Do Expensive Chokes Pattern Better?? | Kicks vs. Carlsons vs. Winchester

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Today I pattern tested 4 choke tubes to see what had the best pattern with my Black Cloud loads. I tested all of the chokes at 30 yards to see what the pattern density was like. The results surprised me.
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[@paultravis7580]

At Home Depot I found rolls of paper that is use for under wood floors. It like 48 inches wide and comes in a roll. Works great for pattern testing.

[@davidfreeman8079]

you lost me at "but I don't have a knife" lol

[@kevinjessel8809]

Awesome thanks for the video! A few of us had asked for it back after your end of season video. Thanks for the upload.

[@nathanday8122]

I love these kind of videos because I piece everybody’s knowledge together because one video told me that you should do a 30 inch circle to get your pellet percentage and then do a 10 to 12 inch for a duck representative so the 7 pellet difference doesn’t mean anything if it isn’t going to be even close to hitting the duck

[@MrBowNaxe]

Always wondered what all the differences were in chokes. I've always used the modified one that came with my SX3. So far never had a reason to change. Thanks for sharing.

[@Ashanti2631]

Thanks bro. Just bought a long range Carlson for ducks and was feeling ‘some kind of way’ about using it during the duck opener this weekend. This video made me feel better about it.

[@eldribblebachelor]

Pretty closes contest it seems, been waiting for this vid, thanks bud

[@morganyoder4277]

Thank you so much for making this.

[@erich3639]

Excluding the shot string... from your test I would stay with the factory Modified being that it came with the gun so you didn’t have to spend extra money and it had a nice even pattern tho not as tight but a little spread helps downing birds!!! Great Video man

[@RT_Wild_Outdoors]

Thank you for shooting a proper size patterning board! I shoot Carlsons Light Modified for just about everything.

[@Saber2697]

I just bought a carlsons light modified for clays and improved cylinder for slugs. Can’t wait to see how they perform.

[@joesilverbliss1721]

When I first started goose hunting I moved to full chokes thinking I could get more birds. I eventually realized modified was working better for me with BB shot. Recently I patterned my Carlson's improved cylinder choke and at 35 yards. It looked great so I am using it. I am having great results. As you also said, steel shot requires less choke. I think as you get better at bringing the birds in, you need less choke. It makes you a better hunter. You don't even consider taking those "sky busting" long shots. Thanks for the video. Joe ps. I find the less expensive Winchester 1550 fps BB works fine. I have shot most of the other expensive loads also. The winchester pattern is great.

[@damelit9416]

exactly the video i needed thanks bro

[@markhansen3111]

I used IC and SKT for duck hunting here in Florida. Rarely used MOD and never used FULL. We hunt primarily over decoys and a long shot would be 40 yds. To me the most used choke in IC. We were using steel shot and trulok extended choke tubes. Birds were lots of teal, mallards/moddled and some pintail. I was using a SX2 12ga w/3" no 4 loads but switched 20 ga 3" no 4 and was killing ducks fine.

[@dalton402]

I got a Carlson black cloud LR in my sx4 it preforms absolutely great for me I use it for doves all the way to geese.

[@kswan2234]

Just got the MR and LR today.. Not sure which I'll run though

[@jasontipton8430]

get a piece of plywood and a can of white spray paint you can use it many many times over and over can of black to put a dot in the middle

[@joshuaeck2712]

Great video I was waiting for you to do one like this! I like that carlson's one the best I think.

[@achoefs]

I do like the kicks tightness. Ive improved my sporting clay score by 6 and raise where the shot was placed but my old choke was shot out. I do like the carlsons choke pattern but have yet to shoot mine. Your test. I guess between the two.... whoever has the best deal at the time

[@matthewvandevalk3008]

Stock modified. Good even spread and it came with the gun. 👍🏻

[@robertgordon9132]

I don't shoot ducks any more but back when I did I shot the Remington factory IC over decoys and the factory modified for longer range and never had a gripe. I've seen some high dollar chokes on KZbin tested and several of them have been a disappointment. Don't get me wrong. I own dozens of chokes and some extremely e expensive but I haven't seen a steel shot choke that was a big improvement over the factory IC and modified.

[@andresbarela1434]

There are lures to catch fish, and lures to catch fishermen. I feel like duck chokes are made to catch duck hunters. Full choke hasn't done me wrong so far, but I can't count the ducks I've missed. There doesn't seem to be a measurable difference between a $70 choke and the chokes that come with your barrel. Turkey chokes make sense because you're getting tighter barrel diameter than a full choke.

[@ymparipohjolaa887]

I like to use big loads, little bit smaller bb's and like mod or IM choke. Then I get a lot of bb's on a larger area even from the distance so that will give you easier kills and if you don't have the greatest aim you still get those birds down

[@kenholmes1976]

I love your videos .I find you honest and straight forward Are you aware that you have an obvious flinch?

[@jakebair1810]

I wonder if you could see the difference in shot string if you shot targets over water. You would have to review the footage in slow motion but it might help.

[@donovanmaclean9441]

I run Carlson's cremator with my sbe 3 and only shoot black cloud new and old.tried other brand shells but black cloud is to deadly so that's the only thing that I shoot now.awsome patterns with it too.

[@garigorgodze1219]

I using X-full kicks high flyer for my stoeger m3500. I love it. (N2 to N5) shooting is great 50 yards duck and goose is trouble.

[@tornikekharaishvili8100]

yvelaze kargi shedegi romelma nomerma mogca? shedarebit wvrili safanti ufro karg shedegs debs xo? vgulisxmob konkretulad mag chokze. mec m3500 maqvs. shenit teni vaznebs tu yidulob? tu yidulob romeli brendis vaznebi gamodga shedegiani mag tofze

[@country_boy21]

I like to see you do this with dove loads with different loads and choke tubes. For dove hunting I use the Carlson ported extended choke tube modified

[@alanhodgkinson1717]

Wallpaper bro!👍

[@YankeeWoodcraft]

I shot Winchester's turkey XX choke vs Carlson's XR choke. At 20 yards, both were close. At 30 yards, the Carlson's began pulling away. At around 45 yards, the Carlson's definitely put more shot on the bird. Suffice it to say, no bird would've survived getting hit by either at those ranges, but I'd still say the Carlson's provided a lot more insurance that you'd carry that bird home at the end of the day.

[@loushackelford728]

Great video I have found that most hunters don't pattern a load, gun, or choke. There are no two guns that pattern the same, and that's why we pattern all 3 for the best outcome.

[@robertwatson818]

Two identical guns--same chokes tubes--same shot--may produce radically different patterns. A given brand of choke and constriction may also produce radically different patterns as well. I have a Remington Modified choke which shoots tighter than all the other modified Rem Chokes.

[@JayMarkwood]

Super helpful video. What is the charging handle on the SX4? It does not look like the factory one on my SX4.

[@germicanlifestyle9069]

I like the improved modified...it's one step down from a full...

[@michaelcolman88]

I just bought the combo kicks x full and modified I have yet to test all the shooting ranges are Ickes down Michigan Governor is a putz !

[@googleaccount281]

How about patterning a Code Black Duck and/or Goose Choke out of that SX4? Maybe with some Heavy Steel, Winchester Dryloks, or Federal SpeedShock?

[@drewbaglin1632]

Kicks has the vortex which is made specifically for black cloud

[@kross1261]

Your so right on with this video. I take new hunters out hunting geese and ducks and they show up with their new super tight aftermarket choke thinking they’re going to drop everything. It’s usually just the opposite. I tell them put in their factory modified or improved cylinder and take your $ and go to a skeet range. The tight choke only results in more misses especially for below average shooters.

[@ryangoby9095]

Have you ever used patternmaster? I'm new to shotguns and selecting chokes for them. So far have only gone after geese less than a half a dozen times this being my first season. Look to do some duck hunting as well. Is there a choke to accommodate both? Curious what your thoughts are on patternmaster even in comparison to the other ones in this video!

[@timg7627]

The stock full choke looked the best

[@keithdetwiler6340]

Carlsons all the way in my sx4

[@fenrirunshackled4319]

The kicks looks like it's just a tighter choke than the others, the pattern was super dense in the center with poor coverage around it. The carlsons had a lot better distribution in my opinion. I'm glad you didn't just look at the number of pellets, and the center like the other choke tube reviews I've seen.

[@ralphzobjeck5786]

My SBE2 shoots the factory flush mount M choke better than all the aftermarket tubes. That includes the a factory extended M tube from Benelli. Shooting Kent Fasteel # 3's 3" 1 3/8oz. I also found that I had a much better pattern shooting 3" at 1300 fps over the 3 1/2" at the same speed. The 3 1/2" has a 1 9/16 oz. load.

[@Blackpanther_risen]

Cheapest target is Christmas wrapping paper end of season sale or $1 store gift wraps

[@ronpires7053]

Hi quick question are you using steel shot or lead or bismuth through these chokes especially the high flyer-thxs

[@10at6]

Summed up, it's proven that factory tubes pattern as well as aftermarket. It's been proven many times. And 1 shot determines nothing other than the POI. For a duck gun I would would have it shooting 60/40 high

[@derickashby8294]

Retay started bore drilling their barrels for straighter smoother shooting, do you think they pattern better than hammer forged barrels?

[@MegaBW420]

Hey when are you going to have more hats in stock? I want one!

[@travisgodwin7775]

For the browning a5 instead it being: steel= full/lead=mod. It is steel=improved mod/lead=mod

[@riverrivers250]

Do you still use modified when hunting big canada geese??? From geese to teal’s???

[@TheTylerWhit]

Work well

[@quackstackoutdoors7600]

I like pattern master long range on my beretta a400 xtreme

[@bo7mood692]

How is it with flying ducks?

[@frankmartino835]

I like tight patterns and it looks like that kicks had the tighter pattern. 👍

[@Plainsimple67]

For sporting clays, light mod. or IC.

[@diogenes5381]

Try the BRILEY straight rifled Turkey tube. Then compare with the others.

[@user-og3kw8zb2j]

Hello bro the carlson choke is early or late season or other choke?

[@eldribblebachelor]

Is the Carlsons choke tube Mid Range or long Range ?

[@maxpinson5002]

Not trying to nit pick- what were the constrictions of the choke tubes? These days they're all different even though they still use I , M , and F and so on. I several here of different makes, Invector, Benelli, Carlson, Briley, etc. and none are the same constriction measured with a caliper even though they all use the I. M F XF etc. I have some marked the same even though they go from .690 to .675 And thanks for showing the targets close up

[@michaeldelrossi4487]

IS your shotgun receiver metal to wood with NO Shim? I have the same shotgun and its hitting high and to th left? Any suggestions, using an Improved Modified Carlson's Extended Choke!

[@cameronscott7393]

You should try a jebs i have a whinchester sx4 with a .695 waterfowl choke and it will kill some ducks

[@camrot06ify]

Pattern master

[@timeslick8167]

What is the bore diameter on the carlson choke that you shot.

[@davidbetts480]

I am like you, I do prefer to use the modified choke.

[@ESHARDY08]

Kicks mod and full in my benelli sv

[@rodogoutdoors]

I like the kickd

[@robertgordon9132]

The difference was not enough to matter. The Carlson and modified factory choke may have been a little more uniform but my fifty plus years of patterning shotgun and then hunting with them has shown what appears to be an advantage on paper may not pan out in the field. Even so I would likely go with the Most uniform.

[@lincolnwerner8077]

I just got a Winchester sxp. I am wondering what a good choke would be good for trap shooting and duck hunting? Thanks for the great ccontent😀👍

[@DegenLaw]

I shoot competitive shotgun sports in college and for trap I use my Carlson Cremator Mid Range same thing I use busting mallards. I have a sxp but I mainly use my Remington Versa Max.

[@705Ibanez]

Give Trulock a try! Love mine

[@j.michaelrogerson8541]

Buckshot is really where it changes up you’ll definitely see the difference

[@alexkiminki8380]

Dude get the mallards bro hats back in stock ! !

[@seeratlasdtyria4584]

You need to actually 'mic' the inside of your choke tubes. More than one aftermarket performance choke manufacturer has been 'caught' simply 'adjusting' the actual choke internal diameter thus shading modified a bit towards full choke inside diameter etc. Also, you need to fire more rounds per choke. Shot shells do NOT 'pattern' identically from round to round. There's a LOT of physics involved in the shot interactions with each other, the barrels, the different wads etc. In short, there's no "Magic" involved here, black or otherwise (wink), just science and entropy.

[@BigBaitsBigFish]

Cora!!!!!!!!!

[@jeffreylocke8808]

TSS hits hard and penetrates to kill not wound. Even in a 20 gauge you will kill not wound with TSS. Try it and see.

[@22review]

I think he should do a live stream with Lucas

[@josephchapman4899]

I’m using a Winchester modified and I’m not switching

[@andyvincent5150]

Modified in steel = Full in lead. Also, Kick’s High Flyer in Mod is actually an IC. The High Flyer Full is a Modified. They gave them their designations based on the old school lead patterns for some reason. If you check the measurements or call Kicks, they will validate.

[@snakeriverfisher]

I didnt think you could use a full choke with steel shot, I've seen some gun barrels bubble after doing it, was a long time ago i guess already, maybe different now.

[@Plainsimple67]

YOU ARE RIGHT, NEW TECHNOLOGY WITH CHOKES AND BARREL MANUFACTURING.

[@Plainsimple67]

PATTERN IS ALSO GETS EFFECTED BY YOUR SHOTSHELL MANUFACTURERS, VELOCITY AND PELLETS USED IN THERE!!🤷‍♂️

[@mm88swrt]

Pattern master!

[@jerrodladner3019]

If winchester uses browning chokes then they are more open than what they say. Winchester full is same as remington modified

[@dankruger2890]

Yap

[@tonykirby9574]

The hole count says it all. Winches the one that came with gun is as good as high priced aftermarket chokes. Aftermarket are waste of money.

[@sethhalmrast2007]

Kicks mod best for all

[@jasontipton8430]

what this told me is to not waste my money on Carlson and just stick with the invector plus tubes that come with the Winchester i have a Winchester that's what I'm going to do

[@minnesota4169]

I’ve heard that you aren’t supposed to use the full choke that comes with shotguns because it is not rated for steel shot...anyone heard anything similar?

[@googleaccount281]

Because using steel shot typically means jumping to the next tighter choke your modified will become a full and a full will become a risky, and dangerous choke to use for steel shot

[@ggw7948]

From my experience improved mod is about as far as you want to go with steel....for bismuth full and extra full are good...tungsten comparable to steel

[@googleaccount281]

@@ggw7948 agreed, I’ve used improved mod before with steel but not enough to know if it affected anything

[@ggw7948]

@@googleaccount281 ive had really good luck out of a carlsons cremator long range which is improved modified constriction.....especially shooting 2s and 3s....bb size for me seem to like a looser choke like modified better

[@brentbusick2245]

The factory choke tube will say right on it if it’s ok for steel. I have factory full chokes that say ok with steel.

[@reddawng43x91]

I like to save $200 and use the factory chokes and get the same if not better patterns than the aftermarket gimmicks

[@mlwalters73]

Great video, Just to add something. With the kicks, the ports are suppose to add recoil reduction as well. Don’t know how much, but that’s what they say. I know it’s time consuming and sometimes costly, but it would be nice to see multiple shots on different paper with the same load/choke to see if it changes any. Most patterning videos online are one shot tells all. I like the videos, keep them coming.

[@yourmomma2995]

ports dont reduce recoil, its just something manufactures say to sell more chokes and make more money. i have had a lot of ported chokes and all ports do is make a lot more noise and make the top end of your gun case real dirty. i wont ever buy a ported choke again.

[@kevinmartin2096]

Carlson

[@podunkish2278]

Looks like you could have saved $150 and went with the modified that came with it.

[@zachtorgerson5919]

Muller chokes

[@DadandSonsOutdoorsAdventures]

Kicks high flyer modified is pretty much an improved cylinder in comparison to your factory chokes. Not a full choke. A Kicks high-flyer full would basically be a improved modified in your factory chokes.

[@philipwatzke5198]

Exactly !constriction kicks full similar to mod extra full constriction same as imp modified per kicks numbers and invector plus factory chokes

[@DadandSonsOutdoorsAdventures]

Browning invector plus choke tube constrictions are as follow improved cylinder 0.737, modified 0.728 ,improved modified, 0.720. Kicks high flyer choke tube constriction are modified 0.732, full 0.722,extra full 0.715

[@DadandSonsOutdoorsAdventures]

All of these numbers are for the Browning invector plus choke tubes which is what the Winchester SX4 uses

[@philipwatzke5198]

Are those your measurements Winchester list. . 730 icyl. 720 mod. 715 imp mod source Winchester guns. Com

[@DadandSonsOutdoorsAdventures]

No it is not my measurement. It is a Google search for factory Browning invector plus choke tube constrictions and the kicks high-flyer choke to constriction. I was just trying to put the information out there for everyone to see. Make what you want of it. have a great day!

[@jdffurr3237]

A modified patterns steal the way a full patterns Lead

[@grousedog88]

Spread shouldn’t be as important as uniform. Large gaps in pattern could mean you are actually shooting around the duck.

[@pahunter7816]

Nice video.. But I'll stick with my Remington SP 10 ga shooting Federal Black Cloud in # BB out of my .720 Terror Coke Tube for geese & my Browning Gold 12 ga shooting Federal Black Cloud in #3's out of my .675 Terror Choke Tube for ducks.. Both setups are hands down lights out devastating on geese & ducks..

[@cooperconleyoutdoors6330]

Who remembers cope junkies

[@curtmuffley2995]

Factory chokes are labeled for lead shot only. Steel shoots tighter patterns through factory chokes. For example, a factory modified choke (labeled for lead) patterns like a full choke when using steal. Most manufacturers recommend that you not shoot steel through a factory full choke, because the choke constriction is too tight. Conversely, the modified Carlson and kicks choke tubes (labels for steel) would operate like an improved cylinder if you were to shoot lead through them. In conclusion, if want a modified pattern with steel, you should have used a factory improved cylinder and the kicks and Carlson chokes in modified or mid-range. You right about black cloud. Black Cloud said you can now use a ported choke tube with the new ammo. Still a very cool video.

[@whitebuffalo3425]

Not always. My factory full choke is rated up to bb for steel and any lead. Depends on choke and pellet size...

[@curtmuffley2995]

White Buffalo yup, that’s right. I believe when you get into BB is where constriction becomes an issue with factory full chokes.

[@Hades-in5jy]

So basically save your money and use the ones the shotgun comes with.

[@camrot06ify]

Is that the carlson creamator

[@BeatRock253]

No, he said its the Carlson Black Cloud choke designed for the Black Cloud ammo

[@monameljareh1203]

What was the size of carlson black cloud

[@MartellOutdoors]

Carlson chokes are garbage, high flyers are garbage, if you shoot a winchester or browning I'd recommend a Wicked Wing choke tube you can get close range mid range or long range and I use the long range I have no problem shooting ducks up to 65 yards somtimes I get close 20-25 yard shots but late season when ducks are already shot at i get 40-50 yard shots and I never have to chase ducks unless I get bad shots flying like if it's a wing only shot or if I shot behind it a bit. Other then that I destroy divers late season with that choke.

[@guybaxendale]

With the greatest respect this is not any kind of a real pattern test - its a few shots at bits of paper

[@googleaccount281]

Agreed but 80% of the time this is how a hunter patterns their gun

[@FirePirate099]

Shot string length has zero effect on flying targets

[@rudyelizondo1935]

Interesting vid with no conclusion, hmmmm.

[@dillinsauve1118]

Bro your not supposed to shoot steel out a factory full, as a gun mechanic nut I can say it’s not healthy for your gun!

[@whitebuffalo3425]

It depends on the choke and shot size. My factory full is stamped up to bb for steel and any lead. To say never is not correct...

[@brentbusick2245]

Some factory full chokes CAN shoot steel!!!!

[@kenholmes1976]

I.surprized at your flinch

[@geraldelwood5460]

Carlson