Do Wider Tires Actually Have More Grip? Testing 27 Cars

Does Weight Effect Your Car's Grip?
Vbox Sport (Test Equipment Used) - amzn.to/2nPBBwX
The Physics Of Wide Tires - • Why Do Wider Tires Hav...
Nissan Titan vs Mini Cooper - • How Did A Nissan Titan...
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This video answers three questions:
- Do wider tires have more grip?
- Do cars that weigh more have less grip?
- What's the most effective way to improve grip?
At NWAPA's 2017 Mudfest I tested 27 different AWD and 4x4 trucks and SUVs. I did a 60 mph to 0 mph braking test with every vehicle on the road, and a 20 mph to 0 mph braking test with every vehicle off road.
Vehicles Tested: (Order below is order of tests)
Lexus GX460
Nissan Armada Plat
Nissan Pathfinder Plat
Toyota 4Runner TRD Off
Volkswagen Alltrack
RAM Power Wagon
Mazda CX-5
Subaru Forester
Land Rover Discovery
Ford Raptor
Jeep Wrangler Sport
Mini Countryman
Jeep Grand Cherokee TrailHawk
Mercedes GLS 450
Nissan Rogue Hybrid
Toyota Highlander SE
Kia Sportage SX Turbo
Mitsubishi Outlander Sport
Mitsubishi Outlander
BMW X4M
Honda Ridgeline Black
Volvo V90 XC
Acura MDX SH-AWD
Toyota RAV4 Platinum
Jeep Compass Trailhawk
Nissan Titan Pro4X
Honda CR-V Touring
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[@amirglobo]

the only way to accurately measure this is below. 1. use one car only, preferably with strong brakes. 2. get 4-6 different sets of tires and rims with different widths. 3. make sure tire hieght, brand and compound are exactly same. 4. run test several times per set of tires. 5. make sure the weather and temperatures are same. I can't think of anything else for controls. feel free to add

[@mattymag2394]

Amir Hussain I don't feel you need 4-6 different tire types. if I were to run the test I'd have 3 sets of identical rims for a vehicle. run 205s 225 and 245s of same tire (my old e36 bmw could take those 3 sizes). you should be able to see a corrolation if there is one. and to add a bonus fact I'd run the same sets on wet road to see if wider tires are worse for hydroplaning.

[@mattymag2394]

Amir Hussain I don't feel you need 4-6 different tire types. if I were to run the test I'd have 3 sets of identical rims for a vehicle. run 205s 225 and 245s of same tire (my old e36 bmw could take those 3 sizes). you should be able to see a corrolation if there is one. and to add a bonus fact I'd run the same sets on wet road to see if wider tires are worse for hydroplaning.

[@mathieumichaud1193]

Yes I agree that this was not the best way to look into this because he totally disregards the diameter of the tire and the difference in the sizes of brakes

[@ThePwaifya]

You're asking for lab conditions from a single engineer. The test isn't extremely accurate but the results are enough to conclude that tire width isn't the biggest factor in stopping distance, which is exactly what the experiment set out to do.

[@papayaman123]

I agree that each science experiment needs a constant but in this case using multiple tires for a single car could be a bit difficult unless Jason has a tire company in his pocket lol

[@fredflintsone3850]

what about doing a test with one vehicle and several different tyre widths. (just need a tyre shop to sponsor)

[@EngineeringExplained]

Yep, would be great to do!

[@goatmonkey2112]

An interesting idea from a guy who stops his car with his feet.

[@Grayman222]

As an AP1 S2000 owner who got very confused looking at tires and rims I would like this. AP1 and AP2 have different staggered widths and then the possibility of a square setup on handling?

[@joshuavanmeter5494]

fred flintsone that would be a true test

[@GmanMilli]

Ya, what about brake strength, ABS specifications, and tire slippage? Maybe low profile tires have more braking strength. So many variables, difficult to isolate to come up with sound conclusions. Limiting to one vehicle and just swap tires would be good.

[@Ballacha]

There are so many other factors impacting a vehicle's stopping distance… brake - determines how long it takes for your wheels to lock up suspension, tyre compound & tyre pressure - determine how hard or soft your tyre profile is overall. Softer means more grip and therefore shorter stopping distance and vice versa You can only get some accurate correlation when all these factors are considered.

[@hamzatu2]

the fact you graphed them with stopping distance on the X-AXIS really messed me up...

[@johnbennett9030]

Beautiful video. Good information. Totally answered things I had been wondering about. Thanks!

[@EngineeringExplained]

Some people aren't stoked - that's no good! What I enjoyed about all of this information is that it's not exactly what I expected to happen. Sure, there are different variables when every vehicle tested is a completely different car, but I found it fascinating how little correlation there was to a vehicle's weight and stopping distance. Quite surprising seeing the Nissan Armarda (6000 lbs) braking in the same distance as a Mitsubishi weighing 2700 lbs less. Also fascinating that tire width didn't strongly correlate with stopping distance. Even if the vehicles tested are different, you can see that clearly there are more important factors for stopping distance than weight or width alone. If you think the point of the video was to say that tire width and vehicle weight don't matter, that's not the case (as explained here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/oX_EY5qQg9agipo). The point was that if you're planning on modifying your car, and think that you need bigger wheels and tires first to get better performance, you might want to simply check the rubber you're using first, and then worry about tire width. While you'll make marginal differences in grip with width and weight changes, you can make massive improvements with a good tire swap (my Honda S2000 increased peak longitudinal braking grip by 0.3 g's, that's insane!). Hope everyone's having a great day!

[@Incubuspaxs]

Engineering Explained I liked it and it really does tell how important tyres are for your vehicle depending terrain and environment.

[@famguy619]

Don't try to please everyone, Jason. As your channel grows, you will have far more aggressive comments from people that want to harshly criticize you. Criticism, as you know, is good! I've been watching your channel since the second or third video, and I can tell you care for the comments. You care about what people say and you change a bit to make things better for us viewers. Don't mind those that judge the quality of video, because you will learn and improve off of some of their comments, as you always do. Great video again! I love the amount that I am able to learn from being a subscriber to you. P.S. I turn off my adblocker just for you :)

[@ShawnDickens]

Engineering Explained Summer tire rubber compound would be the most important factor with tread pattern second (other than where tread has large holes or tiny tread blocks that deflect easiest with load). The traction rating of AS and A will include the combination of compound and tread block effectiveness in providing grip.

[@S13Egg]

how grip = stopping power?

[@Diode5]

I think the data demonstrates that the engineers building these cars for the most part are putting on adequate brake, suspension and wheel size configurations to meet whatever minimum breaking distance safety standard they need to. The choice of a better tyre simply helps improve those results further.

[@impossiblemission4ce]

This seems really interesting Jason! I feel like doing some statistical tests on the dataset myself. Thanks for including your test results in the video!

[@badr_marfou]

Awesome, answers a lot of questions always came up to me, I love all details, it makes all sense. Thank you so much for the informative videos, love your channel

[@1fastnigel]

Awesome test! I would have liked to see tyre contact patch area and weight versus stopping distance. This would give more indication of how tire width and radius play into this.

[@wheelheroes7902]

Despite some of the negative reactions I still think this was an interesting and enjoyable video. Now we know that tire compound is more important than width, it would be cool if you did a comparison with some vehicles with a fixed tire type but with different sizes, in width and diameter. starting from OEM and increasing the size till there are negative effects (because of higher weight, drag, price etc.). I look forward to that! Thanks and have a day! Greetings.

[@BucketWheat]

Yes... very much agree...on all points... Informative video, and great suggestion for "Part 2".. (-:

[@SvenStadt]

You just gave the conventional wisdom of things I've been told by my dad all my life, and he is a mechanic! Great videos. You're the only guy I would want to give me car advice. Thanks alot!

[@EngineeringExplained]

+SvenStadt Your Dad seems like a good dude, great to pass down car knowledge!

[@beaud9974]

Hey Engineering Explained, love your videos. Your videos inspired me to pursue engineering. You always bring so much insight and engineering knowledge into your videos, it’s great! Could you do a video on wider tires specifically on snowy or slushy conditions. Would this be similar to the off road stopping distance results?

[@matthewblainey4254]

hahahaha R=0.25 would be the wet dream of any psycological study

[@EngineeringExplained]

Haha yeah, my girlfriend's a biologist and said that 0.25 can be publishable. Fascinating haha.

[@rocknslope]

R squared. Not R.

[@drewren1231]

If a class spends the first week trying to convince students that they're as scientific as hard sciences, then it's not science. Every social science class ever.

[@peaj4812]

Man I worked at a Biochemistry Lab for a while and my experiment needed an r^2 value of at least .95 or I had to redo it, but to be honest it was always above .98. But then again it was a simple experiment.

[@matthewblainey4254]

Pearson James yeah i study Biochem at uni! :) always a p

[@BrandenMcNabb]

You did a very good job with the slideshow. Please don't ever do it again.

[@octaviogasparutti69]

omg, you made such a huge work, great job!

[@balthasarlumbantobing4112]

I love how you do engineering measurements just for fun. There are some mistakes on statistical calculation but I did enjoy your presentation. It didn't give me the most accurate data but I think it's a good preliminary study to give general view of this matter. I think it would be a great pleasure for having you as a guest lecturer in Institut Teknologi Bandung (my uni) LOL

[@sinewave999]

You should actually make a video with your S2000 with wideass tires vs with oem tires

[@URBANENGINEER]

I thought the point of wide tires was cornering stability.

[@JohnUnit]

It helps the most with cornering, but also helps with lateral (acceleration and braking) grip.

[@chrisallen8395]

Lateral refers to cornering.

[@atirrell]

Lateral grip = holding forces perpendicular to direction of travel Longitudinal grip = holding forces parallel to direction of travel

[@zuilok]

There are way too many variables in these tests actual answers from experience: Do heavier cars have less grip? No they have more. (doesnt mean they stop faster) Do wider tires have more grip, in theory no, in actual life yes pretty much 100% of the time. Most important factor for tire grip? Tire compound.

[@telewubby1961]

example is the pressure of the caliper, the number of calipers, and the material of the rotors and pads.

[@Klikkitse]

Thank you captain obvious, zullok. If you watched any of Jason's other videos you'd know he knows all this and has educated us about that. If anything the title was a little misleading but I think it was meant to provoke thinking. Instead of finding out the obvious answer with five repeats over 25 different tires with the same car and suspension setup and tire pressure and outside temperature and .... Jason found out width isn't even half of the story. Active setup systems and tire compounds seem to account for most improvement in braking distance. This means that with the given (diverse!) real world data about cars in general he failed to reject null hypothesis. That is what you're supposed to take away from this video. He even goes out to point out the limitations of his dataset and I believe his numbers. If the actual research question was about tire width I'm pretty sure he would have used one of his other standard testing setups. I'm just overwhelmed by the number of people who took this for serious publishable research. Heck, he even says he doesn't know the weight of one of the vehicles he tested, why aren't people outraged about that if this is serious research?!

[@megaFINZ]

And what's the theory behind wider tires?

[@djd34d14]

If your take is the true take away, then imho the name of the video should be "which of these stock cars stops better?"... but the data doesn't support that either as there are modified vehicles in the test. I think the precedent set in the early days of this channel means many of us expect well thought out experiments whether the results data is publishable or not. This seems to be more of a fleeting thought he acted on while at a cool event.

[@hawkdriver68]

Djd34d1, ummm... yeah. If offered an opportunity like that, I'd jump on it and make something of it as well. I believe he implies as much also.

[@apeanutbutterwolf6529]

Outstanding information! I bought the Michelin Pro Sport PS4S because of your videos and they are AmAzing btw! Now I need to find the best tires for off road and street on SUV's and Truck's

[@rotatingglasssafe]

i loved this video and i really think Jason that you do a tire width video with your s2000 using different widths to show are wider tires equal/less/greater than stock tires. try and stick to one particular type of tire to keep the variables low too. Once again Engineering Explained your teaching me things in a clear and concise manner. keep up the good work!!

[@kinglimpang8067]

Plot price of braking system against stopping distance please XD

[@megaFINZ]

I'm pretty sure stock brakes will outperform stock tires on most of the cars. If ABS is engaged during the emergency braking, then it means that brake applies more force than tire can handle, so it's the tire that is the limiting factor, not the brakes.

[@optionedup]

Wow. So many commenters here who seem to think they are very intelligent completely missed the point of this video. I'm going out on a limb here to say that Jason's goal in creating this video was not to create the ultimate tire test. It's possible he doesn't have the resources to conduct the comprehensive tire test some of you think he should have done. In addition, many comprehensive tire tests have already been conducted and he has nothing to gain by duplicating them. He had an opportunity to participate in a limited driving test of 27 vehicles. Instead of presenting the same boring feature comparison that all the other dozens of reviewers undoubtedly did after the event, he chose to stand out as different from the average reviewer by recording a limited amount of data and showing us how to draw useful conclusions from it. I learned a lot more from this video than I would have from a traditional auto review. I'm subscribed to this channel because of this unique perspective. Thank you for the work you did on this video.

[@EngineeringExplained]

+optionedup appreciate the thoughtfulness of your comment, glad you enjoyed the video!

[@theripper121]

Well if the point of this video is to answer the question that is contained in the thumbnail than no this video and all this data that was compiled is failing at answering said question. If you are simply asking if wider tires have more grip you would not be testing different types, sizes, brands, compounds, and cars. There are way too many variables that are changing from test to test. While this video gives some good information especially toward the end this video is not a good test for the stated question that was initially imposed. The data is certainly not bad but does not really correlate to the question that was posed. "So many commenters here who seem to think they are very intelligent completely missed the point of this video" Seems to me they aren't missing the point of the video if the point of the video was to answer the question in the thumbnail. Seems to me this video needs to be titled differently for that's not what was really tested through the parameters of this experiment.

[@djd34d14]

To me it's kind of like this: Think about an electronics publication. Say they have 5 computers that they used a day each. They decided to perform hard drive benchmarks from within 5 different operating systems. They then use the data from the different tests on the hard drives to comment on the speed of the whole computers. It's related, sure. But the relation is loose and the expirement didn't provide enough data to really prove anything.

[@BucketWheat]

I strongly agree with 'optionedup' that Jason is presenting some very useful information & data, and I appreciate Jason's work on all of this..!! But I also agree that to answer the specific question, all of the testing should have been done on a single vehicle, or maybe a group of 3 -- street, all-season, and off-road -- to show how vehicle design/structure also effects braking efficiency. Otherwise, you can't 'isolate' width as the differing factor. Does a 265 tire on the BMW stop faster than a 235 tire? and so on.

[@micklimteckwee7831]

Appreciate the time and effort to show us your data and analysis.

[@demolitonfreak]

I actually enjoyed the slide show pretty well. I'm shocked, keep up the good work !

[@gedasalekveravicius5466]

I petsonaly think this is one of the best way of explaining, better than whiteboard. Also if youake animations about new invensions it would be even better. Like laferrari's intake or so. Thums up from me.

[@Dylesxic]

He's said in the past why he doesn't use animations. For the most part it's because of the amount of time added to each video in order to get good quality animations vs how many videos he can put out using his white board. Plus it's kind of his thing now, why would we take that away?

[@lundy6577]

Why was Parker not invited ?

[@Richyd7770]

because Rob Dahm stole his invitation

[@EngineeringExplained]

And here I thought this was a drama free channel. 😂

[@aDIYCarGuy]

no one is immune

[@Richyd7770]

Oscar Thorpe no replacement hood and akward apology = no invite to tire events

[@porkchopgaming8480]

Because he was gonna bend their hoods not pay for it then insult them

[@GTModified]

Good video Jase, good data collection. Love your work as always, but please use metric units in addition to imperial. Also, just a production note for videos of this style, gotta edit out that swallowing bro, audio doesn't all have to be one take. Keep up the good work.

[@MrJsyed]

Great video. Thanks for the data and analysis.

[@horaciolopez7721]

Screw the data! I am going to slap on some 315's all seasons for my stock 8th gen civic! Burn rice baby! 🔥🍚

[@eddieb8678]

Horacio Lopez 8th Gen Civics ftw

[@levy5867]

stick brembo decals to the calipers, it'll greatly improve the breaking distance on your rice. Trust me.

[@eddieb8678]

Stickers are +5 horsepower each!

[@ZachPye]

that's not rice, that is how you get a ticket

[@bin1127]

add more water when cooking?

[@horrovac]

In central/northern Europe, as well as in alpine regions, everybody uses summer and winter tyres. Only total cheapskates use all season. All season sucks in all seasons and is just marginally better than winter tyres in summer or summer tyres in winter. In the US, everybody apparently uses all season (which explains these comedy videos with cars sliding all over the place on icy roads), and I don't really get why. It's not like you're saving anything - sure, with winter/summer you have two sets of tyres, but they last twice as long. You need two sets of wheels, but they don't have to be alloys (lots of people use steel for winter tyres). You can have wider, grippier tyres in summer and narrower ones in winter, which don't suffer that much from aquaplaning and work better in snow and sludge. Also, you'll have a vastly superior performance in any season, and a huge advantage for your safety. AND you'll have a whole lotta more fun. Good tyres are the MOST important performance mod you can do for your car, and it's not expensive either.

[@BirdiesGoCherp]

All season tyres are actual really good, shitty tyres are shitty. All seasons are very good, check out tyre reviews.

[@horrovac]

@@BirdiesGoCherp I'm sorry but that is just not true. I wouldn't be talking like this if I did not know. OF COURSE i have checked out tyre reviews - most importantly the ones of the European car clubs. They do very thorough joint annual tyre reviews, both for summer and for winter tyres. And obviously their loyalty does not lie with suppliers or manufacturers but with their members only. They also do all-seasons, though I believe not regularly. Every time, the result is horrible. Some of them deliver performances almost on par with summer or winter tyres - the key word here is "or". Either one or another, but never both. Essentially, they are either summer tyres with a bit of snow-going capabilities, or winter tyres with a bit of summer rubber compound and a summer-ey thread profile. The better they are in summer, the more they suck in the winter and vice versa. Some of them offer a balanced performance, which actually is just another way of saying that they're equally horrible in both seasons. Whichever type you get, the one common thing they all have is that even the best performing ones for either seasons are never nearly as good as even mediocre summer or winter tyres. You can't cheat physics. The verdict of the tests is always the same: buy summer or winter tyres instead. If you don't have money, get the cheapest ones, they cost less than the non-horrible all seasons, perform better in both seasons, and last at least twice as long. They couldn't think of a good reason to use all-seasons, except that if for some unfathomable reason you MUST drive the same set of tyres all year round. And neither can I. Sure, to prevent fatal accidents, most people won't need the highest performance from their tyres most of the time. Until they do.

[@BirdiesGoCherp]

@@horrovac their latest all season reviews show incredible performance in the wet and on snow though.

[@horrovac]

@@BirdiesGoCherp not disputing that. They might even be just as good as mediocre winter tyres, because in essence that's what they actually are - winter tyres made slightly worse. The dry performance is going to totally suck, I could almost bet. I was not conteding that all-seasons were TOTALLY useless for everything, just that they're vastly inferior to a summer/winter combination in almost any measure - cost, performance, longevity etc...

[@FranciscoFRAO]

Nice video!!! In the first tables you could divide the quadrant in four diamond corners and close it, then assign attributes to them! You are an awesome car you-tuber by the way!

[@d1sturb3d119]

Lovely data collection and statistical study! Awesome work! A more precise test would involve using the same weight car, same brake compound and just different tire width's but for right now it was great to see proper data collection.

[@tamiyadriverGp]

Well, it would be interesting, but the tire grip is just coused by a friction coeficient and a load.. The width doesn't count there..

[@d1sturb3d119]

True but given the title equalizing those factors would answer the question a little better.

[@OmegaF77]

"Do wider tyres have more grip?" *Tests with different vehicles including their weight rather than having one vehicle and testing with differ tyre widths and compounds.*

[@panayotpopov6698]

This video is meaningless, You don't isolate any of the properties that you are testing. Testing different tire widths on different cars tells you nothing. To find if the width of the tires has any effect you should measure the change in stopping distance for the same car with different tires. Same goes for everything else.

[@Kalandaari]

Different cars, different kind of tires (road tires vs off-road tires), ... This video is really bad.

[@radix4801]

Test one car, summer vs offroad vs all season tires. Same car, test all season narrow vs wider tires. See which change gives the biggest performance boost. Quicker, simpler, and more accurate.

[@Conservator.]

Jason I like your video's a lot but this one (lets say) the least of them. Because of all the different parameters (cars, weight, surface, tyre manufacturer, tyre type, pressure, …) you found only very weak correlations. That was no coincidence. The best (imho the only meaningful) comparison was the performance on- and off-road. The Dodge performing about worst on-road and best off-road really says it all. I would love to see a video of you testing your Honda on different tyre widths! Thanks anyway for your awesome vids!

[@bluetarget]

ya know the graph that shows weight/width to stopping distance? that normalizes the data to show exactly why width and weight don't matter nearly as much as compound and tire category. that's the whole point of the video. you don't need to isolate the variables to get to this conclusion. please take some math classes. all of you.

[@mikeb1031]

he is finding a trend

[@Na5iR11]

Great data. Think Amir Hussain the comments addressed the better way of answering the question. Wish you would do that test also.

[@PianoScottDeBoer]

This was a really informative video, I enjoyed it very much. What program are you using to do your data charts and analysis?

[@amolauliyan7318]

hey ! engineering explained instead of plotting so much data try Buckingham theorem which will assist you in plotting a particular quantity vs another......have a nice day

[@VforValenti]

Well, you have applied really poorly the OLS Estimator. It is obvious that when, for example, you estimate (brake distance) = α + β*(tire width) + error, that error term contains for example weight that has great correlation with your regressor, ie tire width (it could be not only weight! Everything contained in error term, that has good correlation with your regressor could have the same effect: like for instance brake size, that you did not measure). So you do not have the most important assumption required to use OLSE: strict exogeneity; that is that in y=α+βx+ε, Ε(εi | all x's)=0 for all i. Not only your results have poor R^2, but, because of this, they are also completely meaningless. Just waste. (NOTE: some results had R^2 like 0.14? These don't even worth to be shown, even if you had ensured the validity of OLSE assumptions) You could use at least a multi-variable regression like: (brake distance) = α + β1*(weight) + β2*(tire width) + ε, for example. This way you extract the effect of weight in error to a new additional factor, so ε gets cleaner (not guaranteed clean enough though; check "omitted variable" problem for further info). Your outcomes would become stronger in R^2 and more serious. You have a great channel, and I appreciate it very much. I am telling this in really good faith, as a more statistics educated person. Hope my intentions will not be missapprehended. :-)

[@labradormcgraw2409]

I've said it once, I'll say it again - this guy embodies everything that's great about KZbin. Unrivaled knowledge coupled with a natural talent for teaching... add to this the seldom-seen ability to include only what we really need to know, and what we have is an absolutely indispensable learning resource. The fact that, through KZbin, we get all that for free necessitates the burning question: why are we paying $$$$s for inferior quality tuition from college? Huge respect to EE!

[@vacazboara]

Luv'ya for using imperial units. Of course, it is not hard to mentally compute the conversion, but it's still a better experience to have both imperial and metric units on the graphs :) About the video, the topic and the measures: very well done! The common sens is finally backed up by a pretty accurate test :). If you guys live in a moderate/temperate climate you should use summer/winter tires, depending on the season AND the right tire pressure.

[@MyRealName]

I'd be ashamed as an engineer if I didn't use the universal metric system.

[@LogiForce86]

Plus you'll increase your world wide job chances as well by using the universal metric system.

[@Garebare1]

MyRealName I'm an engineering student and every company in the United States as well as American companies in foreign countries use imperial system so if you want to attend engineering courses in the U.S. Or work for U.S. Engineering firms, u must know the imperial system...you are mostly taught metric system in other courses like physics and chemistry courses and a mixture of metric and imperial in engineering courses

[@hightower2537]

we use both. and yes every engineer that i know prefers metric.

[@Garebare1]

Hightower I agree the metric system is a lot easier to compute with, however I find that I can visualize the imperial system better, for example I have a better idea on what a mile looks like than a km, I can visualize how fast 60 mph is but not really 60 kph

[@patw52pb1]

The shame is yours. As an engineer, you should be able to proficiently and accurately use any unit system, any scale, anywhere, anytime, for any reason or any specification. He used what was available as mentioned in the video. I really do not believe he is auditioning for a job world wide.

[@zzInFusioNzz]

SI units please

[@IBreiKeL]

Why does it matter? The chart would look exactly the same.

[@herculesrockefeller2984]

FREEDUM UNITS RULE!!! America 1st!, Every place else is the worst!

[@tyrereviews]

Well, this is good upload timing between our channels!

[@autovidz2455]

Great video. Love all the data!

[@denistablica]

I am sure you can make grafs with metric units parallel to imperial... at least for weight unit Mini Cooper?? Cooper is trim level not model. Thanks for the video

[@coldblue32E]

denistablica except it was a Cooper. All Countrymen are Coopers, so he wasn't wrong. In fact, they are all Cooper S's

[@lululombard]

PLEASE. Use METRIC.

[@herculesrockefeller2984]

AMERICA 1ST! EVERYPLACE ELSE IS THE WORST!

[@herculesrockefeller2984]

+rossi23 You'll be singing a different tune after Glorious Leader Trump starts WW3

[@BowYangJam]

Use a calculator. It isn't that difficult.

[@atirrell]

You're watching an engineering video and you are concerned about units of measure...? Do you also want him to have this video translated into 27 different languages for you?

[@emin86]

SI units are the standard in engineering. Better not do the same mistake like the Mars Climate Orbiter. While NASA used the "International System of Units" (SI units using metric system), the navigation software made by Lockheed Martin used the outdated imperial system. No conversion was made, the space probe approached Mars to much (by around 100km, calculate in miles on your own) and the probe got destroyed. Would not happen if engineers would have used the standard units of engineering in the first place. But that's none of my business. As a European I don't pay taxes that financed this disaster. Plus, this channel is Engineering Explained, and yet no usage of SI units.

[@cymbrium]

All the data makes me happy! Before you adjusted for weight, I was wondering if using weight per tire width units would give a more objective view, and then you did it!

[@YukitakaOhashi]

Thanks for the video!

[@itaytabib4665]

technically, physics wise, friction has nothing to with contact area EDIT: yh that's not true

[@ipodge1731]

I wonder why so many people believe that wider tire means more grip. Tire company conspiracy?

[@giorx5]

Any test braking a car on dry tarmac and upgrading its tire width testing again, all the other componts remaining the same, makes your theory false. And the F1 cars of 2017 where all the drivers are ultra-excited about much less stopping distance vs the 2016 season cars. Even with harder compounds the grip from the wider tires is greatly improved, especially when braking.

[@RandomGenera7ed]

Theoretically yes, in real life not all materials behave this way. Watch his tire load sensitivity video.

[@itaytabib4665]

Yh of course u can benefit from wider tires.. they're also more stable On paper the friction is the same. just throwing it out there

[@LeDerpsson]

Thats not completely true. In a tire you have more forces then just the friction between the tire and the road. at first you have cohesion, wich means the tire is going to be deformed by the road on a small scale. Imagine little bits of the road pressing into the tire, thus creating more grip (and even more if your tire is wider). The second force you have to take into account is adhesion, wich are little bonding forces on a atomic level. They are also increased with wieder tires. trust me i'm an engineer

[@SgtKanyo]

Do wider tires actually have more grip? Yes, because of a bigger tyre patch on the road surface. Case closed.

[@IvanToman]

Do narrower tyres have more grip? Yes, because of bigger pressure on the road. Case closed. When you take your argument and my argument into consideration, you will find out that it actually doesn't matter, and there are many more important factors that will determine grip, like tyre wear, tyre compound, tyre thread type and so on.

[@Kizaoners1]

If false then tell me why F1 cars have wide tires? especially this year...

[@dewolf49]

Bazsa Largely because the wider the tire, the softer you can make the compound without it collapsing the sidewall. The actual contact patch doesn't affect grip directly because friction is directly proportional to the normal force (i.e. the small the contact patch the higher the normal force and so the resulting friction is exactly the same, all else barred.) The size of the contact patch -does- affect wear, but not grip directly.

[@herculesrockefeller2984]

+Bazsa Wider tires are better for dry and sometimes light rain conditions. Skinny tires provide more grip in the snow and heavy rain where puddles form on the road. Then there's off road where the arguments never end, but skinny is typically better for shallow mud/snow while deep sand requires a wider tire, and the rock crawlers will argue all day long between wide vs skinny.. Wider tires are worse on fuel economy which could also be a factor depending on the situation. In races where different tire sizes are allowed, a car with less grip and skinnier tires could actually win against a car with better grip due to less pit stops etc. Everything's subjective.

[@IvanToman]

Narrow tyre is better in shallow snow, but in deep is wider tyre better because it doesn't sink that much. If vehicle sink through snow too much, it starts to plow too much snow with a bumper which slows it down and finally stops it completely. Wider tyres make vehicle to "float" over the snow better.

[@razaz1]

I got so exited @ 09:40 . and its from a boring slideshow. great job Jason!

[@alphazuluz]

I remember learning in physics that the only two variables that are at play with friction are the coefficient of friction of the surface(s) and the downward force applied. It blew my mind. Theoretically, the size of the contact patch means nothing. I had a long discussion with my physics teacher about this and why wider tires increase traction on cars. Apparently there is so much more at play within the tire/pavement interface that it nearly nullifies the theoretical aspect of the equation. It was still interesting to learn that if tires had no tread, didn’t deform, and you were driving on a perfectly flat, hard surface, the width of the tire wouldn’t matter at all. A 5mm wide tire would work just as well as a 345mm tire given the same vehicle weight. It still doesn’t seem to make sense.

[@ocping]

Engineer using imperial? Blasphemy!

[@geriatrics9557]

I've never had the highest likes on a comment

[@c0d4041292]

You got this, man!

[@anthonybatista8045]

and hopefully you don't get it on some like hungry comment like this.

[@BillCut]

HAHAHHAHA your name is hilarious!!

[@EngineeringExplained]

The spotlight is all you!

[@onefastcyclist]

A well documented guide to the advantages and disadvantages of different tire types !

[@ZeroneRaven]

Been needing to change tires since you started talking about your S2000 crappy tires, since the car I bought came with winter tires and its getting hot. Finally decided and got a Michelin Pilot Sport 3 in 225 width, 20mm more than what it had 205. Man what a difference in stopping power! It feels like I have twice the grip I had before, love these tires.

[@gislemark79]

This video is pointless. USE METRIC!!!

[@BucketWheat]

Very informative, at least as a base-line... and clearly useful in determining tire choice. Of course, there are still some of the things you address in your summary... DESIGN of the tread and amount of friction surface (pavement) and 'cleating' (off-road), tire compound (HUGE factor in racing!), and the 'squirming' (tread movement), actual square inches of friction and shape of the footprint/psi downforce on that footprint (in other words, not only the width of the tire but also the length of tread in contact under the weight and air-pressure in the tire, and the circumference -- such as lowering the pressure in the example you gave -- and smaller diameter tires vs larger diameters) ...and of course, the weather and road conditions...and the ability of the Brakes to actually slow down the tire rotation One 'factor' that sort of gets "mis-interpreted here is "weight"... Not that your factors or incorrect pertaining to overall vehicle weight (smile) ... but as the amount of downforce per square inch on each tire. For instance, as friction is applied at the road surface, the weight of the vehicle CoG / momentum gets shifted forward rather than vertically downward...putting MORE weight on the front and less on the rear. So "downforce per square inch" becomes MUCH higher, which DOES increase friction on the front while reducing friction on the rear. {Very easy to 'see' with motorcycles... 'wheelies' when weight-rotation is greatest on the rear, under acceleration (also a friction factor) and rear wheels completely off the ground in extreme braking}. Vehicles that shift less of their weight forward can improve braking simply by getting more braking friction from the rear wheels. [Longer wheelbase, lower CoG, lower center of axis, etc.] So, your 'conclusions' and summary are correct that ultimately we each have to 'consider' ALL of these factors, and the type of driving we will be doing, and select the tires with the least 'compromises' for our driving purposes and 'diversities' of conditions. With YOUR data in mind, of course! (Smile)

[@stevejobs5]

This is excellent! Even though you can't control all the variables, the results are still very interesting and meaningful

[@epizzoli6104]

YES! Thank you for doing this video EE

[@jjames267]

seriously good video!!

[@kennethblocher6110]

Early comment, yay! Keep up the great work, I really like the math and the real-world application!

[@ChrisCaseboldt]

"This amazing sketch I did truly breathtaking" I literally laughed out loud!

[@daxosm]

Amazing job!

[@noabclements3256]

Thanks for doing this work. the relationship between types is larger than I would have guessed. I am the conflicted person with an s2000 and a Wrangler.

[@diegow55]

Awesome job!

[@kun1o]

Great that you pointed out some endogeneity between the weight and tire width!

[@arthill2310]

Man, great info.

[@alanbrown397]

Back in the 1980s one of the Australian car mags did tests with various widths on the same set of vehicles. What they found was that wider tires give better grip "up to a point", but when they lose grip it's harder to recover it. Tire pressure is also important The stopping distance didn't really change much, but it mattered when cornering.

[@bradlywages]

We tried this with a 91 mustang on a private test pad. 33 X 18.50 15 did not grip like 29 x 11.50 15. Same compound same day. 33s would break loose before the 29s would. Full contact patch was verified during the burnout and pressures were changed as needed. It came down to suspension set up, weight transfer weight over the tires. You have to have the weight in the right place to get the grip.

[@maskimko]

Great job. I like it very much! Actually tire grip depends heavily on the tread temperature in the contact zone and tread destruction. Wider tires means less pressure and hence less destruction, but less heating of the contact zone. That is why there is no linear dependency between tire width and grip.

[@clipperwing]

Wow , that's a lot of data to compile, thanks for sharing. The final conclusion, that tire type has a bigger impact on grip, than wider tires, or vehicle weight, seems reasonable. I think the title of the video " Do Wider Tires Actually Have More Grip? " was difficult , if not impossible to determine, due to the conditions of the testing, as also commented on below, however you did an excellent job of compiling and interrupting the data, and offered insightful conclusions.

[@N33sWorkshop]

I have Hankook Optimo/Kinergy combination on my Focus and the stopping distance is amazing (in dry and wet conditions), also good grip in corners and good grip on snow.

[@maxsalvail3397]

That was very interesting, and i'd like to know if camber setting is an important factor. What do you think Jason? My car has camber factory setting of 1.2 degree and i beleive this impacts grip in braking and accel, in a bad way of course. I am thinking of reducing that to 0.6 degree, maybe. I know cornering might not be as good, but tire wear is bad on my pilot supersport, and is very very bad on soft winter compound.

[@amateurtorque6709]

That must have taken you ages to measure all the braking distances. I wasn't expecting the type of tyre to have more of an impact than the width of the tyre. Great video. More like this please. I run summer tyres between April and September and winter tyres between October to March. Even though we don't have much snow in England it rains a lot and the grip from the winter tyres are much better when the roads are wet than the summer tyres.

[@roscothefirst4712]

VERY useful, used it to order summer vs "3 season" tires. Have a good set of winters, so switch over for CANADIAN winters (regularly see -40C, which BTW = -40F) Also harder summer compounds (generally) have longer tire life in hot weather than softer all season compounds. I drive a Ford Flex which actually stops quite well as it has massive rotors.

[@ParthGohil1]

Asked this question to my physics teacher about 11 years ago, never got an answer then, but he did tell us that the formula for friction doesn't depend on area of contact (because molecular level contact can't really be calculated) instead it's dependent on load and on coefficient of friction (i.e type of tyre) while this data seems to be in relation to that I later found out that the width of the tyre is important during turns.

[@felixbelanger2659]

I think tire pressure could have been interesting to see (while difficult to do at an event like this). I think the shape of the contact patch might have been more important than the actual width of the tires. Perhaps a test for the S2K?

[@vipeboy2003]

this is so interesting.. i love tests like this. Although i would like to see same weight, same size tire but with different compounds or tread patterns. and also same tire but just different widths on the same car

[@dodgethis_9273]

Engineering Explained, I called a local Utah court today and there was a familiar voice on the other line while the intro played. Just found it rather amusing and had to share.

[@mikebrown614]

It would have been interesting to see what the R-values of the trend-lines would have been had you removed the upper and lower outliers from the calculation. That Ram PowerWagon and the BMW slewed the line dramatically.

[@brunodays]

We need a stock vehicle tested with different tire widths and loads. Now that's a good test.

[@nissanpacific9793]

The Ridge looks so fun

[@handsmex93]

Having the slope of the wt/width vs stopping distance closer to 0 indicates a closer correlation of weight vs tire width. Interesting study dude thanks for the data!

[@neilduncan8657]

In michigan we have crappy roads and plenty of snow/slick roads in winter. I use a narrow real snow tire in the winter. My wider all season tires work in the snow but are not that good. Wide tires IMO are only good on dry roads in good condition. Narrow tires are good for bad, rough slick roads These are my observations, I did not make a chart....good video

[@PaulDebaecker]

What I learned at school, and on wikipedia, is that friction forces do not depend on contact surface (mathematically it does not, it is not just that the effects are neglectable); besides, for a same material, if you increase the vertical load, you will increase the horizontal force appliable before sliding. So I do not really understand the point of wider tires, from a grip point of view anyway (from a wear point of vieww, maybe it decreases wear...)

[@Slider68]

It is clear tire type has the largest impact on stopping grip (on specific surfaces) but once you take this out there may be additional relationships to discover in the data. For example I suspect you will see a slope of close to 1 when plotting weight/width vs stopping distance for a single tire family. If so this would suggest several additional relationships: 1. Increasing the ratio of weight to width in general worsens dry pavement stopping distance and vice versa. 2. Increasing tire width (without changing anything else) improves dry stopping distance. 3. Reducing the weight of a vehicle shortens dry pavement stopping distance and vice versa. The above predictions align well with what we experience when changing tire size and driving on dry pavement BUT wet pavement and snow/slush covered roads are totally different (opposite conclusions are typical).

[@MrHebert91]

Was the VW alltrack on factory wheels? I had mine with 225mm tires from the dealer (in Canada, so I guess it could be different). But I agree it is very fun to drive :) Will you review it eventually? I would like to know your opinion on it!

[@BigEightiesNewWave]

I had 315s inside the wheel wells on custom Boyds back in the day on my 88 IROC. Cars were way lighter back then too.

[@danielwamathai7363]

Great content n it's inspired others to think about it more deeply. But a major factor to also consider besides tyres is the brakes. If they had the same brakes different tyres, that'd have less variables to consider

[@craigweis1675]

Years ago Road and Track Magazine posted an article about tires ... the conclusion was wide tires have a shorter front to back footprints while narrower tires have a longer front to back footprints. The tires were driven over a glass panel and photographed from the bottom looking up at the rubber. The photos revealed that the surface area of 'rubber on the road' for wide or narrow tires is the same square cm on vehicles of the same weight.

[@tpsolidious]

can you do a video on what is bearing the weight of the car ? Wheel bolts, The protruding center bore from the hub, or the clamping force of the bolts that create friction between the wheel and hub? how much pressure is applied when torqued down? diameter of the bolts?

[@Mikeb8134]

Nice. Wish you would have given some basic themes you saw, then, showed the data (it helps the mind's eye put numbers together... you could have just put a link with the powerpoint files the way you did this, yes, I can read like you too). Thanks for crunching the numbers bro.

[@Oblithian]

I imagine the answer is "obviously yes", but noting that "just because a car has wider tires than a different car, doesn't mean that's the only determining factor" (especially of braking distance). If every car had the same tire design and compound, and if the braking test was performed with narrow and wide tires, the braking would be better with likely no exception.

[@th1nk_outside]

u really could have made those half circles of the all terrain sketch fit together evenly to from a nice tire. these little edges drive my ocd mad XD

[@kylandaminick13]

The slides worked great for this video.

[@mainmain5303]

The amount of mind you put in is...amazing!

[@nicofer6426]

Nice video man, but I was expecting a comparison between a car with standard tyres and the same car but with wider tyres. For example, my car has 225mm wide tyres, I like going to the track, so I was thinking of changing tyres for 235mm and change suspension to get more grip when cornering. So I would like to know if wider tyres than standard gives you more grip.

[@KoudZ]

this video is briliant demonstration how statistics can be manipulated. Good Job mr. EE

[@gqh007]

This is very nerdy and I LOVE IT