Does Your Flash Distance Really Matter? | Take and Make Great Photography with Gavin Hoey

[@csc-photo]

Gavin Hoey vid = instantly watch 🙂👏🏻

[@surajitchoudhury7946]

You never miss the phrase, "Let's get a light set, let's get a model in, let's get shooting". Wonderfully explained the concept. And I guess, you already explained this theory in one of your live sessions- hard and soft shadow on still objects.

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks for the kind words. Still life or real person, hard and soft light is the same. It's all about relative size of the light to the subject.

[@charleyl264]

Possibly, when further away, your light is reflecting more off the white walls and ceiling, and not being absorbed as much by the black backdrop. A great demo, even if the result was not as predictable as expected. I have run into this in my white studio when I'm using a black backdrop and move the lights too far back. At least I'm not the only one to experience this. Thanks.

[@jaad7562]

First of all, the light should go higher as you move it away (the nose shadow would look much better), then you should increase the size of the modifier so it stays the same in relation to the model. And yes, of course, typically the IGBT controlled strobe flash temperature will be warmer as you increase the power, because the IGBT circuit cuts the "red tail" of the flash spectrum in lower settings (xenon flash at full power outputs more blues in the beginning of the flash duration and more reds at the end, and when you decrease the power the transistor gate just shortens the flash duration more and more).

[@GavinHoey]

While you might be correct you rather missed the whole point of the video. It's not about changing your set-up to compensate for the distance but understanding what happens when you DON'T change your set-up and move the light. Fun fact... to match the nose shadow angle I had at 2.5 feet my flash would have to be 28 feet high at a distance of 20 feet 😲

[@Spawn666949]

Great stuff! I'd like to see the same thing outdoors that way there's no chance of light bouncing around room.

[@jerold1216]

A very good demonstration of how light changes as you move further from the subject. I was noticing the warmer colour during the video. I completely forgot that FlashPoint flashes have a slight colour shift when you change the power level. It is a good thing to remember to pull out the colour checker if is critical when changing lights around.

[@shootNbreezeIRL]

Always a pleasure to tune into Gavin's videos

[@sutashiku]

Thank you, Gavin, for your work! Each film is extremely useful.

[@BrentODell]

Gavin's shots always look SO good, it's amazing. That's not even the 'Pro' Olympus lens, but the budget model... doesn't even matter, he's a master.

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Brent. Pro lenses are lovely but they don't take pro photos... that's the photographers job 😉

[@jer3006]

I've heard a lot about this but now you have shown the differences step-by-step. Very helpful to see 2x the distance for each shot while a pro points out the changes in the resulting shot. The catch lights decreasing were amazing. Thank you. ⭐x5

[@250GTOAJ]

Another great demo Thanks Gavin, Sophie and Sam 👍😀🇨🇦

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Alan 👍

[@davirosa]

Hey Gavin, I find that there is a trade off - when you palace a SB this size that close, and I Will make my point later. First things First, Its a brilliant comparison and didactic video, thank you. Im a painter aside of photographer, so, Im quite interested in the light rendering to persue the best 3D Reading of the volum I can. So, in Broad terms, there are 3 main aspects of shading (rendering) the form, diffused color, shadows and specular highlights. The more defined they are, the more easy tô read the 3D shape. So, the First shot, Its so close that the specular highlights are so big, that they almost take all places where the diffused could happen. The next step, you get a clear definition of which is which. Maybe the closer one diserves a smaller SB.. Anyway, I just mention It cause there is this small thing to consider. Cheers from Brazil!!

[@saskelee]

Is this a new studio? Could you tell me the square footage for it? Explain that tethering set up. Are you shooing directly to the iPad? Which iPad is it and is it the Lightroom mobile app that you’re using?

[@philsheath]

I ain’t even seen this video yet, save that for later..hit the like button though simply coz it’s Gavin Hoey..the master.

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Phil. Enjoy the video when you get to watch it smile.

[@patrickphotos]

When the light was close to the model it was in a position higher than the model. As the light moved further back it needs to be raised to give the same shadows across the nose to match the first set up. You can see in the later pictures that the nose shadow is parallel to the nose losing that "Rembrandt" look. Would be interesting to see the results with the light being also raised to the correct matching height.

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Patrick. A whole chunk of video about the nose shadow got cut from this video, partly for time and partly because I wanted to stick to distance not height. Like many small home studios I have limited ceiling height (8 feet) and as you can see at 5:01 I was at the maximum height. I had a nice little graphic to illustrate nose shadow that showed to maintain the same shadow angle I had at 2.5 feet distance, by 20 feet my light would have to be 28 feet high 😲

[@patrickphotos]

@@GavinHoey Thanks for taking the time to reply. Appreciate that the video is aimed at the small home studio but I do think that missing the lesson in the laws of physics was a real shame.

[@giannitherock]

Brilliant, as always. However, there is another distance to care of and it is the distance between the model and the wall. In this setting, the model was close to the wall, so that when the light was close too, the contrast is maxim. When the light is far, the contrast is low.

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Gianni. The effect of the wall opposite the light isn't just about it's distance from Sophie, it's also about it's relative position from the flash (its ratio). With the light close to Sophie, the wall is relatively far away and bounces relatively little light (lots of shadow). As the flash moves away from Sophie, the ration of light bounced from the wall increases (less shadow)... and that's the point my brain shuts down and I move the flash back to where it should be 🤯

[@GustavoSantanna]

Hey Galvin I really love yours videos, it's help me a lot. I would like see a video with the difference distance of the light, but in a outside, where there is no bouncing light. I really would love see it.

[@EdwardKilner]

The partially black wall had more of an effect than I would have guessed. Then again, you were steadily increasing power. A change of ISO instead might have partially mitigated that, although not entirely. Valuable demonstration, so thank you!

[@photosvein]

The light hitting her was the same amount. To keep the exposure the same, flash needed to be more powerful. If iso went up, so etching else had to go down to keep the same exposure. The exposure on all pictures are the same, but because of inverse square law the light bounces and reflects more.

[@420sigmapower]

It is a nice demo you gave here. But putting the modifier very close gives too bright highlights. so i kind of disagree with putting the softbox close. It all depends on how bright your highlights should be. And how big the softbox is. Of course putting it 3 meter away it will look horrific. But 50cm or 75cm or 100cm all give a different contrast and can still look acceptable with a medium softbox. I was doing a similar test with my 165cm umbrella (i saw your big umbrella video and just had to buy one). too close was not very pleasing, and put it a bit further looked more pleasing. I thought to put it close before, now i pay attention to what the photo looks like and adjust contrast by moving the light further away. Thanks for the video. By the way, if the model can touch the softbox with her arm usually look pretty good as a starting point, have you ever tried that?

[@glbutler1]

I'm also interested with what you're using to tether your Olympus camera to the tablet, can you provide any details?

[@photosvein]

The orange cable is an TetherTools usb cable

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Gregory. I use Tether Tools USB cables (link in the video description) to connect my Olympus E-M1 mkiii to my Lenovo Miix Tablet PC. It runs Windows 10 so for I use Olympus Capture software to connect the camera and laptop and Olympus Workspace software to display the full screen images as they import.

[@peterpeterson7784]

Funny I keep having the same conversation with my photographers that are photographing sports teams and individuals. Use two lights one on each side of the camera and get them as close to the subject as you can without having to Photoshop them out. You will get a nicer quality of light, use less battery power, faster recycle, and create two beautiful catchlights in each eye. And the other thing is you know have a nice zone between the flash units to move the camera around. Great video.

[@fotogmike5887]

You can add to your theory that some of the light would have hit the ceiling and bounced down as well since the light beam wouldn't just spread in the X-Y plane, and that would affect how the shadows look (unless you have a black ceiling). And while this new Sophie is also quite beautiful, some long time viewers will miss "our" Sophie, whom you've been photographing for so long. Thanks for another great video!

[@kimcockitt2564]

This has just answered a problem and now understand why the background changes, need to go back to looking at the inverse square law again! Thank you.

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Kim. I'm glad to have been of help. Here's a link to my recent inverse square law (light fall off) video kzbin.info/www/bejne/rmLOnoisrdKHjNk

[@kimcockitt2564]

@@GavinHoey thank you, I watched it as you mentioned it, again, this helps so so much, I can’t tell you! What it highlighted was that despite getting the light fall off, you diagram showed how it dispersed. Which, I never really clicked! Have you got any snoot videos?

[@GavinHoey]

@@kimcockitt2564 Try this one Kim kzbin.info/www/bejne/aHilYpVrjs2Abpo or this one for a more DIY approach kzbin.info/www/bejne/jYCvooWMp9GCi5I

[@kimcockitt2564]

@@GavinHoey thank you so much, I’m going to experiment with tubes and different length for sure.

[@FrankP83]

a true professor…thanks Gavin 🤗

[@andrewsharpe2587]

Excellent presentation, as usual. I was kinda hoping (as I mentioned on your twitter feed) to see Grover saying "Near...FAR!...Near...FAR!"

[@DelonYeoh]

is there a soft filter applied to the lens or is it in the post production effects? I can notice color look up was applied in the post production

[@ScoTreVan]

Great video as always Gavin, always appreciate your delivery and explanations, thanks

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Trevor 👍

[@alun7006]

Good stuff, Gavin. This kind of thing bears reinforcing regularly. The bit about shadow fill from bounced light is especially useful! I frequently run into this when shooting in models' homes.

[@photosvein]

If you don't want it, get a flag 👍

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Alun. Thanks for the kind words, it's always helpful to circle back to the basics and remind yourself why something is your instinctive "go to"

[@photosvein]

Good inverse square law in practice. The bigger the light is in relation to the model the softer the light. But there is also a point of no return, if the light gets too close, the light gets very harsh no matter what you do.

[@dunnymonster]

Another excellent demo Gavin! 😃

[@volkerotten4127]

Hello Gavin Thank you for another great video from you. I am always learn a lot from your tutorials. I absolutely agree that the pictures with the main light close to the model look much better. In case I want to lighten the shadows a little and use a second light for this, should this second light be just as close to the model or should it be further away to get more diffuse light to brighten up the shadows? What would you recommend?

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Volcker. The placement of the second "fill" light follows the same principles as the main " key" light. So closer MIGHT be better if you want a soft fill light, but if you want more of a separation light (thinner, harder light on the shadow side) a more distant position might be best. As always, it's all a matter of personal taste.

[@rtyler1869]

Flash distance is dependent on the look you want to achieve and the shadows you want to have. Increasing the amount of power will compensate for distance, but cause the light to wrap around the subject and kill the amount of shadows achieved

[@GavinHoey]

Reverse your first statement... The look you want to achieve and the shadows you want to have is dependant on (amongst other things) the flash distance. You control the light, don't let the light control you. I could bang on about why the power of light won't effect how it "wraps" but that sounds like a future video idea. Thank you 👍

[@photosvein]

@@GavinHoey I agree. The power does not effect the wrapping, only distance and size of the light does as far as I know

[@Sportserjeff]

Great info as usual Gavin but Sophie was the star of this video, sorry but her beauty was the star of the show. Keep them coming.

[@GavinHoey]

The model is (quite rightly) ALWAYS the star of the show!

[@Conyne]

Thanks for this tutorial Gavin. Can you give an indication of the monitor or tablet that you are using for the therthering?

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Alex. I'm using my Lenovo Miix 2 in 1 laptop. Now discontinued there are faster and better options such as the Microsoft Surface Pro.

[@Conyne]

@@GavinHoey Thank you for your answer Gavin. That helps me already :)

[@AnVoPhotography]

Brilliant video as always 👍😊

[@mohitthapa2265]

This is about light ratio and shadow density... The closer you place a light to your subject the higher the light ratio and higher the shadow density.. in layman terms the contrast is high when light is closer and contrast is low when the same light is farther away... The ratio of the distance from lit part of the face to the light and the shadow side of the face to the light determines the contrast.. as we move the light farther away the ratio decreases and so does the contrast and shadow density relative to the highlight... Two people standing a 100 km apart will both read f16 on a sunny day, because the ratio is negligible the sun being millions of km away.. the contrast between the two also negligible... The same two people standing only a few feet apart will have noticeable contrast from a light source a few feet away.. Indoors or outdoors the bounced light also changes contrast..

[@photosvein]

Or as most calls it, inverse square law

[@JayNRamos]

Exactly what I wanted to say. I thought no one would point this out....

[@paulbell9957]

Really enjoyed this Gavin, informative, easy to understand and as always, beautfiul images. You make learning fun mate 😊😊

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Paul 👍

[@cessna6535]

Thanks for the video. What is the screen that you are tethered into? It doesn't look like a laptop and as far as I know you can't teacher to a pad. And what software as you using to tether? I use Capture One and would love to be able to put a screen up like you do.

[@GavinHoey]

Well, brace yourself... It's a laptop! Often called 2 in 1 laptop it's a tablet with a detachable type cover (keyboard). Mine is a Lenovo but Microsoft and other make better options then mine. Software is the free tethering software from Olympus called "capture".

[@cessna6535]

@@GavinHoey Do you know if it is powerful enough to support Capture One? Not to edit, just to capture tethered. I have a Dell XPS 13 that is plenty powerful enough to edit in Capture One (and LR and PS), but it was expensive and I don't want to take it into the field. I've been looking for something much less expensive to tether. Thanks for all your videos.

[@MikeJamesMedia]

Thank you, Gavin and Sophie!

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Mike 👍

[@michaelschmitt5413]

Great demonstration and content !!!

[@saeed_kia]

Everytime I learn sth new from this man

[@stelioskritikakis]

Great demo!! Thank you!

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Stelios 👍

[@arieraharja3717]

Thanks Gavin, tomorrow i will try lightning setup Further away from subject. Do you have some sugestion for passport photograpy? I have trouble controling light fall off to forehead with strong shaddow that women wearing veil or like an person wearing hat ( like army hat) my setup 3 lightning with reflector. Thank you.

[@GavinHoey]

Passport photo requirements vary from country to country but generally the lighting has to be flat, boring and safe. So two flashes in softboxes, equally spaced, angled and powered at eye height would be a good place to start.

[@arieraharja3717]

@@GavinHoey thank you, i will try 🙂👍

[@daveh8679]

Great video as always 👍. Were you using the equivalent of an AD400pro that has a colour safe mode? If so that would have resolved Kelvin difference?

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Dave. I avoided the colour stable mode as it's not something available to everyone. Had I gone down that road the white balance shift from 1/1 to 1/256 power would have been around half what I noted.

[@jaffarbh]

So educational. Thanks Gavin

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Jaafar 👍

[@chrisz_126]

You may want to adjust the angle of the softbox when it is moved away from the subject and also adjust the height of it too. This would also affect the height of the catch light in the eyes and the shadow from the nose.

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Chris. That's very sound advice but unfortunately you might have spotted at 5:01 I was already at the maximum height (8 feet) of my studio 😢

[@tedebaer1]

Thank you! What kind of monitor/tablet are you tethered to?

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Ted. That's my Lenovo Miix tablet PC. Sadly discontinued, there are better (more powerful) options around now such the new Microsoft Surface Pro.

[@tedebaer1]

@@GavinHoey thank you!

[@estetubo]

Hi Gavin, well done as usual! Your videos are excellent, easy to follow and the topics are excellent. I noticed you were using a tablet on a light standing connected with the typical cable. Could you please tell me what tablet you used and the software to be able to exam the pictures on the tablet? Thank you 😊

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Alejandro. The tablet is a Lenovo Miix which runs Windows 10 and I uses the free software from Olympus (Capture and Workspace) to do tethering.

[@estetubo]

@@GavinHoey thank you so much

[@stuarttatlock8217]

Nice video with simple explanations, keep them coming. 😀👍

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Stuart, will do 👍

[@alanplummer2248]

What are your thoughts on fill lights? I’ve seen setups that use two lights (one close (main), & one further back ( not on same axis though as a fill with lesser power)). It seems where this would maybe utilize both the properties demonstrated in this video in a more complex lighting setup. Am I correct?

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Alan. Fill lights, or hair lights, or separation lights are a big part of my work. To keep this video and test simple I avoided using one but you look back at many of my videos to see one in actio. Lots of extra info here kzbin.info/www/bejne/m4OQm5mtidt-hJo

[@flysandman]

I am sure that once again I am in the minority but.... I think that your third setup (~10 ft.) would be my favorite "if" the background were much darker or anything but white..... If I had a studio I would certainly try it.

[@GavinHoey]

So here's some good news... You're absolutely right, the 3rd set-up (10 feet) is the best for YOU. Others may disagree but if you like it, everyone else (including me) is wrong 😉

[@chazM6116]

if you move further away you need a bigger softbox to stop the hard shadows and gain the smaller light fall off

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Chaz. At 20' you'd would need a HUGE softbox to match the softness of the shadows at 2.5' but the size of the light won't effect fall off. That's a property of sauce to subject distance 😉

[@chazM6116]

@@GavinHoey yes I understand that, I was just saying larger would help a lot, depending how far you moved.

[@METAL4K-UK]

When I put my octobox as close as possible I end up with with massive catch lights. I mean really too big. Can this be avoided?

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Metal 4K. You can change the size of the catch light in several ways. Obviously you can move the light but as this video shows, that's not necessarily a smart move. There's post processing if you're handy with Photoshop and have the time to do it well. Then there's using a smaller softbox, covering part of the softbox with black fabric, feathering the softbox, changing the position of the softbox... lots of options, all with trade offs but that's the joy/frustration of photography 😉

[@pattymattes7124]

Another great video! I imagine if you stretched out your black on the wall etc. the shadows would be darker.

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Patty, thanks for the comment. You're right, a black background is a great way to hide shadows 👍

[@Renichi2609]

Great video and great test, very clear in the inverse square law.

[@martynphillips6646]

Excellent

[@brad_in_yyc]

Great demo Gavin! Super informative! Interesting to see how that worked. Maybe a way to negate that white walls bounce is shoot outside in the shade?

[@GavinHoey]

If you have suitable weather Brad, that would avoid that problem 👍

[@brad_in_yyc]

@@GavinHoey Being in the UK "suitable" weather (mainly without rain) is few and far between 😜

[@loihpatli]

Hello, Gavin! Could you make a video about proper working with smoke machine? I mean, right angles, right amounts, righ combination with speedlites, etc. Thanks

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Mati. I have lots of videos on the subject of smoke and I'm sure I'll make more in the future. If you missed it, this one is packed full of answers kzbin.info/www/bejne/bF60anuMr998eZY

[@ChoicesHabitsAttitudeLuck]

How about the size of the softbox?

[@GavinHoey]

The size of the light modifier is a whole other video! Here's a link to a much younger me covering that subject kzbin.info/www/bejne/l17VcqGui71soac I should probably update it!

[@ChoicesHabitsAttitudeLuck]

@@GavinHoey OMG Gavin Replied to me❤

[@jenniferknox1599]

Thank you!

[@rockxie6710]

I repeat this video. Great !

[@GaffMultimedia1]

great light tutorial

[@Jackbrsp]

Nice video Gavin! You mentioned the light bouncing of the white walls and filling up the shadows... What if this test was taken on a dark space? Let's say in a very big storage or outdoors at night? That would be a nice add to this study!

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Paulo. Light bounces off objects, so if there's no objects, there's no bounce. A video with inside vs outside would be useful 😉

[@GustavoSantanna]

@@GavinHoey I really would like see a video like this one, but outside, where there is no bouncing light.

[@marcinmrzyglocki]

A useful thing would be translating units to cover a wider range of viewers - I have no idea, at what distance the flash was standing in each step. A different temperature of the light between close and far shots might have been caused by the ceiling or floor - there was enough distance for the light to add for example a green tint from the floor tiles, if they had such a color.

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Marcin. I guess you could Google feet to meters but if it helps, 2.5 feet is near enough 75 centimetres so... 2.5 feet = 0.75 meters 5 feet = 1.5 meters 10 feet = 3 meters 20 feet = 6 meters You're right about coloured walls or floors influencing the white balance but as I mention at 6:53 in this case the effect is mostly down to the power of the flash. Most flash manufactures will list the white balance of there flashes with a +/- xxxk as a guide to expected colour shifts.

[@maithamalaboodi8230]

Very informative 😍

[@tomlynn1000]

Do you do magic performances part time?

[@adrianwilliams763]

Brilliant explanation of the inverse law.

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Adrian. Not just the inverse square law, also hard & soft light AND flash white balance vs power 👍

[@haiderhusain9964]

good presentation

[@kirstyhepworth7343]

great video Gavin

[@GavinHoey]

Thanks Kirsty 👍

[@kirstyhepworth7343]

@@GavinHoey your welcome Gavin

[@Neopulse00]

4:00 - Ok, I admit that is pretty scary how you nailed for the 2nd time in a row an f/2.0 readout on your light meter. Then when you did it again at 5:15 I think you're not human to pull that off so casually.

[@Cotictimmy]

I'm thinking little bits of tape placed on the floor for the double distances. ;-)

[@GavinHoey]

I'm 100% a human 😁 I'm also fairly clued up on the properties of light, so I expecting a shift from f/4.0 to f/2.0 every time I doubled the light distance.

[@GavinHoey]

@@Cotictimmy Tape on the floor... why didn't I do that!

[@markstanley-adams4594]

That's the beauty of the inverse square law.. these changes become entirely predictable. Similarly, if the flash-to-subject distanced is halved, it's a gain of 2 stops. :)

[@dnyanodayphotosupekar1702]

I am waiting your videos🎥

[@leotomma3494]

That's the fun part of photography, always experimenting, trying to get what you want

[@aseancat]

how to see iTTL off-camera flash exposures on EVF?

[@GavinHoey]

You can't preview a flash until you take a photo. So with TTL flash (where you're not using a flash meter) all you can do is take a test shot, review and then fine tune the flash exposure compensation to taste.

[@HenryJuliao]

I'm interested in that tethering setup.

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Henry. Which bit can I help you with?

[@HenryJuliao]

@@GavinHoey Thank you. Are you tethering to an android tablet or windows PC? How are you mounting it on the light stand?

[@GavinHoey]

@@HenryJuliao Hi Henry, great questions. The mount is a Tether Tools AeroTab (link in the video description) and the tablet is a Lenovo Miix Windows PC. Technically it's 2 in 1 laptop, a bit like a Microsoft Surface Pro but less powerful, less expensive and (sadly) no longer in production.

[@지나가는나그네3306]

Is the tethering device an iPad?

[@1BigBucks1]

So closer was better all along 👍

[@GavinHoey]

Perhaps I should have just gone with that as the title 😉

[@eszterszabo6640]

❤

[@BostonClipper]

The shadows lighten further away because of the additional bounce off the white ceiling.

[@GavinHoey]

I'm sure that played a part but with Sophie pushed into a corner and the sloped design of the ceiling (a long way out of shot) it probably wasn't as much of a factor as it might have been elsewhere.

[@boblillard51]

Hey Gavin, what tripod were you using in this video? thx

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Bob. For the past few years my go to tripod is a Benro carbon fibre model.

[@manoharmgr8235]

SUPER. SUPER , THE BEST நன்றாக இருக்கிறது வாழ்த்துக்கள் R.MANOHAR-CHENNAI

[@heyokaikaggen6288]

Is it me or has Gavin's 'small home studio' got slightly less small of late?

[@GavinHoey]

Actually it's now smaller (was 13'x25' now 15'x17') but with extra storage and a separate office, I can now use and show most of the space 🙂

[@justcallmesando]

Someone is way thinner!