Ten Commonly Banned Spells in Dungeons and Dragons 5e

[@o0Takka0o]

Wish is already softbanned in my games by nature of the fact that getting a group together consistently until they have lvl 9 spells is something I would need to cast wish IRL to make happen.

[@Hotrob_J]

In the campaign I'm in now, we captured a djinn, and our DM knew we were going to use it to try and teleport an npc that betrayed us. We had his name, and a knife he used. We figured he gave us a fake name, so went with "we wish for you to teleport to us this knifes last owner". Turns out, the knife was stolen. We all thought it was a funny and clever workaround to a very powerful spell.

[@jade4130]

@@Hotrob_J ha, I would have said: “Teleport this knives last owner to us” The djinn gives a smirk. A mist begins to grow heavy around the party as you hear the snap of the djinn echo in the distance. The sheer amount of power dispersing into the air around you almost sounds like thunder in a storm. All this culminated to what sounds like a bell toll as the mist at once fades into the distance. You all prepare your weapons for what has just happened in the area around you, but you quickly notice nothing has arrived. You, as the most recent owner of the dagger, have not been displaced by this wish spell.

[@gabrielhawkins-connolly143]

I would differentiate Wish and Omnispell. Make them both ninth level spells. Perhaps add restrictions on Wish, perhaps a few more of said restrictions. Then use Omnispell to cover the other bits for spells. and make Wish a legendary something.

[@oz_jones]

@@jade4130 yup. Totally what would happen, because djinnis are mischevious

[@stephenstonge7968]

@Not Given there's plenty of balance already for this. You want to become gods/litches? The inevitables have an answer to this and your new quest direction just took a massive difficulty hike. Also, that BBEG was a figurehead, taking the ire for a now much more vicious force that has to come out of the shadows and enforce control over the now disorganized enemy forces... Play into your story, group creatively can be as beautiful and epic as the romanticized image of counter spell in a mage duel.

[@joshuasorey6031]

In my games, highly trained assassins will often make a point of damaging a victim's head in order to foil Speak With Dead. When my players see a corpse missing its tongue or with its jaw crushed, they can immediately tell they're dealing with a pro. Really adds flavor to the world

[@CidGuerreiro1234]

I'm stealing that!

[@AC-eb7kt]

Thats brilliant

[@3nertia]

*yoink*

[@noahmehringer29]

The corpse is also under know obligation to be truthful. It could be spiteful and unhelpful, or it might assume you're in cahoots with the murderer and might not say anything to you.

[@Coenani]

We recently did the same as players, since we were dealing with Yakuza, and the one who asked the questions is also part of the Yakuza, but from a different area and she isn't supposed to be there. Gotta make sure the local group doesn't know she's here to check on them!

[@T1J]

i'm only a few years into DMing but the more I play the less I feel that anything in the game is banworthy and the more I just structure my games around the fact that these things exist

[@darklightstudio]

Same here! :)

[@AflacMan13]

THANK YOU! Finally someone said it! :-P

[@MikkosFree]

Exactly! I only have one ban rule. No using anything from books we don't actually own.

[@sev1120]

There's only one spell I ban, and even then it's not a full ban, just a delay. And that is Wish I simply limit it to being you can only have it added to your spell list if you're level 19 or higher

[@mythadology]

Never Ban, just increase the cost of using the magic. Nothing is free, and upsetting natural laws has its own cost.

[@Hdhdushzhz57743]

DM: Hello, welcome to the first session of Curse of Strahd. As the mist parts, you see a castle towering over desolate farmla... Wizard: I cast remove curse. I remove the curse of Strahd

[@foxgaming7781]

DM: no this isn’t how you your supposed to play the game

[@AvromCrovax]

Ok you cast remove curse and nothing happens. Congratulations you wasted a spell and pissed off a vampire that is now stalking you and your party.

[@jackalcoyote8777]

@@AvromCrovax That's terribly boring too. It would be more fun to undo part of the curse and somehow make things more dramatic.

[@4ll3sb4n4n3]

Universal hand-wave answer in CoS: "Because Dark Powers and stuff"

[@GlassDeviant]

DM: Oh my, the Remove Curse seems to have fizzled against the vastly greater power of the Curse of Strahd.

[@evoluton117]

PC: “Counterspelling a healing word is so mean” DM “It’s what the character would do”

[@crazyscotsman9327]

Or better yet in the dungeon itself have potions of poison in there that the villain left out for the adventurers to take. After all if he has built a dungeon he knows how adventurers think steal anything and everything of remote value.

[@shawngallagher8764]

Oh well if it’s what the character would do then who are we to tell you how to play them and ruin your fun 🙂

[@maaax5092]

@@crazyscotsman9327 that's just you wanting to kill your pc. All pcs need some sort of plot armor or they will die easily. Have you heard that you actually can't defeat the beholder unless the dm lets you?

[@crazyscotsman9327]

@@maaax5092 I actually haven't. And the potion of poison can be a trap if they don't actually look into what they found not just seeing potion bottle and thinking it's a healing potion. I give Arcana or Medicine checks to figure out what the potions are.

[@davidlindsay5905]

This is exactly what Acererak did to my PCs in ToA. It was awesome. The rules on casting a bonus action spell still say that you can’t cast another on your turn (and Crawford never answer this particular case wrt bonus action spells) so a character casting healing word cannot counter the enemy’s counterspell on their turn.

[@talongreenlee7704]

I’d like to point out that RAW in the DMG, it explicitly states that if a magic item is cursed, casting Identify on it will not reveal that fact.

[@laurencebernstein1233]

Unfortunately, this is SO easily countered by just throwing Remove Curse on anyone that attunes an item. So I use a rule like they described where any given curse will need the spell AND a specific ingredient.

[@talongreenlee7704]

@@laurencebernstein1233 remove curse only lets you unattune to the item. It doesn’t actually remove the curse from the item. It’s like how Find Traps doesn’t actually find traps.

[@laurencebernstein1233]

@@talongreenlee7704 Yes. But the problem is solved since you can remove the item. Making cursed items a non-issue for the players.

[@ChaosMind10531]

@@laurencebernstein1233 This is why you make the item so temptingly good... XD

[@Torthrodhel]

I like cursed items that potentially are wantable even if you did know the curse. Like that shield that attracts all the ranged attacks. Very useful for a tanky sort who's protecting someone else that's particularly vulnerable to ranged attacks (say, a squishy player with good keep-away abilities).

[@Tomyironmane]

Point of order: Making a spell *useless* without telling the character who took the spell and just burned spell slots using it is *worse* than simply banning it. If it's not OK for the DM to say "hey, I want to ban that spell because I don't know how to balance it" then there is a problem.

[@millsada]

this is why i left one of my play groups, DM just chose to ban banishment cos he didnt like it

[@Assametry]

@@millsada I assume there was more then just banning banishment why you left

[@skotosman]

my DM flat out told me that banishment will break the world we are in if she allowed it as we are in a sort of prison pocket realm made by evil wizards. In character I've tried to test the barrier that has been built around this pocket dimension already and above game my DM said that banishment and other plane shifting spells won't work until you unlock the secret behind how to escape this realm. So she told me not to take banishment at lvl 4.

[@millsada]

@@skotosman that is a super fair thing to do. I didnt allow it in COS. But i gave them a new spell. Just locked phased a person for 1 min. They cant move or see anything.

[@Jayman1clone]

@@millsada I remember this one campaign I joined that was gonna be like a Planescape campaign where we started the campaign as experienced adventurers (level 11) and just got plane shifted to the abyss at the end of our last quest, and we started the campaign trying to find a way to escape the abyss. I remember deliberately NOT taking Banishment so that the story could happen, as a courtesy to the DM.

[@chrisfox961]

I was the DM for a session where the party was attacked by hungry wolves. The Druid took some meat with Goodberry in each piece. The wolves quickly ate the meat - suddenly felt full and then wandered off. We all thought that it was one of the most creative uses of Goodberry that we had seen.

[@boiledelephant]

That's actually brilliant

[@cyanideytcuriousseadoggo]

lol. As a DM that would grant the full XP as that did satisfy the wolves with what they were after “Meat” and solved the encounter. And the Druid will get a “Friend to Forest Doggos” XP bonus

[@kedolan4992]

As far as banning all the res spells, there's a much easier way: make diamonds scarce. If the party has only found one single diamond in the last 3 months of play, you can bet that's still going to be a meaningful cast, and once they've used that one lifeline, they're going to be very worried the next time they get in trouble.

[@carsonm7292]

Yea-in a modern game I run I make diamonds a legally controlled and tightly regulated resource, while in the post-apocalypse game they're just mega hard to find. The limitation on it is definitely built-in.

[@jjmara01]

In the Icewind Dale game I'm in, diamonds are impossible to find ever. It's so rare and makes every fight extremely intense and interesting.

[@StormScale89]

you don't even need to make them scarce. Diamonds are expensive, it should be part of the pre adventure shopping trip to decide if you want to spend that 300 gold on a diamond in case something goes wrong, or spend that 300 gold on healing potions that may prevent the death in the first place. If your players are running around with enough money to constantly shell out 1k+ gold on new diamonds every time, you may need to consider why you are giving them so much money and nothing to spend it on.

[@jjmara01]

@@StormScale89 I've been in campaigns where we have only 100 gold between us for sessions, and some where we have 100k each. To me, the low gold is more fun and brings out better RPs and more intense situations, trying to survive and balance whatever we are doing with lack of gold. Where a health potion is huge for us, let alone a diamond.

[@StormScale89]

@@jjmara01 I'm running a new game with my old group and i ran into the problem of i gave them too much money in the previous game. To the point were realistically they had no real reason to keep adventuring and should have just settled down. The new game they have a lot less money but they enjoy it a lot more because everything feel earned instead of given.

[@poe_slaw]

Also good to remember: there is a 2nd level Illusion spell called Arcanist’s Magic Aura that can make any object reveal false information when players use a Divination spell on it. When your party’s wizard asks if an item is magical, then RAW there is nothing stopping you from lying to his face.

[@SCI-FIWIZARDMAN]

So long as you (as a DM) don’t do it EVERY TIME, then yes. The Magic Aura Trick is a delightful tool to use every once in a while, but anyone reading this, don’t be the guy who makes every single magic item have a false aura just so your wizard’s indentification is useless. I’ve seen that happen before. It’s not fun for anyone.

[@RedrumZombies]

Sure. It reveals false info, like a school/spell/type of magic. Big it's imbued in magic still. So It is still found to be magical to a player. And depending on DM and their world/mechanics, you might be able to tell that, that spell in on it, but not tell what info other than that is false. Also identify and Legend Lore should never be negated as such.

[@RedrumZombies]

@@SCI-FIWIZARDMAN As a prank or to hide what a item is that is for a delivery quest/story plot, then sure. But a cursed item or something someone needs to use for advancing whatever is too far.

[@PiApproximate]

i use this so much as a DM, even have it set up to just hide the curse on a item on time to time. not all the time but i do roll a % about 5% that it has Magic aura, and about 50% of cursed items do, why do i do this cause identify and detect magic is not some super secret spell for casters, tho i always say a spell like true sight sees threw this.

[@natedillow1725]

As long as you have notes ahead of time of which things have this spell on them then yes, that's fantastic! If you just do this spur of the moment it's lame.

[@jaspermooren5883]

"Counterspelling a healing word, that would be otherwise saving a player character's life, that is the most villainous thing I could do." No, it's not. Last session, the cleric tried to revivify my character and it got counterspelled. THAT is the most villainous thing a DM can do.

[@DungeonDudes]

Oof

[@Humorless_Wokescold]

Bro....

[@tobizerker4153]

The party was fighting the bbeg who had a minon that was an arcane trickster. The trickster hid when the bbeg died and waited for the cleric to use revivafy on their died members and stole the spell from the clerics list

[@sillyking1991]

villainous thing a *villain can do.

[@jaspermooren5883]

@@tobizerker4153 ok that is somehow even worse.

[@devinkerr5474]

I think Remove Curse can be a great option for RECENT curses, anything under 30-90 days, something like a 1,000 year curse would be far too settled to be removed so easily and may require 2-5 people casting remove curse at the same time to affect. That way the party would almost definitely need a good amount of outside aid to impact a long-affected curse

[@mitchhaelann9215]

I do a thing with Cure Disease in that it cures the SYMPTOMS, but not the disease itself which will 'return' after it goes through the incubation phase again. You could do something similar with Remove Curse and make it alleviate some of the symptoms of the curse, while not actually breaking the curse. Temporary relief, not a cure-all.

[@whoahanant]

@@mitchhaelann9215 I use both under the rules that they have to be very recently diseased/cursed to be able to cure. But I'll use your rule for set curses and diseases as symptom treatments cause that's actually pretty cool.

[@fabulous_finn7810]

I always have a lil addition that I present to players: upcasting remove curse can allow for more powerful curses to be lifted. Curses that generate from lower CR/level encounters can and will be covered by the spell, but there is a scaling chart I keep on hand and pass onto my players to let them know that remove curse works a tad different.

[@devinkerr5474]

@@fabulous_finn7810 Also a great twist. "I don't care if you're only curing disease, this is a disease from a 2,000 year old vampire, Imma need a higher spell slot from you"

[@IIIGioGioStarIII]

In my table, remove curse only suppresses the curse, depending on how serious the curse is. Like, if a PC is inflicted with lycanthropy, remove curse suppresses the lycanthropy but doesn't remove it. If they want to remove that curse, they need to find a powerful NPC who can cast a rare ritual and the PCs have to fight the lycanthrope spirit that was inhabiting the PC. If they defeat it, then they are cured. If they don't, then they are stuck with the curse and suffer the negatives it brings. Accepting the curse, the negatives are negated but I change the aspects of lycanthropy such as they get resistances to normal weapons instead of immunities, silvered weapons do the full damage, they can heal for 1d6 if they haven't been hit by a magical/silvered weapon or spell, and things like that.

[@tylerlabombard9092]

My DM allowed me to use wish one time in a two part, one-shot type of deal. (Still new to D&D, sorry lol) and he said that if I use it, my character could never use magic again. I used it, and I retired the character as a blacksmith. Now that blacksmith is in our current campaign, just living out his life after saving the world, so to speak. Love you Dudes, and all your hard work!!

[@bigdog421]

Reoccurring characters are amazing, especially when its characters from an old campaign

[@talltroll7092]

That is kinda bad DMing, from one point of view. Yes, Wish is a powerful spell, but every description in every edition I've ever seen makes it clear that the spell still has limits; it is not an all-purpose "I win the campaign" button. Several even suggest that DMs actively screw with PCs that try to abuse it : "You Wish for a billion gold pieces? Sure, they materialise 50ft over your head. You are dead, no save. Please roll 3d6 six times, stats in order", "You wish the BBEG Ancient Dragon was dead? Sure. You are now facing a Ancient Lich Dragon, with an extra 10HD, fully healed, a load of extra spell slots, all now refreshed, and an extra 2dx+2 per attack over the living version, a new breath weapon that just so happens to be the element I know your party has limited or no resistance to, with 4 uses/day, all refreshed. Have fun!", "You want to be immortal? Sure. You are now a living, unbreakable statue made of an unknown metal that cannot be damaged by any means known to anyone in your dimension, or any other your non-statue friends might be able to contact. You can't move though, it's a bit stiff. Your mind will be free to contemplate the deepest mysteries of existence for all time though, guaranteed. Just as soon as it stops screaming", etc, etc. Essentially, if a Wish is going to break something, just don't let it happen. Even if some rules lawyer has sat down and worked out this perfectly worded, 30 page Wish document with appendices and footnotes, that covers every possible subversion, have the Inter-Dimensional Wish Fulfillment Tribunal pop out of a Gate and emerge with a magical Cease and Desist Notice that prevents Wish spells from completing anywhere within

[@tylerlabombard9092]

@@talltroll7092 I was okay to never use magic again, though. It was just a one-shot, and it went with the RP for our first session to the new campaign.

[@H41030v3rki110ny0u]

@@talltroll7092 You're looking way too hard in to it... it was a two-session one-shot lol I also think it's kind of a cool story from the OP.. verdict.. NOT bad DM'ing

[@drew-horst]

That's enough to make a grown man cry

[@mcphadenmike]

Sounds like we need two levels of curse removal: Remove Lesser Curse and Remove Greater Curse.

[@Draeckon]

Or have text within the spell for upcasting it, which would save a spell-known.

[@achimsinn7782]

I would say we need two levels of curse - lesser curses can be removed no problem, greater curses need the shenanigans they talked about like performing rituals, getting specific incrediants or performing specific tasks to remove them.

[@mikeymcchoas3511]

I used to have fun running Ravenloft campaigns (2nd Edition) where you trip over curses walking down the street. Nothing so trivial as Remove Curse even nicks the Dark Powers or the Vistani's uber-curse abilities.

[@zackmorse9042]

I thought the same thing.

[@irwingbrasil]

Much better than the dudes suggestion. They just made a spell not a spell. There ideia loooks like anyone can do it and turns remove curse useless

[@cressthunderhawk1492]

My greatest moment with polymorph, i was playing storm king's thunder, and playing as a kobold bard. We were fighting with whatever that frost giant npc that joins you for a bit, against a couple of other frost giants. My kobold had the bright idea to climb into the frost giant's palm and i think you can get a feel for where this is heading. I have the giant launch me at the giants, while in the air my kobold casts polymorph on himself to turn into a mammoth with the intent of crushing a giant. The DM has the giant roll for accuracy and tragically but at the same time, beautifully misses the roll and my mammoth crashes into the ground taking max fall damage, not enough to eat through the mammoth hp, but more than enough to break my concentration, leaving my kobold by himself, seperated from the party by 120ft of difficult terrain snow. Proceed to 4 turns of the most intense game of whack-a-kobold my character never asked to play as he reconvened with the party

[@kullinnmeilleur-finn5734]

Kill a terrasque with a single spell slot. True polymorph on self. Clay golem. Punch it to death. Be immune to all damage it deals

[@cressthunderhawk1492]

@@kullinnmeilleur-finn5734 to that a dm could easily say that there's enough adamantine debris (swords, armor now, etc.) Stuck in the tarrasque that it can crush the clay golem without having to worry about the immunities.

[@davidsabotta6528]

My best use of Polymorph so far: I used winged boots to get about 30 ft above a small boat full of enemies, then became a whale and crushed the boat (and my own body). The DM has now warned me these shenanigans will only work as long as it's cute enough or funny enough.

[@Fredrikwikberg]

mohahahahahahah :D

[@WoofleWaffles]

I really like revivify because it can only revive someone who’s been dead for a minute. I can imagine a situation where the party assassinates the bbeg and now must fend off their hoard of apprentices until that one minute passes to ensure the bbeg doesn’t get back up. I see it more as like a defibrillator than resurrection. That diamond is shattered to send a jolt of arcane energy to the heart to get it pumping again.

[@EskChan19]

Just an uncalled for comment passing by to mention that a defibrilator is used to STOP the heart during ventricular fribillation, NOT to get it running again. That's what chest compressions are for.

[@WoofleWaffles]

@@EskChan19 I learned something new today, thanks! 🙏

[@ladytanuki]

That explains why artificers can cast Revivify but not the higher resurrection spells (with the exception of alchemists and Raise Dead). Super easy to flavor it as a defibrillator.

[@charleskoster6246]

​@@EskChan19I

[@anonyme4881]

A defibrillator absolutly doesnt stop your heart when you do a ventricular fibrillation you moron Defibrillator are used to stop cardiac fibrillation and turn back the electric signal that make your heart beat back to normal. A ventricular fibrillation is a state were the heart beat ineffectivelly and in a disorganized manner. Its basically shaking (and not stopping) instead of beating because the electrical signal that organize your heartbeat got desorganized Chest compression are made to pump blood enough time to wait for said defibrillator, or to re-activate said electric signal if the heart completly stopped working. (In which case the defibrillator is actually useless, but your goal is to do chess compress enough time to transform a non beating heart into AT LEAST a fibrillation to let the defibrillator save the person. At best chest compression is enough but its rarely the case) Chest compression alone is 90%+ of time NOT enough, and Im a french pharmacist that already did it many time. And if you still needed chest compression after using a defibrillator, implantable cardioverter-defibrillator wouldnt exist at all Sad fact, even if the person heart start working again, it can still fail again after like 5 seconds

[@yiklongtay6029]

I do like how Matt Mercer states a DC of 10 to revivify and Resurrection but lets the DC increase by 2 after every successful resurrection. This lets you use revivify a lot at low levels while everyone is floundering around with no competence. And by the time the plot gets crazy level 14 and up, these deaths can get incredibly risky. Although this system does encourage DMs to sadistically burn through their resurrections to make sure they are vigilant and paranoid at the endgame.

[@Uncle-Jay]

Oh, I think I am going to use this, I feel like it adds a little more tension to the game.

[@justnoob8141]

At that point, I might as well just play AD&D over that rule

[@Uncle-Jay]

@@chaoswithkara Just because it's in a fantasy realm doesn't mean there isn't accountability. I'm playing with a group right now where someone had a pet goblin that died and they stuffed it in a bag of holding and went on a quest to get the goblin revived and I'm over here just rolling my eyes so hard.

[@chaoswithkara]

@@Uncle-Jay damn, yeah I'm using Mercer's rules for resurrection, I had one player turn into a zombie so they went on a quest to find someone powerful enough to bring him back which wasn't easy

[@SmolAnarchy]

Though there is a workaround, the more people help, the DC is decreased by 3. So, if 4 people are helping, the DC is reduced by 12. This is a rule no one follows, and it isn't even a variant, but a rule that's been in the book forever.

[@michaelramon2411]

I'm fine with Counterspell as long as the person using it shouts "OBJECTION!" in proper Phoenix Wright style. Shouting and finger-pointing are the verbal and somatic components.

[@tylerian4648]

I have a player who's a bard lawyer. This is a great idea.

[@michaelramon2411]

@@tylerian4648 Weirdly enough, I also have a Bard accountant/lawyer in my "Characters To Play Eventually" file. They are ridiculously serious, though.

[@theuncalledfor]

Or you could say it in that smug tone that the Wizard from XP To Level 3 uses.

[@aidenauty9716]

Inbefore you realize counterspell has no verbal component

[@michaelramon2411]

@@aidenauty9716 OBJECTION!

[@MC-gj8fg]

Making spells useless is even worse than banning them. At least if they're banned the player needn't fill sometimes valuable spells known or spell slots with spells they don't realize are worth nothing.

[@rcschmidt668]

I have been at a table where the DM said the McGuffin was so old and mysterious the Identify spell did not work on it.

[@rafaelbordoni516]

Nerfing needs to be treated like a ban: explained and clarified at session zero or any time before the game starts and players are making their characters.

[@krispalermo8133]

@@rcschmidt668 Then use Legend Lore.

[@Daile0303]

@@krispalermo8133 Or... You know... A history check

[@Battleguild]

@@Daile0303 or...HIT IT WITH A ROCK!

[@Artrysa]

I actually think Counterspell duels can lead to some very interesting bluff tactics. Like the enemy sees you casting and counters, but it was actually a cantrip and now you're safe to teleport away. Or maybe allow for a deception check to try and waste the opponent's counterspell. Or trying to get an enemy to waste their reaction so you've got a clear shot.

[@mccallosone4903]

agreed

[@Paerigos]

Key is having someone to counterspell a counterspell

[@leahbeah1585]

It hypothetically should be interesting, and I think it would be in maybe a more video game sort of setting. But in a live play session I feel it can create pretty obnoxious metagamey situations especially when you are trying to play optimally.

[@jacobborkholder6335]

sounds like magic the gathering lmao

[@bobwilson679]

@@Paerigos In the campaign I'm in the party recently had a counterspell duel last session against the BBEG. The BBEG just got the last artifact he needed for his evil plan. As he was trying to leave, we catch up and I cast hold person. The BBEG cast counterspell at 7th level. I cast counterspell in response, but don't roll high enough to counter it. Then the party abjuration wizard casts counterspell and rolls high enough. Hold Person resolves, and the BBEG fails the save... and then he uses a legendary resistance, and proceeds to yeet himself out of there. Realizing we don't have enough spell slots left to stop him, we don't give chase. Honestly it was a fun duel, kinda sad that the boss had legendary resistances tho

[@Yotun-of-the-WWW]

Another soft ban on the pixie-polymorph problem is, that the pixie must know the creature it is polymophing you into and since only the DM knows what the pixie knows you can nerf the spell pretty easily. Just picture a bunch of fluttering pixies looking puzzled at the request and asking the player characters in a squeaky voice: "What is tea-racks, can you drink that?". They are fey and mischievous by nature, they will try to fulfill the request of the summoner but probably can't help being pixies a bit of the time. It is like asking a water-elemental not to drip on the carpet.

[@alangriffith9453]

Then a PC just draws a T-rex or casts an illusion of one. Bam,, now the pixies know. Yeah that matters in combat, but in combat the enemy can just target the pixies like the video said. The overpowered part is when you summon the pixies out of combat so you can storm the castle as flying t-rexes or whatever with the pixies safely hidden at the back.

[@Yotun-of-the-WWW]

@@alangriffith9453 Still the fickleness of the pixies could see the pc's become fluffy pink miniature t-rexes, burping bubbles.

[@Sil3ntLynx]

​Sounds likely that they just turn into the party into random lizards or crocodiles. If it were true polymorph, I'd say "Even better, they turn everyone into drawings of the T-Rex", but that's me being mean

[@marcosantonio-hj7vp]

About the Polymorph and the Pixes what you think about: you can cast but not in your allies.

[@singledad1313]

"No, no, no. Not a Tea Racks, a T-REX" "Ohhh!! A giant tea bag with a crown on top! Coming right up! Should I polymorph the Rogue into a giant cup of hot water so you can steep in him?"

[@Snaog]

In the first DnD campaign I ever played the DM made an epic boss fight with a high level bard, which swiftly got demolished by two spellcasters with counterspell. Almost a year later I got to witness the joy of that same DM, now playing a wizard in one of the other players' campaign, casting counterspell on an enemy's Revivify. Absolutely perfect revenge.

[@Dinotk421]

any bard I make always either subclasses or feats to get counterspell, its just what makes sense for a character who is typically steeped in the lore of epic wizard fights and battles for the world.

[@TheGreatDanish]

My players and I treat Counter Spell like a nuke. If either one of them or I use counter spell, all bets are off and everyone starts using it. And since I think its a terrible spell and is literally anti-fun when used on players, I have effectively banned counter spell via fear of me using it back.

[@nathanfivecoate5848]

​@@TheGreatDanishMutually Assured Counterspelling

[@crowsenpai5625]

One of my favorite limiter tweaks for “Conjure Woodland Beings” I’ve heard is players can choose their creature, but it has to be a creature that fits with the current environment when cast. Like no summoning animals that live in trees when you’re in barren mountains. In that way Pixies, as fey, creatures, can only be summoned in areas closely linked with the Feywild or in the Feywild itself.

[@Packie318]

But the spell is literally "you summon fey creatures" not you summon creatures that live where your standing currently.

[@coreylouviere8960]

Yes but the dm and group agreed to how they want it to work on their group. The classic saying "the book is just a guideline, the dm has the final decision." Which is true you don't have to follow by the book.

[@rollieford2287]

One soft change of the spell. Let the player summon pixies, however when summoned they are non-playable. The caster can suggest actions but its up to the Pixies "dm" what they decide to do.. "arent pixies's mischievous"

[@buck_X]

I"ve always thought the spell itself is fine. The example used of its brokenness is always pixies, which should suggest that maybe the problem is with them. We just houseruled that pixies are CR 2, and the spell hasn't been a problem.

[@thechatteringclown]

funfact, if you believe sageadvice, the way the spell is intendend to work, is that it's actually the DM who's gonna decide what happens. unlike a spell like find familair, which gives the player a list of options to choose from, conjure woodland beings simply states that a certain amount of creatures of a certain cr appear. as the spell lacks a specific list for the player to choose from, all the player gets to choose is the amount of creatures and their cr, it's up to the DM to decide what will actually appear. instanly makes the spell a lot less broken that way.

[@loadnlock357]

In older editions counter spell was just an ability most casters had. The spell had to be countered with it's polar opposite. Like haste with slow for ex. Spell craft was used to identify the spell.

[@thecursed01]

wasn't it you could also use an equivalent spell slot but then had to make a spellcraft check while the polar opposite always counters?

[@loadnlock357]

@@thecursed01 yeah I'm pretty sure

[@thecursed01]

@loadnlock357 then there was the paladin and fighter version of counterspell: prepared (re)action armored fist to the face :)

[@tideoftime]

@@thecursed01 The options were: using a directly counter-effecting spell (Haste vs Slow, for instance) or using the spell, itself, to counter the noted spell (Ex: If you had Fireball, you could use that to counter another character's Fireball.) Simply having the same level slot available, even with a spellcraft roll, wasn't enough -- you had to either have a noted opposite or the spell itself.

[@diamondmx3076]

You could also use dispel magic to counter anything.

[@brandond2768]

reminder, wishes getting twisted or fails only happens when NOT replicating a spell of 8th level or lower

[@Daile0303]

Exactly. You can mimic any 8th level or lower spell without weakening yourself, and the DM can't monkey paw you on that

[@dustinwheeler3833]

@@Daile0303 says who? its dm discretion, if i want to make all wishes have a monkey paw effect, and the players know it, whats the issue? not like many campaigns actually get that high level anyways

[@thefracturedbutwhole5475]

@@dustinwheeler3833 says the spell description.

[@shiroamakusa8075]

@@thefracturedbutwhole5475 Zeroth law, what the DM says, goes. Otherwise there wouldn't even be any banning of spells, would there?

[@XmasterHUN]

There is a list of effects where the spell cant go wrong but you still have the 1/3 chance of losing Wish forever

[@StrifeTheHorseman]

As for "remove curse", I would say that the longer a curse lasts, the harder it is to remove it. Thus if during a battle some mage casts "bestow curse", you can relatively easy remove it with "remove curse". But if a curse lasts generations, well, good luck undoing it...

[@WriterKing92]

That's my workaround. I feel I should add context: I have this idea for an adventure loosely based on the Illiad where the "Helen" of the scenario had actually been cursed before she was even conceived by a very pissed-off archfey (they didn't like not being invited to her parents' wedding) with a two-part curse. Part 1 is that she'd grow so beautiful thousands would one day fight and die over her (case in point, the war where her kidnapping is leading to a brutal conflict between two kingdoms). Part 2 is on the full moon on her 21st birthday, she'd fall madly in love with the first person she made eye contact with... and the BBEG of this little adventure wants it to be HIM so he could rule over both kingdoms. The easiest way I thought about to completely and anticlimactically derail this plot was "Remove Curse", which can be cast at the earliest (if I read the Player's Handbook right) by a Level 5 Cleric, Wizard, or Warlock (but should the Warlock have an Archfey Patron, especially if it's the Archfey who roped her into this, I'd make it require a Persuasion Check with a DC of 20 to convince her to trust them), a Level 10 Paladin, or Level 13 Eldritch Knight Fighter or Arcane Trickster Rogue... and this is before we even talk about any other subclasses in supplements besides the Player's Handbook, Dungeon Master's Guide, or Monster Manual (I'm not sure about Tasha and Xanathar, yet). I intend this questline to be around Levels 8-12, so odds are, they'll have access to it. So I planned to have a higher DC depending on the spell slot they cast it with. And there will be a twist should they succeed on the spell at lower spell slots. This is what I came up with: 3rd Level (Default): DC of 30 (Nigh Impossible), the big side effect is that any future child she has will inherit her curse, resulting in a greater mess. 4th Level: DC of 25 (Very Hard, Requires Modifiers), only her firstborn daughter would 100% inherit the curse. 5th Level: DC of 20 (Hard, but can work), her firstborn daughter would only have a 50% chance of inheriting the curse. 6th Level: DC of 15 ( Normal), her firstborn daughter would only have a 25% chance of inheriting the curse. 7th Level: DC of 10 (Easy), her firstborn would have only a 5% chance (basically me rolling a Natural 1) of inheriting the curse. 8th Level: DC of 5 (The Dice are Cursed if this fails), no side effects. 9th Level: Don't bother rolling, you succeed with no side effects, but I'm touched you actually went this hard into removing an NPC's curse with your magic.

[@GalacticCoffee2077]

I like that. I will use it.

[@imadethistocommentonthings4787]

Remove curse should work like it does in Grim hollow in that you need special material and you need to be a certain lvl per the curse.

[@KaiCalimatinus]

Or having it fail and cause some kind of feedback, if someone tries to undo without taking the proper procedure, you could be temporarily afflicted with a temporary version of the same one

[@bronzieblue63]

I would basically treat Remove Curse like a more conditional version of Dispel Magic, except you have to meet the Curse's spell level to actually dispel it. Optionally, you COULD allow players to make a check using their spellcasting ability against the DC of the Curse (in the same way that Counterspell and Dispel Magic have you make a check if you aren't using a high enough spellslot to automatically dispel it) while casting Remove Curse but you may have to fiddle around with the DC of the check needed to dispel the curse, hopefully a player doesn't abuse the idea of being able to make repeated checks by spamming Remove Curse. If a player is problematic and spams Remove Curse in the hopes of just getting lucky with breaking it, you should probably establish additional consequences of either repeated failures over a short period or drastic failures that are like failing by 5 or more or something along those lines. Perhaps due to the magical connection that has to be established between the caster and the curse, a drastic failure means that a fragment of the curse is passed onto the caster attempting to dispel it (to put it crassly, like a magical STD). Or simply the curse's negative energy causes a rippling shockwave of energy that to anyone else feels as if there was a faint wave of pressure rippling through the air, but to the caster who established a direct connection, they recoil and are flung backwards as if they were knocked back by an explosion

[@Crash32378]

One of the best play sessions I've ever had was when the DM actually caused certain spells to fizzle and we had to find out why. That campaign lasted 2 months and went from local wizard supply to talking to a God. It was epic.

[@kylelees2064]

Well... tell us why man!?

[@Crash32378]

@@kylelees2064 The campaign was years ago but I still remember it. I still have the character sheet somewhere around here. An old dying God caused the weave to " break" trying to hold onto his last thread of life. In the end we had to stop the God and find a way to repair the weave. Which meant finding a wild mage willing to sacrifice themselves to repair the weave becoming part of it. It was AWESOME! We also had to find a God powerful enough to stop the old God and willing to intervene which wasn't to difficult considering they were all kinda miffed at the dying God.

[@mugenokami2201]

@@Crash32378 Gods and Goddesses Lords and Ladies step right up for your chance to beat the shades of shit out of the bastard breaking the weave.

[@saskiascott8181]

@@Crash32378 yeah that sounds epic

[@Xecryo]

Here's an interesting thought about Counterspell. As Kelly mentioned he'll only use it for a spell that targets the monster. Building on that and the apprentice spell casters idea, what if the apprentices each have a limited use counterspell but they only use it to protect their master. Because now we're talking a strategy of a boss encounter. If you take out the apprentices first you don't have to worry about counterspell. Alternatively a party might try taking out the necromancer with non-spell damage primarily.

[@fortunatus1]

Just to be clear, Matt Mercer's ritual communion with the soul of the fallen applies to raise dead and resurrection but it doesn't apply to revivify. Matt uses the expensive diamond cost of revivify and greater restoration as a limit on the players.

[@starcrafter13terran]

The exhaustion rule they suggested would help a lot also. Best suggestion they made on this channel at least for my campaign.

[@tibot4228]

There's also the resurrection roll for which the DC increases each time.

[@RyanAcidhedzMurphy]

Pretentious actor BS. I hate his idiotic, hypocritical rules in that regard. Magic can summon flaming meteors that can devastate a city? No problem. Magic can bring someone back to life? Not without extra, arbitrary hoops that do nothing but drag things out for the sake of dramatic wankery.. I will never understand where the notion that death in fiction means anything came from.. It certainly doesn't mean anything in real life.

[@artie9940]

@@RyanAcidhedzMurphy Well, doesn't mean anything to you. Good thing we all experience life and stories in different ways, imagine how boring the world would be otherwise

[@winsol]

@@RyanAcidhedzMurphy Yeah, why would a DM try and add drama to their campaign? *eye roll*

[@Nexsusthepro]

I love the image of a player and DM crossing their arms at each other going "I cast a spell: STARE:"

[@baatmilk]

I think it's worth mentioning, the rule requiring spells to be identified with a check is taken from the optional spellcasting rules in Xanathar's Guide, which proposes among other things that identifying a spell as its being cast would itself require a reaction to make an Arcana check. It's not like a random viral houserule.

[@MrVirus9898]

For 3:47, writers need to account for magic usage in D&D because that is the nature of the setting. The party will have access to magic the compels a response.

[@starshinewindlord2716]

turning "remove curse" into "adventure path required here" can either be super annoying or an epic storyline for a group of PCs. It really depends.

[@liondovegm]

Turning *Any* spell or ability into a time-consuming event with pomp is a risk. Same with any stealth or problem solving. Playing to satisfaction is hard.

[@jeremyc4811]

I love the idea mentioned in the video: having location or personal components to spells. Remove disease/curse has been a real bane of my existence in Pathfinder and DND. I really want healers to feel useful and varied, but nothing saps the drama from a sequence faster than coming up with an intricately cursed, tragic NPC only for a PC to cast remove curse (or for the DM to try to explain why the affliction 'isn't really a curse'). I would really like it if they came up with a small skill challenge for these kinds of cure-all spells, gave curses a DC that had to be overcome, or at the very least increased the spell level from 3 to 5. It's odd that a relatively weak lvl 5 cleric can go around dispelling multiple curses every day.

[@ERBanmech]

It really depends on the curse. Most curses are significant disadvantages with no benefit, which makes adventuring to break the curse all the more cumbersome. On the other hand, having some sort of benefit that comes with the curse is a way to make the adventure bearable, so at least the person with the curse can still feel like they aren't just dead weight.

[@BlackZethyr45]

In my Curse of Strahd campaign, I've turned Remove Curse into what is essentially a stun spell against lycanthropes as well as a means to stop an infected player from rampaging and force them back into their OG form like Moonbeam does (because of COURSE three of the plays get infected between two random encounters with werewolves). They've already completed the sidequest for Father Petrovich to remove their curses before they became permanent... they're just not doing it because they don't wanna.

[@emileo5024]

It should probably be rewritten as: remove minor curse, retaining the ability to break attunement, but only removing curses with equal or lesser spelllevel

[@jacquelinealbin7712]

I just counterspelled one of my players' Mass Healing Word spell that would have made the encounter a guaranteed win for them, with how it was going. Their reaction was priceless. But after the game, they said they liked how it upped the stakes and made tactics matter more!

[@brandond2768]

this is a good dm. play your villains smart. don't meta game, but all is fair. your players will respect you for taking them seriously and giving them a real challenge. good job

[@holykonchu7250]

laughs in assasin rouge/ 1 lvl of fighter for longbow proficiency and archery style so you have 150 ro 600 feet of range, screw you and all you stand for

[@jacquelinealbin7712]

@@holykonchu7250 good luck fighting 600 feet away from your target when the combat is taking place on a 70ft ship

[@cjslime8847]

That’s evil but you were smart you knew it wasn’t going to make them loose just make it harder that is one god tear dm mind

[@JameSeraphim]

@@jacquelinealbin7712 spike growth in front of the rouge. Boom.

[@blizzardthefox]

At our table, regarding counter spell, we use descriptions of the spell that aren't directly naming the spell. For example, the DM might say "the wizard fires a beam of concentrated fire from his hand" and if we decide that it's worth counterspelling, we do it, but there's still the chance it was just a firebolt and not a fireball.

[@plektosgaming]

+100! ALWAYS give descriptions instead of names, unless they absolutely KNOW what the monster or spell is. In magic, there are a thousand spells or potential variations, curses, innate abilities, item abilities, and so on out there. Something as simple as the appearance changing could be half a dozen different things. Other things like a summoning circle are pretty obvious and more along what the spell was designed for outside of a specialist's hands. Even most mages won't immediately recognize most spells over level 1 instantly. I also change the description or effect/color. Magical fire/mana comes in many colors and every mage's magic will tend to be its own preference or effect (my favorite was magic missile as tiny screaming skulls). There's also the element of subterfuge. Why announce your spell to every fool with counterspell or some item? *Learning* a spell means that you need to take the other person's instructions and integrate them into your own magic. So everyone's magic is a little different.

[@somedudewithakeyboard5388]

I'll never forget the DM who had Counterspell be the two spellcasters trying to convince the Weave to follow their commands, needing to argue logic and reasoning in the time it takes for a fireball to reach its destination

[@CocoWantsACracker]

That sounds funny, immersive and a chance to make epic memories!

[@somedudewithakeyboard5388]

@@CocoWantsACracker One of the funniest moments was a Boss Fight against a Wizard who tried to counterspell a Sorcerer from casting Heat Metal on the Wizard's Cold Iron prosthetic arm, which he would normally use to subdue Fey creatures. The Sorcerer, literally being the equivalent of a person half made of solid Weave, just said "It will be like ripping off a bandage, it'll hurt, but we'll both hurt less afterwards". The Weave listened to the Sorcerer, and the Wizard's arm then started boiling his body alive as he tried to pull it off. Bandage officially ripped off.

[@IMXLegedaryBard]

Monty saying he'll use counterspell for healing word, it's so evil but as a DM I couldn't help but grin as well lol

[@crownlexicon5225]

Yeah, I asked my players about that when we started our current campaign. They said "if that's what he'd do, do it"

[@saint3371]

I did it once for the introduction of a super evil mage. Counterspelled 3 healing words from the bard and cleric. They survived but only by pleading. They hated her so much, which was perfect. Their revenge later was so sweet

[@crazyscotsman9327]

I did it once when the Cleric used his last spell slot to use healing word to try and save the paladin. The Rogue is the one who saved the Paladin by using a medical kit.

[@37thgungrunts]

Id dance a jig if the GM counterspelled a bonus action spell. That means my much bigger and nastier spell can be safely cast.

[@fhuber7507]

Evil wants to win. Counterspell vs healing is winning.

[@r.downgrade5836]

Counterspelling something like 'Healing Word' is something I save for really high end bosses like hags or other bosses a level 10 or above party would face, because, by then, you have an enemy that, even if they have never heard of the party, have at least heard of heroes who keep coming back from the brink of death with but the barest touches of healing magic to deal critical blows to their foes.

[@aaronhaskins9782]

as a GM I've never had an issue with Counterspell, villains love it.

[@malvatoss5840]

One of my friends banned wish in a really fun way in his campaign. For the characters with high enough arcana lore they could learn about this ancient demi-lich who was infamous for removing the wish spell from existence through some unspeakable ritual.

[@redhoodie4111]

the ritual was just the demi-lich casting its own Wish, which was "no wish for you"

[@Student4Life89]

cringe, house-rule removing fun.

[@mr.bobdabbalina1246]

​@@Student4Life89you're cringe

[@Darkuschris21]

​@@Student4Life89how is that cribge? Some people just dont wanna deal with all that insane, gamebreaking shit lmao

[@pendingchange3776]

OK but here is the thing a good dm can work around wish pretty easily

[@TheAurgelmir]

When it comes to "Because clerics exist" I ruled this very simply when it comes to worldbuilding: There aren't a lot of Clerics, most clergy are priests. Even then the raise dead spells are very rare and expensive.

[@lolihitler4198]

I don’t understand why everyone feels the need to make every village priest a level 1 cleric it really makes more sense for pretty much any setting for miracle workers to be very rare

[@RyanWBL]

@@lolihitler4198 yup, most non heroic heroic NPCs should be commoners imo.

[@MonkeyJedi99]

In my campaigns, I usually limit resurrections with a few mechanisms. First, the target's religion influences the percentage chance they will come back. A follower of a god of the cycle of life and death is unlikely to come back, while a follower of a god of luck get's a base 50/50 chance. Second, the target has choice. If the target is "done with life" they just won't come back. A target may choose not to be resurrected by an enemy interested in their secrets. A target may really want to come back for the sake of their small children. Third, I usually add a difficulty to the casting, such as it can only be done in a 'sanctified' location that fits the religion of the target. Or maybe followers of a particular religion can only be raised in certain moon phases. Or there is a high price of special herbs, incense, special paint for a ritual circle, blessed candles, etc.

[@Hazel-xl8in]

even court mages only need to be around 7th level. that’s high enough for something like private sanctum, which is what we expect a court mage to be able to do, but not so high as to break completely break the worldbuilding for that nation.

[@MonkeyJedi99]

@@Hazel-xl8in Add in a cleric just high enough level to cast Zone of Truth, and you get private meetings without lies. great for treaty and contract negotiations.

[@thecookiemeister5374]

I’m very honestly shocked that Wall of Force isnt on this list, it’s a catch all for nearly any large creature encounter when you can just… lock the most powerful threat in its own wall of force tomb

[@tomc.5704]

It probably should be on the list, because there's some seriously broken combos that a party can do. But honestly, the counterplay is to not throw a single big enemy at your party. If you're running 4+ encounters per day (as you should) then it becomes less of a big deal. The party has to properly manage their resources, and they get rewarded for doing so. Alternatively, make Wall of Force a 6th level spell, and Forcecage an 8th level spell.

[@andybraid4263]

Force cage and sickening radiance combo. Can a demi-god die from exhaustion.. lets find out..!

[@wesleywyndam-pryce5305]

@@tomc.5704 4+ combats per session? "as you should?" do you have 12 hour sessions?

[@wesleywyndam-pryce5305]

@@tomc.5704 why would you get in 4 different fights EVERY DAY. do you do anything besides combat?

[@tomc.5704]

@@wesleywyndam-pryce5305 DMG, page 84, I believe. And no, you would not do this all in one play session. A single "day" would take at least two or three sessions, and you would still strive to have all three pillars of gameplay. No one does it, but that's how the game was built. 2/3 of the reason casters and nova builds are so strong is most DMs only run one or two encounters per adventuring day, and then everyone gets to take a long rest.

[@lmungillo]

For plane shift, I made the “tuning forks” stationary. They were like gateways or portals. They still needed the spell, be in the location, and it required a toll of some kind

[@isaacgraff8288]

That is pretty cool. I like it

[@lmungillo]

@@isaacgraff8288 thanks! Thankfully, my party didn’t use it too often. They preferred the regular plane and so do I lol

[@noahmehringer29]

It's like the Realm bridge (bifrost) in God of War 2018. You could use them like hubs or have to travel way out of the way just to get to one.

[@lmungillo]

@@noahmehringer29 right!! I described them like a mix of the Oblivion gates from ES4 Oblivion and the Guardian stones from ES5 Skyrim. They were done shaped but had runes cut into them. And they would light up light the guardian stones lol (I’m an Elder Scrolls nerd)

[@nathanthom8176]

I made my world a post a planar war/cataclysm one. I made planar travel an incredibly dangerous endeavour unless beacons/gates are used. I also made it so that in some places planes have merged giving areas of Shadow fell etc in the world (that way I can plan for going to the shadow fell or one of the hells etc).

[@mrbaitandwatch2259]

As a new DM, I have been loving your channel. Not just because you are easy to follow and very intuitive, but also for the people you draw to the comments giving even more good feedback.

[@bigwig8657]

I love how Monte goes full bbeg on counterspell, "yes it will crush their souls 😈"

[@billhart3728]

Said with a wry smile

[@Ilithrya]

All behold the future Doctor Martin...motivator of DMs and nurturer of worlds.

[@davidlindsay5905]

I counterspelled healing word and it was wonderful

[@NapatCID]

@@Ilithrya to get p

[@007narufan]

@@davidlindsay5905 lqu61

[@No_Named_Nobody]

i'm still relatively new to dnd and took counterspell. One of my favorite thing that's happened so far is when i counterspelled someone, and his ally counterspelled me. My spell didn't work but it was still really cool

[@aqacefan]

I was looking at the perma-death of my Warlock a few weeks ago, when he was fighting an owlbear that took him from 10 hp to -43 thanks to a crit during an AL run. But he was saved by random chance, not once but twice. The previous week, we had been awarded Robe of Useful Items; two of the random patches on his were for 100 gp gems (10 per patch). And the Druid of the group had Revivify memorized. Had those two factors not overlapped, I would have had to roll a new character. 30:23 "cold, dead hands". And a Simulacrum is made of snow. I see what you did there, Monte.

[@Fredrikwikberg]

cooL !

[@beowulf.reborn]

Breaking up wish into a 9th level version of Anyspell, that gives you the Wish's ability to cast any 8th level spell or lower, and then Permanency, and some sort of Greater Fabricate, would be a cool way to reign in Wish as a spell, whilst also allowing Wishes to become something that exist in the World that are super powerful (Artifact level power).

[@ZttackFrmBhind]

In Pathfinder, Wish is limited by having a material component of a Diamond worth 25000 gold. This drastically limits the shenanigans that players can get up to. "Yah, sure you can cast whichever spell in the game you want, but it'll cost you half of the value of a dragon's hoard."

[@Mabujold]

Counterspell is getting/got a pretty big nerf where a lot of spellcasters are getting their spells replaced by abilities that do the same thing, and since it won't be a spell anymore, you can't counterspell it.

[@isaacgraff8288]

That would also hardcore nerf the Mage Slayer feat... which frankly needs some love as is.

[@arcticbanana66]

Just note whether the ability says "this ability does [x]", or "This ability allows you to cast [x] spell." Per page 5 of the Sage Advice Compendium: "For a Way of Shadow monk, can their _silence_ be dispelled? A spell is a spell, no matter its source. when you cast a spell through a feature, the spell is subject to the normal spellcasting rules, unless the feature says otherwise." Most primary spellcasters' class features aren't spells but things you can do, but many other class features just say you can effectively cast a spell, such as many warlock Invocations, and a lot of what monks spend Ki Points to do (especially Four Elements and Sun Soul, but _not_ Open Hand). _Counterspell_ and _dispel_ can shut those down (and they trigger Mage Slayer), but I've almost never seen anybody counter or dispel a Searing Arc Strike or Bewitching Whispers even though they could.

[@noahmehringer29]

A sorcerer or someone who took the Meta-magic feat can use Subtle-spell to bypass Counter-spell as well because without V or S components how does someone know your casting a spell.

[@transientanus]

@@noahmehringer29 true, but that's also super situational. Theyd have to know their enemy is capable of counterspell first, otherwise they're just wasting sorcery points. But in the event that an earlier spell of theirs was counterspelled, giving them the knowledge their enemy could do it, using subtle spell to bypass it is actually pretty ingenious. Again, super situational but in that specific situation, absolutely clutch.

[@Person01234]

@@transientanus sorcery points could be spared for a situation in which it's important for a particular spell to go off and it's plausible the enemy has counterspell. Subtle can also be good for other purposes, such as not letting general observers know who cast a spell or being able to cast a spell whilst bound and gagged, it's a fun one to keep around imo.

[@benh2339]

if you're banning 9th level spells cause they "break the game," then I'm afraid you don't know how that tier of dnd works.

[@alyzz9863]

@@thothamon9046 you do not go to tier 4 if you like low magic settings

[@avocadoarms]

your argument would hold any weight if 9th level spells were at all well and consistently designed, but they weren't.

[@alyzz9863]

@@thothamon9046 dunno, why cant you have a wizard with Wish in a low magic setting?

[@alyzz9863]

​@@thothamon9046 >Lord of the Rings lol A tier 4 character in DnD SHOULD be able to do all these things. If that bothers your sense of setting, then don't play at these levels or don't play DnD at all, as it is a high magic system in its core.

[@sethsalahadin]

@@thothamon9046 "why can't you have a conan or elric like character who's high level in a low magic setting?" People need to understand that d&d5 and d&d in general is a high fantasy game, not a low magic, low fantasy game. You can do a game, by making new rules, twisting some, that is more dark, more low fantasy but it the d&d system is not design to fit a conan or any other low magic universe; specially in high level. If you want to play a very powerful high level barbarian in a low magic fantasy do it with a game system design for that. A conan or Elric game (they exist) for example; the rules in those games are more design to create the atmosphere of those universe than d&d5 rules. D&D is great for epic adventure in high fantasy and magic universe not low fantasy and low magic setting; it can work (at low level) but the more you gain power the less the rules, habilities and others will help to keep this atmosphere of low magic. So just use another system and have fun with it. People need to stop trying to turn d&d5 into everything.

[@tristenl6938]

“It’s such a winning move” 😂😂😂 Monty”s take on Counterspelling Healing word made my week.

[@wesomek]

That's why I use good berry to revive players :)

[@FacebookAunt]

@@wesomek "Eating a berry restores 1 hit point" so it doesn't take effect unless eaten. How do you get an unconscious person to chew and swallow a berry? Drop it in their mouth and it isn't eaten, they just have a berry lodged in their throat.

[@joec9693]

Kelly: It will make your players feel bad! Monty: (smiling) Yeah oh yeah it's brutal!

[@wesomek]

@@FacebookAunt use you imagination. You a dnd player aren't you?

[@Hidden-Brush-org]

@@FacebookAunt that would be the same for healing potions then...

[@liger8869]

The Scanlan 9th Level Counter Spell on Vecna will always have a special place in my heart no matter how evil that spell is lol.

[@davidhfranz]

Especially because he was saving that spellslot to try to override the Raven Queen's pact with Vaxildan using a wish spell.

[@beanjuice4263]

i dont tell players what spell is being cast, but i do let them use their reaction to identify the spell. Whether they succeed or fail, they can decide to counterspell as part of the same reaction. Its been working really well

[@mendrik.]

For me it depends on how good your players are. I'm letting my wizard make an arcana check for most counterspells, because otherwise it would just be powerful.

[@joseof-]

Frankly, one should be able to recognize a spell freely if they have seen it cast before, or better yet, know the spell themselves.

[@individualismincarnate6467]

I personally run it if the caster of CounterSpell has the spell being cast or has someone in the party who casts it on a semi regular basis, no check (Arcana) needed. If that isn't met, I set the DC at spell level plus how rare the spell is in the world (my decision but...my world so I know) +3 for common, +5 uncommon, +10 rare, +15 very rare. If they pass they know what the spell is and what level it's being cast at. If they fail by less than 5 they know what level the spell is. More than 5 they know nothing of use. Most users of CounterSpell will usually be proficient in Arcana so they rarely don't know what it is. Usually balances what it is and it's a free action, not the reaction so they can use the reaction for other things but can still only do it once per turn

[@ViccVegaa023]

I would rule that a caster can recognize any spell that they themselves can cast. Otherwise they need to make an Arcana Check. I think that fixes most of the spell's perceived issues.

[@Blobby3822]

@@joseof- Mages cast the same spells in different ways my friend.

[@hannahbecton9209]

Re: Curses In a campaign I’m in, it was a big part of one of our character’s backstories that members of his family did something that was looked upon disfavorably, and everyone (including that character, who was very young and had no say in the event) was on the receiving end of some Elven High Magic to strip their memory of the event. With that character, it had a nasty unintended side effect of basically making him forget pretty much everything that’s happened in his life if it was more than a few months old. He confesses this to our party during a cooldown night before we had to go face the BBEG of that arc. My character, a bard with Greater Restoration, heard that and became concerned that it would negatively impact his ability to fight. Because whatever was done to the affected character was similar to a Modify Memory spell, she figured she could remove it with Greater Restoration. Here’s where it becomes relevant to 1000-year curses and Remove Curse… She was trying to lift the effects of Elven High Magic. That’s trying to negate 10th level+ spells with a 5th level spell. Our DM asked me what my Spell Save DC was (17) and had the other character make a Wisdom save. He made it, lifting the effects and giving him a level of exhaustion. Our DM informed us after the fact that had he not made the save, he would’ve died. TL;DR: If you’re trying to remove some big curses, have some big consequences.

[@nickkowalski5209]

A DM's word is the law, of course, but killing a PC outright without them knowing the stakes doesn't seem to be meaningful. Should the character die it'd bring only frustration (unless the party has a revivify or something) and if they live they don't even know they could've died. To punish a player for meddling with matters they can't even comprehend throw in some nasty but reversible condition. Drop them uncontious with 0hp as a quicky, or make them blind or petrified. Depending on the party you could make it so that only a special potion/ritual cold reverse the state so now they've got an adventure in their adventure to have more adventure (and a chance to learn what went wrong and why you don't mess with ancient Elven magic)

[@Zombiesbum]

@@nickkowalski5209 I agree with this. Stating "if you failed, then consequences" after the fact is completely meaningless. Players should be made aware of the risks beforehand.

[@Ajehy]

Yeah. Perhaps, in the case of a failed roll, the curse would infect him too?

[@elysemccarty1415]

@@Ajehy That's honestly a great way of wording it. If you fail, it rebounds on you. I also like the idea of warning the PC of what happens if they meddle, be it death, blindness, petrification, rebounding the spell, etc.. "You begin to cast greater restoration... you realize that removing this curse could be dangerous. You get the impression that your restoration spell must battle the curse, and if it fails, there will be deadly/serious consequences. Even if it succeeds, it will be exhausting for you both. Do you want to continue casting this spell?" Subtly letting them know that they can certainly TRY to do what they want, but that if they fail they could kill the other PC.

[@plektosgaming]

@@nickkowalski5209 +100. Having them have a crippling headache halfway through the attempt is better than "it fails - DOOM!". Let them know that this is probably going to make their head explode to attempt, if they go on. As flavor, maybe have them gain a tiny bit of the curse or something similar as a side effect for meddling with powers beyond their level. That way their own poor decisions give them new quests and new problems to solve rather than "roll up a new character".

[@maxvandalfsen8273]

Counterspell in a party with multiple mages fighting other mages is really cool and interesting. Chaining multiple counterspells to see who lets up first and at what point the original spell going off/failing is worth it anymore

[@Hazel-xl8in]

is this from experience? or is it hypothetical?

[@pda8987]

Based on my experience with MTG and blue vs blue - nope it will be not.

[@laurencebernstein1233]

My experience is that it can be quite a cliff-hanger.. I use Arcana rolls to determine what you know about the spell as it is being cast, then the mage has to decide whether to counter it. In my recent BBEG fight with Sorceror & Wizard vs. Nagpa, the Wizard decided not to counter a spell the Nagpa threw on himself that he couldn't identify exactly. It turned out to be Eyebite.

[@dyeager152]

I play an abjuration wizard and my party’s warlock has counterspell too. So when we tried to assassinate this evil elf wizard the battle got ridiculous 😂😂😂

[@crimfan]

This can be fun from time to time, I agree, but it's ripe for abuse and really hoses over some casters, such as Warlocks.

[@nathanrailsback9667]

Best version of the "fluency mistranslates" thing I've seen that could work with Comprehend Languages: In Terry Pratchett's Making Money, an archeologist wizard says, at a crucial point, "Remember when I said that the dig would turn up four golden golems? Well, it turns out that in the ancient ______ language, the word for gold is almost identical to the word for thousand, and they really rely on context clues to differentiate between them..." *Ominous rumbling as a massive army starts to come into view.*

[@briankelly1240]

As a DM I love characters learning what happened through identify or similar spells. I worked hard on campaign I want them to learn about it!

[@Modernsour19]

I really love how you gave us options to use these spells in our games without breaking the game and even adding more flavor to already fun abilities

[@DutchBlackMantha]

If you have a curse that can't be removed with Remove Curse, I feel the spell shouldn't just fail. It should give information about how to break it. Maybe with more information depending on how high level you cast it.

[@rohenthar8449]

I hate banning spells, after all, as you said, there are tons of creative ways to bypass this spells imbalance, but its rare for DM to do them, they are mostly purists. Anyway, great video.

[@Supremax67]

You can tell the party that if they'll be using Goodberry, the difficulty of the campaign will go up by having a lot of escort quests. We didn't have Goodberry in our party, but we did have a quests where we were escorting almost 100 creatures which didn't know how to hunt.

[@slimee8841]

People complain about goodberry, but the Outlander background also has a similar ability as a feature. And there are other spells in the game that can create food or water, although only at slightly higher levels

[@xenonuke1194]

the difference between a 3rd lvl spell and a 1st lvl are quite different

[@DaDunge]

Your background is a lot more of an investment than a single spell preparation.

[@pda8987]

Outlander's background feature require location to contain food and water, so there is a level to pull if you want. Plus you can also rule as DM - "you have to spend your 2 free hours from the rest so you need someone else to keep watch". Goodberry is lvl1 free spell which have cast time of one action...

[@rhysjonsmusic]

The thing with the outlander background is that its dependent on the natural resources of the area.

[@nimric3348]

@@xenonuke1194 yeah but if your starving you don't care what spell level it is the thing Is that both spells equally derail that play style if they are allowed. But it makes since that they would exist, who wouldn't work on creating magic to not starve.

[@LowLifeAM]

I wouldn’t ban detect magic or identify, some games seem to assume to party has it and it ends up being their only lead in some magic based mysteries.

[@orangejuice481]

Dude I think I got brain damage trying to read your comment.

[@Nethar6]

Advice to any DM's, always check your players spell list when planning your games

[@austindenny7094]

I love counterspell and I want to throw in an idea that would help get around the case of a DM wanting to have a powerful spellcasting boss against an adventurer crew with several spellcasters with counterspell. The DM can give the boss apprentice wizards as guards and those guards can counterspell the party's counterspells. In the magic cardgame, a duel between two spell-heavy wizards often includes several of these counterspell battles and they can be quite exciting

[@jamiespooner6597]

So a fun one, in regards to good berry, I ran Toa for a group of people who had this spell, I just made the dinosaurs in the forest more aggressive in regards to these. Should a player have a good berry on them, or consume one. The aroma of these would attract more dangerous creatures to them. (Nullifying the survival aspect, but bringing forth harder combat challenges + Giving the players a choice on how they want to proceed for the next day or so). This system worked really really well, and if the party was a bit low on resources, they would spend a bit longer looking for food and water. But if speed was their goal, good berries + harder encounters would be the way forwards.

[@GrimmundusRex]

See, the problem with this is that you've made an in-universe rule that "Goodberries attract Dinos". Either the dinos have a great sense of smell and can scent-track goodberries, or there's some magical f***ery going on. Either way, you've established a precedent with an interesting corollary: "If goodberries _attract_ dinos, then goodberries _lure_ dinos, and thus serve as excellent bait for a trap." Add in a PC with a high enough animal handling stat, and suddenly every PC has a CR1+ mount. Alternatively, if one of your players has a flying familiar, then an easy way to sneak past a strong critter or dangerous area would be to fill a bag with a casting of goodberry with a few rocks on top, give the bag to the familiar, have them fly a mile or two off the path, then drop the bag. Instant enemy lure, leaving the path much clearer for your clever players.

[@1Ring42]

I like the animated spellbooks tweak to goodberry for survival campaigns.

[@mal2ksc]

The Goodberry provides nourishment for one day. But it doesn't say anything about satisfying hunger. I've also houseruled that you can only eat one Goodberry per round. You have to wait for each one to do its thing, otherwise you're just too full for another one. This doesn't (and shouldn't) matter when the party is camped, but it does if the situation is unsafe and you're trying to gain HP in a hurry. A handful of Goodberries are not a free healing potion, as far as action economy goes. But they're fine for topping the party up to full after a short rest, without burning hit dice or potions that are overkill.

[@brandonmiller4868]

I gotta say, I absolutely love counterspell, and while I definitely see how it can get annoying and broken, easily one of the wildest and most harrowing encounters I've had in my current campaign was because of counterspell. Our party of 2 was fighting the simulacrum of a long-dead, incredibly powerful (read: lvl 20) wizard. Unbeknownst to my character (a very spell-dependent sorcerer/cleric), the simulacrum carried a wand able to cast counterspell a certain number of times per day. The party had gotten the macguffin and was very, very low on health, magic, you name it, when we encounter the simulacrum. Within two rounds, the other player is unconscious, and realizing that we are outmatched and about to die, my character tries to pull her signature move by dimension-dooring her way out of the dungeon. Counterspelled. Horror dawns on me as I realize I might actually die here, but I wager the simulacrum might be running out of spell slots. So I try again, and get counterspelled once more. In desperation, I call upon a powerful fae I'm already indebted to to give us a fighting chance, and now owe her even more, only the dm knows what that might entail. Finally, my character has a moment of clarity and realizes (because she also has counterspell) that the simulacrum must *see* her to cast the spell. So finally, with her last 4th level spell slot, my character pulls the other party member just out of sight, and we're able to briefly escape the dungeon. We end up killing the simulacrum outside the dungeon in the end, but realizing that not every problem can be run away from (via the use of counterspell) was pivotal for both me and my character.

[@testfire3000]

That is a very cool adventure! And a powerful learning experience. Not every fight can you charge into headlong, sometimes you have to retreat. Not every fight can you run from either. Plan A is great, keep Plan B at the ready. But you gotta have a Plan C or maybe D sometimes too. *High Five* to you and your playing group!

[@dndbasement2370]

i hate counterspells do be done on monsters... because of a single reason.. the action economy of monsters is whackly out of balance. as in players let's say 5 of them, clearly have lots more actions to do then say that bandit king and his 5 minions. right there you got players who have a lot options. while your bandits will just stand there losing turns every rounds until they are done. thats why most of the monsters from upcoming books of D&D now will be more action oriented and less about spell casting. basically our monsters wont be casting spells anymore, they will be using actions or special abilities instead. its cool they will still have some spells because thats how it works... but say a pitfiend who has fireball at will might end up hvaing it in an action instead. otherwise, that pit fiend, every turns will be countered and do nothing. this actually hapenned to me a few times, where the pitfiend literally couldn'T attack for like 5 turns in a row. 5 turns, he was dead. he justs didn't do a thing. thats the kind of problem that monsters get. so i understand th epoint... but banning counterspell isn't the solution, because it is necessary. that said my rules on it is... even if you are a player.. you always tell me what you are casting and i will do the same if any of the party members can know the spell. the spells can only be known if it is on your casters spell list. aka a wizard can only know the wizard spells, a cleric knows only the cleric spells. and i do not allow them to freely just casually say he'scasting that, counterspell it. because its a reaction. by the time you say that, its already casted. people have to realise that the game isn't 6 seconds by turn. its 6 seconds an entire rounds. that means everyone moves at the same time.

[@breyor1]

Good berry in gritty realism is actually interesting, since it’s 1/7th it’s power compared to normal.

[@JarieSuicune]

A number of spells, such as Planar Shift, that have specialized material components are examples of where the Material Components rules need to be cleaned up. Something like: -Common Component: Included as part of a Component Pouch -Uncommon Component: Must be purchased/stolen/etc. individually and tracked -Rare Component: A limited number exist and must be purchased/stolen/etc. and tracked -Legendary Component: Quest-only item.

[@VoltieBird]

I hate it when DMs ban something as a kneejerk reaction to an item or a spell having an unexpected effect on their campaign or encounter. One of my favorite moments in recent games I've played was when my party got to the end of a dungeon and discovered an enormous fire elemental. I was playing a fighter, and wasn't keen on the idea of wading into melee with a living tornado of flames and molten lava, so I started looking through my equipment to see what ranged options I had available, and that was when I remembered I had picked up a decanter of endless water just in case we ran into any survival situations where we needed clean water. For those unaware, the decanter of endless water has three command words; stream, fountain, and *geyser*. Rather than tell me no, the firehose blast of water from my decanter would have no impact on the elemental because it would change the dynamic of her encounter, the DM excitedly assigned a damage value to it and started thinking of clever ways the elemental might react to try and neutralize my watery threat. Yes, it changed what had been planned, yes it made the fight easier than it was intended, but that's just the nature of D&D, and everyone had a lot of fun.

[@kendallchaos]

Exactly, that’s how dms should be, the stereotype of players destroying campaigns/one shoting the bbeg with a crazy idea that’s just crazy enough to work is so prominent…because it happens, and how dms react is what separates a good dm from a bad power trippy dm

[@lucasleiva8215]

Yes, but you were a fighter with some random resource that you took because of a "maybe" moment. Casters get weird shit all the time and their only use of imagination is taking a long rest to use it again. And they actually have a spell that do that for extra brain dead.

[@notmyrealname4363]

Yes! The point is to make people think.

[@kjellgunnartrimbo-forthun6052]

I liked Zee's goodberry idea, where goodberry consumes the material component

[@MonkeyJedi99]

Consuming a listed material component when it would not otherwise be consumed (RAW) is a neat way to change the whole game. If all material components are consumed, the party has to put a lot more resources and thought into keeping their spellcasters functioning. And so would governments and enemies.

[@pda8987]

@@MonkeyJedi99 Unfortunately nope - it would lead to the issue that the power level is the same, you just force players to do more dumb "work".

[@MonkeyJedi99]

@@pda8987 opinions differ, I guess.

[@guilhermeteixeira4421]

I made this adjustment to the goodberry spell so that the mistletoe was spend. Since mistletoe doesn't exist in the jungle, the druid had to stock up and spend gold to buy the mistletoe in the start of the adventure when the characters didn't have gold in abundance. It is not too expensive but it is a limitation nonetheless for a survival adventure in the middle of a jungle.

[@KB-fk3jj]

@@pda8987 Doing dumb work is what Dungeons and Dragons is about, otherwise it would just be another simple rpg clicking buttons. Some people are actually interested in that kind of play, like myself. It may be better to view hunger as an interesting mechanic rather than a silly addition, I mean, I eat everyday so why not my PC?

[@kyokonightstorm5844]

Remove Curse as an adventure on it's own reminds me of the "Curse" of Redcliffe in Dragon Age Origins. If you seek to root out the heart of the Curse, you have to go get the mages from the Tower. And while the tower is its own quest, after that quest (or you did it first), going in to remove the curse's source is still an involved process and requires effort on the player's part.

[@lightning2034]

I picked it up because it was a situational spell (even though we were playing curse of strahd). Our Ireena got bit by strahd and was getting worse. Our Cleric and Warlock also had remove curse but we had to overcast it together to remove one level of vampirism. it made for a fantastic moment in game

[@plektosgaming]

Yep. Basically since there's no "identify curse" spell, all of this takes time. You have the tool but without knowing how to apply it, you're still at square 1.

[@Pennywise12528]

I dunno if the 5e version has some sort of tweak that makes it not a thing now, but I always assumed that the main hurdle to summoning Pixies for Polymorph exploits is that you're summoning PIXIES. One of the most well known examples of Fey being dangerous not because they're inherently malicious, but because they don't really understand how non-fey work and will likely harm them even if they don't intend to. Like the Pixies you've summoned might not know what a T-Rex is, but have seen a crocodile and mistake that for what you're describing. Or they may not like the tone of your voice and plan to 'Playfully' revoke the flight enchantment when you're a couple hundred feet off the ground. Or they might polymorph and flight enchant you as normal, then do the same thing to your enemy because "It's only fair."

[@JohnDoe-bf7hb]

The actual issue with that spell is just that people dont actually READ the spell. The Caster does not get to decide what they summon. The GM does. The only choice the caster gets is the number of creatures/CR level. The GM then decides what they summon. Also they do not get complete control over the creatures either. The creatures are NPC's played by the GM. They player can then 'ask' the creatures to do something, and then the GM interprets the instructions using the lens of the creature. It is not Mind control/complete domination of the summoned creatures. The rest of this is absolutely valid and should 100% be used.

[@mariekeho]

@@JohnDoe-bf7hb Looks like you didn't bother to read the spell as well. It never specifies that the DM chooses what they summon, it just mentions that the DM has the statistics, which seems like a way for the player to not have to prepare the stats of whatever they're trying to summon and put it on the DM to just pull up the statistics. And they do get complete control over the creatures. It literally specifies that the player rolls initiative for them, and can give them verbal commands, no action needed.

[@Nixoth]

The way i handle counterspell is by enforcing that range of 60 feet. Do u wanna counterspell? You gotta stay close. Most casters dont want to stay close

[@wwade7226]

Thank you! High Five for you! I've commented a lot on this video because banning spells is just lazy DMing. DM's should simply use the built in limitations (component rarity, range, time, etc.) rather than take the easy way out via banning.

[@Nixoth]

@@wwade7226 this 💯

[@guyman1570]

Really? 60 ft feels ludicrously far enough for a caster. Most encounters are usually 50 ft or less.

[@Nixoth]

@@guyman1570 most in my games tend to stay further away with longer range spells. Then they try to counterspell and most often i count the squares sorry mate too far away

[@noahmehringer29]

And if you're casters have shield or other reaction spells/abilities their using, counter-spell won't even work if they've already used their reaction.

[@HappilyHomicidalHooligan]

If I were ever to become a GM, I wouldn't make any Curses in my game Immune to Remove Curse, BUT I would make the use of Remove Cure difficult as suggested in the Video. Simple, low power Curses are easily removed. Century Old, Bloodline Curses cast on the Family by an immensely powerful Demi-God on the other hand are going to be FAR more difficult and costly to remove...

[@burningshine5524]

Imo, best what you can do with curses is, that it can be removed with the Remove Curse spells, but: You need to identify the curse You need tk find out how to dispell it You need to do the ritual endeding with the Remove Curse spell

[@russellstanley8884]

I've had a few cursed items in my game that you can use Remove Curse on, but if no one else is subjected to curse (i.e. attunes to the item), the item will automatically become attuned to the last creature that attuned to it at midnight/dawn/etc. So you either find a way to pass the item along to someone else, find a way to permanently break the curse, or use a 3rd level spell slot every day to keep removing the curse.

[@plektosgaming]

As a good general rule, failing to undo a curse, if not successful, means you meddled with the magic and now some of it has affected you in return. Not the full curse, but enough to potentially cause a larger problem or another quest to deal with.

[@Kevlar2010]

Regarding "Remove Curse" you could add in language to the effect of, "Powerful curses may require additional components to aid in the removal of the curse. If these components are necessary, they will be revealed to the caster upon the first cast of Remove Curse. Once they are revealed, subsequent castings of Remove Curse will have no further effect until such time as all required components are present."

[@briancoolbreeze]

A detail about counterspell; in 3rd edition and 3.5 there was no counterspell spell. Instead, you had to have the same spell prepared and then use it against the enemy and pass a specific skill check. If they cast Fireball you had to cast Fireball. So if you didn't have the specific spell prepared or available then you couldnt counterspell

[@HBookbinderGM]

Spoiler: Fascinating that a climactic dramatic moment in Critical Role Campaign One is the Bard with a Wish spell choosing between Counterspell and saving a party member. Seeing this moment on Matt Colville’s channel is what got me watching Critical Role. I had seen this powerful and emotional moment and wanted to see how these players and their pcs got to this moment.

[@Darkjonny79]

Such a good moment as well. Choosing between losing his best friend, or losing other friends. The choice he made was a hard one, but it saved the world.

[@testfire3000]

It was a very powerful moment and the ramifications of it hit like a sledgehammer.

[@patrickanderson3373]

Im my games, I added wardens of the planes called 'plane repears' and every time a player uses a spell like dimension door, blink, plane shift, etc, they risk attracting the attention of the plane reapers, who seek to punish trespassers.

[@robertb6889]

The auditors of reality?

[@mitchhaelann9215]

Hounds of Tindalos. Same thing.

[@admiraltonydawning3847]

"plane repairs"? "plane reappears"?

[@JacopoSkydweller]

@@admiraltonydawning3847 He spelled it right the second time, it was just a typo, don't be that guy, guy.

[@Uncle-Jay]

Yuck, I often use blink to avoid dangerous situations, I've probably used it in every fight my character had. I would hate the idea of being punished for using a spell that's part of the core rules.

[@holyknightthatpwns]

Counterspell only having a range of 60 feet is such an easy and obvious weakness to the spell, I'm surprised that people don't find ways to play around it more.

[@Njilin]

Yeah, as someone who LOVES using powerful spellcasters against a group where there is usually at least 2-3 characters capable of counterspelling I have become quite an expert on avoiding it. Its range is one weakness, but a much more important one is line of sight, if the caster is invisible, if the caster is behind a wall, if the caster is within a darkness spell or basically obscured in any way they cannot really be countered. Heck, sometimes the best way to avoid it is just to place a massive iron golem between your spellcaster and theirs and have it obstruct line of sight that way.

[@gram1438]

the slight issue with that is, if you are playing that much keep away the melee fighters are doing nothing that fight.

[@holyknightthatpwns]

@@gram1438 Honestly, if you're at a high enough level that counterspells are commonplace and the melee fighters don't have any mobility or range options to use in the circumstances, that feels like it's on them. To be clear, I don't do 200 ft range battles all the time, and sometimes it does devolve into a counterspell fest - but I do generally tell my players that it's on them to try to adapt to different scenarios and not to expect that I'll play into their hands.

[@RedrumZombies]

@@gram1438 dash action.

[@RedrumZombies]

@@holyknightthatpwns If the enemy has 60ft+ of possible movement or general flight, it ain't the Fighter's fault. Dashing would do nothing.

[@Zhaaligkeer]

For counterspell I have one argument against banning it, if you have a podcast such as critical role or high rollers, some of the best moments I’ve heard as a listener is when there’s a multiple counterspell moment where there’s like 3 casters in the party and 2 in the enemy group and it is so exciting to “counterspell the counterspell” three or four times in a round!

[@sharlesdaviskendy2391]

The Goodberry conversation is funny to me. “When it’s useful, make is less useful. When it’s useless, let players use it for no reason.”

[@charlottenelken]

Goodberry isn't useless in a non-survival scenario. Outside of the whole ~no money spent on rations and such, which is debatable and highly conditional on the type of campaign you're playing, at low levels, casting Goodberry with your unused spell slot at the end of an adventuring day, and being able to top off characters with that pool of ten hit points during short rests, or raising someone back up after a fight without using a healing spell... it's far from useless!

[@captainwodie2753]

Yeah, making resurrection role-playing focused is a good call, and making it fit in your campaign is tough. Revivify is not a revive, it's a defribulator

[@jthompson7024]

Exactly why I keep all other resurrection spells but ban revivify. Especially being a 3rd level spell it trivializes death without really giving good RP potential that the higher levels have

[@MythicMachina]

@@jthompson7024 I think Revivify is fine. Remember that it only works on the 1 minute that the creature died in, and it's sort of a last ditch effort. Plus, if you are at the end of a huge combat, there might be a chance that a player won't have the spell slots they need. Do note that you also need the 300 gp diamond, AND you can't upcast it. If you are out of 3rd level spell slots, ya boned.

[@ARCThunder]

@@MythicMachina Yeah, it has a really steep price especially when it first comes into play. I have a Cleric that hasn't had access to 300gp diamonds until recently at level 8. Even then our funds are still tight enough that we look at those diamonds we found thinking, "we could sell these..."

[@MythicMachina]

@@ARCThunder It depends on the game when it comes to funding the spell of course. But the biggest drawback is just how limited your level 3 slots can be sometimes. Do you save that last 3rd level slot for emergenices? or do you use it now to potentially help the fight?

[@ARCThunder]

@@MythicMachina I'd rather save a 2nd level slot for Gentle Repose to preserve my dead ally for Revivify later, and use the 3rd level for killing the things that murdered a party member. Especially because, just prior to leveling up to 8, 3rd level spells were/are my big workhorses because I only have one/two 4th level slots.

[@TheAurgelmir]

I'm sure someone else said it, but I'm gonna be "That guy": The rules for cursed items clearly states that ""Most methods of identifying items, including the identify spell, fail to reveal such a curse, although lore might hint at it. A curse should be a surprise to the item’s user when the curse’s effects are revealed." So I don't really see Identify as an issue. With my group we decided that if an item requires attunement I will not tell them what item it is until they attune to it, I will just tell them the effect of the item (But not the curse) If it's an item that doesn't require attunement then it doesn't matter, because it will not be cursed.

[@laurencebernstein1233]

As I said above. Just throw Remove Curse on anyone that uses a new item. Problem solved. It completely neutralizes the threat of cursed items anyway.

[@TheAurgelmir]

@@laurencebernstein1233 That's specifically mentioned in the remove curse spell as not working though: "If the object is a cursed magic item, its curse remains, but the spell breaks its owner's attunement to the object so it can be removed or discarded."

[@laurencebernstein1233]

@@TheAurgelmir Right.. so it goes something like this: 1) Fighter - I attune the sword. 2) Cleric - Put down the sword. 3) Fighter - I can't 4) Cleric - I cast Remove Curse. 5) Fight - I put down the obviously cursed item

[@TheAurgelmir]

@@laurencebernstein1233 well you get to know everything about an item when you attuned to it. A d at that point it also took you an hour of in game time. Which is at least something of an inconvenience.

[@laurencebernstein1233]

@@TheAurgelmir It's just very "lame" to have curses so easily overcome. I use two factors to avoid this scenario.. One is that the user can put down the item for a while. It is only after repeated use that it becomes a problem. Two, as the Dungeon Dudes suggested, can only remove the curse with a specific method AND the spell. This gives cursed items more of an impact on the actual game play then.. "well.. that was a waste of time".

[@celsiusnebula]

In my games, I changed Counterspell into "Subvert Spell". I don't remember the exact wording, but you needed to be affected by a spell that affects at least one more creature (so the subverted spell will still have some effect). If you successfully subverted the spell, you were unaffected, but the other targets still were. If you upcasted it to 1 level above the subverted spell, you could select another creature to protect, and if you upcasted 3 levels, the spell just fizzled out (and you could be the only target)

[@chucknorris1920]

This is a great video for DM's of any skill level. I appreciate that you do not simply state which spells are problematic, but how to deal with them in creative ways as an alternative to banning which is a lazy option imo.

[@christhewritingjester3164]

Re: remove curse. I've always been in favor of added requirements. The spell itself is just the ceremony part, but each curse may have unique requirements to remove them. Adds a lot more to it that i think is fun.

[@erubianwarlord8208]

the version id use is more of a reveal how to cure said curse when cast so like cast on X item it has a curse of undeath the spell then says "to remove this curse you must head to place A and perform ritual 8 at midnight"

[@christhewritingjester3164]

@@erubianwarlord8208 also a very cool idea. More like an identify spell for curses. I have them research the curse to determine that type of stuff, but that works just as well.

[@orionar2461]

Look at grim hallow

[@orionar2461]

@@erubianwarlord8208 but it's a niche third level spell. 3rd level should do more than that.

[@eflarsen]

i like to let my players do whatever they like with the reminder that if they can do it, i can use it for the bad guys, too. keeps the playing field even.

[@NobodyTheHeartless]

This has not only helped me add more structure to my game, you've also given me ideas for adventures, very good video!

[@jstewart_1]

Another thing to remember about polymorph is that it is a concentration spell. This makes it slightly less OP.

[@CalculusPhysics]

not really, that's just standard for a spell of that effect

[@CalculusPhysics]

like, the concentration thing means the spell isn't completely broken, but even for a concentration spell it's pretty damn good

[@noahmehringer29]

Also if Pixies are seen casting the spell and the enemy is even remotely intelligent, F&*(ing up the pixies will hurt the party. Or attacking the guy who summoned the damn pixies in the first place. Its called get good DMs.

[@Fenen24]

Indeed people seem to forget that fly and the pixies invisibility are also concentration. So if you do the trex polymorph their are just 8 pixies sitting there with there 9hp.

[@imadethistocommentonthings4787]

@@Fenen24 Their Fly speed is natural you are correct about the Invisibility tho

[@ZombieMonkey7]

I'm sweatin' over here if my DM bans Tasha's Mind Whip after I keep taking away the dumb monster's turns.

[@DavidGonzalez-zl3dz]

I don't think that spell should get banned, it's strong but it only puts down a single creature

[@godzillaaccount2672]

@@DavidGonzalez-zl3dz when you cast it at higher lvs it’s targets more creatures

[@cenycal]

I loath Tasha's Mind Whip. One of my players has even told me if I ban it, he'd understand. But I don't want to be that guy

[@DavidGonzalez-zl3dz]

@@godzillaaccount2672 That just puts a target on your back to have your concentration broken

[@CallenExile]

Mind Whip only lasts one round. It's slightly less influencial than having a Monk with Stunning Strike, because they still get one action.

[@charliealphatango11]

Thank you for giving your well balanced opinions on these spells. It is refreshing and extremely helpful to have a video explaining how these spells can be kept in the game, in a logical and fair manor.

[@liondovegm]

They didn't bring up the one spell that must always be banned. True Strike.

[@RustyDust101]

As a really old school AD&D (1st/2nd Edition) player I still recall multiple spells causing certain disruption in our campaigns. So we created house rules for these spells. Goodberry required exactly what you said. A handful of freshly picked (edible) berries that the spell is cast on. It imbues ONE berry per caster level, up to ten at 10th level, for one day with the power as listed, not ten without regard of caster level. The caster is able to distinguish the berries that are imbued by the spell; others may not. Also, like with ANY druid spell in 1st or 2nd Ed. AD&D it required mistletoe cut by the druid himself during the full moon to be 100% effective. So without fresh mistletoe, the effect is toned down a lot. BTW: we introduced the overfull ruling when a high level druid dumped truckloads of goodberries on the party for a quick easy hp heal. You had to make a constitution check for every goodberry eaten above three, as each already represented a full day's meal. People soon didn't like the spell that much anymore when they quickly started to gain weight, outgrowing their clothing or armor. We also used an absolute max of eight goodberries per day for healing purposes. Detect Magic: 1st/2nd Ed. Only within the visual field of the caster, not within a 30 feet radius, regardless of visibility or not. Again, caster level gave a 25% base chance +5% chance per caster level to correctly identify the school of magic. Each school of magic involved required one full round/minute of concentration, so multi-school spells could quickly eat up your duration if tried to identify all schools, especially on items. The full concentration was required so you couldn't just stroll down a corridor detecting magic willy-nilly. Full concentration meant standing still, mostly quiet, definitely NOT in combat, not overburdened by gear or equipment. Identify: same chance (25%+5% per caster level) to correctly identify ONE ability of an item. Casting time was a lot longer: 1 turn minimum, plus one round per caster level. After the first full turn of handling the item in the required way (a helmet had to be worn, gloves dito, a wand wielded, etc) you were able to have the chance to determine one ability AT RANDOM. The number of charges however were only given as a percentage of its full number; rounded to the next full 10th percentile. Each additional attempt to determine an ability reduced the chance for a successful determination by 5%, and required another full round of handling. Curses were NEVER identified by the spell. Comprehend languages: yeah, we left that relatively untouched, as 1st/2nd ed did NOT include written languages. Also, we included a BASE understanding of the languages, similar to an A1 practitioner of a foreign language, that increased with every full five caster levels to a full C1 at level 20 but never to a true native speaker. At A1, you grab the gist of it, not the subtleties, nor any double or hidden meanings. Especially when multiple meanings are included in a spoken language misunderstandings can be arbitrarily introduced, requiring player interaction and fun role-playing situations. Also, each two caster levels allowed for one additional language to be understood, not ANY and ALL languages in a 30 foot radius. Again, you have to concentrate on the persons speaking the language but in this case this only requires cursory concentration, not the dedicated full concentration. Thus, it was possible to use it in combat, but the chances of misunderstanding grew significantly with noise and activity. Speak with Dead: yepp, the ultimate 'who done it' murder case buster. We used the caster level again to limit how old the corpse could be, and also limited it to one question per caster level, or a short sentence explaining the corpse's current state. We made it be an ordeal for the dead to be forced into this state. The dead do not like being awakened again to be questioned, so they may be quite cantakerous. Sure, if it was a very recently dead it might still be in shock of the pain of dying, and just scream at the caster. Other dead might hold prejudices against the caster's race, especially if they are very forceful in their questions. Also, the process of dying may shock a corpse into forcefully forgetting what caused its death, especially if it was very brutal. This is the DM's prerogative to handle it. Especially if the players use it regularly. Make the caster play out the questioning; have them be very empathic, and maybe the corpse will like them. If they are rude, let them be rude and evasive as well, wasting their limited questions. Counterspell was not a spell available in 1st or 2nd ed, so I have no idea what it does. But the description sounds massively overpowered to me for any spell below 5th or even 6th level. It seems similar to the 1st/2nd ed Dispel Magic spell. I have no experience with either 4e or 5e D&D so I may be completely wrong. Remove Curse: yeah, this spell was a curse on my campaigns in many cases (pun fully intended). After some time I decided to make it a long, drawn out ritual, not something that could be cast on a whim. The caster needed to KNOW what the curse was, in detail, to even recieve a chance to amerliorate, or completely lift it. Again, in this case caster vs caster level could be used. The level of caster of Remove Curse could be pitted against the level of the Curse. Base 25% chance to remove a curse, plus 5% per caster level of the remove curse, minus 1 to 5% or even higher per caster level of the opposing curse, with an absolute maximum of 90% to remove a curse. If the opposing curse was a long convoluted ritual, often with special components this would probably reach 4 to 5% per opposing caster level. If the Remove Curse caster fails spectatularly, such as by rolling lower than the chance to successfully remove the curse; and be under the opposing caster's level it could be possible to become the target of the curse yourself. Sure, if it was just a short Bestow Curse spell, without any special intention or effect, the Remove Curse spell should be able to lift it almost automatically. However, lifting the Curse of Undeath from a legendary vampire should not be possible with a wimpy spell such as this. Revivify (was similar to Death's Door, probably), Raise Dead, Resurrection: yepp, another slew of those spells that should involve ritual, not simply poofing a character back from the dead. Death's Door required a target to be at 0 to -9 hp to be called back to 1 hp. They are weak as a kitten after being recalled from Death's Door, and can't do ANY physical activity, nor any work requiring concentration no matter how much healing they recieve. The recipient has to rest for a full day after the ordeal. Also it doesn't stop them from bleeding out, unless taken care of IMMEDIATELY! It only holds them at 1hp for one minute/round per caster level. Raise Dead: instead of 10 ten days fixed it allowed a caster to raise a person from the dead that had died withing one day of caster level. Again, this requires a fairly intact body, otherwise the person may immediately die again, if they are missing major limbs which could cause them to bleed out. Remember, kids, loosing a leg at the hip opens a huge artery that will make you bleed out in 45 seconds in real life if untreated. Also, being Raised from the Dead costs the recipient 3 years of their life span, ie aging them, plus a point of constitution deduction. They can ONLY be raised from the dead ONCE per original constitution point they had. Also, there was a percentage chance of a person being raised from the dead simply failing to be raised depending on their constitution. If they failed that percentile roll they were PERMANENTLY dead. Only a full wish could bring them back. As each raise dead reduced their constitution, which also lowered their chance of successfully being raised, it became very, very unlikely for a hero to be raised as often as the full number of original constitution points available. Resurrection, as a cleric's 7th level spell, was always very, very powerful. But it was also very, very costly. The casting cleric aged a full five years for a Resurrection spell, and was left completely drained for one full day per level or resurrected character. The Resurrected character however was returned instantly to full function with full hp. They still lost one from their count of potential raise dead or resurrection attempts despite not loosing a constitution point. There was also no chance of failing the resurrection due to low constitution. That's why it was a 7th level cleric spell, the highest spell level available to 1st/2nd ed clerics (notwithstand Quest spells). There were no 8th, 9th, or 10th (or even higher) level cleric spells in 1st/2nd ed. Summon Woodland Beings: again, awesome druid spell, but again, the druid had no choice in what they summoned in 1st/2nd. They simply called into the wild, and had to be happy with what they got, ie the dice roll of the DM, or at worst, full DM whims. The DM could have a full roster of what beings are available in the range of the spell, and allow even pixies to be summoned, but not under full control of the caster. Pixies are whimsical creatures who dislike being given orders. They may do something completely different from what the caster intended. The less intelligent, the more controlled the woodland beings may be. They may be friendly to the caster, and may ATTEMPT to help them, but not like automatons reacting to their every wish. But the woodland beings also have to travel to the caster, not just poof into existence by the power of the spell. They are fully living, individual beings, with their own will, somewhat leavened by the spell.

[@scyanhalcyan]

I absolutely love the fact that you are mentioning Dresden, it is one of my favorite book series ever

[@TOOLandNINfan]

My DM didn't ban any spells yet, but did add homebrew rule: "If reduced to 0 HP, you will gain one level exhaustion after you recover any HP." She wants to discourage yo-yo tricks with Healing Word.

[@CallenExile]

I have a similar rule. You gain a level of exhaustion for each failed Death Save, 2 on a 1. It still takes 3 to stabilize, but it's now 6 to die, in exchange for the downside of Exhaustion.

[@Shadylikeatree]

I hate this kind of rule. To me Healing word especially, is not broken. You have to chose to do it over all your other options as a Cleric/Bard/Druid and to me that balances it, although there's nothing wrong with it as is.

[@tinkerer3399]

At really low levels yo-yo tricks can be slightly annoying but at a little higher levels it can be a real risk. Particularly if you are dealing with multi-attack monsters.

[@Noobie2k7]

The thing is though it's fine. . . If you're there just using healing Word every other turn a party member gets downed then you're not doing anything more useful, you know, like helping to kill the thing that keeps downing your friends.

[@Garnichgutt]

I have the first drop free, starting with the second drop to 0 within a day players gain exhaustion in my game. Though it is mostly cause its a seven player party with tons of healing options.

[@diobrando6910]

"Speak With Dead" is honestly amazing when used correctly. You can create so many side quests from it. "Oh you figured out why your informant was murdered? Turns out one of their contacts was either unknowingly manipulated, mind controlled, or was on the BBEG's side the whole time. Hell, maybe it was just a random murder due to their line of work. Time to keep investigating!" Edit: BBEG'S "side"

[@RagingReaper]

One of my favorite homebrew rules for Conjure Woodland Beings was due to the fey nature to be controlled by the DM and they focus more on pranking or disrupting both sides. I've also tried havingi t where different types of pixies will appear based on the enviroment and the spelllist will change based on the area.

[@DarrylCross]

Weird that Clone isn't put on the list of banned spells along side Revivify, Resurrection and Raise Dead; while it does take the prep-time beforehand it can do something that the others might not necessarily be able to do. That is, it can reset your age back to any point along your life. As an NPC plot device that can be the best part of it - the BBEG could come back as someone the PCs might not even recognize as the same person. The old man with the long grey flowing beard could come back as a magical prodigy child far surpassing the ability of his peers. The young man can then present himself as someone useful and friendly to the party all while secretly engineering their demise. (Depending on how the DM wants to play it, that could be a redemption arc as he gets to know them better and finds he actually likes them - or he could suddenly betray them at the worst possible moment.)

[@BryanHo]

Totally agree, Clone is a great spell for NPC villains, less so for PC's.

[@damianjonsson1688]

Remove Curse: Use a higher level slot for more difficult removals. Many other spells have the ability for more power at higher spell slot

[@stevdor6146]

so what you're implying is that curses that are not meant to be broken easily should have a high spell slot requirement as part of the casting cost. i can dig that

[@theeguy9022]

@@stevdor6146 you could also make certain curses require a specific ritual tied to it for instance lycanthropy as there's alot of symbolism with such a thing and having it lifted with a 9th level spell slot is just boring and doesn't develop the character at all

[@mishapetrovich5495]

I like your take on Curses. Another less dramatic but simple solution would be to give curses casting level. It might take a 9th level spell slot to remove an epic curse

[@scorpioDreamsTn]

I've given this a good deal of thought and you brought the idea to light before I could post it.

[@valasafantastic1055]

I do spell levels and slots like counterspell for remove curse!

[@vanwiem]

This is exactly what was done in Pathfinder 2E.

[@RealSeanithan]

Man, I don't know that I would counterspell healing word, but I would definitely counterspell the players trying to dimension door the hostage away.

[@wilhelmpaulm]

sure fire way for people to never play with you again 😂 unless it's part of the campaign, you're gonna have a lot of angry players

[@stevefilms1997]

@@wilhelmpaulmthey can just counterspell the counterspell.