Dwight Howard: The Best Center That Never Was | Bill Simmons's Book of Basketball 2.0 | The Ringer

In 2008, Dwight Howard was destined to become the NBA’s next great center, but in the years since he never quite lived up to that potential. On this edition of the ‘Book of Basketball 2.0’ podcast, HBO and The Ringer’s Bill Simmons breaks down what went wrong with Howard’s career and his all-time NBA ranking.
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[@mazzb305]

"When your best player is not a leader, but not a follower either..." Perfectly sums up Dwight 🤣🤣

[@bay782]

Dwight Howard is the last center to lead his team to an NBA Finals. The dude was a great center. He's still playing at a high level

[@dbreiden83080]

He had one go to move. Dunk the basketball. He never developed his game. He was a terrible team mate. Thought he was much much better than he really was. Howard is absolutely a what if.

[@bay782]

@@dbreiden83080 he won teammate of the year. Sometimes you have to make your own observations instead of just repeating things that other people have said. Look at how many teammates said he wasn't a bad guy but it only takes one player and the media tries to destroy this man character.

[@roneldov]

Wish he would have stayed in Orlando. That was his team. I don’t think he had the ideal mentorship during his young NBA prime. All respect to Kobe, but Kobe at the time was rumored to be a stubborn unrelenting teammate that criticized Dwights every move. That chemistry was never going to work. Dwights touch with the basketball seemed to never improve as predicted and injuries followed. I remember the severity of the injuries being questioned, not only by media, but by his teammates...more bad chemistry. Then Dwight falls into this journeyman category. He played with big personality players. Never holding his “own” team again and I think he never fully embraced not being the #1 guy. He clashed with harden. It seemed like Dwight wanted to play classic center ball from the inside, while analytics and coaching transitioned to a more 3 ball and fast pace game. He never became the MVP superstar again and got a reputation as a bad locker room guy. A teammate that was unwilling to adapt or take the game seriously. Always saying things like, “I don’t need a ring. I’m just happy to play the game.” Not a legitimate quote, but he said similar things and it bothered people, although I seemed to agree at times. He lacked the MJ mindset of win at all costs. Now he’s found a great situation in LA. He respects his teammates and accepted his role. He’s still a beast of a human and has raw athleticism. All LA wants him to do is play smart, finish dunks, and swat shots. He’s more than capable. His potential while he played in Orlando was sky high. This man was great! Stan Van Gundy had Dwight surrounded by lengthy 3 and D type players that could handle the rock. That Orlando squad was one of my favorite all time. People bad mouth Dwight a lot and say he was essentially a joke and fools gold. I think with the right mentorship and team setting this guy could have been something generationally great. The physical gifts were elite, but maybe Dwight lacked the mental intangibles needed to succeed in a high stakes high profile game like the NBA. It isn’t easy lol. BUT, to the incessant haters out there, don’t act like Dwight wasn’t a box office athletic freak that players feared to play in his prime! This dude had fans on the edge of their seat waiting on the next jaw dropping outrageous alley-oop or block

[@bay782]

@@roneldov well said

[@dbreiden83080]

@@bay782 He spent his last couple of seasons in Orlando constantly playing games with the media and the city of Orlando about do I want to stay, or do I want to leave? How the fuck is that being a good teammate?

[@JonSmith-hk1bq]

He was "only" the best center in the league for a solid half decade.

[@spicerc1244]

He was the "only" true center for a half a decade, is the problem. Around that time, Shaq would miss the first half of a season and still lead the position in all-star votes.

[@RobertSmith-ow5kf]

@@spicerc1244 I mean he was the best player on a team that made the finals. If you trade their second best players as in turkolu for pau he wins it

[@spicerc1244]

@@RobertSmith-ow5kf So I don't deny he was their best player. But that team had a lot of 3-point shooting and relied heavily on it. More importantly, in the playoffs, Hedo and Rashard Lewis were monsters, working off each other, in crunch time. Two big do-it-all small forwards on offense, they closed out so many games for the Magic. It's like Paul George on that short run the Pacers had - he was certainly "the best" player but he wasn't carrying them by any means.

[@RobertSmith-ow5kf]

@@spicerc1244 He was their best player by a significant margin. He was in the MVP conversion, won DPOY, and was the best rebounder and shot blocker in the league, and their leading scorer. I mean he averaged 20-15 with nearly three blocks in that playoff run while shooting 60 percent.

[@spicerc1244]

@@RobertSmith-ow5kf Tossing up his numbers in a vacuum isn't an argument. Hassan Whiteside was the league's best rebounder/shot blocker for a while too. Again, regarding Orlando's run to the finals, I don't think you were around to watch the games because Lewis and Turkoglu were the closers. Howard was a force for them but didn't take anyone to the next level. If you have two guys closing out big games, sure, it doesn't hurt to have an agile 7-footer.

[@CasterShellz]

Wow it’s almost as if Dwight’s career almost ended prematurely due to a horrific back injury or something

[@dayra6425]

Ok well if would of been nice had he retired instead of bumming around the league for years

[@subby97]

@@dayra6425 Bumming around the league? Have you watched him at all?

[@Itswebbgaming]

subby97 right? How could he be a bum if he’s a starting center averaging 32 min a game up until these last two years.

[@miorionomichi]

@@dayra6425 the bum you talking about just won a championship

[@MrRuSh61]

@@miorionomichi this is what I came for lol.

[@BALLAB21]

Didn’t mention anything about Dwight Howard’s 3 defensive player of the year awards.

[@haydensigurdson388]

Did you listen to the whole podcast

[@TheShadow84]

Bill shows no respect to Dwight or Ben Wallace. They have better resumes than plenty players already in the Hall.

[@advithvashist9889]

He’s 65th in bills rankings ahead of Robert parish... that’s plenty respect

[@RobertSmith-ow5kf]

@@advithvashist9889 He’s right around the 50 mark. 3 DPOY’s

[@JoeSmithGOAT]

You clearly didn't finish the video.

[@TheLastWalenta]

Most people don't put this almost star ahead of the Chief. I don't. Simmons did.

[@jameslockman7664]

This vid is insanely unfair. Bill criticizes Dwight for losing to Boston while forgetting that same Boston team had just kicked Bron out of Cleveland and damn near beat Kobe.

[@Juice-ig3jz]

Listen to the whole podcast!

[@Zeus0886]

James Lockman bill need is on the celtics nut sack

[@Evan-gi1hs]

i think you need to rewatch the video because he never criticized dwight for losing to the celtics. he criticized his mentality for doing a comedy bit while he was in the middle of a playoff series (which he went on to lose).

[@iwantaoctosteponmyneckbut3545]

did we even watch the same video? He didn't criticize the loss, he was showing Dwight's flippant approach to the game

[@a11pu1poj]

Publish the new version of the pyramid bill pls

[@pancon5]

Yesss

[@jordan12118]

Selling Dwight a little short here

[@razkable]

dwight was the bob lanier of his time..talented but not good enough to lead you to a title...a very good stats center but lacked that next level dna

[@paliboy93]

He put him above Robert Parish though

[@umberto488]

Is he really, though? Dwight is physically talented and minimally intelligent and skilled.

[@t4d0W]

I think its pretty apt. Had the physical gifts, had limited ass basketball skill, made the most of what he had until the game changed and thus nearly phased him out until this year where he is a great high energy backup big in a championship bound looking team that can destroy 2nd units.

[@himmie1]

If he took as many shots as shaq he would average 25 a game. He has never averaged more than 13 shots a game in any season

[@Kalinbuggs]

Too harsh but fair I just wish Bill got someone who was a Dwight Howard fan I felt like this was a “let’s just get this out the way”

[@TheHawkdaddy]

I feel like the media has insider info on Dwight Howard we don't know. Other than the Stan Van Gundy stuff I never understood why everyone thought he was such a jerk.

[@APPLEcrispBISH]

All of his teammates find him childish. Its alright in an interview, but its clear his peers never respected him.

[@TheIcemanthomas]

Chris McDonald not true at all. Some guys didn’t like him, but his real peers speak highly of him. Nick young, lbj, cp3c arenas, kg, Pierce, and a few other guys all have spoken about the unfair treatment he’s gotten.

[@AirCanada1J5]

@@TheIcemanthomas a lot of his teammates outside of like Hedo Turkoglu (because it was getting him paid) got irritated with Dwight, I'm a Dwight fan though

[@TheIcemanthomas]

@@AirCanada1J5 getting irritated and not liking are 2 diff things. Go listen to interviews from guys like Gilbert arenas, jj reddick, big baby Davis. They sing nothing but praises for him.

[@geraldos9094]

Teammates love him. There are plenty of videos of Dwight and his teammates online off the court enjoying his company.

[@jacksonbyrne5835]

This is far too harsh on Dwight, no mention of the three straight DPOYs is straight up disrespectful and the ignorance to the fact that while a part of his career was wasted due to his personality and not taking the game as seriously as some other superstars; injuries derailed the end of his prime in both LA and Houston. 2014/15 Houston Dwight is far from a bad player and i think this segment overall diminishes and critiques far too harshly on an entertaining, fun and likeable superstar from a pretty weak era of the NBA in terms of star players. Just my opinion however!

[@bbest009]

I’ve stopped listening to bill simmons he’s just clamoring for relevance at this point most shit he posts we can do without like fr

[@AirmanJack89]

suleiman009 then don’t listen to it. How is this for relevance nobody even talks about Dwight now

[@AirmanJack89]

S51 Sporting Analysis injuries didn’t derail him in LA he didn’t like the pressure put on him and the expectation so he left. I suggest you listen to the podcast because they break it down pretty well. And he wasn’t likable none of his former teammates like him at sll

[@jordanwhite1683]

Listen to the podcast before typing comments like this. They address his defensive ability, his Houston years and way way more. And the thing is free to listen to, so no excuse there. This is just a tidbit which even cuts some things out.

[@MysticMungusSlungus]

Absolutely agree with you dude! Bill's take on Dwight sounds less like an 'expert' in basketball, and more like a teenage redditor on r/nba. He's talking about Dwight like as though he never watched the man play, and only looked at some stats.

[@KollegahDerBub]

I liked his kobe video but this is just bs.way too underappreciative of dwights accomplishments. 3xDPOY. NUFF SAID.

[@paliboy93]

You didn’t see he put Dwight over Robert Parrish? He shat on his flaws all video but in the end he put him as a first ballot

[@RobertSmith-ow5kf]

@@paliboy93 And anything but first ballot would just be unknowledgeable. He is around 50 all time

[@SonnyK248]

Dwight was amazing in Orlando. His experience in LA was what started his career freefall. But right now there is no 2 million dollar contract more valuable that Dwight's. In the playooffs he will prove invaluable off the bench.

[@danielmaia3559]

LOL dude has a ring now being a fundamental role player

[@WhelmedButReady]

Imagine being able to say that you lead a team to the NBA Finals and were 3 games away from the championship. And was also the second to last team to defeat LeBron James in the East and people actually say your career was a "never was"

[@joedagg4495]

Yeah imagine doing that with 0 offensive game and the wisdom of a 6 year old child. Now imagine what he would've been like with the mentality and work ethic of Kobe. Thats why he is a "never was"

[@mr3000sr]

Why imagine that’s the only time He beat Bron

[@tcmon1616]

Hes not saying he was never a good player. He just was on a trajectory to be an all time great and now isnt even on the top 75 list that came out. Didnt quite become the career we might have thought early on. A lot of that did have to do with the league changing, which Bill mentions.

[@Packer431]

Dwight Howard ... the player is a little bit unfairly scrutinized. Howard is the sliding door of what Shaq would have been if he went straight to the NBA instead of LSU, and never was paired with a complimentary Guard.

[@spiidey1]

You're underselling Shaq a bit there. In the years without Penny and with a very young Kobe, you can still run the entire offense through Shaq. He wasn't over-reliant on the pick and roll to get his points, you just needed good passers to get him the ball in the post.

[@Packer431]

spiidey1 yes that is completely true .... my point was that those skills that he had could arguably be traced back to his time at LSU. Howard came straight from high school to the NBA and never had a reason to develop much of a skill game because of his competition not being able to handle him physically. If Howard went to a Duke level school best believe he would have had to learn some actual back to the basketball moves

[@BlackOtaku22]

@joceja23 but college is more physical than high school? he's saying if dwight went to college he might've developed a post game

[@BlackOtaku22]

@joceja23 its not as simple as just because lebron, kg, and kobe did it dwight can as well. its also about mentality and environment, and its probable that dwight would mature in college although not certain. there are always cases when a player should go to college or go straight into the nba, its different for everyone. i also feel if dwight was made to play in a system not emphasizing him before he got his ego, he would be a better player overall.

[@IntisarKazumi]

Um dwight is nothing compared to shaq. Hes a HOF and potentially a top 50-60 player of all time. But Shaq had GOAT potential and is sure fire top 15. No comparison.

[@emmanuelmoses7249]

Wow Bill.....Mutombo 2.0? "Nobody enjoyed watching him that much" ..What a hater lol..

[@Grant25]

Simmons wants attention

[@richardyocum353]

go look at Mutombos prime numbers and you'll see that's not a diss.

[@rmoultonrmoulton145]

How is he being a hater? You do realize that the only reason you think Dwight is better than Mutombo is because Dwight was the ONLY center worth a damn in his prime years...right?

[@TheStop]

@@rmoultonrmoulton145 it's also cause dwight was better than mutombo.

[@rmoultonrmoulton145]

@@TheStop Really the only discernable difference between them is Dwight was more athletic in his prime. That's it. Mutombo is easily one of the best defensive and rebounding centers of all time

[@ProfessaJ]

disclaimer: this is from a celtics fan

[@JoeSmithGOAT]

So? Other than 09, Howard wasn't even in the Celtics threat radar lmao

[@MrArjunchoudhary]

@@JoeSmithGOAT Celtic fans are the worst

[@emilenate835]

Dwight is a first ballot hall of famer.. PERIOD

[@Grant25]

Anyone who says differently, has no idea what they’re talking about

[@alexjimenez6893]

@@Grant25 I agree

[@Hotobu]

Did he say he wasn't?

[@-Rhy]

Emile Nate he will get in. But you have to acknowledge that He has been trash for more than half of his career.

[@emmanuelmoses7249]

@@Hotobu He might as well have ..

[@jovanidillon9225]

Damn this was the most negative one yet. You would think he was the worst player ever. Not a fan of Dwight but felt bad hearing this

[@rmoultonrmoulton145]

I do remember that, in his prime, he was a huge variable on the defensive end. A lot of teams wouldn't even go near the paint when he was in. Similar to not running to a stud DEs side of the line. That inflates his value offensively because he's also subtracting points for the other team.

[@kendleoneal4080]

Aging Celtics in 2009? This dude will make any excuse for the Celtics.

[@JoeSmithGOAT]

So Garnett not playing that series is acceptable? Lol

[@christiancamilo]

I love u Bill Simmons! Reading yout book and trying to learn more about basketball and English. Regards from Brasil!!!

[@MultiDoctor]

Dwight is wayyy higher in the list!! He was a top 3 player in the league for five years (with players like Duncan, Melo, Dwade and more beneath him). He was and still is a hell of a defensive anchor and one of the greatest rebounders and blockers ever! Great pick and roll scorer, most athletic player of all time and very smart on the court (great off ball screens, smart runs in transition etc) Dwight is so much more than Mutombo 2.0!! He achieved more than players like T-Mac, Reggie Miller, Vince etc and he did it with a team with Rasheed Lewis and Jameer Nelson as the best players after him. Stop the hate and give the man the respect he deserves!!

[@js2010ish]

Glorified DeAndre Jordan 🕵🏼‍♀️

[@MultiDoctor]

@@js2010ish 2 years later you kids still don’t know a thing about the sport and still disrespecting great athletes…

[@anonymoususer2634]

@@MultiDoctor yeah we get it, you're the lone Dwight super fan. Yawn.

[@benjaminan1183]

I don't see how you wouldn't take Wade over him, but would simultaneously would take LeBron over him in their primes. You get the exact same advantages and disadvantages of each playstyle.

[@kevinjohnson4498]

He was the best center during a historically weak era for centers. Look at the All NBA 2nd and 3rd team centers from 07-12. Broken Yao, Amare, washed Shaq, Bogut, Horford, Andrew Bynum, Tyson Chandler. All of them solid, none of them all timers. He is properly rated.

[@blakespadaro2313]

Dwight’s a Hall of Famer , 3x Dpoy, 8x Allstar, 5 1st team all nbas , Top 15 Alltime in Rebounds and Blocks. Will most likely retire top 10 in Both.

[@anthonynorman7545]

How do you trash someone that much AND put him on your all-time pyramid!? I think someone wanted to hate

[@harryo82]

I'm a life long Magic fan. T-Mac and Penny are my favorite players. I loved watching Dwight but what I used to say about Dwight in his prime was "If Dwight Howard ever learns how to play basketball he'd be unstoppable".

[@alexjimenez6893]

Dwight Howard skills were Athleticism by finishing inside the paint with lay ups, dunks, alley oops, and put backs. Great rebounder, great shotblocker, and elite defender. Major weaknesses are perimeter shooting, post game, and foul shooting. Overall, I'm surprised to see Howard ranked 65th. In the book of basketball, he was ranked 81st. Huge jump

[@kaylee42900]

Early in dwight's career when he had 3x in a row DMVP I remember there being an argument if him or lebron were better. THAT's how good Dwight was. Keeping in mind that both had major deficiencies early on despite being electric and full of potential. Lebron is what you get when those gaps fill in, Dwight is what you get when they don't. Speaking of Dwight offense, while dwight never got a post game there was a time where a dwight pick and roll had the best point conversion in the league for multiple years.

[@mrmacross]

Dwight Howard was no Shaq, but he legitimately was a great defensive center like few others, way better than Shaq in that regard. Seriously, look at how competent the Dwight/SVG Magic teams were on defense, and then look at their personnel. It's almost as though the entire scheme was funnel the attackers to Dwight and let him handle it.

[@mrmacross]

@Rodzilla They were pretty good on offense, but defensively? They essentially had one plus defender in Howard.

[@chernosamba1128]

@Rodzilla They had some shooters and hedo turkoglu was a nice playmaker....But defensively they had 0 after Howard,and they were one of the better defensive teams in the league on him alone.

[@stizanley3987]

Great video

[@d204b207]

i hated dwight now i love him, show some character growth bill and learn to love

[@Zecamilleo]

Prime Dwight was something special

[@ngc-fo5te]

Special headcase.

[@DrDetfink]

The fact, Andre Drummond was dumped for a bag of balls tells you that the guy who dunks and rebounds and plays inside is a dinosaur in the age of 3-point shooting.

[@chernosamba1128]

Andre Drummond isn't comparable to Dwight Howard.Especially not on the defensive end

[@robesterd8132]

@@DrDetfink Drummond is just a horrible player offensively and Defensively and is very slow. He was just a great rebounders. Those other guys would dominate in this era, if they could move well, cause some didn’t.

[@DrSJH159]

Bringing up the superman interview a bit of a lowblow imo.

[@joshclontz1306]

Sometimes I feel like people see professional sports like madden or 2k, the fact is not everyone makes every shot or has every move which to me is what makes sports awesome because everyone is equally flawed in one aspect or another.

[@ryannarby4519]

Hey. Guys. This is gold. Just keep pumping these out. I would listen to Bill Simmons y’all about random players until I fucking died. Just keep doing them. Pump me out. Blam blam blam blam. Don’t stop. Every do em

[@MrDannyboyFL]

If you know Bill then this is high praise he’s giving Dwight. By Bills standards

[@razkable]

bill has wade like 28th...he is an idiot...

[@paliboy93]

Asmosis Jones Most people say D Wade is 3rd best shooting guard ever

[@Hidden_Seeker_]

@@razkable Where do you have him

[@MisterDoctorEsquire]

Asmosis Jones I think I’d have him somewhere in the higher 20s, 23-24, but 28th all time is fair. I can think of 20 or so names that I’d put above him. There are probably more but these are the ones that popped into my head: Wilt Russell Magic Bird Jordan LeBron Kobe Durant Hakeem Shaq Duncan Kawhi Barkley Kareem Dr J Moses malone Scottie Oscar Robertson Jerry west Steph curry

[@petiteexplication6249]

@@MisterDoctorEsquire Kawhi ???

[@dangolden8020]

People talk about Dwight as if he didn't lead his team to the NBA Finals and make 5 First Team All NBA's with 3 DPOYs. He was a great player. Think about it like this : Dwight Howard age 26: 6x All Star 6x All NBA (including 5 First teams) 4x All NBA defensive first team (including 3 DPOY) 4x NBA rebounding leader 2x NBA blocks leader NBA Finals Appearance Joel Embiid age 26: 3x All Star 2x All NBA (0 First teams) 2x All NBA defensive SECOND teams (0 Firsts) No NBA Finals Appearances

[@chernosamba1128]

Let's be fair to embiid though he has had much more injury problems than Dwight had at that point in his career.Still an absolutely ridiculous video that seems to judge Dwight for not being a top 5 center of all time?He was 6'9 6'10 at the end of the day so he definitely had to work hard to overcome that.Its not like he was this god gifted dude that didn't put any work in

[@sunriseeternity300]

Dwight is what happens when a person is blessed with natural talent and doesnt feel the need to really work to refine it. The thought that the natural gift will last forever. And then it doesn't. Many of us fall to this same issue over time in our own respects.

[@macnolds4145]

It's not fair to attack Dwight (or anyone else, for that matter) for not living up to the expectations that others put upon him. Dwight was always a strong, fast, hyper athletic leaper, who was amazing at rebounding the ball and blocking shots. He couldn't shoot and he didn't have a post game. He was also a nice guy, who was naturally funny and kind-hearted. That's fine! Basketball is a team game. Instead of relying on Dwight, or even building around him, treat him as just another piece and go fetch some players to do what he can't do. Don't expect him to become Shaq. Don't insult him. If you view him like Ben Wallace, then he's "the greatest Ben Wallace ever", but if you view him like Wilt Chamberlain, then he's "the most disappointing Wilt Chamberlain" ever.

[@anthonycook7384]

Dwight wasn't just a shot blocker, he's a very smart overall defender

[@joenicedj]

In addison to being All-NBA First Team (2008-2012), Dwight Howard was: 1. All-NBA Second Team (2014). 2. 2× All-NBA Third Team (2007, 2013). 3. 3× NBA Defensive Player of the Year (2009-2011). 4. 4× NBA All-Defensive First Team (2009-2012). 5. NBA All-Defensive Second Team (2008). 6. NBA All-Rookie First Team (2005). 7. 5× NBA rebounding leader (2008-2010, 2012, 2013). 8. 2× NBA blocks leader (2009, 2010). Yet, he should have been so much more.

[@DCANNONSTEPSBYKE]

Bill Simmons has the unique trait of giving you your props while roasting the ever loving shit outta you

[@jamesmiller5331]

I remember a pundit saying in Spring 2010: "LeBron and Howard will trade MVPs for the next 10 years."

[@GuitarWithBrett]

He’s champion now

[@Spider-Complexion]

I never got to see Bill Russell play but watching Dwight Howard to me is probably what it felt similarly like but Bill had so many better intangibles like being a leader that set him apart.

[@fifi24ablefifi18]

Love that Dwight recap

[@erictaylor1217]

For a brief stretch it seems like he was adding to his offensive game. He was working with Hakeem in the offseason and I remember him taking a few more jump shots early in his first LA stint. Then it seems like he gave up and went back to dunking for another 8 seasons.

[@saint6563]

He got injured. Foolishly played on for the Lakers. [thought he should have fully recovered] Never got all of his lift & quickness back. Sad.

[@jordanlopez8644]

I wish he’d post the full video of the pods these little clips are fire

[@kx5517]

Pretty cool that Dwight won his first Title the year this was recorded, albeit in a reduced role.

[@jaedonfrancis8476]

Facts 💯

[@BWalker9313]

Dwight got caught in a weird transition in the NBA. A player trying to bring a back to the basket player instead of being an athletic power forward that can face up and hit a mid range. He really wasn’t a back to the basket guy, incredible off the pick and roll. Gets double teamed and banged up inside in the paint, gets a bad back injury, instead of coming back and getting a mid range game, he was told to be the next Shaq and dominate in the paint but literally couldn’t anymore. Being taught to be a big man out of high school really hurt him. If he tried to play more like a Chris Webber, Tim Duncan or Garnett where he can play make from the post, face up and hit a jump shot and still do some work on the inside, he would’ve had a much better career. Especially after the back problems.

[@siukong]

Yeah for a while it seemed like every year we'd hear some variation of "Dwight is working on post moves this offseason, he's been having sessions with Hakeem/Ewing/whoever". In hindsight that time may have been better spent working on shooting/midrange skills as you say.

[@fernandocastellanos8676]

These guy Simmons always spend at least 80% of the time highlighting all the negatives in the players.

[@Anthonycheesman33]

I cant believe this video is 10 months ago lol

[@DavidBagga]

I think looking back on it, Dwight should’ve stayed in Orlando where he could’ve been beloved from that time period of 2012-19 but I can’t hate on him anymore he was a huge piece in winning a ring for la ✊🏽💍

[@shotdoctor5869]

Why can’t his book of basketballs be longer? Such a tease

[@haydensigurdson388]

The full versions are on Apple podcasts and Spotify

[@MISTAMONEYBAGZ20142]

Damn p u threw a lot of shade to say he’s a hall of famer 🤦🏾‍♂️ 🧂salt kills Snells not playaz 💯

[@Kagemusha91]

if T-Mac is, everyone should be there

[@georgeparker8198]

The DISRESPECT!!!

[@dillonbeckwith]

god the audio. can barely hear bill? hit me up ringer

[@gamemonsterr]

fan of the channel, not a fan of the hate

[@zamis87]

You forgot to mention Alonzo Mourning

[@alinjo4421]

It’s hilarious hearing guys who can’t dribble a ball with their left hand shit on NBA HOFS lol

[@amberbailey8241]

he's more alonzo mourning than mutumbo

[@justinnardine8564]

This is Simmons at his best

[@InsomniaS3S]

The only thing I didn't like about this pod was you guys barely talked about his 3xDPOY. To be the best defensive player in a year should mean something, just like MVP. To do that 3 times in a row is insane. Also, he's second behind only Malone in players with the most 10+ rebound games. Feel like that's worth bringing up.

[@CitizenoftheWorld1]

Follower or not Dwight Howard is a top 75 player. Shame that his personality and off court antics overshadowed his game

[@djnixon5791]

Dwight was a beast and Bill is being way too hard on him. Dwight was never Shaq but he was miles above what Bull Simmons just described. Let’s not forget that Howard had a back injury that knocked him out of his prime early and he never had the supporting cast of wing scorers and top rate passers Shaq did in his prime. Shaq played with Penny Hardaway, Kobe, Dwyane Wade, Derek Fisher, Jason Williams, and at the end of his career he had LeBron. No offense but Jameer Nelson and Hedo Turkoglu don’t compare to those guys. Dwight was not Shaq but with a better supporting cast he would be a champion and we’d remember him differently. Side note, what the fuck is he talking about nobody liked to see him play?!?!? Seeing Dwight’s brute strength was amazing!

[@salakerz324]

You forgot Andrew Bynum! He was considered neck n neck with dwight for about 2 years.

[@brodericksimpson6049]

He's going into the Hall of Fame easily. His number will be retired in Orlando and it will be a crime if it's not just because people don't like him. This isn't a case of "What would've happened if". His Orlando years were enough to get him into the Hall of Fame. He was special during his first season in Houston. Injuries took his explosiveness away. He's led the league in rebounding five times including that season in LA when people said he was trash. 3 time Defensive Player of the Year. He's led the league in blocks twice. I know it's popular to trash him and his career like he's been a disappointment but that's definitely not the case. He was a borderline All-Star for my Charlotte Hornets. 17 points and 13 rebounds a game that season...just two seasons ago. There were no problems in the locker room. What went wrong was the league changed, centers became outside shooters and the injuries took a toll on his body. He's the most dominant center since Shaq. That's not a bad career to have.

[@Grant25]

But it’s cool to say he’s not that good. Simmons just wants attention

[@UtotheJ]

Simmons ranked him 65... that’s very accurately ranked

[@AirmanJack89]

Lionel Muggeridge they literally said he was a hall of famer easily

[@AirmanJack89]

Broderick Simpson no problems in the locker room? Dude had constant problems for just being immature and a bad leader

[@brodericksimpson6049]

@@AirmanJack89 Not in Charlotte. That's the team I was talking about. Kemba was the leader there. All Dwight had to do was defend, rebound and finish at the rim and that's what he did.

[@patsayjack402]

Never learned how to play the game. One of the most naturally gifted players of all time. It's not that Dwight Howard wasn't really good at one point but he had the potential to be a multiple time MVP and be an elite level HOF. As it stands now he may barely sneak into the hall based on his longevity. A small shame.

[@FTO9797]

8x all star, 5x all nba 1st team 3x DPOY 2 finals appearance 1 ring he will easily make the hof

[@lincoln8530]

That’s a good fit. Just right behind Parish.

[@TheBlueDevilDuke]

Dwight has been serviceable these past couple of years. The only reason you're now noticing is because he's on the Lakers

[@martinblake2278]

Totally agree! He was never really good offensively. I and many other sensible fans always thought that he is more of a Dikembe and never a Shaq/Hakeem type of do it all center. In the 2000s: Yao was dominating him on both sides of the floor, Vlade Divac was exposing his footwork and offense, Amare was running circles around him, Ben Wallace was a better defender than him, even guys like Chris Kaman, Zydrunas Ilgauskas, and Brad Miller toyed with him on multiple games. Yeah he grabs a lot of rebounds and do a lot of blocks shots but his overall game was not that of an MVP but more of a 1st tier supporting cast like a Robert Parish and a Chris Bosh. Also, the only reason Orlando became elite in the East is because aside from the big three's Celtics and Lebron's Cavs, the rest of the Eastern playoff teams are soooo bad that they won't even be top 15 in the West.

[@superintelligentapefromthe121]

Bill Simmons: The Best Columnist That Never Was.

[@AcerbicOrder]

Of all the valid criticism the only one that really matters(because people don't really change who they are) is forcing a trade to the wrong team/bad career management. The injuries were just the beginning of the end for D12. Melo is in the same category

[@tapiwasoropa]

We just gonna ignore the fact that Dwight was so fun to watch and beloved during that “athletic AF” era? At one point him and D Rose were by far the most popular players in the league

[@RetroKid]

Do Pippen next please!

[@john-hill]

Mid January eh ... Seems like 30 years ago

[@marlonmiranda4648]

Howard depended so much on his strength and athleticism. He had no offensive game. When injuries slowed him down , he went from monster to average player

[@TheIcemanthomas]

Marlon Miranda he was never average. He was still above average for years after the injuries. He was limited but still very capable of big moments..

[@courteo]

Dwight was a beast. But like a lot of players, injuries set him back. Just because he wasn't Shaq or Hakeem doesn't mean he wasn't great. He was a point guard that had a growth spurt and got drafted out of high school to play with grown men and became a allstar and defensive player of the year. You gotta respect that. He wasn't a scrub.

[@magellanmalala482]

As an avid Dwight Howard hater who wishes he never rejoined the lakers. He’d probably be an unquestionable legend had he and/or Kobe never been injured. I fully believe Kobe would’ve set him straight had they both been healthy enough to compete in the play offs. But Kobe going down so harshly and Dwight having to worry about an injury while also dealing with Kobe’s harsh methods definitely sunk that ship faster than foreseen.

[@capdriving]

dwight first time HOF rememder he is only 6 foot 8 my favorite of all time

[@swpdisciple]

This is a really good assessment. For like 5 years, he was the 2nd best player in league behind Lebron.

[@swpdisciple]

trufiend138 not at all. The eye test said it...but also every advanced metric that measure player value, impact on winning etc...win shares, box +/- and VORP...

[@tonytone3799]

What 5 years was that? LeBron didn't become the "best player" till Kobe stopped getting his teams to the finals. So arguably since around 11... And by then Howard was a clown...

[@swpdisciple]

tony tone I’ve argued this on too many threads over the years. If at this point you think Kobe was better than LBJ after his 2nd season or so, then you just believe what you believe. There’s no metric or eye test or impact on winning to suggest anything different. You are correct that Dwight Howard fell off after 2012 or so, but that was because of a serious back injury he never really recovered from. I’d say DHo was the 2nd best player from prob 2007-12. Kobe won the 07-08 MVP (deservedly) as a career achievement award because if he didn’t win that one, he wouldn’t have won one, which would be a travesty.

[@tonytone3799]

@swpdisciple I wont argue the lebron kobe thing and just concede to agree to disagree. But to say that Howard was the second best player behind LeBron from 07 to 12 means your stating that he was better than Kobe, Duncan, KG, Dirk, and D wade.... There isn't, any "eye" test or metric that would convince any well informed BB fan that Howard was better than any of those guys. Which btw will all be in the (some already) HOF... And howard will not.

[@swpdisciple]

tony tone in DHo’s prime the Magic were winning upper 50+ games and his 2nd best player was Turkoglu. He was 5x All-NBA 1st team in that period, 3 time def player of the year, 4x All defensive 1st team. Timing is the key. Those guys were all older by the time DHo was in his prime. He’s not the most polished player and I think people compared him to Shaq (plus his prime ended at like age 27) so that casts a weird light on him but his peak value was off the charts. He’ll def be in the HOF. As far as greatest centers I’d go (no particular order) Wilt, Russell, Olajuwon, Shaq, Robinson, Abdul-Jabbar, Moses Malone, Ewing (maybe) ahead of him. To give you an idea, he’s better than guys like Parish (my favorite center), Bellamy, Mutombo, Lanier and the best center today, Embiid.

[@pjny21]

Parrish is a great comparison, TBH. Better obviously, but...the bulk of their game was the same.

[@therealpeopleofvancouver]

What about all the off court stuff.....that contributes to the on court stuff.

[@williamlominchar1781]

Bill forgets he also beat his celtics in 2009 in game 7 in boston how many teams or players can say they won a game 7 in boston

[@davidmccrea6800]

the disrespect shown to Dwight here by Simmons is OUT OF CONTROL

[@robertrichards6378]

Some of yall dont understand that Dwight was compared to Shaq for a long time. Both start in Orlando and quickly become the best center in the league. Both are dominant physically. Dwight just didnt live up to that comparison at all. Still was great by other standards but Bill is right. He was so strong/athletic and surrounded by shooters that people always hoped that he would dominate like giannis does but out of the low-post. He just never became an elite or even well above-average post player.

[@joshnyamburi]

Behind Bernard King?😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@malemanjulpax2155]

How many times he was dpoy? He was more of better version of amare stoudemire with no jumpshot

[@personperson5041]

Sold Dwight short for sureeeee

[@timothyd1496]

He's a first ballot Hall of Famer.

[@ginonunez6954]

Dwight was a pretty funny guy tbh

[@julianbell9161]

Dwight is the classic case of which do you value more: peak or longevity. In terms of peak, it’s one of the greatest peaks ever. Consecutive all NBA first teams, defensive player of the year awards, and he took a team to the finals. The only thing missing in his peak was winning the 2009 finals. Then, he just fell off of a cliff. I remember watching him with my dad when he was in Houston. We were waiting for the Dwight we saw in Orlando to show up and play with Harden, but he just never did. He peak was short, but man, it was bright. I think recency bias makes us undervalue Dwight.

[@nickwagner9551]

The back injury and the shoulder injury

[@amare1cro]

Pretty stupid to put his free throws at 0:49 from a game in which he broke the Lakers all time record at FTs made.

[@Richie3Jack]

I remember watching him play against Randolph Morris and Morris outplayed him each time. At the time I didn't think Howard was *that* special and overrated Morris. Obviously those were both terrible projections on my part. But it didn't surprise me that Howard's career ended up like it did from watching those games. Some guys have the killer instinct, the pride and determination...many do not.