Disproving Gods with History and Science (Richard Carrier)

In this lecture, Dr. Richard Carrier quickly surveys the history of major religions, and lays out a collection of logical arguments for why science and history support naturalism, and disprove the god hypothesis. See below for additional resources.
Part 2: Q&A (interesting questions, which I cut from this video for time purposes): • Video
The Case Against Christianity (playlist): • The Case Against Chris...
Good articles by Richard Carrier:
Why I am Not a Christian: infidels.org/li...
Why I Don't Buy the Resurrection Story: infidels.org/li...
and books: www.amazon.com/...
Thanks to CFI Calgary for the original upload. Check out their channel for more excellent videos! / cficalgary

[@Keith.Harvey]

I don't usually watch videos this long, but Richard Carrier is a mad genius! Thank you for being the one to tackle and talk about the Godless Universe. More theists needs to open their minds to understanding more about how the natural world works instead of worrying about how their supernatural afterlife might be. Great video!

[@haqq4260]

LEARN THE TRUTH WWW.COSMOLOGY-THEORY-EVOLUTION-QURAN.COM

[@insme]

Interesting that even Christianity itself is a product of evolution of myths and legends before.

[@freddiemcwoon9058]

If you really study the Bible not the church traditions or what you see in the church practices you will find the answer..Tq

[@insme]

Delusion

[@CountBrass]

I hate to tell you this, but the Bible is itself the product of church traditions. Who do you think determined which books would be "in" and which books would not? The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha are filled with books which *could have* made it in, but didn't.

[@edmondlonnergan395]

Aravis Tarkheena

[@DavidBrown-xd2xr]

Satan has duped you for sure

[@easyas314]

Well done! Let's get this stuff out there people!!

[@revvsstrength6269]

One Of The Best And Easy To Understand Lectures I've Seen So Far

[@petuniaandpoppy4615]

One of the most capitalized sentences I’ve seen so far. 😉🤣

[@jamesbarlow6423]

Superficiality is his fortè. He's the Bill Maher of historian wannabes

[@ChillAssTurtle]

@@jamesbarlow6423 mad because you cannot refute the facts XD oof..

[@jamesbarlow6423]

@@ChillAssTurtle . No professional historian takes him seriously. Why should I. Or you.

[@ChillAssTurtle]

@@jamesbarlow6423 many do whatre you talking about XD the copium is strong.. but i expect little else from a delusional person.

[@AtamMardes]

In the beginning man made God.

[@franciscorivera6271]

atam mardes correct and primarily from the ape , our ancestor ,,

[@sirjackjackal1042]

Underrated comment

[@thagreatfrank3071]

This is Beyond I MEAN IT'S FREAKING BEYOND INTERESTING & PRETTY AMAZING!!

[@jamesbarlow6423]

Caveat emptor. He's an ancient history ph.d who can't read a single ancient tongue, knows no original text. That's why he sounds like an 8th grade book report of a Wikipedia page!

[@noseefood1943]

god is santa claus for the grown ups.

[@Skiskiski]

Santa is not real and Christmas is a bunch of pagan hog wash.

[@Skiskiski]

I hope you don't celebrate Christmas. I don't!

[@coleabrahams9331]

@@SkiskiskiYou can still celebrate Christmas even if you don’t believe in Jesus or Christianity. You can still keep the tradition and frame it as a gathering of family and friends to celebrate the lives of each other.

[@user-vh4tu4qg8j]

There is no religion that does not have a Santa cluas, even atheism has a Santa cluas!!!

[@ImaginaryMdA]

The first 2 minutes really are all you need to see that there is no god.

[@DonaldTurner]

potent lecture regarding the improbability of god!

[@VanLightning900]

This converted me to naturalism!!

[@GodEqualstheSquaRootof-1]

People have been drawing supernatural causation ever since a Caveman saw an animal, thought to be dead, leap up and run away after a lightning bolt struck nearby.

[@KilianMuster]

Love the Hitchhiker quote at the end, I could litteraly see the puffing cloud of logic ;-)

[@SOBIESKI_freedom]

Good talk. Thanks for sharing.

[@visforvegan8]

As soon as you started reading 7 min, Raiders of the Lost Arc was exactly what I thought of. I always got a kick out of that movie, but I didn't realize it was biblically accurate, which means historically accurate. I'm going to have to re-watch it, with a new appreciation. 

[@tedapelt9944]

I love the "big picture" idea of seeing all the world's religions at once and how their ideas formed. This video is a "must watch" for anyone who is interested in the history of religion, regardless of personal beliefs. Start with facts and how we know them to be facts, and go on from there. That is exactly how you get to truth. This is the same process used by courts to determine guilt and by air crash investigators to determine the cause of the crash. Religion does not get a special pass.

[@glutinousmaximus]

+Ted Apelt Well, It's not _quite_ the "Big Picture" Absent are for instance: Hinduism (including Jains) Japanese Shinto and Buddhism... but I know what you mean.

[@jamesbarlow6423]

No its not! It's misleadingly superficial, 8th grade level stuff.

[@deanwcampbell]

@ 19:00 he didn't know about malaria & mosquitoes either.

[@BillZebubproductions]

This was highly enjoyable.

[@scooprammer5934]

Its funny how so many comments left by what im asuming are 'believers' just call Richard Carrier stupid but say very little about what he has actually said as a counter.

[@tributeact6995]

probably his best lecture to date,clear and concise, except for one thing, why does he have to talk so fast, or is my brain getting to old.

[@bdwilson100029223]

tribute act I actually sped it up 10% to save time, so don't feel bad. :)

[@tiberiusvetus9113]

bdwilson1000 I speed it up an additional 250%

[@mikebrunet54]

tribute act because that is how he convolutes truth. His just rambles like all atheists and since he believes in the Big Bang which is a joke and the masses are catching onto Entropy and Dinosaur soft tissue...You start with one lie and then ya gotta just keep telling more to sound like your telling the Truth...Richard is a quack just like Richard Dawkins...

[@tributeact6995]

Mike B oh dear

[@LudicFallacies]

Mike B "the masses are catching onto Entropy and Dinosaur soft tissue..." WTF are you talking about?

[@mcoftheyear4000]

Much Love to all people in this chat. Yes guys, I am a christian. (more baptist and protestant to be specific). But From the comments I notice that a lot of bright minds in here, are falling into a little into denial, and not free to really use their reasoning skills more honestly. Honestly while I am all for listening, and researching other points of views (bachelor in world religions), right off the bat, I see a red flag (from 0 to 1:48 min). While is definitely OK, to imagine. he then starts using God and scripture to support his argument against God and scripture. Saying God only revealed himself after so and so time, to a small village. Then withheld knowledge of Jesus for a thousand years. ---Even if this was true, this is not disproving God, this is simply bible study, and expressing a dislike in his actions. Just to clarify, through scripture, God revealed himself since the beginning, and people knew about him always, and God does mention Jesus, the redeemer, since the first promise to Adam and Eve. as well as through the whole history of the old testament, the messiah. But back to my point. Then this guy mentions how God's actions (not biblical sound, yet uses scripture), are senseless (according to his sense?). 0-0. At this point he is just making up an idea of God, that if God doesn't fall under that criteria, then he must not exist? The speaker, becomes God. Also, for many of you guys, we were made to think, and we have freedom to form conclusions, but something is off, when 'faithful' empirical fact based only thinkers, compromise on their own ideals. At least admit that some of your info, is more of a conclusion, rather than truth. Even I as a believer, and yes I do think that believing in Christ (the same one in the bible, not a made up one) does not sacrifice reason, honesty, nor knowledge, or rational, etc, but it enhances it. But even so, I cant say i know every little fact. and I can still respect conclusions, yet while disagreeing with them. (we have a strong ability to doubt even our own existence, I can even doubt my own parents if wanted to, ---meaning I am only human, I cannot possibly know everything!!, worse yet claim it) -(no one in this human world can, regardless of beliefs) (I do claim to know, i exist, I know God, and he loves me, I have a soul, and I came from parents. LOL. just having fun!) And YES, it is completely OK, to also conclude, that God is real. the God of the bible is the real one. Jesus was his son. Sacrificed for our sins, so we may have grace, fulfillment, eternity, and a relationship with the creator, who is the essence of life and all these other great stuff, we seek. That's all, I'll just leave my two cents in. P.S I actually do believe in God,so I know that while all humans can study God, and he can reveal himself, in an infinite amount of ways (including but not limited to , even using these very words, or even this video (free thinking human with speech (amazing!!, like a robot but with life, wow!!)),), God doesn't need me, to show himself in each of your lives, (although you never lose the choice to keep your eyes shut). and truth doesn't need me to defend it, It simply is (like its meaning), at the end of the day it will stand. and Like I said, I don't have to sacrifice Honesty, nor reason. (God is actually very patient, loving and reasonable with us humans --that's why we appreciate his grace) I do admit, I didn't watch the whole video. and again, much love, hope my comment was positive, yet challenging. God bless ya.

[@i.kaminskiy7563]

thank you so much for this!

[@benko916]

Excellent like all his work. Thanks for posting this

[@formulaonegrandprix1]

Very informative video, thank you and God bless you.

[@djupstaten2328]

"thereby refuting the entire Bible" just saying.... ;)

[@davidjoseph2731]

Well, exactly. Failed prophecy is one of the most satisfying ways to show that god is either imaginary or a liar.

[@tim57243]

David Corby Failed prophecy is also consistent with a douchebag God. There is already such a being well documented, if you can stand the banner ads. We should call Him Sithrak.

[@Faeriedarke]

I love it when really, really stupid people try to discredit a brilliant mind...read these comments and be entertained for at least an hour.!

[@Faeriedarke]

I live in Ireland and I am fascinated by the Tuatha de Danann, and I am very much a woman, oooops, your bigot is showing.

[@Sayris13]

So true... laughed so hard at some it brought tears to my eyes

[@aboulabs]

it often starts with: " I don't agree because I believe..."

[@Faeriedarke]

aboulabs Although most aren't even that polite, they just go straight into attack mode. I have even received death threats just for stating that I don't believe in their make believe sky friend.

[@Faeriedarke]

On this thread, a whole raft of comments have been deleted, don't know if it was by youtube, the channel or the commenters.

[@OrbitalAngel]

EXCELLENT

[@ciliaris2]

My god is really friendly and wags her tail when I give her a biskie

[@rdorleans6522]

Dyslexia is your friend.

[@watcherdave23]

Not a good ad for Apple.

[@elmavandermerwe4253]

+Watcher Dave I think its a brilliant ad , buying a apple today !

[@AndyWhite007]

The *funny* thing about this debate is you're meant to believe it's true. @2:00: Shows his ignorance - why would God conform to his view? It's the other way around. Which again shows at @2:21: Sure many religions (the 'silly ones') are just cultural based. The Abrahamic ones show a very common theme but their differences define them. One interesting thing is religious dating seems (to me) to be dated by the artifacts (which makes Hinduism and Zoroastrianism 'early' religions) doesn't seem to take into account religions (such as early Abrahamic Judaism) into account as idols and relics were forbidden. @7:30: Google the translation of the verse in Zechariah (unless you choose to read it in context).

[@Minecraftiano1204]

The late worm gets to live The cross The crucified Jesus The rosary The candels Plagiarism the bible made from other religions: Sacrifices Devils Resurrections All the things in the video And the most incredible plagiarism that I, when I was a christian, could not believe: The Epic Of Gilgamesh. Read it. It was written WAY before the Noah's Ark story.

[@shadrachemmanuel1720]

Dude , just get over it, Christianity is fake!

[@nicksklavos]

Well Done

[@HowToVideosAndTips]

Before the Internet where would the ordinary person been able to access this kind of information, I mean any questioning of the validity of religion at all?

[@seekernz7790]

Have you not heard of Libraries ?

[@MindAnimations]

At eighteen minutes this gets animated! If you where to stumble across a Tardis... a brilliant historian.

[@obaidCarkey]

I wonder what he thinks of the statement that this world is ruled by evil/satan and the next by god....(such as in judaism and islam)

[@davidjoseph2731]

Do you believe that? I think if you were to put that statement forward, you would need strong evidence, and good luck finding it.

[@None17555]

12 minutes in... can't help but remember that the original evidence was that these religions didn't have a consistent message. Yet at 12 minutes the fact that a few religions has similar messages is evidence against them. Double speak? Strawman? How about begging the question? A 40 second window and I've caught all 3. So, yeah, that's enough of this.

[@antiherognome6703]

None17555 The historical evidence does lead to the religions of cultures that were proximate do indeed share and borrow for each other. Carrier is absolutly correct in his analysis

[@davidjoseph2731]

Oh. I thought he was pointing out that the handful of congruent points between the monotheisms was resultant from their adapting to the religions around them.

[@themasculinismmovement]

Wow modern christians really do live in a bubble

[@Zman44444]

Thank christ someone understands the world. Great video!

[@kenosentity6455]

Lol , "thank christ".

[@shadrachemmanuel1720]

Thanks , Jesus Christ. I'm atheist.

[@n0gulag]

I don’t think he disproved science, but I think he did disprove history.

[@stewiegriffin5075]

God is mankind's greatest invention

[@Teltaminoru]

Or... vice versa. Who knows?

[@hugolindum7728]

I find spoons to be more useful.

[@nobody-rw9cc]

i also find spoons more useful then humans well said hugo

[@Irishmule169]

Stewie Griffin I would say the opposite though... Religion and so called gods has been the downfall of humanity

[@Teltaminoru]

The irish mules are not better...

[@d.b.cooper8379]

I am the one true god and I demand you bring me a milkshake!

[@abinstein]

Good argument.. actually a great one. But those who insisted to be religious probably don't know what improbable means mathematically in the first place.

[@bwkelley]

A quick search on Google informed me that there are far fewer than a trillion galaxies. It seems like exaggerating this point does not really help his case. It is still an interesting talk.

[@wilsonvonfluffenstein7695]

+Brian Kelley "New research estimates there are 2 trillion galaxies in the observable region of the cosmos, an order of magnitude more than previously thought" This quote is from an article from The Atlantic in 2016.

[@glutinousmaximus]

I love that term "Douchebag God". I'm guessing that "Douchebag" is particularly an Americanism. 'Douche' is just French for 'shower' - or just to cleanse. Curious as to where the 'bag' part came from? Maybe the *_Big Bag Theory?_*

[@glutinousmaximus]

Gosh! Thanks for telling me. So, can you buy a Douchebag? I mean like at the Pharmacy. ("Drugstore" is it?) My GF would certainly benefit from one. Is it a present she would appreciate? Thanks. Oh - she likes things in pink.

[@jmmvirta]

"if the universe is picked among from all the possible universes" -> who or what does the picking? Nothing comes out of pure chance, not even the slightest possibilities, since even those are something (opposed to nothing).

[@big504easy]

this guy mentioned all this stuff buy somehow left out ancient Kemet / Egypt where a lot of the stuff was taken from butt he seemed to credit Greece and Rome and Persia heavily leaving out the African influence of all this stuff

[@markroutt4790]

Carleton Coleman the point is that religion is man made.

[@pelegelareus1270]

Carleton Coleman. Exactly. No mention of Africa

[@Omega0850]

He DOES mention egypt. Also persia, greece and rome DID HAVE a much stronger influence on judaism/christianity than the entire africa, maybe except for egypt, so leaving out possible similarities to african religions is the reasonable thing to do.

[@Jamie-Russell-CME]

You might wanna look into the ancient Chinese writing. 4000 BC and is clearly based off the biblical narrative. Uh oh!

[@sirbottoms1998]

That doesn't prove anything

[@killjoy9218]

+Patrick “PaulsTwoCents” Paul ikr

[@davidjoseph2731]

Wtf?? You need to provide references.

[@sirbottoms1998]

David Corby references man! My mom says she knows the bible is true because the bible says its true, like WTF

[@davidjoseph2731]

+Patrick i mean, I know how people seem to think that second hand accounts of misconceived opinions make for convincing arguments, but really :/

[@zorroinhell5549]

What he is not saying is that Osiris dates back 4000 B.C.E. in Kemmet, aka Egypt.

[@kodijames6277]

It has been (my) 'observation' (for many years)...that...'FAST TALKERS' (like 'this' guy) are very 'shallow' individuals. They have 'intelligence'...but...(not necessarily)...'WISDOM'.

[@kodijames6277]

+lazyrix iscariot 'LAZYRIX ISCARIOT'?!! Are you (fucking) 'KIDDING' me?!! Where..."IN THE HELL"... did you 'get'...such a 'FUCKED UP' name?!! That (has) to 'be' the 'STUPIDIST NAME'...I've (ever) heard!

[@kodijames6277]

+lazyrix iscariot No...idiot. Lazarus is (not) spelled 'LAZY-RIX'.

[@kodijames6277]

+lazyrix iscariot L-O-L!!!!!!

[@RSEFX]

+Kodi James And, of course, Kodi is actually spelled Cody. ;-7

[@kodijames6277]

+RSEFX And, of course...'IDIOT'...is (actually) spelled 'RSEFX'.

[@themasculinismmovement]

The universe was not designed to produce life

[@TheMargarita1948]

The soundtrack of this video is artificially speeded up to an extent that makes the speaker nearly unintelligible.

[@forcedtohaveahandle]

What soundtrack? Also, he’s very intelligible. You might have hearing issues if you’re not trolling or exaggerating, you should consider seeing a doctor.

[@corylwillrise]

What does he mean Christianity was 'borrowed' from Judaism? The prophets under the old law prophesied the coming of Christ. They are inextricably linked. Christ's life on Earth was written about several hundred years before He was born. He's just idly chattering around this being true. Just because a people are aware of the Bible doesn't mean that they can't cause harm on other people through cruelty. This man will spend his entire life debating the existence of a God he doesn't believe exists.

[@mythbuster1483]

Name one prophecy that 'Jew-Zeus' fulfilled. The anonymous author of Matthew based his fake "virgin birth" story on a mistranslated Greek version of Isaiah. Matt. 1:22: "All this took place to fulfill what the Lord had said through the prophet: 'The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and they will call him Immanuel". The author is quoting a Greek version of the Hebrew Scriptures called the Septuagint, which famously mistranslated the Hebrew word for 'young woman' in Isaiah 7:14. You can read the correct text in a Jewish bible: "Therefore, the Lord, of His own, shall give you a sign; behold, the young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and she shall call his name Immanuel." www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/15938 The Hebrew word used is "almah", which means "young woman". The Hebrew word for "virgin" is "betulah", which is NOT used. The Jews had no teaching of a virgin birth anywhere in their scriptures. And also, Isaiah 7:14 is not a messianic prophecy, but was fulfilled in his day. So there is NO virgin birth prophecy anywhere in the Hebrew Scriptures. FAIL! This is further proof that your New Testament stories are based on fraud and fake prophecy fulfillments. Additionally, this shows that the author of Matthew apparently couldn't even read Hebrew and was unfamiliar that he was reading a Greek mistranslation...so he most likely was not a Jew from Palestine. DOUBLE FAIL!! Additionally, it shows that whoever wrote Matthew was a liar trying to make the life of Jesus fit Old Testament prophecies...and in this case we can see through the deception because of the mistranslation. TRIPLE FAIL!!!

[@josiatokirina1788]

Brilliant! I love science and evidence based logic. To bad the majority of humans are so ignorant and seem to like it.

[@unrecognizedtalent3432]

G.O.A.T IMHO 😊😊

[@themasculinismmovement]

So christianity isn't itself. But what about Hinduism?

[@martinwhite7053]

This is really very good isn't it? However we knew this already *didn't we?*

[@garybell1291]

As obvious as the remnant nictitating lense in your eye, as obvious as the 50+ Christians buried alive in their church in Nepal, as obvious as gays given legal marriage status in the US instead of being given rather large rocks to the head.

[@RiotKurhein]

Garish Belliferous What are you getting at? Neither of those things are related to one another and you'd be a loon to suggest as much.

[@garybell1291]

RiotKurhein Mmm, the connection is religion which is the direct topic of the video. 1. Creationists deny the science of evolution and the nictitating lens in our eye is evidence of evolution. 2. Christians die like everybody else, even when worshipping their gods in church, showing it either doesn't exist or doesn't give a fuck. 3. The 3 Abrahamic faiths all demand that homosexuals be stoned to death with rocks to the head and the world is in the process of legalizing gay marriage, proving that modern man is more moral and civilized than any religious faith or any of the thousands of gods. All are direct references to the topic at hand, the joke of Christianity.

[@None17555]

Garish Belliferous "The 3 Abrahamic faiths all demand that homosexuals be stoned to death" Hate to bring facts into your diatribe, but this is easily refuted. The punishment for homosexual acts in Leviticus was exile from the holy land. There are no punishments listed in the New Testament, perhaps besides "shall not inherit the kingdom." In Romans 1, it's actually the punishment. So yeah, Surah 7 says to stone homosexuals. That's one. You got 1 out of 3. That ain't bad, right? The problem is that your point #3 is the closest analogue to reality. Cognitive dissonance should not be your basis for judging entire segments of the population. Instead, it ought to prompt to you to wonder why you're so easily cowed into believing what you've been told without considering any real evidence, when your only criticism of others is that they've committed the same sin.

[@martinwhite7053]

None17555 The bible is full of *punishments in fact, not only death but a *second death* Clearly the bible was written by bronze age goat herders. Inspired by the big man himself? I think not.. www.openbible.info/topics/punishment_of_sin

[@secularfoundingperiodhistory]

Why not simply ask God Pretenders the ultimate question where did their God come from who made their God they want to present their God like it really exists without pointing out where their God came from who made their God

[@pyron9574]

Religion believes: Believes>>>proven facts

[@i.kaminskiy7563]

incredible!

[@marklimbrick]

And then a freak impossible accident leaves this guy brain damaged and this lecture is redacted, retracted! I like the way he makes his way so quickly and articulately through pre-history to the present. It's the issue of the human need to have an imperfect comfort rag to cling onto that he also needs to address. He isn't an anthropologist, neither is Richard Dawkins. But they should be able to look in a more sympathetic way at why humans are able to have this supernatural belief system at the same time as a rational enquiry and curiosity which is where are technology comes from. Children's minds are malleable and after a few years of indoctrination and they will grow up believing anything.

[@markwoods4439]

Yes he dose have good record of history, if you like it or not. Now prove history wrong an I'll believe you. Good job Richard.

[@germanscientist5761]

God is Love and Christ Jesus is the Lord God bless you reading this

[@mythbuster1483]

God is love, which is how we know the 'buy-bull' isn't from God, since it tells fanatics to murder children and infants: "This is what the Lord Almighty says...Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys." (1 Samuel 15:2-3).

[@stewiegriffin1723]

@@mythbuster1483 don't forget how the all-knowing perfect god "regretted" making saul king of Israel later on in that story 😉

[@loriw2661]

The Christianity quote was, I am pretty sure, said by Aron Ra.

[@siperaking5480]

Worship bacon.

[@Piglatinsuperstar]

someone is out on a mission to destroy christianity before it was Jacklyn glenn today it is Richard Carrier

[@ParadiseLordRyu]

Maybe because it isn’t true

[@Piglatinsuperstar]

​@@ParadiseLordRyu you can always find out. Tell the lord Jesus that you would love to make Him the lord of your life and that you long to be in His glorious presence to worship and adore Him forever and ever

[@Chloe_Titles]

I can not wait until we are beyond the phase of religion. My only question that remains is how did we successfully program millions of minds about this God that isn’t real. I will never understand that.

[@Killzoneinbound]

It’s been used throughout history to control “weak minded” people by the people at the top. Much like slave masters would let their slaves learn the Bible all because of one simple verse Ephesians 6:5 5 Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.

[@pyron9574]

It was a way to make the curches richer.

[@appnzllr]

Your comment that the Jews were taken into captivity by the Persians may not be accurate. Someone has probably commented on this. The northern kingdom was taken into captivity by the Assyrians, but the southern kingdom of Judah was taken into captivity by the Babylonians. The Babylonians conquered Assyria, but the Persians conquered Babylonia and took over the Judeans/Jews. They didn't have to carry them off into captivity from Judah.

[@dewinthemorning]

So, religion was evolving, like everything else. I mean this in the concept of general evolution (Matt Ridley - "The Evolution of Everything"). Biological evolution is a specific case.

[@Skiskiski]

If I did not believe in God and he is not real I would not utter a make believe word in my mouth. I would spend my days being happy and then die.

[@martinwhite7053]

Rather than being miserable and die anyway?

[@nirmalapersaud7589]

.

[@hakalaprcko]

dewinthemorning true

[@ciliaris2]

And some folks think DT is a christian just like JC. Except for all his words and actions

[@AtlasandLiberty]

Joseph Murphy's Book "The power of your Subconscious Mind" absolutely destroys Richard Carrier....Religions were initiated by a genius...then they are destroyed because average humans cannot comprehend why things are done the way they are...resulting in the typical violence...and then we have Richard Carrier who is a smart human with tunnel vision...who further makes God unintelligible....Read the Murphy Book....it is free even in audio versions on KZbin

[@patrickbateman4087]

"because average humans cannot comprehend why things are done the way they are" You are aware of this thing called science, aren't you ?

[@AtlasandLiberty]

Patrick Bateman: Science is systematized knowledge of a result after which a capable disinterested third party can perform the steps and obtain the same result. All of this can be found in Joseph Murphy's many books.

[@patrickbateman4087]

OK, so your JM mentions things in books... so what? Is he a relevant scientist, historian or has he published anything science related that passed peer review that suggests god is real???... is he even alive??..no, no, no. Do you realize the actual science can be found in the library, and it isn't opinionated or skewed by apologists.

[@AtlasandLiberty]

Patrick Bateman Perform the Science or you can let an ignorant Richard Carrier do your thinking for you. J. M. had several Graduate Degrees. So do your own due diligence and check it out. God is within all beings.....Just remember Sam Harris thinks humans do not have Free Will...So what, animates his thinking or controls his thinking? Funny Joseph Murphy has written about the Answer

[@shadrachemmanuel1720]

​@@AtlasandLiberty Which god exactly?

[@johngivson5717]

Jesus

[@alajxandro1907]

To believe what Carrier we need faith.

[@mythbuster1483]

“A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence” - David Hume

[@alajxandro1907]

@@mythbuster1483 What Carrier said is evidence. We need to have faith on him.

[@enchantingamerica2100]

what a surface level understanding of theistic morality.

[@timhallas4275]

Even though this is brilliantly played, and the facts do speak for themselves, there is one aspect of Christianity that is not being considered here, and will allow the Christians to simply ignore all of this as not being relevant to their belief. When we point out the way in which their God mistreats us, and allows horrors to be brought upon us, and does nothing to help, they (the Christians) will refer to the original sin of disobedience, and claim that all of the suffering is our punishment and that we deserve it. Their premise is, that the human race sinned against their creator, and were cast out of the garden, meaning cast from his presence and love, and now suffer at our own hand. They will maintain that god doesn't visit bad on us, that without his protection from it, we suffer. Then in the savior twist, their god has offered them a form of redemption, (a second chance for the garden) that is, by accepting the label of sinner, we are in essence begging forgiveness for our sinful ways. What they are doing is essentially looking for forgiveness for their own indiscretion that they don't believe is forgivable by fellow humans. Regardless of the psychological reality of their situation, they do believe that this god exists and that he is the only way to be saved from the imperfection of being "of the flesh" as they say. An animal, as it is. In other words, they do not respond to the inference that their God must be evil, because they are simply saying it is our own damned fault.....Furthermore, if you expect that anything you say can make them believe that their god was man made, they will simply refute that on the basis that you cannot prove he doesn't exist, blaming bad human interpretation of his word as the problem with your belief. Christians have an understanding that goes beyond anything visible, provable, testable or "of this world". You can't win that argument, because, in their minds, there really isn't one. There is a complete reality disconnect here. Logic does not apply. I know. I have discussed religion and reality with hundreds of them, one on one. It is always a one way conversation, with me talking to myself.

[@davidjoseph2731]

That whole spiel is bullshit though, since god is by default the author of all evil, no matter what, and regardless of our 'sin', a capable, morally upright god either would not allow evil to exist, or would not just sit idly by and allow its flawed beings to suffer. Regardless of our choices, in this picture we're the created, finite, morally blind creatures, and so god, being infinite, allpowerful etc etc, holds the whole ethical responsibility all the time, not us. And in the saviour twist, if he really made a sacrifice to atone for all the world's sin, then either sin would not exist, or, we would already have been forgiven for all sin and so all be automatically free from hell and death, without having to beg and grovel. It's a load of fearmongering and grotesquely arrogant displays of false knowledge.

[@timhallas4275]

David Corby I have no doubt that the original stories, AKA old testament, are just the inventions of a few men looking to have power over the tribes, and get more goats and virgins in their tent. It is easy to see how the Hebrew writers of their history embellished their stories of war and conquest with a whole lot of fiction and superheros. The real story was quite pitiful. On the other hand, the new testament is a story of intrigue and mystery, with a bigger plot for world domination, that for the most part, is still working. As a reasonable intelligent man, it is hard for me to believe that any modern human is fooled by this scam. I mean, it is literally a complete scam, that holds people as voluntary slaves, for a lifetime, on the promise that an invisible being is going to send Jesus back for them, to keep them from the eternal fire. That is remarkably like volcano worship from the stone age. And the real joke, is it is all based on an astrological system of sun worship, with the volcano god added in from the old testament. These people don't even realize that they are worshiping two different gods at the same time. How desperate do you have to be for a Dad's love to buy into a mythological god as your stepfather. The psychology alone is worthy of a book series.

[@kurtisviktor3314]

Always respond to the Adam and Eve story with the question of incest. How did the earth populate? Did Cain bang his mother? Did Adam bang his daughters? His niece, who was born from mother and son? We know the complications of inbreeding. Mental retardation, still births, increased risks of diseases, and other health complications. The Adam and Eve story is bunk. A population created by 2-3 individuals would either die out or create a population of mental retardation, disease, and deformities. No cities would be built, no inventions, no cures, and certainly no life longevity which the bible claims.

[@MrDaiseymay]

Why doesn't this geezer line -up with other, better known anti religious leader's--like Dawkins ?

[@steve767300]

+Philip Croft Why don't you open your mind?

[@alg11297]

Where did the Zoroastrians get their idea. As a Jewish scholar I can say everything he said up to 9:00 is just wrong. There is no mention of Satan in the OT, the burning fire is in the NT, there are no gods fighting each other of good and evil..the Lord is One. Hey if you want to make stuff up, it would be nice to give references.

[@Beatles123ful]

What you are arguing is that our Very existence is highly improbable and somewhat of a miracle in itself...

[@willemvo7296]

your speech comes forth directly from the university logic that is one sided and more bringing together past ideas in a structured way then exploding ideas and bringing something new and more fullfilling. Logic doesnt need to be build up from the small, but from the big, divided into the small, and how difficult it can be to understand why god would create such chaotic evolution in religion for a certain reason, the reason can not be seen as long as your worldview is centered around your own salvation, atheistic self selvation in consiousness or religious heaven salvation are both the same coin, they start to understand god/truth from their own perspective. Your speech has no sight on the esoteric that is hidden in all religion nor is it allready open to the faillure of science concerning all questions that step outside time. Logic, is a structure that is in need of detail, that relfects back to the total, and detail is created by division, and history is interwoven in such ways that opposites play each other out in the most smart and efficient way to create a glory not made for ourselves, but for the total of us, that controls us and our opportunitites, god. this evolution is the arc, put as methaphor in religion, as all things in religion are the literal mirror or methaphor of the abstract that could only become and exist through the development of the mind, which comes forward from the heart (the need to evolve). this is why something is,was, and never will be, or will be, was and never is. Revelation is a book that can only be understood by the rejection of faith so you could find it back. Truth and love become one in that place where logic becomes born and becomes god, and free from logic, to be able to choose to be it. God is the final paradox, and because of that the answer to all questions. Evil is a logic consequence of the existence of god, as love is the creating force behind evil, and also the solution. the lost sheep is the methaphor for god himself.

[@nyxxie023]

I want to download RC's Biblical knowledge into my brain.

[@VideoGrabaciones2010]

Sarcasm is not a good argument. By the way, I read the stories and legends about Jesus. He is "quoted" arguing for the importance of spirituality instead of rejecting proper hygiene practices. Watching hands affects our physical bodies, but does not make us more spiritually pure than others. Carrier needs to work on his Greek exegesis and Talmudic studies.

[@mythbuster1483]

Jesus is responsible for millions of deaths by teaching that the cause of human illness was DEMONS and that medical issues should be treated using exorcism (Matt. 18:16, Mark 1:32, Matt. 9:32-33, Matt. 12:22, Matt. 17:14-18), which set medical science back by 1,500+ years, and he discouraged hand-washing during a time when 50% of all children died of disease before age 5 (Mark 7, Matt. 15:1-11). According to the CDC, handwashing is the #1 way to prevent infections - www.cdc.gov/handhygiene/pdfs/CDC_HandHygienePoster.pdf Thanks, Jesus!

[@kumuthamachavellai3554]

Nice

[@onestagetospace4892]

He is preaching to the converted but the problem with counting on probability as an argument is this: I am 100% certain that God might exist, while I am never certain that I can disprove the existence of a God. Science cannot disprove or prove with certainty, and all logical or reason based systems have mathematically been proven to be self-contradictory (the uncertainty theorem, correct me if I get the title wrong). The agnostic view is by definition outcome-neutral. The atheist argument deals in believing or trusting the assumption that a preponderance of evidence can reasonably qualify as proof. But the issue is not being reasonable or not, but absolute proof or disproof. The first is statistical or qualitative, the second is binary. The theist view apparently has no reason to feel threatened by atheist arguments. While errors or antiquated morality in a book can be laid bare for all to see, the basic idea that a God is working through history or was present it's start, remains out of scope of science. Even a working Big Bang theory, even if it works, cannot disprove an unmoving mover willfully giving it a nudge. And how would we ever go back in time to check? Maybe we will invent time travel, but for the time being, this is quite far away. So any scientist with the hunch that God might exist or believes he exist, can never be proven to be taking an absurd or untenable position. In fact, it turns out to be the more prudent view. (He will see it as more prudent or more correct, or more in tune with his intuition or belief, while an atheist scientist would more likely describe it as mental cowardliness). Again, a preponderance of evidence would never qualify as absolute proof because "belief" is not bound by strict reductionist scientific reasoning. Now, the opposite question; if God could be proven to exist; does not necessarily supersede the possibilities of science. God could possibly manifest as a measurable field or power today described as 'supernatural'. Electricity and lightning used to be 'supernatural'; God might be a "dude" moving about in a tenuous higgsfield. But as with taking a peak before the Big Bang, (how does nothing expand, in nothing, in no time, out of nothing, and make a matter filled room in it?), for now most atheist scientists feel it supersedes, the basic methodology available in the scientific toolkit, so there also is no way for scientists to deliver convincing persuading arguments. Those who do want to try to venture into this realm, or apply scientific methods to what atheists deem/assume unquestionable, like questioning if a consciousness-field exist outside of the brain, are ostracized. This too is lamentable.

[@patrickbateman4087]

"I am 100% certain that God might exist"..... I say the same for unicorns, bigfoot, Nessie, el chubracabra, aliens, fairies, the moth man, and alligators in the sewers...

[@onestagetospace4892]

Well done Patrick Bateman. There is hope for you :) Scientific method isn't perfect. It is good for a lot of things but, as it currently is, not for a definitive understanding of the nature of reality.

[@vinskeeter]

History and science actually completely obliterate any notion of gods. You only need the logic and common sense of a kid of about 12, to understand that gods are contrived.

[@704GOD]

Jesus is not religious! He rebuked the religious leaders of His time for their acts plus He said if one is to take up a religion it's to heed the orphan and widow affliction and keep unstained from the world so how does that work... Dr. Richard!

[@dirkcampbell]

As he said, there was a number of saviour religions around before Christianity which borrowed all their material. Included are the deeds and sayings attributed to Jesus which you can find in the deeds and sayings of the other saviour gods, those for whom some record still survives As the Jesus Seminar has shown, much of the Christian liturgy comes direct from the Dionysian mysteries and many of the sayings and instructions of Jesus come from Greek philosophical tradition.

[@Irishmule169]

Carrier K’Od the bible on this one....

[@p.jessoncollins7296]

I am in love!!!!!*#$$

[@Overonator]

One criticism of this presentation is that the speaker seems to pull out the "10 to the power of 5,000,000,000" probability the way creationists pull out probabilities, out of their ass. No need to do that.

[@SlyNine]

Overonator I agree that the statistical part was (probably lol) his weakest argument.

[@SlyNine]

***** I don't care much for appeals to authority. I find it flawed for the same reasons I find the Drake equation flawed. But I'd still like him to walk me threw the process that lead him to those numbers.

[@mikebrunet54]

Overonator always an example used when debating a single cell evovling from the aftermath of a Big Bang theory and evolution..not pulling anything out of ass...just a fact that disproves Macro Evolution which is absurd..

[@SlyNine]

Mike B So how did he come up with the number than? Also are you saying "the fact" that disproves macro evolution is absurd or macro evolution is absurd?

[@RidgelJones17]

+Love God BAM! Damn good point.

[@williambillycraig1057]

If Richard Carrier were God, he would have done the God thing differently. He twists the Scritpteu to say what he wants it to say so he does not have to engage it on its own terms.

[@roder51]

Gods are so real people lose it at funerals.

[@deacondanieldauvin4124]

Naturalism cannot deal with the supernatural or transcendence. It is its own theory and secular religion. Man is a living being with soul, mind and body. Richard Carrier's analysis is not pertinent to the realm of the unseen, invisible creation or spirits, truth, love, joy. Is he another pseudo-historian trying to bash God, the supernatural and theology in general. Tsk, tsk. That's not cricket you know. You're out of your league, sir. However if you are sincere in your vague quest for truth. I respect that. God bless you.

[@oceanceaser44]

+Deacondaniel Dauvin Naturalism to me (and I expect Carrier as well) is the position that there is not enough evidence or reason to believe in the supernatural, as opposed to the exclusion of the supernatural from any thought, as you have proposed.

[@deacondanieldauvin4124]

+oceanceaser In philosophy, naturalism is the "idea or belief that only natural (as opposed to supernatural or spiritual) laws and forces operate in the world."

[@deacondanieldauvin4124]

+oceanceaser naturalism is the "idea or belief that only natural (as opposed to supernatural or spiritual) laws and forces operate in the world."

[@oceanceaser44]

Deacondaniel Dauvin True, but the two are not not mutually exclusive. I hold the the belief that only natural laws and forces operate in the world. This belief is built on the lack of evidence for the contrary. This doesn't mean that this belief is an assumption, just as I doubt you view your belief in the supernatural as an assumption.

[@PharociousArt]

Aye, you bring up a good point there. This man seems to be ignore a lot of the unseen. But, since he is idealogically opposed to faith I guess that isn't all that suprising. I can use natural laws to hint at the divine though. Shit, that's where it's at. Microwaves, ultra violet, cosmic waves. Music. All unseen. Until recently, and only an interpretation is seen. However, they are very real. We didn't always know about them and yet they were around before we did. Only when we discovered them by chance and built recievers where we able to study them. Wireless signals go right on past any thing that isn't meant to recieve it. Think about that and the context of divine messages. (I'd check out the pineal gland.) What about DNA? How's that for intellegent design? All living things on this planet use this same coding language for all the of it's life fuction. We all use the same chemicals and elements to operate our glands, to build our hormones. All of it the same. How about electrons and protons? How do they "randomly" develop a system of positive and negative poles so that they can stick together. I'd say there is an intellegence there. Speaking of positive and negative. The balance of both leads to equilibrium. Which is a stable platform to exist off of. There must be the contrast and the bridge between. He asks about the evil. I cannot speak for all of it but most of our suffering as humans is pretty much self-inflicted. We are currently still learning collectively how to behave. So, there are going to be a lot of mistakes. Which is how natures are grown. Trials. We call our groups of people "Cultures" and just like bacteria cultures we grow. Some adapt, most don't. New ones are formed from what survives. Now a little personal...I come from a belief that there once was only 1 omnipotent, immortal oversoul in nothingness. Which is pretty shitty. I'd imagine it be quite lonely to be all knowingly conscious in an eternal infinite void. I'm just a human so I have no idea how it got there. So, anyways the oversoul decided to break itself up into parts to create expirieance (I know I'm spelling this wrong but spellcheck has betrayed me) Some parts became the material, the rest became the energy that interacts with material. I believe that every soul is a piece of the divine and that life is something more than nothing to do. I also believe that this explains a lot of the seemingly absentee father kind of ideas people get about god. I'd argue it's a conflict of interest. If you love everything you ever made and then your creations start destroying themselves and each other you're gonna have to come up with some very covert ways to fix it so that nothing feels cheated. Y'know like kids and shit. Because these creations are also you. With their own mini-you dreams and ideas in mind all with equal merit. If I was such a being. I'd put all my upstart creations in a "holy shit what have I started" bin and then organize a method to perfect them so that they can join my other perfected creations. But, like in cooking. You don't make it all at once. First off, no fun. Second, humans require evidence. Kinda like this egghead in this video. Humans only really learn through realization. Which mean there must be examples of what to do and what not to do and some one to do it. Just to provide proof. So sacrifices are made. Which if you believe as I do that the soul is eternal then it's not all that bad. God is the actor, the witness, and the director. It's all for you.

[@tedgrant2]

So what he is saying is Popeye isn't a real person ! Although he might have been based on an actual sailor named Popeye. But all is not lost, because we have an eyewitness account of Popeye. Her name is Olive Oyl and she had a personal experience of Popeye.

[@jmoemorris4133]

This Zoroastrianism is exactly how Jehovah Witness religion believes.

[@kennethgutman3465]

Your very use of the word Jehovah tipped me off that you're not the scholar you appear to be. Check with ANY actual Hebrew scholar. There is no such word in Hebrew. The two acceptable ways to say the name are spelled either Y H V H or YHWH and pronounced either Yahveh or or Yahweh. The 4 consonants are called the tetragram and the name "Jehovah" is a mistake hundreds of years old. Nobody's born knowing these things but a a scholar who doesn't gains a ton of my skeptisism, no matter what else he says.

[@mythbuster1483]

There is no such word as "Jesus" in Greek or Hebrew either. "Jehovah" is the English translation of the Hebrew YHWH, just like "Jesus" is the English translation of the Greek word Ιησούς. There are no "J" consonants in Greek or Hebrew. So if you have an issue with "Jehovah", why don't you haven an issue with "Jesus"? Why don't you have an issue with "Joshua", which is "Jehovah Saves"?

[@donnafoster2478]

Actually religion and science are both limited human attempts to understand God and God's creation which existed even before human beings arrived on the scene.

[@jmitterii2]

+Donna Foster +Donna Foster That's assuming god exits. Science doesn't just assume anything other than the method which assumes anything in reality can be tested so long as examined to the point the testing can be falsifiable, supporting evidence that happens everywhere in the same repeatable testing or examination, produces repeatable predictions within their context and conditions. Religion is just forgone conclusion that god exists, then points to anything and everything for example a theist sees a rock and states there's rock exists therefore god exists. Or anything that comes to their attention, they'll say "coke exists, therefore god" A therefore god" they stick anything they want for A, an infinite variety and often get cute narratives one long turd nugget chain and say therefore god; doesn't matter what the A is, we already know it will end in "therefore god". Makes no predictions and can often cause terrible actions of their followers. All chunks of stupid and irrational turd biscuits.

[@DeconvertedMan]

epic.

[@darriuswilliams6007]

if any 1 has read the bible and simply knows any history isreal was conquered by babylon not persia

[@toms3664]

😅😇

[@jmmvirta]

He was misreading the pagan sources. Read for example Osiris online yourself. Read the documents themselves, and you see the misleading.

[@anthonynuzzo9512]

I thought I would hear an accurate description of Christian Theism and yet again this lecture is found grossly wanting. But far worse, Mr. Carrier is a terrible Philosopher. He simply does not understand the argument from evil and the attendant resolution of this purported problem. I loved his comment about hand washing, presumably making reference to Mark 7:5. I hate to say it but I couldn't stop laughing. Mr. Carrier missed the point of the teaching, and then went on to attempt a refutation of a point that Christ never made. I love listening to his lectures when I need a good laugh.....

[@Itsatz0]

+Anthony Nuzzo Christians suck farts out of pigeons.

[@anthonynuzzo9512]

+itsatz A brilliant retort. You betray exactly what you are solely capable of..... Lmao

[@anthonynuzzo9512]

+itsatz Scholar....... Lmao

[@LewesMusic]

yahweh.... do you realize that JUPITER was actually called by the Romans IOVIS, and that at that time they pronounced it YOHWES...?

[@haqq4260]

LEARN THE TRUTH WWW.COSMOLOGY-THEORY-EVOLUTION-QURAN.COM

[@lissaleggs4136]

Francesco Andreoli Want nothing to do with Jupiter the killer of asteroids.

[@lissaleggs4136]

HAQQ Quran is a bummer man, and so backward it isn't fun.

[@Ensgnblack]

Well, I teach high school Latin and "Iovis" (pronounced closer to yohwis) was the genitive case--used for possession. Latin is an inflected language, which means that different endings, or word forms were used to indicate different uses of the noun (like subject, direct object, etc). In Latin, if you were addressing Jupiter, or using him as the subject, he was "Iuppiter" which is the English word almost exactly. The stem for the word was indeed "Iov-" and all other forms looked closer to the word you mentioned (Iovis, Iovi, Iovem, Iove).

[@lissaleggs4136]

Ensgnblack Luppiter sounds Lucifer

[@mikebrunet54]

John Doe and 13AWG you ignore Entropy, sin and death.You immediate think your belittling me which is nothing new for those who follow truth without prejudice or bias. Your atheist buddies must believe that entropy has reversed and is evolving and ascending which anyone with common sense knows is not true. So what is fact you deny without a valid rebuttal.thus having to prove that entropy no longer exists.

[@paradisecityX0]

Disproving gods is easy. God Itself however, this was a rather straw-grabbing attempt

[@patrickbateman4087]

one only needs evidence.... where is it for ANY gods existence beyond claims?