Drinker's Chasers - Avatar 2 Breaks $1.5 Billion

Somehow, Avatar 2 is shaping up to be one of the biggest movies of all time. Join us as we try to figure out how and why.

[@tdcdog77]

I think you all are underestimating the craving for the common moviegoer for a low stakes, easy entry beautiful film. Many people couldn’t care less about stories and consistency

[@bigboi5545]

Honestly this. Avatar 2 is the kind of movie my parents have been yearning for, and it was certainly a wonderful experience at the cinema with them.

[@bagggers9796]

idk if that's a good thing

[@bigboi5545]

@@bagggers9796 That's a discussion for another day. Regardless, its unchallenging simplicity is a likely reason for its success.

[@ruiscomps1553]

This! Not everything has to be a flawlessly written masterpiece. It’s nice to switch your brain off sometimes and enjoy nice visuals with entertaining action scenes

[@Dustin.Smiley]

Same reason people keep going back to Taco Bell and McDonald’s despite the quality

[@paranoyd70]

I think that there is one major factor that keeps getting overlooked that helps explain why this movie is doing so well...and that is that Avatar 2 is a movie that most parents feel they can take their kids to watch. Its colorful, its magical (fantasy), it features a ton of nature, and it will be a spectacle for the kids. When you consider that the market for kids movies are so terrible then its easy to understand why parents are talking their kids to see Avatar 2, driving up its profits.

[@gianalfredo]

Yep! Specially in the holiday/vacation season. Entire families watching instead of a couple or a solo visitor. I bet this was given as q Christmas present for many families. Like, “uncle McCallister is taking us to watch avatar.”

[@johnbanks4761]

shiny keys jangling in front of babies.......basically what it is ..far too many people who are mindless when it comes to films ..thats why it is making money

[@KABLAMMATS]

@@johnbanks4761 it just a fun family films

[@bikramarora1819]

@@johnbanks4761wow man you’re so cool 😂

[@bradsmovies]

Well said - what other "family" movies were really about family last year?

[@ballswan]

I think it's just a very palatable movie. The plot is safe and hits on deeply relatable themes of family and not fitting in. The visuals are obviously gorgeous and at times stunning. It's family safe without being boring for adults. The alien setting translates super well internationally, as there are no local cultural elements that get lost in translation.

[@jaredpoon5869]

That's the thing, right? Yes, it does have some very obvious environmental and anti-human sentiments, but it also hits on those simplistic family story that people really like. I think a lot of people can relate to the idea of not fitting in or having to make difficult decisions for the family. That's what appeals to people, and if that core story is there, I think people who are hyper critical of everything in movies can miss these simple values.

[@cane6074]

@@jaredpoon5869 Its a James Cameron film, his films have always had a rather dim view of humanity, so no surprise there.

[@polarfroge]

It had no measurable creativity that couldn’t be directly inserted into A1. Boredom Incarnate. If this is the future of cinema, I’m grateful i got to grow up before this soulless filmmaking defined by its bourgeois activist themes & tiresomely amateurish screenwriting. Favreau & Filloni are the antidote to Cameronesque-Insanity, thankfully. No pressure on them.

[@judgebruceschroeder3118]

@@polarfroge are Favreau hitting Cameron numbers though? So far Cameron wins everytime he is on the directors chair . He filmed Terminator on a shitty budget and made it really really profitable ever since then everyone wants his sack.

[@Saeronor]

@@judgebruceschroeder3118 In terms of absolute numbers, actual money or ROI? Cause he first one is relevant only to gawking journos, the second one to people who financed it, the third one to the former and to those who might finance future projects. A2 is not _equally_ impressive on all three fronts. The way international BO works is indicative of it on its own.

[@PortfolioPL]

Avatar 2 is popular cause it let people immerse themselves in a new world that does not look depressing. Plus it has universal values like the importance of family, the role of mother and father. It appeals to the whole family as everyone can find someone they like and cheer for, etc.

[@ojetolataiwo]

This is it... Absolutely spot on

[@kylemountford8572]

Love it or hate it, I'll take a film made by one man's creative vision and passion over the soulless assembly line of superhero movies and live action remakes made by Disney

[@christianmedina6343]

Not when that man's vision is cucked and his passion is soy-pilled

[@Davidsworldtravels]

Exactly

[@user-xl2qx3qv3c]

For me Avatar 2 is just the same but with good visuals. Ngl

[@LukeLovesRose]

YES. THANK YOU

[@BatPierrot]

Basically the reason I bought my tickets despite hating the first one

[@MattDawgGaming]

It's important to recognize that it's got appeal internationally, this is big in EVERY country. You can have a movie that's really popular domestically like Top Gun, but to have close to that level of appeal in EVERY country... that's hard

[@LukeLovesRose]

My local IMAX screenings are almost consistently sold out on Friday and Saturday

[@Wrahns]

Exactly and also way more demographics such as teen girls etc etc... I'm not surprised it has appeal to more types of people.

[@YouTubecanbitemyhairybanger]

@@LukeLovesRose yeah because a studio has never faked numbers before.... Like with captain marvel

[@LukeLovesRose]

@@KZbincanbitemyhairybanger Hey, I'm the first person to admit that Disney likes to hike up the numbers and commit all other kinds of fraud to get audiences interested. But this is James Cameron. Not a cheap Marvel movie

[@ninjaskeleton6140]

I think Top Gun Maverick made the most money per capita in Australia

[@shiroryu]

To say that Avatar 2 is just pretty is understating what you see on screen. It is, as far as I can think of, the only Hollywood Movie that is showing a completely original, new World that you can experience for the first time. Almost all Movies today take place in worlds we already know so so well. The Star Wars Universe, Middle Earth, the MCU, the countless Reboots and Spinoffs, etc. What makes Avatar 2 so well perceived is the visual experience of something completely new and unkown. Probably or maybe especially because we get so few original Movies these Days that are also Blockbusters..

[@Will-ie3xb]

Didn't Cameron literally take a sub to the bottom of the ocean for visual inspiration?

[@shiroryu]

@@Will-ie3xb Yes he did

[@junglemoose2164]

It isn’t all that original. The creatures from the first one are boring. I couldn’t believe Jimmy spent all that money to have stupid-looking animals that are uninspired mashups of well-known real animals. That was the most disappointing aspect of the first film. The story was dumb and the characters were bad but the boring animals? That was the worst.

[@landonmathews6111]

Honestly, as a guy who went in super skeptical and someone who was not a fan of the first movie, I thought Avatar 2 was pretty good. Definitely not a masterpiece, but it had some solid action scenes and wasn’t afraid to make an Uber-masculine father figure as the main character. A win in my book

[@FMJIRISH]

Hell, there are multiple masculine men that aren't portrayed as weak or stupid.

[@themollymachine]

That's good. I'm sick of bitch ass men who cry and follow a 120lb woman . Lol

[@Will-ie3xb]

But they're aliens right? Lol. I haven't seen it yet, but I'm guessing they still make all the White characters evil or incompetent.

[@Drimil3]

@@Will-ie3xb Nah

[@samwallaceart288]

Yeah I agree; Quaritch was pretty interesting

[@elitronprime7322]

This is more of a win for Cameron than Disney

[@asian_duck8208]

@Son Vegeta sounds like a you problem

[@tjsignature5612]

Disney exes, board of directors, people behind disney curtain should be licking jim cameron's feet for saving their ass from embaressment that was 2022.

[@rohhhann]

If Avatar flopped I’m sure It would be an L for Disney instead

[@1kbmahan]

@@outcast8053sounds like a broke issue in all honesty

[@zmeura1]

What fortune? In my town was very cheap, like 5 euros, or 6 dollars! And of it was more I wouldn't pay for it.

[@millerr9307]

How many times are people going to doubt James Cameron before they finally realize he knows what people want? He offers a massive spectacle unlike anything seen before with a serviceable storyline. That's literally been the case for every one of his movies.

[@flameshana9]

We've been burned pretty badly by cinema and the media in general. With all the endless preaching and checkboxes.

[@Starwarscc33]

@@flameshana9boo hoo

[@phil_5430]

Yeah you're right. The movie has no woke bs and damn: even no poc. I think James Cameron wanted to really play it safe here with *THE MESSAGE*. He absolutely didnt want to piss of the audience (maybe?)

[@LukeLovesRose]

Cameron is the master of 3D cinematography. Obviously audiences want to be absorbed in his stories and characters more than any other filmmaker in Hollywood

[@Saeronor]

@@phil_5430 Well, he took his delusional views to media coverage of the movie, instead. Seems like a preferable way to avoid audience alienation, because it's not like a significant portion of moviegoers cares - or even knows about - what modern journalists regurgitate.

[@ogamiitto5642]

Avatar 2 did something that very (very) few movies nowadays manage to do: When I left the cinema, I was smiling and left it in an uplifted and elated state of mind! Viewed in that perspective, the fact that the story is paper thin is quite irrelevant; for a little over 3 hrs. ones mind is transported to an alien, fascinating (fantasy) world, that lets one forget everyday troubles and sorrows - and all that without any preaching or reminders about social unjustice. Having watched Avatar 2 shortly after Top Gun: Maverick it seems to me, that people like James Cameron (and Tom Cruise) are one of the very few in Hollywood who still remember what the “magic of cinema” was (and is) supposed to be all about. That alone is enough, that I will - all criticisms notwithstanding - watch it again next week.

[@flameshana9]

If people hadn't claimed that the first one was so magical that they were deeply depressed after it was over... I might believe you. But I'm going to stick to being cautious about this one.

[@steffimaier7297]

Loved both of those movies as well. Felt like watching something that was made before 2016.

[@manolgeorgiev9664]

Interesting, when I left the cinema I was scratching my head trying to comprehend what I just saw and thinking about everything the movie did wrong. Guess everyone had their own experience.

[@manolgeorgiev9664]

@@flameshana9 Long story short - Avatar 2 is the same as Avatar 1, but worse. Character building, plot, pacing is all objectively worse, otherwise it's mostly the same.

[@markymarkfive]

When drinker said Avatar 2 can't be the biggest movie of 2022 because it went into 2023, that would mean Maverick is still the second movie of 2022 because spiderman no way home finished it box office run in 2022.

[@peto1986]

Exactly! His whole reasoning is pathetic

[@judgebruceschroeder3118]

Disparu irritated me a lot more in this session. Very very low IQ.

[@vectorbass9679]

I mean its an inoffensive, simple story that is absolutely amazing to watch. The visuals are so stunning its incredible. Why is it so hard to accept that sometimes people want some simple amazing entertainment and not hurt their brain every movie.

[@reezlaw]

Also because utterly convoluted plots tend to fuck up and leave a trail of plot holes, especially recently. Maybe that's what people are tired of

[@I-hate-youtube797]

Because the popular narrative amongst pseudo-intellectual basement dwellers was that Avatar was shit for brain dead normies and if you were a part of the cool kids club you thought it was “gay” and “ Pocahontas in outer space”. And the fact not everyone has accepted this as truth is surprising to them I guess.

[@davoman5781]

Most you tube critics said Avatar 2 and Top Gun 2 were the sequels no one asked for or wanted before they came out. Just shows how much they know!!

[@naheemquattlebaum2267]

I had a few Non-American friends tell me what makes Avatar 2 special to them and a few from Southeast Asia have said other than how it out looks, it's themes of family drew in a lot of people, which they feel is rare for modern blockbusters.

[@deadeyedmillennialmedia]

It's lovely to see that the Cameron cycle, in which media claims this is the end of the man only to watch him steamroll everything, is still playing out in the year of our Zord, 2023.

[@tymoteuszbryx249]

It’s success is due to two things: 1) wonderful visuals 2) a simple, yes super predictable, but not WOKE story. It’s story of a father and mother whom love their children and who wants to protect them. It’s just a family drama in space. And it works, because we haven’t had any normal movie in like few years…?

[@baraodascolinas979]

The film has themes of colonialism, Noble Savage, anticapitalism, and pro-environment If you just stop to think. It has a message, it Just has the ability to interwove the message with the art, show do Not tell, instead of the others that just tell. But it has a message and vision, it is not just a family drama.

[@tymoteuszbryx249]

@@baraodascolinas979 no, it doesn’t

[@baraodascolinas979]

@@tymoteuszbryx249 if you close your eyes enough, i suppose it can pass over your head, in the same way X-men can pass over peoples's heads as a metaphor for racism, discrimination and social persecution, but it is stll there, interwoven with the visual spectacle and the characters.

[@tymoteuszbryx249]

@@baraodascolinas979 not really, but thanks for being polite 😉

[@baraodascolinas979]

@@tymoteuszbryx249 Xmen was inspired by the black movement of the 60s, just search it. Avatar 1&2 : An advanced culture invades a more primitive one {colonialism, imperialism, iraq war}, to explore a resource {capitalism, corporatism} , with complete disregard for the local population {genocide} and Nature {environmentalism}. The locals are shown as sympathetic and lovable, because of the humanisation, the invaders are shown as vilains, merciless and without families to be seen, and the Native cause is the correct and moral one, as shown by the film. The characters are both inserted in and shape This social structure. Again, it has a vision, a message, etc, and a very progressivist one. But it uses show do not tell. IF it was Marvel, some navi would be exposing This in some dialogue.

[@bucknutz9290]

Just acknowledge it... people like the world of Avatar!

[@dimitryanyanwu7681]

Ikr these people don't even use their brains 🤣🤣

[@nicholashylton6857]

Perhaps it's because we're in our own little sci-fi/comic book bubble and don't realize that there's a larger world of casual viewers who simply want an escape?

[@deathbb703]

I think it's the difference between people that went into the movie wanting to shit on it and those that were open minded when they went in.

[@Harry.117]

Avatar is still running strong in India too, a lot of families were there too.

[@prohacvice9671]

I agree with many of the top comments. It's a movie. It's not that big of a deal. These guys' incredulous attitude points to a lack of understanding or just condescension. Yes things that you don't particularly enjoy can make tons of money and no the people who can enjoy Avatar 2 are not dummies or philistines or whatever.

[@benjaminrockhill8356]

You can just feel the hate radiating off of Disparu

[@zzygyy]

Yup. Some people can't handle being wrong.

[@benjaminrockhill8356]

@@zzygyy It’s honestly cringy the way he just waits to say something negative about it.

[@jdogg448]

Yeah, I like these guys but I don't believe this narrative that it needs to make 2 billion to break even. That sounds ridiculous and I'm not sure it's ever really been sourced.

[@phlynx68]

@@jdogg448 you can google Avatar 2s budget, it needs 850millionish after adding in marketing cost. budget was about 450 million

[@neilvannatta2520]

The "tranquil" "boring to some people" parts are the exact parts that make people come back over and over. So it really is just a difference in what people find enjoyable.

[@theanonymousnomad]

Fine, I'll just say it: Avatar 2 is a fun movie that I would be happy to watch again.

[@benjaminrockhill8356]

You aren’t allowed to say that here lol

[@Lonovavir]

That counts, it beats watching more MCU phase 4 spam.

[@ytskt]

I loved this movie. Watched it twice... Most decent movie is difficult to watch for the second time for me (most MCU movies are difficult to even once), however Avatar 2 held up pretty well.

[@judgebruceschroeder3118]

I love how Mauler requested a poll to be made. And you can tell they weren’t getting the feedback they wanted xD.

[@manolgeorgiev9664]

@@ytskt Avatar 1 was better though

[@leannerose6181]

I loved seeing siblings,a family dynamic. Growing up w several sisters,I could tell that the writers had siblings as well ❤️

[@johncra8982]

Yeah Cameron isn't getting enough credit for how great the sully kids ended up being, especially Kiri and loak considering so much of their time in the film is them being moody, feeling like outcasts, and making mistakes as a result. They did a great job actually showing you how much they all love and care for each other despite the constant sibling quarreling, and this is their first movie in which they've even shown up together. Such a great cast that's so easy to care about 👏

[@steffimaier7297]

Same here. Grew up in a similar family (two older brothers and a younger sister), which made me happy to see. And the kids were written like kids and not like meanspirited obnoxious mini-adults. And like how the dad wasn't portrayed as as a goofy idiot.

[@AmigaWolf]

I also had them, but they were absolutely not as annoying as the kids in Avatar 2, and they were making most of the trouble in the hole movie, they never listen, and dad/mom is the one who have to fix there dumb stuff, because they simply do not want to listen. And i did not understand that he (Jake) literally said, my family is more impotent then my clan and there family's, he was the leader of that clan, and that he did not go somewhere were there were no other Na'vi, no he went to another Na'vi clan, and put them in great danger. I likes Avatar (2009) a lot more.

[@TheEffectOfMass]

I could tell the writers were parents too. I told my wife after the movie: "Avatar 1 made me want to be a hero like Jake Sully. Avatar 2 made me want to be a better dad."

[@steffimaier7297]

@@TheEffectOfMass Which is why I find it weird when people call Avatar "woke" and ignore that part, while praising actual woke movies. Example: Ghostbusters Afterlife showed the typical broken family (with a crappy single mom) with arrogant kids (that don't act like kids) we see a lot these days, and portrayed the (grand)dad as a crazy deadbeat. The movie had the ultimate lazy writing (full of plotholes) by basically rewriting GB 01 and bombarding the viewers with empty nostalgia. The Drinker praised that movie. Avatar (and Top Gun) is a passion project that isn't based on existing franchises, doesn't talk down to the audience, has amazing world building and showcase male characters in a positive way. Drinker belittles the movie, picks it appart and wonders why it is so successful.

[@richardcahill1234]

This video is 15 minutes of saying we're out of touch without saying we're out of touch, especially Mauler. Rewatches are highly overrated, the overwhelming majority of people do not rewatch movies, especially at the cinema. Appealing to a vast spread of an audience is far better than appealing to a much smaller base of fanboys who will rewatch it.

[@maiasdad]

One thing I got from this convo is that Disparu doesn’t know what he’s talking about most of the time

[@mrmystery9965]

Clearly a lot of people were not bored and actually enjoyed the experience. Possibly not as bad as you think? Maybe that’s something to consider?

[@heliopyre]

you know how many people eat McDonalds every day?

[@hrvojebutkovic]

@@heliopyre Because it's the best food around that they are willing to pay premium money for?

[@randomly_random_0]

@@heliopyre because McDonald's have some of the best tasting burgers, fries, chicken?

[@mrmystery9965]

@@heliopyre wtf 🤣

[@bastadimasta]

A lot of people watched Star Wars sequel trilogy, the Matrix Resurrections and recent Marvel movies too. The success of the original usually reflects into financial success the sequels. However, once the illusion is broken for people, there is no return back. Terminator, Star Wars, Marvel, Disney are all dead. Speaking for Avatar, I don't expect to pay more money to watch some blue aliens calling each other Cuz and Bro.

[@RationalOrc]

The Avatar series is how America wins a cultural victory in Sid Meier's Civilization. It's so flashy that most countries couldn't even imagine such things being possible.

[@CabezasDePescado]

?

[@reezlaw]

What?

[@Wolfenstein69924]

I was surprised how emotional the story was. A lot deeper than the first one. I came close to crying and I could hear other people sniffling 😢

[@Will-ie3xb]

But was the visual experience as interesting as the first one?

[@johncra8982]

the kids rescuing their parents from the ship, the funeral, and the spirit tree scene at the very end with Jake going "I *see* now" as the music swells all had people crying throughout my imax screenings, all of which were packed so you could hear a lot of people sniffling.

[@Wolfenstein69924]

@@Will-ie3xb better than the first. Everything was even more well polished.

[@big_grub]

Avatar is the perfect example about how online discourse/twitter really means nothing to “real” life

[@darthgroot9130]

Don’t, it’s a scam!

[@somerandomcommenter5823]

If Cameron was trying to hide his fetish for guns in movies with Avatar 2, he totally failed. That scene at the beginning in the forest where the kids make contact with the Avatar soldiers and one of the latter fires with that Hydra gun got everyone's attention. Cameron is too good at this, using guns that look realistic and that raise our heartrates with fear... remember the gun sentries in Aliens? I mean I remember going like WOW.

[@stevenesbitt3528]

The sound got me, every time Jake shot anything it sounded immense.

[@Afineaddition]

Cameron rocks at creating fictional militaries. I know he "hates guns" but he does a terrible job of backing that statement up haha

[@shitmandood]

That’s not enough to get me interested in it.

[@davidmclean357]

yeah with aliens Cameron single handedly killed the credibility of laser pistols in sci-fi. You can draw a line between pre aliens and post aliens in how future guns went from zap guns to future firearm that act suspiciously like something we might actually use in a few decades

[@johncra8982]

Yeah literally that scene in the forest alone has better gun action than anything new I've watched in ages. Thank God I'm not some millennial/genXer with a sunglasses-in-carseat profile picture that spends all day looking for articles and headlines to bitch and moan about in some endless effort to wake up the bluepilled masses. Choke on your redpills, 90iq tryhards, normal people will watch a great film and have a great experience with their families.

[@ryankornacki9918]

While I admit the story was slow at times, and the dialogue wasn't the best I really latched onto the visuals and the fact that for the first time in forever I saw a functional family dynamic portrayed on the big screen. It's kind of the case that there is so much garbage out there that the old mediocre is now the new good/great.

[@marinawolf]

Good point!

[@MALICEM12]

This standards are so low that what was basic or mediocre at best in the 90's is groundbreaking now

[@Lonovavir]

"Success" via lowered standards, what a world we live in.

[@serenityinside1]

Indeed. 😔

[@TheRubberStudiosASMR]

Yeh bro

[@benjaminrockhill8356]

The Drinker always said the critics were disconnected from the audience. Well it looks like he lived long enough to see himself become the villain.

[@judgebruceschroeder3118]

lol right. Usually he is correct but mannnnnn like its not that deep. He really wanted Top Gun to remain the top grossing film of 2022. He, Mauler and Disparu are giving any excuse to not give Cameron his flowers.

[@benjaminrockhill8356]

@@judgebruceschroeder3118 It was released in 2022 so it counts as the highest grossing movie in 2022.

[@judgebruceschroeder3118]

@@benjaminrockhill8356 Correct. But at the start of the video, Drinker said it didnt break Top Gun .

[@benjaminrockhill8356]

@@judgebruceschroeder3118 Yeah that wouldn’t make sense. Why would he think it’s 2023 film. So all the money it made in 2022 doesn’t count? He just can’t acknowledge that it beat top gun? Lol

[@judgebruceschroeder3118]

@@benjaminrockhill8356 Listen to the beginning of the video again. Nobody fact' check him lol I watched the video twice to make sure I properly heard. Also, pay attention to Disparu's illogical analogy " I rather a movie that makes 400m profit than a movie that breaks even, to me thats more impressive" when we all know Avatar 2 has a one hell of an expensive production cost, more than anything ever put out. How is he not impressed by this breaking even? lol

[@murdockfiles9406]

Cope. You embarrassed yourself saying Avatar 2 was slow in the box office.

[@katarinaaguilar1936]

I just really liked to see a film that featured a respected and badass father, it was enough for me to like the movie, despite its obvious plot holes. I’d rewatch it 😊

[@ruiscomps1553]

Same here. As a younger movie viewer I haven’t seen many positive portrayals of fathers in the entertainment I’ve watched so this was really refreshing. It was awesome watching this with my dad as well

[@Bhavyo]

Yep, that was refreshing. It were indeed two fathers. That father from that sea people was pretty much portrayed the same.

[@CynicalOldDwarf]

@@Bhavyo Yes I was just going to say they did the sea people chief really well too, especially how they did the husband-wife dynamic. His wife is really against letting Sully's family in and she pushes it, and you can see the chief respects his wife's opinion but ultimately makes his decision, his wife counter-counter-argues but the chief gives her a subtle look and she accepts that he has made his decision. Best of all she doesn't even storm off to pout, she returns a subtle look of her not liking the decision but bows her head and respects her husband's command. And that is really good example of how you do the power dynamic between a ruling couple, and also a really good example of how to have a non-verbal conversation.

[@CallSign_Alucard]

Agreed

[@aldunlop4622]

There’s probably lots of kids getting their parents to take them.

[@jacobrogers2906]

I think the story was better than a lot of people suggest. I rolled my eyes at times too, but the world building itself and the concepts are quite interesting.

[@TheMonthlyJack]

Yeah, one of those films where you feel like you lived the life of the characters.

[@p5ych0p4th]

Yeah, the World Building is great. The actual story told isn’t that hot. I think Avatar as a Franchise doesn’t have to be the story of the Sully family. Treating as more of an anthology would have been better in my opinion.

[@b.melakail]

The hybrid character is set up for the main theme of this series, consciousness. That is the only point of this movie in the larger narrative

[@jeanpaulchristian3282]

I dont think the story is flawed at all, the pacing is, the storu elements get cut short or the viewer is expected to just understand the character logic on the first go which I thi k many if most people miss some of the logic behind intentions and motivations... Quiddiths story is actually quite nuanced... He came back as a blue alirn and somehow this experience has had of causing him internal cognitive dissonance... I think on repeat watches people realize he isnt just casted as the same meathead as rhe first film,,, the missing plot details between the first and the second film didnt help viewers, but rewatching it you understand the context better before following the character arc wotj a more involved understanding.

[@WreckingWood]

My one eyeroll was the whale and Na'vi having actual conversations. Somehow a harder pill to swallow than bonding brains with connecting tentacles. And my dad, who has limited tolerance for films over 2 hours and past the year 2000, except LOTR, says the plot summary on Wikipedia made it sound thin when it really wasn't.

[@HecmarJayam]

I really don't get the dismissive attitude of people towards that film from almost every one. Especially these guys.

[@bongwaterbojack]

It's a family movie that doesn't overtly shove *the message* down everyone's throat and released during the holidays when families are getting together and looking for something easy to do. My dad and I, who tend to me more critical and really had no interest in it, ended up seeing it because my mom and sister wanted to while I was visiting for Christmas. I wouldn't be surprised to hear similar stories repeated. Then there is the visual aspect. The original was something special just in it's visual presentation. And Like Tyrone said, people love pretty things. I'm sure many would watch it just with the expectation of being blown away again.

[@dennikstandard]

"that doesn't overtly shove the message down everyone's throat" Oh ... doesn't it tho? White colonists redundantly evil, blue natives good and noble, yaya yaya. Women morally superior, yada yada. This movie is for simpletons and simple kids. Also chock full of The Message. Don't let low standards of these last few years cloud your judgement.

[@sarov7658]

Proly cause it was on production before disneys hands were on it and too late wait for next parts

[@arbitragesupreme1461]

Uh.. what? Avatar absolutely has a big message lol. The anti-colonialism message where the Navi seem to do no wrong + the environmental message are woven through out the movie.

[@ingwiafraujaz3126]

@@arbitragesupreme1461 Yeah true, and they even make it seem like "whitey bad", but at least it's not the same as the usual message pushing multiculturalism and "diversity" (anti-whiteness).

[@bongwaterbojack]

@@arbitragesupreme1461 I'm talking relatively. Against the likes of Velma, the MsheU, Rings of Power, Lightyear, and others of that caliber, it's comparatively mild. And while I can't back it up statistically, I would wager "killing whales for profit is bad" is not nearly as polarizing as abortion rights or police reform.

[@KiscosAplsos]

Avatar 1 is such a humongous hit that it can carry it's sequels without breaking sweat. The storyline is simple enough that it can be understood by a lot more people around the world than a regular Hollywood movie. That's is one of it's greatest strength.

[@imanoldurango8213]

For both avatar movies, the international box office makes up 2/3 of its box office pull. International audiences aren’t as picky as Americans

[@KiscosAplsos]

@@imanoldurango8213 Yep and James Cameron figured that out after the success of Titanic

[@matane2465]

It's greatest strength is the audience is stupid.

[@artemlarionov7084]

​@@imanoldurango8213 Or maybe they just have different taste and interests, Top Gun Maverick is also very simple movie with very basic characters and as non-American I don't understand the craze about it. It's good old-fashioned hollywood blockbaster to watch once in boring evening, nothing more. Maybe international audience just can watch and enjoy movie without action-oriented pace etc, so this middle section of Avatar 2 is boring only for american audience.

[@ReformedSauron]

I suppose in a way that's fair. The problem with Avatar movies is that they have a lot of hype when they come out in about a year afterwards and then barely anybody talks about them until the next one comes out. It doesn't stay in memory long. It doesn't really become something that you'll want to watch like a classic years from now.

[@peebothulhu8768]

Why is Avatar 2 so successful? Because it simply is the movie it is meant/portrays itself to be. It doesn't subvert. It doesn't 'Meta'. It doesn't bait and switch. It's beautiful to watch. Easy to understand (Pretty simplistically so) basic movie.

[@peto1986]

Here you go - I've just returned from the cinema from my fifth Avatar screening. And why? Because I love my blue people and Pandora and James Cameron

[@scallywagnation3780]

Seen it twice and want to get at it a third. Keep taking new people to it. With all the crap that we’ve endured the past couple years, I’m happy that something is worth my money in the theatres again.

[@michaelivan9066]

Just saw it yesterday and I must have seen a different movie that wasn’t boring.

[@benjaminrockhill8356]

I think the narrative they have been pushing was Avatar was going to suck. So now that it is actually a good movie they’re stuck.

[@cttommy73]

@Benjamin Rockhill The reason they say the movie is boring is because they paid attention to the plot. I watched the first Avatar movie not in a movie theatre. It was boring as shit. Bland and I totally forgot the movie existed till I checked the list of highest grossing movies.

[@benjaminrockhill8356]

@@cttommy73 I mean the plot of Top gun is ever more boring than that yet they love it. Because it’s about spectacle. If you judge top gun by the plot and dialogue it would be unwatchable

[@chileanyways196]

@@benjaminrockhill8356 exactly

[@diocre7446]

@@cttommy73 Avatar is not a movie for a person who wants to be cool. If you say Avatar is so good with your friends or classmates you are not cool. This movie is not for pretentious people like you. It is a movie for people who doesn't give a fck what other people say. Which is cooler than pretentious you. Be honest to yourself. You only like movies that makes you look cool to others.

[@arhael3594]

I mostly gave up on cinemas from long ago. But I wanted to try out 4d. Avatar IS the movie for that. The point of cinemas is to fully experience high budget movies. This movie screams high budget and high tech with all its essence. It's the movie you want to watch in cinema, even if it is rather weak plot wise.

[@vikidprinciples]

I just watched it for the second time yesterday. On first viewing it was just like as you said, a little lack luster. On the second viewing I was blown away. All the plot points that annoyed me just disappeared and I was transported into Pandora and was totally absorbed. I loved it.

[@peto1986]

Same here. Happened to me also with the first movie. Second time was the best experience!

[@BaazarStudios]

As someone who has been crippled by cynicism for modern film and media, this was a surprisingly good time at the movies. It's ok for you to click off the brain and just enjoy the pretty colors, it's not dishonoring a long standing franchise, subverting expectations or shoving "the agenda" in your face. AND it is competently made and pretty to look at. These days that's enough.

[@bronwynbeistle8317]

In other words, your expectations have been lowered so much by the recent unpleasantness, that anything mildly pleasant looks good.

[@soumyakantigiri]

@@bronwynbeistle8317 Umm, it has to tick a lot of boxes. Not just the story. So mildly pleasant in one category is enough and then 5 stars in all others like the visuals, the repetition of the family theme making it cohesive, the adventurous music, fresh media (relatively new as it has been 13 years). I can never understand people's scoring system sometimes. Its not a novel, Its a movie. The whole rating does not just goes to the plot.

[@SouthernGuy5423]

A lot of people are ignoring that 2, or maybe 3 other Avatar films are already essentially in the can with just post-production left to go on them. Cameron invented brand new technology to make these movies and a lot of his costs were from developing those new techs. The following movies will cost a lot less to make and be just as popular, most likely.

[@auroraSLAP]

@@soumyakantigirithe script IS the movie though. A movie isn’t just acting, visuals, music, etc in isolation. All those other things are in service of the script.

[@soumyakantigiri]

@@auroraSLAP Yes, I am sorry might have come a little strong. But people have to learn to segregate a blockbuster which caters to all people requires a different skill to make. I do not like when people say its easy to make a blockbuster. Many directors who are brilliant at creating good cohesive stories would fail to create a worldwide pleasing blockbuster. And hence, credit should be given where credit's due.

[@olivermcdermidperring5755]

In my opinion, I think it gives people what they need more than anything right now, an escape from the crushing weight of reality tbh.

[@prestigiorebelde]

People are rewatching it because of the second act mostly. It’s escapism for a lot of people of their mundane depressed lives. People just wish they could live there in a paradise next to the ocean. The world building in this movie makes people feel like they are almost there. The story is in service of the spectacle and the world building, and people just wanna go back to pandora again and again in the big screen. Cuz this movie is not meant for small tv screens or smartphones

[@RunyaEithelNar]

I remember the Na'vimania, when people were photoshopping themselves and every famous person into Na'vi. I bet there will be another wave after this movie.

[@Psilo_Sybin]

Not every film needs an intricate, complex, thought provoking story. Sometimes simple is good. And sometimes your judgements are wrong. The people have spoken. Avatar 2 is awesome.

[@kevincarter2020]

I experienced the pretty visuals but the film was boring to me. Won't re-watch and probably won't see next one

[@obarbeito]

Besides the visuals the movie is a borefest as was the 1st one...

[@Psilo_Sybin]

And I thought it was highly entertaining. The beauty of humanity, how we perceive things so differently.

[@zzygyy]

It's "family theme" appeals to many cultures outside USA. It a visual treat with a loving father protecting his family.

[@bikramarora1819]

@@kevincarter2020nice anecdote buddy but you don’t speak for the people. Significant majority of people that saw it liked the movie and the word of mouth is unprecedented

[@KorraPokeReactions]

Tyrone offered FANTASTIC commentary when he spoke in the last two minutes of this video.

[@tomektalk4671]

It’s also not done with box office. And box office numbers are based on release, it doesn’t matter that it rolled into the next year.

[@tommymarco]

huh, how did none of them pick this up !

[@Aspectt1991]

i like it to be honest, the last hour was really good imo. And i dont find the story bad.

[@pedrosantos6183]

Word on that.

[@kd9749]

To each their own, but the story was s***, straight up Dawson’s Creek level tween drama for about 2 hours.

[@paulwoodford1984]

People like you are easy to please though. No standards

[@Aspectt1991]

@@paulwoodford1984 if you say it, then its true i guess.

[@prestigiorebelde]

It’s better than endgame.

[@DCWAGE]

James cameron knows what the people want and thats why he nails it every time.

[@elidasilva5558]

I dont care for Avatar but It's as the saying goes "Never bet againist Cameron"

[@buzzkillington1567]

'You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain' I have watched Drinker go from speaking for the regular audience to being like every other cynical Hollywood critic who is out of touch with what regular audience enjoy. Truly remarkable seeing this transformation.

[@reezlaw]

I hope you're wrong and he comes to his senses

[@buzzkillington1567]

@@reezlaw I highly doubt... recently he has turned to shitting on films that the average masses enjoy. Livestreaming with the other KZbinrs has definitely tainted what made him popular with people first

[@genrihlanevsky6612]

Thank you for saying it. It's not just me who thinks the same way. The guy is cynical. He constantly whines about the lack of proper entertainment and than he shits on Avatar 2 and says stuff like it was like watching a three hours screensavers. That's just blatant cynicism and lying. The reason I begam watching his videos is how authentic he felt and now his just one of those snobby out of touch cynical critics who shit and criticise everything.

[@buzzkillington1567]

@@genrihlanevsky6612 it started when he switched to streaming and listening to the other critics. I think they corrupted his former personality

[@jessesmith7932]

My theater was packed full of kids so people that enjoyed the first Avatar are parents and grandparents by now and it definitely provided a nice family experience for a dinner and a movie...

[@royjones8312]

I loved it and will be going to see it again next weekend. I didn’t find it boring at all personally. I found the day to day lives of the characters and them just living in water to be really cool and tranquil and just peaceful to me. I’m obviously the exact person he made this for lol.

[@jettoaji646]

Why is Disparu so cynical about everything

[@genrihlanevsky6612]

Because it sells views.

[@tomektalk4671]

I’ve watched it several times. Many people are rewatching.

[@katthunter6561]

I think the lack of, let's say depth, to the plot is far, FAR offset by several factors- there's no identity politics in it, even if it has a clear whaling message; it really is joyful to watch, so many colours and inventive ideas; a core theme of family and love, especially very traditional with a protective father; some good bits of tension with the characters, for example Spider's choices; enough well-shot action and some big emotional moments which can grip you. I did cry at the end watching Neytiri and Jake's grief. It has hugely wide appeal, it doesn't surprise me it has been successful.

[@Boots43096]

for me I loved the movie because it was a break not just from superhero movies but the CONSTANT assault of identity politics, it was like back in the good old days when movies existed to entertain rather than preach. Also even tho technically it's not really a new franchise, it's the closest thing to an original IP we've had in a while pop up in the mainstream so im curious to see how the storyline continues to build.

[@DANGERProductions2020]

These guys are shocked that Avatar 2 did well and legit seem disappointed about it. A couple of them are even trying to act like the movie was unsuccessful and that it merely “broke even” (as if that’ll wipe the egg off their face for predicting its failure). In reality, it may end up making $1B in profit when its run is over. Believe it or not, sometimes people just want to be entertained by a simple story with good visuals (see Top Gun: Maverick as an example).

[@reezlaw]

What's surprising to me is that this is usually THEIR point

[@DANGERProductions2020]

@@reezlaw It's pretty hilarious actually. I've found that the "get woke, go broke" crowd is torn about Avatar. They wanted so badly for it to fail so they could blame it on "wokeness" (after all, who wants to see James Cameron's anti-colonialism, pro-environmental "virtue signaling"). But it clearly didn't go broke!

[@reezlaw]

@@DANGERProductions2020 to be honest, I think "get woke go broke" is real. But you gotta be fair about what is or isn't woke and A2 isn't.

[@DANGERProductions2020]

@@reezlaw James Cameron has said in interviews that the main purpose of making the Avatar sequels was to promote his message of environmental activism to as many people as possible. And it's not very subtle in the actual film. That's quite literally a virtue signal, which squarely falls under the umbrella of "woke." Frankly, I don't care either way (the message is fine to me), but if we're being honest, it flies in the face of the "get woke, go broke" mantra.

[@reezlaw]

@@DANGERProductions2020 I disagree. Woke stuff is performative progressiveness, at least this is how I have always intended it, and in this case it's just not performative, it's genuinely progressive in a good way and it doesn't even feel preachy. Truly woke stuff is devoid of real content, sounds like a pretext for a long lecture, the message is jarringly disjointed from whatever semblance of a story there is and it always feels somewhat insincere. This is definitely not the case

[@147salsa]

I just really enjoyed this film... I don't understand the hate and confusion lol I will see it again. And the story problems ppl say it has don't seem to have huge pull...

[@tommymarco]

Man, it feels like you guys are looking for something to hate about the film. It is pure escapism from reality, what's not to love.

[@godzilla5502]

Couldn’t agree more I like watching the drinker and Tyrone but sounds like there trying to find something to hate especially disparu couldn’t stand him

[@randomly_random_0]

Nah they're just afraid to accept they're wrong about judging this film too early . It will hurt their ego if they admit the movie is good enough to appeal worldwide. That's why dont listen to these armchair youtuber-turned critics.

[@manolgeorgiev9664]

I could write you down a several paragraph essay on everything wrong about the movie, but for that I'd need to watch it a second time. God, no. I'd rather watch Violent Night a second time lol.

[@manolgeorgiev9664]

@@randomly_random_0 The movie isn't good. This has nothing to do with its wide appeal. Hollywood has released next to nothing decent in a long time and so Avatar 2 gets a win due to not having any politics and not being outrageously bad. If it earns so much world wide, than it seems a lot of people like it, still doesn't make the movie good. The original Avatar was better with better structure, world and character building, but no one cares to acknowledge that, even though Avatar 2 is basically the same movie with a different coat of paint and a lot more contrivances and a dumber plot.

[@santanusk2853]

@@manolgeorgiev9664 The movie IS good. People are watching with their families & thoroughly loving it. You can make a 100 contrivances they only exists in your KZbin bubble.

[@Jacksonmontyart]

I’ve seen the film twice and I plan to see it a third time in 3D as a concept artist the visuals alone move me because I know what it takes to make something like that. The story was fine for me too, didn’t feel the runtime at all. And I loved the family aspect of the film. So refreshing for modern cinema. I really think you guys are underestimating how much people enjoy this film, and it’s message.

[@gameoverwehaveeverypixelco1258]

See it in 3d in 48 frames per second. It's so lifelike.

[@Jacksonmontyart]

@@gameoverwehaveeverypixelco1258 not sure I’d enjoy 3 hours of being shaken lol

[@HansOlo-qe4pf]

Today we are at 2.15 billion and it will end at probably around 2.3 billion. I still don't get why you guys do not understand why it is so successful honestly. Drinker, I love your channel and I agree with nearly every video you make but on Avatar I disagree so much. I am 43 years old and a child of the 80s/90s and I weep at how bland, idiotic and stupid most modern movies are. I hate how they incorporate "THE MESSAGE" in every film or series nowadays just to cater to some idiots or the mainstream media. Avatar 2 is a beautiful movie with absolute perfect CGI and one of the most re-watchable movies out there. This is also exactly why it does so good at the boxoffice, people go see it several times. Why? Because you can escape our current bleak world, you can escape to beautiful Pandora and watch a glorious movie that you can lose yourself in. Yes the story is rather simple and you can follow it easily, but it is family friendly, it has heart, lots of emotion but also awesome action scenes and fights and it has an underlying message of how we humans tend to exploit nature and stuff but this movie is far from woke and does not try to sell THE MESSAGE to the audience. Basically it is a story about a man who wants to take care of his family, who does choose poorly in just running away to the water tribes. He is naive and thinks he can outrun them but he is desperate and just wants to see his family save. By the end of the movie he finally realizes that he can't run, that he was wrong in just trying to hide and in the next movies we will probably see him uniting all other tribes with an all open war by the end of either movie 4 or 5. Avatar 2 is way more than just "pretty pictures" and "well done CGI", it is an absolute passion project for James Cameron and they worked on this film for 6 years and you can just feel his enthusiasm for this world and I will take movies like this over bland superhero movies anytime. Also looking at the actors how they had to learn to hold their breath for 6 minutes and then act their scenes under water and show emotion and such is cool. I saw you talking about how bad the pacing and dialogues were, interestingly enough I loved how they basically did 3 parts in this movie and the 2nd one with the "teen drama" and how they have to learn how to survive in water was beautiful. In the 1st part we see how the family grows up, how the humans return and how Jakes decides to abandon the forrest tribe, then in the 2nd we see how they have to learn to survive in water and then we have the great finale with those awesome action sequences. I found the pacing perfect like this and let me tell you something else: Our teenage boys today really do talk like that, unfortunately... I also cringe everytime I hear my sisters son and his friends talking like that but that's how it is today. And Jake mentioned early in the movie that he struggled to learn the Na'vi language but when he finally mastered it, it basically sounded like english to him. To me that means they actually talk Na'vi most of the time but for the audience it was of course english because you don't want to read subtitles for 3 hours. That's why James Cameron can even get away with the cringy "bro" in my opinion. Sorry for the long text... I get carried away when talking or writing about Avatar 2. :P

[@hkmrsrg1367]

I've watched it twice. It's such a visual marvel and Pandora is a beautiful world that looks believable. Is it the greatest movie? No. I can point out the many plot contrivances and weird character motivation. But that's the magic of Cameron. He knows what the market can find acceptable and enhanced the vision he has.

[@oscarmike1307]

Pls name those many plot contrivances and weird character motivations?? Discussion wise, no hostility here bro😉. I've watched it 4 times by now and can say that story has logical and consistent progression and characters are fleshed out and act according to their personality, intelligence, social status and age; with both protagonist (Neytiri) and antagonist (Quaritch) having a colossal character ark in the movies climax.

[@darkdawnbringer]

@@oscarmike1307 Why would you watch a movie 4 times in a short time?

[@oscarmike1307]

@@darkdawnbringer I like to properly digest the content that I find interest in and understand all it's aspects, needless to say there was a lot to digest/process in Avatar2 + Cameron fan! Satisfied?😉

[@hkmrsrg1367]

@@oscarmike1307 1. Leaving the forest. They were not in communication with the humans. Whether they leave or not, the humans don't know. Jake assumed that the forest Navi people would be safe just by leaving the people. That's not true because they weren't in communication with the humans or even Quaritch's team. Leave or not, the forest people would still be in danger. If they (plot contrivance here) didn't happen to get the chopper's signal that wanted to check Kiri's seizure, they wouldn't have guessed that Jake and family were in the island. What happens if that didn't happen? Well, the forest people would be in danger anyway, whether they leave or not. 2. Plot contrivances. The kids happen to go where Quaritch went at the same time. Quaritch hunt Tulkun. Jake Sully said to report if they see the device that marked the tulkun. It just so happens that the tulkun being hunted is Loak's tulkun minutes after Jake announced to tell the tulkuns. Quaritch just happened to hunt the tulkun Loak bonded with. It also just so happens that all the kids were around both when they went to the forest and meet Quaritch and when Lo'ak was going to warn his tulkun. All the interaction between Quaritch and Jake were the result of "coincidences". The kids just happen to be in the jungle when Quaritch was there, and then the kids just happened to be in the sea with Loak tulkun when Quaritch was around. Kiri just happened to be sick so a chopper can come in so Quaritch can find Jake. The plot relies on coincidences aka plot contrivances which is okay because coincidences happen. But too many coincidences = plot contrivances. Even Quaritch's son was just a plot device so Quaritch can get help finding Jake and family and in the end for them to have an edge against Quaritch. If you don't think about it, it's easy to suspend disbelief. But if you think about it, it kind of doesn't make sense to assume the navi people would be safe just by leaving unless there's a line of communication where the Navi people say to the humans, "Jake Sully is no longer a part of us. Whatever problems you have with him has nothing to do with us." But even then, Quaritch's interaction with the female admiral(?) showed that it doesn't matter anyway because they want to take Pandora. Minor grievances, just so happens that there's a new thing that makes people immortal and it's in the tulkun and that's why they hunt tulkun. This also happens so the can have a base of operation for Quaritch in the sea. Everything is just so conveniently set up so Jake would meet Quaritch. What happened to unobtanioum? What happened to the first movie where the only reason there was a fight was "preemptive strike" because Jake Sully destroyed a camera so they can chalk it up to "the blue monkeys are hostile, we have to defend ourselves by striking." This was the reason Quaritch attacked in the first movie. Meaning, it's not so easy to just attack, there are rules of engagement. And the navi sent the people back, didn't kill them. So there must be a governing body implied that set the rules for engagement, some kind of UN, but in the second movie, they just engage as they will. Anyway, I like the movie. I just don't think it's the best. After all, it's Pandora that I'm in love with. I loved the first Avatar and I loved the second. But the flaws are there too.

[@oscarmike1307]

@@hkmrsrg1367 Hey bro thanks for taking time to articulate your thoughts, much appreciated :) 1. They were not in communication with the humans that's true, but Quaritch and his team were resurrected for one purpose only as stated in the beginning, to hunt and kill the leader of the Na'Vi insurgence - Toruk Makto aka Jake Sully. Also General stated that Eywa developed an immune response to humans like cancer(remember hellfire and flames that arrived with humans-all part of the plan), hence Na'Vi recombanants have logical purpose not to mention the revenge factor these KIA marines have towards Jake. When they arrived to Pandora (Quaritch and his team) they were shortly deployed to forest (which makes sense since forest was last place where humans and na'vi collided and where search had logical purpose) and started recon operation; meanwhile kids were playing in the forest and roaming around (as kids do). They didn't just bump into each other, Lo'ak founded suspicious footprints and started tracking them (bcs that's his impulsive character as we all were as stupid kids) and only then they met. He reported the situation to Jake but XP Marines lock on them pretty soon and grab them hostage. Also it makes perfect sense for Jake to take his family far away from the clan to the other side of the planet(moon) since 'death squad' was tracking HIM PARTICULARLY and eventually would find him in the forest, him staying would increase the chance of Na'vi casualties with Quaritch on his back. Also General stated that one of the main mission parameters is to 'PACIFY' the enemy not ANNIHILATE them which also makes sense since if later was the case the Humans would just 'carpet bomb' or 'thermobaric bomb' every inhabitant place so no, forest people are much safer without Jake and his family being around. 2. Like I said, Quaritch and his death squad was on a recon mission in the forest and their search for clues led them, quite logically, to the last spot where the last stand between him and Sully occurred; kids were roaming around and they only met after Lo'ak founded footprints and started tracking them (you can also see the passage of time, Cameron shows several shots of sun evading while all this is happening) Quaritch hunt Tulkun!? Yes Jake said to report if they see the device, HE ALSO SAID a second later to Tonowari to notice all of Tulkuns to runaway(so to say) from the reef perimeter in order to save their lives. Payakan was not part of the clan since he was an outcast so it makes sense he didn't get the info hence it makes sense he was the one who got 'marked' with the device since all other Tulkuns were gone. Yes kids usually play together, do stupid shit together and back each other together-already explained the forest scene and Payakan scene :) How can all interactions between Quaritch and Jake be the result of coincidence since Quaritch and his death squad were resurrected for one and only purpose, to find and kill Jake Sully - pretty solid reason for them to meet more often whether someone finds it convenient or not :D Quaritch and his son Spider led to one of the most intense ark I have seen in a while. Only after 6hours of movie you get to see a goddamn 'antichrist' showing for the FIRST TIME an emotional resonance and empathy towards life and at the same time you witness protagonist showing borderline insanity and apathy towards life (talk about subverting your expectations) Well the immortal serum is most probably Camerons reference to adrenochrome, I can understand you having problem with it plot-wise but inhumane and mindless exploitation of resources is nothing new for Human race to say the least bro ;) Unobtanium was a plot device for A1 localized mining operation, A2 is about humans invading and colonizing Pandora, pacifying the enemy and prepping the place for coke, jeans and neoliberal way of life xD Like I said it's not about preemptive strike or anything like that, story is different now, it's not about mining operation, unobtanium and cameras it's about full colonization! The Na'vi are aware of human presence and their hunting of Tulkuns but still they mind their own business since it's not in their nature to wage aggressive offensive wars, I mean that's the whole philosophy of the Cameron xD What you call coincidences and plot contrivances is literally something that makes every movie otherwise we would only watch Jake eating mushrooms in a forest for 3h and hopefully see some 'Neytiri nipples' again; the most obvious example being - In a galaxy fuckin' far away, Leia stored data into midget robot that was CONVENIENTLY founded by her long lost brother... in a galaxy that consists of thousands of solar systems.. Butch conveniently bump into Marselus Wallace on a pedestrian crossing so we could have a rape scene and emergence of evil.. yeah right xD I wont give more examples but you get the picture.. Anyway glad you liked the movie and glad we had this discussion bro, stay healthy xD

[@MrWarren1979]

The fact is Avatar the way of water is a very good movie, not Camerons best, not by a long shot but it has generated repeat viewings, I've seen it multiple times taking the Grandchildren etc, & they loved it. It's a movie the whole family can enjoy. It's that simple. Seeing people who dislike the franchise get sore about the box office success for this makes me laugh, they were all waiting to write obituaries for this movie and it hasn't worked out in their favour. James Cameron wins... Again...

[@tommymarco]

I find it odd also that people thought this would fail, if anything this was meant to succeed :)

[@randomly_random_0]

As they say *Never bet against James Cameron*

[@TheGavrael]

3:05 Disparu, yes, it already worked. That's what got you into Avatar 1, then they all said the same thing about 2. The story is pretty much par for the course compared to Avatar 1. I wasn't bored, but I wasn't thrilled or surprised either. It is a very decent film. When 3 rolls around, it'll be the same song and dance, though supposedly we will get "Ash Navi" who are aggressive and meanies, so that'll be the draw for that one. As long as Cameron can put out 3 with the same technical prowess of 1 then 2, it'll do fine.

[@Jeneric81]

Picked up my wife’s 13-year old and his friend yesterday after seeing this movie and they were completely enthralled.

[@YormanGina]

It was nice seeing a family that was "traditional", even if the family itself wasn't. You have a human-turned-Navi married to an actual Navi, with an adopted daughter who is basically female Jesus (virgin birth and all), the loyal older son, the rebellious younger son, and a human who has gone "native" and is an active part of their life.

[@chrisdee1583]

A human basically fucking a beast/alien 😂 Sully's got some serious issues.

[@matane2465]

Yes, a transhuman is somehow traditional.

[@YormanGina]

@@matane2465 traditional as in the family dynamic.

[@jonathanwells223]

@@YormanGinathey’re aliens created by a super intelligent alien brain system that masquerades as a functional biosphere. Never forget that.

[@chrisdee1583]

@@YormanGina Sully might aswell be beasting canines is that the message you want? A human falls in love with a 12 ft dog and that's some sort of pat on the back shite? 🤮

[@IBTU]

People must be desperate for anything that’s not superheroes

[@chasehedges6775]

People are desperate to be entertained that mediocrity is seen as the best thing

[@ComposedSage75]

Doesn’t surprise me at all really

[@catherinehubbard1167]

I think it’s more that it gives a powerfully immersive and beautiful escape from the real world. The typical superhero movies don’t do as intense a job as this.

[@tjsignature5612]

I didn't know you were elected as a representative of people. Good for you.

[@thatguywhodoesstuff1432]

Or it's a good movie that people saw and went to more than once.

[@DanteBA2550]

It’s a good movie , it has the best visual effects of any movie I’ve ever seen

[@reezlaw]

Hands down best VFX ever, and this isn't a small feat in this day and age

[@lees8359]

The most expensive movie ever made, it took all the time it needed to be made and to look this freaking good.

[@arenegadea2431]

I loved it, and I agree with all the criticisms (some cringe dialogue, the middle is a teenage drama, pacing, spyder, etc). Based on everyone I’ve talked to, it’s been the “it’s an experience” view that wins out. I think that people are willing to forgive a lot of mistakes if you make the audience top priority, which is what James Cameron tried to do. For that reason, I’m happy to see it succeed, and will definitely be going to see Avatar 3

[@matane2465]

Yay, James Cameron made a 3 hour theme park ride.

[@flameshana9]

So it's magical like the first one? You know, where people claimed they were depressed that Pandora wasn't real?

[@bikramarora1819]

@@matane2465yes, and there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that. Atleast he made it with his heart and soul unlike the MCU

[@arenegadea2431]

@@matane2465 yes.

[@arenegadea2431]

@@flameshana9 yes.

[@darson100]

My daughters loved it and have seen it a couple of times each. They were too young to remember seeing the first Avatar on the big screen in 3D, so for them it's a real experience. For me, it was a 6/10.

[@CataclysmDM]

Honestly, I thoroughly enjoyed Avatar 2. Didn't rewatch, but I liked first viewing!

[@XanderGray1990]

I'll be honest, in an age where every movie appears to be pushing a huge message i enjoyed avatar 2 for simply being a basic film. It looked good, had a relatable family dynamic (for blue people!). It was the first film in a while where i didnt leave the cinema feeling like im the villian! The only major gripe i had was the poor writing which i expected and Spider wanting me to tear my eyes out every time i saw him on screen. The kid was atrocious. It's nowhere near a masterpiece, but it does the basics well which is better than 99% of the marvel trash released.

[@reezlaw]

Right, there's no in-your-face message or lecture, and that's why I'm perplexed that these guys except for Tyrone seem to be against it. They should be happy that THIS sells

[@arbitragesupreme1461]

@@reezlaw This is a joke, right? From the whaling scene to everything else in the movie, there's absolutely an in-your-face message. James Cameron even points it out that he intentionally designed the movie with an anti-colonialism and pro-environmental message. It was literally a message saying humans are treating our planet badly.

[@reezlaw]

@@arbitragesupreme1461 what I mean is that it's well integrated with the story and it's not nonsense, the opposite of what you normally see in woke content

[@Lilbuckets2]

@@reezlaw lmao “woke”💀

[@reezlaw]

@@Lilbuckets2 lmao broke

[@matokuroi8520]

Avatar haters are like vegetarians keep telling meat eaters that meat sucks, they still cant accept that majority of people likes meat, majority of people liked this movie but then they will say "well i guess these people like stupid movie with just spectacle". They feel superior for being smart not liking this movie.

[@benjaminrockhill8356]

You nailed it. Th critical drinker sounds like the people he complains about.

[@MrCaveman366]

Very traditional film in a lot of ways, i am really happy that both this and Top Gun: Maverick did so well. I hope Hollywood takes notes, most people do not like overly woke movies.

[@jacobyullman5005]

This is what I've been saying for years to all the nay-sayers. All Avatar 2 needed to do was have an okay story and look INCREDIBLE for people to go see it, and that's exactly what it did. Normally you guys are pretty on-base with what people want, but with this one I could tell right away, you guys might've been a little out of touch with this one. The reason for that is, you guys have been in the trenches for too long, you've all gotten too hypercritical and good at picking apart every facet of a film. It's made you really good at pointing out why a movie is bad. But at the same time it's made you hyperfocused on those aspects of film, so when you're watching a film that has writing that's just "okay" you don't understand why it's popular. You guys just aren't members of the general audience anymore, you're critics who always view things in a critical light. You literally just watch movies differently than most people now. Nothing wrong with it, it just is what it is.

[@anastasyavie6236]

I think it also related with how the "critic" is mostly from western country and they think it has no cultural impact. Forgetting that even the 1st movie was a global hit. They don't think that global audience actually want to watch this movie because they recognise Avatar and they like it. It's as simple as that. Star wars or marvel franchise is not that mainstream compare to Avatar worldwide because it's easier to immerse to the world of avatar than other franchise.

[@jaredpoon5869]

I think part of it is the assumption that when people put certain left-leaning elements into their films that the entire film is going to go the same way. For sure, there are heavy environmental and heavy anti-human/anti-colonial elements of the movie, but there are equally pro-family (and a mixed family at that) as well as pro-fatherhood elements of the film that audiences relate to. Add on to the film the fact that it is gorgeous in a theatre and has some amazing world building elements, and you have a film that people enjoy seeing.

[@steffimaier7297]

@@anastasyavie6236 This is so true! When I went to California; you barely could escape Star Wars and Superhero stuff. While in my homecountry you may find it in comic book stores or conventions. Made a similar experience when I visited Japan. I think another reason why many Americans don't like Avatar as much (and simp for Top Gun) is because it shows Americans in a negative light.

[@JR-hr3qc]

Enjoy the movie. Enjoyed the story about family. Didn't think it was boring or slow at all except for maybe the one scene. But other than that I loved it. So did everybody I went with

[@Ruprect44]

First thing that came to mind when you mentioned the classic "gearing up" scene was Commando. So glad you referenced it.

[@ComedicPause]

Westerners on the internet were convinced that Avatar 2 would flop, and their were plenty of valid reasons to believe that, but all Asia wants in their American films is a simple plot with groundbreaking visuals. Domestic box office isn't a huge concern when you have half of the entire world watching.

[@ophanimangel3143]

Makes sense as me being Asian, living standards are crappier than ones in the West and education in general isn’t so great that complicated stories that require someone who is very literate can be easily disengaging for a viewer. So the movie’s simplistic story and otherworldly visuals do appeal to these masses more.

[@randomly_random_0]

@@ophanimangel3143 complicated stories are bad for a movie. expect them to flop. they will only cater to people like you on the internet who just make up 00000.1% of audiences.

[@santanusk2853]

@@ophanimangel3143 Or perhaps it's the other way around. Asians see how woke & degrading the westerner's culture is becoming they want no part of it. So when a film is about good family values we take our kids to watch it. You know because the impression of a responsible family member is very important. People here don't want their children to be fatherless motherless murderers drug addicts & questionable genders. There's always westerners for that to provide a good laugh.

[@danielmcdonald9604]

Just watched Avatar 2 in the cinema going in with poor expectations after watching this video, and to be honest, it was actually really good. Yeah it was a visual feast, it was immersive, it had a long slow moving second act but really it did what it was supposed to do, it showed life on another planet. There were character arcs: it teased the idea of a growing bond between Spider and Quaritch, with an interesting teasing of Spider being forced to choose between the people he grew up with and his own kind, the classic case of marginalisation. Spider was nowhere near as irritating as the comments suggest. Yeah he says “bro” a bit too much but he is a character that has integrity, is brave, and when given his choice at the end of the film, he did what he thought was right even if it does have dire consequences to come. I recommend it.

[@studentstudent5044]

A simple story is easy to understand and easy to feel for. It is about parents protecting their family, it does not need to je some huge agstravaganza

[@evildoughboy7773]

Whatever the reason might be, never underestimate a mediocre popcorn film because that's what usually makes up the majority of top grossing movies.

[@jkfozul2316]

When Jurassic Park came out I'm pretty sure it was considered a mediocre popcorn film

[@thatguywhodoesstuff1432]

It's no more mediocre than Maverick which also made a lot of money and was well liked by fans.

[@1kbmahan]

Your dumb point could be the case for literally most movies, movies are subjective mediums of entertainment.

[@mansolo3183]

Like Top Gun?

[@ruiscomps1553]

@@mansolo3183 that was a good popcorn flick with heaps of nostalgia. The popcorn flick appeal for mainstream audiences was still there.

[@grandmufftwerkin9037]

Avatar is fortunate to have top drawer visual effects, because if it didn't, the story isn't enough to carry it.

[@JIreland1992]

Which makes me wonder if they can keep the momentum going. Part 3 was made at the same time so it won’t be nearly as big a leap forward.

[@chucksenhowzen9740]

Don’t forget China & being allowed to stay in the IMAX theaters

[@milkbutter117]

That's the point it has breathtaking visuals Beautiful enough to transport you to another world Also the reason why imax digital 4-D X is are selling out

[@thebatman4279]

The story, characters and dialogue are horrendous. I felt like watching it again so i downloaded a crap cam copy and it's nigh on unbearable without the 3D element.

[@chasehedges6775]

@@milkbutter117 The story should also be a BIG priority

[@Kim-by5uy]

It was a great movie. Well deserved

[@ianmoriarty2199]

At least it's clear James Cameron and his team are working on the Avatar franchise with a love and passion for filmmaking. Sure, the stories and characters are all relatively un-original, but the franchise has more going for it than against it. It is very accessible and open to a wide audience (hell, my mom likes it and she doesn't watch sci-fi films), including adults and children, locally and internationally. It handles common but relatable themes, the visuals are made with the greatest care, the world-building is given actual effort. There are no woke elements, no rushed low-quality CGI, no rubbing politics into the audience's noses (environmentalism has always been at the core of the franchise and going into the movie we all knew what the statement is, it's not poorly shoe-horned in political messaging). Outside the film itself, there also appears to be a concrete plan for the rest of the franchise, which is to say that the writers have already done most of the work for the other sequels and planned out the whole thing, unlike current MCU movies or Disney Star Wars, which more often than not clashes with itself and retcons characters and events willy-nilly because different teams do not seem to communicate, and there doesn't seem to be an overall plan. I might be wrong, but I read somewhere that Cameron has stated they have already shot all of the scenes for the remaining sequels, meaning they now have years of post-production freedom. Filming a movie franchise back-to-back is something that rarely happens nowadays, and reminds me more of successful projects like the LOTR trilogy, than rushed failures like much of modern cinema. My impression is that so many people hate(d) on the original Avatar film because it 'had no reason' to be as successful as it was, because it was just 'Dances with Wolves with blue monkey people', as if the movie was some lightning in a bottle type situation that wouldn't be repeated. Clearly that is not the case. Thirteen years later the Way of Water appears to be a success, despite many people calling the original a forgettable fluke. Is it really that much of a surprise that among the dozens of shitty low-quality assembly line Marvel/Disney productions, people are flocking to see the one blockbuster that is actually trying to be good, rather than just being another soulless cash-grab.

[@Ramires213]

The Lord of the Rings trilogy and the first two Pirates of the Caribbean sequels are the reason James shot the 3rd Avatar film simultaneously with the 2nd. James was impressed by the risk taken with those films being filmed simultaneously and planned to do the same with sequels to both Avatar and Battle Angel, turning them into trilogies if the first film of each franchise proved successful. He expressed this in an interview all the way back in 2006.

[@rushaholic]

Honestly, I am surprised, I never thought it would do so well!

[@andrewreynolds912]

Same I mean the writing and dialogue is crap but it's the best thing that's only good

[@andrewreynolds912]

AaAHHHHHYYYEEE THEY HAVE TYRONE! AWESOME he watches drinker lmao

[@imanoldurango8213]

Because everyone was being a hater lmao also this movie is more for the international audience than the American audience. That’s why for both the first and it’s sequel the international box office makes up for 2/3 of its worldwide pull.

[@GreenFalcon926]

Why are you surpised? Avatar is loved worldwide, and the first movie is a clear example that people enjoy this world and its characters. So not in a disrespectful way or anything, why didn't you think it would do well?

[@andrewreynolds912]

@XOshamelessXO well you know it has awful dialogue and the plot isn't really good

[@EdwardLewisIV]

Dune Part 2 could do very well. Part 1 got almost all of the heavy exposition out of the way. It can now focus on the "spectacle" side of the story. The second half is the more exciting on a screen part of the story.

[@maned20]

Dune was absolutely boring, stop

[@pedrokantor3997]

Dune will be forgotten, just look how quickly part one has been forgotten. The most memorable scene was the throat singing of the Sadukar

[@imanoldurango8213]

Dune would’ve done a whole lot better if it’s wasn’t dropped on HBO max at the same time as theaters.

[@chrisdee1583]

@@maned20 Not enough smurfs for you? 😂

[@imanoldurango8213]

@@maned20it’s wasn’t but you just must have a short attention span

[@thedealmama3070]

As a parent to small child ren, this is literally the first movie all year that we even could discuss going to. The choices have been pitiful for kids. Just for the fact that my kids could go, and not be subjected to complete garbage the entire time, I am not surprised by the popularity.

[@arbitragesupreme1461]

Minions? Puss in Boots? There are many movies you could have gone to this year.

[@Agk3los]

Avatar 2 made 1.5 billion (so far) because it's a fucking great movie. Visually it's stunning, the story is incredibly enjoyable, and it's the sequel we all wanted. This movie fucking killed it. I could have walked directly back into the theater and watched it again. People who were bored... probably just don't have a sense of wonder anymore? I honestly feel bad for them. All these dudes just sound like bitter people hating something because they can't enjoy it even though it's CLEARLY an enjoyable experience. People hating on it honestly just feels like... they're doing it because they're supposed to? Either because they just never recommend a movie unless it's basically an 80s action flic or they're plugged in and you're SUPPOSED to hate Avatar because it's racist to blue people or some shit.

[@randomly_random_0]

well said. all of these armchair youtuber-turned film critics should not be listened to. They rely on hate contents and that attracts a lot of views. Their egos are too big they can't admit that they judged this film too early saying it sh*t, no cultural impact, no one cares about it, stupid film about blue cat people, rip off of Pocahontas-ferngully-dances with-smurfs blah blah blah. Now they reuse all their remaining cards to dismiss the film's success.

[@davidmun1601]

I think a lot of the hate has to do with Disney. Everything associated with them is supposed to suck

[@peto1986]

It's ridiculous how people are forgiving to other simple story movies like last Spiderman, Dune and even TG Maverick, all incredibly thin stories, but with beautiful visuals, yet Avatar is the only one that gets all the shit talk and criticism

[@randomly_random_0]

yeah it's unfair. They just hate it for the sake of hating it.

[@davidmun1601]

In all fairness, Drinker and his fans tend to be anti-Disney

[@louisenglish8069]

Cameron knows the formula and he sticks to it

[@reezlaw]

And he knows not to piss off his audience and that's a rare gift

[@Streeknine]

It also has the fan appeal of the fact they didn't change the characters or the theme (theme) same planet, same characters, same (lets save the world from evil earthlings) idea. They even saved the same villain. So.. it's really nostalgia getting a lot of people back and the visuals bring the new generation in.

[@SdotWebb]

It's sad that drinker can't just admit he doesn't like the movie but the fans do. 2.7 billion and now 1.5 billion speaks for itself. It wasn't perfect I admit that. But the fans enjoy it so stop hating.

[@swampcastle8142]

You will find somewhere in your 30s that you'll realize your tastes in films have gotten particular, and you have become pickier and harder to impress and have left what the masses find interesting behind.