismael they had more of an Abrahamic faith.

[@moosa86]

@jdwagman I would love it someone could provide some quotes from Philo supporting the Trinity. I agree with you Platonism, Neo-Platonism, and a 3rd century CE philosopher named Plotinus all had a heavy influence on how some in those communities (unfortunately even Islam) chose to interpret their scriptures. From my understanding Philo was known as a “Hellenized” Jew who likely leaned in a “less than traditional” direction when trying to relay his ancestors’ writings to his contemporaries.

[@lionofthecherubim4486]

@@jdwagman The Trinity IS the Abrahamic faith lol. Read Genesis 18:1-3. Muslims are pagan moon god worshipers who emulate a small handful of Abrahamic ideas, muslims are not authentic Abrahamic.

[@kelvyquayo]

AMEN❤

[@fightthegoodfightoffaithmi8676]

1 Corinthians 3:17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are. Revelation Chapter 22 18For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: 19And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

[@robertcain3426]

The book being, the book of Revelation.

[@ArtorGrael]

The Ignatius quotes are (mostly) consistent with arianis,m. Scholars have said there are Ignatian writing which are forgeries, even by arians. It doesn't establish Jesus is God in a trinitarian way.

[@justchilling704]

This is fringe nonsense.

[@erickotev]

Pope of the Vatican- February 2019 -" I am ashamed to tel you this ,but I have a secret agenda to deceive you".

[@alisterrebelo9013]

My brother in Christ, I thank the Holy Spirit and you who have been moved by Him to make this video. I will be speaking to some Mormons next week and this video is an ENORMOUS help to show them that doctrines such as the Trinity, hypostatic nature of Christ, the true divinity of Christ, are found in the Church prior to the 1st Century (100 AD onwards). 100 AD is a MAJOR milestone for Mormons as they claim this is when the early Church went into Apostasy, this proves them wrong utterly and truly. May God the Father, God the Son and God the Spirit bless you and motivate you to continue your ministry, for it is NOT in vain.

[@AChristianGuy]

Thank you for the feedback! May the Lord bless your witness to your Mormon friends.

[@abeychan1970]

Holy Spirit the person is here in this world to support a believer right after the Glory of Lord Jesus Christ soon after the Resurrection some 1991 years back.(may be AD33)

[@frankkhethanidubedube919]

Disgusting... I'm in Africa to hear such its idolatry and abomination to God of Abraham and Moses .. we all spirit being created in the image of God.. we all have God in us ... that's does not make us little gods .. so fellow human being... study the hebrew scriptures, your eyes will be opened... catholics have doctored idolatry religion called Christianity to messy up the world ...

[@gregorylatta8159]

The Godhead is the Trinity!

[@carvellboyce6434]

WHERE DOES THE SCRIPTURES SAY THAT???????

[@gregorylatta8159]

It is common sense!!!

[@carvellboyce6434]

@@gregorylatta8159 I ASKED A QUESTION DID YOU GIVE ME A ANSWER NO ALL YOU DID IS DEFLECT FROM ? AND CLAIM IT'S COMMON SENSE I ASKED WHERE IS IT MENTIONED IN SCRIPTURES AND BECAUSE YOU CAN'T DO THAT YOU HAVE TO MAKE AN EXCUSE FOR YOUR BELIEF SO UNLESS YOU HAVE SCRIPTURES TO JUSTIFY THAT STATEMENT AND YOUR BELIEF THEN YOU PROVED NOTHING

[@carvellboyce6434]

@@gregorylatta8159 THE WORD GODHEAD IS IN THE SCRIPTURES YET TRINITY HOLY TRINITY ISN'T RECORDED AT ALL IN SCRIPTURES SO HOW IN THE SCRIPTURES WOULD ONE COME TO THAT CONCLUSION

[@carvellboyce6434]

@@gregorylatta8159 SO IF ITS SO COMMON SENSE THEN SHOW ME BIBLICALLY THE COMMON KNOWLEDGE OF THAT IS THAT TO MUCH TO ASK FOR I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY CHRISTIANS CLAIM THEY BELIEVE IN SCRIPTURES FOLLOW SCRIPTURES HAVE PROPER UNDERSTANDING OF SCRIPTURES BUT WHEN YOU ASK THEM FOR THE PROOF IN SCRIPTURES THEY MAKE SMART REMARKS AND ACT LIKE YOU POSE TO BELIEVE SEE UNDERSTAND IT THAT WAY WHEN MAYBE I ASKED TO GET THAT UNDERSTANDING AND SEE THAT YOU PROVED NOTHING AND YOU POSS TO ALWAYS BE READY TO GIVE A DEFENSE FOR THE GOOD NEWS OF YAHOSHUA MESSIAH YET YOU DIDN'T SHALOM

[@orangemanbad]

The church was underground until the 4th centuries. And atheists are still confused why they didn’t release their creeds until the 4th century. 😂

[@mdelaney9008]

Man gets himself in trouble when he tries to put labels on things that are not in God’s word. The Bible is clear about God Jesus and the Holy Spirit. God explained it quite well. But man is not satisfied and must add their own labels or descriptions to simple scripture, this creates confusion.

[@MichaelTheophilus906]

True, they invented a three-headed god, like the pagans.

[@jamesmufugi5316]

I concur. We end up adding to scripture when we introduce our own labels. We should stick to the terms/titles the bible uses.

[@TheCriscantu]

It’s also extremely dangerous to accept the writings of Ignatius as inspired of God especially when they go beyond what was written in God‘s word.

[@MichaelTheophilus906]

@@TheCriscantu The "Church Fathers" were the first apostates. Jesus, Peter, and Paul warned us about these people.

[@mike62mcmanus]

The Son was made of a woman under the Law, before that he was the Word.. Word in Greek meant a spoken utterance, a thought, a plan, the mental faculty... Through the blueprint of Jesus God made the world... God became a partaker of Flesh and Blood.

[@carlosandresmejiagomez1112]

The best statement in the video: the concept was not defined berore well after the 3rd century. Meaning = it is human development. Every clear doctrine is clearly revealed and held in the bible. The Trinity requieres mental gymnastics it is not held in the ole testament and only inferred in the new testament. It is human conjecture

[@AChristianGuy]

You're confusing a the naming of a particular idea with the teaching of a particular idea. The Trinity did not have it's name doctrinal name proper until the Cappadocian Fathers. However, the recognition of the co-equal, co-eternal nature of the Father, Son and Spirit as the one God (YHWH) is taught in scripture and was also taught in the early Church: kzbin.info/www/bejne/noKpY6J_YrF9n7c

[@carlosandresmejiagomez1112]

@@AChristianGuy The bible clearly states 1 Cor 8:6 there is but one God, the father. Paul, when using a similar formula to mathew 28:19 lists: God, christ and the Spirit. Identifying the father as God. Christ sits at the right hand of God (is he sitting at the right hand of himself?). The terminology required to conceptualize the trinity is not early in church history. Moreover, the spirit Of god is his personal presence, or are there any other biblical examples in which the spirit is separate from the person? (marys spirit rejoiced, so we conclude marys spirit is separate from mary? Nonsense) 1 cor 2:11 the spirit of god is a different person from god just as your spirit is a different person form you, now, is your spirit different from you? NO! Therefore Gods spirit is not different from himself, it has personal attributes because it belongs to a person. and it is not my argument, it is pauls in 1 cor 2. In contrary to the plain and clear texts i have given, trinitarian texts always need to make an implicit reference, or extrapolate a personality from an attribute. If the personhood of the HS is as important (or even biblical) why is it not clearly stated. We have to take the bible as it reads and not assume things into the text.

[@hiriasbloodweaver8593]

@@carlosandresmejiagomez1112 The angel/messenger of the lord also clearly states that HE IS GOD in the bible in Genesis 22: "Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from ME your son". He is talking in first person, referring to himself of god. Yet he is the angel of the lord and not god, the father. Now what, how else are you going to explain that without the trinity?

[@carlosandresmejiagomez1112]

Easy, just take the Bible as it reads. The Angel of the Lord to my understanding is the Son of God. The same Michael (The one like god). Just as a son you have is human because you are human, Jesus is God by inheritance: hebrews 1 he inherited the name, the father gave him to have life in himself (Jhon 5:26), He was LIKE God Philip 2:6-11 (Why Like god and not god?). After his resurrection and being glorified he sits at the right hand of god. God taught this through creating Adam and Eve Thats why He said lets make man in our image: He made 2 people, not 3. In fact adam was created first, Eve was taken our from adam, and She inherited Adams name (Gen 5:2). Just like Jesus was beggotten from the father (Proverbs 8:22-30, Micah 5:2) and inherited his name. The Father is the ine true God of the Bible, and His Son, his ONLY BEGGOTTEN SON, Jesus is God by birth, It is his wright, the brightness of his glory, given for God to us, By God the father. God is a Person (he has bodily parts and we were made in his image) once we understand that principle, the divinity of christ is based on his sonship.

[@hiriasbloodweaver8593]

@@carlosandresmejiagomez1112 that is one hell of a conspiracy theory when the obvious reading is that the angel simply refers to himself as god. You're claiming Jesus is called god while not being god, do you not realize how absurd that is?

[@CharlesDaniels-m7p]

When Constantine pretended to become a Christian he brought the pagan gods with him the black jews didn't agree with his doctrine of the 3 gods they believed in 3 manifestation of God but Constantine having no understanding about black Jewish beliefs because he was a pagan brought the trinity into picture

[@TheWitness-fx4xq]

The Bible has been teaching the Holy Trinity ever since the beginning. It may not have the literal word "Trinity" in it (the one coined by the forefathers), but the evidence of the 3 personalities of God is everywhere in the Bible, even from the Old Testament. Peace and Blessings!

[@Folkstone1957]

I disagree, as the OT is Jewish & I’m not aware of such a poorly defined concept in Jewish thought, Are you ?

[@TheWitness-fx4xq]

@@Folkstone1957 If you're willing, kindly give your insights regarding the following: 1. The word for God in Hebrew is ELOHIM. A grammatically plural in form and yet often used with a singular meaning. Why did Moses or the Hebrews use ELOHIM instead of ELOAH (it's singular form) if this has no special meaning? ELOAH appears 70 times in Tanakh but why still used ELOHIM to refer to God? 2. In Genesis 1:26, When God said "Let Us make mankind in Our image, according to Our likeness;", who was He talking to? that has the same creative power (e.g. co-creator) as He does and has the same image and likeness as He is?... Surely, not the Angels for angels don't have creative power as God does and don't have the same likeness and image of God for they have wings, some have many eyes. 3. In Isaiah 6:3, Why would the angels surrounding God praise Him as being "holy, holy, holy." Why the threefold repetition? Why not 1 or 4? Peace and Blessings!

[@Chadwick-k7x]

While some tenuous connections between the Father and the Son are found, there is nothing that indicates that the Holy Spirit is a "person".

[@TheWitness-fx4xq]

@@Chadwick-k7x If you believed in Jesus then you must believe His words, and Jesus often refer to the Holy Spirit as "He" or "Him". If He (Holy Spirit) is not a person then why would Jesus used those pronouns to address the Holy Spirit? why not just simply say "IT" or "SPIRIT"?

[@bible1st]

Trinty is inaccurate as its taught. God is not 3 seperate persons.

[@paultkalec7022]

Matthew 26:19 makes it crystal clear: “Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.” Jesus could’ve simply said to baptise them in the name of Elohim, but He chose to make the distinction to his disciples one last time….it seemed to have worked as when the Holy Spirit came upon them, they never doubted again!

[@jollyrancher521]

Matthew 28:19 mentions the Father, Son and holy spirit in the same verse, but it does not say that they exist in one divine essence as the Trinity doctrine says. It does not say that they are three persons in one God, all co-equal, co-eternal and consubstantial. The doctrine of the Trinity as taught in churches is not stated anywhere in the Bible.

[@MichaelTheophilus906]

What is the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit? I have never heard that name. God's name is Jehovah (YHWH), the son's name is Jesus, and the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Father.

[@cariboubearmalachy1174]

This does not say anything about the Trinity.

[@MichaelTheophilus906]

@@cariboubearmalachy1174 That is because the trinity does not exist. The trinity was conjured-up in the imaginations of pagan catholic priests.

[@cariboubearmalachy1174]

@@MichaelTheophilus906 "Pagan Catholic priests". Sure, man. 😆

[@francois1546]

God the Father, the Son of God and the Spirit **OF** God, perfectly Biblical. God, God the Son and God the Spirit, is an added philosophical concept, with No supportive Bible scripture. Try and explain this philosophy to the Jews who understood that the Father is the source of all Life and therfore He is referred to as the only true God unto this day. 1Cor 8:6. Scripture can be misused to ALLUDE to many false teaching like the Trinity. Where in scripture is there a "Thus saith the LORD" for any of the Trinitarian assumptions like three persons forming a singular God, Christ being Co-Eternal with His Father (unlogical ) or Christ being referred to as "God the Son" etc. NO Scripture to back it up. There is only one Jesus, and He cannot be divided into a pre and post incarnate Christ. He simply continued His life as the incarnate Christ with both Human and Divine nature, where as before he had only a Divine Nature. Jesus a Jew by human nature, and God by Divine Nature also states that His Father is the Only true God, Jhn 17:3 because He is the source of all Life, and that He Himself received Life from His Father. (Jhn 5:26) When did He receive life from His Father? Not at His incarnation because that would mean He did not have life before. Proverbs 8 states that it was before all creation. Jhn 8:54 Jesus answered, If I honour myself, my honour is nothing: it is my Father that honoureth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God: (The Father is The God of Israel, not a Trinity) Jhn 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said....3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. (The Father is the only True God according to Jesus) Jhn 5:26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself; Through Solomon Christ declared concerning Himself as the Wisdom of God: Proverbs 8:22- "The Lord possessed Me in the beginning of His way, before His works of old. I was set up from everlasting,...When there were no depths, I was brought forth;..before the hills was I brought forth....I was by Him, as one brought up with Him; and I was daily His delight, rejoicing always before Him." *Eph 1:17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him: *

[@robertd9965]

Thank you very much for that! Oh, so many doctrines and practices in the church(es) nowadays (and for a loooong time now) that are completely unbiblical - one might say: intentionally fabricated to destroy the true faith.

[@KononR-gz4vo]

@@francois1546 - I agree pretty with most things you said, but don't agree that Jesus PRE-EXISTED before his creation in his mother's womb. Jesus was fully human and God's Son because he had no earthly father, and he was qualified to be our atoning sacrifice that empowers us to righteousness unto the attainment of salvation. His mission was specific. He was not God.

[@francois1546]

@@KononR-gz4vo From studying scripture as a whole, I think it is pretty clear that Christ is the One that created all things through the power of His Father, His Father being the God of the Universe and Source of all, and Christ being the Son of God, has the nature of His Father, which is a God nature, just like my son has my human nature. Christ is not the God of the Universe, He is the SON of the God of the Universe and is because of His Sonship Divine or God by nature, not Title. Jhn 1:1-14 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God……..14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;……. 8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. 9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows. 1Co 8:6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him. Blessings

[@Chadwick-k7x]

The Trinity is not biblical. It is a concept developed for political compromise between competing sects of early Christianity, namely Arian, Nicene and Antiochian Christians. It largely failed at this, and actually emboldened those that opposed the concept. It took decades of conflict and struggle within the Church to legitimize the Trinity (which was widely acknowledged as a mistake), solely for the fact that it was previously declared canon, and reversing on the decision would be an embarrassment and de-legitimize the authority of the Church. Almost all of the Christianity we have today was guided and forged behind closed doors by politically powerful men with personal agendas.

[@douglaswarden2584]

"Monotheism," I don't think that word means what the early Christians think it meant.

[@BushGuy-tb1pg]

" men have gone to opposite extremes in the discussion of the trinity. Some have made Christ a mere man....others.....have made him the 'God and Father' of himself.... I would simply advise all that love our Lord and saviour, Jesus, Christ, to believe all that the bible says of him, and no more. Then you will have the truth, and not occupy either of these extremes". Roswell. F. Cottrell, review and herald, july 06, 1869, p.11.1. 1 cor 8 v 6❤

[@windyday8598]

the doctrine of the trinity is clearly revealed in the new testament. it is a mystery understood by the word and the spirit, and cannot be defined by the words of man. "all authority in heaven and on earth is given to me....go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the father, and of the son, and of the holy spirit"

[@dane3365]

Where in those statements from Ignatuis do you get the quote Jesus is the Most High God, and where does Ignatuis show the holy spirit as the third person?

[@adriandalanon474]

Obviously, you did not understand what you read!!

[@dane3365]

@adriandalanon474 You are the one who doesn't understand.

[@BuffAle]

It seems that calling Jesus God isn’t enough? If Jesus was simply another deity or lesser God then that would imply polytheism, not monotheism as preached by the early church, moreover, Ignatious calls Jesus our One and only Physician, which as we later saw was applied to the Unbegotten Father, thus demonstrating that they are One in being. This is further backed by scripture itself, “I and the Father are One” “Whoever has seen me has seen the father” “The Father is in me and I am in the Father”. Ignatious was also a disciple of John learning directly from him, thus we can take his words as valid, furthermore we have more second century pre-nicea trinity church fathers (Justin Martyr, Irenaeus of Lyons, Origen of Alexandria, and Tertullian whom coined the term “trinity”)

[@Tiredcoffee1]

Notice how Ignatius clearly makes a distinction by describing the Father as the True God. Jesus is not the true God Yahweh/ Jehovah. As far as John 10:30 in the father or one, read John 17:21. The oneness John is discussing is not of essence Christ and his father being the same Being. It’s a wellness regarding closeness unity of purpose.

[@BuffAle]

@@Tiredcoffee1 So you're a polytheist, congratulations you contradict Jehovah himself whom shares his glory with no other gods. But John clearly states that Jesus shares his glory with the Father. Jesus claims to be united with the father in essence. Thus you get the doctrine of the trinity, you are a heretic who ignores church history and twists the words of Ignatious. Learn your history (Justin Martyr, Irenaeus of Lyons, Origen of Alexandria, and Tertullian whom coined the term “trinity”)

[@godandtodd]

The word God the father is not a separation. It is a conjunction. Just as it is written in the word of God. AND is NOT separation. Come on man

[@khadijacaz7]

Great info! Thank you!

[@hargisP2]

His information is wrong. Ignatius believed ONE GOD. He reads like a westerner, instead of middle eastern. And failing to consult the Greek.

[@thechoice89]

The religion of Jesus changed into the religion about Jesus. Greek mythology creeps into Christology. Satan made them seem to be truth and logical, straying from the right path without perceiving it.

[@michaelshubr4084]

The Trinity had to be created, and the Anointed of G-d elevated to a man-god, because the Greeks and Romans had to justify their previous belief in Zeus and Jupiter. A study of the Hypsistarians will show that the religious Greeks referred to all other people’s gods as Zeus. And the concept of Zeus was combined with this Jewish Messiah character because Zeus and man-gods were the only familiar concepts to them. Remember though, it is stated of Jesus, “that he thought of equality with G-d not something to be grasped”-unlike satan who tried to establish himself above the Most High. Also, in John 20:17, “I ascend to my Father, and your Father, my G-d, and your G-d.” This scripture alone makes it pretty clear that the Father is G-d!

[@KnowthyseIf]

I really like your videos but please open your heart and make a good research about the Trinity it’s 100% Unbiblical Shalom!

[@AChristianGuy]

See this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/noKpY6J_YrF9n7c

[@sanukatharul1497]

Non-Christians: "[Biblical Doctrine] has no evidence!!1!1" This man: *Gives evidence* Non-Christians: ". . . Okay but deez lies!!! We truth, may you know the truth!!1 We are not wrong at all1!!1" Also Non-Christians: *No evidence or debunked "evidence", conspiracy theories that blaspheme God.* May you get to know God of Salvation (Jesus) The Saviour (Christ)

[@neko7675]

if u look at clement of rome which is an early church father. (he’s even mentioned in the bible and got taught under paul) the trinity is true

[@Forgivenmuchlovingmuch]

How can that be true? Jesus literally says, Baptize them in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. It is very plain. Anyone who denies the Son does not have the Father.

[@agro-valleyfarm7217]

Does Jesus say that we should pray in the name of the Father , Son and Holy Spirit

[@limjerry2735]

U can believe the father the son and the holy no problem that's correct but not mention trinity it is unbiblical the Gospel forbidden or forbid adding or subtracting the scripture just focus what is written have respect our God the creator ..even the early christian the apostles didn't mention trinity ..trinity is a man made doctrine came from nacea council ..u need to study more thank u

[@Forgivenmuchlovingmuch]

@@limjerry2735 The word trinity means triune. Jesus said baptize in the name of the triune God. I will obey Jesus.

[@johnsiverls116]

Jesus Christ said,,make Disciples!!!! O how we need Mature Fathers Mothers, and growing in the Faith from so many wonderful resorses that the Holy Spirit has given to the church. Love to All.

[@ZahidHasan-tj2rl]

Trinity is a fully man made concept! There is only one god allah! Jesus (pbhm) is a prophet from Almighty god allah!

[@kiwihans100]

Look! The 'trinity' was NOT formulated and accepted as 'true doctrine' till the council of Constantinople in 381AD! So 'trinity' advocates often try and justify the false teaching that insults the true unique nature of Almighty God who is 'above all', it denies the love of Christ who truly was The Father's obedient son who came down from heaven to become a REAL man, but perfect, e.t.c So what do they do? they vainly search for 'evidentce' to justify this 4th century teaching! There is NOT ONE bible verse that says 'There are three persons in one God' NOT ONE bible verse that says 'God the Father, God the Son & God the Holy Spirit'. NOT ONE! Oh, it DOES mention the Father, it does mention the Son & it does mention the HS, no problem, but NOT that thay are 'the three persons of the trinity' THATS FALSE!

[@SamBrowngo]

I am glad I have the Holy Spirit within me and that I know Jesus Christ personally, fully God, fully man, son of the almighty Father. I may come back to this site when I have more time and comment further. Praise to God, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.

[@HopeFaith7777]

JESUS CHRIST SAVES! Dear friend, have you been saved? If you are like most people in the world today, you would probably say yes, but there are still doubts in your mind. What does the Holy Bible say about salvation? Jesus said, “Verily verily, I say unto thee, except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.” (John 3:5) How can we be born of water and of the Spirit? Peter preached, “Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call” (Acts 2:38,39) The problem is, that the churches of today (Catholic and Protestant alike) do not preach this gospel, as the apostles of Jesus Christ preached it. And the Bible says, “Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.” Period. (2 John 1:9) Who shall we believe, then? The churches, or the word of God? Jesus Christ is coming soon to judge the world in righteousness. Are you sure that you’re ready? Let’s go back to the BIBLE! To see and hear teachings according to the truth of the Holy Bible, visit: WWW.SWORDOFTHEVALIANT.COM KZbin: TheWordprophet

[@TheDoneroll]

Trinity had been thought to the Israelites even from Genesis..and from the entire OT. Watch Dr. MICHAEL HEISER about Trinity.

[@EhinomeOkojie]

Jesus isn't the Almighty God. God is not Trinity The Trinity is originally supposed to be a foundation of Christian belief in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit for proper functioning.

[@kristianhurstinoikeusmurha]

Ignatius says nothing about the Trinity. He leaves out the Holy Spirit, and does not even say the Father and the Son are distinct. How could they be when the Bible says by Ignatius' teacher, the apostle John (14: 11): "Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me."

[@trabob4438]

Sure there were people who believed in the trinity before Nicea, that was being debated for the first 300 years.

[@JFD4_Believer]

Notice the lack of mention of the third part of the trinity...the Holy Spirit. Perhaps this was the adolescent stage of the doctrine? The Holy Spirit came later? dunno.

[@claudiozanella256]

Jesus did not even KNOW what a trinity is supposed to be! 1. The four gospels definitely disclose ONLY ONE "Father - Son" relatioship. As concerns the Trinity, the most qualified Person to give information is Jesus, who dozens of times reiterates to be ONLY WITH THE FATHER! Jesus is NEVER with TWO divine Persons, nor a SECOND relationship with an alleged third divine person of a trinity exists. Thus there is no doubt that neither a THIRD divine person, nor a trinity exists. 2. Jesus sometimes even EXPLICITLY states to be only with the Father: "I am not ALONE because the Father is with me" i.e. just Father and Son. 3. Jesus states that the Father is a spirit "God is a spirit" (Jn. 4:23,24) 4. Thus Jesus is ONLY with the FATHER WHO IS A SPIRIT. 5. This means that only TWO blasphemies exist: either 1. against the Son or 2. against the "Father who is a spirit" 6. Those TWO blasphemies were discussed by Jesus: blasphemy against the "Father who is a spirit" (called "Holy Spirit" by Jesus") will not forgiven, neither in this world, nor in the future world. 7. To recap, ONLY ONE (divine) SPIRIT exists: He is the Father.

[@AChristianGuy]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/noKpY6J_YrF9n7c kzbin.info/www/bejne/mnPdfmdsf9tggq8

[@claudiozanella256]

@@AChristianGuy The Trinity is just a CONVENTIONAL doctrine, an invention of the councils of the fourth century. It has nothing to do with reality.

[@bobbycecere1037]

Not bad reasoning, but no. The holy spirit is not the father himself just a power he uses to accomplish his will.

[@claudiozanella256]

@@bobbycecere1037 Yes, it's like that, but the way of thinking 2000 years ago was very different and Jesus had to somehow be in agreement with that way of thinking. "Remote communication" was unknown, in its place you could talk of a spirit of the missing person being present next to you. This is what happens with God. God is AWAY, this is the reason why no one has ever seen him ("No man has seen God at any time"). INVISIBILITY has nothing to do with that! ONLY THE SON saw the Father. That is, God is ABSENT, He is not here, He is AWAY in a different (temporal) dimension from ours ("before the foundation of the world, (Jn. 17, 24-26)"). However, even though absent "the world has not known you", the almighty God is able to hear and respond to us from that distant dimension and to PERFORM ACTIONS HERE. That is to say, God is able to be here in practice, but only VIRTUALLY since actually NOBODY is present. You could thus say that God is "in a spirit form" among us, He is the "Spirit of God" AKA "Holy Spirit". This is fully confirmed by Jesus "God is a Spirit." God therefore has a dual presence: the 1. "Spirit of God" is HERE, who is a kind of "EXTENSION" of 2. the FATHER who is DISTANT from us. The Father can thus SEND HIS EXTENSION - his Spirit - inside selected persons. .Of course everything is decided only by the distant Father.

[@bobbycecere1037]

@@claudiozanella256 Well yes, scripture indicates that the god of the Hebrews IS in another dimension called heaven. But so is every other Spirit creature. He's definitely not alone. Christ must have been speaking metaphorically when he said only he has seen the father. Because we know that's not true. Satan has seen the father when he entered in among the Angelic choirs to discuss Job. So the angels have also "seen him"

[@Mr2TIMOTHY4V2]

In Apologetics we use this rule: The principle of the harmony of Scripture (or, Scripture interprets Scripture): “no part of Scripture can be interpreted in such a way as to render it in conflict with what is clearly taught elsewhere in Scripture” (RC Sproul). I agree with this Christian even though Christianity does NOT follow its own acceptance of this rule. Therefore when you say "John saw that the ONE WHO SPOKE TO HIM WAS THE "SON OF MAN" - Rev 1:12,13" Then it means you can differentiate between the Son of man and the Almighty? Correct? And how are they different? Can the son of man be the Almighty? If we have to stick to the rule of harmony then he cannot be the Almighty Eloheem since it would contradict what Yahuah has said Of HIMSELF at least 89 times ALREADY BEFORE including this verse concerning the "Son of Man". Do you want to make him a liar and the son of man a liar too to make your false Catholic doctrine fit? It is fitting that Yahuah says HE DOES NOT LIE in case we forgot. "Numbers 23:19 Eloheem is not a man, that he should lie; neither the *son of man, that he should repent... The Scriptures Refute "Jesus is God" by Declaring Yah'ushua (pw Jesus) as the "Son of Man" According to Matthew 1:1, Yah'ushua (pw Jesus) is the SON OF ELOHIM, the SON OF DAVID, SON OF ABRAHAM. He is a man, but most importantly he is the SON OF MAN. Every time this term is mentioned referring to Yah'ushua we remember that Elohim (pw God) has already categorically stated that the Son of Man is NOT Elohim according to Numbers 23:19 as above. In the (REC) Renewed Everlasting Covenant (pw New Testament) it is said 89 times! Mat 8:20 (KJV) And Yah'ushua (pw Jesus) saith unto him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head. Mat 9:6 (KJV) But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (then saith he to the sick of the palsy,) Arise, take up thy bed, and go unto thine house. Mat 11:19 (KJV) The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children. Mat 12:8 (KJV) For the Son of man is Master (pw Lord) even of the sabbath day. Mat 12:32 (KJV) And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come. Mat 12:40 (KJV) For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. Mat 13:37 (KJV) He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; Mat 13:41 (KJV) The Son of man shall send forth his malakhim (pw angels) , and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;................." etc., etc., see my book as I cannot fit all the 89 verses (Mat Mark Luke Acts and Rev) in here From my free book on my website "Why Jesus is not God / Why Yahushua is not Eloheem"

[@cleitondecarvalho431]

nobody denies the divinity of Jesus, neither the divinity of the holy angels, it does not prove any triune God, since they are all part of the creation, the son being the first one made ; besides the holy spirit cannot be proved to be a person without throwing away metaphorical speech from a book full of metaphores. Jehovah is one alone.

[@langreeves6419]

I am a trinitarian. But i don't pretend it was a dotrine held by Jesus or the Apostles....cause, well, i believe in being honest about what the bible and extrabiblical sources say.

[@kidsteach938]

Not really interested in what Ignatius said or believed, but what Jesus said. Jesus said nothing about the trinity. Nothing. Sorry.

[@arjealis97]

Jesus is not God. The issue is that describing the complexity of the nature of Jesus Christ inevitably leads to misinterpretation. The best possible way to describe Jesus is with the title ‘Son of God’ which already causes debate. Jesus Christ is like a superhero of sorts, fully human, but with divine gifts and a unique role imbued with the Spirit of God. Born of the Holy Spirit in the same way that scripture is inspired into this world by the Spirit, thus substantiating his pre-determined role as Messiah. Does this make Jesus pre-existent? Of course not, merely his arrival was prophesied beforehand similar to John the Baptist

[@jetset808]

the first concept of the trinity is 4000 bc.. IT's not a Christian idea The trinity is used by clitics it's a pagan symbol.

[@eddiezote5490]

Is Jesus Everlasting Father or Everlasting Son ?

[@ab4363]

The faith was practiced without the expressions needed to be so secular explained. Heresies were the reason the doctrines needed to be declared and the doctrines established.

[@excellenteku]

Quotes that mention Father-Son God-head is NOT equal to early form of the doctrine of trinity. Those quotes mean exactly what they say …the God-head is Father and Son (period). There is too much theological gymnastics need to believe otherwise. This type of “gymnastics” can be used to proofread almost anything. So, it’s not advisable; so please let the quotes speak for themselves.

[@innocentodinkemere4597]

You are saying the Holy Spirit of God is not God?

[@fcastellanos57]

The Trinity has created an imaginary God that consists of three persons one of which is not a person or referred to as a person. It is pure out of the imagination of humanity, that is all.

[@CharlesDaniels-m7p]

Constantine created the catholic church to his teachings of the black jews doctrine about his false God's and began to teach prayers to the saints

[@CalledChosenandFaithful]

Let's really consider a few established fact. History says that in 200 AD Tertullian a Greek Platonist and Arian coined the word "trinitas" or threeness from which we get a morphed version of it in the word trinity. However, he plainly said that in "Contra Praxeus" against busybody that his view was the minority and all around were monotheists. His views are considered heresy today though. Next we have the Council of Nicea in 325 where against Arianism, God and Jesus were made equals. This view in the Roman Empire changed back and forth until 381 AD. The three Platonic Cappodocians said of the trinity "In thinking upon the trinity, we came upon the trinity." So you made it up from Platonic philosophy that Paul told us to avoid in Col. 2:8 "Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ." In fact, nearly every trinitarian scholar agrees that the idea and word is not scriptural. Here's some exames. Writing as a Trinitarian in his bestselling book Christian Doctrine, Professor Shirley C. Guthrie Jr., makes these strong admissions: The Bible does not teach the doctrine of the Trinity. Neither the word “trinity” itself nor such language as “one-in-three,” “three-in-one,” one “essence” (or “substance), and three “persons is biblical language. The language of the doctrine is the language of the ancient church taken from classical Greek philosophy (pp 76, 77). But there is an obvious problem here (calling Jesus Lord and Savior). There is only one God, the Creator of heaven and earth, the Lord and Savior of Israel. If we say that God is really present and at work in Jesus, how can we avoid saying that there are in fact two Gods - one “up in heaven” and one who appeared down here on earth? The N.T. does not solve this problem (pp 78, 79). The doctrine of the Trinity is not found in the Bible (p. 80). Trinitarian G. W. Bromley is quoted in The Evangelical Dictionary of Theology, edited by Walter Elwell, as saying: In the New Testament there is no explicit statement of the doctrine… (p. 1112). Respected Trinitarian Evangelical Biblical scholar Professor Charles C. Ryrie, writing in his well known work, Basic Theology, admits: The N. T. contains no explicit statement of the doctrine of the Trinity of God. Where in scripture can we find God the son, eternal son and God the Holy Ghost/Spirit are three gods in unity? Where is the verse? If you say it's not there, then you are not different than a Catholic who worships Mary or Mariology because ot is implied, and like the trinity it is not. The scriptures were completed by around 90 AD. Any other teaching like trinity, Mariology, Purgatory, Praying to Saints, ect. is falsehood and an add on (Rev 22:18-19) by perverted men and wolves in sheeps clothing. Paul warned us of in Acts 20:29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock. 30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them. Repent of this pagan Platonic idolatry or face the wrath of God. Keep yourself from idols, said John.

[@HatredForMankind]

Trinitarianism (tripartide godhood) is an ancient near eastern/Indo-European pagan tradition. I just can't understand why some people, especially many muslims claim that old christians didnt believe in trinity. I mean the very existence and commonality of tripartide godhood among Roman empire's populace is the sole reason that the Empire came up with that quasi-paganistic solution of trinitarianism for the "new official doctrine" so to appease the majority of the folk and make the new faith look lukewarm for them

[@michaelshubr4084]

“No man has beheld G-d at any time”-John the Disciples words, not mine!

[@davidskolik5303]

They believed a lot of nonsense back then, so one more myth wouldn’t hurt.

[@GR65330]

I find that the three persons in one God was nicely explained by Irenaeaus of Lyons in 180AD: "First of all, it admonishes us to remember that we have received baptism for the remission of sins in the name of God the Father, and in the name of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, who became incarnate and died and was raised, and in the Holy Spirit of God; and that this baptism is the seal of eternal life and is rebirth onto God, that we be no more children of mortal men, but of the eternal and everlasting God. - Irenaeus of Lyons (a disciple of Polycarp of Smyrna), [d. 202 AD], "Proof of Apostolic Preaching".

[@tadcotadco6344]

//Did Anyone Believe in the Trinity Before Nicea?// Yes, the baptizer of Armenia - st. Grigor Lusavorich (Illuminator) did believe in the Trinity and had baptized Armenians in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost 24 years prior Council of Nicaea. His son Aristakes (next catholicos of Armenia) attended that council and, of course, was among those who fixed that true belief as an indisputable pillar of faith - dogma. And how it could be otherwise when Jesus Himself says "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost." (Matthew 28:19)

[@gabrielrocha560]

What does your inner law of conscience tell you As a child did you think of 3 beings or only 1 being Before indoctrination , I only understood that there is only 1 god and Jesus is him

[@robertd9965]

I was just about to write almost exactly that comment - thank you! Yes, exactly: one should read the Bible with an open mind and an open heart, not with preconceived notions and concepts that only blur understanding and make a rational exercise out of it.

[@martinadams8877]

in the Nag Hammadhi documents there is a story of the Christos and Sophia which is dated around 500bc which tells of how consciousness eternal existing (or what you may call god) breathes life into the Godhead (the word). The receptive (male) intelligence at the centre of the Godhead is called the Christos. The energy of bliss light and sound that erupts forth from the godhead is the sacred feminine which is divided into aeons, one of which is Sophia (wisdom). Sophia creates the earth but loses control of life exploding forth upon the earth and this starts to send her mad so she calls for help from the Christos who leaves the godhead to unite with her and bring order (fertility, ecological niche and life/death) to earth and as such becomes the Saviour (in greek = jesus) Christos. This is the same in yogic traditions in which consciousness breathes the Godhead into existence through the Holy aum (the word). The receptive male is Shiva and the sacred feminine is Shakti. An aeon of Shakti named Parvatthi creates earth and Shiva has to mate with her to bring fertility to earth. All ancient kings played the role of the 'Jesus Christos' through the resurrection initiation in which they became one with the sacred feminine and so birthed the spiritualised form of the king (in Egyptian the Horus). The ideas of the trinity you put forth contain some aspects of this truth but it does not mean that ''Jesus was god himself, only that at 30 years old he became one with the Christos through initiation.

[@wavethemessage8520]

The caption question is a bit flawed. The question should be along the lines :" Did anyone believe in the trinity as Christians of the 1st century?" When you investigate the early Roman fathers who took over the Jewish Messiah movement 300 years later. Yes those individuals all had pagan backgrounds in which they believed in a trinity...they just later inserted that narrative into Christianity with the Niceen Creed once they devised how to throughly seperate Judaism from Christianity. No Jew

[@dushyanthihoole3340]

Some like Eve are taught by another spirit to doubt and disobey while some experirnce through Trinity entering into Christ, drowning in the Spirit in the knowledge of the ever joyful and life guving I am . Spend your time on the open minded. Not the calloused in heart

[@hughlowe4431]

See? How can we have a concept that blood spilling gives assurance of salvation? What are we being saved from? Reality is our physical experience on earth , not some illusive deity somewhere in space

[@AbdirahmanDayib-e3e]

Why didn’t the old testament prophets preach the trinity. Even in the new testament there no trinity the word or the concept of trinity either. It’s a made up thing that was created by the pegan Roman emperor.

[@RalfBiermann777]

There is only one God, the Father, who has an only begotten Son Jesus Christ. The Holy Ghost is the Spirit of Christ.

[@fightthegoodfightoffaithmi8676]

1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Amen to those words from Ignatius about every law of wickedness vanished away that is a fulfilling and bringing to pass of what God speaks of in 1 John 3:8.

[@chadgordon7298]

There is only one most high... The same one sent his son...

[@ziaulislam87]

Its confusing just say we have three gods. That would make it less confusing

[@ggductor1511]

Almost 300 yrs after the death of Jesus, Galatians 1:8-9 but even if we, or an angel from heaven , preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed. Written 55-57 ad. Saving Gospel was already known. Who cares what the cappadocean fathers say 300 yrs later, want to know Gospel read acts. But we prefer something that came about hundreds of years later

[@DDFergy1]

Why do these people not understand all the obvious scriptural references to the God of the Bible being three persons who are one in essence? This one in essence means if one sins against the Spirit then one has also sinned against the Son Jesus Christ and the Father. If the Son has declared one forgiven then the Father and the Spirit treat them as forgiven. If the Spirit is grieved then the Son and the Father are grieved. They are one in essence. The Spirit is not a force. The Spirit is a person who creates a new spirit within believers. The Spirit loves gives joy and peace to others. These people who deny the Trinity do not know the work and roles of each person in the salvation of the lost. They do not know the life Christ gives ,for this is eternal life to know the Father and Jesus Christ whom He sent to redeem and the Spirit to create life in the believer, resurrecting them to live in God's Kingdom.

[@E.OrthodoxMHNIN]

Great video.

[@FollowChristNotMan]

No. It was coined by tertullian in 213AD in the book Adversus Praxeas which is still available today. 9t was then taken as a concept by the roman emperor at the time and handed off to council of nicea after that. It is not in the word for good reason. The bible explains perfectly what the relationship.actually.is and it is far more beautiful than any man made doctrines

[@childlikefaith7257]

If you don't believe God actually has a Son, you are still in your sins, when you say Jesus always existed then you are saying you don't actually believe God has a son.

[@jcbutler9901]

keep on messaging that doctrine...it still won't fit scripture... One question: Is Jesus in the Godhead, or is the Godhead in Jesus? Col 2:8-9 Beware...

[@Kingdomncontrast]

Interestingly, Ignatius is perfectly willing to spout his perspective without validating his view with actual scripture. So you're saying we should take his word for it, got it. Even more interesting, Jesus referred to himself as the Son of God. But we shouldn't take his word for it. Christianity has deified the title "God". In hebrew thought it means power. The Father is the Most High power. The Son is also a power, not on the same level as His Father. According to Jesus, Israelites are gods-powers, again not at the same level of The Father.

[@tygon13]

People believed in the Trinity back in 3000 BCE (Canaanite polytheism, of which eventually led to Yahwism, judaism, and then Christianity.) They just called it "the tripartite" back then. God The Father, Lord Anu. God The son, Lord Enki. And God the Holy Spirit, High Lord Enlil. High Lord Enlil ruled over Heaven in the Golden City built upon the Red Stone, as he hovers over all things. Lord Anu ruled over the Deep Void of the sky from within the Silver City. And Lord Enki ruled over the Earth in the city of steel and Earth.

[@charleswilson5067]

The Apology of Aristide’s is a 1st century Christian document that states the belief that Jesus was God tabernacled in the flesh. The trinitarian benediction in 2 Corinthians 13:14 is clear. In Deuteronomy chapter 6 ( may be off on the chapter) it is written- “Behold Israel the LORD God is one…” The word here in Hebrew is ehad or echad. It means one thing made of more then a single component. It is the same word used in Gen 2:24 speaking of marriage- the two shall become one. In Christ dwells the fullness of the Godhead bodily. To deny the deity of Christ is harmful and a false gospel. He is not an archangel, he is the creator. Some even deny his physical resurrection and return. Research the Colossian heresy. Paul wrote the letter to the Colossians strictly to emphasize Christ deity and refute legalism, Arianism, syncretism, etc. Gal 1:8- anyone preaching a gospel contrary to the Bible is cursed.

[@swordthroughsoul]

Can someone explain how Jesus can properly be God's Son if he's only playing the "role" of son? This is a serious, serious issue. He's either a true son, or he's not. Please someone help me here

[@saintofelshaddai]

All I see in this is that the father is God and the son is God. I think the church fathers were binatarians

[@louiswhitehead5938]

Deuteronomy 6:4 says “ Hear , O Israel , The Lord our God is one Lord “. Jesus said in John 4:24 that “ God is a Spirit “ that means one Spirit not two or three spirits . It was the Holy Spirit that that created the heavens and the earth and said “ Let there be light “ in Genesis 1:3 . God is the Holy Spirit . Why would a Spirit need another spirit ? In 1 Timothy 3:16 it says “ And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness , God was manifest in the flesh “ . In other words there’s no argument about it , the omnipresent God became flesh or the Emmanuel God with us . The scripture that most people think Jesus was talking about a trinity in Matthew 28:19 . Where he said “ Baptizing them in the NAME of the Father , and of the Son , and of the Holy Ghost . Father is not a name , Son is not a name , Holy Ghost is not a name . This was parabolically spoken by Jesus to be revealed in Acts 2.38 where the Apostolic Peter said for everyone to be baptized in the NAME of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins . So the name singular of the Father , Son , and Holy Ghost is Jesus . There’s absolutely no place in the Bible other than Matthew 28:19 that mentions Father , Son , and Holy Ghost or where anyone was ever baptized in the name of the Father, Son , and Holy Ghost . Every convert in the book of Acts was baptized in the name of Jesus Christ only . All the epistles that speaks about baptism refers back to the book of Acts . There’s not a trinity of persons in the Godhead . The Godhead is in Jesus Colossians 2:9 not Jesus in the Godhead . Jesus is the Mighty God , everlasting Father in Isaiah 9:6 , when you see him you have seen the Father in John 14:9 , he’s the Almighty in Revelation 1:8 .

[@CezannieMelchor]

This confirms the trinity is a man made doctrine, hence, not biblical truth.

[@noblemottythomas7664]

The first century preachers were not European (Romans and Greek) but were Jews,, for a Jew lord means God.. disciples use to call Jesus lord after the transfiguration

[@malikrahim-ei1vd]

No early church believes in any trinity because there were no early church before the council of Nicaea. The church began in the 6th century. If there was a church before then who built it, why it was built, how long did it take them to build it, what kind was it? The trinity was added to the New Testament thousands of years after the council of Nicaea during the age of learning which is reading and writing or renaissance era. The trinity was probably in the Old Testament in a different form Greek such as water, spirit, blood, once the Old Testament was translated to Latin it more likely became God the father, the word, Holy spirt. Then Erasmus going back to Greek wrote it in his synoptic gospels as God the father, Son, Holy spirit or it could have been added during the council of Trent 1545- 1563 when they were censoring the bible, or lastly the king James version when Jesus first becomes a Jew. written by scholars as the authorized version.