Does Matt's Off Road Recovery use a TOW BALL in his off road recoveries? What he says about it!

Tow Balls in 4x4 or vehicle recoveries? Matt from Matt's Off Road Recovery explains how he uses his Tri Ball Tow Ball (Hitch) with his off road recoveries.
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Why I DON'T like using Tow Balls and my thoughts on their Dangers in 4x4 Recoveries - • A Tow Ball is NOT an o...
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[@77gravity]

If that 3-ball device was done without the centre ball it would be just as effective. And if those balls on the side were just a metal bar through the stem no-one would even blink. But because they're shaped like tow balls (and I admit they probably ARE tow balls in a different life) people get upset. It's the engineering that counts. I think that is a great device.

[@MadMatt4WD]

thanks

[@neilfrasersmith]

Best comment so far. 100% correct.

[@mw5905]

We live in a day and age where people who've never been further off road than their Subaru Outback suddenly become experts in everything. (or those city slicker "jeepers" that are everywhere) One problem is their local rip you off 4x4 shop feeds you all kinds of crap to get you to buy military grade tank recovery equipment for the simple bottom line-->profit... I've wheeled full sizes(mostly ramchargers) for 25+ years now running both locked/welded diffs on tires no less than 36"-40" and have seriously yanked the FU*# out of these things having NEVER broken a hitch receiver, ball, hook, or shackle. (even a good bumper mounted one in 3/8 plate) I usually weld hooks f/r on my trucks these days. I've broken 2 and 3" straps before, but that's having to yank hard enough to raise the rear wheels on one or BOTH full size trucks complete with a hopped up mopar V8 roar. Another simple thing I see no one ever do for Mattt is have their wheels spinning BEFORE his rope catches. I've also learned to preserve my drivetrain by accelerating hard and then letting off the gas just as the strap catches. That uses the weight of the truck/momentum to yank and see just how freakin stuck they are. Matt has some serious patience to put up with a nearly constant lack of basic mechanical aptitude from the steady stream of keyboard off road recovery experts. However, I am envious of these somewhat new recovery straps that would have saved me years of bouncing off my steering column/windshield when those straps catch...haha

[@element271]

Perfectly worded

[@ABH-82]

You'll notice they're three different sizes as the attachment is used for when he has to recover different types of trailers too. It's a very clever piece of engineering that solves many problems.

[@mrchams]

Matt knows what he is doing. I would trust his experience any day of the week.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes he is certainly is a professional at what he does. Unfortunately not everything is understood by the audience.

[@yooooodennis]

so what about tuesdays?

[@trevorb555]

I have learned so much from him that I’ve used in off-road vehicle recoveries and pulling my own car out of a ditch last winter.

[@sniperlif3]

@@abelzlatkovic65 and bolts do the same, bolts have even less metal than a decent tow ball, of course the ones that shear are just a cheap simple bolt screw in attachment. Yet, as said here, he uses the tow ball on light work, and this is 2 tow balls sharing the load. Think about where you attach on a car for light towing, it is either a single bolt screwed into a tow point or some suspension component on both sides of the car, which is as low as 1 bolt per side on said suspension component. Equal failure rating as even a cheap 3 point tow ball setup that uses screwed in tow balls (these are welded on fully).

[@josephsonntag3445]

@@sniperlif3 any recovery point that only has one bolt is hardly a rates recovery point tho

[@adidas4275]

He is also a professional that has thousands of recoveries under his belt and have insurance associated with his profession. Normal people don’t :/

[@MadMatt4WD]

interesting point

[@spoolin610]

I like Matt’s easement of “I’ll decide what will work for a scenario.” Only need to watch one of he’s videos to know he knows how to get the job done and safely.

[@NaruSanavai]

Yup. He may seem like a simple man, but you can tell that he does a lot of mental math, very quickly. Some of it is inherent, most of it is experience. Above all else, he'll admit (and show) when he gets it wrong, and then adjust.

[@robertwilson1827]

Wonder if he will use them in Australia!!!???

[@tritchie6272]

I have watched alot of Matt Winders recovery video's. I have also been amazed at the predicaments him and his yellow jeep have gotten people out of.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Amazing what people get up to.

[@antisocialjusticewarrior2073]

@@MadMatt4WD you're a useless unt

[@Equinox121]

I'd still trust this man with anything. Tons of recoveries under his belt and the setup he uses has done him well for a while. Like another comment said, if it was a piece of steel with 3 prongs such as those tow balls, nobody would bat an eye at it.

[@MadMatt4WD]

So long as people understand the difference between a triball and a towball

[@JheregJAB]

I feel like it was brushed by kind of quick, so I want to point it out. In your other videos, you talk about a single shear point being one of the most common points of failure with those tow balls. With the 3-point tow ball there and the way he usually uses it, there will be at least two of those tow balls taking the energy - therefore, a double shear. Then, should those fail, the third (top) ball is there to help absorb some of that energy. The welded failure point you would normally find on a drop hitch also does not appear to be present. The rope/strap is still technically not as secure as using a recovery point with a shackle, but I rather doubt that 3-ball is any worse in practice than anything else you could put into a tow hitch, as far as its likelihood to break. Put another way, I'd expect the receiver or the pin to break before the hitch itself does (on most vehicles).

[@MadMatt4WD]

Well said. Personally I would just grab a hitch receiver.

[@donhappel9928]

Technically it's not double sheer, but multiple single sheer points. Regardless, you're right in that it's far more robust than a standard drop mount. I actually have that same tri-ball draw bar for my work van. It's pretty stout. You may not be able to tell in the video but it's a solid piece of bar where most drop mounts are hollow and as you noted the balls are welded instead of bolted. I still only use it to tow a trailer but with the eye looped over/around it the way Matt does it's probably not the weak point in the system.

[@royalriding1720]

Good points, but he has a pintle hook he uses on the rear, why not just go by another one of those so you have really strong points front and rear. Even if you don't always need that strength, at least its there

[@donhappel9928]

@@royalriding1720 I can only speculate. I carry a tri-ball like that in my service van because although I know what size ball I need for my own trailer I may need to tow something else from time to time and this is faster than swapping balls. Maybe Matt carries this for a similar reason?

[@kain0m]

One important difference with Matt's Triball setup is that there are multiple hooking points. If one ball fails, the rope will stay attached, and thus keep the majority of the energy contained. Recovering off a single tow ball, if that fails, you have a tremendous amount of energy available that is accelerating the broken ball towards the other vehicle. Also, note how these balls are tapered towards the center tube. That gives them a lot more strength.

[@jasonbyrne6312]

If you've watched enough videos, you would see that when Matt is up against a bad situation he does not use that tri ball, but instead uses the pintle hook on the back. I agree with him that these newer vehicles have nowhere to hook onto and you'd be lucky to see a lower motor mount or even have access to a lower A-arm and with the way these things are built now, there is a real good chance he could rip these cars apart. It would be way more dangerous if Matt was only using a tow strap on that tri ball regardless what he was trying to get unstuck. Matt, keep doing what you are doing and keep those recovery videos rolling!!

[@MadMatt4WD]

bang on

[@Jeff4559]

@@MadMatt4WD I’m on your side. Better safe than sorry and especially when you have a huge following and are essentially promoting using a poor/inadequate setup. I could send you a Facebook link to the picture of a scene that happened last week where a 3 ball hitch on that same setup was used for a snatch and the hitch gave, and shot through the driver side window, the drivers chest, and the drivers seat.

[@eliloomis7860]

@@Jeff4559 that guy died if Im thinking of the same one you are saying…

[@thisisyourcaptainspeaking2259]

Why use a pintle hook when there are better options like a forged ring?

[@toddk1377]

@@Jeff4559 That's what happened to my jeep. It was stuck so bad that when my cousin tugged on it, the whole receiver hitch ripped out of the frame and sling shotted across the ground.

[@georgecurtis6463]

I find this a perfect answer to my issues. First is having the correct ball at any given time. It also provides an easy way for pulling someone else or myself out of a simple sticky situation. No, I never plan to recover anyone. I have a tow strap and that's my limit.

[@MadMatt4WD]

ok

[@tracerichmond7203]

I noticed Matt using a pintle hitch for recoveries. I thought he looked so cool slapping the hitch shut after hanging the tow rope on it. I was about to buy a pintle hitch for myself so I could be as cool as Matt.

[@MadMatt4WD]

LOL

[@jessegillan7013]

That makes a lot more sense after watching it, I was confused how you were gonna say that he used a tow ball since I wouldn’t ever think of using one. Although, seeing Matt’s tri-ball and hearing what you had to say it makes sense now.

[@MadMatt4WD]

excellent.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Matt (from USA) has some interesting points. What are your thoughts? If you haven't seen my thoughts on Why I DON'T like using Tow Balls and my thoughts on their Dangers in 4x4 Recoveries please check it out here kzbin.info/www/bejne/rZvZZmSlq9d4aZI also consider subscribing to Matt's Off Road Recovery channel kzbin.info/door/wdVOry0oNF9WIe_3uCfz9Q

[@andrewmacfarlane9448]

I personally don't have much experience but my father who worked 25+ years in highway patrol noted that with all the different accidents he had seen with trailers involved over the years he never saw a broken tow ball. It was always bent and broken tow bars and bent trailer draw bars. The only decent accident that I ever saw, my old boss had a head on accident with a light truck in his 80 series whilst towing a car float with a holden panel van loaded on. Huge head on crash that bent the trailer draw bar like a banana and sent everything flying into the fields. No broken ball.

[@T25de]

welcome to con air How much time are you willing to spend to get 100% safe buddy? Are you in the tow truck game? Or are you just experienced wheeler? What’s your preferred method

[@T25de]

welcome to con air “Know” limit 😂😅 You crack me up. I’m not a tow truck drive as ya think...But I could drive a car round a circuit faster than you I bet, likely a more skilled driver off the pavement too. Common sense 🤙🤙

[@T25de]

welcome to con air No I gave you a chance to qualify yourself. You threw insults plenty, not that you have slightest clue who you’re talking to but ya didn’t give much reason for your “opinion” You work in high risk job and safety has no time limit? What kind of industry can tolerate that business model? As far as a high risk environment? You have a problem with the guys technique but it is nothing more than an asshole sitting a bar spitting nonsense opinion. You’re no expert nor even amateur in skill so what exactly do you bring to the table?

[@57thorns]

Many times the alternative to using the tow ball (and the threepointed monster is not your average tow hook either) is dismantling the vehicle or getting a crane there, if the army engineers can spare a tracked crane. And that might be more damage to the environment and still not be very safe and in any case will to more damage to the stranded vehicle Think of tow hook recovery as a butchers knife: it is a very dangerous tool if used without the proper safety measures and know-how.

[@element271]

We need a reality check guys, does your 4WD have a bolt any where on it bigger then a tow ball? Most receivers are bolted through in about 4 spots with little 10mm bolts into your 2mm frame. Your tow ball is about the strongest thing on your car. If you go the wreckers you will see entire hitches twisted in knots from trailer roll overs with the ball still firmly on.

[@MadMatt4WD]

And yet we're seeing balls and hitches fail and kill people. kzbin.info/www/bejne/rZvZZmSlq9d4aZI

[@o1mtbiker]

MadMatt 4WD well stupid is as stupid does, what I mean by this. It is very common for a human to over look such points and not inspect their equipment or rigs. Depending on the area you live in, the integrity of you tow/recovery point need to be inspected often and replaced as needed. I have seen hitches hallow out from rust, to straight falling off the truck.

[@l337pwnage]

+element One of the questions that pops up is how many times can it handle the repeated stress of that. The second is for someone who didn't go through the trouble of getting a dedicated tow point, do they (in case of standard threaded tow balls) check the torque to make sure it's tight? A bolts primary strength is its tensile strength, not shear strength. Bolts used for shear force are often used as a weak link in that capacity. Just some points to consider.

[@BigStreams_]

Torsional stress and shear stress are two very different things. Most materials will take far more force in shear than in torsion. Tow hitches also aren’t design with torsional strength in mind, they’re designed for tension and shear (with some bending moment due to the offset of the ball). It’s not surprise that when a trailer flips the hitch fails in a twisted mess while the ball (that was presumably pulling the weight of the rig to begin with) is still in tact, being able to handle the weight of the trailer.

[@kevinwalker7302]

But if your bolt through ball hitch comes from China (the majority used by weekend warriors and not someone in the industry) is likely crappy pot metal compounded by the bolted stem being reduced to 50% diameter at 1"... And it's bolted to a poorly welded drop....

[@tacticalant3841]

He is a natural engineer, intrinsically knows, within limits, what will work and what wont.

[@jasonlessard2373]

That’s NOT a “normal “tow ball. It’s welded. Tow balls fail when they sheer off at the threads.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Did you watch the linked video?

[@jasonlessard2373]

MadMatt 4WD, No I will go look for it. However I did see the 3 part videos by Ronny Dahl. Really amazing. That’s where I got my knowledge about how they sheer off. Love your work.

[@jasonlessard2373]

MadMatt 4WD , went and look at the link you mentioned, yes I have seen it, that’s how I found out about Ronni’s. Great job. Keep it up. Loving the Matt and Matt team!

[@justinbenjamin4651]

All that Ronny Dahl video did was prove how safe tow balls are. They pointed out the ball was loose when it finally broke the first time, after that they precut the stud to get any more to even break. Any time you make a recovery there is a possibility of something to break.

[@jasonlessard2373]

Justin Benjamin, True, they did cut the ball to make the demo easier. Not sure it that proved the “safety” of using the tow ball. However it did demonstrate the violence of when thinks go wrong, what ever the failure.

[@796andy2]

Seeing how he only does this like everyday ...

[@MadMatt4WD]

Except the 4 days I was there. :(

[@boester69]

MAN he missed the chance to say "Linked down under", that would have been both original and hilarious :D

[@MadMatt4WD]

😂😂😂

[@bradsgold345]

I was a welder of 40 years, fabrication and structural. Something that's not brought up is on Matts three way ball setup the balls are welded on and not bolted. When welded on properly they have much higher shear strength than a bolted ball.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Correct. The tribal although not ideal is strong enough for the job. As I say in the video the load is not on a single ball.

[@olliehopnoodle4628]

Nothing wrong with the tri-ball setup for most recoveries.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I would still prefer a recovery hitch though.

[@pb8582]

Everythings wrong with using a Ball as a recovery...

[@pb8582]

@@MadMatt4WD we should go 4wd matey around crescent head or Coffs!!!

[@Snookchaser007]

Most recovering straps and ropes will fail before a tri ball hitch will if the pull is relatively straight and As Matt said if you are pulling something that has suction force or has an extreme situation such as wedged or extreme angle then you better get some heavy shackles and a 30 K lbs strap involved but this is fairly uncommon so the tri ball and yank um rope work for 90% of recovery

[@tigerchinese]

Single ball hitch will not work, but Tri-ball will work because each ball has weight ratings

[@jonathangreenawalt5724]

I think what Ronny Dahl was trying to imply when he did the tests is to show a failing, end of life, non stretchable, and/or an older kinetic rope (a static strap for the purpose of demonstrating the worst case) is possible and to never hook to a tow ball for that 'just in case' moment. For someone like Matt, he goes through his equipment and rotates out defective and old gear allowing him to use such techniques just fine. The common person having to use a recovery kinetic rope might have the strap stored deep in the vehicle and for it to be not used for a great length of time; so the condition is more unknown and it may act more as a stiff static strap when the time to recover does happen. An old rubber band is less likely to stretch than a new one. This is the same reason why old tires that are not driven on are also dangerous as they have dry rotted and become stiffer. Its also the same reasoning why hard hats should be replaced every few years. Plastics, rubber and material just degrade over time. Is it good advice to always use stronger and/or multiple attachments than weaker ones, yeah sure. Also, Matt having a vehicle as light as possible while as powerful as necessary, not only to stay on top of the sand, but it helps avoid the huge kinetic inertia that is able to be built up when using a kinetic rope so the jerky motion of towing is avoided reducing his risk even further. His vehicle having those modified drive train, differentials,...etc makes his vehicle act as much as a tractor as possible. That is why we sometimes see him have to take several tries to get people unstuck. All the power doesn't help if he isn't able to deliver it to the ground. His vehicle is still heavy, but it is not overloaded with camping gear, overland gear...etc during the rescue tugs. He even goes to emptying his vehicle when he plans for a 2 day or more rescue before actually pulling someone out. It is about avoiding being at the limits and avoiding going beyond the limits of stretch when using the kinetic rope. Once your past the stretch limit, the strap is in danger of breaking or becoming more like a static rope and that is where the tow ball 'issue' comes in. For those that say Ronny has modified the tow ball by cutting it before pulling it, material science dictates a compression and extension side of a force acted on a lever (tow ball). The side with the extension shows separation and the side with compression initially is unevenly broken at failure resulting in a tow ball failure and an 'even line' shown in Ronnys' video at 13:04. The steel atom start to separate, mode 1 tensile fracture, reducing the effective diameter of the tow ball to a point such that once enough atoms have separated catastrophic failure occurs shearing off the tow ball unevenly, roughly half way in this case, on the side that was initially under compression. Mode 1 tensile failure is a clean break hence why it looks shiny and 'cut'. The tow ball is undergoing a bending force test of sorts during a static tow tug. Instead of receiving the force over time, the force is applied all at once in a moment of time. We all know F=MxA. A running start static strap tow takes the mass of a vehicle and when the strap reaches a point of no slack, the strap tries to decelerate the vehicle in essentially zero amount of time as there is no give in the rope, which creates a huge amount of force. Lets take a lightweight 3,000lb vehicle, typical sedan, traveling at 5mph towing with a static strap on a class III hitch rated for 6,000lb. Lets say once the strap is taught the car goes from 5mph to 0mph takes 0.5sec (very generous). Accel=dV/dT, 5mph/0.5sec= -10ft/s2. F=ma, 3000lb*10ft/s2= 4923220lbf. Pound force, lbf, does not equal pounds. Lbf converted to pound mass, lbm or lb is what we are looking for. 1lbf=32.174lbm x 1ft/s2. Converting 4923220lbf to 153,018 lbm. So 153,018 lbm or lb is around 25x greater than 6,000lb tow rating. That is the basic rough math. Due to the vehicle not sustaining the force, because it stops, and the rough estimation does not account for steels elasticity properties the tow ball is able to take some abuse as it took Ronny several tries to have a ball shear off.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks for the input

[@jonathangreenawalt5724]

@@MadMatt4WD I am not an offroader by any means. After watching your "tow ball is not an option" video after I wrote this, it seems like I'm kinda on track with the same premise. I didn't even talk about the receiver and shear 'single vs double' being a mode of failure, as I was focusing on just the tow ball itself assuming the hitch itself would withstand the force. I agree with you on having double shear aspect. I have a Titan and I know someday I will have to utilize my knowledge and truck so I am trying to learn before the time to get myself or someone else unstuck. What are your thoughts on this? I welcome criticism in order to better science. :)

[@RobGADV]

Having paid closer attention to Matt's tri-ball, I see some good things -- it's totally straight, and the balls are welded to it rather than bolted. I have a hunch that tri-ball is going to take more abuse than the receiver that's bolted to his front bumper.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I would still prefer a hitch receiver.

[@ultimate1576]

Aftermarket Cherokee bumpers are attached to the frame rails on both sides, usually with plate steel tie in plates. Matt's bumper is tied in to both of the frame rails as well as into the bumper. The stock bumper is sheet metal and would rip in half if it was ever used for any type of pull. Edit: I bet that center point behind the receiver is tied into the cross member on the Jeep and not to the bumper itself.

[@SegoMan]

Welded in place in a foreign country by child labor..

[@pj4433]

I’m old before KZbin told me I couldn’t do it we’d done it for years for the same reason Matt did. It was all that was available

[@dongeiger4500]

Looking at the ball set up you have to notice that there is a direct line of force via the hitch to the frame. There is no drop on the hitch to impose leverage force on it. I think he is safe to use this on his vehicle. The other end is a different story.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I’m passionate about helping the 4wd community and I'm developing an online course so i can help as many people as I can to get out there and wheel well on their 4wd adventures. To register your interest and for free and exclusive training videos visit www.4x4online.org/register

[@jacks86australia]

Unfortunately we have rules for the lowest common denominator. People like this guy can assess the situation with years of experience. In Australia we build recovery points for 19 year olds with monster flat hats bogged in the beach still in 2wd....the lowest common denominator..

[@MadMatt4WD]

Good point

[@notreallyme425]

Immediately thought of this video after watching your most recent one about the tragic incident. I think the key here is that people who know what they’re doing can do this safely. But people who are not experts, like myself, need to understand that we are not experts. Therefore, for people like me, we should always use the proper recommended gear that has extra safety margins built-in. That may not be the fastest or the cheapest way of doing it, but since this is something I may only have to do a couple times in my life versus every day like Matt, it’s better to take my time and do it as safely as possible. I would never have known not to do a recovery from a tow ball, that doesn’t make me stupid. But I would be stupid if I didn’t learn from others mistakes.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Excellent comment. I think though as experts we have a responsibility to our audience to demonstrate good procedure. It’s not always possible and sometimes the subilties are not understood. A 10 minute video can only do so much.

[@DUNEATV]

That 3- ball hitch is F-ing STRONG! The way he has that strap connected to it I would bet my life it would never break! My personal 3-ball hitch is rated at 10k pounds for towing obviously but it’s a stout chunk of steel!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes it is strong. No doubt.

[@DUNEATV]

@@MadMatt4WD But I agree with you on the single ball method...

[@DUNEATV]

@Nomen Clature Totally get it

[@lawrencewiddis2447]

I don’t want to trust a rating for my safety.

[@stephenlamphier1141]

The 3 towball attachment will safely hold a tow strap. A single towball is a NO. I do like the pintle hitch attachment Matt uses on his Jeep to loop the tow straps onto. It's quick, easy and safe. Great video!!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks for sharing!

[@Lon1001]

I just recently watched a feature by Colorado 4X4 Rescue and Recovery discussing the tragedy in AZ this past July (R.I.P. Ryan Woods)... Yeah they did a few things wrong but it's a stark reminder just how much force can be transmitted when hitting that rope, and how lethal it can be. After watching that video you can rest assured safety will always be on the front of my mind when it comes to deciding if I'm going to call in the pros or not.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I’m glad to hear the respect in your comment.

[@jamiejenkins5643]

Yeah I just watch that too that's why I'm watching this now

[@TwinShards]

Something that has not been mention (or i missed it) about Matt's T-tow ball is how it could break in the event of a failure. If it were to snap, 1 or both balls would shoot upward and never directly go to the car at a possible deadly angle, and it's only because the tension on the side balls is coming from underneath, see 2:22. Matt's use of those tow ball is much safer than if the rope were to be hook with this tow ball: 0:55

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes your right. I do think this is a strong enough hook on but I do think there’s better solutions

[@TwinShards]

Thank for still replying to everyone even after 6months ! :) And yes you are right, there's def better achor type!

[@ronaldfulton1175]

Shout out to the never mentioned 5/8" pin holding the tow ball or pintle hook to the hitch ! No matter how big your balls are...it comes down to a 5/8" pin.

[@mrromantimothy]

Back in the 70s all we had to tow cars with was chains and they would slam if you didn't keep them tight I don't know if I was the first to discover the trucker strap, (you will see them on the side of the freeway occasionally, when I do I stop and grab them up) but when I first used one, I was overjoyed, sometimes necessity dictates you use what you have and I happened to have one I tied knots on both ends to the frame rails, I couldn't believe it ,no teeth rattling bumper ripping slam you would get from a chain, just a gentle tug and it wouldn't break, so I would tell anyone that would listen to me to use one and how great they were me and my brother towed a car on LA freeways 60 miles with no problems at all, I still will keep one rolled up in my trunk of my car in case I need to tow someone or be towed.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks for sharing

[@rockymtndieselrider1133]

That "tow ball" will rip a Toyota or Jeep in half before it breaks.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Matts Triball connection will but a towball may not.

[@1towmater1]

I use a pintle hitch. The one i tryst most uses a pin so its fast and easy to hook up

[@MadMatt4WD]

The Pintle is good system.

[@joshua22301]

I trust Matt’s expert advice lol the guy has earned any bit of information he can give out

[@billbertagnoli4226]

Watch the other video and MadMatt Explains the kinetic recovery is doable with a stretch strap.

[@crazyscott71]

I've used this way for years wrapping the hitch. say what you want ive broke mine chain and strap never a hitch and ball

[@davidshettlesworth1442]

Thank you for and outstanding video. It was good to see open communication between Matt of USA with Australian Matt. Carry On Gentlemen saving vehicles and lives.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thank you very much!

[@TrevorDennis100]

Hah! Fancy seeing you with Matt, Casey and the gang. I hope they follow your channel because you and your buddies get into insane situations by comparison. I know of one recovery situation that nearly ended badly, but that was a shackle that broke and not a tow ball. I'd better not say exactly who we are talking about, but one of our engineers, (there's a wee clue there) had been doing some tests with a 20 ton dump truck, and when they finished he went to dump the sand out of the bed, but the silly bugger forgot to open the tailgate and ended up tipping back with the cab waaaay in the air. So one of the fitters went out to pull him down with another dump truck, but the engineer was too scared to climb down from the cab. The fitter used a long steel hawser, so zero stretch and shock absorption, and attached it at each end with a shackle (I don't remember how big the shackles were). He was a crazy bastard we called Black Jack, and I think he must have thought he'd have some fun with the engineer and took off like a mad person, got to the end of the slack, and the cable with part of the shackle sprung back and took out the wind screen in the truck behind. Somehow the engineer survived with nothing worse that some scratches from flying glass and soiled kecks, but he was a quivering wreck for ages afterwards. This was a very long time ago - 1970 (ish)

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yikes

[@ThatGuy-sd3zl]

I pulled a wrecked dodge Dakota with a 2-5/16 tow ball. I gave it a bit of a wank to get it moving and ripped the Dakota’s tow hook off the frame. It also flew over my vehicle but thankfully didn’t hit it. I’m not scared to pull with a tow ball. It’s just a bit annoying when the rope unhooks.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Having a failure like that should make you rethink things ay?

[@ThatGuy-sd3zl]

MadMatt 4WD Well that’s Not something I could have predicted. Sure is odd though, here in Canada I’ve never heard of people snapping tow balls before. Could it be the weight rating and dimensions are different? Mine I think is rated for a 14,000 lbs trailer with a 1” diameter bolt. You can get smaller ones too but I like using heavy duty ones. Fifth wheel hitches as we call them use a 3” ball good for 30,000 lbs trailers. Hard to imagine that snapping.

[@MadMatt4WD]

i think our balls are 7/8 bolt size. I still maintain using the right tool for the job is best.

[@TheStevester2]

I feel like the men that criticize practices like this, are the same men that believe there is a wrong way to turn a crecent wrench.

[@orangepickel2]

Single point towing bits on commerical towing vessels have the eye of the rope made fast to the bit as Matt does on the , triple ball hitch. Coast Guard vessels tow the same way. Is the strongest👍👍👍is what this old Seadog said first video I saw MATT put an eye on the tow bit.

[@donhappel9928]

True, though the towing bit on a boat like that is designed for the loading where the tri-ball wasn't. Not that I think it would be the weak link in the system. Sadly I've been towed over a bar (Newport OR, 38' Ocean Alexander lost both engines on a trip up the coast due to fuel contamination) in 6' swells. It certainly put some strain on the system. In that case I was more worried about the towing bridle ripping one of my bow cleats out of the deck.

[@MadMatt4WD]

yikes

[@donhappel9928]

@@MadMatt4WD Luckily that's the only time the Coasties have had to come get me in many trips up/down the pacific coast!

[@orangepickel2]

@@donhappel9928 I'm a former Coast Guard Boatswain mate retired Merchant Sailor deep-sea and licensed near Coastal vessel Captain. Per a comment I made about kinetic energy stored in a rope. Took over the tow into Apra Harbor Guam from a 110 foot Coast Guard vessel 2 days after a 150 mph typhoon went over the island seas were 35-40 feet. The Galvaston Island had towed that 120 foot 300 gross ton Japanese longlinner through that storm in 60-70 foot seas for 5 days they had lost an engine. Their tow line was Samson Double Braided Nylon 4" diameter 600'. My tow line was 400' of polypropylene 2.5" diameter tow was done at idle on 2; 12V71 Detroit's 42' crewboat.3 miles out took 2.25 hrs to make that 3 miles to entrance bouys. 45-55' seas at enterance due to shallow water 96' to top of reef; 20 minutes on 1 engine from when I cleared the bouys till the tow did at near dark. 13 lives at the end of that rope. Those seas were following into the harbor. Hr.5 later we were on calm water could shorten the to line shift to a 3point along side tow and put the fishing boat on the dock.

[@donhappel9928]

@@orangepickel2 So just another day at the office then? No arguments with you- I've seen plenty of towing (though not that big; mostly Vessel Assist types) and absolutely they rig like you said. As a coastal guy running around CA/OR/WA I'll be quite happy to sit in harbor rather than go out in that sort of snot! By the time it starts getting over 10' I start asking how hard I want to work somebody else's boat!

[@BuildSomethingAuto]

I think this discussions interesting! I actually made a video in response to matts original one where I did the physics and used some finite element analysis to look at recovery with a snatch rope and a single towball - the original intention was to prove matt right that its safe. However it turns out its not always so simple. It IS possible to break the tow ball (like you showed in your other video) but in my estimation matt’s jeep would have to be jerking the rope at over 10 mph and the stuck vehicle would have to be hard stuck with no movement. Anyways, I think the physics (and matts videos) show its safe under 10 mph with a kinetic rope, but never safe with a static rope. Glad to see the continued discussion and very cool crossover between these channels!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Great comment.

[@Pinzpilot101]

Guys......To really understand the forces involved in Kinetic recovery you have to have watched a 65 Ton Chieftain Tank, recover another 65 Ton Chieftain tank that is up to its 'turret' in sticky, claggy clay! I,ll just run through the procedure for you (this vid used to be on KZbin Tube but has gone). The recovery guys laid out their rope (huge) kinetic rope like a wiggly snake, attached to the two front tow points welded to the hull of the stuck tank.......It was pulled from one tow hitch on the other tank (huge - rated at god knows what).....The pulling tank sets off at what we would think of as a leisurely pace....(not going to work we all said).....but the rope straightened out and then started to stretch......it got to a certain point and then 'God' reached down and simply lifted that stuck (65 tons remember) tank up into the air...it literally flew out of the mud hole, tracks hanging from sprockets. All who watched this demo, knew that 'god like' forces had been applied. This has always stayed with me when doing any kind of recovery....I always used very highly rated and quality equipment and I never, ever underestimate the forces involved.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I think I’ve seen that video or certainly similar ones. Yes the forces involved are terrifying. And even a small increase in speed makes a massive difference to the amount of force generated.

[@CaseysOffRoadRecovery]

How dare you put stuff on the hood of Jail Bird? Just don't trust that front bumper!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Ha Ha Ha. Did you weld it?

[@RjBrown-ks5tz]

This is mind blowing i just wrote on a video that he should test yankum ropes. Well Matt's recovery rope to be exact and walla. Here is the video

[@MadMatt4WD]

:)

[@SkylinersYeti]

Just found the channel. I live in the Central Oregon Cascades and see lots of people stuck in snow and mud here. MOST of the tow companies employees I have seen are clueless on off highway recovery practices. It is good to listen to a couple of experienced off highway recovery people explain how and why they do their recoveries. Keep the videos coming.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Glad you found us Robert. Thanks for the kind words

[@jamiejenkins5643]

Just came here after watching a guy get killed from using a drop hitch. And they pretty much said no ball hitch was safe. I'll use them with no problem so and Matt is a professional

[@MadMatt4WD]

I would suggest you don’t use a recovery hitch as part of your recovery device. Read the comments in my video about Rays death. Some of the stories are scary.

[@jamiejenkins5643]

@@MadMatt4WD I don't know how I missed that video I've seen every one of your videos and been a subscriber for a long time. Definitely was a sad story. And trust me I definitely know you are top-notch professional and using your judgment when your professional

[@MadMatt4WD]

@@jamiejenkins5643 thanks so much for the support and kind words

[@agentcrm]

I've seen Matt recover on normal tow bars quite hard more than a few times. Espetially on full size trucks.

[@MadMatt4WD]

ok

[@colonelJ77]

Peanut in the background.... lol

[@nickjennings3500]

Nice one Matt, keep them coming.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks, will do!

[@themilkman5593]

An Arizona recovery KILLED someone using a ball hitch as the towing pull point. !!!!

[@MadMatt4WD]

See my recent video about that

[@shiminowind]

When it comes to recovery, any new knowledge I have yet to obtain in my experience, I confidently follow Matt from Matt's off road recovery. His and his teams reputation and success rate is enough for me. As far as recovery with a tow ball goes, I agree using a single ball under 2" is not a good idea in a dynamic scenario. I have used tow balls for recovery for many years without fail or damage but by scenario only. Only with adjustable steel drop hitches have I done dynamic pulls because of the structural integrity and the quality of the welds of the particular product. I will use a single ball only if it's a 2" or greater and if it's a dead pull. No different then using a strap verses a rope. Yes the integrity of either are far different but the concept the same. You treat them differently as they are and you repect them more and use them appropriately you have a safer outcome. You treat them the same and you will have catastrophic situations. It all about using logic and experience in each situation to get the best and safest outcome. I've used ratchet straps for recovery in 4 ft of snow and only because of the rating of 1. The strap and 2. The amount of force/energy it will take to do the job. If you weave dental floss there is a scenario it can be used as a recovery line and do very well 😉 its all about thinking of all possibilities

[@MadMatt4WD]

Interesting

[@Lucas12v]

I personally wouldn't have any qualms at all about using a tri ball but to each their own. I've also used a single inch and a quarter shank ball lots of times but i wouldn't use it in a high force situation.

[@zzcoool]

Great video with lots of great points. Keep in mind that the tri-ball hitch is rated to 10,000lbs. Combine it with the progressive pull of yankum rope, you will not see close to 10k pull or come close to the shearing force required to snap the ball off. I've been using the same setup for over 20 years abd have done as many recoveries with it as Matt does each week, lol.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes but why not use a device designed for the job. Why use a crescent wrench when you can use a spanner

[@lonerider5315]

The limit is the king pin. That fails before the ball

[@johnnyringo35]

As a mechanic, fabricator, off roader, for decades..... I use what I got on hand and it hasn't but me to hard. Some failures happened but I always weighed risk vs reward. That's said....I am now almost a Nurse Practitioner (Doctorate) and have a B.S.N. and M.S.N. and I see many injuries that could have been avoided. I see both sides. Ultimately I think it comes to the individuals specific skillset, knowledge, and good ole fashion luck.

[@Petriefied0246]

I think the word you're struggling for here is that Matt uses the triple tow ball as a static capstan rather than just a simple tow ball.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Ok

[@philipbird77]

I am not an engineer, but how I see this is the load is applied to the 2 outer balls plus the receiver hitch, would it not be better to also loop the rope over the top tow ball to apply the load both backwards and through the 2 outer balls and the receive hitch at the same time ?

[@MadMatt4WD]

Good thinking. Personally I would just use a proper hitch receiver.

[@Psyco913]

The problem with that configuration is that it's entirely dependent on a consistent tension on the rope, which is unrealistic in a recovery situation. Any slack in the line or sideways pull that allows the loop to come off of one of the side tow balls would result in the rope only being looped around the other side ball, because the loop is in front of the top ball. The way Matt loops the rope on at least allows the top ball to be a backup should the rope come off of one or both of the side balls. I agree with Mad Matt that this setup is not ideal, but I can see why it's convenient in situations where the rope won't be experiencing a large load.

[@MadMatt4WD]

@@Psyco913 Well said

[@philipbird77]

@@Psyco913 the size of the loop dictates the amount of slack witch would be minimal, so therefore the load would be spread over 3 rather than 2 tow ball's with the receiver hitch as last resort, as for side loads this would also be spread out wider I would believe

[@Psyco913]

@@philipbird77 What I meant about side loading is not that your configuration would be any weaker as far as distributing the load, but that a side load could pull the loop off of the ball on that side. Remember that this rope is designed to stretch up to 30% of its length, so the loop could very easily be enlarged under load. This enlarging of the loop doesn't matter much if you have it going through a fully enclosed shackle, but it certainly could come into play if it's just looped over a tow ball or two (or three).

[@VintageBlacklist]

Why is the pin a double sheer? Why is the ball a single sheer? What happens when you add a second ball? Answers: The pin goes through 2 sheer lines The ball has but one sheer line... balls have 2 sheer lines......... soooooooo.... It's what gets cuts when guys get a vasectomy... Yay physics and biology.... i guess...

[@T25de]

“Think about what you’re doing” Great advice. I live in Houston and work in aerospace with NASA. “Think 5” is a safety mantra. Think about what you’re doing. What things can go wrong? What’s the worst that could happen? Can risks be eliminated? If no, can they be mitigated? In short... take a beer 🍺 to consider the situation before Sending It!

[@MadMatt4WD]

I like that

[@rezalbb]

While it is certainly important to use caution regarding the elastic energy of any tow rope or strap, I consider citing the specific "danger" of using a hitch ball as a recovery point fake news. A standard 2", 5000lb rated hitch ball, properly installed, is incredibly strong. The solid shank welded 3-ball hitch Matt uses would certainly double-shear the 5/8" pin before it failed in any way. I know there are numerous accidents involving tow straps, hooks, chains and cables. Can you cite one where a properly installed hitch ball failed causing injury? In this MN case the entire receiver hitch failed so whether it was a ball or shackle wouldn't have made a difference: "But during this process, the receiver hitch from Nusbaum's vehicle broke, sending the fractured hitch and trailer ball hurtling toward's Pineur's pickup."

[@rezalbb]

Searching more I guess there are a few cases in Australia where failed tow balls may have been the culprit. In the US, the tow rating of the ball is stamped right on it.

[@MadMatt4WD]

You can’t convince me that a tow ball is the right tool for the job. Sorry but it’s just not. Read through the comments hear and there are people who have first hand testimony.

[@rezalbb]

@@MadMatt4WD Thank you for this and all of your thoughtful replies. I feel like an intelligent conversation centers around ensuring that you are aware of the weakest link in any hook-up and take precautions accordingly. One advantage of a ball hitch is that the tow rating is normally stamped on it. Unfortunately that is a max trailer weight and not a straight-line pull rating but it does give you a point of reference. The only comparison of the two I can find is for a Curt front-mounted receiver hitch (not a ball) rated at 5000lb towing and 9000lb straight-line pull e.g. with a hitch-mounted winch. If a tow ball is stamped 2000lb or any rating below your comfort level by all means it is the wrong place to hook up. If it is loose or damaged, same thing. If it is stamped 10,000lb and properly installed, I would challenge anyone to devise a test demonstrating a failure. People are killed by hooks, bow shackles and even hitch balls when unsafe recovery methods and/or equipment are used. A hard jerk with a tow strap like your video demonstrated is a recipe for disaster no matter what recovery point is used. I wish you would have pointed that out.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks Brad. Based on your comments I presume you have a level of recovery understanding. So you do understand the difference between a tow recovery and a kinetic recovery. Often people confuse the two but they’re totally different but the connection is exactly the same. Another factor with a tow ball it doesn’t have the depth in the throat that a hook has. They’re not known for slipping the strap but it’s not a good design. Anyway I still come back to this. A towball is not designed to take the force of a kinetic recovery and when it’s so cheap and easy to use the right tool there is no argument for their use. I’ll see if I can find the link to @robert peppers video on the forces we achieve in recoveries. It’s terrifying.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Please take the time to watch this. kzbin.info/www/bejne/mp7YdpSZn9l0jLc

[@TimsBitsnPieces]

I Believe its all about thinking first then doing for every recovery.

[@CaseysOffRoadRecovery]

Amen!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Totally

[@jamesmoore3346]

Exactly! Put the brain in gear before risking an accident........that refers back to the part between your ears is the best piece of safety equipment there is........kinda like 'think before jumping', lol

[@gentlejake605]

So someone just died because of this in my local offroad community a low drop hitch snapped smacked guy in the head through the windshield and the steering wheel bent back and killed him and he was just offroading with his family...and he got stuck ...and welp long story short /\

[@MadMatt4WD]

See my previous video on Ryan’s death

[@gentlejake605]

@@MadMatt4WD I had no idea there was a video i actually live in kingman so i seen it on a facebook thank you for letting me know I'm sorry for Ryan's loss

[@timjd7964]

Maybe it's a little quicker but when you have a big following on line why wouldn't you just use rated shit? I agree something else would probably fail before 3 tow balls. Plus a hitch shackle is less weight to carry around. Regardless people will always find something to bitch about so who cares any ways

[@weskirkland5850]

I'm watching this after seeing the videos of the guy that got killed in the f250 when the pulling trucks rear hitch broke and came through the windshield.

[@dobledekersoulwrekr]

Some people talk about the right way to do things, some people go out and get things done

[@MadMatt4WD]

And then die but hey the job got done. some go out take a little longer get the job done then go home.

[@zrodzach8142]

The fact you boys missed that that tri hitch has welded on balls and not bolted on would have been a fantastic point to cross. Those welded on balls are much stronger than a bolted ball on a receiver. Making that Tri 3 point receiver ball much more robust aspecially when using the strap style that puts load on all 3 balls.

[@anthonymaestas4863]

This.is two years later and I read through about a two dozen comments. Seems everyone misses what is being said. Neither of them say it's safe or that he should be using it. Yes, these tri-ball have different physics. Lots of factors are changed with it being welded, that kenetic ropes are used and where the leverage is. But again, neither of them say it's right or that it should be used.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yeah the frustration of KZbin right there. People hear what they want to hear.

[@anthonymaestas4863]

@@MadMatt4WD lol, thanks for the reply, it's not just youtube.

[@b.vo.]

With Matt making videos and putting his recoveries out for the world to see, someone without expert knowledge might see that and think it's safe to do and I think as a public figure he has a responsibility to either make a disclaimer each time he does it or not do it at all. Tragedies have happened.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Could I suggest you watch my latest video which address this

[@b.vo.]

@@MadMatt4WD I did! And I understand the stresses are different, but my point is someone without expert knowledge or having been educated by a video such as yours, might not know any different. They just remember seeing a dude with really cool equipment and a magnificent beard did it, so it's probably fine.

[@MadMatt4WD]

@@b.vo. it’s certainly something I’m well aware of and try to implement in my videos. It’s a great point you make though.

[@chicnwing4519]

Apples and oranges ,,reciever hitch with a bolt on ball is a no no .. a triball is welded .and the force is divided between 2 welded balls and the 2 inch receiver shaft

[@MadMatt4WD]

We do cover that in the video.

[@esteemedenergy]

I would trust Matt and his thousands of recoveries, over some keyboard ‘professional’ leaving comments on KZbin.

[@RatherBfishin]

If either of these guys shows up. You’re getting out safely.

[@peterhatch1583]

Its all good mate 👍 over here in America matts the man !! New build is killing it!!

[@DaleEarnhardtsSeatbelt]

If you want to help wheel better and safer please consider the following: •Hardly and I mean barely showed alternative products to tow ball. throwing it through the frame would have done equally as good as matt did. •says tow balls are dangerous, just links to another video. Not even a couple reasons or facts referenced. Did we stop and think before planning this video or intentionally want to fragment useful information. •supoorts matts use of the ball hitch for recovery •also makes fun of Matt's use of a ball hitch •Stops to tell you water is wet and that you should stop and think about what you're doing. Honestly that could have been the entire video. Since nothing else is really useful. I believe you need to structure your videos better or storyboard them. This seemed like it was improved and poorly at that.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Thanks for the input

[@sendit1158]

Tragic accident due to tow ball hitch failure , watch this video

[@rolandrochon343]

I broke the looking pin on one recovery once. Luckily nothing happened.

[@SuzJim99]

Matt (Winder) has a wealth of experience; trust his methods very much more than someone spouting 'best protocol'

[@MadMatt4WD]

Interesting

[@petercrawford2597]

The point is.. Matt 4x4 Recovery is a proffesional and every situation is unique.. He needs a vast array of tricks and techniques.. That said the tools and situations are calculated and well thought through.. The 3 ball apparatus he only uses in situations and techniques that would not create a shock load, The load itself being spread between the bar itself and two balls.. Therefore flying balls of decapitating could only happen if irrisponsible and stupid.. Which of course Matt is not.. Bottom line is.. He knows what he is doing and is a very responsible and knowledgable man.. Unlike the Idiots that frequent 4×4 tracks, Pretty sure 50% of them either dont have a brain, or dont use it.. or plainly just leave them at home.. 🤷‍♂️

[@MadMatt4WD]

Interesting

[@ramzyzoom6674]

How do I tow American sedans like Impala Taurus Malibu Caprice, Classic Victoria, etc. Because, you know, American companies do not provide pull hooks for sedans. and I don't know why !!!!

[@MadMatt4WD]

from what Matt says is a challenge. He often uses the big hooks he has to hook into a suitable part of the chassis. Just be very carefull.

[@jakebrakebill]

yep there's a few hundred things to consider when pulling someone out. if you're not sure, let the experts pull you out. you wouldn't play catch with a loaded handgun. lives can be lost doing something that seems so simple.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes indeed

[@kirkc3542]

Ball hitches have a very low side impact stability,and is never a good idea too use them like that lots of people have been killed doing that.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yes. Go back a couple of videos on my channel and see the one where Ryan was killed. Not because of the ball failing but the hitch.

[@simplyamazing880]

I'd like to know who has actually seen a tow ball pulled\broken off during a towing situation or have they actually been able to break one off in a test. Anyone actually seen that happen?

[@MadMatt4WD]

Read some of the comments on here. One guy was in hospital when he posted having been hit by one.

[@colinboyd7779]

I'm with you. Show me a picture of a failed towball from a kinetic recovery. A few years ago I spent days searching the internet for examples in Australia, I read several coroner/inquest/court statements. All the stories were tragic with innocent friends or good Samaritans killed. In every case the towbar or tongue had failed NOT the TOWBALL. They were ALL towbars with leverage, typically the ones that hang low off the chassis on tray back Ute's, so using the towball in these cases allowed leverage to be applied to the towbar in a way it wasn't designed. In one tragic beach recovery in Tasmania, the broken towbar was so rusty it probably wouldn't have got a 6x4 trailer load of rubbish to the tip. So pls show me pictures of a failed towball or even a failed 50 x 50mm minimum offset tongue. I don't want to hear about your mates aunties next door neighbour had this happen to him. Show us the pictures, the evidence. "Never use a towball to snatch" is a simplistic rule to cover the lowest common denominator.

[@RetiredPilot]

I think any discussion about hitches and balls should start with their rating. My hitch is rated at 12000 lbs as is the ball a hitch from Harbour Freight or TSC may be rated at 6000 lbs. My hitch ball has an inch and a quarter bolt. Then there is the class or hardness of the bolt. Not all things are created equal. If you look at Mat's hitch it looks to be heavy duty. Also the yankam rope puts a lot less strain on the hitch. JMHO

[@MadMatt4WD]

Some good points there

[@glenns.8277]

At least he never uses a chain! That's where things get really dangerous. Snatch ropes are awesome.

[@tommycarter977]

Also if someone has a trailer they need pulled out, Matt has every ball size to pull it out if needed.

[@MadMatt4WD]

That’s probably why he got the triball in the first place.

[@jonathanpeterson1984]

You just have to choose the parts and manufacturer carefully, look into how they are rated and what the sheer strength and max weight, factor 55 stuff is damn near indestructible, it's how the tow ball is secured, if you buy a 40 $ hitch it's gonna snap! Matt has very heavy duty equipment.

[@f87115]

I’ve often found , it’s really easy to shoulda woulda things and give my opinion from the comforts of a recliner :)

[@MadMatt4WD]

Lol

[@Craig_Narramoore]

I'd say 80% of the recoveries we see on MORR aren't really "stuck" as much as they just need a nudge. Dad gets stuck on the tractor or lawn mower like that a lot when he tries to get one more swipe. He hasn't buried anything to axles in years trying to get himself out. Let's just say with my childhood experiences I'll never be a "mudder" for fun. Oh and it is fun to see the Matt's Yellow Recovery Rope just pop them out of their traps.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I think that’s a fair comment. The trouble I see is then that person think the process that got the lawn mower unstuck is still applicable when they have a serious recovery on hand.

[@Craig_Narramoore]

@@MadMatt4WD That is when "common sense" (which isn't that common anymore) would say "hey listen to the guys who have done this before." Then again I watched a lot of Offroad Wins and Fails today and it doesn't seem that common in those groups.

[@SimonElenor]

I can introduce you to man that used to use the exact tow ball system you use! He is missing his right ear and can not turn his neck. The ball snapped at the weld went through his tailgate and through the window and took out the right side of his head. If you would like to argue it with him go ahead but you will loose! Don't be stupid use correct gear or don't do it! I have been wheeling for close to 30 years and seen all kinds of injuries most of them from incorrect gear. It is a dangerous enough situation don't add stupidity to mix.

[@cornishlad97]

Simon Elenor if you listen to what they say Matt only uses it when it when the balls are far from the weakest link. I’m sure when your friend was almost injured the were clearly the weakest link. Everything has a time and place to be used. Not understanding this is when it all gets a bit risky!

[@SimonElenor]

@@cornishlad97 So you are saying it is safe sometimes? He was pulling a CJ5 on 33" tires and it was only down to the hubs in mud. If you don't have the correct equipment for the job or you are too lazy to swap it out. DON'T DO IT!

[@MadMatt4WD]

Nick excellent points and glad you recognised it in the video.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Simon, If you listen to Matt he's very clear on how and why he uses it. Having said that I'm with you and feel a hitch receiver would be just as easy to use and safer.

[@SimonElenor]

@@MadMatt4WD The correct gear should always be used. I don't care what people say. I am a fabricator and as such know the stresses that welds can put under. Those balls are not bolted which provides shear strength. I don't care how many times he has done it. Steve my friend did it thousands of times and had been wheeling since 1964. He won't even get in a 4x4 anymore scared to death of them. Unless you xray those welds each time you use that piece you can not guarantee the safety of yourself or anyone around you. This kind of video is unsafe and that should be noted. Giving bad advice or unintentional bad advice that can get people killed or hurt is inexcusable. I would advise that you amend this video to say as such or remove it. I will not report it as I am not an infant. But this needs to be corrected.

[@apex1113]

The safest way is to stay home and comment about what others do in the big dangerous world.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yeah. Glad I don’t do that. Do you do that?

[@dgiroday1]

I like seeing the different perspectives on recovery!

[@codywohlers2059]

But it doesn't break when you tow a 10,000kg trailer and hit the brakes... The real lesson is don't stand in the danger zone when doing recovery.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Hey Cody, Very different forces and far less load in actual fact.

[@jamesmoore3346]

Lots of difference between 'static' and 'dynamic' load stress.......

[@garyp.7501]

Amazing the comments from folks who appear to have no problem spending $200+ per tire, not wanting to spend $75 for a specialized recovery hitch. I always judge these expenses by this question. "If i were stuck, what would I pay you to have X piece of equipment". And generally out in the boonies with the sun going down, if I had a recovery strap/rope, couple of soft and hard rings, and a hitch mount, a shovel, and a friend with an unstuck vehicle c/hitch, we'd be on our way home, vs calling Matt, and waiting until he can come get us.... And after watching those ball hitch failures, "What would I spend not to be in the emergency room having been hit by flying metal...." You can't even get a bandaid at the ER for $75.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Yep and yet here I am like a voice in the wilderness. I love that you mention the shovel. That’s the most versatile piece of recovery kit you can get.

[@garyp.7501]

@@MadMatt4WD I have been carrying a shovel (Ames 40" garden, small spade) for years. Well before I even knew about recovery straps. Growing up in snow country, it's just a given. Recently went nuts and bought a ridiculously expensive DMOS Delta folding shovel because space is a premium, and covid.... I blame covid brain sitting home for a year working, for such excesses... Anyway watching those nuts tear the front axle off that Jeep CK you mentioned in another video made me wonder why no one in that large group had a shovel. But for your normal person, the Ames works just fine, and is better than those WW1 Dhandle trenching shovels.

[@MadMatt4WD]

From my observations most are just plain lazy and busy drinking to worry about safety. We're out having fun so who cares tends to be the attitude I see. Most of the time they get away with it but you only need to have one failure to kill a mate.

[@mrromantimothy]

Hey you aussies always got my mad respect, I remember when Americans gave up and said there's no way to stroke a Harley, you guys didn't quit and gave us the screaming eagle. it's neat how we have different words for things for example ,we call it aluminum and you guys call it aloomineum , but a snatch here is another word for a pussy, and I'm just not going to tow or recover any car with a pussy strap.lol

[@MadMatt4WD]

LOL

[@jonjames4281]

wow what an old thread, but anyway, 60 years ago we were taking 80ci flathead crank/flywheels and stuffing them into 1200s making 1340s. Harley finally caught on to what we were doing and copied it to make, of all things, the 1340. Not sure where in the US your from but it wasn't around any Harley mechanics worth a damn.

[@dartmoordave]

He doesn't use a Towball, he uses a purpose made bit of gear and that seeing his standard of fabrication I'm quite sure its designed for the job. Based on a self-earned knowledge of what works, what breaks and what to avoid. The key thing is not to stand nearby.

[@MadMatt4WD]

I would still prefer a hitch receiver.

[@clarencemcgregor8568]

Not all tow balls are created equal, some are junk with very questionable bolts and threads, quality tow balls have high strength grade 5 or grade 8 bolts and high strength solid construction.

[@MadMatt4WD]

Sure but I would still suggest a Hitch receiver is a better solution.

[@clarencemcgregor8568]

@@MadMatt4WD Don't suppose that you have ever seen a receiver fitted with a 1/2" soft (Grade 3 or ungraded) rather than the hardened pin and Jesus clip? (It gets called a Jesus Clip because when it gets lost the reaction is "Jesus Christ where is that damned clip!".) Bolts like that have the nasty habit of either shearing or falling out because the nut has unscrewed. Then there are the owner installed receivers which may be very questionable as well. Another good one is the hitch ball installed on a typical pickup truck step bumper on a decades old pickup with lots of rust. the whole damned step bumper might just come off with a light tug.

[@joehendrickson5]

I ALWAYS use a tow ball n a logging chain wen I have to recover a vehicle NEVER had n issue n I've yanked a vehicle or 2 pretty good n It still held up n even towed a trailer the next day with the same tow ball

[@MadMatt4WD]

The question then is were you doing a tow recovery or a Kinetic energy recovery? Very different beasts. You can't do a Kinetic recovery with a chain FYI.

[@joehendrickson5]

@@MadMatt4WD I've pulled a loaded 10yd dump truck loaded with sand n a plow with a logging chain n a tow ball don't even own a kinetic rope, I guess wen it comes down to it to-each-their-own

[@Idahoprepper71]

You failed to mention the most important part about the tow balls he is using. They are welded on to the shank. They are extremely strong and their is no way he is going to break them.

[@MadMatt4WD]

That’s irrelevant and does not make them a suitable recovery point. The triball is designed for towing not the loads induced by a kinetic recovery. That’s why I didn’t mention them as suitable.

[@evictioncarpentry2628]

Funny story. About 10-12 years ago, I had a lifted F150 with 37s, geared. Detroit rear end, Eaton e-locker in the front. Went to pull a guy out that was burried up the doors. Suspension was completed sagged out, sitting on the frame. I let him hook up to my recovery point on the year... I backed right up to his tailgate and floored it... Probably about 8 times until the truck came out. Little did I know he hooked the rope up with an even smaller dinky little shackle like matt's holding, to the place where you put the chains on your hitch. I have ZERO idea how nothing snapped and went flying through either of our truck. Lmao. I got out to unhook it and saw what he used and was like duuude what the ffffuuudge is this?! Lol

[@MadMatt4WD]

Wow Glad no one was hurt

[@mach1motorsports828]

So don’t use a tow ball unless you use 3, or if you have thought about it and a decide it’s the right tool for the job then it’s ok. But you should never use a tow ball of any kind for a recovery. This sounds like the government telling me about corona virus.

[@dubious6718]

You can use a tow ball that is welded properly as it wont be the weak link anymore

[@MadMatt4WD]

LOL.

[@robertyouens7764]

Don't always believe the click bait you watch on youtube. Look closely... if you see a tow ball failure on an internet video it is usually being done with a chain or tow strap (not Snatch Strap or Kinetic Rope). Typically the failures are at welds or hitch structure on homemade or second rate equipment. Per SAE standards a Class 3 hitch and ball are tested to 15,000 lb longitudinal tension. Ronny Dahl took 8 full throttle accelerations on a 30' Tow Strap to break a ball he had sawed the shank half way through and had the towed vehicle strapped to a tree. It deformed the hitch well prior to failing the cut ball. The shear rating on a SAE Class 3 ball shank is over 46,000 lbs. Destruction testing has been done on a Class 3 hitch (available online) and the hitch welds and metal failed at 24,500 lbs, so in this test the hitch will fail well before the 46,000 shear rating of the ball shank. All the information I shared is publically available. I will share a link to SAE Hitch standards. I wouldn't recommend doing a "Snatch" (rolling pull) with a tow strap or chain as the Impact Force using a tow strap or chain that has no stretch can theoretically exceed shear ratings on a high speed roll out with a heavy towing vehicle and severely stuck towed vehicle (or one tied to a big tree, LOL). The Impact Force generated by a Snatch Strap with 20% stretch or a Kinetic Rope with 30% stretch will not create that level of Impact Force because forces generated are spread over distance and time as the stretch occurs. docplayer.net/30029960-Sae-j-sae-j684.html